Donut Media VS. Subaru 

This was a tough one to do, mostly because I don't want people to think that I prefer one side over the other BUT I don't think Donut's initial experience with Subaru's is that....out of this world. After all, how often do we see marketplace ads with Subaru's mentioning rebuilds or ringlands? At the same time, Donut Media maybe had duplicated issues because they didn't have the experience required to build these cars. But at the end of the day, they're just Subaru's. Right? it shouldn't be that difficult, or is that exactly the problem? It IS difficult to work on them..Would love to hear your thoughts below on this and hope you have an incredible day! ✅ Subscribe here - bit.ly/3kXgWr0 🔥MartiniWorks DISCORD BB - bit.ly/3XhEV5z 😊$39 Heavyweight Hoodie - bit.ly/3XcECIU

I think one thing we have to remember is that the Donut guys never claim to be experts on everything. Some are certified mechanics, and James is literally a comedian. That's part of the charm, they're kinda just normal guys, like most of us are.

I liked donuts hi lo series on the Subaru because it shows all of what can go wrong with modding cars and how frustrating it can be

As a non-car enthusiast (average guy) but also likes nice cars, Donut Media got me back into cars after years of forgetting the scene existed.

I think the main appeal of Donut media is that they are relatable to most audience. I can relate more with people who tried to modify a car but break it instead, rather than a group of car experts who know everything in advance and make very few mistakes. Try out and find out, that is fun part of their project series. That being said, if a machine requires you to be super knowledgeable and make very few mistakes, is it a good machine?

Hit the nail on the head with the rotary comparison. Most down to earth subaru owners will admit that the platform is finicky, AND the stock form is underbuilt as hell for its "desired" applications. Much respect for those willing to thread the subaru needle, but Hi/Lo works on a simple premise (normal enthusiast building street-able HPDE cars).

I wonder how much research Donut did before they jumped into this platform. I think they should have done Civics for time attack cars. Not cause Subarus are bad, but because they demand more attention and care than most platforms.

I had the same exact takeaway from the Donut series. Still think they are a great platform, but for being the type of car they are marketed as you shouldn’t have to be a Subaru expert just to enjoy the car at a track.

Being in the Subaru community for 10 years now you absolutely nailed it. They are extremely temperamental and are much less forgiving. But they are lots of fun when done right.

I honestly think donut just showed a perfect example of how a new owner to a subie feels. I'm sure donut put research and clearly time into their builds but ultimately didn't know as much as the subaru community. I don't own a subie bc of how finicky they are, love the cars but I can't justify the time investment of picking up someone else's rebuild

As a new to the platform subaru guy, I have to say, a big reason I even felt confident enough to get into the scene is because one of my best friends is already a Subaru certified tech. If I didn’t have him all the work we’ve done on my car and a lot of the things I’ve had to fix would have been so much more daunting and frustrating. So my advice to anyone wanting to work on WRX’s or STI’s is to have a friend who someone in your town who knows the platform well and is willing to help you learn.

I personally think you hit the head on the nail with this response they don’t take more knowledge to be done right and aren’t the easiest to work on but they are definitely still great cars I have heard plenty of nightmare stories and as well as it’s the best car ever stories and the differences between the two people is the amount of time they have put into finding out how to properly take care of them

This video is fantastic! Having gone from an Impreza to an SRT-4 to a FiST, I’ve learned that every car platform needs needs 3 different thing from you as the owner. Patience, a willingness to learn, and enthusiasm. If you skip any of these things, you’re in for a bad time.

I don’t consider the money spent “wasted”, I found it highly entertaining throughout, ESPECIALLY when “Subaru things” kept popping up and throwing a spanner in the works

I think it should show as a warning. This can and will happen, and sometimes it unavoidable with this specific platform. Just means its not the best platform for beginners who want to hop in, and rat out. Just goes to show this can happen to anyone. Great video Alex!

I don’t get how so many people missed that they said they had baffled oil pans the whole time. It was later in the series that they noted it, but they said they had them on the whole time because they knew!!!!!

It's indeed like rotaries. But I think the difference is that rotary guys know it's not always an ideal platform but they accept it and it actually makes them more motivated. While I feel a lot of subbie guys don't like when their car is seen as bad. Kinda like that meme with the guy crying but with a mask over it vs the blonde Chad guy that just accepts it.

This nails it really well, especially on comparison to the B5 S4 and the RX7. All VERY touchy and finnicky cars- if you know what you're doing in respect to the platform, you're golden. But if you expect it to be easy, or expect to be able to treat it like literally anything else on the road, it'll bite back.

tbh if your experts shared so much information it would have been nice to have a technical section where we get some of that expert info relayed to us.

As a professinal mechanic, you did an excellent sum up of my feeling towards subaru. My experience has been almost exactly what you said. In a stock configuration, yhey are great, reliae and capable cars. As soon as you start trying to add power, the cost of quality parts and the tolerance curve for how you install things, goes waaaay up. If you cheap out on one part, i.e. trying to re-use head bolts, no name turbo, disciunt autopart sensors, etc, you will end up rebuilding the motor again.

Alex, you nailed this. You did a fantastic job being objective here, which is something that very few other people can claim. Great job!

The biggest thing i got out of the situation is like you said " subarus are harder to work on" and as long as you keep it stock and dont "abuse" the car you will be fine. If you are going to track it in any way. You better do all the supporting mods!

Basically argument of the Subaru community: "Donut doesn't know what they're doing because they didn't know all the special little bits of information about how this car breaks if you put parts on it"

As someone who loves subaru and doughnut, this video was extremely well worded. Side note, hope to bring my mk8 golf r to some meets this year, I live in Sheboygan.

I was done with Subaru when our 2009 Legacy blew up trying to get up to highway speeds one day. We did the headgasket job the year prior, had no warning lights and no other indicators that would tell us that what was coming. Of course, we just lost our dog a month before that so needless to say, we didn't have the money to fix it and ended up buying a 2008 VW Rabbit. Even with all that car's problems, we love that thing and it hasn't tried to kill itself yet.

Great video, Alex. I think you nailed it. It’s a nuanced situation. They’re plenty experienced, just not with that platform. The Low Z is a perfectly functioning V8 swap with no issue, and both money pit cars work just fine.. they just didn’t know the extra info needed for the EJs. Great job buddy, keep it up!

I'm on my 2nd subaru. My first was a 2017 CVT Impreza, and it was amazing. Never let me down and I made it up to 211,000km on it with it only ever needing a wheel bearing. Parted ways with that beauty and hopped on into a 2016 WRX. It's an absolute blast, and with only 87,000km on it I look forward to the (hopefully) many more kilometers to come

They’re temperamental cars. I’m running equal headers, Cobb 20g turbo and cooling mods. Have to watch engine temps, oil and accessport readings before getting on it. Demands a lot of attention and you have to have everything in order such as quality parts and fueling. Can’t skip out on anything.

I’ve spent some time with the donut team and they are not incompetent by any means.Subarus boxer platform is sensitive and requires a bit more work. I believe the series donut produced exposed those weak points that an average enthusiast may see first hand.

Extremely informative, and as a Subaru owner, I agree with everything said here and even learned a lot! I purchased mine with it already having some stuff built on and I can definitely second that it’s an extremely finicky car to work with. Stock doesn’t have enough, modded, it becomes a much more complicated process when maintaining it. I’ve always said this, although the platform is affordable (to buy the car), but I think they’re on the more expensive side of things in terms of modifying and keeping it drivable.

I have to agree with most of what you said. Any compent build is going to take a sizable amount of cash & patience...and let's be honest. Most enthusiasts can be short on both. Stock Subies are cool cars, beyond stock tho I feel it gets sketch If you're not fully vested long haul

In their defense no one that buys a Subaru knows how to take care of it

The global community just needs to see older Subarus like they do with the rotary and it would be fine. Imagine If there was a video response for every rx8 that blew up in a RU-vidrs video.

Thank you for being a level head in the community. Instead of being super bias or naive and assume you know everything and anything when it comes to any car and thinking that unless people think like you they’re wrong. I get so freakin tired of people being so close minded to things they think they understand but just don’t. The smartest people are always the ones who shut up, acknowledge they don’t know everything, and just listen.

From my perspective, just as a car enthusiast, former Subaru owner, and former mechanic/dealership trade in manager, donut kinda should’ve known better. Subarus are known to be extremely fickle beasts so I wasn’t surprised at all that they went through so many engines. I’ve experienced the purest joy of Subaru ownership (a blown engine while basically stock) myself and said never again will I invest in this platform. It’s kinda like how I love rotaries but understand I’m going to have to do a rebuild every so often if I ever get an FD. The subie community also shouldn’t hate on donut for showcasing what reality is like for ~20 years of ej owners lol

Perfect take with nuance. The rotary comparison is spot on

I’m really loving your investigative journalism in the car community. I really hope you keep finding stories to dig into.

Collector Car Feed said it best in their Hard Truth WRX video: Subaru's are special needs cars.

i love this video i feel like everyone needs to watch this. a lot of key point but mainly is that these engines are very particular, as you said the most smallest of things can cause a complete melt down of these cars they are very persist on how they run if one thing is in the slightest bit off the engine will hate it , as you said they have a very low point of hitting the mark an if you don't understand the engine your gonna miss that mark if you build them correctly they will run like a dream.

Well Done! Very objectively covered and presented. I enjoyed that and learned a bit as well... Thank you. 👍😊

As someone who owns a VA WRX, and a N/A 2002 Forester, I still think they're both good platforms, but taking good care of them and reading more information about them is key to make your EJ/FA Subaru reliable.

Looking at the scrap pile at the local Subaru tuning shop, I would say the EJ has its fair share of issues 🤣

Very well said, this is my first time watching ur stuff and u got me subscribing! I loved this perspective and I agree with you

😂 I own a b5 s4 and what you said about it is 100% accurate… I’ve been building cars since I was 16 and this is my favourite/most hate car I’ve owned. Like you said when it’s working it’s the best car… when it’s not I am crying (most of the time)

As a WRX owner I agree, they are more temperamental but still a great car. I also agree with what some others have said, want to have a great, reliable experience with a WRX? Leave is stock or just do some aesthetics. Getting into the powertrain requires a lot of knowledge and being prepared for things to be harder.

Great video that takes a step back to look at the real issue. As someone whose building their first EJ on their channel right now, I can totally relate to needing to do a lot more research to make sure you're "doing things right". When in doubt I often just get OEM parts or well known and proven aftermarket. Very informative video! 👍

Sweet mention for Flatirons Tuning at 3:48! Thanks Alex 🤘🏻

Your conclusion seems pretty accurate, I spent a year or two volunteering at a monthly open track day at our local road course. The unfortunate reality is that I've seen a disproportionate amount of Subarus leave on the back of tow trucks compared to almost any other platform. It's really unfortunate, I hate to see it because I know those drivers put a lot of prep time in just to get bit anyway.

I think it's a little ridiculous that a car marketed as a "performance" car can't be driven as such without modifications to keep it from blowing up. I loved my bugeye WRX. I got it in a trade for my 8th gen Si that I was definitely not a fan of. The WRX was fun to drive, made decent power, handled really well and looked awesome on coilovers with wide black RPF1s...but I always felt like I was on borrowed time. I knew that if it blew up, it would cost a fortune to get an engine done right. ThatDudeinBlue had an excellent video on what it really takes to have an EJ rebuilt correctly for longevity and power. Seeing that, I can see that probably 95% of people won't do what it really takes.. either because of cost or the effort involved. I knew that if mine blew up, I didn't want to half ass it and I couldn't afford it to be done 100% right...and I would lose my butt on the car having a shell I couldn't sell or an endless project. I made an effort to sell the car while it was in tip top running condition with all the awesome parts I installed and cash out ASAP.

Excellent take and episode HiLow Season 3 is a cautionary tale that not all build will go as expected and to research your ish.

After watching my dad work on his '92 Talon it became apparent that every time you make a change it affects the way everything else works and something always inevitably breaks. This is the "fun" of custom jobs. :b

Pretty solid and balanced take! From the beginning of their series with the WRX's I was worried about them running into problems because of how finicky WRXs are with mods, and wasn't surprised that they did end up running into problems. It's still unfortunate though, I wish EJ's were less fickle than they are. Here's hoping their next HiLo does something with an EA888, as those engines take VERY kindly to boost. The obvious choice would be a Mk7 GTI, but a B8.5 A4 would probably be more entertaining (especially given their higher ceilings from Quattro & the ZF-8HP).

This should help keep prices down

Quality,unbiased and educational are just some of the good things to say about this video

Me and my 5 Subarus with only 1 getting a new engine after 220k miles thanks you. Great video.

8:35 That awesome moments when a crewmember his ride makes it into a video 😭🔥

Great video! Your becoming the go to channel on anything cars for me

I'd say this is spot on 🔥 Killed it my man 🫡

You hit the nail on the head, Once I saw a clutch replacement on a Subaru, I noted out of thier AWD system as a whole. Never mind the insane amount of bolts holding the timing cover on and an engine pull being required to do a lot of major maintenance that most makes just don't require short of a rebuild.

I ended up on the Audi platform, knowing full well it can be expensive. Doing your research and having a fundamental understanding of what problems can affect each production run is key to keeping your money in your wallet.

I like Subaru's from a distance. Hell, I'm still looking for a nice quality Manual Forester because of your videos mentioning them. I was looking at them for my first car even! I just feel in this age, making one mistake (buying the wrong car) is very frustrating because it feels like too much of a set back. Which is why people want to get it so right the first time. I don't think a Subi is a "get it right the first time" car. If you do, you're lucky. I will give them props where it's due, I don't think there is a better sounding 4cyl out there. And, not EVERY car can/will be amazing. Some have to be a learning experience. Love your stuff Alex

I was sitting in thinking while watching this video, Alex, you should make a video about deeper ways to get into platforms more than just service level knowledge

I have a 17 STi and you are 100% correct. I bought the car because I always wanted one as a kid, but coming from my other project, an AW11 MR2, it is pretty crazy how temperamental the Subaru is after researching EJ modding requirements for a few years. I found Tanner's channel (smeedia) back in 2019 or so, and he was a huge help, but what I want out of the car performance-wise is going to end up costing as much as buying the car again, and I am not really sure that's something I want to go through with when I can just purchase a different platform that I can push some and tinker on without having to worry about replacing a block if something catastrophic happens. I love the car, and plan on keeping it a while longer, but right now it is just a way to have a down payment on something else. I don't mind spending the money to upgrade the car, but I don't want to end up dropping $15-20k in power mods just to have to do it again if I make a mistake or miss something.

That's a great perspective. Really makes you think about buying a project car. I remember how scared I was when I bought an RX7. You don't know what you don't know

One of the only people in the car industry to hit the nail on the head with this one.

I am the 3rd owner of a fully built 15 sti. It was scary at first but I did the research, had it PROFESIONALLY looked at by a shop that I trust and even got the build list and contacted the previous owner. I LOVE IT. Not even a Subaru guy, just a car guy with a subaru. And honestly, I think they're great cars and LOVED donut media series on it. They really don't deserve the hate.

Deep knowledge on a platform is relatable like people who think the 4.6 2v in a Crown Vic s a pointless motor but if you know the platform it's a beast to drive

Alex, excellent piece. Really enjoyed the deep dive explanation. But I am curious, why no mention of arguably Subaru's greatest rival in this class. The Mitsubishi Evo?

I wanted a WRX for my first projects and decided to get a Civic SI instead because I new they’d be easier for a novice to own. I’ll still own a WRX or STI though. They seem like really fun platforms.

A base wrx is honestly more comparable to an Audi A4 than a S4. I don't get why people think that a wrx is anywhere comparable to an STI in terms of being a performance car. The Wrx is what the Civic SI is to the Type R, it's just a souped up Impreza not a bargain race car.

My friends had 3 STI’s throughout the years. 2 were boosted slightly above stock with bolt ons and both motors blew fast. 3rd one was new stock from a dealer and has been fine for 2 years

Man I really appreciate this video. The fact that I was watching it after having seen MrSubarus vid I felt this had good perspective. The comparison to the rx7 is fantastic... But also kinda sad. The lack of r&d money into Subaru engines over the years really alienates the community as a cult. Only the new WRX seems to accept more power as willingly as other brands have for years.

Bro, lemme fix your hair real quick -Alex’s Cat

Ayy! smeedia the goat, donut should have had him build the engine or at least consult him. I own a wrx and have had a wonderful experience both driving and working on it but not everyone is as lucky or as tedious as me. And you hit the nail on the head with this video. Its a finicky platform, but in turn it is a very rewarding platform.

Hey thanks for the love! ❤ From the Flatirons Syndicate folks 3:49

Nowadays when there shenanigans in the car world I wait for Alex to make a vid

You listened, and we as a car community appreciate that, thank you! All I have to say!

My thoughts exactly. Got a gdb last year knowing very little about cars and I’ve learned a lot but it’s constantly giving me issues. 8 previous owners

Amazing video I think you hit all the marks with this one. loved it

Good video. I cannot understand the love for such a flawed engine package, when there are so many better alternatives. At least with the rotary you are getting something unique. Sure it's a boxer, but they look like an absolute nightmare to work on compared to an average I4

Agreed Alex, great synopsis. I bought a 2003 SRX that had been converted to STI with the 2004 engine and trans. I loved that car, loved the way it looked, loved the way it sounded, loved the attention it garnered, until it broke...twice. I blew the first motor at streets of willow, oil pump failed. Spent 10k having a local LA subaru builder rebuild it, even had to install a new turbo after the original one failed on the dyno, not the cars fault (it turned out to be a cheap chinese knock off). Drove and tracked the car a few more years and then blew another motor. I never looked into why it failed as at that point I figured it was going to take 15K to get the car to where I wanted and I just didnt want to spend that much on that car. I sold if with the blown motor for $3500 and bought a 2013 Ford Focus ST. I have tracked this car at least as much as the Suby and have only had to replace the failed rear sway bar mounts. Subarus definitely take some special knowledge and just dont think they take power-adding parts unless you spend ALOT of money. JMHO.

I had an 04 WRX with the EJ205 and 5 speed manual for my first "performance" car. Reliability wise, it took 4 years of hard driving for something to finally break, 2nd gear on a hard launch. Sure, the clutch burned up, but then again doing a 180 in the snow and trying to clutch drop going back the other way will do that to an OEM clutch. Blown out suspension, I probably shouldn't have been jumping it. Out of all the vehicles I have owned, the WRX was the toughest damn car I've owned, any issues it had were my own damn fault.

I have a 900whp 730wtq 2020 Subaru STI and they are an excellent platform. You are also correct that it is not like building a 900hp LS or Coyote and they have really specific recipes to get good power and make sure its tuned correctly by someone who specializes in these cars. Hands down though, ripping 50psi of boost through a Precision 6870 on the street is enough to be terrifying and glorious all at once!!

This is the best video on this topic I've seen. Kudos to Alex. Subaru is basically not a 'lazy' platform. You cannot throw stuff into it and just expect it to work. It takes real thought and money to do it right.

Got to love honda's. Drop the car from the moon and it still runs.

I would really enjoy a longer video on this topic with some of the clips from the interviews! Also, as a fan of Donut and someone who drives a subaru. I think a lot of people talking about this topic fail to realize that it's just impossible to show every piece of everything done to a car in a series like hi-low. I don't know if they didn't do research, or did stuff wrong. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't. But, as you said, and I agree, subarus are just tempermental. It's just the way it is. I drive a VA wrx now with the FA20 which is likely one of the most forgiving engines you can get in a subaru and still I have done so much research and study on parts combinations, tuners to buy from, how and when to maintenence things, what supporting mods are necessary. The list goes on and on. I've been very lucky with mine and had no issues so far, and hopefully it stays that way but, I understand and agree that it can be a more intimidating and challenging platform than others someone could choose from.

I'm glad you mentioned rotaries because I was about to make the same comparison lol

Compliments on a well balanced view point. In my personal experience going from my first car being an 88 AWD Ford Tempo that had constant axle issues due to being to long, then a 92 Nissan Maxima that had the timing chain break throwing the piston fully into the spark plug busting the piston completely and leaving me stranded. A 93 S10 Blazer that I carried a spare cleaned EJR valve to switch out when the other got clogged, then a 02 Buick Regal and a 99 blazer both that suffered the good Ole GM dExcool lower intake manifold gasket issue to it's full extent. A 03 Neon that was simply bought due to it being cheap but only ever drove it 4 miles lol. Now to my current car being a 2002 Subaru Impreza Outback Sport which had 123,000 miles when i bought it 3 years ago that I've replaced all the drive train except the transmission and driveshaft, replaced all wheel bearings, front control arms, all the struts, valve pan gaskets, plugs, plug wires and multiple other varying things that needed replaced simplly due to the previous owners lack of preventive maintenance. At current day the OBS only has 142,000 miles and has slightly developed the head gasket leak but after doing all the repairs myself in my driveway I would gladly do it all again vs doing any of the repairs on my other past vehicles. The subaru platform just makes sense usually. Yeah the oil pan baffle issue is dumb and other random things that shouldve been no brainers to subaru are there but compared to the zero tolerance of my maxima, the obsurdly cheap and garbage designs found on my 2 blazers and buick and the utter irriatation of working on the dodge neon and it taking hours to replace a simple belt tension pully which might be the dumbest desing i've ever seen. That all being said i feel even if Donut didin't know what they were doing or know nothing about the platform they can all read. I watched the Hi/low episodes when they were being aired and i may only owned a subaru for 3 years but I read a lot and learn fast and feel they could've avoided many issues by doing the same but unlike them I haven't done any mods. I've simply replaced with mostly subaru oem parts and drove like a grandpa so maybe my fait would've been similar to theirs if I had modded and raced my 02 bugeye. \

This video is it. That's all I gotta say, spot on Alex. Coming from a Mini owner lol

Smeedia is the goat imo, glad you talked to him

I'm ready to produce more for you guys. Love you guys

Very good review Alex well done, I like the style of it and the info that was discussed

You're exactly correct. Whenever someone bags on me for subaru being my go to for cars, this is exactly what I bring up. Fantastic video as always man.

As an owner of a WRX and STI. You do need to get to know the platform. I always recommend to take your time and not rush the process. Mods like AOS, cylinder 4 cooling mod, and exhaust is the safe way to start.

I have a wrx sti and you nailed it. Great video

Wait, aren't you the guy that made videos for that company that sold aftermarket parts? I loved your videos. Oh, I read your about section. I guess you get this a lot. lol

that was perfect dude. the high low series did make me a little frustrated subarus are harder to build nothing more nothing less. there are a lot of little things when it come to subarus that need to be done and its a lot of little things that other platforms don't have , like hours and hours of research and stalking forum posts about how to get a tiny bit farther into a build or figuring out a problem. i remember having a problem with my maf sensor and my map sensor not being perfectly syncd together and it took me a month to figure out that's a stark comparison to my old focus where it took me maybe a week to figure out a problem and get it perfect again. similar with the rotary people they are a super cool cars and very hard to build but not to say they don't make power or they arent reliable just harder to build and I think that's why people love them. if ii wanted easy power I would buy an ls powered truck and slap a turbo on it done . but I don't and I never will I love subarus because I love to play with my car I love to change the way it feels I love to break it and understand why it broke and improve the car in that way.

Maybe if they vaped and read hentai they subaru gods wouldve come down and bless them with a reliable engine

This video really sums up subarus and the aftermarket community. As a 2002 wrx owner and technician I appreciate this video 🤙🤙🤙

I have an 02 bugeye with 130k and Im only adding up/down pipe exhaust and intake. Everything else is just maintenance. Even though I’m a dsm guy I still see the beauty in the bugeye and plan on keeping it.