Cultish - Examining The Church Of Christ 

Next time do your homework . Talk to at least one or two who are truly knowledgeable about the churches of Christ. Destroy your straw man argument which no member I have ever known believes. If this had been a debate you would have been eaten alive. I COC hold a well defined pyramid chain of command which every member knows their position. They have a single head of the whole group advised by a board composed of regional church leaders. None position is chosen by the people. They broke away from the COC 30 years ago and started using instrument as a sign of having completely broken away. If those two hits represented your. knowledge of the church and worst still your knowledge of the Scriptures you would have been eaten alive in debate. Please represent those who disagree with you honestly..

The more I listen you yall, the more yall prove you all are not well educated in Scripture. John 3:5 and the thief on the cross you mentioned, the thief KNEW of the Kingdom, thats why he said to Christ "remember me when come into your Kingdom " John preached the Kingdom AND baptized people. So it is totally plausible for the thief to have been baptized by John, and therefore be forgiven in that fashion. Relating back to John 3:5. This is ridiculous how yall don't even know or think these simple things through. Ask yourself, how did the thief actually know about the kingdom of heaven/Kingdom of God ? He was repentant because John preached repentance, so it's evidence against your position.

Church of Christ believes that the Bible is the whole revelation of God and it doesn't need alterations or additional books, ( we use KJV mostly but all Churches of Christ are independent ) Just as any protestant church. To say that Church of Christ is a Cult just because of some difference in interpretation is so disappointing. May we find unity as Christians in Jesus

HERE IS A QUESTION.... IS CULTISH BRING PEOPLE TO KNOW GOD IS REAL AND JESUS IS THE MESSIAH, AKA THE SAVIOR OF THE WORLD? its being funded by liberal plagerist of the abandoning truth inorder to find comfort of social wins for tic tok and discrediting the bible. GUESS WHAT... there is a wide road that is capturig alot of cultish watchers and people who love to feel good and believe the guy in the middle watching this video. LIKE the guy in the middle as long as you just hear good stuff and feel good about what you see your ok even when its homosexuality and all sorts of hate against straights and flagreantly apeasing how you are a good person and need to ask for things like a zombie. SECULARIZED churches want you to joel olesten everything and feel like you get rich by selfishness and pride. Like cultish they want you to go away from the church of Christ and trade Jesus chruch for church of feel good.

I am not in the 'Church of Christ' denominations but upon quick review, some of the elements you call out are COMMON things in the bible that give folks pause to consider due to wording and context and then find a need to research more about through their own journey with God through the bible. It is all of our jobs, individually to 'rightly handle the word of truth' and work out our own salvation with 'fear and trembling.' Two out of the three podcasts I've listened to you have been throwing shade at anything but 'your' brand ™ of Christianity. Christianity is not a brand. Focusing on tiny nuances of belief to attempt to amputate whole fists and calves and toes of Jesus' church is not productive. Fast forward almost 2000 years and we are all split apart, trolling facebook and social media for ways to 'catch' people in 'bad' theology. Also all your branding (for example on your twitter page, your advertisement shows people like Charles Manson, Jim Jones, Koresh and (L. Ron Hubbard?).....those are cults. Cult is a psychological and sociological term. Christian denominations who have slight to major differences in theology (than yourself) are not 'cults' and to put them in the same bucket is disingenuous and harmful. Also your ongoing statement of 'people that believe the bible as the sole source of truth' discount history is totally false. All sorts of folks that believe the bible is the main source of truth (who don't ascribe to a human creed or confession to priests) look into church history, read works by historical Christians etc. How about let's read the bible, love God, serve others and be a shining example to the world and peaceful and brotherly to each other? Minimally, invite someone from the denomination on to teach people the differences in interpretation and dive into the bible to see if a conclusion can be made. And actually, after looking more into that church to support this post...this sounds like a church I would visit. Non-centralized.....focus on the bible as the common factor....the main differences (if this summary website is true) is the 'steps to salvation' and their level of 'necessary and sufficientness' although I'm sure there is variation across churches: 1. One must be properly taught, and hear (Romans 10:14-17);. well yes, the bible speaks in Gal 1:6-8 of folks following after a different gospel. An example would be someone hearing the mormon gospel or the JW gospel. How could you disagree that you need to hear the right gospel? Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. (AGREE) 2. One must believe or have faith (Hebrews 11:6, Mark 16:16); (AGREE) 3. One must repent, which means turning from one's former lifestyle and choosing God's ways (Acts 17:30); AGREE that it's evidence of salvation (not the cause of salvation)-it's a lifetime of repentance and turning away from sin because that's what the Holy Spirit does to you after you are born again, DON"T AGREE that unrepented sin causes you to lose your salvation like the catholics. Repentance is not a checkbox you have to do with a priest at the last minute before you die. It's more of 'evidence' and 'a process' and 'a lifestyle.' Thank God for repentance and the Holy Spirit that works to save me from this sin and flesh which so easily entangles and harms me. 4. One must confess belief that Jesus is the son of God (Acts 8:36-37); (AGREE THAT IT'S EVIDENCE OF SALVATION TO VERBALLY CONFESS, but not necessary/sufficient for salvation to verbally confess this on point 100%, aka Peter denied Christ 3X, even the devil can quote the bible and knows that Jesus is the son of God). What a curse to deny Christ though....I pray none of us face martyrship and this fear. AGREE that you would have to believe that Jesus is the Son of God (per point 1, 'same gospel we taught to you').....Muslims believe that Jesus exists, is holy, is annointed, but don't believe that Jesus is the Son of God. They believe he is a prophet....that's not enough for salvation. 5. One must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ (Acts 2:38); (UNSURE if you need a ceremonial baptism, Jesus said you must be born of water and of the Spirit, but I don't read this as you must have a baptism ceremony. But this is an example where folks may read things differently. I was baptized as an adult, if my neighbor never did, that feels ridiculous that they would go to hell all else being equal (and God is not ridiculous). I would study it more if I was concerned for myself or others. 6. One must live faithfully as a Christian (1 Peter 2:9). (AGREE as evidence....your acts and behavior are evidence, not the cause of salvation. Your salvation is from God, we didn't do anything to deserve it) If it's true that they don't believe there is salvation outside of their brand ™ of church than I wouldn't visit. I don't see anything in their doctrine that mentions 'grace' (undeserved favor) so that's a big miss....but educate instead of calling them a 'cult.' The baby question is also something that isn't super clear (to me) in the bible. I agree that all humans have original sin no matter how old you are. I don't agree that baptism 'saves' a baby if they are about to die (although why not just do it?). I don't believe that a baby goes to hell if they haven't been old enough to have faith. God is just. If something sounds unjust to us, then how much more can we be assured that God has a supremely just plan. For example Jesus went to the place of the dead to preach to those who haven't heard the gospel before he came (1Peter 3:18-20) so there is some kind of due process after death for those who have never been old enough to understand.

Glad to hear it, most of the time someone who switches will be cut off no doubt

I'm not sure this is really talking about mainline churches of Christ. And if it is, maybe it's geographically specific? Some in my family have attended churches of Christ for generations on at least 4 continents, and this podcast isn't representative of _anything_ I've experienced with the church. (Expect the two times I ended up visiting an non-cooperational* church by accident.) * I know them as "anti-churches," and they prefer "anti-institutional" (which erroneously suggests other coCs are pro-institutional), so I used this older term that's also not offensive to identify them.

@@jacksyoutubechannel4045 Typical mainline CoC's teach salvation-by-works, particularly Baptismal Regeneration.

@@jacksyoutubechannel4045 I'm a member of the Church of Christ. Honestly, the people in the video trying to explain their thoughts on Baptism had me confused. They were saying "you don't have to be baptized to be saved, but you better do what Christ says to do, and he says to get Baptized". That makes zero sense to me. It also makes zero sense to me that it seems as though the guys in the video don't seem to believe that once you are saved you can't loose salvation. So they are saying I could be saved then at some point in the future go on a rape and murder spree, and wouldn't loose my salvation because of it (if I didn't repent)? I've been in several Churches of Christ, and I've never once see anybody "shunned" because they fell away. I have several friends that no longer associate with the Church of Christ, I still see and talk to them regularly, and other members do also. I think it's actually often the case that the one that leaves shuns the the Church of Christ members.

I come from a church of Christ background and that’s straight up untrue.

I am struggling with that right now. I was baptized into COC and have been going back and forth with whether I should be re-baptized for years

@@stephaniepierson9782you know where your heart was, and so does Jesus. I don’t think it’s necessary, it was just something I felt like I wanted to do.

Same here grew up in COC and though mainly use KJV we sometimes pull the same verses from other translations to compare and get a more thorough idea

I have a kjv Bible they didn't like it's called the companion Bible it's a real good Bible but I don't care what the coc thinks about that I'm hoping the LORD will lead me to a non denominational church that's not coc

@@harolddavis1493 I hope you find what you're looking for. I use the NASB and the Legacy Standard Bible as those are believed by many scholars and critics to be closest to the original documents although learning Koine is always going to be the best option.

These guys have no idea what the CHURCH of CHRIST believes,For one,,The COC a is not a denominational church. Christ is the head of the church,,and Christ only set up one church,,His church,,So a non denominational church has Christ as it head,,And then there are elders that over see the church as to make sure that it is following God’s word,, If you go to a Church of Christ that is not following the word of God,, then that isn’t a true Church of Christ. They only go by what the Bible says, As far as “ restoration” I don’t know about that,,There has been no new teachings ,,no new revaluations and no hidden truths brought forward . If these guys are talking about the Mormons,, or United Church of Christ ,, then they should make that clear,,Because if they don’t then they are calling a church that follows the word of God as close as humanly possible a cult.

I have heard of this belief among more hyper-conservative Churches of Christ. Usually it's the older folk.

Severe division has always existed among CoC’s. Although they were initially established on the basis of forming unity on the “New Testament Pattern,” each group’s idea of unity had to be centered on that certain group’s interpretation of what it thought that pattern was. Because, when doctrines are built upon speculation and private interpretation, rather than absolute truth, then each group just ends up picking and choosing what it thinks will best suite the interests of that particular group. CoC author, Leroy Garrett, even admitted in his book, "What Must the Church of Christ Do to Be Saved?"---- “We must face the fact that this tragic habit of splitting into sects and sub-sects is due largely to a faulty “Restorationist” hermeneutics, which says there is an identifiable pattern for the work and worship of the church which spells out details, which when adhered to “restores” the true church” (p. 40). “We have erred in our claim that there is a uniform pattern of organization and worship in the New Testament churches and that we have duly “restored” that pattern. This is evident in the fact that we can’t even agree among ourselves as to what that pattern requires. We have not only differed but divided over almost every aspect of the life of the church…. are we to conclude that God has given us a prescribed norm or pattern that is so obscure that we ourselves cannot make head or tail of it?” (pp. 131, 132) -- (SCMe-Prints@stone-campbell.org., ©2010). (Emphasis his)

This guy is out there with a distorted view

Agreed, i grew up in an independent Christian church and have seen many people from the CoC denomination that do not nearly fit into the picture painted here. Massive generalization being done here

Sadly, many seem to be absolutely clueless when it comes to the damnable heresies that truly make up a Christian cult, such as: Baptismal Regeneration, Open Theism, Pelagianism, Sinless Perfectionism, etc., all of which are found in the CoC. The restoration movement also gave rise to other cults, such as LDS, JW's, SDA's, Oneness Pentecostalism, etc., which speaks volumes.

From my experience there is no “church of Christ group.” Every church is an individual, autonomous church.

@@bigzachus From your experience, how many of them are teaching baptismal regeneration?

Their silence always speaks volumes!!

Honestly these guys explained the Church of Christ very well. I went to church three times a week for the first twenty years of my life. They are do- ing their best, they’re terrified of God..

I agree with what you said. If Campbell had started a Church (which he did not) they probably would be known today as Campbellite's but I have never heard about that Church. What is evident today is that John the Baptist like Campbell were never commanded to start a church but we have the Baptist Church today.

@@jorgegonze you’re kidding about John the Baptist and the Baptist church, right? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

@@karigross4596 Am just saying what some Baptist say and others deny but in the Bible God never Commanded John to start a Church. If John did not start the Baptist church according to other Baptist then the question is who did?

Spot on. The history was butchered. I will admit that in my experience in the coc the Restoration history is ignored. I find it really funny that the group who embraces their history the most(disciples of Christ) are as far from the movement as possible except they take communion each week.

Yah its always do more research. as far as i know I have never gone online claiming that the coc was started by Campbell which is what you guys have done. In history there was never a group called Campbellites nor did Campbell start a church, just as John the Baptist did not start the Baptist church. Find books that are not bias and you will agree with me,

So where was the true church for 1900 years?

@@Journey_of_Abundance it never went anywhere. It was still going strong. But certainly not in false divisions like the Presbyterians or Roman Catholics.

@@chadh.5004 there's literally no evidence of the church of Christ as you know it until the 1800s. I agree those are false divisions, by the way.

@@Journey_of_Abundance I don’t believe that just because you call yourself the church of Christ that you’re the true church either. And I also don’t think everyone that calls themselves a member will go to Heaven. Jesus said the tares would grow among the wheat. But the fact of the matter is the “Church of Christ” universal the Body of Christ is the Church Jesus built and the the church Paul speaks of when he says that the “churches of Christ” salute you.

@@chadh.5004 If your interpretation of Romans 16:16 is correct, then where did the "churches of Christ" go directly after Paul's time? The people that heard Paul preach have very different beliefs than you and the coc denomination. There's nothing factual about the church of Christ American protestant denomination being the true body of Christ

I was deeply entrenched in the CoC for over 30+years, until the Lord truly saved me. When I was younger, I would've probably written the exact same thing that you have.

You’re saying the “trying your best” is part of the criteria for salvation?

@christrescuedme! What was wrong with what I said, genuinely asking?

@noahcutshaw I know that I’ve been taught my entire life to do my very best, and to also know that I will fall short almost daily, but that’s why there is faith and to trust in God.

@@chelscidpfighter5980 I’m not sure if that answered the question. Was that a yes? The ungodly person who believes and does not have works is given the righteousness of Jesus by faith (Romans 4:6)

Actually, the CoC is much worse than most people realize. Eerily akin to Romanism, the CoC not only injects mysticism into baptism, it promotes it as a requirement for salvation that turns the one who administers the “requirement” into a human mediator, which is blasphemy! There is only one mediator between God and man, Christ Jesus (1 Tim. 2:5). Only He can administer what’s necessary for us to be saved, for He has obtained our redemption and all of the spiritual blessings that accompany salvation (faith, repentance, obedience, love for God and others, etc.).

they cannot accurately refute what CoC teach. because they would condemn their beliefs. Did you notice when Acts 2.38 was read they ignored "be baptized For Forgiveness of sins" they did mentioned the promise mentioned in Acts 2.39 which is 2 fold. which is given to all repentant baptized believers will receive 1) forgiveness of sins 2) the gift of the Holy Spirit which is being sealed by the Holy Spirit Eph 1.13-14

here is what the CoC believes worded a little different than normal Eph 2.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. Some of the questions we need to focus on is 1) what is grace and mercy since they are linked together 2) what is faith (belief) & what is involved in this to have a saving faith (belief) 3) at what point in one's growth in one's faith is one saved 1) what is grace? God giving something we do not deserve. God Forgave us of our sins. Does not contain all aspects of grace what is mercy? God not giving us something we deserve wages of sin is death. God us his son to die on the cross to pay the price for our sins. Does not contain all aspects of mercy 2) what is faith (one's belief) John 3.16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life by this passage many claim that Belief in Jesus is just a mental acknowledgement of Jesus and nothing else. But is this Correct? John 3.19-21 due to time, I'll focus on vs 21 But >>whoever does what is true >his works> whoever does the will

Notice how the CoC will always say we can't earn salvation, but that there are works that we must do in order to get saved. That is a complete contradiction! Two mutually exclusive assertions cannot possibly both be true, within the same context. So this reveals something very sinister within the CoC. Because, obviously, its leaders realize deep down that they are promoting a false gospel not represented in Scripture, or else they would not try so hard to re-define their terms and hide what is really being taught in the CoC when they are exposed.

@@christrescuedme2182 You are the one who keeps twisting things.Which one of these is a work CoC says 1) must believe >> John 3:21 But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God.” >>> this is God clarifying what true belief is >> those who DOES the truth >> isn't this a work 2) must repent true repentance involves a changed life style >> isn't this a work 3) be baptized >> Titus 3.5 says we are not saved by works BUT according to mercy >> what follows is not a work but telling us how to receive GOd's mercy

He's. Lying

Whatever else you learn in this video, you learn the guy in the middle cannot articulate. He uses a passage such as Abraham pleading with God for 10 righteous souls to save Sodom to show there is no one righteous. He fails to mention God saved “just Lot” and his two daughters. If Lot had converted just his family Abraham would have found his 10 and Sodom would have been spared.

Yeah not sure about the cult characterization either. I don’t agree with COC teachings but I always thought the #1 characteristic of a cult is that they can’t have any contact with anyone who has left it and salvation is only through their church/org/etc.

TheLyndsay1990 0 seconds ago He has been ostracized from everyone in the church of Christ because of his beliefs. The church openly says to its congregation that he has sown discord and for their members to not have anything to do with him or his church people. They have been told to not study with them and love them from a distance. This comes because he believes that God is completely sovereign and that baptism is not what saves you. He believes you are saved by faith alone as does this podcast.

They are a cult because they preach a false gospel that is condemned by Scripture. I was a CoC captive for over 30 years and it's only by the grace of God that I have escaped such deception and found the true Savior.

@@christrescuedme2182 What false gospel do they teach?

@@lynnettapierce1741 Baptismal Regeneration and subsequent works for justification.

Do I Have to Be Baptized to be Saved? Aaron Gallagher & Trey Fisher Discussion on Acts 22:16ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-emxJgszo1Lk.html

So she left her CoC congregation?

Same experience in many ways.

This!!! This is exactly what happened to me in the Spring of 2013! Before I was a Christian, I was a universalist (very common in Cali), but I was pretty open-minded about other belief systems, so when this guy (let's call him mike), invited me to, what I thought to be a light Bible study, I agreed, thinking he was completely normal. I went to these Bible studies led by Mike and his friend (we'll call him Paul) at my school. I've come to know they intentionally prey on college students. They said in these studies that the ICoC was the only real church and told me that in order to be saved, I must be baptized in their church and be virtually sinless. Looking back, they cherry-picked about 10 verses and made them the entirety of scripture, which is what all cults do. The first red flag I had was that Mike and Paul called/texted me at, like, 5 AM every morning and told me that if I was truly a devoted Christian, I'd get up hours before sunrise to read my Bible. They then would constantly text me intrusive questions throughout the day. Now, I'm pretty grumpy if I don't get a full night's rest, so that got real tired real fast. The second was that they discouraged me from reading anything other than the book of Acts (not even the other Gospels or any of the epistles) and certainly discouraged me from reading any 'blind theologian', as they would call them. Third, they talked as though they had memorized a script (which there is one that you can find on Google), and if you brought up something they didn't prepare for, they would just say, 'Yeah, Amen,' or something like to just brush it aside. Fourth, Mike and Paul tried to evoke emotional responses. When they explained the way to be saved, they basically interrogated me and questioned whether or not I truly wanted to be saved because I wasn't crying when they gave me their gospel. But the biggest red flag of them all was the night I went to their church a few weeks before Easter and met their congregants. It was, by far, the weirdest, cultiest thing I had ever witnessed. Everyone was nice, but they were too nice and it didn't feel genuine. In researching them, is their love-bombing stage to get people initiated into their cult (which later turns to a shunning stage if you step outta line). Then, they had a collection and everybody looked at me as though I killed someone when I didn't give anything (I was a broke college student at the time; gimme a break!). Mike told me that the church basically owns you and your finances. The sermon was basically 'you need to get baptized in the ICoC way', but what struck me as weird was that the pastor rarely quoted the Bible. He just said what the church tells its congregants to say when they do their evangelism. Mike then introduced me to this super sweet girl, but again, she was a little too sweet and it felt very weird and uncomfortable. She told me that she had prayed for new male members to come and strengthen the body and was super flirtatious all night. She sat next to me, Mike, and Mike's wife during the service, and afterwards, she wouldn't leave me alone. Mike told me when he dropped me off at home that she was praying for a husband, so I better get baptized in their church so I could marry her! I later found out that the ICoC sometimes will arrange marriages and at the very least make you get permission from them if you wanna get married. She probably thought I was gonna be her husband. A whole bunch of the congregants wanted my phone number, which I stupidly gave to them, where they would proceed to call or text me constantly, from 5 AM to the middle of the night. The last straw for me was that Paul wanted me to do something with them during Holy week and I told them no because I had to get ready for my family's Easter party. Paul said something to me about choosing my family over God because cults try to separate you from your families (misapplying the verse about hating your mother and father btw). I kinda went off on him because at that point, I'd had enough and he was acting all apologetic, saying that he wasn't trying to pressure me. That was the last time I ever spoke to any of them. They called and texted, but I blocked all their numbers. I was beyond done with them at that point, and I spent the next few weeks researching them and finding out so much crazy stuff about that cult-like their dangerous disciplinary practices for dissenting members, their financial structure as a pyramid scheme, and the fact that they try to separate you from your family and friends. I avoided certain places at school where I knew they'd be because I didn't want them to harass me. But what Satan meant for evil, God meant for good. In researching about them, I came across Kirk Cameron's and Ray Comfort's ministry Living Waters, where they explained what the true Gospel was and why the ICoC was a cult. If I hadn't come across them, I would be lost to this day. TL;DR: The ICoC is a cult and they're weird, but the Lord used my brief experience with them to bring me to the true Gospel, repentance and faith.

Sounds exactly like the cult “International Church of Christ” and not church of Christ. The ICOC has nothing to do with the actual church of Christ. They do things they call “ discipleship,”’and and other practices that they make up. They are a denomination that was or still is run by a cult leader. Seems like his name was or is Kipp. They were a bigger deal more than 20 years ago and back the. They were the fastest growing cult in the USA, even faster than the Mormon cult. They do not pattern their life and worship by the New Testament alone, like Jesus’ actual church of Christ.

I had the same experience in college. Those folks are not the same as the mainline C of C that originated with Barton, Stone, & Campbell. The campus C of C people are a separate group. However, both groups have questionable theology. The campus folks are a cult and are very controlling.

There are many so-called "churches" throughout the country that call themselves the Church of Christ when in fact they ARE A CULT that just wants your money The statement you made that said: I have been a member of the Church for over 50 years and none of the churches I have attended have said anything like this. The church I attend says you give from your heart as god has prospered you. There is no pressure for anyone to give. Preachers in the CofC quote the bible throughout their sermons to support their statements and reasons for our beliefs. Another statement I have never heard which is beyond silly, I have never heard of this, and like I said I have been in the church for over 50 years. "???? There is NO holy week in the true Church of Christ> Lastly, the farthest thing from the truth is that Our mission is to save the LOST and doing so, bring your friends and family TO Christ, not push you or them away. I suggest you do more research and look for a Church of Christ that is biblically correct and not one that is truly a cult. May God Bless you in your search for the truth.

Can you explain what gospel the thief on the cross obeyed, according to Hebrews 4:2?

Exactly! I attended BOC in the early 90s it's definitely a cult.

I was part of the ICOC in the late 90s / early 2000s. Agreed that it is cult like for sure.

@@gregcarlson8438 they wanted me to move into an all women's home so I could be completely under their control. My brother also attended for a while. He almost lost his marriage over this church. All the women I met had either been socially abused, had serious addiction issues or eating disordered. I am not judging because I fit in one of those categories, just an observation.

@@dianmichaelis I lived in a few of those households. I couldn’t date the girl I was interested in for two years with lots of control over that relationship. We’ve been married for 19 years now so that was a long time ago.

Great point.

Sadly, many seem to be absolutely clueless when it comes to the damnable heresies that truly make up a Christian cult, such as: Baptismal Regeneration, Open Theism, Pelagianism, Sinless Perfectionism, etc., all of which are found in the CoC. The restoration movement also gave rise to other cults, such as LDS, JW's, SDA's, Oneness Pentecostalism, etc., which speaks volumes.

I understand your perspective, but as a result you've simply created your own tradition that you follow and have put yourself in the same position as the other churches from made up traditions.

@@Journey_of_Abundance Thanks Zach I will let Jesus be the judge of that. Have a nice day :) My fellow sinner

@@johncruickshank7455 Ok, but just know that rejecting the hierarchy that God put in place within the Church in no way gets you closer to God. And I agree that coC and other denominations are not legitimate, but that doesn't mean we throw out the baby with the bath water and no longer seek the legitimate Church that Christ established.

The United Church of Christ is a mainstream/mainline Poststent church which was founded early in this country's history. They are a fairly liberal denomination. Nothing cultish at all about them. In my opinion, the Church of Christ used this name to spread around and to hide their true intentions or beliefs. My brother in law and his wife are members and they are extreme in their beliefs. The Atlanta Church of Christ branched off of the Church of Christ and they were very cultish and controlling of their members. Even my COC brother in law called my husband to warn him to stay away from them, because they're a cult. United Churches of Christ are the normal ones. If they aren't called that then they are the cult Church of Christ, which are all over the US.

The international Church of Christ isn’t the church of Christ. They are a cult. They have zero to do with the actual church of Christ. They do not live and worship by the Bible alone, specifically the New Testament. They follow some discipleship program where they all try to be like the cult leader who created the cult.

ICoC is not the same as CoC.

@@txsleepwalker6640 they are not like you said yet have common threads and one branched off from the other. It’s important for people to know the history.

@@darrylmendoza9764 what did I say that is incorrect? My statement was simple. ICOC is not the CoC.

For centuries Christians have tried to biblically reason with CoC leaders, but more often than not, they will tenaciously cling to the Campbellism script that the CoC universities have indoctrinated them into. Sadly, Christians who try to reach them with the true gospel, and expose the CoC's heresies, are often treated as if they are completely ignorant of what the CoC actually teaches, because the veil is still over the eyes of those who are deeply entrenched in it, which makes them unable to fully comprehend the heretical implications of their own belief system.

@@christrescuedme2182 each CoC is it's own local church.. They're known to be nondenominational. He cant speak as though each COC has the same problems.

@@michi-bi They all have the same salvation theology no matter how many peripheral issues may be different.

@@christrescuedme2182 you're quick to condemned without doing actual research of each church. they're locally runned with their own elders how would you kno if they're following heretical or not, you must be self righteous! If u actually cared about these churchs u would pray for them, instead of condemning them. Satan won't stop at trying leading us astray and dividing us, the least u could do is pray that God help them seek truth smh

@@michi-bi Why would you assume that I've not done my research? I've only written an entire book about it. Lol. Perhaps apostle Paul should have just prayed for the Judaizers instead of exposing their false gospel, right?...NOT

Sadly, CoC's are all going by the same Campbellite script, NOT God's Word.

Can you explain what gospel the thief on the cross obeyed according to Hebrews 4:2?

Im sorry to hear that Cindy. I believe we will be doing a follow up soon. I would love to talk with your husband about these things. Praying for you and your situation. God is with you through it all and His plan for you is working out perfectly...continue to trust in him.

Do I Have to Be Baptized to be Saved? Aaron Gallagher & Trey Fisher Discussion on Acts 22:16ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-emxJgszo1Lk.html

@@tdfish311 update: my husband no longer goes to a CoC. He is now going with me to a reformed church. God is so good!

@@CHall338 praise God! Episode TWO comes out Tuesday. Answering the objections. You can also see a lot of CoC content on my RU-vid channel, The Parish Reformed. Praise God Cindy!

what they teach does not match what the Scripture teaches which follows Eph 2.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. Some of the questions we need to focus on is 1) what is grace and mercy since they are linked together 2) what is faith (belief) & what is involved in this to have a saving faith (belief) 3) at what point in one's growth in one's faith is one saved 1) what is grace? God giving something we do not deserve. God Forgave us of our sins. Does not contain all aspects of grace what is mercy? God not giving us something we deserve wages of sin is death. God us his son to die on the cross to pay the price for our sins. Does not contain all aspects of mercy 2) what is faith (one's belief) John 3.16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life by this passage many claim that Belief in Jesus is just a mental acknowledgement of Jesus and nothing else. But is this Correct? John 3.19-21 due to time, I'll focus on vs 21 But >>whoever does what is true >his works> whoever does the will

@@jayu2551 We are saved when we believe in Christ. I recieved the baltism of the Holy Spirit in my bedroom. We must believe with everything in us, i have been baltized as we should. But those dieing can ask Jesus to be LORD of them and He will be. For those who are alive on earth, accept Jesus, be baptized and walk it out. Walking it out exercises our trust in Him and our belief that He will care for us. If we believe in anything we are going to walk that out. But we are saved not by works but because of what Jesus already accomplished. When we walk it out it is a testament of whether we really believed when we said it or not. If we continue to try verses saying we believe and not caring when we are convicted. We are saved by nothing of ourselves. The works that we are speaking about, are what we do after we believe/profess to be believers. We judge by the believers fruit.

@@sherricoffee7067 Sadly, the CoC has no true knowledge of how we are to “work OUT our salvation with fear and trembling,” rather than work FOR our salvation which is why it always isolates this passage from the verse that follows, “For it is God which worketh in you to will and to do of His good pleasure” (Phil. 2:12-13).

@@christrescuedme2182 Amen! If not for grace, then why did Jesus take our sin upon Him? When Jesus said it is done, we doubt the Word of God if we believe there is something we who are filth (made rightouse by Him) believe we should add to it with some miserable work that is thought of and exercised through a willingness to produce evil and not good? Without Jesus we are filthy rags. Glory to God we are made rightouse and stand in front of God now because of what Jesus did. After we see our sin, then He shows us our savior whoch brings hope, then the actions of our walk produce fruit, not works, but living to love Him and let Him live through us... Not working, living. You are right friend. Thank you for your reply.

@@sherricoffee7067 Into what church were believers added (Acts 2:47) after being baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)? The Church of Christ (Romans 16:16). ♥️ Jesus is not coming back for multiple churches that teach different doctrines and false plans of salvation (Galatians 1:8). He is not a polygamist. He is coming back for His one Bride. 💜 There is no authority for denominations in Scripture (division). All who die in a denomination die in a lost condition. He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.” Matthew 15:13 Baptism of the Holy Spirit only occurred twice with the apostles, all apostolic gifts have ceased 1 Corinthians 13 “Not by faith alone” James 2:24

Thanks for sharing. Yes, the Boston movement can often be more aggressive than mainline CoC's, but they both still share the same salvation theology, which is why they both end up with the same sad outcomes.

No every COC is the same but one thing I would say to you is that Ephesians 2:8-9 says we are saved by Grace through faith. no grace only not faith only.

@@jorgegonze Do you believe we should trust in Jesus Christ ALONE, or in Jesus plus other gods too? Please give an honest response.

That is the same group who I started with in Calgary, Alberta, Canada.

It feels so good to not be alone. I too was a part of this church.

YES, thank you!!

Of course you’re going to say that. Catholics say it too. It’s what you practice and emphasize though.

I was deeply involved in the CoC for over 30 years. And sadly, it's system of works is safeguarded by theological term-twisting. Instead of being taught that Jesus satisfied God’s law perfectly on behalf of His people, it teaches that Jesus merely lowered the bar so that anyone can just slip in, as long as they just try hard enough to live up to their full potential and do the best they can. They give people a false hope that they can eventually reach a degree of righteousness that God will accept. When the truth is that the only righteousness that God will accept is the imputed righteousness of Christ. "For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God" (Rom. 10:3).

@@christrescuedme2182 idk who taught you that Jesus has lowered the bar but again I have never heard it presented in such a way. I have to ask if that’s is your belief then are you saying all i have to do is believe and I can live like a heathen if I choose. That’s ludicrous. I promise the COC know we are all flawed. That’s laid out in literal black and white. If expecting believers to live a faithful life makes the COC a cult then I’m proud to be a part of it. I don’t know a single person who believes their works will earn their salvation.

But if Baptism is required for salvation, that is a work. That is a thing a person must do in order to be saved. Jesus did ALL that is needed for our salvation. It's a gift of grace offered to all. We just have to accept it. Anything else we do is not required for salvation but done to please/serve/obey God.

Can you please explain what gospel the thief on the cross obeyed, according to Hebrews 4:2?

Does it concern you that you've been unable to demonstrate an ability to harmonize the CoC's "new terms of salvation" with Hebrews 4:2?

@@christrescuedme2182 Hebrews 4:2 affirms as Romans 10:17 does that faith must be joined with hearing the gospel. The thief professed his faith that Jesus was innocent any wrong and that He is the Messianic King in his plea for Christ to remember Him. This was before Jesus's death, burial, and resurrection which is the saving gospel, and before Jesus's command of baptism in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This was all before the new covenant of Christ being established through His death, burial, resurrection, and ascension to God (Heb 9:15-17).

@@scottshifferd8439 So how do you reconcile that two-gospel theory with Hebrews 4:2 and its parallel passages (e.g., Isa.53:1, Jn. 12:38, Rom. 3:29-30; 10:16 and Gal. 3:6-8)?

HINT #1: In those verses, notice that according to Isaiah, John and Paul, the “report” of Isaiah 53 was nothing less than the pure and unadulterated gospel of Jesus Christ, with nothing added to it. Also carefully notice that Isaiah, John and Paul never equated water baptism with obeying the gospel (Rom. 10:16), because the gospel of Jesus Christ does NOT include man’s own contributions. The sum and substance of the entire gospel is simply Christ and Him crucified (1 Cor. 2:2), nothing more, nothing less. These truths not only confirm the fact that the true gospel was preached long before Pentecost, but they also further disprove the CoC’s theory of water baptism being a part of the gospel message.

I don't think they were saying those theologies are what the Robertsons believe but that the Robertsons go to a church that officially believes those things. Edit: Many people I know don't believe every single thing their particular church teaches.

If that’s the case then great. Just from listening, to me it sounding like they are were implying that’s was the Robertson’s theology. The way the conversation flowed. But, yea if that’s the case and I misunderstood than great. I still think a unashamed/cultish podcast would be awesome.

As you watch the Unashamed podcast (which I love btw), pay attention to the debates between Jase and Phil on topics such as baptism or works. If you pay attention you will start to pickup that Phil is much more hardline CoC than Jase. I think Jase gets it. Saved by Grace!

I get what your saying. But from listening I don’t think Phil believe it’s Faith plus Works. I think he’s just has such an evangelistic heart for the simplicity of the Gospel. When he lays out how we are sinners in need and Jesus. And we put our faith in him, we are baptized, and we go on our way “trying to to good.” Everytime I hear Phil talk about works, he always, always says “try to do good” not “you must do good” he always says “try” and he has said we may fail, he admits he did a bit earlier on as a believer. But, he still pursued Christ, and kept trying. So, just from what I hear, nothing he’s said has felt like faith plus works. More like saved by Grace, and because of the change in your heart, you’ll see the goodness of Christ start to permeate from you by the Spirit. But, if you stumble Jesus is your advocate to the Father. That’s just my opinion from listening.

Praise the Lord Jesus Christ! Thank you for sharing.

So sad you fell into apostasy

Really Trail Reeves? You seem pretty smug about it: and by what standard, was it the Bible - because I’m pretty sure that’s been covered…

@@trailrvs why apostasy??

@@Me-ic3li lol ‘saved out of’? What kind of Church of Christ aka basically Baptist church did you go to?

And the wrong reason to be baptized is when one attempts to make use of a sacrament to save oneself. If one is baptized in order to get saved, then it becomes an impure, meaningless and defiled work of the flesh that God has no part in. An unregenerate act that attempts to appease God’s wrath, instead of believing Jesus has already done that for us, becomes a witness against us. So unless God first purifies our hearts by faith, nothing we do will be pure in His sight (Titus 1:15). It is dangerous ground when one tries to go through an outward performance in order to try to bribe God into saving them, for that is an abomination to Him!

The more I read of your comments the more I have to believe you do not have a grasp on the COC teachings or you are part of a rouge group that doesn’t adhere to the teachings of any COC I know of. The correct reasons to be baptized is simply and well laid out in scripture. You have to explain away baptism in every other faith. Jesus himself commanded it in the great commission. We are baptized into one body not baptized into membership of the baptist or Methodist or any other denomination. Baptized into Christ.

@@nickrussell8029 who cares about the nutty COC teaching. Care about the true Gospel. Repent and be converted and stop making asinine arguments that show no fruits of salvation.

@@this9128 your statement is conjecture. I could say the same in reference to your beliefs. Consider practicing humility or do you not believe in that either?

Baptism is a beautiful, symbolic ordinance to be once enjoyed by all who believe in the sufficiency of Jesus’ perfect sacrifice. Whereas those who say it’s a requirement for salvation, mar its beauty by implying His grace and sacrifice wasn’t enough. Therefore, the person going through the ordinances must know and believe beyond all shadow of a doubt that their salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Jesus’ perfect righteousness alone as their only hope of God’s acceptance, or else the ordinance becomes a witness against them.

I know a Baptist who is KJV only. I started attending a different Baptist church that uses esv. So I'm confused.

Have you read "Christ Rescued Me from the Church of Christ"?

​@@KM-zn3lxI've never understood the obsession with a Bible altered by a biased king who wasn't a great guy. Government bible.

Praise our Lord Jesus and God our Father

I can relate. Thank God Jesus rescued you too.

Qq

@Yvonne Yes! Even in Acts 11:16-18, Peter describes what God had done in Acts 10, and there’s absolutely no mention of water baptism saving anyone, but only of Holy Spirit baptism into the Body of Christ through faith. He is wonderful indeed! And everything we need to know is right there in His Word.

@Yvonne I agree. Water baptism is often, but not always, one of the first fruits of sanctification. Sadly, the CoC confuses justification with sanctification, just as Rome does.

I was in the CoC for over 30 yrs. and I know of zero that don't preach Baptismal regeneration, but they won't call it that. They all try to redefine it.

@@christrescuedme2182 that’s what I thought, thank you! 🙂

@V.H. Mizzell I was recently kicked out of a chat room because I refused to believe that the gifts had ceased. I never knew what denomination/belief system the group predominantly identified with, but CoC would make sense (int’l or otherwise). I thought that to be such a strange sticking point for them.

@@texanruss1470 John MacArthur is a cessationist.

I’m sorry that was your experience. Thankfully mine has been very different. Grace has been a central teaching, and all the more so in my theology courses at Cincinnati Bible College and Seminary, mostly under Dr Jack Cottrell. It really seems to depend on the particular Church.

Faith alone is heresy

@@Nicholas-Michael The CoC teaches that faith + works = justification The Bible teaches that true faith = justification + works There's an eternal difference between the two.

Nowhere in the bible does it say all those things have to be done in conjunction to be saved either. Sounds like the works of pharisees to suggest it. I do wonder if there are levels of importance though. Surely faith supersedes immersion by water

Speak for your self. I know my repentance you don't and thank you are not my judge.

What a stupid thing to say.

Please try to lay aside whatever qualms you have with what you call Calvinism, and actually engage the Scriptures, in context. After all, Romans 5, for instance, was written way before Augustine ever came along. People can try to disprove God's Word by calling it Calvinism all day long, but despite such desperate attempts, sacred Scripture is still set in stone and cannot be broken. Although Pelagian cults, such as the CoC, will acknowledge Bible passages that declare sin is not imputed where there’s no law, they will twist them to their own destruction, by suggesting that Adam’s sin could not have been imputed to the entire human race because God’s law hadn’t been set in stone yet. However, they fail to realize the blatantly obvious fact that sin WAS imputed to Adam, which happens to be irrefutable, biblical proof that there WAS indeed a rule of righteousness to be obeyed, even BEFORE God’s written law ever came about (e.g. Rom. 3:31; 4:15 and 5:13). Therefore, the fact that sin WAS imputed to humanity’s representative head, despite there being no written law, further proves and clarifies Apostle Paul’s point that Adam’s sin WAS imputed to all of his posterity. “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned” (Rom. 5:12). Adam’s sin guilt was imputed to all mankind, or else we wouldn’t have needed for it, and our own personal sin guilt, to be imputed to Jesus at the cross. And, this very same principle reveals to us why we desperately need Jesus’ righteousness imputed to our account, in order for the imputation of Adam’s sin guilt, and our own personal sin guilt, to be cancelled out. If there was no inherited sin guilt in Adam, then why would there be a need for us to be in Christ in order to escape condemnation (Rom. 8:1)? We will be waiting patiently for your answer.

Into what church were believers added (Acts 2:47) after being baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)? The Church of Christ (Romans 16:16). ♥️ Jesus is not coming back for multiple churches that teach different doctrines and false plans of salvation (Galatians 1:8). He is not a polygamist. He is coming back for His one Bride. 💜 There is no authority for denominations in Scripture (division). All who die in a denomination die in a lost condition. He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.” Matthew 15:13

The True Church of Jesus Christ, which is a spiritual body of believes, not a certain physical building that takes up space, cannot be synonymous with the COC cult. You’re saying that you’re the true church simply because it’s in the name. This is simply a hasty generalization fallacy. If I call myself Christian and don’t do the works of a Christian, am I a Christian? We should know this answer.

So you believe one must be baptized in order to get saved?

It is what the scripture says. What do you suggest he believe?

But why does the CoC refuse to answer those questions biblically?

@@christrescuedme2182 ur assuming they dont

@@thegollyer903 Then let's test that theory. Can you explain how the thief on the cross was saved?

@@christrescuedme2182 yes. The new covenant hasn't started yet. Hebrews 9 16-17

@@thegollyer903 How do you reconcile that view with Hebrews 4:2?

I was in the CoC for over 30+years and thought the same way you have expressed, because I didn't realize what I was really being taught to believe, and the serious implications of those beliefs, until the Lord saved me. For instance, although our “second laws of pardon” were conditioned upon our own works, the CoC claimed that these works were exempt from Paul’s condemnation of works salvation, because they were supposedly works of a different category….those that baptism had made acceptable for salvation. The CoC would also elusively dodge Paul’s condemnation of works salvation by giving lip service to the fact that one couldn’t earn salvation. But what was really meant was that one could not initially earn salvation, for one could not lay the sacramental groundwork for salvation, which Jesus supposedly did when He instituted baptism. But after baptism, “works” of repentance, faith, etc….could be meritorious, for they were now “baptized works,” acceptable for meriting or earning salvation. So, the gist was that one couldn’t earn salvation by works…until after baptism, which was still a salvation by works… just misleadingly worded different.

Was never taught any of that either. Good thing Churches of CHRIST are independent.

Baptism does not "save" as in it doesn't provide justification for you before God. Salvation (as expressed in the reformed faith) is clearly by grace through faith alone (Ephesians 2:8-9). Baptism is simply a sign of outward obedience as well as being included in the covenant community.

In 1 Peter 3:20, Noah’s family was “saved by water” only in the sense that the reality of their salvation became obvious through the trial of water, for they were enabled by God to pass safely through the destructive waters by being in the Ark, which represented Christ. The word “by” in this verse is translated “through” in the original Greek. The water itself was a means of God’s judgment, not a means of salvation.

I think the parenthetical statement clarifies this. Here's the verse using the NKJV: "There is also an antitype which now saves us-baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ," Do you see how that parenthetical statement reveals that baptism is linked to the "good answer" of one's heart towards God in faith?

@@lai_strength_training by saying baptism is “simply” a sign of outward obedience as well as being part of the covenant “community” suggests we have a choice of outward obedience and being joined with the covenant. Faith is that power that gives us the ability to “obey from the heart” that form of doctrine that was delivered to you. Baptism cannot be excluded from the doctrine that was handed down. And since we obey from the heart, it is more than an outward sign. It involves every part of us and the Holy Spirit is involved as well. Nothing physical about it except that we submit as we are buried.

@@aaronbeverly4711 The assumption in the CoC was that a physical coming to the front of the church, to soothe a guilty conscience, was automatically equivalent to a spiritual coming to Christ. This was due to an extreme emphasis placed on the will of man, and the idea that man’s choice has the final say as to whether one is saved or not. Once Jesus reveals Himself to one's heart and mind, they are finally able to apprehend the gospel of His grace, by faith. Then their conscience is finally purged from dead works so that one can then serve the living God (Heb. 9:14). One must first be justified by faith, then and only then can they begin the process of sanctification. And baptism is often, but not always, one of the first fruits of sanctification. Sadly, the CoC confuses justification and sanctification, just as Romanism does. And for them to put the cart before the horse is to glorify man and his works, rather than God alone. “God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by Whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.” (Gal. 6:14). The heart (which is the seat of our conscience, thoughts, emotions and choices), must be made anew by a supernatural act of God, due to the effects of being spiritually deadened by sin. Although we don’t have the ability to do this ourselves, it does not excuse us from being responsible toward God, for we are still fully conscious, self-aware and actively rebellious. He does not lower His standard just because we are fallen. This is why we need the Savior, Who lived up to God’s perfect standard of righteousness perfectly. I hope this helps. God bless.

Wonderful testimonies like yours helps make outreaches to CoC's even more encouraging!! Thanks for sharing.

Into what church were believers added (Acts 2:47) after being baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)? The Church of Christ (Romans 16:16). ♥️ Jesus is not coming back for multiple churches that teach different doctrines and false plans of salvation (Galatians 1:8). He is not a polygamist. He is coming back for His one Bride. 💜 There is no authority for denominations in Scripture (division). All who die in a denomination die in a lost condition. He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.” Matthew 15:13

@@christrescuedme2182 and with what plan of salvation do you reach out to them? (Galatians 1:8).

@@christrescuedme2182 where is your Scripture for your arguments? (Book, chapter, verse) “The Holy Book of My Feelings”

@@christrescuedme2182 Jesus commands water baptism, Mark 16:16, John 3:5 He says his commandments are not burdensome 1 John 5:3 Which Bible are you reading, may I ask?

All the links you need are in my book "Christ Rescued Me from the Church of Christ" by Lee Anne Ferguson

@@christrescuedme2182 Yes, excellent book! Says it all in a way you can't misunderstand.

@@arcticfox2639 Thank you. I really needed some encouragement. This battle has really been taking its toll on me. Your prayers would also be greatly appreciated. Time seems to be running out for me to reach my CoC people.

@@christrescuedme2182 Some of my friends and family are still in that church. I love them so much, but the brainwashing is so extreme that it is impossible to break through to them. I just pray that God will break through their programming. It is so comforting for these people to believe that salvation is in their own hands so they can control it. But then, they cannot say they are sure that they're even saved!! Some of my family became atheists and others just became worldly and gave up on spirituality altogether. Praise God, my mother, who was CoC for 50 years came to understand the gospel! I rejoice in this! I do believe some members in the CoC are saved, because they understand that it is not works that save them. Many of the hymns they sing teach truth, like: "What can wash away my sins?.... nothing but the blood of Jesus!" These types of hymns are gospel messages that they accept. Keep praying and I will include you and your loved ones in my prayers. I will do this. Pray for me also. God bless you!

@@arcticfox2639 I definitely will! Please stay in touch and keep me updated. My email address and blog is on the back of my book.

The gospel was given to me by someone from the church of Christ, and I was saved. I never heard anything like this before that they are bringing up which surprises me!

Well said, this video was a misrepresentation from my 30+ years of experience.

@@mr400meter Sadly, the CoC makes water baptism and the gospel synonymous.

@@poseyperspective3591 I was in the CoC for over 30 years, but thankfully I now have over 17 years under my belt as a true, born-again believer.

@@christrescuedme2182 What is your interpretation of 1 Peter 3:32 regarding Peter's claim that baptism now saved believers?

Because it's nowhere in Scripture probably.

here is a brief summary of what some, most, coC believe about grace, when is grace received, but not worded in the way they usually say it Eph 2.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. Some of the questions we need to focus on is 1) what is grace and mercy since they are linked together 2) what is faith (belief) & what is involved in this to have a saving faith (belief) 3) at what point in one's growth in one's faith is one saved 1) what is grace? God giving something we do not deserve. God Forgave us of our sins. Does not contain all aspects of grace what is mercy? God not giving us something we deserve wages of sin is death. God us his son to die on the cross to pay the price for our sins. Does not contain all aspects of mercy 2) what is faith (one's belief) John 3.16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life by this passage many claim that Belief in Jesus is just a mental acknowledgement of Jesus and nothing else. But is this Correct? John 3.19-21 due to time, I'll focus on vs 21 But >>whoever does what is true >his works> whoever does the will

Like Pelagianism, the CoC denies our desperate need of the Savior as soon as we’re conceived (Ps. 51:5; 58:3). Never mind that infants often have to pay the wages of sin, which is death. Although they are innocent of volitional sin (Jer. 2:34), they have inherent sin, or else no babies would ever die. “For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (Rom. 6:23).

@@christrescuedme2182 Psalm 51 doesn't say what you want it to say. Infants die for the same reason Adam did - he didn't have access to the Tree of Life. At least that's what the narrative says. You should actually read your Bible.

@@HoytRoberson I actually do read my Bible, unlike some who try to make up their own narrative to fit the CoC's pet doctrines. Scripture is clear. "The wages of SIN is death" (Rom. 6:23). It does NOT say the wages of "the lack of access to the tree of life" is death. Adam DID have access to the tree of life, until he sinned. Since then, God has kept mankind from that tree, in order to prevent them from living forever in a fallen condition. However, those who receive the gift of eternal life through Jesus Christ will once again have access to the tree of life (Rev. 22:2).

THIS!!! Thank you. ❤️

“Salvation includes … continuing to try and live according to what Christ asks of us…” Works

@@hawkeye2958 you can label anything works, that doesn’t make it logical. Christ said, “if you love me you will keep my commandments and my commandments are not burdensome.” I Guess the Israelites should have sat down on the bank of the Red Sea and not crossed b/c that would have been “working” for their salvation. Trying to live like Christ asks us too is not “works” anymore that what the Israelites did, it is humble obedience.

@@shellbell2167 There's a huge difference between those who wanted to escape Romanism (the true reformers) and those who wanted to "restore" Romanism. The Stone/Campbell "restorationists" claimed to restore “unity,” based on what they termed “the ancient gospel.” But what they actually “restored” was the Roman Catholic, sacramental concept of salvation, primarily, Baptismal Regeneration.

@@shellbell2167 Can you please explain to us exactly what gospel the thief on the cross obeyed according to Hebrews 4:2?

I’ve never seen the things described in any Church of Christ today .. what I’ve seen is basically Baptist .. Idk what weird ‘churches’ / cult versions people are going to today

do you read the Bible?

@@tomcollins3972 Yes, I read the Bible. It plainly and clearly teaches the doctrine of baptismal regeneration. From the beginning of Christian history Christians have always believed in baptismal regeneration because the text clearly teaches it. The text is so clear concerning baptismal regeneration that zero writings exist speaking against it for the first 1500 years of Christendom.

Into what church were believers added (Acts 2:47) after being baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)? The Church of Christ (Romans 16:16). ♥️ Jesus is not coming back for multiple churches that teach different doctrines and false plans of salvation (Galatians 1:8). He is not a polygamist. He is coming back for His one Bride. 💜 There is no authority for denominations in Scripture (division). All who die in a denomination die in a lost condition. He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.” Matthew 15:13

@@tomcollins3972 Into what church were believers added (Acts 2:47) after being baptized into Christ (Galatians 3:27)? The Church of Christ (Romans 16:16). ♥️ Jesus is not coming back for multiple churches that teach different doctrines and false plans of salvation (Galatians 1:8). He is not a polygamist. He is coming back for His one Bride. 💜 There is no authority for denominations in Scripture (division). All who die in a denomination die in a lost condition. He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots.” Matthew 15:13

Is Baptism for the Remission of Sins? Aaron Gallagher & Trey Fisher Debate/Discussionru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-r2bJElZwKx0.html

Although the CoC claims to have no formal creeds, you might want to better familiarize yourself with the CoC's official literature, which speaks volumes.

@@christrescuedme2182 where does one go to find official CoC literature? I would suggest this doesn’t exist. Sad to learn after all these years that I am in a cult.

@@cartermahanay2729 One of the CoC's official publications is called "House to House Heart to Heart." It deceptively re-defines biblical terminology, which confirms all that's being exposed about the CoC. It's better late than never, when it comes to realizing one's true spiritual condition. There's still time to repent and to come to the true Jesus of the Bible; the true Savior Who actually saves rather than expecting people to save themselves first.

@@cartermahanay2729 Also, one of the CoC"s main publishers is "The Gospel Advocate," which has been aggressively promoting the CoC's secret creeds (that it claims not to have) since 1866.

@@christrescuedme2182 those are not COC official literature. The COC has no official literature other than scripture. Those are publications put out by members of the COC. House to house, heart to heart is under the oversight of a specific congregation, but it would only demonstrate that local congregation’s beliefs, not ALL COC’s. Therefore it cannot be “official literature.” Each COC is autonomous and doesn’t believe everything in those publications is scriptural. Some congregations use house to house to help with evangelism, others do not believe it is accurate and won’t use it. Gospel Advocate is no different than any other publishing company for instance, Zondervan. G.A. will publish items in line with their views just like Zondervan published items in line with their views. Still doesn’t make GA the light on the hill for or official literature. Each Church follows their understanding of scripture. Not every church with the name COC on the sign is scriptural and not every church that has something else on their sign is “unscriptural” either. It’s a gross misunderstanding to lump all COC’s together, each is different. Like I tell my kids. You find a church that follows scripture, I don’t care what is on their sign.

I am part of the coC. 1) we do not have to reconcile being a new creation when one is saved. that is what is Found in Romans 6.3ff 2) there is the OT Law given by Moses which is no longer for us today See the last couple of vs of Hebrews 8. and the NT law of Christ see 1 Cor 9.21 and Gal 6.2 which God Prophesied in the OT will be written on the hearts of Christians 3) God's word is recorded as saying Moses wrote the OT law on Stone and He will write the new law NT on his people's hearts, there are 3 ages, dispensations, in the Bible. 1) the patriarchal age, Creation till Moses, 2) Mosaic age, from Moses receiving the commandments in the wilderness to Jesus' death, 3) the Christian age from day of Pentecost when the church began till the end of the world 4) Not familiar with the passage you are referring to about the Heart born of flesh and changed to Stone and back to flesh. >>>with this said,

We understand metaphor.

The CoC absolutely detests being called a denomination. and they do not believe that they are truly saved until they finally get to heaven.

@@christrescuedme2182 Sorry but this is a totally false statement. If you follow the requirements to become a member of Christs' church the one spoken about in the NT, then d you can know you are saved because you know you have been to the "Church", The Called OUT", The "SAVED". there is no question about not knowing whether you are saved or not.

@@sandragibby7611 Do you truly believe one is saved by going to the "Church of Christ" denomination, and following its "New Testament Pattern" ?

Yes really there were sooooooo many commercials ugh.

Do you think that's literal water?

It's so good to hear from others who have been through the same thing. Thank you so much for sharing your testimony!

@Yvonne So true. That's how it was for me when I was in the CoC. But once God led me to true expositions of scripture, I remember being brought to tears when God finally gave me the blessed assurance that He accepted the righteousness of Christ on behalf of sinners like me. And I've never been the same since! He set me free! Needless to say, Jesus became precious to me as I perceived a peace in my soul that He had always loved me with an everlasting love, and that I was His forever. By the Lord giving me such strong consolation, I was finally able to know true, supernatural and eternal “joy and peace in believing” (Rom. 15:13), without a terrifying fear of losing my faith and ending up in Hell! God saved me because Jesus is perfect, Not because my faith, repentance or knowledge of His truth was perfect.

1 Corinthians 1:14 “I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;” “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.”Psalms 51:5 We are born with a sin nature

@@rickraybourn7456 The CoC suggests that Paul was just thankful that he hadn’t personally baptized the Christians at Corinth because they were calling themselves by the name of the person who had performed their baptism. But this lame excuse makes Paul out to be a tease who tells them that they can only be saved by water baptism… but then withholds it from them! So, the CoC system must answer the question… just how in the world did Paul begat believers in Corinth through the gospel if he didn’t baptize them? Because Paul clearly stated: “for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel” (1 Cor. 4:15). Ironically, the CoC's characteristic ploy of trying to defend a lie with another lie always catches up with it, and proves that the gospel Paul preached….was Not the CoC's watered-down “water gospel."

Reggie, thank you for your testimony. That is exactly what I have witnessed with the CoC churches around me.

1 Corinthians 1:14 “I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;” “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me.”Psalms 51:5 We are born with a sin nature

@@rickraybourn7456 thank you Rick.

Lot of misrepresentation

Care to provide an exegetical demonstration of why they were wrong to use the texts in the way that they did?

It is sad that the CoC always seems to get away with flying under the radar, while all other cults are given a more thorough expose.'

The creators chose to monetize or not. RU-vid determines the ads. Even if the creator choses not to monetize ie. profit from the ads RU-vid will still run ads and keep all the advertising money for themselves. There are ways to avoid the ads that involve changing the speed the video plays at or fast forwarding then rewinding the video. Personally I let the video play through and hopefully who Im supporting gets some ad money. I can just turn down the volume for the ads. If ungodly companies wind up paying to spread the Gospel well then the jokes on them, Im not buying their junk no matter how much money the spend trying to manipulate me.

Check in their playlists.

Church of Christ was a unity movement to my knowledge, not a restoration movement. It was a highly idealistic idea to essentially just bring together all the presbies and Methodists and Baptists etc into one church. It has no core theology but rather some traditional trends which are simply common among the various churches. The congregations themselves are completely independent from each other

That’s not to say the child was perfect but God sanctifies the children of believers.

@@guessable So do you believe that non-believer's babies go to hell?

@@masonskaggs1711 I don’t believe they do but I wouldn’t be able to make a good argument either way because I don’t think scripture is clear. I only know God is sovereign, just and good.

@@guessable What about when Jesus tells the disciples to not shew away the children "But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."

@@edshepherd3291 that’s doesn’t mean the child is sinless. In the verse after He is clear that the Kingdom is theirs because of their faith, not because of what they have done.

This will not help you to know what the church teaches because these guys don’t even know.

American Hinduism is what some have called it. They believe in reincarnation. They are in the same grouping as Christian Science, Religious Science, and other Mind Sciences groups.

Because of his background he had to clarify that Steven Lawson was talking about disagreement among each other because of infant baptism and not baptism for salvation. Reformed Christianity agree on almost all things besides infant baptism. It’s a joke among each other because it’s not a salvation issue. Steven Lawson let him know real quick that that is exactly what he was talking about. Just a joke among brothers on infant baptism. He wasn’t being corrected or correcting, he just wanted clarification that he mentioned baptism on infant baptism and not baptism as a work to be saved because of the COC drilling in his mind that baptism is what saves you.

@@TheLyndsay1990 I understand that part, it's the part where Steven says they are not brothers and the guy was hurt and that it's his Nineveh. I think it's his thing he needs to repent of I guess.

No they weren't.

@@HoytRoberson your pagan magic water ritual won't save you only God saves. Im sorry you need externalism because you lack the Spirit :(, praying that changes. The best gift ever

@@PurePuritan apparently, you haven't read your Bible. Baptism was normative in coming to God and is described as both saving and resulting in being raised with Christ. Hoping you learn how to read one of these days.

@@HoytRoberson except when ppl recieve the Spirit before baptism. Like me. Sorry!

@@PurePuritan people received the Spirit - at least manifestations of it - in the NT. So what - assuming you actually did? Please do some actual exegesis of the practice of baptism as it is discussed in the NT. Then come back and we'll see if you learned anything.

@Jon - This is where proper hermeneutics comes into play. Peter could not possibly be saying that baptism (as in the act of being dipped in water) actually saves you, because that would put him in contradiction with Paul (and the entire NT). Since there are no Scriptural contradictions, we know that is not what he is saying. Context is key. In context, Peter is speaking of the Ark and the times of Noah. He says "which corresponds to THIS" - well, the "this" harkens back to speaking of the days of Noah and the fact that 8 people were brought safely through water in the Ark, which is a type and shadow of Christ. Christ is OUR ARK. He even says in v. 21 - "Not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience" Since he is not speaking of "dirt" or "the body", it is clear he is not even speaking of physical baptism, but rather spiritual baptism, that is baptism into Christ, who is our Ark. He is speaking of Union with Christ as our Ark of safety from the judgment of God. Judgment fell on Christ just as the judgment of the flood waters fell on the ark. The word for "appeal" has the idea of a pledge, agreeing to certain conditions of a covenant. A person is saved by faith alone in Christ, but their guilty conscience is also cleansed and no longer plagued by sin and guilt since they can rest in the peace that Christ has paid their debt.

In 1 Peter 3:20, Noah’s family was “saved by water” only in the sense that the reality of their salvation became obvious through the trial of water, for they were enabled by God to pass safely through the destructive waters by being in the Ark, which represented Christ. The word “by” in this verse is translated “through” in the original Greek. The water itself was a means of God’s judgment, not a means of salvation. Baptism does not put away the filth of the flesh (v. 21). And a symbol cannot literally purge a guilty conscience. It can only be an outward sign of what’s already occurred inwardly. Baptism, in no way, shape or form, effects what it signifies. Yet the CoC claims that it does.

CoC teaches Acts 2.38 where Repentance and Baptism of believers results in forgiveness of sin. Acts 22.16 Paul was told to arise and be Baptized (the mode is immersion in water) which results is the washing away (the forgiveness) of one's sins. then most CoC teaches Titus 3.5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the Washing (which is result of one being Baptized Acts 22.16) of Regeneration ( when using a more familiar term which is Rebirth, which means to be born Again) Titus 3.5 could easily be read as Christians are saved by God's mercy by Baptism which washes away our sins and by which Christians are Born again. since scriptures show us that we receive forgiveness during being Baptized it is very easy to understand 1 Pt. 3.21 that state baptism now saves us. Mk 16.16 whoever believes and is baptized will be saved. According to Acts 2.37-38 the first step of salvation is ones belief in Jesus. the Second step is to repent and the third step is to be baptized>> when all steps are fulfilled the result will be forgiveness of sins. If one leaves out any of the steps, especially the First step, one cannot be saved even if all other steps are followed, thus it is written If one does not believe he will be condemned. without faith one cannot be saved, But the true faith (no contradictions) includes baptism (immersion in water)

also check out my response to Zandrello

@@zandrello This is where proper hermeneutics comes into play. true but you do not use it. the Statement you made " Peter could not possibly be saying that baptism (as in the act of being dipped in water) actually saves you, because that would put him in contradiction with Paul (and the entire NT). Since there are no Scriptural contradictions, we know that is not what he is say how can you say " 1 Peter 3.21 is not referring to water baptism. when we see all these other references referring to the necessity of water baptism. Acts 2.38 where Repentance and Baptism of believers results in forgiveness of sin. Acts 22.16 Paul was told to arise and be Baptized (the mode is immersion in water) which results is the washing away (the forgiveness) of one's sins. Gal 3.27 we have been baptized into Christ Rom 6.3 those who have been baptized into Christ were baptized into his death , at which time we buried and our old body is put to death and then raised to walk in newness of life then most CoC teaches Titus 3.5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the Washing (which is result of one being Baptized Acts 22.16) of Regeneration ( when using a more familiar term which is Rebirth, which means to be born Again) Titus 3.5 could easily be read as Christians are saved by God's mercy by Baptism which washes away our sins and by which Christians are Born again. since scriptures show us that we receive forgiveness during being Baptized it is very easy to understand 1 Pt. 3.21 that state baptism now saves us. Mk 16.16 whoever believes and is baptized will be saved. According to Acts 2.37-38 the first step of salvation is ones belief in Jesus. the Second step is to repent and the third step is to be baptized>> when all steps are fulfilled the result will be forgiveness of sins. If one leaves out any of the steps, especially the First step, one cannot be saved even if all other steps are followed, thus it is written If one does not believe he will be condemned. without faith one cannot be saved, But the true faith (no contradictions) includes baptism (immersion in water) can include more scriptures where the Belief "baptism is not necessary" contradicts what the scripture teaches

Yes, baptism is required for salvation. One cannot go to Heaven without it . One doesn’t need a scholar, only a Bible.

John 3:5 is water from being born, not water baptism. Mark 16:16 is simple if you aren’t told to believe something it doesn’t say. It says whoever believes and is baptized will be saved. It is telling us those 2 things are required. You can’t deny this. It then says whoever does not believe won’t be saved because if you don’t believe you can’t be saved. You also can’t be baptized if you don’t believe. The reason baptism isn’t mention in the first half of the verse is because you can believe and still refuse to be baptized. The reason it isn’t mentioned in the second half of the verse if because you can’t be actually baptized without first believing, so if you don’t believe you also won’t get baptized. “Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.” ‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭NIV‬‬

@@adamholmes1992 "John 3:5 is water from being born, not water baptism." Well, it's comforting to know that every human is already half-way there. The way you would have it read is: "Unless a man is born of amniotic fluid, then at some later date born again of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom." Somehow that just doesn't ring true: it looks like someone is struggling to come up with something. Can you name any early Christian writers who saw it that way? Or can you find any references in or out of the Bible (from Greek writers of the time period) of natural childbirth being referenced as a "birth of water" or "born of water."? Your explanation would have a little more credibility is such language was common.

@@brendanjobe6895 I read koine Greek. I still believe that John 3:5 isn’t specifically talking about baptism, but Acts 2:38, Mark 16:16, Matthew 28, and 1 Peter 3:21 certainly is. The fact that I don’t see John 3:5 talking about it doesn’t change the fact that the New Testament tells us that we are saved by Grace, through Faith, at Baptism (full immersion water baptism).

@@adamholmes1992 Why in the world would you not believe it? It's good that we both read koine Greek. So far, you've asserted that the "born of water" part refers to natural childbirth, i.e. amniotic fluid. I've done a ton of c-sections so I know exactly what you are talking about. And Jesus was talking about entering the church, His kingdom which was at hand. Anyway, why would you go 100% against what people who lived at the time said it meant? That was my question. Not arguing. More like curiosity.

Okay, so perhaps you could tell us how the thief on the cross was saved?

Can you explain what gospel the thief on the cross obeyed according to Hebrews 4:2?

1 Corinthians 1:14 “I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;”

the guy in the Middle twisted and distorted what the coC teach so much I can barely find any truth in what he claimed the coC teach. Although it is possible some coC may teach that distorted truth. Because I do know many teach things so far from the truth I will not visit that specific congregation again.

how about this Eph 2.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. Some of the questions we need to focus on is 1) what is grace and mercy since they are linked together 2) what is faith (belief) & what is involved in this to have a saving faith (belief) 3) at what point in one's growth in one's faith is one saved 1) what is grace? God giving something we do not deserve. God Forgave us of our sins. Does not contain all aspects of grace what is mercy? God not giving us something we deserve wages of sin is death. God us his son to die on the cross to pay the price for our sins. Does not contain all aspects of mercy 2) what is faith (one's belief) John 3.16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life by this passage many claim that Belief in Jesus is just a mental acknowledgement of Jesus and nothing else. But is this Correct? John 3.19-21 due to time, I'll focus on vs 21 But >>whoever does what is true >his works> whoever does the will

@@rickraybourn7456 out of context

@@jayu2551 You are correct. I'm not questioning that he went to some church of Christ somewhere. I'm sure he told the truth about that. But when he started offering his idea about "what the church of Christ people would say", I had never heard any of it. And he had the nasty (and probably) sinful habit of purposefully misdefining Greek words. It's either that - or he's just stupid and doesn't know how to use a lexicon. How he got involved with a group like this is beyond me.

If a person tells CoC's that they have repented and whole-heartedly put their trust in Jesus Christ alone to save them, and that they've been baptized as a testimony of that faith, those CoC's will do their best to try to make that person think that they are going to hell if they don't believe that water baptism is what saves them.