In a tiny narrow pathway. WE WANT A HUGE BATTLEFIELD WITH RAGE AND THINGS FLYING, and THINGS SHOOTING AND SPARTAAAAAAAAAAA. I really miss playing the game now.
That actually was a bit disappointing to me when I got to that area. Also in 3-1 you don't hear the lady singing until you are close to her cell. Other than that it was a great remake, even if it felt a bit easier than the original.
i do like this version but it would be nice if they did something similar to RE2 where you had the option to switch between original and remake soundtracks
@@DRMENTAL1000 We don't have to agree with someone to recognize their good traits. Garl is hero because he sacrifices everything for his beliefs. Astraea isn't a demon. She uses a demon's soul to help the poor creatures of the valley who were abandoned by her God. She has pure intentions.
Idk if it’s true but I heard people say she was just delusional in thinking she could heal them when the inhabitants of the valley are basically just rotting undeads, and Garl wasn’t actually as devout as he seemed, but was basically unintentionally enslaved by Astraea with the power of the demon soul. Haven’t played the remake though, so don’t know if there’s any new lore disproving this
@@dungeaterfancam I don't know if there is any lore proving what you just said? So I don't think there is anything to disprove either. Garl chose to stay with Astraea on his own accord. Garl is her most trusted bodyguard and companion, and they might even be childhood friends, but regardless I don't think that's the case.
@@dungeaterfancam What you're referencing is the chit chat from the dirty lady. However the dirty lady is shown to be an unreliabale narrator. She's jealous of all the attention astraea get's while in the past she used to be the talk of the town. Maiden Astraea had good intentions and she did ease the suffering around her. Garl Vinland was a devout friend/possible lover.
I find it amazing that in both the original and the remake - even with how different they sound, they still manage to convey the same feeling of you being the "bad guy" with desperation lurking in the notes... Great piece.
It is an amazing ost no doubt. But this ost doesnt fit astreas personality.They should give this ost to another boss it doesnt really fit astrea having an epic theme her theme was suppossed to be sad dramatic and upsetting
People saying how “this doesn’t fit” but honestly I personally love this, you really feel more of Garls side of it through out the song, his final stand, his final task to protect astraea with his life. The choir is the sorrow and cries of the pain and the bang of the drums is the weight of his shield and will to fulfill his task. But when you kill him and you approach astrea it changes into more of a tone of her, showing how their humble lives is now to an end, no hope for them, only despair and death. I personally feel that every instrument in this song perfectly showed every detail of them. From beginning to finish
The problem with focusing on Garl is... he's trash. He's a weak opponent and he doesn't last long, so the heroic direction doesn't just fit the original mood poorly - it doesn't fit any mood the battle could possibly provide.
@@Goodbutevilgenius take off ur nostalgia goggles and actually read the fucking comment. The whole paragraph is about why the theme fits. But hey, gotta keep complaining about the perfect high quality remake of a beloved classic because it slightly changed some things
This boss and soundtrack is the most magnificent part of the game from an artistic and atmospheric standpoint. The Valley of Defilement the most depraved place in all of Demon's Souls, yet its Archdemon is the most pure of heart and this soundtrack compliments that perfectly.
Finally gonna have enough to get a ps5 with my refund can’t wait to go thro this game this and sekiro are the only 2 I have not completed in the series
I first heard this theme when fighting Archdruid Caimar from the DS3 Convergence mod. I scoured the entirety of RU-vid for a full version until I saw someone's comment saying this is where it was from originally. Very beautiful piece right here
I've discovered: This version has the constant melody with the strings (don't know the instrument but sounds like a harpsichord) in 4/4 (8 steps), whereas the original was in a 7/4, they added one step to complete the melody in a fancier way but the original had the 7/4 to make it sound more unnerving. You can hear it have a double bounce on the same note when it goes down, while the original had no two notes repeated.
I'm curious what happens at 2:39? It sounds like the melody is somehow expanded upon within that last stretch of the song but I don't know music theory so I don't know how.
@@dorkmoonblade4315 'Tis just more arrangements that give an epic tone to the track, but yeah, for epic music like this the 4/4 or sometimes 3/4 is more convenient. Maybe they wanted to remaster it in an epic way and that's why they changed it to 4/4. Even if that's the case, although the original melody was in a 7/4, the rest of the song was in 4/4 and with each 4 steps, the melody created more and more dissonance until a point that it had to change to 4/4 once before returning to 7/4 to keep it nice. The female choir there serves to emphasize the woman (Astraea) and give the piece a sense of overall progressiveness. I like it a lot but when you know the game's lore the original fits better with the atmosphere and story.
Both are good. The original is sorrow. You're, in their eyes, some monster coming to kill them and damn all of those innocents to an existence of suffering. The new one is more bitter, and heroic. It's Garl Vinland's final stand to protect his maiden. Which is emphasized by how it only kicks in when fighting him, and shifts to a new song when he dies.
Honestly, I took Astraea to be a poignant example of hubris and self-centered morality, ultimately divorcing her from any real faith. It's exceptionally subtle, owing to her demure manners and her ostentation of helping the denizens of the valley- but in doing so she has not only embraced the heart of what corrupts them but even sustained it. She's completely self-deceived in that she feels they've been abandoned by God and that she is the valley's only hope- but when she abandoned the cause of ridding the Old One's influence on the Valley, that very act itself condemned the valley to its fate. As an Archdemon now herself, she helps no one, only continues to lament her own situation and the destitution of those around her, wallowing in death and decay she has perpetuated as she is fed souls from her servants. And Garl the Fool, blinded by lust and self-righteousness, defends her to his dying breath in a shallow mockery of love, caring only for his own relationship with her, and not that his maiden has become the embodiment of evil. It's honestly despicable and the player ending their facade is more justified than putting down anyone, except Allant of course. Hell, her name is a reference to the Greek virgin goddess of justice, innocence, purity and precision, but it's also a cleverly disguised way to imply she's gone "Astray" from her path.
Though I haven’t been able to play Demon’s Souls myself, so I haven’t been able to read the lore and come to my own conclusions, I just wanted to say this is very well worded. :)
I do agree with you, but I feel there is another tragic aspect to her story that you might be overlooking a little. There are a lot of hints in character dialogue and item descriptions and so forth that their ‘God’ is in fact the Old One. It seems to me that Astraea herself slowly reached this conclusion and understood that this was the only means by which she could help the denizens of the valley.
Great comment! People miss this even though she kills herself without standing for what she believes is right. It's despair disguised as righteousness - and the valley reflects that.
@@TheDustyForest Garl supports this as well, saying that they were abandoned a long time ago and that you had no right to come there now. Astraea is much like Allant in that she understood the truth of the world, but ultimately chose a different path than simple nihilism. She would no longer uphold the lies of the faith if it meant people like those in the Valley of Defilement would suffer. If there's any indication of how delusional the faith is, Saint Urbain has no inkling of the truth behind his "God", even down to the last minute when the Old One wakes, and doesn't believe that Astraea would ever leave the church. Even if it meant becoming an Archdemon, she *would* help the poor souls of the Valley. If anything, it's a sad example of the truth behind the world of Demon's Souls. Anyone who knows the truth either goes mad with delusions of power like Sage Freke, or loses hope and believes there's no point to life at all if God had indeed abandoned them like Astraea. In a weird way, it paints the Monumentals as just as delusional for thinking that sealing away the Old One will do any good. The "good" ending even admits that there will be those who hunger for the Soul Arts again and that this will just happen over and over. Fight poison with poison, indeed.
God... this is one of the best tracks in the series. Didn't think anything could come close to my favorite Bloodborne tracks. RIP Astrea and Vinland. They died so humanity could live.
Demon Soul's community is becoming toxic on how they are bashing this game and its sad. Blue Point took the time out to give a beautiful remake and instead of showing gratitude the original fanbase bashes it. It's sad
Honestly I didn't see much negativity surrounding the game , I feel like most people that played the remake liked it a lot , but some few things ( like this track ) were more fitting in the original
@@lynackhilou4865 I feel like a lot of the character redesigns are pretty dumb. Why does the Old Hero have hair? Why does Flamelurker literally look worse than he did in the original? So many of the tiny changes in the remake are pretty baffling to me.
@@harrymason4300 yeah I agree , I don't think all of them are bad but some just look out of place and unnecessary at best , like you'd see them and ask yourself what was the point of these changes/redesigns , for example patches who looks too silly now imo especially when speaking and also the fat officials . Again I still think it's a great remake but it does have some questionable changes ( which is why i'm kinda hoping they don't release a " sixth archstone " dlc without having from software work on it which in of itself is hiighly unlikely due to elden ring , bluepoint devs are very talented but if they were to make somethings souls related like people are suggesting , I think it should be a new IP rather than a demon's souls dlc )
A lot of people are saying it doesn't fit the fight. The way I see it, this one fits more for Garl Vinland (sounding more like a theme for a battle), while the original fits perfectly for Astraea and her story (sounding tragic and desperate). Just my interpretation though
The hate that this gets is baffling. This is a gorgeous piece of music... among the best in the Souls series IMO. Fits the mood of the moment and the choral bit at 2:40 nearly brings tears to my eyes.
Honestly, my first playthrough was the remake so I dont have the nostalgia from the original. But having heard both now I prefer this one. To each their own I suppose.
I really like this also, but I think I prefer the atmosphere of the original. The choral bits are beautiful - but they add an epic feel to something that I think works better as being understated.
To people batching about this theme not fitting the fight or being bad there is a dynamic music change that happens after you kill the man himself and head down to the maiden! That is a much slower and sad theme please do your research or play the game before judging a song!
Loved the original version, but I also love this one, too. It's just more fitting for Garl and that makes sense to me, since he is the one we actually fight. Either way, both versions are great!
I love this comment because it describes how I feel perfectly. I feel like the original was a good theme for Maiden Astrea herself; while this one is extremely fitting for Garl. Thank you for this.
So I quite like this, even though the tone is very different. The original makes you sit and think about what you're doing. It's shown from the perspective of the player. It's meant to be uncomfortable and questioning. This theme is much more defiant. It really, really feels like this theme is played from the perspective of Garl. Down in the muck, protecting his dearest Astraea, against this monstrous, powerful slayer of demons. He makes his last stand. If you watch the actual fight as well I think the visual benefits from how they time the music more than any other fight in this game. There is the opening cinematic we all know. "Go forth, Garl Vinland." The music swells up slightly through that opening cinematic, lasting from the beginning of the song up until about 0:40. However, once that cinematic ends, the music stops almost completely. Almost complete silence except for the ambience of the moans of the damned around you as Astraea begs out to you while you walk into the room "Leave us, slayer of demons. This is a sanctuary for the lost and wretched. There is nothing here for you to pillage or plunder. Please, leave quietly." If you wait long enough and listen hard enough, there are some suspenseful low strings, but that's about all. As you walk further down, Garl blocks you way. "You will not turn back, will you?" We know the lines. After speaking as you step toward him, he strikes out, the true hero of the encounter - not the player, but the lone knight standing against the inevitable. This all-powerful slayer of demons. He has no chance, but he will fight till his last breath to protect his dearest Astraea. As that first slam of his hammer strikes, 0:44 kicks in. This somber, defiant march that swells as Garl continues to fight to his last breath. That is what I truly hear in this theme. Defiance, inevitability, sacrifice. It's a different perspective. It's a different take on the original theme. It tells a different story. But I still find it magnificent. EDIT: Everyone should take a look at how the fight plays out with the music before condemning it. This is my favorite because Lobos really blasts the music, which I think works well for this fight. There is some great work done with the timing of the music. It should take you to the correct timestamp but it's at 6:37:30 if for some reason the link doesn't take you there. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-4VSr0a3JGDs.html
@@xeno6338 the elitist community of souls games will never be pleased. I prefer the original over this but I’ll be damned if I’m some stupid jackass saying “lol garbage ass theme, nothing like the original. Ruined the whole theme of the original, a complete disgrace to the original. The original is far superior than this garbage. Even though it’s a remake this is by far the most soulless work done in the franchise and isn’t a half assed remaster like how I wanted it to be” and so much other bs you wouldn’t believe. I prefer themes in the OG OST and I prefer some themes in the Remake over the original. Both are just amazing, it sucks that people can’t appreciate the hard work that was put into both masterpieces.
Guess I'm one of the few that thinks this is as good as the original. I like them both for different reasons. Sure, this one sounds more 'epic' and 'heroic', but I think it still fits the overall theme of the fight. There is still hints of that melancholic melody found in the original ( 0:35 ) with a church choir that obviously references Astraea. The new melody weaved within the new OST ( starting at 1:45 ) is referencing Garl Vinland, who was once that "heroic knight" archetype, but even then, you can still hear the minor key of the track that conveys that he has indeed fallen and this is his last stand. To me, this remake track does a pretty decent job at telling the story of both Garl Vinland and Astraea, while the original was focused more on Astraea's fall. EDIT: I'm noticing a lot of comments saying that the "tone" of the OST is completely different than the original. Yes and no. It's more 'epic' in sound, but the tone/message is the same. The somber and melancholy of the original is definitely present. In fact, I would say that this is actually a much more dramatic, melancholic version than even the original. The Remake's OST is almost telling the full story of Garl/Astraea's journey instead of focusing on just their fall like the original did. Different intent behind the sound, same story and overall message.
Good analysis. One thing I want to add more: The theme combining with the setting creates something contrasting like Astraea herself. Astraea is considered the most impure, but her act is the most divine.
@@HaoNguyen-ut9pj Yeah. If I had to guess, the intent behind the Remake's OST was for the player to get in the heads of Garl and Astraea. The original was all about Astraea's fall and from the player's perspective, knowing we had to essentially murder a woman who had every good intention in the world. This OST is more from the perspective of both Garl and Astraea. They see themselves as protectors, despite the ruin around them. The Remake shifts the attention from the player and makes an attempt (to mixed reception apparently) to let you see this boss fight from their perspective. They are the heroes who are about to meet a tragic end to the villain of this isolated story. There is no "triumph" to this OST like people claim. There is only death and the OST's minor key and somberness reflects it.
I agree with you, but the thing is, demon's souls tracks do not realy tell a story overall, they are more about speaking the mind and feels of the boss. Yeah, the track kind of mantains the same feeling and the piece takes you on a trip about both characters...but the original wasn't that, the original melody conveyed pretty much a mix of sorrow by them to having to fight and kill another person more and fear of being killed by you, and that's it, it wasn't necessary anymore, specially with how short the fights in this game are. And you go from there to fighting actual demons like phalanx, the spider or the tower knight which just sound like pure madness, or like the 2 blob of shit bosses on the valley of defilement which sound like brain farts etc...not like someone wanting to tell you that they were once heroic or how much destruction they bring now etc. That was obviously not it and the overuse of choirs and strings and orchestra overwall was "okay" in bb or ds3 because the "eclesiastic" is a big part of the ambientation in both games and it fitted, but in demon's it just feels so out of the place.
@@byrcust1858 I disagree man lol. I've been a fan of Demon's Souls ever since its American release in 2009. Beaten the game more times then I care to admit. The main difference between me and others it seems is that I am not a purist. Nothing necessarily wrong with being a purist, but if you want a experience like the OG, play the OG. The original Demon's Souls was created by a Japanese team while this was recreated by a Western team. I actually find both of them compliment each other because both regions like to present certain themes in different ways in their games. If that doesn't make any sense, this is the overall feeling I have for the Remake. The Original was all about showing you the desolate, hopeless state of the world while being very mysterious with its narrative. The Remake (being created by a completely different studio) attempted to stay true to the original while making the story much more comprehensible to the casual player by redesigning the game in both graphics and OST. A purist would hate that approach. I personally see it as a studio who wanted to flex some creative muscle without completely undoing what came before. I mean hell, if I'm going to spend $70 on a game, I don't want it to be a 1:1 Remake of a game I've played a thousand times. I expect something 'new' to justify the purchase price.
I like to think this is both Astraea and Garl's theme. It has the sad melody for Astraea. And the epic choir for Garl, in his desperate attempt to kill you. The anger towards your player, the fear of losing Astraea, Garl will do anything to win.
I love this version, i rly enjoyed demons souls remake (played till NG plus 5, unlocked penetrators amor and platinum) and i won t forget the first time i entered the boss fight and that song started.... So epic. THe sounddesign in the entire game was awesome!
Alright, as an OG Demon's Souls fan without the budget to buy a PS5 and with a fair bit of academic knowledge on sound engineering... let me judge this: - first off, both versions are amazing! The original was simple but effective, this one with a bit more orchestration but still effective - with that said, obviously there are differences that make all the difference. First off, the remake track didn't need to add percussion, or percutive elements to the track, thus giving the triumphant feel many are getting (01:34 is where I believe the composer strayed away, everything else up to that point was exactly what one would expect from a remake). This is a sad moment, not a tense one. The original isn't percussive at all if you listen to it; - I love that they added a female voice to somehow... well, "voice" Astraea's sorrow and anger. However the original track wasn't so dependent on voice and used a harpsichord and strings/violins/whatever that is, which gave a much more chilling vibe. I felt that they could have made more use of that when coming up with this theme in particular. If they combined both voice and strings in that way I would surely have jizz dripping down my fucking trousers; - I like how the remake track adds some bit of grandeur in a way, yet doesn't go full bombastic like other tracks. Astraea and Vinland were respected names and they deserve grandeur and class to go with it (which was what the harpsichord was doing in the original track); Anyways, both solid tracks. I understand they wanted to get a bit more mournful-orchestral to follow suit with the remaining Souls games, but this is one of the areas where they really should have kept it more OG and less Bloodborne-ish/Dark Souls 3-ish
@@ags8507 if you actually bothered to read my comment in its entirety then you wouldn't have oversimplified it. Both the original and this one miss certain things, while being strong in others.
@@andrecarvalho8244 i did read all, but lets be honest, most ppl won't, both tracks got good and bad things, in the end they added too much and the essence of the original was lost, they missed a great opportunity here to make a very good soundtrack
Personally, the percussion that gets added at 1:34 doesn't sound triumphant to me. It sounds (to me) like it's supposed to represent Garl Vinland's imposing presence and desperation as he makes his last stand to protect Astraea.
The original is sorrowful, half Astraea's theme and half yours. You're the catastrophe which is coming to end an innocent's life and to end a great deed. This time the perspective is more shifted to Astraea's and Vinland's side. It's their theme. And they're the heroes.
Oh God, i finished the 5th archstone today... I was waiting for this boss and music since I bought the game! Bluepoint nailed it... I almost cried. May you be unharmed😢
Slayer of demons:oh,hi Astrea!Sorry,but i really need your soul because,you know,to save the world and stuff so... Astrea:waitwaitwaitwaitwait,I won't be smashed by this giant fricking sword,killing myself will be way less painful.wait a Second...aaaaaaaaAAAAAAHHHHaaaaaah *dies* SoD:...ok...so...yeah...If It is this way...
@ws01 nn I think they just should have had an option to switch between the original soundtrack and the new one, simple. I wouldn't say they raped the original in all aspects though? I don't see the problem elsewhere.
Everyone here shitting on this probably doesn't know that this music stops after you defeat Garl Vinland and a far more emotional one starts that fits the tradegy really well.
This theme is definitely growing on me, especially after experiencing it in game. That opening cutscene for the figgt is beautiful. This is a fantastic track that DOES capture the atmosphere. The only problem is, the original track is so untouchable in its excellence. Can't blame BluePoint for trying though. If the original track did not exist, people would be much kinder to this track.
It DOES NOT capture the atmosphere at all idk what Ur on. If the Boss was Garl Vinlan then it would capture the atmosphere but the boss is called Maiden Astrea not Garl Vinland idc if he's the only one you fight you go there to kill Astrea, not some random simp knight who loves her. And the music sounds epic which is the exact opposite of what maiden astrea is. The theme is supposed to be sad not some heroic bs with chorus
@@s8theninjawarrior916 Nah that's not the case, that's vinlands theme not astreas.When you kill Vinland astreas theme starts playing I realized this on my 3rd playthrough xD
Van weergaloze schoonheid deze theme Kreeg altijd een naar gevoel van binnen wanneer ik d'r moest omleggen op 't einde van 't gevecht, unieke baas was dit
I appreciate what they did here. I think Bluepoint's goal with this game was to bring DeS more in line with the DS3/Bloodborne style. No, it isn't as simple & pure as the original, but IMO the soul is still there. The OST in general feels much more in line with what SoulsBorne became. Very Sakuraba/Kitamura-esque.
@@santiagojara8056 Except that that's not why I felt that way, at all. The arrangement itself, as a whole, shares a lot of similarities with DS boss music to my ear. The motifs, the flow, the melancholy.
And there's the problem lmao I HATE ds3 and bloodborne, this single concept of bringing des more in line with those has completely ruined the game for me
Who needs the dark, crushing in many ways atmosphere of the original, when we have a huge fking orchestra! Forget the unique vibe of Shinsuke Kida's work, look at our production value!
Most of the original Demon's Souls players said this version of the song ruined the feeling of the "Boss". But I think this version is by far the best song of the remake. Just You and Garl, who will never accept your objetive
I think many people here missed the fact that this version is more focused on Garl than Astraea actually. Anyway, I don't see the point on hating a masterpiece because it's different from the original
Well I personally prefer the original but both tracks went for slightly different directions while still beinh really good , as someone else commented :" this song fits garl vinland and the original fits maiden astraea better "
@@MarkHogan994 Well, actually the one you fight is Garl. Maybe you see Astraea's boss health bar but you don't really fight her. That's why the new theme fits better.
The original is a wonderful song in and of itself and very fitting with the setting of the boss. But the remake? The song itself is a story. It starts off soft to represent Astraea pleading with you to leave despite your determination to get the Demon Soul within her. And as the music picks up, that is when Garl bars your way, determined to stop you from killing her. A clash of your wills and refusal to break despite every death you've suffered up to this point and all the time he's dwelled among the diseased and wretched for the sake of his beloved who gave everything to assuage the suffering of the most forsaken souls of Boletaria. As the choir rises, he furiously asks what right you have to come here after the two of them had been abandoned by the world, by their faith, by everything. A final furious demand for you to leave them be. To leave HER be. And the final female voice, Garl's final desperate effort to protect his beloved who can but listen as he struggles against you, only for your weapon to strike true and deal the killing blow as the final notes of the cello hum out his final words of regret. "Dearest Astraea.....I have failed you....."
I like your analysis and I do agree. I think for me though, one of the people who prefers the original's soundtrack, a lot of it just comes down to original artistic intention. Being honest, I think a lot of this debate could've been squashed if we had the choice to use the original soundtrack if we prefer it. I really like the unique sound of the original soundtrack and the original version of this track in particular was one of the standouts, as, while sure it doesn't tell as quite a complete story like this version does with it's ups and downs, Souls has never been heavy handed with its storytelling, even if calling the ups and downs of a track to be heavy handed is a bit rich. The original keeps a steady, tragic course, which not only echoes the rest of DeS (being a tragedy), but also gives just enough feeling to still tell bits and pieces of that story. Other people in the comments have said that this version of the theme feels more like Garl and Astraea's theme compared to the theme that plays when you're fighting them, and I can see that, but again, it really all comes down to original artistic vision from Shunsuke Kida. This isn't entirely relevant, but I think the biggest example for tracks that lost sight of their original purpose is Flamelurker's theme. In the original it's a foreboding and uncomfortable track in a dark room with a strange beast with a melted face like a man's. If you look far enough into the lore, you can go back to that theme and draw some parallels and read between the lines of what's REALLY going on there - maybe. The remake? I still like it as a battle theme but it's just... a bombastic track for fighting a big flaming guy. Remember how so many people complained about FL's design from the announcement trailer that they changed it? Stuff like that made me nervous - like they were going to change the lore and stuff, and DeS's lore is my favorite in the series. I can appreciate what the new composer was trying to go for with the new sounds and interpretations for the soundtrack, and on it's own I definitely think the soundtrack is still top notch, but in trying to appeal more to Dark Souls fans than trying to stick as close to Demon's Souls as possible from an artistic standpoint (there were also some arguments of lighting/color choice and minor character/boss redesigns up to release, and they changed archstones from green to red - to more align with bonfires), I think some things that made DeS special were lost, especially when compared to the very unique soundtrack of the original. I've heard some people think and hope that Bluepoint might get their chance with Bloodborne or maybe Dark Souls? I fear if they get the latter they'll turn Gwyn's theme from a somber piano piece into something else entirely, and I'm equally concerned for Bloodborne's artistic direction being corrupted as well... Sorry for the long rant, but I'm very particular about remakes and remasters, and generally prefer looking at the two as two separate entities than the remake outright replacing the original. I really enjoyed DeS remake, but I'd still like to play the original at some point.
@@qazentro4444 No worries, it's cool. I appreciate your thoroughness and your appreciation for the original, which I do like a lot as well. And that particularity toward remakes and remasters is understandable since much of the time nowadays, they seem like little more than soulless (no pun intended) cash-grabs. Of course, my statement was specifically for the Maiden Astraea theme, rather than the rest of the ost, which I do agree could have overall been done better in the remaster. Though honestly, given how influential in terms of final boss music and game music in general it is, I'm positive bluepoint wouldn't dare to change Gwynn's theme. Most they'd probably do is re-record the piano, or remaster the other boss themes. I mean, even Yuka Kitamura remained true to the somberness of his theme for the Soul of Cinder when she shifted it from the bombastic final boss theme to Gwynn's piano. She simply put violin accompaniment alongside it. Plus, since Bloodborne's ost is already supremely high quality, especially being a live orchestra which was still a delicacy in videogames around that time, there's not much to remaster in that regard assuming we DO get a Bloodborne Remastered. Of course, this is merely my own opinion so I cannot comment on what might be the future of potential Soulsborne games, both new and remasters, so I shan't be quoted on this. Especially with how stupid Sony has been lately doing things like gutting their Japanese studios. Ultimately only time will tell.
This theme tries to hard to be epic to be more. In the end the simple sadness conveyed by the original is buried beneath the excess. It's not bad. But not everything needs to be more.
its good on its own, but compared to the old one, and the escenario it plays, its way too grand for what its supposed to represent, imo, its one step forward and 2 steps back
I think the music try to more tell story in the remake . With Latin choir and other things like that's .I really like the approach the composer try for the remake .
I listened to the original song many times before playing the remake. Absolutely incredible song, imbued with a massive sense of duty. I made the mistake of thinking it was a covenant song, like in ds1. I was so excited to find her in the world and meet her as an npc. Playing the remake and finding out I had to kill her and Vinland was truly heartbreaking.
The amount of hate on this song is so crazy. I think it’s awesome that we have 2 versions now. And what is even cooler to me is that Demon’s Souls started it all- the soulsborne games that followed all took inspiration from Demon’s Souls, and now Bluepoint’s team has taken inspiration from the soulsborne games to now come back and revitalize the aged, financially-restrained soundtrack of the original. So it’s come full circle now. I think the new soundtrack is a masterpiece, for that reason, and because it is just damn amazing. Even the original composer tweeted his approval of the new soundtrack, and he easily could have just stayed silent about it.
@@rufiorogue haha I guess you didn’t read what I said. My point is that he didn’t have to go public on Twitter about his approval. He easily could have just stayed silent about it. Nobody was pressing him for his opinion or forcing him to give his thoughts about it. So the fact that he chose to voice his approval about it means that he must have enjoyed it.
@@drbakterius9232 I think the overall confusion is mistaking remaster with remake. With a remake, the developers use a new engine, new mechanics, new soundtrack, etc. In a remaster, the game only have some tweaks, like increased fps or bug fixes. When Dark Souls remaster was announced, I remember the souls community having delusions of FromSoftware adding cut content, remaking the Bed of Chaos boss fight and more. I guess that's why the remaster was so poorly received when it came out. Edit: Just grammar. English can be hard XD
More like this section does. The whole theme is dynamic, & much longer than this. As you said, this section is essentially the "Garl Vinlond" boss section of the full theme. Astraea's actual theme is much quieter & barely any of it is included here.
Copied this from another comment: That's a pretty interesting idea. This theme may have worked from that point-of-view. Garl Vinland's last stand to protect his lover. Here's the thing: the song keeps going after Vinland dies. If the music had gone silent after Vinland died, that could've been a poignant point. Might've even sold the idea that Astraea isn't really a demon better than the original. But it doesn't. The song cuts out when Astraea dies, just like the original. It's Astraea's new theme, and as that it's leagues worse than the original.
How do you people not feel and hear the despair and utter struggle in this piece? It's a death march for Garl, one he knows he's doing, and he has no choice. The player is the demon in this case by all accounts, this remastered track perfectly captures the frantic desperation Garl is feeling in his inability to save the woman he loves. Some of you give the original track too much credit, as it was fairly forgetful when I originally played the game unfortunately. This one was absolutely amazing during the fight, especially because it's dynamic.
She's a great example of "the road to hell is paved with good intentions". Initially a pure soul that wants to help the downtrodden people of the Valley, she ended up overtaken by the Deep Fog, and her ties to worship turning her into an ArchDemon, and a subject of the Old One, constantly feeding it souls from whoever tries to penetrate deeper in the Valley. So your mission is still necessary, you're not the "rEaL bAd gUy", regardless of how the ArchDemon came to be, ultimately you have to end them and lull the Old One back to sleep, because the Saints sure as hell won't do it by themselves.
Better than the original IMO, It feels like it potrays both of Astraea and vinland, Heroism, Sorrow and purity, While also keeping the feel of a "Bossfight". The amount of hate this beautiful piece get is beyond baffling.
It's a beautiful piece. But I still vastly prefer the original version, particularly for its instrumentation. I wish the remake allowed us to switch between the original soundtrack and the new one. I would definitely enjoy some playthroughs with one, and other playthroughs with the other.
@@MarkHogan994 I mean opinions are opinions, I love the OG one aswell as it's phenomenal, it just feels like it only potrays astraea alone without vinland, and it's less more complex.
I finally played through the remake recently, and I really appreciate that the triumphant sounding section plays while Vinland fights you, but once he dies that classic haunting melody takes priority as you approach Astrea, fully placing you the player, the role of villain.
I'm disappointed to see how everyone seems to miss the point of the Remake OST. This isn't a reimagination, this is a Tale being told. A tale of an harmless saint who tried to help those people that were suffering using her powerful Demon's Soul. Until you, a far more powerful Demon came to take her Soul. And the progression of this piece just tell this story, the story of how his trusty Knight struggled to protect her from you, a seamless struggle that just prolonged the inevitable ending, as the theme shows when it almost fades entirely after you kill him. She has no other choice than submit her Soul to you, the far more powerful Demon in what is a fake sense of triumph. The only game capable to integrate storytelling into the boss fight in such a great way was Bloodborne, the game often described as the closest thing to Demon's Souls in both Universe and World Building. And you can feel the inspiration on this new OST. Generic theme my ass.
I don't know, I really like both of the versions, but something in the original resembles better the feeling of sadness and dispair, not from us or from the hollow who wants some kind of help to take away their suffer, but from Garl Vinland, desperately trying to protect Astrea from the one who wants to kill his lady just to take more power, and by Astrea, who is afraid to lose Vinland and her soul, who was bringing some relief and peace to the poor hollows, abandoned by the rest of the world like both of them. You feel by the ost that isn't a fight against a great enemy like the penetrator or a epic monster like the dragon god but you, a supposed hero, murdering a woman and her partner, who was just trying to bring some warm to the innocents who had their souls stolen by the demons, using the demons powers to achieve this noble mission
I'm one of the few that actually like this version, but I have to agree that the original is more iconic. It's simple, but incredibly powerful. Today I showed both versions to a friend that never played Demon Souls to see which one they preferred, and they said that "the first one sounds more tense, as if I had to make a great moral choice". I couldn't believe, because that's literally what it's meant to represent, and they guessed it without knowing any context. THAT'S how powerful music can be.
I think none of you have actually played the remake up to this point, or even played it at all. I just finished this part, I was speechless about how fucking perfect, it matched the scene, the music in this game is all about the moment, you can't ear it on a RU-vid video and make a decision. The fucking theme matches the DESPERATE STRUGLE OF VINLAND to protect astraea, they both are absolutely destroyed, yet they are fighting for what they believe is correct. The original theme is memorable as fuck, and there it is to everyone to listen. But I think this version respects the original and adds to the scene in a million revolutions. Thank you for reading.
One thing I think a lot of people who are just looking up this theme instead of hearing it in game probably aren't realizing is this isn't close to the whole theme: it's a short section, the whole thing is dynamic in-game, changing with the situation. The epic part only plays when face to face with Garl. Before that, it's soft & somber, & as soon as he dies it becomes even more tragic. The majority of what plays here is more a snippet of the "Garl Vinlond" boss theme section than a Maiden Astraea theme. Her section barely plays in this. Seeing it in game gives a lot more context. Not saying it will win over everybody, as a lot of the criticisms are valid, but it definitely helps to understand why it's different. I honestly hold at fault whoever arranged the release OST for not including the whole thing.
"I just killed the lover of an innocent woman who gave up her faith and seeked the power of the very being her faith is supposed to fight against, just to help and offer some confort to the inhabitants of the most wretched and forgotten place in the world, and she commited suicide afterwards. Good thing the soundtrack made me feel epic doing it 😎"
The soundtrack is not for you, it's for Garl, the last stand of a warrior untainted by corruption, the tone of the music gets way somber once you kill him.
@@jimjimmy8900 ...but you don't even play as Garl, the music is diegetic, only the player hears it. So how is this a good argument in favor of the butchering of this track?
@@KazuyaMithra because the theme is supposed to represent the characters too instead of just the battle. I liked that they tried to tell a story through it instead of making it only a battle theme.
Good music? Yes, indeed, it is incredible, but changing one of the most iconic songs in the entire Souls Series is quite ... unnecessary. It would be like removing Gwyn's "Plim Plim Plom Plom" or Ludwig's "Lalalala".
Hey, the original theme is still here and can be heard clearly, even if the flavor is changed a bit. New Flamelurker theme, even though good on it's own, is so oversaturated you can barely hear the original melody until the very end of the track. The "Dun duun dun - dun duun duun dun" if you will.
Thank you for uploading. Obviously a lot of people don't like the remake and are taking it out on you by disliking your video, as if you're the one who actually made the song. I appreciate you.
i never expected to find such a force of light at the end of this swamp plagued dump... even the way the dirty woman spoke of her made me imagine Astraea as an unholy dark demon
Honestly this is a great remix. I can see how some people think it's bad because it changes the tone of the fight, but that doesn't mean the track itself is bad. It's a great re-imagining of an originally pretty simple (but highly effective) piece of music that brings a variety of emotions out; sorrow, regret, corruption, but also pride, nobility, and courage, it's tragic and bittersweet.
If you remember in the nexus a certain soul will tell you, you will fall into their trap and you will become evil, the reason why because when you fight the silver knight maiden because you are the boss YOU are evil and *YOU* were the real demon the entire time...
What i find hilarious, is that people are complaining about how they added all this stuff on top of the original, and made it sound more "Epic", even though this song epitomizes the game in general, its the same thing from before at its core, but with loads of pretty stuff on top of it to give us something familiar, but completely new. so get off your high horses lads and ladies, take off the nostalgia goggles, and be thankful you even have this stuff to listen to in the first place, if you dont like it then it doesnt take away from the original, if anything itll make you appreciate the older sounds even more.
What's there to be "thankful" for? You said it yourself, they didn't add anything substantial, just made better graphics and ruined the aesthetics. No, thanks. Didn't ask for this, won't thank for it.
@@Miguel_OHara928 how did they ruin the aesthetics when you can make the game look more like the original through filters and optional preferences in the menus? its literally the exact same game but with better graphics, they didnt ruin anything xD
I think this and the original have two different perspectives on the fight itself. The original sounds desperate, but is also tense, as if portraying the battle of wills of people who think they're absolutely right. It also doesn't sound dissimilar from an 80s slasher flick, where the slasher is the slayer of demons. So Vinland and Astraea plead with the slayer of demons to leave the valley, but ultimately their pleas go unanswered. The remake seems represent more Garl Vinland and Astraea. The music goes through phases of tension. The first to signify the pleas again, the next to signify the fight with Garl Vinland and the wrestling of wills. The one after matches up with Vinland's last words. And the final part where the vocals take center stage signify the maiden's grief.
I kinda find the theme very fitting. It starts very sinister until the camera zooms into them. Then those voices evoke a very tragic story, then goes the initial like with a bit of a tone of conviction for them, while the sinister sounds i think represents our character, which in this scenario is the bad guy.
This fight is the deepest fight by fromsoft. The song ends when Garl Vinland dies and with it Astrea's will to live also fades. Who exactly was the demon, we the human killed a man for our objective who was fighting in self defence yet in her last moments the demon show an emotion which was all too human. After this fight, the line between between demon and human is forever blurred in the game.
every one of Fromsoft's games has a fight that is more than just hard on the player physically. It is emotionally as well. for Demon's Souls it was Maiden Astraea, and Garl Vinland. They were genuinely good people that made one bad decision. A decision that painted a target on their backs. The Monumentals and the Demon Slayers didn't care that she was using her power to help people. All they saw was a Demon that needed to die just because it exists. I felt bad having to put them down.
This is great. But the original theme was way creepier. This is not an epic fight. This is an f'd up fight in an f'd up location. The original theme suited better.
Prime example of storytelling through music. Just hearing it makes you make up a story in your head. I love the original but this is more than the original.
People are getting way too upset about instrument changes to the song. It's still the same melody, key, chords, timbre, etc. Shunsuke Kida approves of the remake ost and applauded it. The tone itself is unchanged, the fight is meant to be a conflict of morals and that you aren't the hero here and the remake song provides the same feeling of the original track in that, difference being a full orchestra versus a midi track. Once you dig underneath choral background and listen to the melody, you will hear the harpsichord from the original and see all of the pieces are still there.
This version isn't "bad" - but it completely ruins the mood of the fight. It's supposed to be quiet and mournful - all that emotion is lost in overproduction. Imagine Gwyn, Lord of Cinder with a full chorus and lush orchestra - sure it might sound cool, but its completely missing the point.
Excelent song. Isolated though. The original has the perfect sad feeling, fitting the fight. This one it feels much more "epic" and "adventurous", much like an Castlevania Stage theme
Yea I've been trying to find the words for it and I think that fits. The original gave off a feeling of hopelessness and made you ask yourself what is the point in this quest. This one feels like it gives off the air of a triumphant conquest after a great loss.
It sounds generic imo, If you ever played the medievil series and then the bluepoint remake of medievil, the ost got the same treatment; taking a fraction of the original theme and adding some generic choir that completely offsets the the tone from the original theme, its infuriating to see again to another one of my favorite games' osts
@@trenta.958 I have no doubt they could have taken the orchestral approach while staying true to the original theme, while what we got here isnt by any means bad, it simply has a different tone and imo sounds relatively tame as opposed to other renditions by members of the soulsborne community
