Did Killers of the Flower Moon Just Bomb? - Charts with Dan! 

Was not expecting the ending where all the portals opened and prior Scorsese film characters emerged for the final battle. And they were all pretty much Robert DeNiro.

Dan: "What would happen if you adjust for inflation?" Audience: *chanting* "ADJUST! ADJUST! ADJUST!"

The way Dan said “The Departed” 😂😂😂

Let’s appreciate that KOTFM has already surpassed Expend4bles at the (domestic) box office!

How can there be any reasonable expectation of a $200 million budgeted movie being profitable when it’s rated R and almost 3 hours and a half? The math isn’t mathing

Congratulations on your upcoming wedding, Dan and Mara! I can’t wait to see you do your classic ‘heart tap’ wearing a brand new wedding band!

Scoresse's movies have rarely made any money, a lot of them were disappointments box office-wise; Ragging Bull, King of Comedy, After Hours, Kundun, Hugo, Silence, New York, New York, Bringing Out the Dead all were box office disappointments to flops. The reason why Studios invest in Scoresse is for Award season, ancillary market , and Repertory screenings.

My mother in law who speaks Tamil was extremely confused when I told her we went to see the new Leo movie on Saturday. Took us a bit to figure out we were referring to separate movies 😂

I’m so glad you called out the disappointing box office for Killers of the Flower Moon. It gets frustrating seeing cinefiles be so lenient with some movies just because they like the director.

Besides Glass Onion, it has already made more than any Netflix film. At least Apple knows theatrical releases are important.

People can claim that it has to do with dwindling attention spans, and maybe, but those actors and that director have aging fan bases, strong cinephile bases who want to see the entire movie, and not have to leave the theater for a bathroom break.

Never did I think this film was gonna make any money whatsoever

How does a relatively straightforward drama cost $200M to make? The problem is the cost much more than the story. Still, it should have been 2.5 hrs max.

I was hoping that studios would do re-releases of classic or hit movies during the strike to keep revenue coming in. While we can pretty much stream anything we want at home, that would appeal to those who really enjoy or appreciate the theatre experience.

IMO Nolan has more buzz (esp theater buzz) than Scorsese. His movies, based on special effects, are considered to be more "you gotta see this in theaters" compared to home/streaming.

I loved the Killers of the Flower Moon book. Saw the movie this weekend, and I'm not a huge Scorsase fan. Overall I liked the movie. Wish it moved at a slightly faster pace.

Five Nights at Freddy's being a hybrid release makes sense from a marketing perspective. There is a huge following on RU-vid that tracks the lore, does deep dives into the series of games, and is completely fueled by this multimedia franchise (it has games and books). Releasing it on streaming means those RU-vidrs can analyze the movie and do deep dives and have lots of video content, which will drive up their audience to see the movie so they can follow along and be part of the conversation. It makes a ton of sense.

Thanks for highlighting the Enzian!!!!! I love this place. It’s one of my favorite spots to see moves. I remember ever film I’ve seen here.

Top tier pronunciation of departed

Thank you for always being Honest Dan.The amount of people I've heard say this movie wasn't supposed to "Make Money" is ridiculous. Some of whom spent the better part of the summer dunking on all the "Big Budget Studio Flops"

I would say that the awards season has started in earnest with Killers of the Flower Moon being released (and movies like Anatomy of a Fall slowly gaining theaters). With that in mind it would be intersting to see if the "Oscar bump" even exists anymore. Everything Everywhere All At Once, for instance, only made a fraction of its earnings post nominations. It seems to me that spending millions of dollars campaigning is no longer financially sensible.

The reason I'm hesitant to see Killers of the Flower Moon is the length. I saw Oppenheimer several times, but I'm not sure I can sit through KotFM without having to run to the bathroom before the end.

Ugh thanks a lot Dan. I’ve been replaying the Crash N Sane Trilogy trying to platinum all the time trials and was up all night until I finally beat the hardest time trial in Crash 1 (The Lab). I just woke up and was deciding if I should take a break from crash, decided I needed one, clicked on your video, and now I have to play crash instead

These streaming services might fund these prestige movies because it improves their negotiating position with other projects.

Thanks for showcasing the Enzian! That’s my hometown theater that made me love movies in the first place

KILLERS vs. OPPENHEIMER Concept: Oppenheimer is a simple sell to the masses. Biopic. Oppenheimer. Atomic bomb. You get it in 5 seconds, and it denotes spectacle. Killers is more novelistic, more complex and harder to translate to prospective audiences. And as cinematic as it may be, the concept can sound like something you see at home. Length: that extra 26 minutes makes a big difference. Not for showtimes (whatever just throw it in a bunch of screens) but for audience commitment. We’re talking nearly 4 hours. Think the difference between Godfather 1 & 2. Both are great but you feel that length with 2. Scorsese is one of our greatest directors, and has been getting massive budgets for difficult subjects for decades. Some are great. Some are a bore. Some make money (Wolf). Some lose a ton (Gangs). All are indulgent- not a criticism just an analysis. Nolan is much more of a populist, also not a criticism. He was inspired by James Bond, Indiana Jones. So even his more serious movies- Oppenheimer, Dunkirk, Interstellar- they’re much easier sells to the masses. Haven’t seen Killers yet, I hope to in a theater but we have an 18-month-old and another on the way. Which there ya go, another gross suppressor, I would love to go see it but that is a big commitment for a 2 working parent household. Last thing on Scorsese- I love how much he beats the drum for Cinema, but between this and Irishman, JUST ADMIT IT MAN, YOU’RE MAKING MINISERIES!

I hadnt seen any promotional material until a week ago

While I do understand that KOTFM is likely to lose a lot of money for Apple in the end, at least they went with a wide theatrical release before streaming instead of dropping straight to Apple TV+ or doing a Netflix-style limited theatrical release before streaming, as the amount of money they might lose in the end won’t be as bad as if they went with one of those other options. That being said, this is only the first wide theatrical release Apple has done, so we’ll see how they go from here with the other two wide theatrical releases they currently have planned in the coming months.

If it wasn’t made by Apple, it would definitely be a flop with that budget.

I don’t think Apple is expecting to recoup their money for Killers of the Flower Moon.

Living in Orlando, love the shout out to the Enzian. Its a beautiful theater for our city.

Nearly fell over when Dan said the name of a theater that’s 20 minutes from where I work. Thanks for highlighting a really cool theater, Dan!

Just so you are aware, if it doesn't open closer to you, Anatomy of a Fall is playing in OKC this weekend.

History of Violence graphic novel was written by the creator of Judge Dredd. He's been trying to get his Button Man property made into a film for a few decades now.

Dans exactly right. Any other movie. Marvel. Star wars. Disney. Freaking fast furious. They have this opening with 200m budget everyone making "wtf happned" with sad face thumbnails but for Scorsese they say its doing pretty well ?? 😂😂guess cause "its cinema"

I'm part of the international audience, and I went to see the movie Killers of the Flower Moon this weekend. Second week since release, and there were less than 10 people in the theatre. To be truthful it was at midday, so maybe more people would come in the afternoon or evening. I enjoyed the movie on the same level as Oppenheimer, both kept me in my seat and focused on the movie. Maybe Barbenheimer boosted the interest for Oppenheimer more.

The Writers' Strike cast a major shadow over the potential marketing for this movie. Subservient actors and other associated film producers did not take an active role in promoting the film with television interviews, advertising and other sales provisioning. Because the major actors were silent during the strike, this was a major problem. The film is long, but very good. The retinue of great acting talent peppering the film left nothing to be desired where quality and commitment was concerned. Over time, this film will command respect and there will be some positive revisionist reviews to drive further attention to it. I predict it will be a classic.

Yay! The Enzian theater has been a staple here in Central Florida since I was a kid! I remember seeing a ton of late nineties Indie Darlings there

If any other movie released to 23 million opening weekend on a 200 million budget the trades would be screaming flop! So I really don’t understand why this movie is getting special treatment

“Taylor Swift isn’t cinema”

I liked KOTFM but my god, what a perfect example of a creator's point of focus being to the movie's detriment. Same thing happened with Once Upon A Time In Hollywood. I didn't really expect that from Scorsese. I definitely expected it from Nolan, but Oppenheimer had a perfect focus.

Movies only staying in theaters for a week or two makes it complicated to go and see a movie. Who has the time to go see every movie they might want to see on opening weekend? I wanted to go see Outlaw Johnny Black, but I only had two weeks to see it in which I was busy and it just disappeared.

I really liked Killers, BUT, financially speaking, what were they thinking?

What Killers of the Flower Moon might have going for it, is that unliked the typical Superhero movies that are often front loaded, it could had long legs through the month of November. It will be competing against the Mavrels and the new Hunger games that either are not the same audiance or are likely to struggle too.

Honestly, I didn’t even realize KOTFM was getting a wide theatrical release. Their marketing may have said so but placing the Apple Originals logo so prominently (or the mere fact of having their logo present like any studio, but the vastly different association) led me to assume it was a digital-first release. I wonder if I’m not alone in that.

You mention awards season, which could help KOTFM some, especially if it ends up winning big at the Oscars and is still around in theaters, or is re-released afterwards. Don't see any way it's going to come close to breaking even, though. And on a side note, I love the way Dan says "The Departed."

As someone who went and saw Oppenheimer in theatres and won't be watching Killers of the Flower Moon in theatres I can say that runtime is a big issue for me. Yes Oppenheimer is 3 hrs long but KotFM is 26m longer and for me that's a big difference. I haven't seen the movie but I don't understand why it needs to be that long. For example the Napoleon movie's theatrical cut is only going to be 2hrs 40m and that has a lot more stuff to cover. They also need to start adding intermissions to movies if they are 3hrs+. Oppenheimer also felt more like an event film that you needed to see in the theatre, in IMAX because that's what Nolan gives you. Although KotFM looks beautifully made it doesn't scream "watch on biggest screen possible".

Haha...The "De-pahted" Boston accent at 13:55 was pitch perfect.

By today's standards, yes KOTFM is a flop with that $200 million budget. However by Martin Scorsese standards I would say not necessarily, it's his third yet nearly second best opening ever. I think if the movie had been made for WAY lower of a budget, say around the same as what Shutter Island was, it might have been a massive success. Apple being the distributer doesn't have to worry too much, Martin is the kind of guy that will still make a movie people like even if it's not the most profitable one.

The Boston accent when you said The Depahhhhted🤣

Maybe they should have waited to release killers of the flower moon in November instead of the scary October Halloween season 🤔 Excited to see Five Nights at Freddy's this weekend in Dolby❤

Graphic request: can you add the budget number along with Week gross and Total?

I LOVE THE ENZIAN! My favorite theater in all of Florida. Great food and service. Deserves the love

Anatomy of a Fall is terrific. Go Dan, GO!

The "Dehpahted" 😂

Dan, break down how much from the Apple products I purchased was funded into the budget of flower moon. That’ll be cool. Loved the picture.

80's baby. I was born in the 70's. I remember watching Tough Guys over and over again. Great final scene with the train. You should give it a watch.

How the hell does Killers cost more than Oppenheimer? But yes, it was probably deeply hurt by the strike. You pay for actors like DiCaprio and DeNiro not just for great acting but also for publicity. And the strike made that impossible. The Producers keep shooting themselves in the foot. How much revenue have they lost by short-changing writers and actors?

To be honest, I’m waiting for every film to come out on streaming. I used to love the theater experience, but it’s not the same anymore. So, if I’m somewhat interested in watching a movie, I will wait for streaming. It’s cheaper and if the movie is not as good, I don’t lose out on spending money. This year, I’ve only gone to the theaters twice, both times to see Scream 6 and only because I’m a huge fan of the franchise (even then I could have watched it three or four times in theaters, but I’ve already knew it would be on streaming in a few months so didn’t). Every other movie, I’ve waited for streaming. With price tickets so high, and unless you’re only paying for yourself then I have to be really excited to go see a movie in theaters. Otherwise, I’m waiting for streaming.

Maybe we shouldn’t judge a work of art by how well it does at the box office. Raging bull flopped at the box office and then a decade later was judged as best picture of the decade. Barry Lyndon didn’t do too well and it’s an absolute masterpiece. So sometimes… Who cares about the money? Maybe 10 years from now people will understand how good “killers of the flower moon” truly is.

I thought I saw an ad on FB saying a Haunting in Venice would be on Disney+ on Oct 31.

I understand period pieces can be expensive and the onscreen talent isn’t cheap but judging from the trailers, idk why this film cost 200 million to make

When I hear about Fathom Events I'm reminded of seeing Never Surrender, a top-quality movie about Galaxy Quest. Highly recommended

Another great Charts episode Dan! That’s an amazing Box Office Flashback Top 5. I saw “Tough Guys” on VHS after it’s theatrical run. Yes, I’m that old. No, it’s not that good.

Great video Dan!

How could you not mention Martin Scorsese's connection with the Woodstock documentary? Such a great built in transition. Thanks for the numbers as always.

Didn’t Scorsese’s Hugo lose a lot of money? It’s not mentioned as a flop because it won Oscars and rave reviews. Yet Scorsese keeps on going.

200 million dollars is an absurd budget for this type of movie. Good for Scorsese for getting that budget, but it's definitely not financially viable.

I am loving Dan's pronunciation of 'The Departed'.

Planning a wedding is a lot of work!😊 Good luck! But it's fun too!

I think it could recoup in the long term and as part of streaming packages but as it stands, there just isn’t enough of an audience & environment for this type of endeavour to recoup upfront, good bad or otherwise. 🤷‍♂️

For me and several people I know, one of the big reasons why we're not watching KOTFM is really simple... We just dont like Scorsese's newer films. They all feel very 'same-y' sure the stories are at a glance different, but when you look closer theyre just bloated pieces of Oscar bait. Hard Pass.

I was basically the only one of my film nerd friends this summer to not particularly like Oppenheimer. The reception on KOTFM has been a LOT more divisive. There's a lot of disappointment with varying degrees of liking it anyway. In short, this movie is dead on box office arrival (a lot of film nerd competition ahead). It will be interesting to see how it does awards season wise.

I saw the 2019 Oscars and a 20th Anniversary screening of Blair Witch Project at the Enzian. Wonderful theater and a home of the Florida Film Festival!

Anatomy of a Fall was an excellent movie. I hope you get to enjoy it soon.

Dan breaks *Betteridge's law of headlines* in an incredible display of movie revenue knowledge!

i still cant believe oppenheimer made more than guardians of the galaxy...thats just insane to me

Dvd, bluray, and digital sales for the taylor swift movie are going to be insane

The dephhaaaarted😂

My husband and I...and our two kids saw it all we all loved it. Only complaint from everyone was the length 3 1/2 hrs... and from me, the time line was all over the place, so it could be confusing. But still...great movie!

Love the shirt dan!

I look forward to the Independent Theater feature every week 👍🏻👍🏻🎥🎞️

In regards to this week in history, The Colour of Money was also the inspiration for the name of the video game series, Doom

I think the difference in subject matter is really holding back KotFM from performing in a manner more comparable to Oppenheimer. Not saying that the story of KotFM isn't worth telling, but the momentous gravity of something like the Manhattan Project just isn't there.

Tough Guys is legendary in the UK - it was half way through a showing when it was yanked off for coverage of the start of the 1991 Gulf War.

I'm actually really surprised by that drop for Taylor Swift. I was expecting it to have a really small one for some reason. This seems very steep to me.

When I saw killers of the flower moon opening night I was the only person in the theater. I enjoyed the film but it seems like it flopped. Good movies flop. It happens

Lets Goooooooo! I still say "No worries" based on Crocodile Dundee.

Hey Dan, I know this is outside what you normally cover but could you highlight the Sabaton film "The War To End All Wars - The Movie"? It will have it's global premiere in museums in the 2 weeks surrounding November 11, 2023 (Armistice Day), as part of the never-been-done-before "History Rocks" project?

Apple made two movies like that this year. Scorsese got Killers of the flower moon and Scott got Napoleon.

One thing that might be going on with sound of freedom is that a lot of movies right now are only playing on the weekdays as Taylor Swift has the screens occupied on the weekend. My local theatre is playing turtles, equalizer, and sound of freedom weekdays only this week.

I am in Seminole County Florida. 22mins away from the Enzian.

Did 'KOTFM' set the box office *ABLAZE*

Dan Murrell, You don't remember but Paul Hogan was in commercials for Australia in the years before Crocodile Dundee came out.

To be fair, I haven't seen Oppenheimer, nor did I see Killers of the Flower Moon this weekend, and for the same two reasons: 1. I just don't have that kind of time. 2. In both cases I've already read the book.

Fun fact: Christopher Nolan got the idea of the collapsing city in Inception from the Crocodile Dundee movie poster.

Wishful thinking but wouldn't it be nice to go back to the days where a $100m production budget was seen as impressive/borderline excessive?! Why couldn't Apple learn the lesson of The Irishman's excessive budget plus Scorsese's box office record when deciding Killers of the Flower Moon's budget?! Scorsese in his very long career only has ONE movie (Wolf of Wall Street) that has grossed over $300m worldwide, so surely it's irresponsible to give him a budget over $100m for any of his movies?!

Thanks 😻

T-Swift tickets are double price so if we're talking butts in seats its a much different standing. Its not apples to apples here at all.

I'm doing my best to avoid seeing any film connected to anyone who signed the petition defending R. Polanski. M. Scorsese was someone whom I looked up to. Not anymore.