Most "mature" shows are just political satire, so it makes sense why both of these stand out while still being "mature" and dealing with "mature" things. Hazbin Hotel is one end of the "mature cartoon" spectrum, being extremely immature to the point of exhaustion and nauseation. Just watching the characters go between being redrawn every frame to just being rotated around feels like a FlipaClip animation. On the other end of the "mature cartoon" spectrum is Dungeon Flippers, being extremely mature to the point of putting the viewer to sleep. Obviously that's hyperbolic, but there's a reason why there aren't a lot of shows about people selling houses. That's just a very "mature" job, and it's hard to make that -EXCITING for the audience.
I wonder if it was inspired by Hazbin, but taking notes on what NOT to do? I know it’s usually coincidental, but it’s something I thought of as a possibility
Dear god....I heart you just say how mature this very mature thing handles it's mature topic maturely...like can you get to the point already? How is Hazbin immature? How is Dungeon Flippers extremely mature? What makes something a mature job? Is a rehabilation center not a mature job?
The biggest difference between Charlie and Maulie is that in the latter's case, the people of Splendor seem to have faith in Maul's ability to sell dungeons and castles to those in need of one. Meanwhile, everyone in Hell outright mocks Charlie's desire to change sinners; mainly for the fact they believe that once you're dead and in Hell, there's no going back
It’s not just that everyone believes Hell is the end of the road. It’s also that Charlie’s method of expressing her ideas and trying to put them into practice is extremely childish. Canonically she’s 200-ish years old and using hand darwn pictures made of crayon to try and sell her ideas to people.
@@mando7346 Right That's also a factor at play on the whole thing...but would it be better if she were mean, ruthless and cruel like Alastor in her methods?
@@SilverScribe85 No. But she does need to change her method of expressing her ideas to people. Charlie doesn’t understand her audience nor does it feel like she’s all that aware of this fact. If she wants people to listen to her. Charlie needs to learn how to explain herself in a way that doesn’t look like a eight year old came up with it.
I dont think the show needs to push the two main protagonists more or to an overly dramatic extend not every show needs to be a world ending threat or their like Let them climb the ranks of their profession and in the end find the perfect home for the Dungon Master of this Universe. That would be nice. Wholesome and finally just not exhausting like every show seems to be these days. Its amazing when people have fun with these high stake storys and enjoy them. But for me, i just grown numb to them. I want simple fantastical storys, with simple fantastical solutions. A way for the protagonists to work and live throught their trauma and come out by the end a better person, without needing to save the world in the first place Thats the biggest flaw in my eyes for the over saturated market these days. everyone wants to make his hero the ultimate hero Frieren somehwat countered that narrtive, because yes. While she was instrumental in saveing the World with Himmel, the show just shows you that live goes on and in the end she is just an elf. with her own motives, desires, abilities, dreams, wishes and problems. And thats why it caught so many people its a fantastical story for simple men Doesnt need to be anything more than that
Well, im not against any world ending threat as long as it doesn't removes main point of show - dungeons (Unlike in hazbin hotel where the threat was getting all attention to itself, basically there's no hotel, only hazbin)
Looking back at it... damn, in comparison the Pilot still stands out, and even more considering I couldn't take ANYTHING seriously in the Prime Series.
There was a early version of the script that got out that showcased how neutered it got due to the runtime among other things. Shame. The original was a fair bit better. Hopefully it can recover from that stumble in the following seasons. Otherwise I think it's going to fall out of relevancy as more indie projects get support.
The Hazbin Hotel pilot was like the milk I left on the kitchen counter for days. Aged Poorly. If you want an ACTUAL good pilot check ouy the first episode of the Castle Series from Oscar Johansson.
Yeah, I see this as a strength of Hazbin- so much of her childish cluelessness comes from her being so untouchable. Her level of nepotism is literally ordained by God- that she is immune to culling because of her parentage. The problem is that the show doesn't take the time to highlight this fact in a meaningful way, but it would be basically... incorrect lorewise if it weren't this way.
I really wish someone in-universe had called out Charlie for her privilege and naiveté. She has this insane goal that she has no idea how to achieve and expects everyone else to agree and be on board even though she has absolutely no proof it works. She honestly seems more concerned with proving she's right than actually helping anyone. I don't think she even knows any of the Sinners' real names, apart from Alastor. Making her prideful and more concerned with being right could've been an interesting character flaw, but the show keeps validating her. Charlie is like the Hell equivalent of a "white savior". She's a privileged person acting on behalf of an underprivileged group, but she's more motivated by ego than altruism. She wants the satisfaction of helping people, but doesn't put in much effort to really get to know them.
I like the cooking chicken analogy to compare the pilots: Dungeon Flippers- a bit bland, needs a little more seasoning Hazbin Hotel- too much seasoning, can barely taste the chicken
In my opinion,I would say Dungeon Flippers has the most potential out of all them. While Hazbin Hotel does have some good scenes it mostly fails at what its trying to do with the characters,story,and possible message/inspiration(Adam is walking proof. He’s an opposing force that most people thought was completely justified in his actions and behavior due to Viziepop confirming that the main cast has killed people or worse and due to being cheated in twice). Hazbin Hotel also was very bad with its pacing in terms of episode release AND story taking 4 years to make an eight episode season(gravity falls did more with less time but to be fair it had more people so a better example is various newgrounds cartoons as they have the least amount of staff but release more frequently. Heck,BFDI does better than all the previous examples!) Meanwhile Dungeon Flippers has just started,seems to have a minuscule amount of staff,but a lot of effort. Unlike hazbin hotel,Dungeon Flippers puts an effort in the characters,making them likable but conflicting(meanwhile hazbin hotels characters are just jerks with double standards). The story seems like it’s gonna be built upon throughout the series as it’s only a pilot so I can’t say much on that. However,I have high hopes with the pacing as it seems to be trying to be one of those “cozy” shows but with a dash of character development and drama. So yeah,thanks for coming to my Ted talk.
I tho that’s why I like Dungeon Flippers. I love animation but “adult” animation is anything but mature. Hazbin wants to talk morality but it Vi doesn’t understand the philosophy of the “mythos” (I am Catholic) and she doesn’t have one to replace it since she seems to have a superficial understanding of what is good and evil, or in Christianity holy and the profane.
@@MrSophire It's a separate take on how the whole Heaven and Hell mythos works. I'm roman Catholic myself, and I can see what Viv's message is in the show. Just because its Heaven, doesn't mean its pure, and just because its Hell doesn't mean its profane. Like, Adam is just a major jerk who fits nicely into Hell, and then there's Charlie, who fits into Heaven. Not to mention the Excorcists, who are bloodthirsty, merciless, maniacs, with the exception of Vaggie, who actually shows mercy. The fact Adam and his Excorcists got into Heaven is beyond me. Then again, we see in Helluva Boss that Cherubs want to save a rich guy who's inventions helped others, but also who's wealth was built off of the hardship and suffering others. It would seem Heaven seems to just pick souls who's good deeds outweight their sins, and even then, Sera herself doesn't even know how souls are filtered between Heaven and Hell
You do realize that the creators of Gravity Falls are not indie creators? They're funded by Disney, arguably the richest company in the world. You're seriously comparing that to Viv's team? Not very fair, is it? They're also doing making two shows, not just one. I will admit that the pacing was problematic, but we have 3 more seasons. I'd rather wait and see if they improve before coming to a final conclusion.
@@Brother_O4TS that’s not excuse for story telling. As a different commenter once said “A true artists does their best with adversity.” And besides,hazbin hotel isn’t indie anymore as it’s own by prime. A million dollar company. Oops.
4:21 I mean it kinda makes sense, the show and the pilot seem to heavily hint that Charlie, quite literally decided to do this hotel thing on a whim, hence why hotel looked so run down before Alistor chipped in. I think the REAL question is why Vaggie didn't intervene, she seems like her manager and yet she had no issues with Charlie's hotel? And Charlie had NO money as a ROYALTY to give to Vaggie to renovate??? 😅 14:51 Fax
Now we just need to fusion both shows and we will get perfection. I mean, having a real state agent as the "adult in the room" keeping all the hotel character focus while also having jokes that real state agents have no moral values would be just perfect, at least for me that sounds perfectly balanced 😅 or on the other side, a client (like charlie) that wants a hotel to redem sinners and has so much specificafions that Dungeon Flippers had to construct the hotel from the ground
Thanks for the fantastic pilot recommendation! I hadn't heard of Dungeon Flippers before this video (yt algorithm sucks) but during it gave Dungeon Flippers a watch and fell in LOVE with the concept and characters. Can't wait to see what it becomes!
Thank you for this presentation of your examination! As a novice writer myself, who quickly became....rather obsessed with Hazbin Hotel (And Helluva Boss), I appreciate those who provide an educational experience, in highlighting what the writers did right, and what they could've done better, and what they shouldn't have done at all. I'll say I'm taking mental notes, for my own project.
I think it would be interesting if they played into Cleveland being a dragon. Dragons are known to be greedy. Maybe he does lie a bout a propertry to make a sale. Or what I think would be more intersting is Molly showing him all the money she's been collecting to fix the dungeon and Cleveland's draconic nature takes over and he just can't help himself and he steals it all
His mom owns the agency, if I understand the lore correctly. I'm not sure greed specifically is the draconic angle DF is going for, but I think draconic ambition is definitely an aspect of things, especially in how the Dungeon Flippers agency interacts with rivals and the rest of Splendore
Spoiler warning! I love Dungeon Flippers so much. At first I thought it was a game being adapted into a series. It is because of a mobile game with similar style. In the beginning to the middle, I watched it and thought it was pretty cool. Spoiler!!!! When the wizard disappeared my emotion just dropped. It was at that scene that I realised the potential of the show. It made me cry a bit, but damn it was worth it. The wizard also connected with me on a really deep level cause of my burn out back then. 9/9 would recommend! P.s: The magic that Molly posses is like the coolest thing!
Honestly after seeing _Dungeon Flippers’_ pilot, I’m honestly anticipating more because it’s so simple yet so complex and to me, the plot moves pretty smoothly and isn’t exactly riddled with too many b-plots and all the characters to me are pretty well introduced, and I’m already pretty excited about it possibly being a show and hopefully the show fleshes out its cast if it gets a chance
What I like about Dungeon Flippers is that there is no intellectual pretense behind it. The show just wants to be a fun and exciting ride for the viewers to enjoy.
DUNGEON FLIPPERS MENTIONED GRAHHHHHHHHH I LOVE THIS PILOT it genuinely had me hooked with its premise and characfers I can't wait to see more from this story
I don't understand that part about their goals, wants and needs not being clear. Charlie is a good person at heart. I don't see why she would need a clear reason as to why she wants to save her people. I mean as you said, she wants her father's approval, but it's not the sole reason that guides her. She has a good heart and she wants to do what she feels is right, that's it. She doesn't have a specific reason as to why she wants to try and do the right thing. That's just how she is. As for Maulie, it's her family's dungeon. Imagine if this house that has been synonymous with your family name for countless generations gets destroyed. Does it really need to be explained why someone in the family would want to rebuild it ? It's the heritage of their family, it's part of their history. It's important to them that their heritage stays alive. Once again here, there doesn't to be a specific explaination. She probably wants to do it because it's her family's heritage and heritage is something that matters to her. For both Charlie and Maulie, their reasoning isn't based on a specific want or need, but on their personalities, on who they are as people and on the way they see the world. Does that make sense ? I mean you do make very good and interesting points about how fleshing out why she wants to rebuild it could give her more depth too.
@@user-x7dc2pq7n Okay fair but this is their character introductions. They can let us know this is a part of their personalities and then expand upon why their personalities are this way later on in the season. For a pilot, knowing that this is how their personalities are but not why specifically is enough. At least I think. Not everything about these characters should be revealed in the pilot alone.
I think Roaming Trend's question is more why Real Estate as a profession for Maulie. I'm of the belief that it's a narrative juxtaposition of a large monster trying to buy and sell homes for other monsters and villains. That said, Maulie wanting to find perfect homes for people for their happiness much like herself is satisfying enough reason for me.
I think Dungeon Flippers did a fantastic job making the relationship between two people feel believable, I never believed that Charlie and Vaggie had a healthy relationship, it felt just so forced with Charlie constantly not listening to Vaggie and things just happening to work out. I think there was only a single moment that Charlie listened when she suggested they fight together to help them bond and that was it with it being mostly glanced over then back to Charlie being always right. It didn’t feel like a relationship it felt where one just the one talking and the other just listened. Overall a very toxic relationship. With Dungeon Flippers they don’t always agree with each other but they trust each others opinions and are willing to hear each other out and try different things. Even when they get angry at each other they still make up equally and are willing to put their ego aside. The funny thing is you would think the Hazbin Hotel duo that was in a romantic relationship would be more open with one another but it is in fact the business relationship in Dungeon Flippers that feels more real. I think if they can do better with the world building they will do a great job.
The 8 episode excuse is pretty flimsy for Hasbin Hotel. Most shows funded by Amazon only get 8 episodes per season and do fine. Hell, The Boys only has 8 episodes per season, but knows where it's going and travels at such a break neck pace to get there that it feels a lot longer. Where the characters are in episode 1 compared to episode 8 is always dramatically different. They have been on one heck of a journey and been changed by it, for better or worse (admittedly mostly worse). In Hazbin they barely seem to go anywhere at all, sniping at each other and having sing offs, until the plot comes politely knocking on their door. So many plot points smash through the same section of wall, the characters start joking about it. But being self-aware about not knowing how to get your characters to interact organically with the plot doesn't make it better. It also annoys me that things only ever work out for Charlie because she's a nepo baby. You think anyone in hell would give her time of day if she wasn't Lucifer's daughter? What does she bring to the table save for an optimistic dream she's literally drawn in crayon? I enjoy the idea of Hasbin and I like quite a few of the songs, but man, does Charlie and the pacing frustrate me no end.
I think one of the best things you can do with a pilot is leave story beats somewhat vague You don’t want to completely establish a character just yet , you kind of want people to infer I think sometimes you can tell how confident someone is with a project moving forward by how the pilot tells its story And whether or not, they believe that that story will ever move forward, I looked back to primal and realize that that entire story could’ve been a self-contained thing on its own Perhaps indicating that even the creators thought this might be the only episode we ever get to make Nowadays, you don’t even make a pilot unless you intend to make more So really it’s not so much a pilot as it is episode one or episode zero Essentially, there are two different types of pilots, and depending on which the characters motivations can either be completely established or very hinted at We have the pitch On the other hand, we have the episode zero
I do wonder what kinda work/life experience Hazbin writers have vs Dungeon Flippers. English is not my first language so my explanation may be a little wonky but here goes nothing - what I mean is that one cannot write a good work comedy if they've never been in a corporative setting. If I wanted to make an animated 'The Office' I'd seek out people who've worked in fast food, retail and a low level office job to write the scripts or at least give me good ideas. I suspect that is something Vivzie lacks - just being out and about in the world and gaining this everyday experience (and some traumas) that translate so well into comedy (real comedy not just endless swearing). I RARELY swear so my colleagues are genuinely shocked/laughing when I do.
My dude, your English is quite literally better than a lot of native english speakers I know, possibly even the majority. Perfect grammar too, I could only dream to write like that in my second language (for now).
I will be honest. As much as I dont like HH Dungeon Flippers felt way too boring to me. In premise, in designs, in worldbuilding. Maybe its all because I personally dont like classic dnd-like fantasy creatures. Imo this is overdone to death. But again. Subjective.
@@RoamingTrend They're more indie web shows, but "Avoid the Void" (by A Kind Remark) and "Dream Catchers" have been delightfully surreal. And heck, some other animation one shots are Tasteful Thickness's "A Blood Moon" and The Sixth Door's "Six Guys" if you feel like watching some stuff that's very RU-vid and way better than it has any right to be. Maaaaybe I dug deep enough for you to have not seen this stuff?
They have each their own style and mood. To me it’s just about how realistic you want your show to be. With dungeon flippers then the fantasy world could just be replaced with a different country, and or luxurious mansions instead of dungeons. It’s a very grounded story about people with normal jobs working. While Hazbin hotel is more like about the struggle of starting on your dream. She has no prior experience. She has no boss and no education in what she’s trying to do. She’s “fighting” against this big hill of making people believe in the concept. Her actually running the hotel as she intend would at minimum be in season two, probably three
The animation is at the next level, just like the dialog. Dont really understand the story yet so no comment on that but im still sure its good. Nobady invest so much in an animation with no story
5:12-5:20 That’s an unfair criticism. She slammed the door on his face because he is a duplicitous murderous sociopath who’s made it big by manipulating and tricking others with deals. She, rightfully so, has a crap ton of hesitancy about letting him in. You spent time criticizing her for being too naive earlier in the video but when she shows wise hesitation she’s also bad?
Holy crap I thought Dungeon Flippers was gonna be a cheap version of Hazbin but I WAS SO WRONG AND I LOVE THIS SO MUCH ABSOLUTELY GONNA TRANSFORM I TO A CLEVELAND GIRLIE
3:10 Not sure if I agree so far but I gotta compliment her VA for voice line delivery and voice itself, it just, feels unique, it's not squeky or bubbly but also not rough and mean, idk authentic is the word you can use to describe it? 😅
I'm going to be honest, as an amateur writer who's only recently started studying industry works, I use your videos as a general point of reference anytime I'm on the fence about something to weight out the possibilities, since you seem to be able to have a really logical and neutral view on these things.. great video, excited to see more
i'm interested in the concept of an indie animation with less smooth animation and more still images to save budget. although, if these are pilots i can understand why they would want to show something impressive. just lower the animation for simpler actions and give it to the highlights of the animation. anyway, this actually made me interested in dungeon flippers, i do like the character designs and the dragon character's attitude.
thank you for that examination of both shows (pilots), that was very educating! personally, i like both shows and i'm not a picker, so i say both are good. I just hope Dungeon Flippers pass the pilot stage and become a full lenght show or a small indie serie like Murder Drones or the Amazing Digital Circus
I just realized I grew up with Adventure Time and Regular Show while this newer generation has Hazbin Hotel and Skibidi Toilet as options Im not saying the 2000-10’s didn’t have brain rot but it was Uncle Grandpa, Xavier Renegade Angle, and Garry’s mod I feel like while I had Mostly good shows with some brain rot that was still good these kids have mostly shit shows with the occasional good show like smiling friends or inside job but like come on those aren’t exactly kids shows but come on who didn’t watch South Park or Aqua Team Hunger Force when they probably shouldn’t have but can’t they get something like Ninjago, Courage the Cowardly Dog, or hell Chowder? It just feels like with the move to more streaming oriented tv we lost the Saturday or afternoon cartoon for more “mature cartoons” that are actually more immature because “haha sex funny laugh why aren’t you laughing?” Even something more recent like Infinity Train or Hilda I think it’s called. I don’t know I could be completely wrong maybe I just don’t see more kid oriented cartoons because I’m older but it just feels like kids get RU-vid or “mature cartoons” and this comment made me realize Cartoon Network had so many good one shot cartoons like there was this one about two friends at a summer camp I think I remember really liking it but I can’t remember the name for the life of me.
There is still a lot of good cartoons for kids nowadays, though Fairly Oddparents: A New Wish, Bluey, Tales Of The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Pokemon, i didn't watch much of Lego Dreamzzz but i enjoyed what i saw, etc Its also super easy to watch older shows nowadays, which means kids can watch shows previous generations watched, like for example, Sonic X, Danny Phantom, any of the previous tmnt and power rangers shows, batman the animated series, ben 10 etc Brainrot is still the minority when it comes to kids content nowadays, its just more noticeable because everyone wont shut up about it
@@SodaFrizz666 for the simple reason that it didn’t try to be mature it knew what it was and it was hilarious the hell sandwich and the one where Shake gets plastic surgery probably have to be my favorite episodes
The sad part is that Hasbin Hotel is not even suposed to be for children and Viv said that before, yet children are still a large component of her fanbase, which makes sense since her series is imature as the ones for children, but has components that are not for children like the action being held in literal HELL. It's sad cuz they think they're mature for watching it, yet there're a lot of amazing "kid's" shows that can be enjoyed by any age, that tell good stories and messages and children chose/ have to grow up with Hasbin hotel.
@@mayor_theo the only one to blame there is the parents, not the kids or viv. The only reason kids know about stuff like hazbin or helluva boss is because they have zero supervised internet access. It's like complaining that a Saw movie traumatized your kid, and blaming the people who made the movie, despite there being like a million warning signs telling you that it wasn't for kids.
@@AshyFeller Lol. They didnt selled that to me... not for laking a ton of stereotypes of TV couples, no plis. Just, I also fell that sort of suport. Or maybe more of a sisterhood on the intimacy and chivralry and loyalty on their goal. Now vouples can have that too, just on them considering how they potray other characters having crushes it's almost invisible.
Our culture is so abjectly horrified by the concept of emotional incest that people get flack for mere observations of unhealthy dynemics. I daresay it seems more taboo than actual incest, when we have political figures defending first cousin marriage. (America is not a serious country, its 50 entities and unwilling stragglers in a trench coat) But its absolutely correct to describe Vaggie and Charlie's relationship as weirdly motherly, especially *when the show itself* does so by giving her a duet with Carmine, with them singing about protecting their girlfriend and actual children, respectively. I mean, come on.
@@Bird-wz7nx I guess I didn't communicate my full thoughts. Yes, the relationship is weird. I didn't think of it that hard before. America is a joke. (Trust me, I know probably better than most people.)
One thing I think you could have mentioned is the sound design. It is a pretty blatant difference: Hazbin Hotel is full of sound effects and music to the point of being annoying while Dungeon Flippers are almost or even silent at multiple points. I really missed background music and would have loved a bit more sound effects. I also really liked your part about the intros. I didn't even realise how strong the intro was for the Hazbin Hotel pilot. Great video, eagerly waiting for the Lackadaisy video and hoping to maybe see something Murder Drones related from you :)
4:57 'We don't even see the hotel at work' That's because this isn't the point of the pilot. The point of the pilot is to establish the worldbuilding, introducting Charlie's hotel idea, showcasing why no one believes in her idea, and giving us the role of each hotel inhabitant. 6:05 'The more incompetent you make them, the more you have to bend the world to justify their success' I don't know what you mean with this because Charlie pretty much does not succeed in the pilot. The only real 'success' she has is getting the support of a guy who literally tells her he doesn't actually believe in her and only does it for his own personal amusement.
I know it's not the point of the video, but "we don't even see the hotel at work" is a complaint I do have about the actual show, like, post pilot. Much like with Helluva Boss, it feels like the initial concept takes a backseat to overlord/angel drama, and we end up seeing very little of how the hotel functions, much like HB stopped being about IMP and essentially became the "Fizz and Asmodeus show, featuring that red guy with the gun" (thankfully the shorts seem to be putting emphasis back on that aspect, at least).
i mean even in the show we didn’t see much of the hotel at work as far as we know it didn’t work cause the hotel doesn’t know serpentus idk his name sorry they don’t know hes in heaven now, honestly i think the pilot’s way better than the actual show, characters fall bland and the og storry has nothing to do to what we actually see, that’s my same problem with helluva which at this point it’s basically a telenovela
“That’s because it’s not the point of the pilot” then why on earth is it called Hazbin hotel and why does the official series make a big deal out of the hotel being destroyed
Someone pointed out in the comments of the pilot that Ace of Wands acts the way he dose is because he represents the negative aspects of the Tarot card he shares a name with. Maulie is shown to embody the positive aspects of that Trump. That could be a real interesting theme for a series, Hazbin has its Goetia, and Flippers could have its Trumps.
27:12 something that kind of annoys me personally is that there's elements in modern like actual TV animation that decide to go outside convention, but in all the wrong ways. At least if you ask me. I swear OK. K.O. just thinking its fine if they go horribly off model for entire shots for *no reason* is just annoying.
The way you say it implies that Charlie not knowing what she's doing is a bad thing, but I disagree. It's part of her character. In the show itself, we see that she has no idea how to help the people of Hell, instead doing silly trust exercises and stuff like that. Considering the way it's presented, I'm sure the show will adress this flaw in Charlie's mindset, and will eventually make her grow as a person. The show has a lot of flaws, but Charlie's writing is good if you ask me.
She at least needs to have the qualities that make her success possible. She is too naive for the job she's taking. I think the amazon show made her a bit less childish, but as a viewer, you can only side against Charlie because she has no tangible plan or the mentality for this task. So, any success will appear contrived.
@@RoamingTrend I'm not sure... She can succeed because she's supported by people who know what they're doing, like Alastor. Before he came around, the hotel was failing hard. Because, as you said, she doesn't have the right mentality for this. But she's not doing this alone anymore, and I'm sure that with the right environment and people, she will eventually learn from her flaws. It's not like the writers ignore this aspect of her as if it's not part of a character (which is what a bad writer would do). As I said, it's clear that she has no idea what she's doing, with her trust exercises and everything, so the writers do acknowledge her flaws, and I'm sure they'll clearly adress it eventually. Episode 4 did that a bit already. But I don't think she's truly incompetent. Her approach is flawed, but her good heart did manage to get through to Sir Pentious in episode 2, meaning she can help people get better. She just needs more experience to learn how to do so properly and consistently. It's fine and I'd even say it's good for a character to not be their best self from the start and to need to slowly get there throughout the show.
I'm thinking it's mostly a thing of to her knowledge there's no solid ways that work, pentious was selfless and redeemed but still she doesn't even know he reached heaven. For her it would be trial and error without even knowing if the things that did work actually worked since she can't go up to heaven
its rare to see the word "Anti" used correctly for these type of videos (instead of just "this color is good while that color is bad" its "why this blue is an anti of red") especially the way youtube nowdays only pick up videos to the algorithm if it had potential to cause outrages, hence the existence of clickbaits... overall this is a good analysis, a really good note-taking video. subscribed!
6:45 Its kind of wacky, because are they *her* people? She was born in hell, born to Satan. If anything the humans are in fact her underlings, possibly slaves, or just in general worth less than herself. At least, that would be logical for her perspective. I dont see any reason she should see humans as her equals, even her people. The problem with a lot of vivsiepop's writing is that the implications of things are never thought about, nothing is ever really thought about for more than a second. Its impulsive writing.
Its kinda more likely that she overthought it in this particular case? Charlie was originally just a sinner in the original version of the story arc. That being said, as a princess, there is quite a precedent of claiming a disparate population as "my people" in human history, so...
Charlie considers sinners to her people because her mother is a sinner. While she is disconnected from them, the sinners, Charlie still see herself on some level one of them.
@@Yipper64 cause she's hot? Idk, but there certainly is historical precedent. I mean two princes in English history renounced the crown to marry a commoner.
Looks like you just provoked the wrath of one of the most rabid fandoms on the internet. Hope you’re ready. (DISCLAIMER: I don’t hate all Hellaverse fans. I’ve met plenty that are reasonable. I’ve just noticed that others are some of the most sensitive and zealous fans of a show that I’ve ever seen.)
@@thenightwatchman1598 I hope one day you become emotionally secure enough to realize how silly it was to try to police people's interest like this. When that day comes, just know I forgive that version of you in advance. Pat on the back, have couple of beers, no hard feelings, my dude. Best of luck on your healing journey.
many consider the hazbin pilot better than the actual series, so I'll leave my final judgement until flippers is fully out, tho I do have more hope for it
Ace seems like he's designed to be reoccurring. The Dr. Draken or Ice King of the show except he's just a guy that they perpetually can't find a home for.
I was very exited for Dungeon Flippers. It seemed right up my alley. Fantasy comedy with a satirical nature. Fun! What i got was a bland, boring pilot, with boring characters, boring designs and... even the voice actors sounded bored. They sound so disinterrested in playing a character. It feels soulless.
Idk, Dungeon Flippers houses perhaps feel empty because the homes aren't appropriate for Ace. It isn't until we get to the Void were things get spiced up. An empty world filled by imagination and the prospecting buyer has no discernable imagination on entry. Real Estate for monsters explains why monsters repopulate dungeons.
Roaming Trend, dude, have you heard of the indie animated cartoon called Sublo and Tangy Mustard? It doesn’t get enough love and it’s been going for nine years now.
Also, finally i can enjoy a good quality wholesome show after what felt like ages of albeit good quality gorefests with depressing tones and everything being depressive for once
finally a hazbin review i 100% agree with. Vivize made great characters and universe. but here lack of writing skill made it not as good as it could be
23:38 I never watched the actual amazon show but I really hope it was at some point pointed out to Charlie that they *had* that chance. You know, before they died? But given ive heard the ending is someone going from hell to heaven its just... That show is a mess to say the least.
Yeah like from the start, the premice of this show is to redeem these siners in order to stop the massacre that is upon them. But along the show, we see demons unalive themselfs and others. What happens to the demons when they die?! By the end would be logic that when a demon die, it comes back to hell if its not redeemed, which makes the extermination premice pointless and senseless. Or if they're not redeemed, their soul is just.. gone? Not very second chance friendly i would add. If the time on earth is not enought to prove u deserve heaven, why to have limited time in hell as well till u disapear from existence
@@mayor_theo Sinners die only if they're killed by angelic weapons. The exterminators use them to kill sinners, preventing them from coming back. Unless they have angelic steel, when sinners kill each other they'll just regenerate back into hell (they still can get access to angelic weapons but in-universe they are expensive since only one of hell's weapons manufacturers is able to produce them). That's why the exterminations are a problem for people living in hell. If they aren't killed by exterminators then sinners have the potential to live indefinitely. One of the oldest sinners is several hundred years old.
first time I am watching a video from your channel, I got really hooked by your comparision gotta say. Good analysis and nice voice. I hope my sub helps you to create even more videos :)
When it comes to hazbin you have to factor in the sister show Helluva boss in terms of hell's lore. You have the multiple rings of hell but all the human sinners are trapped in the pride ring as it's the closest to heaven for the extermination. The question is why sinners can't go to other rings.
I liked the dungeon flippers pilot, but I felt like it was lacking something. There was no real visual comedy, conflict, or excitement. I hate to say it was boring, and I’m not dissing a show with a more low key plot, but even cartoons with easygoing storylines can make most of their medium. Like you said, there’s no real stakes.
I found it immediately quite grating. I do wish the original version had been made though, I kinda feel like they might have injected some vibes the adult animation space could have benefitted from at the time. Still wouldn't have been big, but the animation world is defined as much by its niche deaths as it is its big hits. Animation is a small world
I thought visually dungeon flippers was really nice. Just didn't care much for the story, it felt a little boring to me :/ still hope to see more from the show😊
I dont think the Dungeon Flippers pilot was dull at all. I feel it was more selling the charm and set up than the world and lore. If it covered everything you brought up or even part of it, it would have felt cluttered and muddled like the Hasbin Hotel pilot.
Keep in mind where in the episode they made that point. This is more the voice of the adult animation fan, often one who has been around the block more than a few times. In the same vein of one who is in the hypothetical of greenlighting new adult animation series. Novelty is a highly sought after trait, even to the detriment of basic storytelling principles. Its kinda like how Rotten Tomatoes has two different rating scores, which mostly reflects random folks and the people who make a living watching movies ALL THE TIME. A palate is developed when you consume that much media. They also mention how refreshing it is, and I think both is true, it just has some weaknesses here and there. I imagine calling it "dull" after a fair bit of praise is really a kind but firm nudge to say "If you want to get picked up, you're going to need to pander to these folks more." And I think that's fair. It probably would have to see changes to get network money, and if the public narrative were "more visual interest" as opposed to any character or narrative changes, that's literally the best scenario possible. Rather pragmatic, really.
The biggest difference between these two shows is that - with enough direction - Dungeon flippers has the most genuine potential to become an animation staple. While Hazbin Hotel is...Hazbin Hotel.
I am sorry to say, as much as I do recognize the merits in dungeon flippers it’s extremely unfair to compare the two as equal. Hazbin has it’s flaws and there is no denying that, but it does have far superior animation, a (in my opinion) far better looking art style, unlike dungeon flippers’s more traditional and boring standard western animation art style. I also find dungeon flippers’s character designs extremely boring, and while hazbin’s aren’t perfect by any means, I can remember those because they didn’t look like background characters from adventure time. Overall hazbin not only has far more entertaining narrative, world, voice acting, character design, music, visuals and action, it also did what a pilot is supposed to do, get you to want more, while after watching dungeon flippers all I personally felt was a weird voice in my head telling me to chug down a gallon of vodka to forget having ever watched it. Overall, I am a supporter of any kind of independent indie animation project, but comparing a boring, empty Cartoon Network style sitcom that is generic in the worst way possible to one of the greatest breakthroughs in indie animation, and the project that made it possible for indie animation to actually become a viable market, is basically like comparing the original jaws to sharknado.
@RoamingTrend I guess, a product that frustrates me with inconsistencies and bad writing IS logically better than a product that puts me to fucking sleep
20:00 Dude, maybe watch the video. It was good. Also, if you think you can determine whether Dungeon Flippers did the premise worse than Dragon goes Househunting from just the pilot episode, then the education system failed you
I don't mind sexual themes, I like anime; however hazbin is just obnoxiously obscene and way too in your face. Dungeon flippers is entertaining without being needlessly edgy and obnoxious.
