Demystifying the Distributor - Triumph, MG, Austin Healey, and More! 

There are a lot of cars where the wiring has been... improved. I'm dealing with a 3000 with owner-done wiring now. It works, but makes it near impossible to diagnose anything that's gone wrong.

Actually I'm also a Healey guy. I have a mk1 3000 waiting to be brought home for a restoration so those videos will happen over the next few years once I get started. You'd be surprised the number of skills that transfer between these cars!

Happy to be of assistance!

I'm always learning and forgetting more. It's nice to make myself a revenue, actually!

Really a lot of credit is due to paying attention at Triumph club technical clinics! But thank you--I'm happy that I can be the source of an "AHA!" moment!

I'm positive there's someone smarter than I am that will say some of what I've said is incorrect or incomplete, but for most of us I hope this is helpful! Glad to be of service!

Aw shucks, thanks!

Glad it was helpful!

Thanks, I'm glad they're helpful. It's bothered me for a long time that younger people don't always express interest in classic cars. I have a feeling it's because they're reputed to be unreliable and we can't find anyone to work on them anymore. That's a problem for older enthusiasts too, so obviously the solution is to show everyone how simple it is!

Thank you kindly!

Glad I could help

Glad you enjoyed it!

Thank you! I'm hardly a professional, but I'm decent at reading and at listening at tech clinics put on by the club. Happy the information stored up there in that brain is going to good use!

I hope I got the technical points correct! Good luck on the test!

Thank you. It's not perfect, but hopefully will help someone!

Thanks! I'm happy it's useful to someone

Glad to be of service!

Glad it's useful to someone!

Glad it was helpful! I find that the distributor is responsible for almost all of the breakdowns I've ever experienced. At least short of something like a coolant leak or an alternator issue. It's rarely the carbs if you drive the car regularly.

Midwest Motoring minealways seems to be the fuel pump

I'm happy to be able to help. The distributor is the primary source of running trouble with these cars, so it's critical to have it in good working order!

Thanks! I'm glad it's helpful.

There are definitely advantages to going electronic. It's important to realize the distributor still needs maintenance though, since the ignition doesn't replace the advance weights.

I'd be much more embarrassed to show these videos if I didn't edit out about 90% of the dumb mistakes I make....

Glad you liked it. I bought a distributor machine, so hopefully there will be more with distributors in the future....

@@midwestmotoring I might sound dumb but what's a distributor machine?

Legit question. Back in the day, a shop might have a machine that you would use to check out a distributor. You mount it in the machine, turn on an electric motor, and it uses a sort of timing light to show where the distributor is firing. The speed is adjustable, and so it's a convenient way to make sure the mechanical and vacuum advance is working properly through the whole rev range. Technically you can do the same thing by revving the engine, but it's less accurate, and if the distributor isn't set up right you might not be able to rev it up to begin with. Look up "sun distributor machine." That was one of the popular brands.

@@midwestmotoring Wow! Didn't know that. That's pretty cool 👍🏻 would love to see the machine in action.

There's actually a "distributor cam grease" you can find online. A small tube will probably last forever, and a small amount on a Q-tip should do the trick. Generally speaking, though, you can probably use any grease so long as you don't glob it on. For the weights I wouldn't use anything hard to find or expensive since it doesn't matter as much if it flies around in that part of the distributor, but again not much is needed. I use a small amount of white lithium grease in my cars.

What about lube on the rotating part of plate, to keep its action smooth?

The same. White lithium grease works wonders. You want something that will stay put and not dry out.

Hi Richard. YES! I would be happy to. I was considering upgrading from points to an electronic ignition, so if I do I'll film that and post it. If you need an answer soon though, my recommendation is the XR3000 or XR700 from FAST. This used to be a system from a few different companies... Allison, Crane, maybe a couple others, but it's the same product. The XR700 needs to be used with a ballasted ignition, so if you have an early TR6 you'll either want the XR3000 (which will work with either) or you'll want to make sure a ballast resistor is installed in your car. I believe the "Demystifying the Distributor" video discusses how to tell if you have a ballast ignition or not. Pertronix is also very popular, though depending on who you ask it's either very reliable or not so much. Either ignition is easy to change, so I suggest keeping a set of points and a condensor in your glove box as a backup. If you have a breakdown, just set up the points with a feeler gauge or a business card, and you're back on the road until you can fix it later!

The correct thing to use is conveniently called "distributor cam grease." If you can't find it, something like SuperLube Dielectric grease will work. Just don't glob it on.

It's my pleasure. Midwest Motoring is sort of a hobby that turned into a business. I'm actually a CFP full time. If you're in Iowa City, check out our Time Trials event. You can find more information on www.mwmotoring.com.

Thanks for the tip--I'll have to check them out. Most condensers are junk, so it'd be good to have a quality source... although an argument could be made that it'd make more sense to just convert to an electronic ignition.

Electronic ignition is a great upgrade for the average enthusiast. I'm partial to points myself--I kind of enjoy the "mechanicalness" of them--but I also don't mind the need to tinker with it every few thousand miles, which annoys most people.

Thanks very much!

I recently had a breakdown in the big Healey when that nut loosened up just enough to cause a short. Almost didn't see it and was going mad trying to figure out what was wrong.

@@midwestmotoring Hello there! Yes, it certainly is kind of an Achilles heel. I think some people may be too cautious about tightening that nut against the plastic shoulder insulator, but if it comes loose, like yours did - that would be bad news and could be dangerous. But now we know what to look for.

Any orientation is fine. In fact, the distributor will only fit in one position so you can't mess it up. The TDC helps with 2 things. First, you can make sure the distribution drive gear is in the right orientation. Second, if helps with static timing (though technically a few degrees before TDC is what's needed here according to the shop manual). I default to TDC so I know where the engine is as I'm working on it. Great question.

@@midwestmotoring Thank you for your reply to my question. I am about to take, for the first time, the distributor off of my 1964 MGB. It is a Lucas 25D and looks very similar to the one you used in the video. Your video has helped me to understand what to expect when I disassemble it.

Just a tip if your putting in a brand new set of points. Set your gap .016-.017. This allows for a little build up on the contacts during break in. And it will be dead on the money .015 after break in.

I'm not 100% sure you're looking in the right spot. It would be unusual for the distributor to make a clicking noise--at least it's unusual for the it to make that kind of noise and have the car run at all. Is there something that makes you suspect the distributor specifically? Unfortunately, it's difficult to know exactly what you mean without driving the car, but here are some possibilities: - You might have sticking or poorly adjusted valves - If the distributor is too far advanced, you might be hearing pinging caused by the mixture firing while each piston is still on the way up - It would not be my first thought, but potentially there is internal engine damage and you're hearing "hammering" of the crankshaft on the connecting rods You can check for a lot of this stuff with a vacuum gauge, and maybe a timing light to see where the ignition is.

You can actually send parts and get advice online. I do a number of distributors and carburetors, and even the occasional transmission.

I do, actually. I haven't found it necessary. Condensers are hit or miss, but I think in general parts quality is improving again with the ignition components. My TR6 still runs points, and hasn't needed to be touched in a few thousand miles. I check it during oil changes and don't usually have to adjust it. It's also nice that a complete spare ignition is pretty cheap, so I can keep a spare distributor with the complete setup in my trunk--for less than the price of an XR700 ignition unit. It's easy to loosen the clamp, swap distributors, tighten, and get back on the road (though I haven't had to do that yet).

Hi Richard. Since the weights and springs are just metal, I would use a solvent like a brake cleaner. Carb cleaner would probably work too, but takes longer to dry. You basically want something that will dissolve any built up gunk and clear out dirt. Rust usually isn't an issue that you can't fix with your fingers or a screwdriver unless it's really bad.

@@midwestmotoring Thank you for your quick reply. Looking forward to seeing what I have.

Hi Richard, you need a kick up your a^*e . Leaving a Triumph lying in the garage . Get it going , get out there ! Great cars . I love them. Enjoy your car, best wishes , H.

No. If you have a mechanical tach, it obviously doesn't matter in the slightest. With an electric one, the tach is really just a volt meter calibrated to read a number of pulses. Whether those pulses are triggered by points opening and closing, or by an electronic ignition switching on and off, isn't relevant. Points are just a mechanical means to open and close a switch, which turns power on and off. The electronic ignition does exactly the same thing. It just uses a light sensor or a magnetic hall sensor or some other means to do the triggering.

That said, if your XKE isn't driven too frequently then points will get the job done just fine. Electronic ignitions aren't better. They just don't go out of tune over time. With a low mileage car, the points won't go out of tune very often anyway.

About 2 o clock sounds right. I don't know the exact angle. As for being 180 degrees out, the slot is not in the center. It's off to one side, so the rotor will only point one way. You could have the gear still at 2 o clock but with the slot on the wrong side.

@@midwestmotoring Oh got it, thanks for explaining that. It was really an excellent presentation one of the best I've ever seen on anything. Thanks again.

There is definitely something that separates the spring part of the points from the base. Otherwise, it wouldn't make a difference when the points are open. I believe it's usually just a small piece of plastic.

Not necessarily. Actually, in a TR6 (with the exception of the very early cars) it's a vacuum retard capsule, not an advance. Early cars had both, but either way you don't need to unplug the hoses before tuning.

Hi Mike, The one wire on the distributor just means that you don't have an electronic ignition. This is a massive oversimplification, but the coil doesn't care which way it's hooked up. The spark plugs do, but only a little. In other words, your car will run either way, but it'll run better in suboptimal conditions if you do it correctly. Anyway, as a general rule, if your coil is marked with + and -, then the distributor goes to + in a + ground car and - in a - ground car. Good luck!

I have it in some of my cars--maybe only half. The only real con is that it's expensive (less so the more you drive), and that it's adding a layer of complexity you may not need. It's going to be more accurate than setting points because the dwell doesn't change, so it doesn't wear over time. It'd be like if you set the points perfectly every time you get into the car. With points, you really need to at least check them at every oil change. You might find every 5 or 10,000 miles they wear and need adjustment--which isn't a big deal if you only put on a few hundred miles per year since it could be a decade before they need anything. Technically, an electronic ignition is going to have a more precise control over the coil (and therefore the spark), but not really enough to notice behind the wheel. The real advantages are 1) lack of maintenance--you don't have to remember to set the electronic ignition, and 2) the quality of parts. I really like the FAST (used to be Crane) XR-700. Points and condensers, on the other hand, can be garbage out of the box. I've had good luck from Moss, but it's all just a few suppliers these days so that might not mean much. Another disadvantage is that when points are out of adjustment the car will drive poorly. When an electronic ignition goes bad, the car will stop running, and it can be difficult to diagnose if you aren't handy. Most home mechanics can vainly try to set the points to see if it helps. Replacing a $130 ignition to check and see if it helps gets expensive and time consuming. The main points to consider are 1) you aren't going to get more power, so don't use that as a reason to buy one. If you get more power when you're done, it's because something was broken, and you're choosing to spend over $100 when closer to $15 could have fixed it. 2) how much do you drive? If it's 5000 miles per year, you should consider it, but it's not necessary. If it's 500, then you really don't have to touch the points for probably a decade at least. Most likely not worth the trouble. And 3) do you really mind setting points? I actually kind of like doing it. It's part of the fun of having an old car to tinker with it, and it's nice to tinker with things you know are easy!

Hi Serge, thanks for the feedback! The biggest problem is that I have a large camera mounted on a tripod in order to get a steady shot and good quality. Putting the camera in front of me would get a better angle, but would also very much be in the way! Maybe I can rig up a GoPro camera somehow. I'll work on better angles though--thank you again, and I'm happy the videos are helping!

Good call on the bolt. That's good advice for viewers. That said, this was a Triumph engine in the video, not Austin.

I wasn't sure about the triumph engine as I've never worked on one. I only know this tip from another you tube video so I thought it would be good to pass it on. Thanks for your great work, keep it up!

It's always good to share information like that. It's the only way we'll keep all these cars on the road! Thanks!@@DC-dp3hk

Electronic ignition does replace the points and condenser, but not the cam. In fact, the Pertronix magnet only fits on the cam one way, so in fact your ignition is still very subject to where that cam is (note: if you mean that it eliminates wear from the cam rubbing on the points, then you're correct). That said, electronic ignitions will never fix poor advance/retard. That's still controlled with the weights and springs inside the distributor, by the ability of the points plate and the distributor shaft to twist, and by the vacuum capsule(s) on the outside. If the parts aren't moving as they should, neither Pertronix nor FAST is going to fix it and the distributor still needs to be repaired. So far as which system to use, I prefer the FAST XR700. Pertronix has been letting me down consistently every time I've used it. Failed in the Healey, failed in the Spitfire, and has failed in every TR6 I've had it in. Nowadays I'll only ever use one if it was in the car when I bought it. It's a good system in concept, and hall sensors are generally supposed to be reliable, but if you put a lot of miles on the cars like I do... when a Pertronix module gets hot it just stops working.

Yes, that's true. The distributors are chosen for specific applications, so increasing the range from idle to full advance could quickly damage the engine. It could be a different story for modified engines, but some dyno testing would be necessary to see whether additional advance would actually be helpful. For 99% of cars that aren't raced... the stock advance amount is plenty. Good comment!

Midwest Motoring just when you get into the emissions side of the distributor that's when you start playing with the weight and advance unless as stated for race applications anything after 1970 imo has the emissions bs runs terrible today due to the change in advance an different fuel

Hi Vic! What do you mean by "test the coil?" Are you trying to see whether it's a 6 or a 12 volt coil, or are you trying to see if it works at all? If you're not sure whether the coil is any good, one way to test it is by putting your multimeter between the + and - terminals. You should see a few ohms, like maybe 1.5 or 3. Then do the same between the + and the output to the distributor (the big wire on the top). This doesn't connect directly--it induces a current through the wizardry that is electromagnetism--so the resistance should be quite high (like in the thousands). If you get 0 ohms in the primary test or a fairly low resistance in the secondary one, then your coil is shot and needs to be thrown away.

I'd try a company like Moss Motors or Rimmer Brothers. Not sure who ships to South Africa, but I'd bet they would. Also, you don't need an electronic one. Those are multiple times the cost of just repairing the one you have. You won't notice the benefit on a road car, and they might not be legal in a race car depending on where you're running it. I'd just fix the original.

Ok yes. Technically speaking, they store an imbalance of charge, but with a net charge of zero. If I'm not mistaken, it's going to store energy physically rather than chemically like a battery... so it's incorrect to compare them. Condensers (aka capacitors) don't store charge, but do store energy in a form not unlike static electricity when you touch a door knob. For practical purposes the video is still helpful, but I do appreciate the comment. I can't make the next one better without continuing to learn!

Nah, I'd rather pocket the $450. I could have the original distributor rebuilt by someone else 2 or 3 times for that money.

Not to mention, the average enthusiast has no idea how to choose an advance curve, so it's adding a level of complexity that's simply not needed. It's also adding new failure points that will give less warning if things go wrong. Generally speaking, the benefit of electronic distributors won't be noticed on a classic British car driven on the road. It'd make a bigger difference for performance driving, but often the upgrade isn't allowed on a race track. They're good... I'm just not sure they're worth the money.

@@midwestmotoring You could sell it and fit the original . Mine went on a rolling road . You dont choose a curve ,you build the curve . Done by blue tooth on your phone

I do appreciate the ability to tune, but I can already do that by tweaking a couple springs for free. It's a great option. Just not for me.