my dad was born in November 39 . His dad my grandad got called up in 1940 and went straight to North Africa and then Italy with the 8th army returning home in 1946 or 47 .. Dad was about 7 or 8 before he saw his dad (imagine that ) and he has always said he was lucky as plenty his age never knew their dads . Anyway this song was sang by my grandma plenty of times when I was young ... My grandad was extremely proud to be a d day dodger. It always reminds me of how proud both my grandparents were that he was a d day dodger and it makes me eternally proud too 👍
You've every right to be proud. The same as your grand parents were. My best friends father was an eighth army medic who served throughout the whole Nth African and Italian campaigns. Some dodgers!! God Bless Them All
Lady Astor is the one who also said to Churchill "If you were my husband, I'd put poison in your coffee." He replied "If I were your husband, I'd drink it."
It was Bessie Braddock (Labour MP) she said 'Winston you're drunk . whats more you're disgustingly drunk, he replied 'My dear Bessie, you're ugly, disgustingly so, but tomorrow I'll be sober, and you'll still be ugly
My dad was in the Artillery in the 8th Army. I knew he was at Dunkirk and Bergen Belsen but he never spoke of the bit in between until I came home singing this song nearly 40 years ago. He opened up a little then, but the experience was clearly painful. Ive rarely seen him as bitter as he felt about Nancy Astor. Its nice to know that the political class has held steady - wasn't Nancy Astor the grandmother of David Camerons wife or something similar?
+Colin Charman My Dad was the same..never talked about. Belsen must have been so bad.. My dad went on to Monti Cassion got wounded then on to Milan. All I know was from my Uncle.. Dad never talked about his war...... I miss that for his Grand children...
+Colin Charman The mother of David Cameron's wife Samantha Sheffield married the grandson of "The" Lady Astor as marriage #2, William Waldorf Astor III, 4th Viscount Astor. He is the nephew of another Astor who happened to be her step-father. Hope I've got that right because I've just edited it at Wikipedia ;-) Albeit a *much* easier task than what your father had to go through... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annabel_Astor,_Viscountess_Astor
On this 80th anniversary of the only D-Day that's now remembered, let's not forget that the launch day for all major assaults was called D-Day. My dad was a guardsman in 201 Independent Brigade, landing at Salerno where his CSM won the VC. He was wounded at Monte Camino on 6th November 1943 ( we'd always thought it was Cassino until I got the dated casualty list and matched it to Camino). He was recovering from his wounds when Lady Astor called the boys in Italy "D Day Dodgers". He was proud to own that label!
My grandfather Landed at Salerno ( Sugar Beach) H hr + 20 and was awarded the M.M.I never knew him, but his memory has guided me throughout my life. He fought from there to Rome. Apparently, he never talked about it, Proud to be the grandson of a D-DAY DODGER ...
my Dad's cousin James McCann was killed in Italy, a so called D Day Dodger , he is buried in the war cemetery in Salerno, and we were able to visit his grave. very moving, and very well kept graves, RIP
My father George Meadows was a D-Dodger, he never spoke of his experiences except to me, I am so proud of Lance Bombardier George Meadows and all the others of the 8th Army, Thank you all.
My father was a child in Rome at the time, and I know for a fact that he still has nightmares about the Nazi occupation seventy years after. We Italians don't forget the sacrifice of these men and the fact that they helped set us free.
@@marcvader335 yeah they really didn’t most Italians who were in the allies volunteered to join since and weren’t official armies of the Italians government and the north was still held by the Italian socialist republic aka Mussolini being an even bigger puppet for the Germans
A good friend of mine fought with the 8th army across North Africa and across into Italy. He used to say that the "D-Day Dodgers" had their own D-Day in Italy when they landed at Salerno, and when they fought their way down through Italy, they had numerous river crossings. He used to sing this song at the pensioners club that my wife used to run. He still loathed Lady Astor with a passion until the day he died in 2003. RIP john.
My Father never voted Tory, and always hated "lady" Astor a bloody Yankee, he always said I fought a war to make a home for the common folk, when will it come.
My dear father ,was a so called d day Dodger. Of course l am very very proud of him and all other service men who fought in the two wars and what about the poor service men, who never came home.Thank You all.
Wow! Lady Astor... another politico that thought she knew it all - and knew fuqquall! Thank you, to all those service people that made it through D-Day and the families and loved ones of those that didn't.
One of my uncles did service in Italy, another one landed in Normandy a few days after.Both came home but won,t talk about it. Until much later. R.I.P all soldiers who served overseas in the Second World war. From a grateful canuck.
My father was branded one of these, RAMC 39-45, North Africa & Italy, a medical orderly(unarmed) blind in one eye from childhood, the bravest of the brave. RIP.
Monte Cassino is up there with the Battle for ~Stalingrad ..hand to hand fighting! In the end there were Germans crying... they were Falschumjager... Paratroops... who were fighting fellow paratroops... they said that we Brothers should never fight each other! ...
Susan Littlejohn My Dad was in the RASC part of Monty's 8th Army. It would make him sad if he were alive today, to see what they fought for, we are no giving it away! So sad.
My father was there. He was part of the Polish Free Forces...who ended up in North Africa after being released from The Siberian Ore Mines, where he spent about 3 years as a POW.
I once had a Polish / Scottish girlfriend (from Dalkeith) who's parents were both Polish. I never could understand her mother who had a very thick English accent on to which she grafted a local Scottish one!! Having lived in Scotland I could understand most really thick Scottish accents -- even Gorbals Glaswegians -- but not her!! Her father told me about the Polish assault (the fourth!), on Cassino having been attempted by us -- the Brits, the Gurkhas, the Americans?? / Canadians ?? can't recall. Finally the Poles. The girlfriend's father said they suffered 4,000 casualties. And from memory I have a feeling he meant killed. Which shows what they felt having their country; absolutely savaged. Killing Germans meant more than being killed themselves. Taking Cassino was an equally savage struggle. But the cost did not mean much to them.
"Whether she said it or not, Lady Astor was detested by the soldiers" I imagine as being originally a staunch supporter of appeasement she should have been a tad less vocal once the war erupted and of course she was susepcted of being a nazi sympathiser herself. She was an American who'd moved to Britain yet none of the verses seem to pick up on that. It would have been easy for the British Tommies to have went down the line of you're not even one of us! Says a lot for them that they didn't
My dad was a sergeant in the signals regiment and fought with the 8th army in North Africa and Italy. Found a letter he wrote to me mother during the war with the words to this song included. They had several d-days. British could be proud of ourselves then.
I used to drink with Hamish and Billy Connolly, Matt McGinn and other folk singers of the time, in Ye Olde Scotia Bar, as it was called then. So many years ago now...
The song is actually agreeing with you. It's a tribute to the brave soldiers who fought in Italy, and an attack on Lady Astor, who belittled them as 'D-Day Dodgers'. The first few verses are deliberately ironic. Then it turns serious. Listen to the last verse and see if you still think its a dumb song.
My great-grandfather was a D-Day Dodger, sadly he died in the 1980's. He followed his father into the army who served in various campaigns. He was sent out to relive Ladysmith then he was sent home and then he was off again to India then homeagain then he ened up in mons against the Prussian and Bavarian Royal Guard regiments.
My Dad served with Royal Artillery from 1939 till 1946 , being de-mobbed from the Po river in Italy. He was evacuated from Dunkirk after being part of the first battery to fire at Germans in Belguim. Was at both battles El Allemain and fought with the Polish , New Zealand and Indian Divisions , and this was his song . He used to sing it using a beer glass as his microphone. Thanks for the post
My father was a motorcyclist in the RA, joined a TA ( west Kent yeomanry i think) unit after Munich, went on annual camp in 1939,got mobilised and ,except for a quick home visit after Dunkirk , didn't get back until 1946. He used to call it the 'grand tour'.
Many of the soldiers from North Africa who fought their way through Italy were the survivors of North African campaigns, thrown onto ships to Italy and told to keep on fighting. My father Alex Kennedy of Glasgow was one of them. I took his medals and ribbons to Stirling Castle to have them matched together as they were all packed separately. I was informed most of the 8th army in Italy records were lost. I gave them information and photos for which they were grateful. The archivists in the castle are desperate for more. My dad was a a crazy violent man at times and when he died at 86 it was due to a slow growing brain tumour near the dent in his head received when he was blown off a bridge in Italy, needless to say he kept on fighting right through to Austria.
Austria ? My grandad served in Africa and Italy from 40 to 46 . He told me he ended up in Austria before coming home . He was from Leeds and served in an armour division that was made up of mainly Scots.
Great song. Especially when sung to the tune of "Lili Marlene" as designed. My father was U.S. Fifth Army in North Africa, Sicily, and Italy, though he also served with British Eighth Army. Was on General Sir Harold Alexander's staff (15th Army Group) whom Dad considered to be the finest soldier in the war. Alex's staff was 50% American and 50% Commonwealth. My father wrote home on D-Day (June 6) hours after he heard of the landings. He and the other soldiers became very upbeat and optimistic, that they would finally get some relief after having fought in North Africa for 7 months and Italy for 11 months. They were all betting on a quick finish to the war. But what happened was that the D-Day landings just got all of the media attention. The war in Italy instantly became "The Forgotten Front." Then, Allied command took half of the Allied soldiers for the landings in Southern France in August. They also cut way down on supplies for the Allies in Italy while expecting the soldiers there to do just as much fighting. That would mean the Allies fighting another brutal winter in Italy. Then, to top it all off, this term "D-Day Dodgers"--a callous, ignorant, inaccurate, disrespectful jeer at solders who have been fighting their hearts out and dying for eighteen months. :Lady Astor, MP has the remark attributed to her. I believe the song writer is very restrained in his words of reply. Churchill should have taken her aside for a lesson in respect and awareness of so many soldiers dying to save her. She must have been a mental lightweight to say something like that. I'm so surprised that so many 8th Army soldiers were able to keep their tempers intact.
An old family friend served there with the Argylls, Told a story of a German counter attack by paratroopers flown straight in from a night out in Paris. They could tell they were forming up by the stench of eau de cologne! He went down with malaria and was shipped home eventually settling in east end of Glasgow...unfortunately for him he was called up for Korea and spent a freezing winter with human waves of attacking communist Chinese piled up higher than a man could stand in front of their weapon pits. RIP Hughie old soldier, duty done.
My uncle was severely wounded in Italy in November 1943 when his signal truck went over an A/T mine; all his comrades were killed instantly. His life was saved by a patrol passing who noticed that among the carnage that he was still breathing. Just. The telegram to his father arrived on my Mum's birthday This is, for me, the best of many versions - and always brings a tear to my eye.
I have heard about this version of LILLIE MARLENE, this posting is a brilliant tribute to all the D-Day Dodgers, my uncle and all his friends among them.
It's hard to add a comment when so many have already commented....except to say my Dad landed at Salerno as a stretcher bearer, with the 56 Division and managed to survive Mt Comino, the Grigliano, Anzio, then the Gothic line up to Trieste. A recent book "Blood and Bandages" describes my Dads unit, the 214 Field Ambulance in Italy, and is well worth reading. Lillie Marlene, a German Song, was adopted by the 8th Army and many different versions were sung. This version of the D-Day Dodgers particularly sums up the determination and stoicism of the troops in Italy. I really regret persuading my Dad to let me throw away his old army greatcoat which he wore and slept in, throughout Italy. I now know he was my hero....not Montgomery , Alexandre, Clark, Patton, Bradley, Eisenhower ....
My dad was wounded at Monte Camino ( not Cassino as we'd originally thought). That was during the Guards Brigade attack on Camino 6-7 November 1943. He was wounded by a machine gun bullet just before his platoon walked into a minefield. I wonder if your dad could have been one of the stretcher bearers who took him to the aid station? We'll never know of course!
@@robnaylor4494 Each Monday tea time an insurance agent came around when I grew up. He had been in the Guards, and they chatted about their experiences in Italy , as I tried not to make it too obvious I was all ears. I’ve seen photos too, and eagle eyed to see if my Dad was there. My first memory of my Dad was asking my Mam why he was giving first aid to a woman in a crowded Store. “He did that in the war”……and of course I had no idea what that was .
My father in- law told me his older brother George McKinney,from Belfast was in the 8th Army .Chased the Germans out of North Africa.He was also bombed by the yanks at Monte Cassino.George settled in Manchester and married and raised a family there.
I first heard this in a folk club in Whitehaven in the 60's. It is still as moving now as it was then.With a Dad in the Navy I accepted the war as "normal" and was happy that although sunk twice he came home safely. He told me about his escort duty on Artic convoys where Merchant Navy casualties where 1 in 4. It must have been totally demoralising to have the likes of Lady Astor "on our side".Still, our Armed forces and civilians alike found the courage and dedication to carry on. Thank them.
One of my grandfathers served as a Wehrmacht soldier in Italy, so I guess he had quite an experience with those D-Day dodgers. The other one, a sapper, barely escaped Stalingrad before cauldron was closed and then was relocated to France, where he witnessed D-Day. And the first husband of one of my grandmothers died right in 2nd or 3rd of September 1939, when Germany invaded Poland. Isn't it madness that the people inciting wars never have to fight them out?
Remarque seems to have the same opinion in his book All Quiet on the Western Front. One of the characters says something along the lines of 'all the leaders who want to go to war should be put in a field, and made to fight it out. The one standing at the end wins.'.
My step-dad (who died this year, aged 98), told me that on one occasion in Italy they came across a large group of captive German soldiers (probably eighty or so) who were begging for "Trinkenwasser". The water cans they had in their lorry always contained a few water cans that leaked, so these "leakers" were handed out to the Germans. They were effusive in their thanks and shared the water out fairly peaceably before being sent on their way. On some occasions, when the paths of small groups of British soldiers and Germans crossed, they just pretended that hadn't seen one another!
My father took a map case from a captured German Unteroffizier called "Melchior" ( can still read his name inside the cover). He gave him a pack of cigarettes for it. Not long afterwards my father was wounded by an MG42 bullet fired from a house on the edge of the village of Calabritto during an attack on Monte Camino. He never had any hatred for the Germans he was fighting, except for the SS. He respected them as soldiers.
@@wullieg7269 The Japanese American Soldiers were outstanding...famous future United States Senator Daniel Inouye was wounded in Italy serving in the 442 Regimental Combat Team...composed of troops with Japanese ancestry. United States Senator Bob Dole was badly wounded in Italy as well...10th Mountain Division.
Brian O'Sullivan To be fair there is no actual record of her making the remark, it could well be another Marie Antoinette "Let them eat cake" situation.
My grandad fought in North Africa and Italy. First serving in the royal artillery then because short in numbers, in the Argle and southern highlanders. Was awarded military medal for staying at forward observation post to direct artillery under heavy attack. Died in 1972 when i was just 2 years old, before i could get to know him. Astor is an American disgrace.
It is so nice to hear this again even though there weren't enough verses. I worked with a man named Ted Leeson (late), formerly of Group 2 commandos. He had a fine voice Hughie Green wanted for Opportunity Knocks but Ted was too shy to appear. Ted knew a lot of dirty songs and when he was busy he would sing without realising it but they would seem strange in his fine singing voice. The D-Day Dodgers was a common choice and I think he remembered around 20 verses with most of them being unofficial...
A poignant song composed by former soldier, poet and Scottish folklorist Hamish Henderson, written in response to a question raised by Lady Astor where were the 8th Army.
Kinda curious if my grandpa knew this song,he served with a port company in the US 5th Army.Some of the stories he told were hilarious and others were pretty tragic,like when a ship he was on was being attacked by the Luftwaffe and the navy guys manning the guns couldnt hit a lake if they were on the bottom,so him and a few friends kicked them off the gun shot down 3 planes and went back to what they were doing.Sadly we lost him a couple yrs ago...
@Colin Keenan "I think Hamish was a just a wee bit more memorable than that. He was Hamish Henderson [not Hamilton as in publishing]" Right on both counts! "..and he wrote this effectively from scratch* NOT right. Hamish Henderson didn't write it, he collected it. It was actually written by a sergeant called Harry Pynn. Hamish, I'm sure, would have wanted the credit to go where it's due.
I first heard about this song 'round 10 years ago, in a Garth Ennis' comic with the same title. Of course I couldn't imagine the music, especially because the lyrics were translated in my language (italian). I'm glad I can finally listen to it, it's a really touching song. Still I never manage to find a version with the last, tearful verses:
As usual, a politician sticks their nose into something they think they all about and it turns into a snafu, somethings never change. I think all people who served in this campaign were heros.
My Dad was a D Day dodger and a dispatch rider in Italy with 8th Army and I was born in November 1940 but I was 6 years old before he actually saw me I still have letters sent to my Mum saying he wished that he were at home when I was born. It was doubly dangerous for him as my grandfather was as born in Italy so with an Italian surname if caught at the beginning of the war my Dad would have been shot as a traitor, I still have his medals from WW11 .
My Grandad was a D-day dodger. Apt song. He saw combat, but had a fun time in Italy, he liberated Venice. Sadly the XXX corp came under fire at Market Garden too. I still growl at an Italian when they support the Duce. Most hated him though. (Like in those days, pretty Italian girls hated the bloke.) These men might have a lazy song, but they were all very brave, thats what I love about the last verse. My Grandad lost friends out there.
my Great Grandfather was a D-Day Dodger, served in Italy since the invasion till the end pretty much, was an Irishman in the British Army, originally in normal Infantry before being transferred to an Ambulance Unit, sadly he died shortly after the war when my Grandfather was only 10, so never got to hear any stories of his service, but we do have lots of memorabilia from him and the family at the time, everything from records of what he was issued, all the way to his personal items such as wallet and stuff, the one man in WW2 from my family of whom I have actual confirmed information on, rest in peace, he was an Irish Catholic and so was pretty traditional and apparently was "a bit mean" to the kids, but either way, brave man, shame he didn't live for longer.
My uncle Bill served with the Kings Own Calgary Regiment, Royal Canadian Armoured Corps, from Sicily, Italy to Northwest Europe culminating in the liberation of the Netherlands. God bless him and all his brothers in arms 🙏
sgeir isn't saying that his father kept a diary, but that he kept a copy of the words to the song. With regards to your point that no-one could possibly have been able to keep a diary because of the intensity of the fighting - not true. There were periods of boredom, with nothing much happening, in between the battles. Spike Milligan's memoirs, which my Dad loved (eg 'Hitler: My Part in his Downfall') give a good picture.
My wife's uncle lost his life in the Battle for Cassino. Anybody who has visited the pristine Commonwealth War Cemetery there - will know they were not D Day Dodgers. He has no grave though, just an inscription on the memorial wall. I know the song is TIC and thankfully it does have a poignant ending.
Whether she said it or not, Lady Astor was detested by the soldiers, most of whom were staunchly working class and had been radicalised by their war experiences. I first heard it sung, either by Hamish or possibly by the late Roy Guest, at a concert in Glasgow on the day or day after she died. There was no sentimentality about her death in Glasgow. My late father, who served in Italy, kept a.cyclostyled copy of the words.from the War.
My dad spent 6 years in Italy. He did it to free Britain 🇬🇧. He did all sorts dispatches, lorries through mountains bomb disposal. God bless their memories brave lad’s everyone.
We lost hundreds if not thousands of American Paratroopers in the invasion of sicily due to friendly fire our navay shot down some 23 or 27 c47 transport planes packed full of men only 6 survived. Poor communication between army and navy. War is Hell and these guys who ended up in Monte cassino had no way to dig for cover they built tiny cover out of stones and rocks to lay behind.
Lady Astor, who was a millionaire aristocrat and Tory MP as well as calling the troops in Italy D D dodgers, said about 1930s coal miners , who were massivly underpaid and worked in horrendous conditions 'What do these Earthworms want now?' when she heard they had been threatening a strike. She was a nasty piece of work. Weirdly, there are now plans to build a ruddy great statue of her in London ! One I doubt you will see ex servicemen protecting !
I remember the late Desmond Carrington playing this on his Radio 2 i think it was Robin Hall and Jimmy Mc Gregor version of it, my late Granfather my fathers Uncle and Brother were all in involved in that side of the war
We will remember. we will always remember the men who gave thier lives for a difference. and were criticized for it. For they were the D day dodgers. way out there in italy.
D Day Dodgers had to do 3 sea invasions to the main lands. The sea invasion of North Africa, followed by the sea invasion of Sicily and then the sea invasion of Italy. They fought every battle all the way to Austria when the war ended. Hero's every one of them they were. Long live the D Day Dodgers.
I met Hamish Hamilton - the Scottish poet and Army officer - who collected the various lyrics of this song - at a history conference in 1995. Fascinating. My uncle fought - and was seriously wounded - in Italy. He won't comment much beyond 'sums it up'. One of the best (if not the...) bitter, ironic soldiers' songs ever.
First time in my life I ever saw my father cry. My husband had been given an l.p. Of folk singers and this was one of the tracks. He was in his 70's then. He never spoke of his war experience. He said his hardest battle was coming home to watch his beloved is a die in agony of what I believe was cancer. He may have married my mother years later but his is a remained the love of his life until the day he died.
Whether she said it or not, Lady Astor was detested by the soldiers, most of whom were staunchly working class and had been radicalised by their war experiences. I first heard it sung, either by Hamish or possibly by the late Roy Guest, at a concert in Glasgow on the day or day after she died. There was no sentimentality about her death in Glasgow. My late father, who served in Italy, kept a.cyclostyled copy of the words.from the War.
I don't get this song- the troops didnt have a choice on were they were deployed. Also Monte Cassino was one of the bloodiest battles of the second war. Dumb song
I hope there's never another war of this scale that causes such loss of life, such anguish. I very much doubt humans can live together peacefully though.
