This winter I’m pretty sure I’m doing a S&S 465 cam with all the goodies on my 18 Softail. That’s one of the things I like about S&S is they sell the whole kit with most things you need.
To do this job right, there are many expensive parts to install. Doc didn't even get into cam plates and oil pumps, which many times are also highly recommended upgrades when camming a motor.
Good explanation of what needs/should be done when upgrading the chain tensioners, cam chest plate or oil pump in a TC. It’s a domino effect. While the work is being done, might as well replace the parts that should be replaced or updated/upgraded. Cost wise, they are about the same whichever “avenue” you go, one had more parts involved with less labor cost and the other way involves less parts but more labor cost. Kind of a wash. Great video explaining the ways to go. Took me several trips and many questions to different dealerships to figure out these two “avenues”. You wouldn’t believe how some stealerships would try to combine all of those parts and labor fees into just one overpriced and mixed up mess. Do the research and ask questions! You can weed out the BS faster 😉
I wish I had seen this video 18 years ago when I had my stock cams replaced with performance cams in my 2002 twin cam 88. I could have made a much more informed decision. As it stands. I followed the parts manual suggestion on part numbers to replace and everything worked out well.
I just bought the SE8-447 Cams for my 2021 Street Glide, also purchased Screamin Eagle Tappets, Screamin Eagle adjustable pushrods, once they arrive i will book an appointment with Harley and they can tell me what else i need at time of install.
first of all, great video. initially, I thought you were going to address supporting parts for a cam like matching intake, breather, tuner, exhaust/slip ons, etc. might be an interesting topic to cover so you don't get the wrong cam for what your bike already has on it. just a thought. I'll watch whatever you put up :). Have a great new year.
Hey Doc, did my 2019 CVO Road Glide come from the factory with the upgraded cam bearings and SE oil pump? Did it come stock with any other upgraded factory drivetrain parts? Thanks Doc!
I went to replace the oil pump on my 2019 street glide (it had the old oil pump) well if you’re putting in a a billet oil pump you might as well go with a billet cam plate. Once I got into everything it was only another $200 to buy the complete kit with the cam. The other thing I didn’t account for is the tuning. Once you change cams you really have to have your bike dyno tuned. That was another $700. So in the end I should have just replaced the cam plate and oil pump. It wasn’t just another $200. It was more like another $1000 once you included tax and gas to get to the dyno (the closest one to me was an hour and a half away)
2007 Ultra Hi Doc always appreciate your thoughtfulness of providing service info for us home mechanics. My issue: I have had to replace my ignition switch due to the contact strip getting corrosion. My bike has just a few miles less than 100k. Is there anything I can do to help or prevent this from happening. I'm starting to get check engine light off and on again. Last time it left me stranded. Thanks again, Jim
I know in the computer world and most electronic repair stores they use several sprays that clean and coat to prevent corrosion. Stop by a local shop and talk with them. Maybe a can, can be used to spray at every service to help prevent future issues...Doc
Let’s not forget if your bike has hi mileage you may want to check the clutch if it’s worn will it help get the new found power to road. I know I want s&s 570 cams and will need a new clutch new lifters, springs, cam plate oil pump and on and on and on It’s definitely not as simple as most people think.
What kind of cam set up should I run on my 16 103 and how much should I pay to have the work done parts/labor? Thanks for any input. Sincerely the bolt stripper aka captain break shir
I was gonna ask the same for my 16’ Road King 103,, lol!! I feel or wish I could have just a little more umf! If you know what I mean. T/C & Ride Safe.
Great video. I often wonder why manufacturers don’t over build their products and then de-tune them. For example- put in the screaming Eagle bearings and tappets but use the stock cam from the factory. Those bearing will probably last longer anyway and if a customer wants to put a different cam in, it’s ready for it. I highly doubt the screaming Eagle bearings and tappets cost much more to make if made in large quantities like the stock bearings and tappets. The end result would probably be a better quality product from the start and a happier customer when he doesn’t have to deal with all the “extra” cost when adding something simple like a bolt in cam. Oh well. I guess a rider could wait a couple more yrs when the standard engine now puts out more power than your modified 3 yr old bike.
question for dock I decided to go with the 447 cam for my 2017 M8 , chose to go back in with a new set of stock lifters all installed by my HD shop under Warranty . 30k miles later the oil pump needed replacing , the shop calls and tells me the lifters have a strange wear pattern on them 4 , it looked like to me and the tec. the lifters were twisting in their bore . have you seen or hear of this . we when back in with new cam and SE lifters . I have now traided the bike at 50k for a 2020. road glide .
Happy new year you all. I have a heritage 2005 and I am worry about inner cam bearings. People say that I must replace them because the stock ones are bad and engine could colapse,others say that it was an issiu on 2001 year models. But I have seen simular Harleys for sale and they have gone stock many,many kilometers/miles than my. They say that they did nothing to their engines. I use to have dyna fat bob 2008 and 96cui, problem with that one was compensator. It seems like its always something with Harleys depending on year model. Does any of you have any bad expirience with 1450 motors???my have 12000km on it.
I want to ask you about the new Torque Cam for my 2020 Ultra limited 114. I want more low end power but I also want to keep my stock mufflers and head pipe because I love the stock sound. Can I have my dealer install this cam with the Ventilator air cleaner plus use a Screaming Eagle tuner ? mind you I still have the extended warrantyand don't want to void it.
I have a 2002 Duece stage 1and a 06 Street Glide Stage 3 and both get annoying on long rides so my 2020 is such a pleasure to ride. I installed a Ventilator that comes stock on a new Street Glide but I notice my cooling fans come on within seconds of stopping at a light so I'm worried I might be running lean. The instructions that come with the ventilator air cleaner says that ECM must be Recalibrated after installing the ventilator but my local dealer tells tells me that that there isn't a the screaming Eagle street pro just for recalibrating for an air cleaner and that there is only a Stage number one upgrade tune. Can you elaborate on that?
I’m only about 15 miles from you, and you’re right about power. All these guys paying for drag race powered TOURING bikes is laughable. 150 HP at 6k rpm and never turn it to that anyway. It would be cheaper to just buy Dyno sheets, since that’s what it’s really all about anyway.
I'm really glad I found this great video. I've got a 2014 Slim 103, currently with a 'stage 1' kit (SE Heavy Breather, Bassani Firesweeps, & V&H FP3 tuner), but tossing up between Wood TW-222 or a Zipper's Red Shift 525 (with the 'supporting actors' of course). I'm looking for a vendor who can supply all the bits as a bundled kit & ship to Australia, so hopefully the guys at Low Country Harley-Davidson can win my business. My riding style is solo, city, metro & out of metro, legal speeds, just want to get the true potential from the 103, particularly for effortless acceleration & overtaking. Furthermore, I'm not sure if I should also get a heavier clutch spring or stick the the original. And is the original cam plate, chain tensioners & oil pump good enough to keep in place? Feedback welcome. Thanks in advance :)
As far as your clutch goes, if you do start experiencing any slippage with the new cams you could just add the SE Variable Pressure clutch. Keeps the stock pull on the lever while at idle but as the rpms go up while riding the weights move outward thus putting the extra needed pressure on the clutch spring. www.harley-davidson.com/us/en/shop/screamin-eagle-variable-pressure-clutch/p/37000121A
@@revilok8698 Many thanks for the quick reply. You're a wealth of knowledge. That SE variable pressure clutch kit looks the business. Much appreciated.
Thanks for taking the time to watch our videos. At this time we do not sell overseas. Might I suggest contacting Wes at Cycle-Rama out of Florida. His designed 570 cams would give you all you want. I’m sure his team can build a package to send that will do everything. Ask Wes all the possible options for a reliable build. Thanks ~ Doc
Happy new yr doc! What's your opinion on the adjustable push rods vs solid push rods? And if i am running the HD dino oil in my 2020 m8 would i have to upgrade to the synthetic SE oil if i went with a se cam?
@@chadb5009 I'm guessing you don't live where it's constantly 100 degrees in the summer either. I use Mobile 1. If I run low while on a trip it's easier to find a Walmart than an HD dealership. Especially after hours or on Sunday or Monday
@@BigChuck525 yeah i was thinking about switching to amsoil. I see alot of dealership even selling it so i might try that. And i live in Michigan so its more cold than hot lol.
harley is the only motorcycle company that constantly needs upgrades and improvements.but on a postive note it keeps the indi and aftermarket companies rolling in the dough.and i,m one of them.
About those lifters I hear they’re still having a lot of problems with those roller bearings in the rollers. I know a lot of guys blew the motor is up over that shit. 10 or 15 years ago it was the cam bearings that you had to worry about now it’s the lifters coming apart. Yeah outsourcing I guess they’ll get it right sooner or later . Keep that extended warranty. Thanks Doc
I'm installing a new set of Woods TW222 on a 2016 103ci HO. Found out the hard way the stock push rods will not work, you have to get adjustable ones. The breather Harley sells is not the right one, the gaskets do not line up right and they don't sell the gasket for the old breather. This has been a nightmare.
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson Still trying to find out what's up with the oil breather. Ended up going to an shop here and they just happened to have the gaskets for the old oil breather.
I have an 03 road king classic she just turned 29 k and I'm going to get the service done on it I want to leave it as stock as possible its bone stock now anyone have any ideas on cams tensioners any thing to keep it reliable as it has been its a sweet classic well taken care of not a hot rod and want to keep it that way
I have been collecting all these parts for my 13 RG. Most parts are S&S. I'm close to a $1500. But you have to get the tools also. Bearing puller bolt cutters on and on.
Hey there mate . Can you tell me please if Liqui Moly additive in the engine is ok? I fix it up the engine at local HD dealer but still have noise because of the lifters when the engine is worm . The dealer said i didn t ride enought miles and lifters are empty , i run a Road King FLHR 2001. Thanks !!
Additives don't fix just mask the issue. There is some truth to what the dealer has said. But he should have added, Riding a Harley for short distances allows condensation to stay in the motor. Condensation drips in the oil and does not allow it to do its job...Lifter and Cam chain adjusters are effected alot by this. Change your oil more often, allow your motor to warm up. Ride more and when you return allow the motor to run for 1-2 minutes on the jiffy stand before shutting off...Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson The dealer said that he upgrade the cam shaft , basically like you said in your videos about the camshafts (the 3rd type of camshaft) that the ticking can be in the engine They changed lifters , oil pump camshafts , chains , pistons , cylinders , cam plate and list go on . i already change the oil and filter . Is just wondering me but maybe is nothing , maybe i have to ride more with the bike . Thank you very much DOC and greetings to you !!
If your bike is a 2017 or earlier It's not a bad idea but not really that necessary. If your bike is an M8 it is not necessary at all for a bolt in cam. I know an indy mechanic that tested the stock clutch after a major build (turbo) on a 2019 Fatbob. The stock clutch didn't slip until well over 150hp & tq. Can't say every bike would be the same but I certainly wouldn't worry about the clutch for just a cam swap.
@@revilok8698 Thanks for sharing that bit of information Revilok86 , it answers a question that was in a reply that I posted a short while ago. By the way, what's your take on the replacing the cam plate & tensioners, or is it okay to keep the originals?
@@Jonathan-L if you are referring to the old style spring loaded cam chain tensioners by all means ditch them for the up graded hydraulic cam plate & tensioners or go gear drive cams. Going to gear drive you have to have very little crank run out or they won't last. Also the person installing them needs to know how to measure the gear lash on the cams and if that is out of spec he has to order a new gear that is cut to the necessary spec for them to last. If you already have the hydraulic in a TC or M8 you should be fine for a long time. I've seen the hydro tensioners last over a 100k in the bike and then I've seen tensioners that only had 47k on them that were close to the bottom end of spec. I would say that at some point around 50k miles give them a look to see how the wear is.
@@revilok8698 My 103 is stock internally at this point in time. Although the bike had 1 owner before me, he only put on pipes & air cleaner, so the internals are all original. I'm assuming that the cam chain tensioners are the spring type.
@@Jonathan-L I just saw on your question below what year your bike was and you have the newer hydraulic cam plate. The spring tensioners were in the TC 88 engines with 5 speed transmission. Once HD upgraded to the 96” with six speed, 06’ in Dyna’s and 07’ in touring and Softails, they went to hydraulic.
Hello Doc Harley. I appreciate your expertise on HD given your RU-vid videos that I’ve subscribed to. I am an owner of a 2020 Harley Breakout 114ci and recently upgraded it with a Stage III with a 2-1 Rinehart exhaust running 18mm wideband sensors. I also purchased the SE smart tuner which has been installed. The HD mechanic noted that the Breakout did not require any mapping at this time, but I respectfully disagreed. My question to you sir, what would be the best mapping for the current setup I have on my Breakout? I feel that it’s not performing at its optimal potential. However, I’m not a mechanic but a loyal HD rider for the past 40+ years. Your assistance is greatly appreciated. Richard from Hawaii.
Er’body wants them cams for a little extra and drop all that cash! How about gearing that heavy turd down some? It’s called torque multiplication and the factory geared these bikes really high to help keep emissions really low and make Uncle Sammy happy..... That 6-speed tranny will still keep rpm’s in a reasonable range on the interstate. If ya need high speed get a Busa!
Things in life are always more expensive than you think. As long as you think that way no surprises. It is like a vacation. You already have spent so much to arrive at your destination. You will regret if you did not spend that additional cash. Motors are expensive to modify vs suspension. Buy the bike for the OEM engine then with money you saved for suspension and maybe lightening the bike by 50 pounds. Your fairly limited on air cooled bikes on amounts of horsepower without effecting reliability, longevity, and heat production.
I went with the 255 cam in my 103 along with a long list of supporting actors. Most excellent way to destroy the compensator, then the S E Compensator and starter, and other weak links as they raise their little sleepy heads. It's only money...
You would be amazed how much an SE255 will wake up your engine. Easy to do. J&P Cycles have an in depth tutorial on how to do it. If yer handy with a wrench it's a fun job. Use the adjustable pushrod, no heads have to come off. Fun. And whole new bike.
If you are willing to spend the money, yes! I prefer the solid billet plate over the cast factory plate. It is highly suggested to owners with early spring tensioner, so they have the hydraulic tensioners, The SE oil pump and billet cam support plate. Any cam choice above bolt in, It’s a must. Thanks ~ Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson Reason I'm asking is because my local dealer suggested that I go straight to stage 2 with the existing S&S Mk-45's slip-ons I have to get better performance from my stock 107 and they said the SE tuner is back ordered until December. I do plan on getting all the parts you mentioned in this video and was a little bit concerned the tuner wasn't part of this video. Thanks for clearing this up.
@@jimscycleandautotn8508 Hey, I love Harley, and in my lifetime (I’m 58) I’ve owned 7, my present H-D Is a 2019 FXDR, I chose to keep it Stock, cause the look and power of this Bike doesn’t need to be changed, IMO and I f do decide to sell it, a fully stock bike with an intact extended warranty is pretty rare, since most people immediately change up and re-Tune their bikes, making the Warrnty void. My. FXDR rides 80-90 MPH all day, smooth and full of torque, how much more do you really need on the streets. And when it’s parked, this is one of the best looking power cruisers ever made. 🇺🇸👍
@@wingandhog its too easy to work a hatley yourself you get bent over on lbor from dealership. They will never ever touch my shit and any of my customers shit again.
These are not at all required for an HD. This is stuff that is unique to buying a harley because it allows us to work on these kinds of engines this way. Aftermarket or Screamin Eagle will require stuff liek this. None of this is required, you can ride your bike for 100K+ miles and never spend a dime on any of this.
I know. They put in the low grade cam bearing at the factory, but insist you upgrade when you do a cam swap. So I did. Not an expensive piece of the build but it highlights that the factory didn't do it.
you sholdent need to ask the service consultant znd take him for a drink, they should recommend these things autumatically, that just shows you that harley doesnt take care of thier cistomers the way they should,,, not disrespect to you doc
