ELDEN RING The Usurping Theory | JarHed 

Well i think He might be in luck. I got This amazing vid on my yt fyp so the Algorithm might be in a good mood

I guess this video has been blessed indeed.... But I am so down to see a Collab video where all the lore enthusiasts can quibble away. It honestly never even occurred to me that Marika/Radagon might not actually be two people in one body

The algorithm did me right. May more of us follow!

I think this might answer your last video Tarn ;)

\|T|/

I've got a theory that answers your question, but you won't like it. Because Radagon is Marika is far more literal than you're thinking. As in, everything the Golden Order ascribes to Queen Marika the Eternal is actually the work of Radagon. How this works: Radagon is "Marika's" twin. Not her twin brother, but her twin SISTER. "Marika" ascends to godhood, far earlier than we are led to believe in the story of the Golden Order, and Radagon wishes to usurp her. Everything we believe Marika did prior to the Mountaintop of the Giants was carried out by the female Radagon, calling herself Marika. But Radagon cannot wield the divine power, as his sister can. So Radagon sends his shadow, Malekith, to defeat his sister (yep, I'm calling "Marika" as the GEQ), seals the Rune of Death, and imprisons his sister within the Erdtree. This, by the way, is why EVERY SINGLE depiction of Marika in the game, save the one that may be her in Farum Azula, is a depiction of Marika in her imprisonment. Even at the First Church of Marika she is depicted in the pose we later realize is her crucifixion. The people see the iconography, but don't realize the horrific context. But... there is talk of a curse, employed by the Giants on the Mountaintop. A curse that may be the source of Radagon's red hair. A curse that transforms Radagon from a blonde woman into a red haired man. This is a monumental wrench in the gears. You can't pose as a god and rule an age when you've built it around Marika and you are obviously no longer Marika. Godfrey will likely not enjoy discovering that his wife is now his husband, and the truth of Radagon's usurpation of his sister's power would almost certainly end in his destruction or imprisonment. So Godfrey is Tarnished and hounded from the Lands Between. Radagon uses the Second Carian War to establish himself as a champion, then fakes his summoning by Marika to become the Second Elden Lord and essentially reclaim the throne he had already won. There is actually precedent for the gender change in game. Miquella's story seems to be centered on the idea that he can go from a male demi-god permanently trapped in boyhood to a mature female god and ascend to rule a new age of the Haligtree. Which makes a lot of sense if his father already did the opposite. And, if you're inclined to think that Marika (that is, the being we know as Marika, ultimately imprisoned in the Erdtree) played a role in the Night of the Black Knives this would also explain why Godwyn the Golden is the first demigod to die. Godwyn is actually Radagon's son, not Marika's. He's a grafted lineage, feigning royalty. If I was lashing out at the man who usurped and imprisoned me, I'd kill his golden heir first too.

Thanks man, I'm glad it all made sense! I feel the end segment about the twins was the weakest part of the video, so I've been doing more research to try and strengthen the argument, but I'm happy to know others like the theory!

Sadly I can't say that it does. The cipher pata and one statue in the haligtree firmly puts miquella's birth before the death of godwyn.

@@nanoblast5748I think you mean the Golden Epitaph. I find it’s location weird tbh. On a random corpse in a Hero’s Grave. Suggests that Miquella wasn’t there when Godwyn was given the Erdtree burial. If they were close, why wasn’t he there? As for the statue, there’s is no telling that that is really Godwyn.

@@nanoblast5748 You can check out some of my other replies for my current response to this issue for the theory 😊

Yeah when you said this bit was weakest. I was like nah man this is what completely sold me. The rest was strong. But marika the stagnant vessel makes perfect sense to explain Miquella and Malenia!!!

I'm gad yo enjoyed it! It definitely made playing through the game again feel fun and a bit more fresh for me 😊

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought this either! Glad you liked the theory friend, and any support with sharing this theory would be greatly appreciated!

I'm glad you see where I'm coming from! So many little things just... bugged me! Happy to see it's not just me! 😅

That's a really good point! I've been seeing more and more chat about Radagon being a Mimic Tear or an Albinauric, and now a lot of comments suggesting it also! I think it's a GREAT idea, and very interesting when consider that the Albinauric's were likely to have been created the Nox of the Eternal Cities - Numen just like Marika! I think this idea has a lot more room to grow, and I'll definitely include this if I make another video continuing this theory. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, it means a lot!

My goodness, out here solving contradictions like you're Radagon regressing incantations and sorcery into one complete whole

Agreed! Radagon must be a mimic tear, with the Eternal City's obsession with creating their own Lord, Radagon could have been their end product, with Marika's blessings. That said, Mimic tears are said to have their own thoughts and convictions, hence Radagon being on the opposing side of Marika's stance on the Golden Order. The Usurp Theory really makes sense!

Mimic tear alwais copy original. If radagon is mimic tear he would look exactly like marika

@@kosatk120 I like to answer that question with the notion that The Fell God cursed Marika to have red hair and masculine features like the Fire Giants when Marika defeated the fiery deity on the mountaintops. Then Marika's motive to craft the Mimic Tear gets paired with the idea that she wanted to cast off the undesirable cursed red hair and masculine features. I propose that she used Radagon as a vessel for the Fell God's curse. This infused her mimic, Radagon, with the spiteful curse of her fallen enemy in the form of red hair, which the flavor text on the Giant's Red Braid claims he despised, and masculine features, which prevents Radagon from being an empyrean in the matriarchal lands between. This supports Radagon having ill will towards Marika to be taken advantage of by The Greater Will. Plus it would leave a Fell God shaped thorn in The Golden Order, which is what her fallen enemy would have wanted upon its defeat. I'm probably wrong, but I can't find another theory that coherently answers even half of what this one does. I'm excited to see what other questions there are to mull over after the DLC drops. Happy lore hunting!

That golden egg I feel like is key to understanding a lot of things. My own crackpot theory is that Rennala was reborn using the egg, causing her to go mental and also losing her ability to walk, possibly to keep her quiet from exposing Radagon and his plans. Her eyes glow golden, implying she has grace in her, and the shell that protects glow golden as well, also implying some Golden Order shenanigans at play. Then again, Ranni surely would’ve visited her in that state, as she basically conjured her second phase. Where does that fit in? This game…

No u

No effin waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyy you telling me the Cuckoo was Rennala all along!!! 🤣 Man, that idea is so great though! It's amazing! Someone shared with me the idea that Radagon was actually the Hero of Castle Morne, which I've fallen in love with! www.reddit.com/r/EldenRingLoreTalk/comments/ykexll/a_theory_on_the_unnamed_hero_of_castle_morne/ I had to go and double check Rennala's eyes after reading @ahbooza 's comment, but she does indeed have golden eyes!!! Regardless, I think these theories, however far-out they are, are just more satisfying then just R=M... I'm glad you like the video though, thanks for reaching out! Amazing idea to share!

@@JarHed69 Yeah there's a sort of batshit poetry to the idea that Marika is Radagon is Renalla lol

I like this one.

yes. timeline stuff absolutely rules. this timeline makes tons of sense.

I agree, I'm very happy to see others feel the same way ❤

Very kind of you to say, thank you!!!

Hey again! Several people have mentioned the golden sewing needle, and I hadn't really thought about it before, but you mae a really good point! I'll keep it in mind going forward 😊

Man, thank you for such high praise! 😊 And to be honest, in one message, you've put together all the BIGGEST problems for my theory! 😅🤣😭 As you've seen a lot of my responses to other comments, I won't repeat them here. Instead, I will say that you've phrased the problem of my theory in a way I hadn't thought before... I hadn't really realised this until your comment, but a lot (if not most, if not all) of the evidence I've put together for Radagon using mimicry to disguise himself as Marika, could just be evidence for them merging... I'm really grateful you've spelled it out in this way, as it's clearly shown the lack of actual evidence for the theory in ultimately unpalatable... and I desperately need to PROVE something instead of just casting doubt on various opposing areas of the lore... I will say, I DID know this to begin with, but you've actually clarified it in a very succinct way! And in doing so you've made the reasons why it's needed very clear! This is a great help, and along with your kind words, thank you so much for taking the time share this with me!

I'm glad you agree! One thing someone's pointed out to me though - it isn't ACTUALLY stated that the Great rune was a PARTING gift from Radagon, although I think it can be implied from Ofnir's dialogue on Rennala. That said, I'm a little uncomfortable I didn't realise this ambiguity to begin with, as it being a parting gift was a big basis for my writing the segment on the Great Run of the Unborn... That said, it doesn't discount the theory! Just something to keep in mind I guess!

@@JarHed69 The theory still works well if Radagon brought the amber egg to Rennala so they could create Ranni in a special birthing process that would make her fit to be an Empyrean. In that reading, the demigods would be born from amber eggs rather than normal birth. There's lots of evidence for alternate birthing processes in the work of @tarnishedarchaeologist (ie: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-sVtlCuFVfZ4.html). In that reading, Radagon would be following the Greater Will's instructions to create a new Empyrean who could ascend to godhood in the place of Marika (perhaps because she had destroyed the previous Empyrean meant to do so). This plan would have faltered when Ranni killed herself and Godwyn. Perhaps there would have been time to create a new Empyrean in her stead, but then Marika shattered the Elden Ring and Radagon was forced to go try to repair it.

I didn't fully understand why radagon would give her that rune? I've listened to it a couple times. why does it make sense that radagon would give her the rune of rebirth?

​​​@@XNaturalPhenomenonXWell, based on what I understand from the theory, the greater will called Radagon to go too Leyndell and punish/usurp Marika for breaking the elden ring. Doing so would require him to abandon his wife and kids, which is something he found difficult naturally. As such, he gave her the great rune because it's power allowed perfect *rebirths*, and using the power of the ring, Rennala could rebirth Radagon into someone who would be willing to leave his family and give himself to the golden order fully. That's what I understand from the theory.

@@EldenClown so he rebirthed himself instantly the way we would, becoming the person he needed to be. Then he left her the rune and now she obsesses over it. Am I getting that right?

I'm very honoured that it did pop up in your recommendations! Lately I've been seeing A LOT of chat about Radagon being a Mimic Tear or an Albinauric! It's a really great theory, and something I'll definitely touch on if I continue to explore this theory in more videos! And I agree, Assimi's cut questline was something I was really considering putting into the video around Marika being connected to the Nox. But as the script was already 6600 words long, I was worried I would scare people off if the video was longer than 30 min 😅 Thank you so much for your kind words! They are really touching and mean a lot!

I definitely like the imagery of Radagon hiding the Runes around the place for Marika!

I like your ideas but the "erd tree" is a spiritual tree. It is only visible to the tarnished because they are blessed by grace. The Greattree was the thing they worshipped that blessed the age of plenty with dew and vitality. It reached its death like all trees and in order to perpetuate a new order or cycle it had to be burned to release its seeds. The idea that one tree was grafted on the other never really made sense to me.

With the number of twins that are in this game I can believe this theory

@@JarHed69 in old monarchies there was typically a right and left hand of the monarch. The right hand typically served publicly as a stand in monarch handling what their ruler could not (Elden Lord). The left hand typically operated as spy master, working towards the empires goals in secret with the public having little to no knowledge about them (Radagon and the Black Knives). Also, the left hand becoming Elden Lord after Godfrey was exiled makes sense too, however I suspect Marika had hoped Radagon would remain in Caria and didn’t anticipate the Greater Will conscripting him to punish Marika and become Elden Lord. Now, considering Radagons smithing skills specifically regarding runes (he created the binding rune and converted his Moonlight Greatsword into a holy rune sword) it’s also likely he was the one who physically modified the Elden Ring when Marika took power, which would be seen as blasphemy considering the reaction to the shattering. This would make Radagons existence extremely problematic for the godly image Marika was cultivating since needing an outside force to modify the Elden Ring would greatly undermine her image. This makes him operating in secret the most logical option if this was what happened. Finally, the twins narratives found throughout the game combined with Miquella and Malenia being deformed (inbred) and embodying similar themes to Marika and Radagon (only jumbled together) them being twins makes perfect sense. Miquella has Radagons mind (knowledge seeking rebel) and Marikas soul (kind and motivated by love of family and community), whereas Malenia has Marikas mind (distraught and confused, relying on those around her to help her find the right path) and Radagons soul (fierce warrior who has faith in her convictions and will go to great lengths to defend her ideals). Them being products of the same genetic material explains this as all the other demigods have far more unique characteristics to define them outside of their parentage.

This goes back to the alchemy inspiration for the game. The White Queen and the Red King come together to create the perfect being. That king and queen are often depicted, not as twins, but as siblings in an incestuous relationship. The perfect being spawned from them would be the Rebis (which I believe is Miquella) after it has been rid of all its rot and imperfections. This implies that Miquella and Malenia were once one person while in gestation. But where Miquella is the perfect divine hermaphrodite, Malenia is the waste or byproduct. Miquella was wanted, hence why there are so many references to Radagon and Miquella spending time together, while Malenia was merely the unwanted waste of the process; hence why she seeks out a father figure in the blind swordsman. I believe the Rot God constantly tempts Malenia which is this "call of the rot." It steals her limbs and promises her wings. If it wasn't for Miquella fashioning her new limbs, she probably would have given in. It takes her pride and promises Valkyries. Her daughter returns the pride at her own sacrifice. It takes her sight, probably going to offer her something in return for that too.

Ah man, that's very kind of you to say! I'm glad if the hard work has paid off! I hope the theory makes sense? I went off the rails with a few areas, so maybe it could have been streamlined to less than 29min... Regardless, thanks for taking the time to watch it! Are there any areas in particular you feel the theory could explore more? It took over a month to make the video, so I hadn't even thought of carrying this further, but I'm getting a lot of good feedback, so am going to have to think carefully how best to proceed!

I think they are the same. He’s order and she’s chaos

I spent sooooooooo long trying to work out the levels, and I was SO annoyed when I also heard the first few songs were too loud 😭 But you're absolutely right, and this has been an amazing opportunity to practice Adobe Premier at least! I'm just glad no one's pointed out I misspelled Rennala at one point in the Timeline 😅 And I'm also very glad I put the time in to put the subtitles in - won't lie, it took me 3 days to do them... and took my friend a whole day to spot all the mistakes I made! But it does add something, so I'll be doing the same if I continue the theory in a follow-up video. As I said, this was my first crack at this, so your kind words and critiques honestly mean a lot to me! They are very welcome, so thanks for spending the time to help me out!

Well, it's almost been a year, and I'm still considering options for the change in the timeline 🤣😅 I'm glad to hear the whole theory might work without moving Godwyn's death! I did mention his relationship with Miquella in my second video, along with Malenia being the third child of Radagon and Marika, which I'm wondering if you have any thoughts on? And if I could ask, has the Shadow of the erdtree trailer given you any thoughts for this theory?

@@JarHed69 its been a while :'D I love listening to video essays, but they are not good if you need a quick reminder of the main thesis. Anyhow time shenanigans in ER are many and it's purposely told in vague ways to create a sense of mystery and whatnot. I dont exactly remember what timeline changes you were proposing, but seeing Mesmer... Well. Anything is possible now :D

@@ienott dam, that's a really fair point 😅 Can't stress how nervous I am for the DLC 😂 but I can't wait for some answers! Even if it does break this theory apart 🤣

@@JarHed69 im afraid we will get 10 more questions for every answer we get, and then more on top :D

I'm really happy you liked the video! Sorry it's taken me a minute to respond, was in Italy for a wedding! I think the lack of direct interactions by Marika after she talks with Radagon is key - it's always been so suspicious to me! Her lack of depiction as a mother also works with Melina's character, if she is indeed the secret child of Marika and Radagon! We know her mother gave her the task of taking us to the Erdtree, but her dialogue regarding Boc: "Does being born of a mother... Mean one behaves in such a manner?" makes sense if she was born whilst Marika was shackled in the Erdtree, growing up without being able to have a close relationship with her mother! Side note on this regarding Hewg, we know he was tasked with smithing a weapon to slay a god, so I'm of the mind that Marika gave both Melina and Hewg there secret quests to eventually free her from her enslavement by Radagon. And the Erdtree's Favour Talisman is a GREAT point, I'd forgotten about that one! I need to do A LOT more research on it, but there's so much I'd like to unpack around the Erdtree! I didn't initially focus on it, but people have pointed out that all the ash in Leyndell really might be a suggestion of the Erdtree burning once before! And the spiritual "Golden" appearance might all be an illusion - I always thought the dark strike around and above the entrance to the Erdtree was simply a sort of scar casting a shadow, but someone's suggested that THAT'S actually the remains of the original wood of the Erdtree, as it's not just a shadow like I thought, making the Golden façade an illusion also! Yesterday, someone commented that Marika might have been fiddling with the Elden Ring in an attempt to bring back Godwyn, and it got me thinking about how emotional she must have been after his death. It's obvious when you think about it, but as she's always called the God Queen it's also easy to forget just how painful her grief must have been... and maybe she shattered the Elden Ring when her attempts to restore Godwyn failed. This would make, according to my 'Usurping' Theory, one of her last acts being one as a mother grieving the loss of her son, which is a compelling idea to me at least! Thanks for the in-depth reply, you've given me more to think about! Comments like this are really helping me get my thoughts in order, and getting me to put them into words! So thanks! If you have any other thoughts, please let me know!

Pretty sure I agree with EVERYTHING in your timeline - ESPECIALLY the Blackjack and Hookers! 🤣🤣🤣 Thanks for taking to time to reach out, really made me smile!

@@JarHed69 keeping make more lore my dude! This was some Vaati level content

I'm hoping Vaati might see this, but I don't see it happening... 😭

Miquella was already born and knew Godwyn before he died. Also Ranni's dialogue hints at it from her role before the plot, that Miquella and Malenia lived before it.

I do agree they have a definite Yin-Yang about them, and I'm seeing a lot of discussion lately about him being a Mimic Tear! I was going to include it in the video, but it was quite long and I was worried I'd scare people off if the video was longer than 30min 😅 Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts! It's been a great help to hear everyone's own theories 😊

Thanks for your kind words! I'm glad you enjoyed the theory! And that's a VERY interesting point! I completely forgot about Morgott transforming from a commoner! I'd also add, there's all the OTHER enemy's that transform when you attack them - they all drop Larval Tears, and there's a lot of speculation lately that Radagon could be a Mimic Tear himself - it's something I'll definitely cover if I make a follow-up video... And the idea of Radagon still being out there, maybe to come back, like a comic book villain I don't now why, but I really like this idea!!! 🤣🤣

In my opinion, Ranni's having her chair at the council in Leyndell... is a very good point... I'm ashamed to say, I hadn't even considered this... Bloody hell... Well, first thing that comes to mind - if Radagon went to Leyndell to usurp Marika, then I think it's natural he would elevate his own children to the council with him, but maybe she never ACCTUALLY sat in the chair..? As you can tell, I'm reaching for an answer, because I don't really have anything right now to counter this REALLY good point, that I definitely missed... I will have to address this if I want to take the theory any further! I'll think over it, so thank you so much for pointing this out!

​@JaR hEd69 to help Jumpstart you a bit. Rogier lived in a half dead state for a time. Miquella did know rmgodwin, but all references of this imply the twins were very young. There is a small window where marriage, birth, death, council, then War could happen in that exact order. Interestingly if your theory is true, that would imply that godwin's death as because of the power struggle between radagon and marika.

We inherit all there great runes from them from our play through so that last part doesn’t work. It’s basically fact that when the Elden ring got shattered they didn’t inherit the runes persay they just went and collected a piece of it and they could bc they were demigods who was gonna stop them at the time except themselves, which eventually happened when they all fought with their great runes….mohgs great rune literally states that it became stained with blood AFTER he acquired it bc he was tainted by the formless mother. Melanias became the rot butterfly’s, godricks became even more golden, radahn surviving a Scarlett bloom enhances his athleticism, survivability if that’s how you wanna call it (health equip load and stamina) , and Morgotts gives you I think just more health or something bc he stays loyal to the golden order and protect ting the erd tree. The great runes made them stronger once they got them but their own personalities eventually overtook the runes themselves. It would be super lame and odd story wise if marika was to break the Elden ring but then the shards just randomly go to her children…it makes more sense they all took a piece and not just inherited them.

Oh also duh how I forgot, radagon literally gave renalla a great rune, so that throws even more a loop into the timeline bc how does that make sense if it wasn’t broken yet and he was trying to repair it? You can’t repaid a house and just leave the door off it and call it a day, but regardless that just furthers the notion that the shards weren’t inherited and they took them

@dOZ I think the part of the lore you are missing is that the runes are part of the elden ring, but not the elden ring itself. The biggest example is the rune of death that marika removed to change how death works in the land between. So runes are some short of specific law that you can add and subtract and the elden ring is the set of laws currently in effect.

Wow, thank you for such high praise! I'm just so relieved that people aren't calling me crazy, I never expected so many positive comments! Thanks for reaching out, it really means the world 😊😊

Very kind of you to say, I'm still surprised myself how the video turned out! I was sure I'd come across like a lunatic 🤣 I've no idea where/what I'll do next, but your support means to world to me! So honestly, thank you!

Thanks for your kind words! They really mean a lot! And you're thoughts are absolutely fair! The 'Usurping' Theory is pretty much completely based off of the original 'Radika' Theory, so without it, it's justified to say the 'Usurping' Theory is a stretch of a conclusion to reach on its own. That said, I feel that is the exact intent from FromSoft! The 'Radika' Theory is handed to us, so I think it's natural for it to answer many of the big mysteries and fit the questions within the game. It just doesn't explain the way Corhyn and Goldmask's questline continues after you tell them the message, and I think you have to bend a lot of the lore for THIS to be the final conclusion. A comparison I wish I made in the video is with the illusion of Princess Gwynevere in Dark Souls 1 - as this shown that it's an idea FromSoft have done before! Your questions are all spot on! They're all things I wish I covered in more detail, and things I still need t do a lot of research on. That said, allow me to ty and tackle them, to see where my head is at now regarding them: Why would Radagon be pretending to be crucified in the Erdtree? - Excellent point, and an obvious one I haven't really thought about... First thing that comes to mind, I guess maybe Radagon can only take the forms of things as they currently are? We use the Mimic's Veil to take the form of objects based on what area we are in/what's around us - so I thought of it, like, as Marika slowly deteriorated inside the Erdtree, and if Radagon is taking her form, then that form would also slowly be deteriorating... it's a really tricky point for this theory to answer though! Why would Marika address Radagon as her other self? - To me, this does feel like something she WOULD say to someone intending on copying and using the image of her as their own. I think "mine other self" does work with the 'Usurping' Theory, as maybe Marika realised that pretending to be her was Radagon's plan? How could Rennala's children be Demigods? - You're right that it's not exactly said if Demigod is something you're bon with or simply a title... on a similar note, Enia does call the demigods, "each and all the direct offspring of Queen Marika." If you google Direct Offspring, it can be defined as "A person who was born into OR legally adopted into the direct line of an individual's descent" - so that does mean that Rennala's children are still Marika's direct offspring even if they are only her stepchildren. As such, I would agree that demigod is a title as opposed to something you're born as Why are Malenia and Miquella born from a single god? - I am disappointed with my section on this in my video, as I didn't really address the specific choice of wording used in Malenia's Remembrance. Since I uploaded it though, I have seen someone claim the Japanese text for her Remembrance uses the phrase "唯一人の神" which can be translated as “the one and only god”, INSTEAD of "a single god", so depending on how much you agree on the Japanese being the TRUE text for the lore, there's definitely need for more investigation! And this is something I've not seen anyone talk about!!! And on "Marika is Radagon" being more suitable for FromSoft to use, if this theory is true - I think it's important to remember this message comes from the sculptor! Using the 'Usurping' Theory, the sculptor would be under the impression that Radagon and Marika are married and two separate people. So if he discovered that Radagon has been pretending to be Marika, then the order of words "Radagon IS Marika" makes sense. Whilst everyone has been thinking that Marika is making choices and doing things herself, what we thought was Marika was ACTUALLY Radagon. They may have seen Marika, or been told of her decrees/policies, but they were all Radagon. So Radagon is actually Marika in this case - and if you imagine the transformation of the statue in reverse, I think you can see better what the sculptor is trying to convey. Sorry for the long response, but all your questions were SO on point, I felt I needed to give answering them a go! Can't lie, these questions are also things that have been in the back of my mind, but hadn't yet been able to put into words, so this comment is of such great help, so thank you so much! I'm thinking of continuing this theory in a follow up, and once I've got a script/paper together for it, could I ask you to possible give it a read?

@@JarHed69 these are good points, I think it could be reasonably argued in either direction when it comes to what marika told radagon or the sculptor's intent. though there's one thing i said that you don't seem to have addressed, I'll quote myself here : "To me, the intro part where both radagon and marika are in the same position seemingly doing two different things (radagon trying to repair the ring while Marika shatters it) but ultimately ending up shattering it completely debunks the notion that Marika and radagon exist in two different bodies because we do know that this entity would have to be Marika not just radagon because the motivation to do this only lines up with Marika and not radagon." ,I think this was the single strongest point i made and i'd like to hear your thoughts on it. also, now that you mentioned what enia said, I now think the word "demigod" seems to be both Hereditary AND a given title,let me explain: Godrick's greatrune says that the first demigods were Godfrey and his offspring (the golden lineage), including godfrey here is curious as we don't have anything that suggests that he's at all related to marika or any other god. Enia seems to say that godrick was the weakest of the demigods due to him being a distant relation to marika and so his "divine blood is sorely diluted", yet she also says that all demigods are direct offspring of queen marika, seemingly excluding godrick form this statement but no one else, I think this heavily implies three things: 1-that marika's blood does have inherent power. 2-that when she says "direct offspring of queen marika" she really does mean a biological relation as she doesn't for example suggest that any of the other demigods are weaker than the others due to their heritage, this in my mind reinforces the idea that the game gives us that radagon and marika are the same person since at least three of demigods, including the mightiest of them all are rennala's children, I don't think her meaning that marika didn't take godrick as step son would make any sense in this context. 3-that demigod is also given title as it is indeed given to godrick despite not being a direct offspring of queen marika, and godfrey despite not being at all related to her as far as we know finally, I'll say that it'd be my pleasure to give your next a script a read, and I'll definitely keep an eye out for what you put out next, be it a follow up to this or something else, so keep at it ! I'll also add that getting a 167 subscribers from a channel's first video which only has 2.8k views is some of the best reception I've ever seen a starting channel get, this looks extremely promising for you (if you'd like to continue making stuff) I'd say haha.

Red Herring is so the word... I was always expecting the community to eventually progress into a further theory 😅😅 And thanks for the kind words friend, your support means a lot!

🤣 I'm very glad! To be honest, I felt I needed to have a quick pace to make the video as short as possible - the script ended up being 6600 words long... But I'm happy I did it the pace I did, and I'm happy you enjoyed it. Thanks you reaching out, very kind of you!

Ahh cheers Jacob! You're far too kind! I'm just gad I'm not the only one unsatisfied by the 'Radika' Theory, but I never expected so much great feedback! I'm sure that the DLC will shed some more light on whether or not this theory holds true, but until then, I'm glad you agree that this is a more fun and engaging was of interpreting the lore! I'm blown away by your comments, I can't express how grateful I am!

Thanks friend, I really appreciate the support! For me, this theory made killing Radagon WAY more satisfying at the end 😅🤣

Thanks for sharing your thoughts! There's a lot of areas I wished I covered in more detail, but I was worried about making this looong video any longer! 😅 Radagon's motivations are of course a very interesting part of his story - and I agree that he clearly has a MASSIVE drive to feel complete. This big void, as you say, would be a great motivator, and I think there are quite a few idea that could explain why he feels this way. If he WAS a small Fire Giant, that might explain his drive for perfection - a rejection of his heritage and a unending desire to be accepted within the Golden Order. On the flip side, I have to acknowledge that if he WAS split from Marika, then being essentially half a person would also explain his unending pursuit of becoming whole... Either works in my mind, but I find the idea of it being because he split from Marika... unsatisfying. On the Japanese texts - I need to do a lot more research if I want to continue this theory! As I said, the English translations are clearly missing some of the context implied in the Japanese, as occasions like Rogier contradicting himself pop up also... so this is something I'm looking into. And on Rogier's dialogue - I think his claim to have spent a great amount of time studying the Night of Black Knives, along with his knowledge of the Rune of Death, the Black Knifeprint, and the Cursemarks, makes me trust his dialogue. He's one NPC who gives us a hell of a lot of lore information, so I think he's intended to be a trusted source! On Ranni and Empyreans - I think the idea of Ranni not being a demigod when she's named as an Empyrean is fair to claim. It's just so confusing and un-detailed what makes an Empyrean! And I think Radagon was indeed still with Rennala when Ranni was made an Empyrean, which really could be why Marika begins to have doubts about the Golden Order. As I've said, there's a lot of investigation to do for this, which I've started to do for a video continuing this theory. I hope that all makes sense? Comments like this really help me put my ideas into writing, and are really helping me work out what my next video will need to cover! So honestly, thank you so much for taking the time to comment!

@@JarHed69 Glad I can be of help! I agree that Rogier's words carry more weight than the average NPC but I feel Ranni's whole thing with the black knives is she hid the secret so well. The whole way with which the Carian study hall operates and how it prevents entry to the Divine Tower goes to show the lengths to which she went to hide it. Beyond that I also find it hard to swallow the idea of Godwyn dying while Godfrey was still around. Godfrey's conquests took targeted the enemies o the Golden Order until his "last worthy foe" perished, becoming Tarnished by that point. The black knives as well as Those who live in death are presently an enemy of the Golden Order given great import and it doesn't quite fit well for the death of Demigods to have began taking place and yet Godfrey was not made to fight back against them. The puzzle pieces fit way better together if he was already gone by the time Godwyn was made a martyr.

hey I know you had great intentions, but I am reading through the manga right now, can you put BERSERK SPOILER: or something?

@@rx0102 Fixed it. Sincerest apologies.

@@TheAlphaLegionnaire thanks bro

I'm glad you liked it! And along with getting the know the Japanese text's much better, I'm going to have to start reading up on Berzerk!!!

Thanks! I've really hadn't even thought yet of continuing beyond this video - it took over a month to make! But all the great feedback and ideas have already got me excited to carry on! It's a great feeling! If there's anything you'd specifically like to see covered using this theory, or any other ideas t add to it, drop me a message any time!

I'm glad you enjoyed it! I mentioned it briefly in the video, but this theory completely changed how I viewed Rannala!! On my first playthrough, I wasn't very impressed... especially as the her proper boss phase is just an illusion from Ranni. But this made her character much more interesting and tragic to me - and it made killing Radagon WAY more satisfying 🤣 Thanks for taking the time to reach out, very kind of you!

Ahh thank you friend! The ability for FromSoft games to ALLOW such wide and complex speculations is truly incredible! I never thought I'd one day be able to take part in it 😊

@@JarHed69 No problem! Hopefully we can get more from you.

That's exactly what I've been thinking too!!!! I do want to say, I think I was a bit over-dramatic to suggest Marika was "pretty much dead" when she was chained up, as if she was still sentient she'd be able to give both Hewg and Menila their secret quests that'd eventually free her from her captor, Radagon! I'm gad you are thinking like that too 😊😊

Very kind of you to reach out! I'm really glad you liked it, so thanks man 😊

Very kind of you to say, I'm surprised myself 😂😂😂 Thanks for reaching out!

Several people have suggested Radagon using some extreme form of Grafting to bind Marika to himself, and that sounds to me like a WAY more satisfying explanation than just saying "they merged together" ! I'm glad you like the video at least, thank you for taking the time to reach out!

Very kind of you, thanks for your support! As I said, I was thinking about this since my first playthrough.... so about a year 😅😅😅 If I do make a follow-up to this video, hopefully it won't take as long 🤣

I never expected such high praise... I'm blown away, thank you so much!

It's his line, "Do YOU have a fuller understanding of the matter?" that gets me every time!! 😂😂😂 It's like he's TELLING us that there's another layer to be found!

That's a very pertinent idea! It would help explain things if he had it all along, and if, as the theory suggests, he uses it before leaving Rennala, who's to say he hadn't used it before??

Very kind of you, thanks! Yeah, hopefully the DLC will give us more answers than new questions 🤣🤣

Thanks for your support! It took over a month to make this video... so I 've not got any solid plans for where to take the theory next 😅

If it's got people having fun thinking about the lore, then I'm happy 😊 Thanks for reaching out, very kind of you!

Thank you! I'm really happy you enjoyed it!

Ahhh, thank you for going out of your way with such kind words! 😊😊😊 I;m suprised how the video turned out to be honest, like one 30min happy accident!

Ahhh man.... I was worried the overall theory would get overly confusing by the end of the video, so I never expected to get such kind words! Thanks for your support! I never even considered doing any more with this theory, but comments like this have got me fired up to try and take this theory further!

Well it took over a month to make this video... so long that I hadn't even considered if I would make anything more! But getting so much positive feedback has really made me think about continuing to explore this theory, especially all the points and evidence that I missed... Comments like yours are a great support, so thank you for your kind words! If I've got people thinking and having fun with the lore, then that's all I hoped for!

The flaw in your take is that Maliketh feels betrayed by Marika. The simplest explanation for which is because she was the one who told Ranni where to find Destined Death and set up Ranni's theft of it. After sealing Destined Death so long ago, she has now unleashed it upon the Lands Between once more.

Hey man, I'm glad you liked the theory! Glad to know you don't think I'm crazy 😅 I too think FromSoft's method of worldbuilding and storytelling is simply incredible to allow such in-depth and complex speculation! I don't think it could be done in any other media either 😊 Thank you for your kind words, they mean a lot!

Miquella wouldn't actually need to have known Godwyn for this to make sense or for him to yearn for a true death for his brother. He'd just need to believe that Godywn *was* his brother, and to know about the effects Godwyn's corpse was having on the Lands Between. I think your use of the word "ceremonial" is key. The Golden Epitaph is "made to commemorate" Godwyn's death, which suggests to me that it is something formal and ritualistic - the kind of entreaty made in a religious ceremony rather than something that expresses a personal plea. The use of "lord brother" also suggests that Miquella views Godwyn at something of a remove. Or one can think about it this way: what's the evidence in the description that suggests anything personal? I think that is a harder argument to make.

@@JohnBaileyOwen but what of the statue of what appears to be Godwyn holding Miquella a d Malenia when Malenia was still a youth in the haligtree at the Loretta fight? Why specifically Godwyn? Unless you believe, perhaps, that that is Marika. If you do, then why is there no other evidence whatsoever of Marika having any sort of relationship with Miquella or Malenia?

I'm very relieved that the theory seems to have come across properly... I was VERY worried people would think I'm crazy 🤣 But thanks for your support, you are more than too kind and it really means a lot to me! And thanks for sharing your thoughts! I've been trying to work out an answer for the close relationship between Godwyn and the Twins, but I'm yet to come to a proper argument that I feel is satisfying enough. That said, as you said, I have to agree that the implied close relationship between Miquela, Malenia, and Godwyn is JUST implied, and not as strongly as people have argued! I'm glad you share this sentiment, but the use of the word "commemorate" as you've pointed out is actually something I glossed over! It IS something more ceremonial and ritualistic - I felt like I was on the right path, but I totally missed this detail ,and it really does help! so thank you! And I think you're right, phrasing it "what evidence specifically suggests it IS personal" is a better way to put the argument! Their relationship IS the main bit of the lore that's been put against the 'Usurping' Theory, so I've been doing some more research into Miquella and the Eclipse Ritual. After making a whole 30min video about going against the accepted theory, I hope I don't come across as trying to be a contrarian... but I really don't think there actually IS any sort of ritual with the Eclipse 🤣🤣🤣 I'll try to explain, but this is the first part of the script I've recently written for a potential follow-up video for the theory: ----- Mention of the Eclipse is reserved for a handful of weapons and a handful of talking spirits. As described in the Eclipse Crest Heater Shield - “The sun in eclipse is said to be the symbol of the Wandering Mausoleum where the soulless demigods slumber.” So if the Mausoleums house slumbering SOULLESS demigods, does that mean Godwyn isn’t the only soulless demigod? It is said the corpses of these demigods are housed inside these Mausoleums, and they’re often guard by the Mausoleum Knights, who have decapitated themselves to “ followed their masters into Death” (Mausoleum Soldier Ashes) The Eclipse Crest Greatshield tells us that “The eclipsed sun, drained of color, is the protective star of soulless demigods. It aids the mausoleum knights by keeping Destined Death at bay.” SO these knights are protecting their soulless masters inside the Mausoleums, and the symbol of the Eclipse aids keeping Destined Death at bay. So, to me, “keeping Destined Death at bay could mean one of two things: either it means it’s stopping the soulless demigods from truly dying, with the hope that they could one day be restored, OR that it is preventing these soulless gods from producing and spreading Deathroot, like Godwyn’s soulless corpse. Or maybe it’s both of these? If they are Souless demigods, then surely they also have the potential to spread Deathroot. And maybe, after interring Godwyn in the roots of the Erdtree failed to put his body to rest, maybe they learned to isolate them instead, creating the Mausoleums and their knights to prevent anyone tampering with their soulless bodies? I think it’s crucial that this endeavor would be AIDED by the symbol of the Eclipse, which leads me to the spoopy talking spirits. Within Castle Sol, a Spirit directly speaks out to Miquella: “Lord Miquella, forgive me. The sun has not been swallowed. Our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless... I will never set my eyes upon it now... Your divine Haligtree…” We know Miquella is related to the use of the Eclipse, but if the Eclipse IS representing the concept of sealing Deastend Death, then the phrase “the sun has not been swallowed” could surely simply mean that Destined Death has not been sealed? That the spread of Godwyn’s Deathroot has not been prevented? ----- Very ropey as is, but this is where I got to today 😅 But thought I'd share, as you're comment's been so kind and generous with information!

@@JarHed69 I love having a new a clearly very bright perspective and interpretation of the lore. I don’t think any of us are right or wrong in totality and I think it’s this way on purpose. So instead I just love having discussions about it and hearing new ideas. I’m thrilled that your perspective is so unique and quite clever! I love to consider what ideas you’ve offered

@@JarHed69 Additionally, one of the earliest bits of lore released for Elden ring included some insight into the night of the black knives. The lore released at that time stated that on the night of the black knives, MANY demigods were felled, but that Godwyn was simply the first of them. It is stated that the black knife assassins struck swiftly and in coordination so that Marika could not adequately respond in order to save her demigod children. I also think that staving off death root is not necessarily the only thing the eclipse ritual was for. I think the eclipse ritual was specifically meant to invoke the eclipse. During a lunar eclipse, the Moon turns red because the only sunlight reaching the Moon passes through Earth's atmosphere. The more dust or clouds in Earth's atmosphere during the eclipse, the redder the Moon will appear. The significance of this is that I believe destined death and helphen are both associated with red. The lunar eclipse is meant to break down the barrier between Helphen and the lands between. This would allow for soulless demigod’s souls that have been cast into the depths of helphen to return to the lands between, at which time they can either have destined death appropriately delivered to them, or live again, a second life. This is why I do not believe the mausoleums being associated with the soulless demigods and the eclipse ritual are unrelated. I believe they are fully related. Additionally the architecture of the mausoleums is 100% congruent to Nox architecture and if we associate Nox architecture with leyndell before the Nox we’re cast below the earth for attempting to create their own lord, we can then agree that these mausoleums were built BEFORE the golden order was well established. Another bit of detail that supports this is that the faces on the mausoleums we have to crush in order to get the mausoleums to squat are the same gaping sunken eyes faces of the petrified/statues we find all over Nokstella and Nokron eternal cities. I call them statues because in several places through out the eternal cities you can clearly see the rectangular shape of a base to the structures, suggesting they aren’t petrified beings that previously lived. But are instead crafted statues, placed where they are for some other reason. If they ARE petrified previously living beings, their anatomy is very unique amongst those who dwell in the lands between and they were clearly made into statues post petrification by those that dwell in the eternal cities. But why?

That's very kind of you to say! It's really appreciated, so thank you so much! I was afraid of coming across as a ranting lunatic 😅

Very kind of you to say, thank you! I just hope people will use to the have fun with the lore? That's what makes FromSoft games so great to begin with!

Lost for words friend... thanks so much for your support, you've blown me away. So kind of you, honestly, you've no idea how much it means! ❤❤❤

My pleasure friend, glad you enjoyed the video!

Man, you're poetic! ❤❤

Very kind of you to say! It really goes to show how amazing FromSoft's strategy for storytelling and mystery building is, it just keeps on delivering after a year since it's release! I'm aware that my theory is likely to be proven wrong further down the line, but it's been great fun to work on in the mean time! Thanks for taking the time to reach out, it's very appriciated!

Wow! I never knew the original Sleeping beauty was so dark! That's fascinating, thanks for taking the time to share!

I'm glad you enjoyed it! Regardless of if my theory ends up being true or not, it just shows how incredible the writing and mysteries are within FromSoft games! It took so long to make this video, I hadn't even thought of continuing it any further! But all these kind comments have got me fired up to see how far down the rabbit hole we can go!

I'm really glad you enjoyed it! I was surprised myself how it turned out 😅 It was an amazing opportunity to practice Adobe Premier at least, and I never expected so many kind words! Thanks for taking the time to reach out 😊😊

Ahhh, very kind of you to reach out and say, thank you man! I'm just glad it all made sense at least 😅 I'm working on areas where the theory is weakest, but I know I've got a long way to go!

I never thought I would get so many positive responses... It's getting me excited as well! I'm glad this resonated with you, and glad I'm not the only one thinking like this!

Thanks for spending the time to share in such depth! The whole mystery surrounding what makes someone an Empyrean was VERY frustrating for me! At this point, I'm beginning to question if FromSoft actually had a clear definition themselves 😅 I saw recently something that may give a different angle to the twins being Empyrean's - it's been pointed out that the Japanese text for Malenia's Remembrance might actually give quite a different meaning than the English translation: the phrase "唯一人の神" can apparently be translated as “the one and only god”, and not "born of a single god". Sadly, putting it in google translate puts it as the twins being "the only children of God", which is very unhelpful! So I sadly can't verify this myself... but it's given me some ideas, what do you think? Thanks again for your kind words, and best of luck with your Indie Game!