I have a Mk2+ with a 2,5 upgrade that I have not yet installed 😄 I have used the printer since 2017 and it never failed in anyway 👍 But it would be fun to have a Mk4 :)
Yes and no. If they have private investment or were publicly traded then yes the pressure for infinite exponential growth would force them to make crappier products until they implode or get bought out. The idea of shareholder supremacy that took hold in the 70's and has been f-ing us and the planet over ever since. If not then the only reason to grow is to help as many people as possible. They can grow organically as needed and keep doing their thing slow and steady. I don't know if they have outside investment. I don't think they're publicly traded though. I hope they never are because it will destroy the company. As it stands, I assume they don't need to sell more and more printers every year as long as they break even financially.
@@cupbowlspoonforkknif I might take you seriously when you do one or more of the following three things: 1. Start your own company and decide you don't need to make any money at it. 2. Invest all of your money in companies that decide they don't need to make any money at it. 3. Try to work for a company that decides it doesn't need to make any money at it. Any company that ever existed without startup investment, or decided that it didn't need to provide a decent return to whatever entity made an investment in it, didn't last very long.
@@dggcreations How does dragon HF manages to be high flow when it still uses V6 nozzle? Though my dragon is still waiting for rest of the Voron to be assembled. So not speaking from experience.
@@dggcreations they said nozzle, not the entire hotend. The vast majority of nozzles used are V6 specs, and the top selling high flow setups use them (Dragon, Rapido, etc)
And well done to you Thomas . This video I found so much more informative and easy to watch / listen to than the prusa live stream announcement - which was double the length . You add a real, huge amount of value by working out what to ask, asking those questions, videoing showing detail clearly, and lastly editing it into a whole. Also well done to Josef and esp Mikolas who have such deep knowledge and are so clear in their explanations. I have nothing but admiration for how clear they both are in English - not their mother tongue, they like yourself are far more expressive than many native English speakers in English. Very impressive. Thank you.
And I really love their stance on priorities. Producing locally and fair, as well as keeping everything open and self testing all the parts constantly are values I really like. I'll stick with Prusa for these soft factors alone. I don't need one. But I really want one now. :D
Thomas, just wanted to say how much I've appreciated your videos over the past year -- I purchased a Prusa MK3S+ as my first (and only) FDM printer last year, based partly on your abiding confidence in the printer (despite the many printers you have access to). I'm so glad I did. I enjoy your approach to providing rational analysis of these products, and measured recommendations where appropriate. This video was no different - you invited Prusa to engage on a variety of potentially uncomfortable questions. Keep it up!
The MK4 was one of the fastest new-release products I've purchased. I had a feeling that this wasn't going to be a Mini launch and all the new features just solidified it for me. You can obviously tell the sheer amount of testing that went into a product.
It seemed like they finally did a “mostly good to go on release” release (jynxing it now, and they don’t have the input shaper / advanced use of the loadcell data but anywho) which is refreshing.
At least the waiting for electrical components to be in sufficient supply for mass production was good for something. They had enough time to polish the MK4 and test it properly.
Ended up going for a MK4 after months of mulling and even cancelling my Bambu preorder. No regrets. I love that it needs so little maintenance, and that when it does, I know I'm in good hands. Also, the kit felt like a tour through the minds of _really_ talented engineers. It was super fun.
The new MK4 is looking like a great set of improvements. I hope to get close to one and give it a run some time! We just pushed new Cartesian fixed-time motion planning with advanced Input Shaping to Marlin bugfix-2.1.x - which includes resonance variance based on Z height. This implementation was contributed by Ulendo for the open source world to use freely, and Prusa Research is certainly welcome to adapt it to their own firmware, which is based on Marlin 1.1.x. The fixed-time motion planning system itself replaces Marlin's just-in-time motion planning, but allows for switching to either motion system with a G-code (M493). As a separate motion system it has its own Linear Pressure Advance as well. (Ulendo is most famous for Filtered B-Spline -FBS- but this is not included in their open source contribution.)
I have a few 32 bit boards laying around, and now a MK3S+ that is seeing limited use. looking forward to putting it all together, while hopefully keeping my palette 2 pro compatible in connected mode.
@@ahmetcemturan Presumably the stepper pulses will be more regular, whereas with JIT there may be some irregularity. In situ it's hard to notice the difference, but some have reported that Fixed-Time subjectively seems better. I think we'll need to put an oscilloscope on both of them and see for ourselves. I'm still on Team JIT, as it uses far fewer resources and works great on slower AVR boards, but we'll continue to improve Fixed-Time Motion and it may become the preferred choice for faster boards with lots of memory.
@@SkeeterPondRC lol prusa never innovated? Lmao he practically invented the i3 design which is the most copied printer style on the market. He also invented the heated bed, which hey, 100% of 3d printers use today. Also, segmented heat bed on the XL? How many printers have that? None, just the XL. Meanwhile here is Bambu lab ripping off every open source innovation, then slapping a proprietary label on it. Then contributing literally nothing to the open source that they steal from. Sit down and learn.
I got excited about the new MK4, but then I have a modified MK3S+ with a Revo hot end, and I'm not sure I would want to give it up, it's such a great design. And if I'm going to end up dropping more than $1K on a new FDM printer, I would want to go larger size and Core XY, like the XL or Voron. Although Prusa seems to have been having trouble getting the XL to market and fulfilling orders, backlogged until the end of the year. So I'll wait, let the early adopters work through the kinks.
Reading the comments it’s clear that a lot of people don’t understand the cost implications of building printers in Europe vs made in China. Also the mk4 is exactly what it was always going to be and evolution of the mk3, they have bought it up to date with a solid feature set, while keeping the whole thing open source (i find it funny how quickly the community seems to be shunning open source considering none of these printers would exist without it and yes that includes the Bambu printers) This looks like a solid printer, that takes us one step closer to one click 3d printing where you can set it and forget. And yes that means a focus on reliability and repeatability while maintaining quality over outright speed, so for many this printer will make a lot of sense.
We don't need to understand what makes it expensive or cheap. I am the buyer and I am looking for the best value for money. The development of printing was indeed initially due to Prusa and that is why it is disappointing that it has fallen so far behind. There are now communities and printers that are ahead of it (Voron, Ratrig, EVA etc.) And Bambulab's innovation has also raised the bar considerably. It offers more at a lower cost. What I just click and print (it will never be that easy) Bambulab can do.
@@jakabgipsz4788 I completely disagree it’s really important to understand what makes a product expensive or cheap otherwise you can’t properly asses value as cheap doesn’t always equate to value. when I was talking about open source I wasn’t just referring to Prusa there were lots of others as well, and a lot of the innovations were only possible after patents held by stratasys expired, now we have all these companies ditching open source, patenting stuff and once again potentially hamstringing consumer 3d printing. I would also argue that they aren’t behind, the mk4 is right on par feature wise, I am sure they would like to have bought it to market earlier but that’s just the supply chain reality right now. Bamboo might offer more for less but right now it’s realisability is an unknown, as is it’s long term customer and product support. Another factor that has to be considered when assessing value.
@@wardy89 I completely disagree... I want the best and i want it now and if Joe cant give me that i'll go elsewhere regardless... I don't care if its creality tronxy voron ratrig, I don't care about open source. Cause Joes certainly milked it for all it's worth. He is fat and filthy rich thanks to open source. I don't buy a product from emotion or catchy jingles or false claims (and all the makers are doing it now not just Joe) I'm analytical clinical and decisive in my decision making I have no emotional tie to how or why a printer is made. I'm more than happy to toss it in a bin when i'm done and move onto the next best thing when it comes along...Even if it is a Prusa down the track.
@@Defyant123 I agree with you. When I plan to make a purchase of this volume, I don't choose based on ideology, I look at value for money. I look at what I get for my money. If I didn't do that I would be damaging myself. Prusa printers have been overpriced devices from the beginning. The same machine if you put it together, you can build it for half the price. If Jozef doesn't pay attention to the market now, he'll be in trouble soon.
I preordered the XL, but Bambu has blown me away so much now I have 4 P1Ps with AMSs and 1 X1C. It's the first time I felt like paying more than $200 for a printer was worth it due to the speed. I'm glad Bambu has pushed Prusa into making faster machines.
I started with an Ender 3v2 in March of this year. I did a handful of the common mods for it and it was really just an entry point to kind of grasp the process of modeling and printing my own parts. I bought the Bambu P1S last month and the degree of separation between the two in terms of speed and quality is gargantuan. I mention this because I had considered moving to a Prusa mk3, however the hard fact is that the "bed slinger" as a design concept is inferior to "core XY" in its basic premise. Moving the mass of a print bed will always be a setback. However, Bambu does not have the track record of Prusa, and I would likely recommend a Prusa to someone who was looking to make money with their prints.
@@RYTHMICRIOT I've used a 60 Ender/CR print farm in the past for selling and making money with prints. That has been completely replaced with 7 Bambu printers. I suggest them over Prusa.
Im only about 9 minutes in but I really appreciate how he openly acknowledges that sure, they may not be on the cutting edge of 3D innovation but thats not their focus. They're trying to make a printer that *works*. I really appreciate that. I think the innovation is cool but I'm not at the point in my life where i want to be messing around in uncharted waters just to have "the best." I just want a printer that I can start and walk away from without a knot in my stomach. So far my MK3s+ has been that for me. My neighbor loves to talk about how he saved $600 more dollars that I did and his printer can print the same stuff mine can. But he's constantly down and his prints suck cause he doesnt want to put in all the work to get his printer... working. I've never experienced that.
@@52thephotoshop I think you should take the statement that bambu is reliable with a grain of salt. This can only be said when the Bambu has been on the market for 1.5 - 2 years. Because if something works for the first few months, it doesn't mean that it will always work. Besides, I have heard of the exact opposite as far as that is concerned. You can be lucky and the Bambu works or you can just have problems and difficulties. The spread of quality is way too high. With Prusa, it is always consistently high as usual. That's what I appreciate and love about Prusa. And strangely enough, you Bambu owners always let out the same envy.
@@Neo1983m I have multiple X1 and P1P's Bambu are far more established and reliable company then Prusa ever was at this point int here existence. There are already 3rd party parts. The argument that Bambu hasn't been around long enough really is no longer valid. They are not going anywhere soon
I like it. I mean, no more Z level adjusting, the printer does it. Speed much more than doubled, potentially. If I hadn't already gotten a Revo, the nozzle system would probably wow me more, but it's a nice system utilizing the older style part. Still need tools, but not a lot of them, so that's progress. The drive gear etc looks great and super reliable. Motors are more precise, so prints should be smoother. All in all, a great evolution of the MK3. Probably the best printer on the market if all you want is a machine that will work when you get it home and reliably print you whatever you tell it to print, without any modifications required.
Ya, once you get a Revo, it's hard to go back to anything that requires tools and more than a few seconds to change a nozzle. And once they come out with the Revo ObXidian, it will be even harder. (pun not intended)
@@ScytheNoire But the Revo has a hugh problem with the thermistors. From smoking hotends to burning extruders, we've seen it all. And the whole thing seems to be a design problem. I don't want my hotend to always the printer shows at least a 10 degree difference from reality.
I really like how these guys approach the interview: They know what their machine(s) can do, even though it's (they're) in a higher price bracket than most of the competition. They've got a bunch of improvements, stability, reliability and QC going that they don't even bother bringing up... Just because they take it for granted. They have this thing of "ask me anything, and I will give a straight answer on the fly because I'm soaked through and through with knowledge about these devices. I don't need no prep or scripting" That kind of attitude / mentality speaks volumes!
Thanks, Tom, for a fine video. Your questions were incisive as usual and have helped me make up my mind to upgrade. My Mk3 will become the support machine, still reliable after 1000's of hours work; all the upgrades are done, including Revo, but now's the time for change. Although faster prints are attractive, I still worry about the speed versus structural integrity of printed engineering parts, so I hope the Mk4 exceeds the MK3 in this field.
Absolutely appreciate having a solid workhorse over a speed daemon - thanks for not going down the path of competing on speed as the most important selling point...
I'm very interested to see what the input shaper can do for print quality. Pretty much the only gripes I have with my mk3 in terms of print quality is the occasional messy first layer and the slight ghosting on parts. Looks like the mk4 addresses both, so looks like it's time to grow another kidney.
You going to upgrade or go for a new one? A new one is only US$220 more than a full 4 upgrade(which you’d need to get the new motors) but then you don’t have your old printer after. I think it’s worth it to spend a bit extra and not have to get rid of your old printer.
@@jaredf6205 I'm planning to get a new one, but that's at least a couple month away. I want to make my own little print on demand business, so multiple printers is the way to go anyway in that regard.
@@Neo1983m I meant that the kit is cheaper because you assemble it, compared to the built version. Price won't change until a new machine is announced, as you already said!
By accident I used a Prusa MK4 profile for a print on my Artillery Genius printer, because I wanted to try the Prusa slicer, instead of Cura. It reduced print time more than 1/3 with same layer height and infill, and the print came out fine. At the second print I realized that I was using the wrong profile, but I tried again with good result. So - Prusa MK4 profiles makes quick and good print on Artillery Genius 🙂
@Broski Snowski the motors are from Trinamic, we use this a lot in our automation products. They have excellent performance and features, I dont think there is an equivalent Chinese make for this motor
I have a lot of respect for the goal of reliability over max performance. I hope one day to own a 3d printer which is as boring to use as my regular paper+ink printer.
@@Validole Hahaha you are right. Maybe I should have said 'laser printer'. The one I have has been smashing out prints without fault for over a decade. Maybe i got lucky.
6:37 As for input shaping, I'm extremely skeptical and it seems to me that they put that in on short notice. Unfortunately, you can't calibrate input shaping in general, as you want people to know in the video, because it varies from printer to printer, depends on the current belt tension and the location of the printer. Especially since the mass of the Y-axis changes constantly with a bed slinger. And because Prusa doesn't send an acceleration sensor with the printer, it unfortunately makes the impression that they only decided to include it shortly before the release. I would be glad if someone could explain to me exactly how Prusa wants to implement this with Input Shaping.
I think there is a connector for a accelerometer on the board. My guess is that it will come with a default profile and the option to recalibrate yourself with a accelerometer sold separately.
The variation from one printer to another should be close to zero if you don't change the moving parts. The belt tension can vary but the printer can estimate it by measuring the current passing in the motors, this is already on the MK3. So I imagine that the input shaping can be tuned automatically with these values. And there is an accelerometer port on the bord for advanced users to calibrate more precisely their printers
@@twanheijkoop6753 I hope so. Yes, there is an accelerator connector on the board. But why they dont give one with the printer or dont assemble one in the Hotend like the XL? In my opinion, Input Shaper was an very late decision.
@@bastienx8 But the belt tension is not the only thing. The Place where the printer stands, the feets and underground and some more things. It all makes a huge difference. I think the port is only there because its the same port as the XL has. And the XL has an accelerator on the hotend. You just need to ask experienced users who know about input shaping. They will all tell you the same thing, namely that it has to be adjusted individually for each printer.Nevertheless I am looking forward to my MK4 🥰
Excellent questions! I really appreciate everyone involved in the interviews taking the time to give such excellent answers and descriptions of the new Mk.4! Very well done =-D
Had my Mk3S+ for 5 years, and it prints great, very slowly. My life became much better when I threw my MMU2 in the trash and paired it with a Mosaic Palette 2S Pro. With a well tuned extruder, this is a match made in 3D heaven. As an engineer myself, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing my name was on such a piece of junk as the MMU2. Couldn't hold out any longer, and got a Bambu Labs P1P. This thing is amazing. Light years ahead of anything else out there. Prusa obviously did not see this coming, and it shows. The one thing I never had an issue with was first layer consistency. They have doubled down on that, and for whatever reason have chosen to stay with outdated Mendel technology, outdated motor drivers, and an unacceptably small build volume. Their cult following will keep them afloat, and I honestly hope they are able to fulfill the promises of the XL. I have a business to run, so can't afford to waste resources on outdated technology, but will be watching to see how this unwinds. Will be an interesting year for sure.
I appreciate that the new heater block design takes a page from the E3D Volcano. Hot-tightening the old V6 _and_ worrying about where to grasp the 200+ degree heater block so I don't break wires was not fun, and it's why I ended up with a leaky block and later an upgrade to a Revo hotend. It would be super nice if either Prusa or E3D come up with an adapter to Revo nozzle-breaks and hotends, but given the different location and size of the threads, I would be fine with just using the stock system and the V6 adapter. As someone who has 3 printers with touchscreens... PLEASE DO NOT USE A TOUCH SCREEN. If there's expansion capability for the mainboard, might I suggest things like a camera input and a few headers for things like LEDs? Even though a couple of the printers in the office are cloud-only, I kinda want to see a Prusa solution where you install the management software for Prusa Connect on a server in the office, then that manages the printer fleet connected on the LAN. This is one of those situations where Prusa can charge some serious money, I'm thinking that if you're running an active print farm, you probably have the money to invest in something that will save time and manpower.
Glad you provided real information about the MK4 instead of the (PDT) speculations but I wanted more information about the MMU3 ... I stopped using MMU2 not because it was unreliable but it was to loud in my studio appartement so I am looking forward to any review of that and if it is as silent as the printer
Same here, for me there was a reliability aspect as well though as the blades kept misaligning and sometimes I would need 4 or 5 cycles to load, which is a little much imo BC, as you know, MMU2s homing is LOUD :) looking forward to the new kit and for about 100€ it's an alright upgrade and I hope prusa adds the feature to either select the colours on print start or confirm the slicer selection. :)
What?????? unreliable from Joe Prusa!!!!..... WTF! i don't believe you ! it must have been some thing you were doing wrong, Lets get Tom to ask Joe i'm sure he will sort this out next time he chats with him :)
Already ordered one. If you look into the speed of some of the machines that are claiming more speed, the part quality is not there. Excited to see this new machine in action.
Nice video man, really cool to see them talk about it and seem excited. I am not a Prusa fanboi as I think they are just overpriced for what they are but I really like the new leveling system they showed and they are mostly reliable! I still think this was made as a stop-gap because of the XL having so many delays and problems they wanted to make people see they are still working on projects and not giving up. I started laughing as the little jab he made about the 3d printer landscape would be a different ballgame if all the manufacturers used their own printers to print their printers parts :) He is right about that. I used to work in an injection molding plant and from a cost standpoint they can be more cost effective when you have a FINAL design AND you are going to run that part millions of times. Machines are expensive, molds are expensive, maintenance is expensive but the pellets are cheap. I would love to see Prusa tackle the pellet feeders for 3d printers but I imagine the cost of the machine would outweigh the savings on plastic.
Now that i know that Bambu's prices are without VAT i am definitely going to order a MK4 Kit! - Between the Kit and the P1P is nearly no price difference and the MMU is a bit cheaper then Bambu's AMS, thus together the price is nearly the same. The only downside is the missing Filament enclosure but thats fine for me.
@@dggcreations In my case the P1P costs 659€ without Vat (im Germany). Adding the 19% Vat and 10€ shipping I have to pay about 800€. Prusa includes all those things directly but it's still 880€ for the kit. So 80€ more expensive. For me the difference is low enough that I would buy a Mk4 Kit. But a other competitor joined the game recently. It's Creality with the K1 which costs 659€ including Vat and shipping. Therefore I think i am going to wait until May when the first people can try the K1 out. If the K1 is good I think I am going to safe the 220€ and by that printer. But we will see
I love when Prusa innovates, because we, the other 85% who don't live in first world countries eventually get better parts for our "normal" printers that didn't cost 1 year's worth minimum wage, like a Prusa does.
I'm not sure what they actually innovated part wise... but i sympathise with you not being in a 1st world country.... Maybe Joe should donate all the old mk3 printers when he upgrades them to Mk4 ... that would really show what a cool guy he really is :D
Personal opinion.. own a MK3S+ and it’s one of my goto printers. Kind of opposed to an ‘upgrade’ so I’d have parts laying about so more than likely I’d shoot for a full kit. That being said at the end of the day it will always come down to availability. Don’t want to wait 2 months to two years for something I am needing for projects
There HAS to be a limiting speed for 'bed slinger' type printers that have to move a heavy print object on the bed. For small parts, these speed up technologies are great, but for larger objects, no "i3" style 'bed slinger' will ever print as fast as a 'core -xy' style printer with the bed only moving in the Z direction.
That's why the whole input shaping thing is a bit of a farce..... input shaped from the factory once and that's it. Still trying to get my head around the "millions" of hours of testing.................
The Prusa has never been about speed but always about reliability. Please understand that. Look at the new video from CNC-Kitchen about the speed of the Bambu. There it is well clear that too fast printing makes the parts weaker and the quality suffers enormously. Yes, even with the Bambu.
@@Neo1983m No argument there! However Prusa did claim BOTH increased reliability and speed with this new model. All I'm saying is that they may have reached the limit of speed improvement with their 'I3' style printers, but no doubt will continue to improve their reliability. Still, if you need faster prints, you may have to run more printers in parallel rather than get faster printers. Which is why I still maintain that LARGE SCALE production should abandon 3D printing and use injection molded parts. Where that crossover point in scale is, depends on what you are making.
Actually quite interested in the mk3 to mk4 upgrade path. I own two Prusa MK3 printers (A launch MK3 upgraded to S+ and a purchased MK3S+ years later) and they are going strong, but funny enough I find my MK3S+ I bought doesn't print as well as I want (weird artifacts when the printer gets near the top of the print Z range). Rather then selling it and buying a new printer the MK4 upgrade may be perfect for it, and really not too expensive for what one gets as I was thinking most of the replaced parts are causing the issue. I can save the parts for my original MK3 (which is a rock solid workhorse) and experiment with my second one, but also staying in the Prusa ecosystem.
I can understand why people would think it would be better for Prusa to not 3D print the parts for there printers but I can see for there research and development it will help Prusa in the long run make better 3D printers.
I believe the new hotend is the way to go. I love that Prusa has made it so that standard V6 nozzles can still be used. This keeps the maintenance cost down. To me this is something that the Revo has missed the mark on.
This upgrade was desperately needed. The MK3 was rather outdated and overpriced in the current market. The MK4 is now far closer in terms of value proposition to the Bambu printers than most other printers on the market except maybe a Voron. Hopefully the MMU3 is just as good and reliable as the AMS. Competition is great, there are a bunch of new cool features, some of which I also wish that my X1CC had like for example the auto loading of filament, though when I reached out to Bambu a few questions, some related to such a feature a few months ago, they informed me that they were working on a similar feature. If I were to get a third printer (also have a broken E3V2Neo), choosing between the the P1P, MK4 and X1C(C) would be much harder, though I think I’d probably go with another X1CC or a P1P if I wanted to save some money. I think the X1C(C) and P1P still win in terms of bang for your buck, unless you very very highly value open source, and complete user serviceability, modifications, and upgradability with first party components and instructions. If it is truly as silent as shown in the showcase video then that is very impressive, the bambu printers are LOUD
Indeed the Bambu printers look sweet, but not being open source makes it a hard no from me. Also, for me, tinkering and modifying are the best parts of the hobby, so a Voron kit is more suitable (for me) at that price.
Best 3D printer company ever!! At lest when we look at consumer 3D printers, they cannot compete with professional machines that cost 5 thousand or more euros, but in the class of acceptable prices, Prusa is an invincible king! ❤
What an excellent video Tom. Thank you very much for putting it together. And thanks to Joseph and (I don't know his name) for taking time out of their busy schedules for participating.
03:01 did you cut out the bit where the electrical connectors of the nozzle swap were disconnected? I have not been able to find a video documenting full process of the nozzle swap. all of the videos I have seen so far exclude the process of disconnecting the electrical connectors.
There's a clip in the video that shows the nozzle removal without also removing the rest of the hotend - which you can do and is officially supported. Basically, you undo the two thumbscrews on the side and loosen the nozzle from the heater block, then simply pull it out and insert the new one.
It dosn't compare it wasn't made to compare (you heard Joe) it wasn't built to compete with the X1C , you don't bring a zucchini to a knife fight.... it was made to compete with the Mk3 which it does and wins! hands down. It was produced to get MK2/Mk3 owners to upgrade to Mk4... Which it obviously does extremely well too.
@@dggcreations No offence pls...I don't see it that way.....The ppl who buy machines like Bambu's think different to those who buy Prusa... red blue left right "lets go branden" swj's etc. You see it here.. a microcosm that's representative of the real world. Sure Prusa may have looked @ the features of other printers.. not just bambu but everyone. Taken those ideas and put them into the Mk4 (Joes been doing this since the Mendel)but they know the person who buys a creality a Bambu lab a voron a ratrig ...90% of those ppl are not going to buy a Prusa and vice versa. What they are banking on is the core supporters. When you pitch this to a board what's your guarantee of sales for the expenditure. Your core audience. You always bank on your core. And they will wait patiently.
@@Defyant123 I don't understand this blind brand loyalty, its a company, it doesn't care about any of you really. but thats beside the point, why buy a printer with a name when you are getting inferior tech for the same price. Speed is not the end all be all but like do none of you value your own time? I find I can get through projects faster when I'm not waiting overnight for a part that could be done in half the time.
I couldn’t tell where prusa would go as far as improving the mk3s but these changes look really amazing. I was already very happy with my printer. On another note. What went wrong with the audio in this video? Lots of strange cuts and noise
1:15 Oh my... so this is exactly the issue I was thinking about, since I don't see a wiper like on the Bambu, I was wondering how it was going to clean the nozzle tip prior to using it for probing. And now we see it, dripping filament as it tries to probe the bed. That can't be very accurate, right?
It does a small wipe action as it reaches the bed, so spreading any small amount of ooze before measuring; it also repeats probing at that point if it senses an anomoly until it gets a stable result. A slight retraction may occur to reduce hotend pressure too, but that was not mentioned in the release video.
@@Mike01Hu I guess given the backwards compatibility (in order for ease of upgradability) requirements for this printer made it hard to solve this in a new way. I tried adding a scrub brush idea from some models off printables, but never really got it to work. We will have to see how well this works in reality. Especially when you end up using stringy/drippy filaments like PETG.
@shenqiangshou I have used both brush and blade wipers, without great improvements being achieved. With them, I found more issues of filament accumulation around the nozzle and wear of the full-nozzle silicon socks. I use PETG most of the time, with minor excursions to XT-CF20 (Amphora based) and ASA. Most of my PETG printing is with transparent filament to avoid changes in structural integrity due to colour fillers.
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Cant wait for a video to compare MK4 vs. Trodon 2.0 vs Bambulab X1
What few people think about: this type of kinematics (bedslinger) is not suitable for really fast printing. The bed gets heavier as the printing progresses and therefore the basic frequency changes because of the changed mass, which the input shaping cannot follow because it is fixed. Besides, moving tall but thin objects quickly can easily detach them and you can only print them slowly. This is why core XY kinematics is spreading. There the print head is always the same mass and the table doesn't move sideways, it just moves slowly (in Voron 2.4 it's completely fixed and it's the best). It is now an obsolete printer and expensive. Only those who have an even older Prusa printer admire it, it is better than that, but it is not enough...
Nice job, Thomas. I have been waiting for a video from you before making a decision . Your insights are very welcome. Questions I wanted answered you covered thank you for your efforts.
Thomas, you left one thing that you did not show us. Where is the MK4 that you took for yourself from Prague??? 😊 thank you for the quite informative video! Well done as always! 👍🏼
Sounds like they've made a lot of improvements but.... that's the same price as the X1C and looks like a lot less printer for the money. Not gonna beat'em up to bad as this was likely in development long before the Bambu Labs printers were out, but the older printer companies have really got to step up their game.
This! I'd been holding out for a Mk4, but it feels a year or more too late, the Bambu X1C has a lot more functionality for the same price (less if you consider the enclosure etc)
It's the same size meltzone and similar geometry, so it kinda makes sense that it would perform similarly. However, they are working on high-flow options and there's nothing that's keeping you from throwing a Volcano on there if you need it.
@@CanuckCreator True. Though I was mainly getting at the fact that I don't know how to model up mods like that so I'll be reliant on waiting for someone else to make the mod lol
WiFi is easy to setup on the MK4... You should be able to input the SID/password on the new interface, but you do need to edit 2 lines in the ini file... The interface walks you through step by step...
Joseph said it well. Users want a reliable workhorse as a printer. I bought a mini+ in January and am having a ball. I knew that I wanted a larger printer but was not sure if I should make the jump to a different brand. I ordered a Mark 4 2 days after the release with full confidence.
I don’t own a prusa. But lulzbot I do own and they were very large in supporting the ability to i upgrade there printers. I went from a lulzbot taz 4 and built it up to a taz 6, and when the lulzbot taz pro released in which was a complete re design now allowing me to upgrade. Lulzbot came through with a buy back system at a reasonable price to allow me to purchase the taz pro, prusa has a grade system going and maybe one day when they completely change the design they can too offer a buy back program. At some point I’ll own a prusa product, just waiting to see the XL in action.
@30:55 he has a point.. If you are marketing the printer a tool to make things (not just art) why not use them to print things for the printer itself..
So if creality start printing all the important parts you would buy one? Because that is my point.... we all do print our own parts.... it's called the community modding scene... check it out some time. Theres nothing special about it......
Looks good, I like Prusa, but for me using a 3D printer as a tool to prototype engineering components I need a dual nozzle system, dissolvable supports are a necessity. I originally had an Ultimaker 2+ and tried breaking parts down, putting dowels and location holes in, it worked but takes too much time, it becomes a hobby. Now I’ve an ultimaker 3 and 5, they seem to work. If Prusa had a duel nozzle system I’d be temped to get one.
Honestly I thought this too but then I took the time to tune regular supports and ever since I haven’t had to buy a roll of pva since for my x-max but then again my prototypes may differ from yours Although I have noticed when designing blowers and stuff for diy printers I still may need the pva it all just depends on end use but for my astrophotography products I have been able to avoid Having to use pva and In return all my stuff is printed on my vorons now
Thats the reason why i bougth mein Prusa´s. I am in the EU and pay my Taxes. I must pay my employes also. So i bougth from a Company in the EU there have the Production and think work also here! I am not intredest in cheap Maschines and i dont want to let my Data outside the EU! So Prusa you make my live easyer! Your Video was nice :D Tank you for your good Questions!
Just remember. Prusa has been in the printing game for 11 yrs and this is the best they can do in 2023 when the competition not only under cut them in price but crushed them in features. Sovol SV06+ is 3rd the cost and open source(larger bed, similar speeds and with a sonic pad gets even more features) Bambu is similar price but waaay more value for the feature set(too many to list) flsun V400 is faster with larger build volume This is the best the could come up with. The emperor has no clothes. You all are too afraid to say anything.
Didn't answer all the questions. There was the question about why there was no accelerometer even though there's a connection for it. And how having a different mass nozzle will affect the quality since there is no accelerometer. Finally, will they come out with an accelerometer upgrade and if not can it be fitted with any specific accelerometer?
So why didn't they use die cast metal parts for the rest of the machine, not just the bed? It would be MUCH stiffer that way. I feel PRUSA just cheaped out on this.
I will say that. For a buy and use Option, prusa might be the best even compared to more Professional Printers. It prints without much manual Intervention, it basically just works. But: its not fast, its just not, its still a bedslinger, Single extruder, no enclosure. Its still a thing thats best for pla, petg and simelar easy filaments. Prusa xl is one i really like, if it would have a enclosure. - i might say its ideal then (at least as far as it as closed source can get, would love a open toolhead Design like the discontinued e3d toolchanger). For me as a hobbyist which likes tinkering and just wants to Print Abs, Asa, PC etc which is not like "x can Print on open frame cause special mixture but cannot stand over 80° Temperature" a voron might be the best Option currently. If the prusa xl would have a enclosure, we would use one at work in exchange to the extremely annoying raise 3d e2 we currently use.
the conversion kits are pretty expensive if you want to upgrade the mk3s to mk4 which beats the purpose of the kit, u can just buy the mk4 for that money....
They are aware of that. The upgrade is only offered because people demanded it so much for the previous versions. There's nothing forcing you to buy it, just pay a bit more and get the full thing and sell your old one.
@@LordCreo I don’t know about that. Let’s wait for the reviews. I have made some very unpleasant experiences with Bambu Lab support so far, while Prusa was excellent at all times. Bambu Lab asked me to photograph a package, which I wanted to return so they can see it is unopened and I am „eligible for return“. However in the EU you can return basically anything in any packaging within 14 days after delivery without reason. The package was unopened by the way, but I felt affronted by their immediate mistrust. Just one example out of many, that lets me chose the Prusa mindset over the Bambu Lab. There is but one thing the Bambu has, which all others lack: speed.
@@SilverxXCrown "But one thing", And a Lidar sensor for first layer monitoring and dual bed leveling, built in camera, spaghetti detection, automatic nozzle cleaning, accelerometers for vibration measurement and compensation, built in carbon filters, heated enclosure, belt tension monitoring and auto tensioning, filament odometer, the list goes on and on. As I said, I haven't yet made my choice, but don't pretend that the prusa is not way way behind where it should be tech wise now, the MK4 should have been out 3 years ago, and on a straight tech level it doesn't compete.
@@LordCreo Lidar sensor is a gimmick and makes no noticeable difference, P1P proves this. 1st layer inspection is also a gimmick and everyone just disables it to save time. The built in camera is terrible and you can't change it, since everything is proprietary. You can add whatever camera you want to a prusa though. Spaghetti detection doesn't work 90% of the time and sometimes actually messes things up on its own. X1 doesn't have an active heated enclosure, you still cant print exotic materials on them without warping. Prusas don't need belt tension monitoring as they use high quality gates belts that don't stretch. I have 10k hrs on my oldest MK3 and I've never touched the belts. Prusa also has a "filament odometer, along with total days printing. Here are some unpopular facts about bambu lab printers, their motion system is 100% non serviceable (bambu labs own words). The rods are epoxied in place and there is no way to get replacement rods and bushings/bearings. When the graphite bushings inevitably wear out, you cant service them, you have to send the printer back overseas to bambu labs for repair, again, their own words. Bambu lab is also having serious QC problems regarding warped beds, and they have stated that warped beds are normal on their priners, which they are not, it's not normal on any printer. When they send you a replacement bed, it ends up being warped too. Their customer service is abysmal and they try to void your warranty if you throw out the original box, which legally they can't do. If you have a bad printer and want a replacement, but threw out the old box, they try to sell you a new box for like $40. If you don't do that, they want another deposit on a 2nd printer while they send you a replacement, then they will "refund" the deposit when the 1st printer comes back. Legally they can't do this, and people have gotten attorneys involved. I had to file a charge back just to get my money back on my busted P1P TL;DR--- Just go with a prusa, avoid all the bullshit and headaches.
@@LordCreo Make your own choice. If you want to support a Chinese company for what they deliver, then feel free. I know for sure that my next 3D printer will be a Prusa again after Bambu Lab disappointed me so often.
I'm sitting with a MK2.something; it's so tempting to go for the MK4. It seems like this takes care of all the little things that still go wrong on every printer on the market. Like there will still be a few wear parts; cables, nozzles, bearings, and belt stretch. And there will still be minor adhesion issues. But considering how little maintenance my 2's needed, the MK4 should be reliable in the extreme. As someone with an MK2 that's got the bed and extruder of a 3...I don't think upgrading is worth exploring for anything older than an MK3. At that point, I'd be keeping just the allthread frame and psu. If it's got a new board, motors, extruder, display, cables....well lets just say it'd be like I built an MK4 on an MK2's frame. Which is retro, and could work...but its keeping one of the cheapest parts of the MK2 that I won't miss. It's absolutely better to just buy a kit and have two functional printers. I could sell the old one for more than the cost difference. As for use: yeah, what people really want is a 'set it and forget it' workhorse. The extra speed is big, for both home and business use...but in each case, the less time spent maintaining the machine is definitely why I've recommended Prusa's to my prior two employers and why I've purchased two myself.
That this is locally manufactured and sourced in the Czech republic isnt really an argument for international buyers, but I agree to all of his other arguments why the Prusa is better and more expensive than another printer. They will feel the deserved hype around Bambu and other companies that can offer a lower price for more integrated printers
I think my biggest issue really comes down to…..if I want a printer that just works….I’m gonna get a Bambulab, but of course…closed source, annoying. So if I had to choose after that……I’d prolly just get a Voron kit. Especially as there are voron kits out there that are in the $800-$900 range that have pretty much all the features of the Bambulab like nozzle cleaning and have a fully enclosed environment. Especially for me in my apartment where size is really and I can’t always kick my animals out of the room, any printer that isn’t an enclosed core-XY isn’t making the cut.
Great video!! I'm very tempted to upgrade. I wonder if they are going to bring out a smaller Core XY though, the way Josef Prusa said they were going to experiment with other models made me think they might...
Yeah, they way he said this mk4 was going to be a workhorse and they may experiment really makes me think they already have some vorons in their lab and are considering a proper voron competitor...
I like the nextruder. It seems a really good solution. Sadly i dont really have space for another printer and the mini still works really well. So, i wont scrap it any time soon. Nextruder for mini would be really cool.
Hi, Try your hands in Indian market. There is a great scope. Young people are taking interest in the new technologies coming out. There is a great scope. The only thing which might come as huddle is the price.
Im waiting for this update a very long time. But now its too late. I own a bambu x1c now and its great. My MK3s (updated) is not in use any more. I will get the xl. But i think there is no argument for a mk4 (at this pricepoint) any more.
A deciding factor for me would be the sound level. A big selling point of Prusa is that it's a very quiet machine. As someone who has both- how does the X1C compare to the prusa in terms of volume? I'm trying to decide on next printer in the next few months.
@@theodoreburns1330 Yes, thats a good point. The Prusa is very silent, there is no comparison in volume to the X1C. Its very loud. X1C is very fast, super quality but loud. At the moment the X1C is in anouter room
