Doctor Who: Rogue SPOILER Discussion - What THAT Cameo Really Means! 

No one has yet referred to this as the 'Angry Birds' episode.

To me, "She's my best friend" meant "She's *not* my girlfriend, so we're OK to have that sort of relationship."

CLARA: But you don't die. You change. You pop right back up with a new face. DOCTOR: No, not for ever. I can change twelve times. Thirteen versions of me. Thirteen silly Doctors. CLARA: Okay, so you're number eleven, so DOCTOR: Ha. Are we forgetting Captain Grumpy, eh? I didn't call myself the Doctor during the Time War, but it was still a regeneration. CLARA: Okay, so you're number twelve. DOCTOR: Well, number ten once regenerated and kept the same face. I had vanity issues at the time. Twelve regenerations, Clara. I can't ever do it again. This is where I end up. This face, this version of me. We saw this planet in the future, remember? All those graves, one of them mine. The 11th doctor clearly say David was number 10 So he numbering him self in some order

Slight correction Ellie: the 11th Doctor actually did refer to himself as "11th". He did it in The Lodger, AND he knew the 11th Door in The God Complex was for him, so for a time, he did follow along too.

19:24 I’d heard someone else say The Doctor declares Ruby as his best friend to signal his availability to Rogue, and that made sense to me. Like he’s letting Rogue know, “Oh, that girl I’m with? I’m not WITH her with her, she’s just my best friend.”

Richard Grant also played the Great Intelligence, and in one of his appearances he used “Intelligent Snow” which has a tied motif to Ruby Sunday who snows when she’s in danger or emotionally vulnerable

William Hartnell once said as the Doctor, "I am the original".

Jack is openly attracted to everyone and anyone, we only see rogue attracted to the doctor. One is just horny the other is a gay man. I really hope this is just a new character not a new face of Jack or River.

What I’m liking is that the Doctor has gone through therapy, annnnnd is still going through rehab. Anytime Ruby has been dead/in danger, or the idiots on finetime refused to be saved, he freezes. It’s almost as though he’s healed from all his trauma, but still gets PTSD triggers.

Doesn't Matt Smith essentially number the Doctors in 'The Name of the Doctor' when he explains to Clara that he's run out of regenerations?

Welcome back Ellie

There was also the save gallifrey scene in day of the doctor when capaldi pops up pre-regeneration and says "all 13".

Anyone else noticing how many episodes this season has had a scene where the Doctor sings?

Russel Davies said that Ruth Madeley had a scheduling conflict which is why she isn't in the finale. They liked Lenny Rush in Space Babies and brought him back when Ruth wasn't available. The character of Shirley will be back in the next series.

I think as long as the romance isn't tredding the same ground as before, then I'm open to it for the Doc. We've had a wife with River, we've had unrequited companion love with Martha, danger enduced temporary feelings with Amy, and we've had a companion romance with Rose, so if Rogue ends up a longterm longdistance boyfriend that eventually ends in mutual breakup (preferably not tragic death!) I'd be down for exploring this romance angle for the Doctor!

I think the way that 'find me' scene played out, it was unilateral. Basically both knew that there are countless dimensions and that it's next to impossible to find someone there but then rogue still said 'find me' and pushed the button. I don't think the doctor even had the time to promise this, so it would be a stretch for rogue to actually wait and expect to be found

Hartnel refered to himself as the first dr. “The original you might say”

Something I didn't have on my 2024 bingo card was having Jonathan Groff in Doctor Who

I’d love to see Jo come back 1 day she was such a good doctor

I have had a head canon theory since the Great Intelligence episode. When he walks into the time stream, he is everywhere in the Doctors timeline. Who is to say he stole the Doctors identity and his Tardis and pretended to be him. As the Shalka Doc was canon briefly... that is where we get a REG 9th... BUT as soon as Clara steps in reverses all of that and takes the Shalka/REG out of canon. Briefly he was the Doc and had his two adventures and then not. Has RTD put it back in due to the Toymakers 'Jigsaw' comment?

Idk, I felt Rogue was closest to Madame de Pompadour and the episode had similar vibes to Girl in the Fireplace (the non-Moffat TM elements). The Doctor was instantly taken with them the course of an episode, and then lost them in the end after offering to take them away with him.

The Doctor was RIVER’S conpanion in Husbands of River Song

Rogue (the character) is what you get when you ask someone to draw Captain Jack from memory. I loved him but it's a very funny way to describe him.

**Gets Painted Into A Corner** Most People: Ugh, this is impossible RTD: OOH, PAINT!

Those of us who have not watched Bridgerton, have it seems seen or heard or read enough Austen etc to be able to follow the story quite well. I agree that Rogue has a lot of "Captain Jack" vibes.

One great thing about being an Aussie is midnight = 9am for me, so it's a lovely Saturday morning treat.

The way the Doctor/Ruby relationship went from meeting to friends for 6 months so quickly again makes me think of the way time jumped for Donna in The Library. I still wouldn’t be surprised if this whole season will be some sort of simulated reality with River or Doctor Moon being the one who waits.

I feel like when they entered Rogues ship and the doctor said how dirty it was, he immediately asked who he'd lost. Showing us what it would look like if the doctor himself traveled alone

This was a quick turn around for the spoiler discussion!!! Thanks for the content

The way I see it is that Richard E. Grant's regeneration is just another example of the Toymaker making a jigsaw out of the Doctor's history. I wouldn't be surprised if this is just the beginning and Russell winds up making other non-canon and/or contradictory things canon.

The only time I can remember where the numbering system is mentioned in canon was in the Five Doctors, where 'one' says to 'five' "So there are five of me now."

"Some of the faces look weirder than others"... I think that's because they didn't have the actor to pose and had to pull a still where they're looking in the right direction, correct profile... but maybe was in mid conversation, or just in a completely different mood of the scene. Never take a picture while talking.

When they introduced the War Doctor however, 11 does mention that he's one of his 13 regenerations so it still fit neatly into the idea of the Doctor being limited to so many faces. And then of course immediately after he says that, the Time Lords give him more regenerations so that clearly opened the door to maybe he had more before. It works. My issue with TTC is not that there were more doctors before Hartnell, it's that it made the doctor more special than they needed to be. I personally fancy the idea of the Doctor just being another Time Lord who happened to step up when the call was made. I'm also okay with the idea of the Other from the extended universe where there was a progenitor of the society that just got reincarnated as the Doctor. But then to do what they did with TTC and give the Doctor this even more fantastical origin and basically essentially just give him infinite incarnations that his entire planet abused, tortured, brainwashed, and took advantage of for millennia.... I just don't gel with that. I don't think it's complicated to grasp, but I think it just messes with the lore too much and also went in a completely different direction from where they were going with the 12th's relationship with Gallifrey. I also don't like how they didn't really go further with the Master's beef over it. The Master got upset that he wasn't special and killed Gallifrey as a result, but I wish they spent more time with the two characters actually sussing out their relationship and how this new information changes it rather than the Master just throwing a temper tantrum well the Doctor stood in shock completely useless for the rest of the episode. Also Flux completely ruined whatever momentum they could have built up by just muddying that origin story even further. I had no idea what was going on and they don't explain it and I don't like it.

In the Five Doctors, when the 1st Doctor meets the Fifth, he enquires “Regeneration?” (As the process is still in his personal future and something he has not yet experienced) and the Fifth Doctor acknowledges this and says “fourth!” And the first Doctor says “Goodness me, so there are 5 of me around!”. Incidentally, I’ve actually seen some fans criticize this statement and say “but the fourth Doctor was Tom Baker!” yes, dense creatures, but it was the THIRD Regeneration, the actual process, that led to the Fourth Doctor, just as the fourth regeneration was fourth Doctor turning into the Fifth Doctor. So even that shows the Doctors referred to themselves on some level as the fifth incarnation of the first Doctor (who has been thru four regenerations, etc). So however RetconFans want to play it, the Doctor definitely thought he began with the 1st Doctor/WIlliam Hartnell/Richard Hurndall/etc etc etc. It may have been something that the earlier production teams had played loose with such as the faces in “Brain of Morbius” but by the Deadly Assassin the Regeneration Limit has been set at a hard 12 (12 regenerations for 13 Doctors or 13 different incarnations of the TimeLords at that time, as confusing as regular language is to describe this all! :-) And by The Five Doctors they certainly referred to the Doctors as First Doctor, second Doctor, etc. Still not a fan of the Timeless Child, tho it may be more the way it was portrayed onscreen than the base idea itself. But the inclusion of the Richard Grant Doctor is just ludicrous and confusing and ultimately pointless just as things were starting to calm down. It’s like even RTD is saying screw history, we can throw in any rando we want, and we dont feel any obligation to explain it to fans or give any background or reason for it. And it further seems they simply write off anyone who finds this fluid history diconcerting as taking it all “too seriously” and that we should lighten up, yet if it’s something they find upsetting then how can fans be so lax in their fandom and devotion to Who? It’s driving me a bit crazy atm and turning Who on its head. Or someone’s head, because who can be sure whose heads are even Who’s at this point! :-)

It was a fun episode, and yes, I'd also call it Classic New Who. There was one scene where Indira blinked, and although it was vertical (as we do blink) vs horizontal, which could only be achieved via cgi, the way she did it was *really* bird-like. Amazing!

I literally haven't been able to fault an episode in this series (Except Space Babies, sorry, that one is being repressed). But I just realised something that I really miss... I miss those moments in the Tardis at the beginning and end of each episode, the warm up to the adventure to come, the cooldown at the end - The whirling and roaring of the Tardis and the excitement of the companion to open those doors. The banter and laughing between the Doctor and Companion. I love this season, but I just realised how wonderful those little moments were.

I dont like it when people say "the doctor is/isnt this" re; romance in this case but thats a general rule We all know every doctor has their own personalities and with Ncuti being as naturally flirty as he is, it is a required component but i also wouldnt buy him being flirty with everyone. He gives the vibe of someone who is flirty but only to one person he really likes Whereas Matt Smiths portrayal felt so naturally sexless and asexual. I think its all down to the actors own strengths and weaknesses

Matt Smith absolutely called himself the eleventh in The Lodger after the head-bonk info dump, and he also (IIRC) had a football kit with an 11 as a little cutesy hat-tip.

Now you've done it! I'm hearing Rogue singing "Reindeer are better than people." 😅😂

Sorry, I don't see Rogue as being a character striking fear in the Toymaker...

In-universe the numbering did matter, because of the limited number of regenerations, which came up several times. Nevermind when the Time Lords themselves called out "all THIRTEEN Doctors!" with Capaldi's first appearance on the show. Emphasis on the word "all."

Given the unpleasant terms on which Christopher Eccleston left the show, Russell T Davies was playing a dangerous game by canonising an alternate 9th Doctor

I think the "drama" the birds were going to be attracted to would be war and they'd get the humans to kill each other. I'm fairly sure they said that.

The Doctor refers to Sarah Jane Smith in the episode “Seeds Of Doom” as his “best friend”, but in a later season refers to a companion as his “second best friend”. I wish I could remember the episode but I can’t at the moment but it stood out to me that when he referred to someone as his “second best friend “ he was referring to Sarah Jane as the first.

I think the 'six months passing' thing is due to episode re-ordering? There's been talk that this should have been the episode after Space Babies, and The Devil's Chord was moved from here to tie in with Eurovision and a strong character on that first double bill. That would also explain why Ruby only mentioned their first trip when she tries to convince the Doctor that she's really Ruby.

12:50 But the whole point of the Eleventh Doctor's regeneration was the fact he was at the end of the cycle He even said he was the Eleventh and that the "Tenth had vanity issues"

Every episode we get keeps making me think that the season finale will reveal that they are within a TV show (in universe). The way they mentioned plot twist this episode drove that further

I think we have to say that The Toymaker's line "I made a jigsaw out of your life" can explain a lot of this. That could explain both the Timeless Child Jo Martin Doctor AND the Richard Grant Shalka Doctor suddenly appearing when they never appeared in similar scenes before. I must confess, being a HUGE Peter Cushing fan, even though his Doctor Who can only be an "alternate universe" Doctor, I still would have squealed like a tiny Japanese schoolgirl if they had shown that Doctor with the others.

I WANT TO SEE OSGOOD AGAIN

Jack is rogues lost companion

This has to be my favourite episode yet on so many levels.

Ruth still about, saw her literally in town filming a scene with doctor and Ruby for S2 😊

My theory: doctor has been in some sort of dream/story state and the reason so many characters are reminiscent of others is because of this. Rogue - jack, Susan twist - Clara/Me, Mrs. Flood speech patterns remind me of Tallulah (daleks take manhattan), h. Arpenger/ she is a herold of mad max/ mad max is the worst prime minister ever - harold Saxon. almost dream changed versions. The storylines have reminded me of dream memories of different genres or stories. The labyrinth, a musical, scary, historical romance… like changing channels or reading books.

what if Richard E Grant as the doctor is a red herring and the great intelligence is making a return???? The snow would make sense and could be controlling Susan Twist's character. Both from the classic era and NewWho

That shot of Jodie. I do miss her. Ncuti is great btw. I wanted more of Jodie (episodes )during her time I hope she comes back in a future episode or something.

“You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain” 😂😂 25:08

On the numbering: Pre-Timeless Children, the Doctor seemed to genuinely believe in the numbering system, having no knowledge of the previous incarnations eg. Fugitive. They WERE aware of War, but actively chose to exclude War from the count because they felt he was "not the Doctor". We hear 11 refer to himself as the Eleventh mutliple times, as well as 10 as "10" once, so at this time they still believed in those numbers. As for the Shalka Doctor... We never saw what face War finished regenerating into on screen. It's possible there were more regenerations in between War and 9, which the Doctor ALSO chose not to count as numbered Doctors for whatever reason, or it's possible the memory of those faces could've been wiped from the Doctor somehow. Or it's possible that the Toymaker HAS re-written the Doctor's personal timeline, adding in Shalka or any other additional incarnations, anywhere in the list he feels like. Ultimately... The time has long passed for us to stop caring about numbering, or even what order these faces occured in. The Doctor has had a massive number of faces, mostly off-screen and the numbers are just lingering nicknames based on now defunct information.

You guys are so lovely to listen to!

I look at statements like "all 11 of them" as technically true at the time, but because things are timey-wimey, could have retroactively changed for there to be more. We now have three un-numbered Doctors plus a reused face with two numbers, so we've got to be flexible in our thinking.

I look at the Doctor telling Rogue Ruby is his best friend as him letting Rogue know he showed up to the dance with her but was not *with her. Contextually, that's how it played, in my opinion.

My head cannon is all of the doctors that aren’t numbered (minus the war doctor) are pre Hartnel while the Doctor was apart of the division. Once the doctor got kicked out of division, the time lords locked there memories away/ put a limit on there regeneration to 12. This would make Clara begging the time lords for there help in giving the doctor a new batch of regenerations still meaningful and solve that plot hole

About the holographic faces, what you both seemed to not have caught: it very much seemed to me that Rogue recognized the 10th Doctor's face.

The thing is we only assume the Shalka Doctor is an alternative 9th Doctor because of when Scream of the Shalka came out (he would have been 9th assuming he was after Paul McGann) but now we have whole acres of timeline real estate up for grabs he could be anywhere... And given that someone is Clearly giving the Shalka Doctor orders I am going to suggest he is a Division Doctor. Sure the Tardis is a police box but so is the Fugitive Doctor's and sure you have the robot-master but I am sure timey-wimey shenanigans can explain that.

Damn you guys are working over time on me 😂

I know he is there because of Shalka but I think it could be interesting if Richard E Grant's face has something to do with the great intelligence jumping into the doctor's time stream. It would be cool if Richard E Grant came back to play the Valyard (or just the great intelligence again.)

Theory: The sound in the trailer for “The Legend of Ruby Sunday” where Mel says, “Doctor, there’s something wrong” and Kate says, “Whatever it is, here it comes…” is the same sound the TARDIS made when the Doctor plugs the transport device in and Rogue asks what that was, to which the Doctor replies, “Nothing… indigestion. She gets upset by bounty hunters….”. So, perhaps S TRIAD Technology really is derived from TARDIS technology… and the TARDIS is none too happy about it.

The numbering surely begins in 'The Three Doctors'. Pretty sure the Chancellor or President or whoever it is starts talking about them like that. It never used to be such a thing because there were fewer of them. And the past was pretty much done and dusted, rather than constantly available.

I think the reason why we feel all of this is too fast and we missed a lot with the characters is because a Season is only 8 episodes. We just got episode 6 which wouldn't even be half of the previous runs at total 13 episodes each season

I cannot wait for the response from Nerdrotic and other unpleasant sites like that. They must have had an aneurysm and must be very angry. Two men kissing - how shocking! I thought it was a very good episode and Ncutie is just brilliant. (Fan from 1963) Great video as ever and welcome back Ellie.

I only managed to get round to watching the episode today and I was blown away! They captured so much of what reminded me of a ‘classic episode’ (I told me friend it took me back to the Tennant era). This episode played with my emotions in the best way and I really hope Rogue returns in season 2 (based on his last line, I’m going to assume this to be the case). Definitely my number one episode so far.

this is unsourced, i saw it on reddit, but reportedly, richard e. grant's inclusion was an easter egg put there by the vfx artists and the specific artist who signed off on it hadn't even heard of scream of the shalka, that's the very handsome doctor from curse of fatal death

Richard Grant is also the Great Intelligence, who jumped into the Doctors timeline. Maybe he wasn't the ninth but that got rewritten after Name of the Doctor? Or maybe he was the ninth doctor but of a different cycle as granted in the Time of the Doctor or from the Timeless Child?

There's been several In-Universe references to the Numbers of The Doctor. Both subtle and not to subtle. There's a mention in Journey's End, as other comments have pointed out, “Number ten once regenerated and kept the same face. I had vanity issues at the time.” There's "All 13" in the 50th Anniversary special (Slight reach there, though). There's the cheeky nod Clara gives in The Bells of St. John, where we see Artie reading a book. "Summer Falls," by Amelia Williams (which we know is an Amy Pond reference). He tells her he's on chapter 10 (meaning, the 10th doctors story). She says that "eleven is the best... you'll cry your eyes out." A clear reference to the 11th Doctor, and.. well, everything he went through before meeting Clara... which results in that book existing.

I need Joanna Lumley cameo as a past doctor so much.

I don't know if any one has mentioned this before but the music playing whilst the Doctor and Rogue dance is by the legendary Grace Jones. It's called "I've seen that face before".

@ 13:00. Capaldi actually announces the numbers total. (Known) by adding himself to the group.

Couldn't Susan twist just be an older Clara since she is suppose to be in the lives of every doctor saving them across all of time and space thousands of echos of her

What makes the Richard E. Grant inclusion even more confusing is that - don’t forget - he ALSO played Dr. Simeon/The Great Intelligence in The Snowmen! Speaking of multiversal confusion… that would mean the Doctor regenerated into the face of someone he wouldn’t even meet for another three regenerations and then wouldn’t recognize when he did. Doctor Who is wild - I love it.

The timelords also referred to the doctor in number before Peter Capaldi became the official daughter. There was a scene with him when they talked about all 13 - tardis - so basically we are trying to recon what is happening in this series.

No that's not correct some Doctors have referred to themselves as number. Here are the quotes 1. The First Doctor: As it happens I am the Doctor. The original you might say (The Five Doctors) 2. The Seventh Doctor: It doesn't bode well for my seventh persona (Time and the Rani) 3. The Eighth Doctor: (narrating) In all my travels through space and time nearing the end of my seventh life referring to the dying Seventh Doctor (The TV Movie) 4. The Fifth Doctor: I have 13 lives I already had four times (Mawdryn Undead) 5. A Timelord reference to the Doctor's and 2nd and 3rd (The Three Doctors) 6. The Eleventh Doctor referring to himself as "Eleven" (The Lodger) 7. The Doctor referring to the Tenth Doctor ad number ten: Well number 10 once regenerated twice I had vanity issues at the time. 8. In one of the Big Finish audio dramas the Doctor told Susan he was in his Eighth incarnation. Steven Moffat who is one of my least favourite showrunners has really screwed up the numbers since the War Doctor was created which I still think to this day retconning in a Doctor was a very stupid and most convoluted things to do and I wish they would erase the War and Fugitive Doctors out of existence. The Timeless Child is a lie by the Master end of story.

They referred to numbers of regenerations in Trial of a Time Lord when revealing who the Valeyard is - an amalgamation of the Doctor's darker sides from between his twelfth and final incarnations

The American actor that literally played King George in Hamilton. 😂 Also, love the Doctor and Rose. Expanded the audience. Their relationship and chemistry were real and I don’t think I’m alone on that.

After watching this episode I went back and watched Human Nature/The Family Of blood. There are some incredibly interesting comparrisons to be made, I will let you find them for yourself, but it almost feels like to make Rouge they (at least in part) took elements from Family Of blood (Doctor becoming human via a magic watch excluded) and repurposed them.

Lmao Ellie still messed up and said "Tardis HQ". Too excited!

Richard Grant showing up is just another point towards the theory that this is all a TV-show metaverse thing.

Ellie, yay welcome back. Missed you. Hope you enjoyed a fantastic holiday Rogue. So so good. I lost my mind hearing "Can't get you out of my head" & "Poker Face" I'm wondering, maybe there is more to this bi-regeneration that there seems to be. Maybe we might revisit some old friends?

Welcome back Ellie! I hope you enjoyed your holiday while we missed you.

I’ll just say that, when The Doctor and Craig bump heads, Smith circles his face and says “11”

The Doctor ‘bumps heads with Craig’ circles face “Eleven” 😅😅

Welcome back, Ellie, hope you had an amazing birthday break. I just watched the making of this episode, and when they talk of the interior or of Rogue's ship, they talk about the, 'Assarian' (spelling via the subtitles) ship ! Personally, I get the strange feeling that given that Rogue could actually be a different incarnation of The Doctor. My basis for this theory are : they instantly understand each other's 'traveler saving the universe' lifestyle, the hexagonal control section of a time traveling ship that can disguise itself. It would actually be very on-brand for RTD that the one person The Doctor relates to and falls for is actually another incarnation of himself ! Anyone else think that could be the case ? :)

Richard Hurndell's Doctor in the Five Doctors asks Peter Davison which regeneration he's on, and Davison's Doctor responds with 'fourth.'

I love you guys. Not just the obvious two faces. ALL OF YOU. I would love to see a video in your voices about how many people The Doctor has killed, and why.

The Great Intelligence branched off a new regeneration after the War Doctor to an alternative 9th incarnation. Both played by Richard E Grant

Something I noticed about Rouge is he's sent to another dimension and told The Doctor to find (and there for is waiting for The Doctor) What if he's like River getting referenced/meeting The Doctor out of order, and he's actually the big bad, The One Who Waits... an interdimensional being out for The Doctor. And that plot point will be the focus of season 2

I would have loved to see the tension between the Doctor and Rogue played out over more than one episode. It moved so fast!

I May believe a connection could be with The Five Doctors, Triangle is a symbol of the Dark Tower, death zone, during the time when Timelords abuse the powers to be God, This has also shown The Master relieve of his Regenerations by the Time Council which can explain Doctor Many Faces, Rassilon was forced back in time by the 10th Doctor, Susan, Doctors Grand daughter had a bad ending as Doctor felt that Susan was Grown up and closed the tardis door locked leaving Susan behind, Susan Surname was the same name as the old Scrap yard name, so we don't know the real name, Susan did got called to fight the Time War against the Doctor Orders, Twist or Mrs Flood could be Leela as she was rescued by the Fourth Doctor before the Daleks taken control

Loved listening to Ellie stumble over her words. She didn't even notice "The TARDIS lands in TARDIS HQ" FYI I'm calling it a TARDISh from now on. Time And Relative Dimension in Shpace

Re: Rogue. Loved it, tbh. Big improvement over dot and bubble. Re: panic about gay Doctor, kissing another man. On BBC. I think the new management are trying to change the Doctor into a more normal guy: lonely, looking for more than hanging around with dotty friends he has to babysit. He's growing up! Call it "About a Time Traveler" but without the good luck to cast Hugh Grant. For 60 years we assumed he was a sex-less humanish alien who took an interest in travelling with his pet humans. Think of him as a British school instructor without the home life because fate seems to have condemned him to be on never-ending school outings. He doesn't sleep apparently, or have a dining area, or any hobbies. Or a library or a bathroom. To say he is a bit thin in representation at this point is an understatement. This is a fairly limited palette to work with -- barely above a travel show, certainly not Harry Potter level. But they made it into an adventure show thanks to campy villains and the occasional thoughtful moment -- pretty impressive. Throw in the regeneration gimmick -- absolute genius if you want to replace your star when it is convenient -- and you have the makings of a sustainable, albeit gimmicky show. Would Who have done as well over the years if he fell in love and showed it more explicitly? I don't know. But we are about to find out. It's worth remembering that the Doctor did have River Song in his life. It's just that it wasn't presented very explicitly. A "sort of wife" is how Davies referred to her, or was it Moffat who said this, can't remember -- but certainly not like any wife I've ever had (I was lucky enough to have had 2, both pretty impressive -- not the stuff of vague memories I can tell you.) And of course the River relationship was heterosexual, so not controversial to many. I think homophobia and change in the show in general are the issue here for some of the traditional viewers of the show. And I think the BBC/and now Disney? are having a hard time figuring out whether Who is supposed to be for children. If BBC wants the show to remain British and be as sustainable as it has been, it will have to think about some of these issues. Regardless, I'm a long-time fan -- a man in my late 60s -- and not wilting in the face of a gay Doctor who happens to be able to look okay dancing. And who seems able to appreciate another man looking good in a jacket. It's kind of fun, actually.

I keep hearing the best friend comment. context is important and I rewatched. He tells Rogue she is his best friend, as to his questioning about the female companion he is with. If you are a female and a guy asked about the girl you were with or a guy who had a girl ask about the girl he was with.... If you wanted to be clear you were single... He 100% loves and cherishes Ruby, don't get me wrong but this is a "you don't have to worry about that person being a love interest" context. It's all part of the chemistry.

Grant in Shalka is canon, where is our android Master?