DAW-less Interludes with the Roland SP-404 mk II and MC-101 

Roland sp404 mk ii does have a song mode of sorts. It is called "pattern chaining". I would recommend trying the traditional sp404 workflow based on resampling and layering. For example, you can resample a pattern chain into a pad and then use it as a sample in TR Rec mode, where you can add steps of different length and ... resample again! 😂 Great video. Thank you, Tim! I discovered your channel during lockdown and found it really helpful. Keep publishing new videos, please.

The envelopes sound very snappy on the Motif. ❤

Another great and insightful video! I have a similar workflow but use the Toraiz SP-16 as the sampler. I spend a lot of time generating loops and one shots on all of my studio gear and then sample everything in to the SP-16 as I come up with new ideas. When I am ready to start actually writing the track I have a large library of material to work with and can use the 8 assignable outputs and quirky but powerful sequencer on the SP-16 to create the arrangement without ever having to turn on the computer. While it is not battery powered it is portable and using it as the hub for my studio creation process I am also then able to take those productions and perform them live without having to bring my whole studio on stage with me. The mix of sample and midi tracks and 1 or 2 additional synths on stage allows me to make each performance unique and gives me room to improvise and remix everything on the fly. Cheers!

Well you answered something I was wondering for awhile. The MC-101 has traditional sounds which makes it that much more useful. Thank you showing us how you are enjoying these things..

The new v 4.04 update is a real game changer for the Sp404mk2 as you are now able to set sample length to measures and bars before sampling to auto truncate the capture to the perfect length. This will speed up your workflow immensely 🪄🎹

Try the MPC One. It’s the answer to the weirdness of the 404 mk2. They’ve updated the MPC to the point it does everything the SP does just less convoluted. You can actually finish a song from start to finish in the newer MPCs. You can even sidechain in it. I’ve owned both for a while. Now I have an MPC One and Live 2. Don’t fall in the sampler rabbit hole. It’s too fun.

Spend this week end a bit more time to relearn the SP404 and spend more time with it after upgrading to 4.04. Used your video to get back into the groove. If you not already done/doing this highly recommend to look into V4.04. There is so much improvement made to make this workflow now much easier - Ver 3.0 Sample OneShot Playback (ValueKnob+Gate Allows Samples in a pattern to be longer as the actual Pattern, so you can have 16bar sample in a 4 bar pattern). This improves looping longer samples with a short pattern PatternChange Playback mode - MKII vs SX allows to actually sustains the sample being played after pattern change. - Ver 4.04 - Rec Sample with pre determined Bar Length (no cutting of samples to be perfect 4, 8... bars) - TR-REC Microscope (allows to adjust volumes of sample in the TR Rec Mode (kind of mixing)) - 4 bar (20sec) Looper with Overdub. - Naming Samples and Projects on the device - Exporting/Importing Projects - Creating Stems from Patterns / Bounce full Pattern Chains There are is still some bugs if you resample freshly loaded samples from SD card. But overall for a workflow to record and try-out phrases and use those to play and building some song ideas the box got really much more capable and still once learned the workflow still is fairly quick. Hope this is helpful to some one

Hi Tim, may I make a suggestion ? ... You might consider pairing up an iPad with your SP 404 MKii (instead of the MC 101). It's battery powered and has a top tier selection of sound generators, sequencers, FX - and everything in between. It connects to the 404 via USB, transferring audio/midi/clock losslessly in both directions. The 404 even acts as an AD/DA for the iPad, and a midi controller. Really is the dream portable pairing. Amazing what can be done with just those two pieces of hardware, and of course apps to load on the iPad. Apps of course are somewhat distinct from plugins in that they achieve some of that hardware immediacy, albeit without the complete tactile experience. So you don't get 'plugin fatigue' in the way you might when sitting in front of your computer. Just a thought ! Enjoying the video so far. Take care.

I bought my SP-404mkII for very similar reasons! Great to see similar perspectives creating unique workflows. Two "counter-points" I have after watching: One, regarding patterns and a "song" mode; this exists, albeit not quite as described. The 404 has pattern chaining, allowing you to structure an entire song of patterns, but to repeat a pattern you would simply select it multiple times in the pattern chain, limiting how many unique patterns in total you could use (depending on how many total unique patterns you have). This can be very interesting if you would like to focus your interaction with the unit with regards to its wonderful effects while your entire song plays back. Two, regarding long sample playback. You can enable "one-shot" mode of a pad's sample, which will cause it to playback in its entirety, regardless of pad operation or length of pattern that it is in if using it in a pattern. Hold [VALUE] knob (clicking it) while pressing the [GATE] button to activate this method of operation for the selected pad. If you have not updated the firmware on your device, I highly recommend it, as quite a lot of functionality has been added since the launch of the product, particularly the one-shot playback mode for pads. Again, wonderful video. I rather enjoy your perspective on hardware and the workflows that you develop, as well as your individual musical style.

The MC101 could do with something like a MIDI knob controller, I think it's limited due to lack of surface controls, I had a MC707 and found my whole work flow slowing down due to the menu diving on the small screen, I hated it so sold it. My SP16 on the other hand is an absolute delight to use. Great video, thanks for the upload.

I'm so glad you're speaking about this. Im personally getting a bit exhausted from working exclusively in the box. I've budgeted and planned for building a synth and effect rack and plan to bring a much more human feel (read live performances) to my work. Must be something in the air. It's really great to see your method and reasoning. Great work, Mr. Shoebridge.

Hi Tim. A few notes I wanted to add to your comments about "Can and Can't". Pattern Chaining and looping is possible and tools are provided "in box". Pattern transitions and fading are possible and provided in box with DJ mode. Possibly not exactly the way you would want to implement them but to say it can't do it is not entirely correct. There were a few other areas that I also originally found "non intuitive" but after spending a lot of time with the unit I found workarounds for most of them, such as the TR-Rec step sequencer mode for timing and more complex patterns. Alway appreciate your videos and hope you get a bit more from your 404.

too make it play samples to the end in pattern mode. chance the general option - PTN Change Mode This sets how the samples play back when switching between patterns during pattern playback. MKII - Sample playback stops when the pattern changes. SX - Sample playback continues when the pattern changes -

Thanks so much Tim for this very informative video. My issue has been the same as you and I think the SP-404 would allow me to place samples from all my other studio based devices onto it and noodle around until I found what works best together anywhere I'm located. From there I could export them from the SP-404 back to my DAW Ableton and do the arranging, mixing, mastering etc., there. Finishing off the track in your DAW definitely wasn't a failure and makes perfect sense as the SP-404 wasn't designed for this. Will have to pickup a SP-404 myself soon. All in all I think you are spot on with this workflow. Thanks again Tim.

Many others report the opposite regarding SP404 mkII being intuitive, simple and straightforward. They speak of extreme menu diving and much button combinations.

Hi Mr. Shoebrudge, I think I found the solution to the sample tail cutting off issue. You can go to the Utility Menu--->System--->General--->PTN Change Mode--->SX. SX seems to let a triggered sample to continue into the next selected pattern, while MKII stops all samples when moving to the next pattern. Weird default choice!

Although not portable with batteries your Motif is the most powerful sequencer and sampler you may have beside Cubase. I don't remember if the Motif can import 24 bit, or just 16 bit 44.1 stereo only. Format a flash drive the Motif can read and import your ideas. You could also midi control the 101 directly from the Motif. Mix everything in the Motif too.

I’ve transitioned from FL Studio to an MPC Live II and I freaking love it!

I purchased an MC 101 in Jan 2020 it is similar to the compact JD-Xi synth in that it has 4 separate compartments to work with, and many of the same sound generator tech, plus labyrinthine hidden sub menus which offer finely detailed effect adjustments which can for example, tweek the ways which the sensitivity, and interpretation which the operator treats the keys, - depth, duration, pressure & velocity are individually measured, which then may in turn be assigned a number of diverse command functions to the vast array of different types of instruments preset or loaded into the device banks. This allows for EXTREMELY fine detailed user interface when using the keys to play perc instruments ie: Tablas, Djembes, or Doumbeks with it. Those hand drums can be subtly manipulated to effect the various tonal qualities produced. The JD-Xi I found could easily match and surpass the real instruments in almost every way. It also has a decent vocoder if you get a good mic, and know how to apply the settings...The MC 101 is a fantastic complimentary companion device, in that it adds a means of creating astonishing abstract dimensions to the interfacing, and the processing of sounds, in addition to the innovative new tools packed into the 101. I even bought a second JD-Xi so I had 2 of them a year prior to acquiring the MC 101. The main game changer in the 101 was the ability to import sounds/sample. I tell you that very few people realize the full scope of what these devices are capable. They appear ridiculously small and simple, and even the manuals do not tell us the full picture, notwithstanding the gauntlets of new tools sounds and features that come with the firmware updates. Both are quite compatible with Ableton, and Reason DAWS, as well as most popular DAWS. However I tell you the DAW is not required if we have the JD-Xi, MC 101, AND a SP 404 MKII a half decent computer with nothing more than Audacity and some of the OTHER totally free plug ins that are compatible. With just those things, and if one truly understands how to use them... The possibilities are beyond a human lifespan X 5, and in fact will certainly stretch ANYONE'S credibility to the outer limits. It took me 3 full years of daily research and practice -to even begin to unlock the full potential and power of these devices. I'm dumb as fuck. But that is no excuse for such a learning curve to be an obstacle. To my total shock AND awe, I have recently concluded, from careful observations that there are people even less equipped with mental acuity than I !! That is why I can say with 100% conviction, that we are ALL DOOMED!! No quantum physicists, nor preternatural powers are needed. I have known for a month short of 6 decades that NO one has a more valuable and precious a thing than their "TIME". That is not a theory, belief, nor opinion, but a solid objectively subjective FACTUALITY whether you know it or not. I know that and little else for CERTAIN...I digress and love it. ...The fact is with the tech- Very few people actually bother to do the dive. The manufacturers of this tech are VERY good at distracting their customers with an everlasting torrent of "new" products, and services, which they like to throw at us even as we are unpacking the latest bell and whistle, which is already obsolete, and has been since the mid 80s, no matter WHAT. And- which might seem like next level or generation, but they are NOT. They are just new packaged innovations of what we already have. I don't care what anyone says. The "hot shots" with clipped Germanic accents, and a polished proclivity for presenting themselves in a manner calculated to impress the idea that they have a grip on reality, that is valid enough to warrant even the attention of an avid "Dik Tok" addict... Ever heard of Max Planck? He understood tiny and absolutes, conceptually... Anyway I've yet to see actual direct evidence of technological advance, especially as applied to creative arts. Leonardo DaVinci and classical/revival from the ancients are masters. Leonardo Fibonacci, William Shakespeare, actually could use their brains- ALL by themselves!! Christopher Columbus, Hernan Cortes, Francisco Pizzaro, did something relegated to legend and Steve Spielberg flicks when they had Jovian sized BALLS to "Discover" the other half of a planet, that until their exploits was "Science Fiction Horror" Here's the bum kicker- Those dudes, the conquistadores, Alexander the Ingrate, Julius Caesar, the LOT of them were fucking TEENAGERS. We do not have that kind of MOBY'S DIICK today. Kids today are most likely to "man up" enough to fly into a screaming fit, and chop off their good parts because you can't lower your IQ. enough to play along with the game of "What's under my skirt?" and 'What IS a woman?' After puberty it's str8 down the shaft to Siren Abyss S2pid. I stay sane because of a preternatural sense FOR humour. Women, Whiskey, and my impending death take care of my troubles. If they even exist. I make music for pleasure not money. So there's no shock nor awe and I can ALSO send nasty tweets telling any loud mouth "jib Tech Warrior" they'll be MORE than hard pressed, balls 2 the goddamned wall, when challenged to actually produce something with all the latest Alien tech Foley room sorcery etc, which I cannot, replicate with a fake Swedish lilt, a BIG roll of duct tape, superglue, shitloads of arrogance and narcissism, and two good smacks across the mouth just so they know it's payday! All jokes aside- using nothing but what I've listed + one mid level DAW. My point besides having fun, is basically that Even a bloke could go "woke" and after tossing his dick in the dumpster, along with his shit for brains COULD with a wee bit of focus and a bump of meth figure out some Ableton Live 11 suite and Reason 12. With That, (Justin Case) and an IQ of 57 -59 Tops-, with a good Midi controller alone can with some work and know how, ie: (an I-phone) COULD theoretically, do most ANYTHING that a couple million dollars worth of the latest hot shot techno marvels boast. That's a Goddamned FACT and a half. Has anyone here actually heard the ghastly flatulence which is now referred to as "Pop"? If not, you are very fortunate, to live in a more sane, and culturally rich world than I...But I'm not gonna go there...now...Jesus. I am not the sharpest knife to have ever stabbed a back, but I DO give it my best effort or nothing at all. I've got 280+ tracks posted on soundcloud to prove it. Most were made with JD-Xi, MC 101, Arturia Microfreak AND Audacity That's all. NO SP 404. I bought that a year ago and haven't turned it on but 3 times. Which is saying something - since I don't work, and spend 90% of my waking time making music, doing research, and writing essays... But that is another story. Anyway, I'll shut up now. Love the video BTW. I'll like and subscribe etc and so forth IF...You think it's a good idea.

in your delima .. with the tail cut off I if I where you would check into the gamechanger sustain peddel this in a audio course holds and sustains . i own the mention .. I'm just waiting for my 404 .. your production are in obersavation ... greatly helpful.Auheard .. . itcha read this feedback

Hi Tim. Just watched your video about how you're using the SP-404mk2 and found it very interesting and helpful. You mentioned in it that you'd be doing a separate video about how you make perfectly timed recordings. Is this video still in the pipeline for a future release as I haven't found it on your site?

You have almost built the Roland Verselab MV-1. I also use the MC-101 and was skeptical of the MV-1 upon release, but after circling back to it (and it becoming more economical in the used market) I've found it to be far more useful in finishing a composition than the MC-101. The MV-1 is not battery powered, but it can work (with some limitations) via a USB battery. Something to consider.

This is a great video. I use the same two devices together and got a bunch of new ideas I want to try now. I think as you explore both more, you'll find solutions to some of the limitations. The SP-404 can play out the tail on samples as patterns switch, it's an option in the settings menus. Using "scenes" on the MC-101 is also really helpful when arranging. These two also play really well together over midi. It's real fun to use the motion designer on the MC-101 to send CC to the SP-404 or use the MC-101's arp to trigger samples on the SP-404. They're super fun and flexible devices for how cheap they are.

Andromeda is so beautiful man. The tone is heaven

“Here I got the Roland JDXA… I just don’t use it” Me: bruh, give it to me then

You've been using the SP-404MKII in a similar way to me. I've gotten around the looping issue by putting the loop into one shot mode, and then using TR Rec mode to trigger that pad on first step of the pattern. For tails, I play my loop through twice, and using skip back create a second pad trimming to use the second pass of of the loop, with the tail from the first pass included. If I needed a pattern with just the tail, to naturally conclude that pad or whatever, I would do similar and use skip back to capture the seqeunce and trim a pattern length starting right at the start of the tail. It's all fiddly for sure, but doable. Love the videos.

I got to exactly the same place, enjoying my MC-101 a lot, making dozens and dozens of little grooves, and finding it very creative, far more than just a dance music oriented thing like many grooveboxes, but then wondering, where do I go with them? I've played with the SP-404 mk2 quite a bit, as a newcomer to modern samplers, trying to understand how to use it musically, and not just for doing chops and making beats. Like you, I'm trying to use it as a multitrack recording device, but one that isn't tied to running all the tracks in parallel from the same starting point, like a DAW. I've hit some limitations, like it gets hard to remember what samples are on which pads, so you have to be very systematic about laying things out. The SP is a great tool for live performing, but not so great for composing, I think. I'd like to be able to record my performances on it, and build things up in layers and sections, but pattern mode isn't flexible enough for this, and resampling doesn't let you edit out any mistakes afterwards, so is best used for mangling samples or capturing small performance loops. If there was a "skipback" for the pad and effects trigger data, as well as the audio, that would be helpful for me. I wanted to escape from being sat at a screen, using a DAW, as it didn't feel like playing an instrument and improvising, it felt a lot like writing software, very methodical, and that didn't inspire me to get creative.

Tim, question how to you keep your MC101 and SP404 projects organized. I wonder what works for you. I keep having difficulties to find things after a while again. And now learning that I need to create on my PC folders to get stuff together. Unfortunately the MC101\707 do not have timestamps in the project files. Interested how you ended up. Thanks.

8:16 As of v 4.04 it is now able to create it’s own single oscillator sounds via a tone generator implementation. Great video. I picked up the SP 404 MKII for the same daw less creative reasons.

I would look to the Session page of Ableton on a Lappy! No messing about when moving from Session to Arrange or any of your issues with sample tails. Thinking abut it more, I would love your take on Ableton live, coming from a career of "linear" Cubase, especially now that your tinkering with loops and home samples!

Thoroughly enjoyed your video! I got the MC-707 earlier this year and it dramatically changed my way of making music. Have been thinking of getting a sampler to go with it as I use a lot of samples and sometimes get frustrated by them using tracks even if the MC-707 have eight. End up playing the samples in the drum tracks...

I use my SP404MK2 to fire loops and one shots but it’s completely controlled by the polyphonic midi output from my digitone. It’s probably my favorite setup ever. Super capable

Thanks for sharing this. I can really relate to your approach. Am looking forward to learn more. Even if my objective is slightly different, I hardly make songs for publishing but rather jam for myself with an instrument of choice to decompress from my day job. For that the SP404 is a treasure to record clips from different sources, Synths, grooveboxes and Romplers to build deck of backing track clips, that I can shuffle to set of variations that I can jam / sing to. I love to also hook up a mic or guitar from time to time. I started this workflow with the MPC1, which as a single standalone device is very capable but I am drawn to the SP more often than not due to its simplicity to get started and if I switch things of. They are right there when I come back. Great content. Looking forward for more.

To me personally daw and dawless make me use different parts of my brain/spirit. When I write a song in Cubase I perfectly shape it as I intend to with total control over everything from beginning to end. When I wirte a song dawless (with Squarp Pyramid) I feel like I have no idea how the song came to life but it's finished and I like it, seems more "sincere" (I don't use randomized sequences and that type of things)

I never imagined, sitting in the London premiere of "The Cave" , that someone would one day show me how Reich's variation techniques could be directly useful in my own music making. I'd never aspired to COMPOSITION. When I started using sequencers, they were developing with me and I didn't really see my music making outside of the context of the machinery as if the first thing I was looking at was the limitations they presented, instead of examining the limits of my imagination. I guess that is the root cause of my gear acquisition syndrome😂. Reich's approach is exactly the opposite as is, come to think of it, any composer who is looking for a hidden world inside their instrument. Thank you

Throwing this out there to be helpful, my mackie mixer doesn't have buses, but an "alt 3/4" mute bus that sends to a separate stereo out on the back- using this or a traditional bus, I send whatever I want to sample or affect with the sp404, returning to a regular channel. Makes grabbing samples off the desk a breeze.

Insightful video! It will definitely inspire some viewers.I record my voice and whatever I can hit onto my smartphone to capture rough ideas. Everything else I record with hardware sequencers and that works fine, although using ten of them simultaneously will probably take more time than a software sequencer. I say probably because I have never used software for my music but that will have to change if I want to use SWAM physical modelling software and I do.

My 707 and 404 have been collecting dust and this is just what I’ve been looking for to help get me going!

Dear Tim! Thanks a lot for this brilliant video! So calm, clear and comprehensive! Having spent a lot of time in front PC-screens, I now find myself turning to hands-on things. Not having to turn on the computer can be such a relief, as can it to sit in the sofa working with ideas. I found this video by searching Roland mobile stuff and find it super useful for me. I will your other material out, for sure! 👌

Waiting for an SP-404 mk II to arrive tomorrow and this workflow is basically what I've imagined for myself....with the intention of creating ambient soundscapes and the like, creating sample sets in Reaper at different predetermined BPM's as I go. Thank you for pointing out the limitations that I'd never heard before. Nice finished tune!

Wtf. That's exactly what I was looking for. Well done 👍

Wasn't the mpc X SE a better choice as your house is full of gear anyway.

Thanks for the video. Great to see how the SP404 can fit different needs. I was just wondering, did you touch any of the effects of the SP? What did you think about resampling workflow?

You would probably like Ableton and Push 3 a lot.

Hey man great video. Resample mode is a great for the limitations you spoke of.

Awesome video although i do hate the word Dawless.

Great video! Good to hear your process. I've been trying to convince myself I need an SP404 because I just think it's really cool but I have been using the Roland Verselab MV-1 which seems to do all I need. It's a basically an MC101 with more tracks, song mode, mixer, fx and sampling abilities built in. Real DAW in a box, just not built for live performance. It's fantastic, theres just something I can't put my finger on drawing me into wanting an SP! Cheers

Hey tim, this is an unrelated question to this video, but iknow gear in question is stuff you have experience with seeing your other videos. Even though its not a recent released piece of kit, lately I've benn considering buying a behringer 2600, and i also kind of like the behringer 100 series modules, so i was wondering what your opinion is between the two? I understand the 2600 is a complete synth where the 100 series modules can be bought and customized to how you prefer the complete system(example 3 vco, 10 vco ,or whatever you choose). Besides that though , do they basically sound similar, or do you prefer one over the other? And if so ,which? I kinda seem to think the 100 series are very roland 101 ish and i have a real 101, although I'm sure a 100 series can be much more features than a 101. Which do b you like 2600 vs 100 series?

36:01 The work around for this is to make sure your sample doesn’t have the “loop” switch enabled before sequencing it into the pattern. The sample will then be re triggered with each cycle of the pattern.

Super helpful for a beginner!

you should know wot you want to do before you touch a tool....after that, its just exploration

Great video. I'm considering exactly what you've done here. But I'm wondering if down-sampling from the 101's 24-bit to the 404's 16-bit has a noticeably icky sound degeneration? In this video, the difference is pretty clear. To me the 404 sounds like MP3. Does anyone have thoughts on this? Thanks :)

I'm getting the impression you haven't yet read in the manual how to change sample trigger modes? Loop/hold modes? Mute groups on/off? Actual song mode with resample? Dj mode? 🤔💭 Everything you had trouble with has a solution. Example: you can play tails by having a sample on 2 pads as one-hits. Play the sample, let the tail play out while triggering it again on another pad. These are common sample settings not exclusive to the sp404 that are available with key combos in the sp404.

I think you're trying to use the SP404mk2 for a use case it wasn't really designed for. Its more for triggering loops in a certain style of music and not so much for general arrangement development.