@@slowsavage5522Yeah I've heard the theory. Only problem with it is that Nanna Mori's intervention is the only explanation for Bell Hell's escaping the Weave Mind. If the deal was done because the portal situation there isn't any reason for her to do that. Fey do not deal in freebies. And once the bargain is done there is no connection to be quite so timely if it was about Fearne. Certainly Matt may play it however he pleases but story wise the loophole is closed.
Sam Riegel can really deliver great performances in that manner. Scanlan's Bard's Lament is still my top moment. And his changeling during the city-wide broadcast? Man...
I like how it was FCG who took her out, of all the characters that who were connected to her in some fashion, it came down to self sacrifice of the one most faithful care givier.
In the first fight he kept them up in the second interaction he saved himself and Fearne by banishing themselves and in the third he stopped so many deaths and actually got the kill I loved fcg but I'm exited for sam to either come back as fcg in some way or a new character
Sam is all about getting on character gone for a bit or changing then to add to the drama of the table, I think he said as much in one of the panels or 4 sided dives. People correct me if I’m wrong
@@sandiesandholm1236 I think Travis originally played Chetney as a joke character and didn't expect to be playing him very long, but fans seemed to like him too much.
This is when the DM allows the 'rule of cool' to override the actual rules. So what if it technically wasnt enough damage? It was a beautiful RP moment and sometimes those and the story are more important than the actual numbers.
It was most likely enough damage. Otohan was probably under 20-30 HP before the potion. BH did significant damage between the potion and the blast, to a point where most of the potion HP was gone.
I would say, if some rules lawyer brought up the damage halfing effect, that FCG literally clung to her, through her aura of power, metal to skin, and detonated. There was no way for the effect to account for such force in such close proximity.
This hits so much harder now after Sam's cancer announcement, this wasn't just a character heroically sacrificing himself to save his friends this was a man facing down his own mortality and telling his closest friends how much he loves them
It also hits harder why the gang broke down that way. That wasn't the first death in Critical Role history, and not the first "definite" one (thinking about Mollymawk and Vax's final departure), and these previous times they were more shouty, more bargaining with Matt. This time they seemed truly desperate. And it makes sense now. It wasn't just a beloved character retiring, it was potentially Sam's last game. I understand that they wanted one, two... as many more hours as they could get. I am very happy that Sam's treatment and surgery went well, and that he's back with quips. His little "I've missed talking about anything that isn't cancer." during the announcement make me emotional every time. It's not something that leaves your life, not when you have a missing chuck of flesh as a reminder. But i hope he is and will be well enough that he can enjoy daily life without constant thoughts of it.
It should be a permanent death. I hate saying that but it would be an insult to that characters sacrifice. Tpk was and always was a possibility for campaign 3 all of warned that stakes are higher and the gloves are off.
Totally agree. I love Fcg, but don't sully his beautiful sacrifice by trying to bring him back or even talking about it. Because of what Sam did, we still have more c3 to watch.
@@sandiesandholm1236 As with C1 and C2, Matt always gives his players a choice. They can do an entire revival, but FCG can still choose NOT to come back. It will never be forced.
There was a very brief moment between Matt and Sam when Sam clarified he was attacking his Core, not just himself and Matt asked him if he understood what that meant, while Sam had his sheets out. And then asked again after Sam said yes. I don't think FCG is coming back.
I am not sure if aeormatons can be resurrected. Actually according the the critical role site they have souls so they should be able to be resurrected but sam may decide no
There are several ways in DnD to bypass damage resistances, and often self-damaging effects specifally do so. I don't think its cheap at all for Matt to decide that an aeormaton's core self detonating to bypass damage resistances.
We agree it was the right thing to do, just with all the combat fudging Matt was doing to try and prevent a TPK it just became a lot, and chat was definitely grumbling about it before FCG went nuclear
@@Decado1628 No, thats an essential part of being a DM. You want a story where your friends are having fun, not brutally destroy their joy and spirits. Story > Mechanics
I think you probably misunderstood or forgot but Otohan healed 66 points witch with her resistance would actually represent 122 points, before the damage FCG did, witch was the 79 you mentioned, she had already suffered around 150 damage that with her resistances would be around 63 points of damage, so they were pretty close to getting to where they were before she took the potion and she probably didn't have much HP before, hence the healing potion. Als Matt mentions at the end of the session that "she was pretty close a couple of times" or something, meaning she was probably low on health. And after that she took the 79 points of damage from FCG, that even halved, I believe should've been enough for the kill (I don't believe they should be heaved as it was a PC sacrifice and perma death that made sense). I've seen a lot of people saying that Matt saved the party and that she still had a lot of the HP she healed left when FCD self-destructed, and that is mathematically just not true, it's important to pay attention to these things before having expressing "opinion", specially if you are a content creator... the damage she took is as follows: Ashton: 46 -> 23 attack Orym: 10 -> 5 attack Laudna: 7 -> 3 eldrich blast Laudna: 11 -> 5 eldrich blast Fearne: 9 -> 4 opportunity attack Chet: 19 -> 9 shatter Fearne: 48 -> 24 -> 12 blight ---------------------------- TOTAL 150 -> 63 FCS: 79 blaze of glory See ya. PS: I'm not trying to offend anyone, it's just that I was able to gather this information in less than 15 minutes and I think that talking about things as they happened enriches the dialogue, instead of just saying what we feel is the truth.
yes, this. I didn't go back to calculate, but I knew they were getting at least close to her pre-potion hit points. Thanks for taking the time to write it out. They were small amounts but it slowly chipped it away.
Not to mention. every time the damage was halved due to her Exultant Fury state, Matt made a point to bring attention to the "psionic pressure" being the source of that halving. Like sword and hammer swings being cushioned in their blow like that. Kinda like a forcefield. FCG grabbed her in his final moments and pulled her in. The argument could be made that the blast from FCG's core detonating was within that psionic forcefield, therefore, it wasn't halved. 79 full points of damage. I don't care how powerful you are. If you hug a bomb when it detonates, you don't walk away. If anything, letting Otohan survive that would have been the cheap move.
Honestly this whole campaign has felt like Matt has been forcing his own narrative. It's why I hesitated to come back and watch. It's one thing for the rolls to cause failure, but when the dm doesn't want their own creation to fall it's incredibly obvious. I really hope he can see the over tuning and can adjust, but I think people would complain if he made the big bad weaker at this point.
I feel like this whole narrative of "C3 and Bell's has been getting away with too much!" Is utter nonsense. Compared to the other Campaigns, the C3 party has arguably had it the worst out of everyone in terms of threats and near death experiences. Vox Machina's hardest moments were during the Chroma Conclave and Vecna arcs. And in all that time the party had MAYBE 1 or two deaths in their hardest fights, all of which had some means to bring them back. And lets not forget they were a party that each held at least one vestige each and more magical items than any of the other parties and at least three PC's walking around with the boons of their chosen gods for a "super mode" they could use if needed. Campaign 2's toughest fight was against the Tomb Takers and no one even died as a result of the first encounter. Against Nonogan Lucien Jester died but was brought back mid combat. They also have only one vestige in their group and while at least three received the favor of the gods, none of them received a super mode boon. Campaign 3 has no vestiges, not nearly as many powerful magic items, no godly boons and yet has had multiple near TPK's, the party was forcibly split after LOSING the fight with one of the main antagonists, 3 characters died in the first fight with Otohan, and while two were brought back the third required a more involved process that in order to succeed meant keeping a dangerous entity alive as well. The second Otohan fight leads to two more deaths, one of which was a sacrifice play because it looked like another TPK, that is seemingly permanent. Bell's Hells have not had any solid wins for a long time. If they ever had, because whenever it has mattered the most, they AT BEST get a pyrrhic victory. So regardless of whether you love or hate C3, narratively and mechanically, people need to take off the rose tinted glasses and recognize that this party in this campaign have had the toughest go of things, with seemingly the highest stakes yet. There has been nothing "easy" about this campaign.
To be fair we lost Yasha for a while and Yasha almost killed her future wife as well as other M9 that battle along with the Lucien battle followed by the dragon session were incredibly close calls. Remember how off they were after the Laughing hand o.o all players needed a win of some kind but the table was down visibly. M9 definitely had their moments, but you are right these characters are well less experienced and are being put into a war zone with a huge target on their back that just grew bigger. They took 2 key players from Ludinus o.o I'm glad we lost a player it's sad, but it felt legit there was no way all characters were going to get out of this one and they were lucky o.o
in all fairness, this was a TPK, at least, it should have been. FCG's sacrifice didn't do enough damage to kill Otohan but Matt gave it to him regardless. If Matt stood true to the character he created, they would have been dead at least 2-3 rounds ago. Letting Chet revive. Letting Imogen stay unconscious instead of outright killing her. Not focusing on the healer earlier in the fight. Drinking potions as bonus actions. These are all the ways he gave them chance after chance to stay in the fight for longer.
Things were rocky, but still feeling doable...until that potion went down. Once that happened you could definitely feel the mood shift and true hopelessness set it.
Yup. That potion seemed cruel. I understand, of course a powerful person is going to have healing but still. They didn't stand a chance after that without something like what FCG did.
@@CanadianCritsit was a supreme healing potion. It’s just the second to appear in CR, in 3 campaigns (and the first not with the cast) if I’m not mistaken.
07/08/2024 - I know a lot of people won't issue their own apologys about why Sam blew up FCG, but after the announcement from Sam today, every single person who said it was to help with ratings should absolutely issue an apology video and a massive retraction.
I wouldn't have even been mad if ratings was the reason. It's a show, that's what it's there for. The actual crime is fudging the numbers that much. D&D is a number game wearing a fantasy skin.
@@R7AWSUM well, YMMV, but for me before it's a numbers game, it's a storytelling game. There are times D&D tells a great story without a single roll being involved, so I don't mind if the numbers mechanics get suspended for a time in favour of the story. And I think that's key here - there was no fudging of rolls, just a narrative event taking precedence. But as I say, that's just my opinion, and we're all entitled to our views.
@thegameuser2616 a story gets told, irrespective of the game. You win, it's a story about a team of heroes. You lose, it's a sad tale of hapless adventurers. Either way, for it to have any meaning *as* a game, the Dice have to be the ones telling that story.
I said on twitter, but we all knew that Sam was going to absolutely RUIN us with that small little robit, we just didn’t know how. I was moved for Mollys death, but didn’t cry….Sam describing FCG’s final moments had MANY tears rolling down my face.
Wow. I went in acknowledging spoilers. Wow. I caught a clip of THAT moment with Scanlan in campaign one. It was so emotional and powerful then. Man o man.
@@CharlieThunder24 fcg, automaton built to care, perverted into killing machine, performing the ultimate act of care, by sacrificing himself to kill someone bad. that's the literal definition of a fulfilled story arc, y'all will really just find ANYTHING to bitch about huh.
After the episode, I came back to Churches monologue from the end of red VS blue (don't at me) and I think I'd love to hear Sam read it verbatim as fcg for the campaign epilogue. 'you know. There's so many stories where some brave hero decides to give their life to save the day. And because of their sacrifice, the good guys all win. The survivors all cheer. And everyone lives happily ever after. But the hero never gets to see that ending. They'll never know if their sacrifice made a difference. They'll never know if the day was really saved. In the end, the just have to have faith. Ain't that a bitch"
Just to note when she drank the potion she got 66 HP back (basically double that because of her resistances so 132) they ended up chipping away at her HP until the 66 HP that she got was now down to 22 HP (132 down to 44 because resistances) then FCG did 79 Damage (even if it was halved that is still 39 and she had 22HP so she would have taken 17 more Damage) and if it wasn't halved she would have taken 57 more Damage... Also to note that we don't know what her HP was at before she drank the potion but I'm guessing she was in the single digits or something because that's when you would use something like that... So just saying FCG totally could have legit killed her...
I have been watching C3 since it started and while it has had its problems, this was one of the greatest moments of the campaign. There is no denying this fight was painful and rage inducing to watch, but considering who Otohan was and her abilities, as I'm pretty sure she was CR 23 if not higher, this was going to be an ugly fight no matter how strong the party was. Thematically though, what the Hells accomplished on what was meant to be a SCOUTING mission, as there will be repercussions for the Vanguard and Imperium losing key personnel and an unknown amount of resources, is nothing to sneeze at even with the cost that was paid. This was a Triumph.
It ended up as a great story beat, but that’s because of Sam, not Matt. The encounter was bad, and it would be a unsatisfying TPK (one the players had no visible hand in creating and no power to avoid), but Sam turned it into a cool heroic moment with a strong story choice. I’ll call Matt a genius if his intention from the start was to force one or more of the PC’s to make a sacrifice (there were other possibilities for that), but until I hear about that, Sam bailed him out.
@@HenriqueErzinger Oh absolutely, the whole fight was a nightmare, especially for Matt as there were moments when you can see the thought "oh shit, I made her too powerful" flicker across his face as he tried to compensate. He was genuinely upset towards the end and when Sam made the sacrifice you could see the relief wash through him as well as the other emotions for FCG's story coming to an end. Really looking forward to next week's game for the aftermath as well as what Sam has planned for his backup character.
@@id9907 He's been playing dnd for I believe coming up on four full decades now, let's give the guy some credit. If he thought the fight was going poorly, there are a bajillion ways he could nerf her without anyone even so much as realizing it. This is the power of being a DM, and he knows it, and he has demonstrated not only capability but also willingness to use it. He's not a dice cultist, he's a guy designing a game, and that involves the ability to manipulate the context of an encounter in such a way that everyone leaves, if not happy, at least under the auspices that they understand why something happened.
@@candyh4284 I do give him a lot of credit, and as a GM myself, I'm aware of all the ways to adjust an encounter in real time. Normally I'm the one defending Matt in any and all "controversy". That being said, I do believe he went wrong in this one, or as wrong as one can be when running a game for their friends anyway. She was way stronger than what one would expect at this point in the campaign, with all of the games they played before as a reference (stronger than anything the m9 faced, and would make Thordak seem like a joke), but that in itself would be all right. The part I call bad design is the way they were forced into the fight even after taking steps to avoid it, while already somewhat spent, with no ability to flee, no room to negotiate (she from the start makes clear her o lu goal is killing them), and most important: no alternative win conditions. They basically had to fight, and I'll argue, had no chance of victory. That would make a TPK feel really bad. Now, it might have been a "scripted defeat" event of sorts, with some content to be unlocked after their deaths; or it might as I said be a trick to force a blaze of glory moment, or even some other possibility I'm not seeing. But my criticism is with the information we have. Of course, as long as they have fun, it's all good, but to me, I would be frustrated to be at the table and I was unsatisfied with the story up until Sam did what he does best, and with amazing sense for drama, saved the narrative as much as the party.
@@HenriqueErzinger Otohan's literal first fight with the group was entirely to force Imogen's hand in giving in to her Ruidusborn powers and unlocking her. The Group wanted a harder campaign afaik from multiple comments, citing it as a Session 0/Pre-Session 0 Discussion. Probably something buried in a Tweet, Interview or Dice episode. In that context, Otohan is not at all out of left field. They just dealt some blows to the Vanguard, all of their big names were out looking for them, from Liliana to the Sorrowlord, so it was clear Otohan was in the mix somewhere and she's an absolute Predator. I have absolutely no issue in believing that Matt knew what he was doing with Otohan, from the design and balance to the moments where she and the group trade blows. They are always immediately at a disadvantage against what is no doubt a very high CR Threat. How the audience views these things has always been a little out of touch with the group's views on this. It's their table. C1 E1 rules are still very much in effect, Matt does things his way, they are narrative focused and they have heavily encouraged people not to backseat their shit, time and again. It's bound to happen, it's just turning into a bit of a joke that after years and years of CR, some people haven't caught on it seems. (Not saying it's YOU necessarily, it's just generally funny to acknowledge that some people absolutely still don't seem to realize what their show's boundaries are and that what viewers believe happened or is going on doesn't always translate 1:1 with what the group is feeling, thinking etc. - until we actually 100% know what's going on thanks to external stuff, like Interviews, Dice episodes etc.)
I hadn’t checked in on an episode of Campaign 3 for a while, much less a livestream, but my God, that episode was worth it! It was actually the first time in a while that I was really caring about these characters again. I might actually stick around for the rest of the campaign this time!
Yeah, that broke me. That was the first CR death I saw, not knowing the story already. Some real tears, but I am excited to see how Frida takes this and what Sam comes up with for his next character.
I’ve been thinking about FCGs death and I wonder if he would be able to be reincarnated since we’ve never seen it used in the show and would be an interesting Pinocchio situation with FCG becoming a real boy.
They did get back safely when they returned to Exandria via the backdoor. Whether Matt chooses to use that to deny what Orym asks for is up to him, but she could stick to the letter of the agreement.
I had to sleep in the middle of the battle, but when I watched the recap, I was shocked as hell that happened. The fact they barely survived a TPK, is impressive but that was one hell of a sacrifice. Though I don't like what has happened throughout some parts of Campaign 3, this was something really made it something emotional, and solidified why I liked FCG more as the story went on.
Now I think it’s best to leave FCG in peace (not trying to make a dark pun), and hopefully ensure that messed up NPC we know as Party Killer Otohan Thull NEVER comes back from the dead. It’s a hope, cause if we know Matt, he’ll probably do something evil again, and make it permanent.
After the recent announcement, I wonder if thats part of the reason they all broke down so hard. If they knew he had cancer and needed to step away, they were pushing it out of their minds and had to reconfirm to themselves that he was leaving for awhile and didnt know when hes be back
Sam is a Master Improv. He knew what he was doing and will probably have one hell of a way to keep FCG going or one hell of an interesting new character either way.
We were watching it live and after my gf and I both had exhausting work days (I had an 11 hour shift, she had a 2 hour travel to and then from a gig). She was nodding off during the Otohan fight but snapped awake with FCG's final stand... and she fell asleep in tears. She is buying the FCG plushie today as it had been on her list of wants.
I'm hoping that the reactors that were quick to make clickbaity videos about how "this could be the the end of Critical Role", "this was a cheap railroad by Matt Mercer" now feel like the jackasses that they are.
@@evalynn1863it’s possible they could, and that’s a testament to how competent they were in that fight. But it’s also not guaranteed (she was never bloodied), and that speaks on how truly badly designed the encounter was. It’s fine to have a broken enemy, but then you should also have a different win condition or means of survival. Sam really bailed Matt out on this one.
@HenriqueErzinger she was down around 50% before exalting. The balance was decent. Chat overdramatized it lol bc critters are gonna do that bc we can. Had a couple of marisha's rolls gone differently theyd have been fine.
@@HenriqueErzingerthis isn't the first time he has done this, and if a player hadn't made the sacrifice he probably would have tpk'd the party or almost then make-up another reason for them to survive.
I'm glad Bells Hells took Ludinus' knight and possibly converted the Queen, but was it worth losing their bishop? EDIT: Are we sure 40 damage wasn't enough to drop her? Or that Otohan's resistance applied to what basically equaled a tactical nuke? It was never really discovered if there was a damage type that wasn't resisted or what type of damage an Arcane Core does when it explodes.
It was pretty clear when it happened that Otohan had well over 100 hp if not more after the 60hp healing potion based on Matts description. Even without the damage reduction she wouldn't have died. And the rest of the group were pretty much tapped out. Even if she had 20hp left, she'd have taken them down. Matt let it happen, which was fine narratively. I'm really curious to see who Sam shows up as next because they still need a healer and I just don't see him playing it straight again. Maybe a Paladin or a Divine Soul Sorc?
If it is modeled on "Blaze of Glory" from Daggerheart, it is an "automatic critical success", so the 79 would have been doubled and then halved back to 79.
@@ejd53 And that's perfectly fine and is undoubtedly Sams inspiration for doing what he did. In fact, there's a "cynical" part of me that thinks maybe Sam did this as a way to "preview" a Daggerheat CR campaign. Which, I think is going to happen for C4, anyway. Either way, and I'm sure someone will tally up the damage done to Otahan, I'm still not convinced FCG did enough damage, especially given her Exaltant form resistances.
It all depends if otohan has resistance to the nuke dmg. If any one of the pc has elemental adept then their dmg type could not be resisted. So assuming the changebringer empowered fcg you can make a case that otohan took the full hit and that is enough to drop her
@@GhostpainOG Not really, the party actually almost had the healing potion hp down and matt confirmed that she was close to dead before it. Bells Hells did 126 damage after the potion which basically healed her for 132. So there was 6 hp left from the potion which could be counted as 12 and lets say she had 20 hp or less when she drank it. FCG absolutely killed her. Matt may have also ruled that the explosion of an aeorian arcana core ignored her resistance.
800 dmg did to her , 4 attacks, 4 surges (she got +2 when she went crazy) legendary action's, legendary resistices, each attack did 24+ per hit, WITHOUT THE FUCKING BACKPACK OF BULL**** my god this was insanse
@@TheAusturtle I have a very strong feeling they were never ever supposed to take her down. She was built to force Imogen to give into her powers and trigger the next "big plot". We'll have to see what Matt brews up to push that next..
@@TheAusturtle Not nearly, honestly a well built party of lvl 13´s could have taken her down rather easily. Remember, the party was depleted of ressources and some didn´t have hull HP and they still almost beat her. Judging from the way that Matt described it I am not fully sure that FCG´s sacrafice was needed.
Thank you so much for this video! Not only was is so quick, but I missed the first half so I didn't know what else happened! Thank you for catching me up so quick!!! Great video!!!!
I think the maximum number of hp she had at that point was 60, but I believe it was lower. Still, even before daggerheart, you'd have to be heartless not to honor a sacrifice like that.
Sam's speech absolutely hits differently after his announcement. "Even in this dark, dark cave, these people always make it a smiley day." I was just happy to FINALLY have a fight that had actual consequences at the time, but now that line actually made me tear up a bit
I thought at first, they would TPK so they could put Daggerheart into play. Then the way the dice rolls went...it would be showing how the game (anyone's game) can turn...Then it would be Chetney that would go...Just as Travis and Matt planned it. Now I don't see a better outcome could happen. The story has changed in ways that makes it a must see show again!
Brilliant story telling D&D, just amazing. What Sam asked for just doesn't exist in the rules, but it does in every adventure story. Certainly all the anime shows they work on and know well. Sam said "go out in a blaze of glory", which the vid hear points out, is a rule in Daggerheart. A story telling rule. So this all makes sense to me, and was brilliant! 5 hours of building tension man, just wow.
The cast did make quite a few errors in this fight. They forgot Handbooker Helper teaching them that a death save was done at the start of your turn so Imogen should have been immediately able to act. Also that Shocking Grasp prevents the target from taking reactions so Imogen could have backed away without taking an opportunity attack. I doubt they had it, but since they knew they'd be fighting her eventually Slow would have completely negated the multi-attack, limiting the enemy to one melee attack per round. So somebody should have taken it. And with her having disadvantage because of the hound she would have needed to burn through her legendary resistances much more quickly.
On the Shocking Grasp: Laura gave up moving away because, at least what I remember, she said Thull can chase her anyway. On the death save: Matt “allowed” her to act after giving up searching for the rule on his phone. Laura thought playing dead had more advantage for her not to take more attacks from Thull.
Also: A Supreme Healing Potion, if rolled at max (10d4+20), can only give 60HP. So either Otohan had something that could give her extra HP, or Matt misspoke and she was actually at 66HP instead of regaining 66HP.
Even a campaign 3 hater like me enjoyed last nights session. I don’t even care about the rule technicalities. It was just a good episode. I hope the party keeps the momentum and continues to be proactive. I also hope this Matt sticks around because he was being ruthless. I hope FCG enjoys a well earned rest in the halls of the Changebringer.
he's been being ruthless the whole time imo, people just have post-campaign disorder where they retroactively see all of the VM characters as heroic strugglers and M9 as brutally downtrodden -- VM never faced anything like otohan even up through the chroma conclave, and for as much unlucky breaks as M9 had, they also had an in at the cobalt soul, the cerberus assembly, and pretty serious powers to boot. When they lost the heart of the group, they found one of the best characters in CR history. Bells Hells are a bunch of nobodies with skeletons in their closets that are basically destined to fail miserably against powers that VM didn't even know existed. And he's not been shy of pretending otherwise, unless you've forgotten the previous bloodbath courtesy of Ms. 4-Action-Surges, wherein 3 party members were killed outright, one for the next month of show time, and they got out because someone made a sacrifice play that probably was a bad idea. Just seems like it's the same exact thing only people seem less unwilling to accept the aggression now.
3:10 - I was wondering if the damage would've been enough, then again, the cave probably should've collapsed on top of her from the explosion which would've killed her anyways, but I think Matt wanted them to be able to get the items.
@@junkname9983Agreeing that the explosion damage alone shouldn’t have been enough to zero Thull. At best, it only took away the potion-healed HP and we didn’t know how much was left after. Logically, Thull could have resisted a grapple check to not take the full brunt of the explosion among a myriad of other things a Psi Warrior could do. Narratively, a bomb went off right next to her. No damage resistance could save her vital organs from the blast and the shrapnel.
@@wtchrol7864 And while she didn't have the backpack anymore, she presumably had a ton of other busted tech that would probably not react very positively to 70 points of aeormaton esplosion
in the first campaign he used his last wish to stop Vecna and in doing so sacrificed a friends life. And now he's sacrificing himself to save a another friends life.
As a note to your comment about Sam's next character pick, Sam has never picked the character he will play, Liam has done it for him, per Sam's request. Either way, it's going to be interesting, to say the least.
You sure Otohan's death was DM fiat? Ashton immediately took off 23 of the 66 from the potion, and FCG's would've taken off all but 3. We don't know what Otohan was at before she drank, but there was quite a bit of chipping between Ashton and FCG, definitely more than 3.
The math was something like they had to do 92 points of damage to get her back to her pre potion levels, and only 79 happened, and that was just to pre potion levels which mat described as "she starting to look like she's take some damage".
@@TheCharacterSheet Aren’t you assuming that FCG’s nuke - which they basically said they were winging the mechanics for on the spot - does not bypass resistances?
@@TheCharacterSheet The thing is couldn't Matt lie? The fact that she had to take the potion says to me she was more hurt than Matt let on. Does that mean he didn't fudge? He probably did, but I think she was more hurt than we think.
Even if they have it, it is Sam's choice if he wants to be brought back or not. So regardless of what they have, if Sam decides he doesn't want to bring FCG back, then he won't be brought back.
Fcg could totally pull an altered carbon or surrogates for the uninitiated. Waking up in an aorin factory in either another different robot body or in cryosleep as a flesh and blood creature that fcg didn't know they were
This is also bad because FCG was their main healer and the only other person with healing and resurrection magic is Fearne. If they don’t bring FCG back Sam needs to build a PC with healing abilities.
@@AwesomeNukeIt's always possible to bring someone back in DnD however, because this is Sam's character, I guarantee you he's not coming back even if he wasn't vaporized
Now let's wait ten years for it to happen on screen. About the next Sam's character I think the party still needs healer, but he doesn't have to be fully fledged one. Anyway his new character may still follow a god. I have couple of gueses, besides another cleric it may be a paladin(don't know which one was the most supportive), a monk(the one with punch heals/or long death for tankiness), or zealot barbarian(just for keeping religious arc), another option is for Sam to pick artificier again, and this time use him as a way to bring back FCG to working again, but I doubt Sam would do that, he rolls with consequences.
People forget that D&D is a story between the players and the DM, and the story should always take priority. A TPK wouldn't have fulfilled anything and people would be more upset and them backfilling new pcs into the existing game. A pc made a bold decision to save his friends with something he had available in his resources and to save his friends. If that doesn't make a pc death worthy then I don't know what would. However, I would have had him escape gravely wounded with wounds that never fully heal as scars to remind himself and the PCs of the sacrifice as well as give the players an enemy they will need to grow stronger to overcome. If he wasn't a big bad before, he would be now.
But has this story felt like a collaboration, or has it felt like a person creating a narrative and buffing their pieces so that their players can't mess it up.
@@meowpurpur Does it matter? I would argue no. What matters is that the Players and the DM are on the same page and in agreement with how the game is to be run. This isn't YOUR game. This is THEIR game.
Otohan has been one of the best and my favorite NPC/Villians in CR history(along with the Raishan from Campaign 1), I’m glad Matt let Sam take her out in Movie fashion. Will make for a great animated scene in the future haha.
I’m hoping he does something like a Paladin build. It’ll replace some of the healing from FCG, I think by level 13 paladins have revivify and he would be the second tankiest (highest AC though) of the group
OK, Now I'm excited to sit & view the next installment. This is the pay off I've been waiting for! I'm going to need some preparation snacks! #91 is lit!
Matt said several times "You know what this means?" I think that was him confirming that this is a perma-death. Sam is a master of tears and I think this is his hardest hitter so far, at least of the main campaigns.
Assasin bot's gotta assasin. Killer thematic move. But, I don't think Sam is coming back to the table this campaign. He is busy bringing the toons online.
A lot of people have mentioned how much damage was needed and all that. My question is, would FCG have the presence of mind in his berzerk mode to make a decision like that. The history that was revealed with dancer and the previous party, and the murderbot episodes that he had with bells hells showed him flipping a switch and turning on everybody, but now he feels alive his friends bring him joy and he's willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for them. If anything, it's Sam's actual role play of his character that crosses the boundaries for me. Also, I love the moment, I think it's amazing and I wouldn't change it a bit.
I mean I would love to see if this sticks. I have felt that way too many times when characters 'die' (Lauda/Molly/and others) Matthew has them come back in some way. So having it 'stick' would impress me.
Sometimes I will watch a few minutes of the current campaign and my first ever watching of CR was a random C3 episode, it's what got me to actually watch the show. I'm not at all caught up and I randomly clicked on the premier of this ep while it was going live. Very first thing I see is everyone crying and Sam giving a speech.... I closed the window but all it took was 2 seconds of reading the room to know I just got a massive spoiler LMAO. Couldn't have been more obvious what just happened. I'm not even a quarter through c2....THIS IS EXACTLY WHY I WANT TO CATCH UP, DAMNIT! Who am I kidding, I would have gotten spoiled anyway.
I have watched every episode of CR. Campaigns 1, 2 and 3, and both EXUs. I've seen my fair share of dramatic battles that the party couldn't win. The Conclave attack, the first encounter with Vecna, C2 Ep69, the one episode where they fought the Tomb Takers AFTER an ancient dragon, hell, even the first encounter with Otohan. But this, this is bullshit. At this point, I believe that Otohan could realistically kill by herself a tarrasque, Tiamut and Bahamut. At the same time. Sure, Matt had very high rolls, but if your attack bonus equals the AC of one of your PC, and it can attack 5 times per turn, AND has leg. actions/reactions, AND has basically a second form, maaaaybe you overdid your job
1. The party on the whole doesn't have particularly high AC. They all wear medium armor or lower, so chances of missing were slim to begin with. 2. It's a caster heavy party, if a DM wants to run a convincing 1vParty encounter, LR's and LA's are a must to have. 3. Monster stat blocks do not have to adhere to the same rules and limitations that PC's do. In fact they often don't. 4. Bell's Hells like the party's from previous campaigns are not optimized to get the most out of their classes. The closest characters to being as such are probably Laudna and Orym.
@@MeerkatADV I believe that when Sam said; "go out in a blaze of glory", Matt realized he was evoking a rule from Daggerheart that is named that. It's a storytelling action, to sacrifice oneself in a blaze of glory. imho, and I thought it was great. Rule of cool man!
Ottohan is/was way overtuned- almost to the point of the troll homebrew content for lols on dnd beyond, even without the backpack/echo knight features on top.
Emotional damage aside... this took the primary healer from the group, that is going to be a serious issue moving forward. It's hard to see Sam creating another healer for his comeback character. Granted he could be a healer recommended by Keyleth for the group, but it just feels off, even with the campaign being in the sun-setting faze so any new character is going to be more of a short run character.
Character death always sucks. But I think it's safe to say FCG went out the way we all wish our characters could: in a blaze of glory that saves everyone else.
I genuinely think that if Bells Hells placed FCG's pieces into the Regeneration machine that Mighty Nein put Devexian's body into, that the og FCG Prime will be remade and we'll get a sort of Mollymauk/Lucian/Tiefling type wrap up for FCG who will become a steward to Aeor, removing folks from blue bubble stasis and helping them integrate with the new world...
Well Bell’s Hells took out Otohan Thull (Kass) and only one of them died. Now they are going after Ludinus Da'leth (Vecna), and the chances of all of them dying is very high. Characters die in campaigns all the time. Back in 1e that happened almost every play session.
Genuinely unlike campaign 2 I have had a few issues with campaign 3 and that had caused me to just take a step back from the series for awhile I think the last episode I watched was 75 so I'm quite behind but if something like this has happened I might pick it back up. So I'm happy to have this spoiled if it revitalises my love for the series
Otohahn wasn't even close to full strength when FCG went supernova. She was already near death, but would likely have taken a few of Bells Hells with her if FCG didn't make the sacrifice. As things stand, FCG was on to his last spell slot and he had no more diamonds to do another revivfy. (Although there may have been some ways around that with residuum and Gentle Repose). There's also one other BIG thing to consider...when did resurrection magic start working again? Did it start when they were able to get a Sending to work again? Or...was this another Matt Mercer gift to the cast?
The connection of Ruidus to Exandria via the bloody bridge has the moon locked and the apogee solstice still in play, it messed with all EXANDRIA'S leylines (the magical weave) that prevent sending, revivify, etc. Ruidus doesn't have leylines, so the magic there isnt being interfered with or blocked.
@@LeighRoss-ck9uh But they found Sending to work when they were back on Exandria. So...did both happen at the same time or is there something else going on? I'm not going to deny there's a lot going on in Matt's head that we're not privy to. And it's always possible that he's going to change things on the fly either to support the narrative or to help the players. Who knows what the reasons are. MAYBE we'll find out during a 4SD or in the campaign wrap up? Who knows.
It feels a little like there are two very vocal groups in C3's viewership. The people that completely skipped every disclaimer about their table, from C1 E1 to every one that followed and are thirsty for a TPK or for Matt to run his table the way they run their tables, because... reasons, I guess. Or people that are willing to immediately throw Matt's capabilities under the bus, purely because they themselves felt an encounter was unfair, without even remotely questioning the possible idea that maybe... Matt upped the difficulty for a reason this time around. With nothing to go on other than the facial expressions of professional actors at a table where they play characters, in a narrative centric campaign, because surely the severity of the encounter has never before been a cause for them to show signs of stress, even when those previous encounters weren't Otohan Thull.
