Margi is such a sweet heartwarming person. I feel hugged by a mother everytime she speaks. She's so bright and intelligent in her inputs as well. I just love it.
Shaye, I think that you have absolutely NOT disappointed God; in fact, I think the 'calling' you were waiting for, is THIS, what you're doing now. Transitioning because that's what you need to do but also SHARING YOUR STORY so frankly; you are going to save SO MANY lives. What a blessing you are!
This has been a blessing to me on several levels. My religious restraint was evangelicalism but many of the issues are the same. I knew I was a girl in a boy's body at age three. Sadly, I had to hide my identity in order to survive socially. I finally began living full-time as a woman at age 57, after my parents had died, my kids had grown up and most of my family and Christian social circle had already left me. I have many regrets. Amanda is amazing. I can't even imagine a life with a partner who affirmed me like she does. Thank you.
Your joy comes thru the beautiful smile in your gorgeous photo! I admire you and all who take what must be frightening steps to live as their true selves.
There are many gay communities in Utah from all walks of life. I was visiting Salt Lake and was amazed that they were so open in public. I also learned that they also organize frequent get togethers and i attended myself. Wonderful to see.
I love what Margi said around 2:04:35 about hoping Shaye is feeling more at home. What a beautiful way to put it. I’ve never realised what a privilege I’ve had feeling at home in my body.
What a beautiful love story. ❤ thank you both for this I have 7 year old son who is diagnosed with gender dysphoria and autism. They have gorgeous long hair an have a bright pink and purple bedroom 100’s of unicorn plushies and a dress-up box full of there favourite Princess’s Such happy child that loves their life yet I'm so fearful for the future I hope they find love like you two have ❤🌈
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I am a mother of a late onset Trans Woman who is just the most incredible human being. I do wish I could experience gender disphoria and also wish that everyone could for just a day even. I ache for my child who felt confused and as an active Mormon mother I had no lexicon to help me see her. I am no longer active. And I'm happy living a life where I feel more fully able to love and honor and be grateful for trans people and the variety and beauty they bring to my once black and white world. Nature will always diversify, in every aspect. Creation will seek to express and explore and it is all good, beauty and truth.
it's confusing to me how i/others- 🏳🌈 fit in to the religion/doctrine ( yes i still see/LDS-church male gay or predatory sexual activity as a sin ( as is rape-ect a federal crime and should be enforced as im not for predators ) but legally gay's/LGBTQIA+ there in the right in the USA 🇺🇸 and should stay that way! bi&lesbian isn't a sin under marriage to at least one man/male-role ) of the christen faith let alone the LDS faithfulness but for now id rather not leave my beliefs as a scientific-minded and LDS trans/intersexual in a forced male-role/phalloplasty-ect from 4yo-now and not really sure about changing to female/getting my old parts back, like shaye is/mindset as i just spent the last 20-35 years/millennial-generation learning to love myself as is in a husband-role/consequences of my mother-ect actions and forgetting/forgiveness ect
She seems like she's loving being his Pigmalione. She's found her purpose in life. She needs to lead. All I see is a lot of egotistical issues. He has disphoria, she's like his mother.
1:00:00 - Shaye shares his deepest fear with Amanda and I LOVE Amanda's reaction. She's completely selfless and asks if he "needs to transition". So sweet. 💞🌈
@@Mittenmarket I don’t know for sure but I think it’s bc he was told when he was young that he will be one of the highest spiritual leaders and he doesn’t feel that he’s on that path. But I don’t know for sure
WOW! Just wow! Thank you so much for sharing. I learned so much and I see you both! And to John, having Margi with you as cohost on episodes like this one is so valuable and enriching.
I’ve followed their RU-vid channel for years and saw their “coming out” video! I’m so glad they made their way over here. I look forward to their story
Controlling religions are so unnecessary, you two are Gods blessing. Being baptized Mormon, I started studying ONLY the Bible, eventually I was Saved By Grace, released me from all pressure and questionabl teachings. God is Love and a forgiving God . Thank you Shaye and Amanda.
I love these people. After watching, I told my daughter about the episode and reinforced that I love her just the way she is and told her to never allow anyone to tell her who to be. She’s 9. I’m going to tell her this at least once a week so it will become “indoctrinated “ into her.
What a power couple. They’re both so educated and respectful towards the LDS faith, but with a healthy dose of skepticism towards church leadership and doctrine. Amanda is so intellectual, loving, and supportive to Shaye, and thank you Shaye for sharing your story!!!
What an absolutely beautiful interview. I am so happy to see Shay and Amanda supporting each other so wonderfully. Amanda, i feel the exact same as you - you love the person ❤
I'm always late to the story, but what a great story! I love The Piano Guys! You two embody love. It's really beautiful! And it's eye opening to see the humanity behind this struggle. Amanda's love for Shaye 'the person,' is inspiring! They should really make a movie based on your story! What a great thing Mormon Stories is for the human beings who travel through this space, those who tell their story and those who listen. John has carried the 'burden' of this dream for so long, through so many heart wrenching moments of his own. There are times, I'm sure, when faced with extreme criticism for perceived, made up, or real mistakes he's made, he thought he should give up. His story is woven throughout all of these stories he holdis a space for. It must feel like war to him at times. Yet he continues. One thing is for sure, John's heart is totally invested in these moments right here. And it wouldn't be the same without him. It wouldn't be as good. It's his gift of love to the world. I see his story almost as it's own Mormon Story playing out here and behind the scenes, and what a beautiful story it must be! As he makes space for amazing stories like this, and lives his own story all around it, one thing is for sure, he deserves the compassion and space for being himself and finding himself and making mistakes and growing, that he gives to those who pass through Mormon Stories. And Margi, beautiful, caring, light-up the room, Margi. I've sat next to her on a couch at a retreat and spoken with her about myself, and listened to her teach a group of people. I'll never forget her spirit, her essence, her soul that she shares so gracefully. There's nobody who can make you feel more love around them than Margi. It's hard to put in words. Thank you to John and Margi and all who share their stories and offer support so John can keep doing this amazing thing for others, while he is living his own story too.
I've watched at least 3 of the videos and podcasts about shayes gender dysphoria and both of their experiences in the Mormon church. Your story is beautiful! How and when did you guys come out to your families and how did that go? 💜
Wonderful presentation of two beautiful souls, this is just amazing how much I have learned about the Mormon faith. I was raised Catholic, I’ve questioned many things and have concerns with the leaders in our church. I’m not a fan or organized religions anymore but truly believe in Jesus as our God and hope I am being as open to loving others as you guys.
59:09 I told myself when I was 20 that if I wasn’t happy by the time I was 30 that I would transition. I hit 30, I wasn’t any happier, so I transitioned. I’ve been living as a man for 7 years now.
Can Amanda be my wife? I've never been loved unconditionally, although I've done my best to do so.. started this thinking he'd be fascinating. But, i walk away finding her perfect 👌 she IS WHAT Christlike love should look like..
Shaye and Amanda are amazing people. I’ve watched their RU-vid videos from the beginning as well as lots of The Piano Guys. You are both so strong, loving and respectful. I wish you and your family the best as you continue your journey. Also I really have learned a lot watching Morgan Stories…thx John and company!!
Thank you so much for sharing. As a trans man (with a long time partner) who came out in my late 30s I find Shaye and Amanda’s story very relatable. Powerful story and episode to say the least. I wish Shaye and Amanda all the best on their journey. 💙 Thank you John and Margi for your allyship and using your platform to share a story such as Shaye and Amanda’s.
I am glad you two stuck together through this. My ex-husband felt he had to marry someone else in the temple to get to the top layer of heaven. By this time I knew the church was a lie, so they instructed him to get a divorce. It was sad but I have been bless since ..... I am on the right road now.
I'm so glad I live in Vancouver Canada which has a very accepting culture. I have two friends who have trans children and there was so much information and support available to them as to how to best support their children. I can't imagine that it was easy for the children regardless but having supportive parents must have helped.
NON AFFIRMING parenting is the only WAY. They are CHILDREN. What is happening in their school? What and who are they watching online? Are the parents mentally stable.
Actually your question was answered. You learned that the Mormon doctrine isn't safe, at least it's not the truth as you thought it was. When I listen to you guys, I realized how forceful your awakening was, everything came to you so intensely as if you were jolted to consciousness yet you were ready and open. I don't know of anybody who wouldn't be resistant, afraid, consumed by that turbulent chasm yet you decided the foundation of this difficult experience is the conditioning, the false narrative; to deconstruct everything you were thought, unlearn everything to become whole. You guys are blessed to be awaken and supported by the truth. I learned a lot from you as I, myself struggling with feeling of unworthiness as an older Haitian Catholic woman. I thank you all, you are a blessing in disguise.
I only now am realizing that while I do not feel wrong in the body I have, I do not internally identify very much as a man as it has always been presented to me. I love this idea that it does not need to be "one way" when you do not feel at home with certain descriptors
I cried along with Shaye and Amanda when he described telling her that he has gender dysphoria, and she responded by asking if he needed to transition. I was overwhelmed with admiration and awe at Shaye's bravery and vulnerability, and at Amanda's immediate support for him. Two such beautiful people, wow. Shaye, you won't be "the prophet" (oy), but I have no doubt that both of you will continue to do great things, help countless people, and thrive. The ability both of you have to articulate your struggles, deconstruction and reconstruction is so educational. And your children--so lucky to grow up with you as parents! Augh, I'm getting verklempt again. Thank you so much!
I love them. It’s so touching to see their love for eachother. Every time he got emotional she’d reach over and grab his hand, or rub his back. Such a sweet couple
@@Mittenmarket The 'pulling away' or what you think is pulling away could be for a variety of reasons, not all negative so don't put your own spin on it because you can't know.
A million thoughts, barely any words. Thank you for this podcast. Human experience in life is about love. I feel I just took the master class, with this episode.
You are so beautiful, my favorite couple on MS ! Thank you for your bravery and being an inspiration to so many people. I was deeply touched by your story
Just paused and watched Amanda’s version of Rolling in the Deep with the Piano Guys… Amanda!! Your voice is beautiful! Also, Shaye- So inspired by your voice for those who do not fall into the traditional boxes that so many religions want their parishioners to fall in line. They so often do not give room for so many to fit into their version of life and religion! Very emotional and so thankful that with your wife’s support the two of you were able to find a path for you and your family to explore the authentic version of you! ❤
I am a nonbinary, never Mormon, and I just love watching this podcast. This particular interview was amazing! Shaye is so vulnerable, and I am so happy he's able to step into his truth. Amanda! I am so impressed with her knowledge of the queer community, the binary, and internationality. These two are so beautiful and the energy between them is so heartwarming.
AManda and SHaye you are the greatest couple. Shaye you ROCK!! Thank you for helping me understand better - this will help me with my oldest kid. THANK YOU - all four of you. Blessings!
Such a great interview! I really appreciate the Scotts telling their story, they are both such amazing people. I really appreciate Margi's interviewing skills, she is so thoughtful, kind and empathetic.
I'm in my early 40s and can relate so much to Shaye's story. I found such peace when I learned what Non-Binary meant. It fits so much better for me than woman, female.. like Shaye, it wasn't about wanting to be the opposite, it's about not feeling like you are a binary male or female. I have never felt like a girl.. but I also never felt like I wanted to be the opposite. It's been liberating learning about gender expressions and being able to understand my childhood experiences better knowing I was struggling with gender dysphoria.
That Dallin H. Oaks talk from the October 2019 women's session had me crying in the other room of my grandma's house. At the time, I wanted to feel good about being a Mormon, but the church's stance against the LGBTQ community rubbed against my conscience in a painful way.
Shaye you are beautiful! I think its adorable that you think you dont come across as queer just because you've grown up in a community where the men all act similarly lol
I think this is one of the MOST important episodes so far! Loved hearing both stories and can relate so much. It just makes me angry and sad that the norm in not just Mormon culture but society in general is putting people in their stereotypical boxes and making them feel feel like they have to conform or they will be thrown out with the wolves.
I'm so grateful to have you both speaking up for our beautiful trans sons and daughters, sisters and brothers! Lucky for me, I got hooked on a reality series while babysitting my newborn granddaughter, about Jazz Jennings. She was born male and knew as a toddler she was female. Watching her journey taught me a lot so when my granddaughter came out as trans at age 8, there was nothing but unconditional love, acceptance and celebration of his beautiful spirit and bravery. In our family, we see the role of hormones during pregnancy as a likely factor in whether a fetus develops mentally as female or male, regardless of the sex of the body. Maybe this isn't factual, it's just our guess. But it doesn't matter ultimately. We are who we are, we're all worthy of love, and if you're that human being disparaging people you are part of the problem that leads to such a high suicide rate in this population. Please be kind. If you find yourself in a situation with the LGBTQ community and aren't sure how to behave or react, err on the side of love. ETA: I have found so much peace, beauty, love and "heaven" on earth through meditation and allowing myself to just BE. There is so much to be said for allowing yourself to just be alive, to find that inner spaciousness, that inner divine, that inner eternity. The answers are within. "I am" is all I am; everything else is a thought construct which is just so freeing. Thanks again for this! I love hearing people's experiences of leaving behind someone else's thought constructs!
Hormones do play a role in the pregnancy. All male fetus's receive a testosterone washing at 6 weeks to masculine the brain or if a female fetus receives to much testosterone, it will masculine their brain. The mother could have been sick, medications she was taking at the time. Also look up DSD babies too, it was a med given to mothers in the 50's and 60's to prevent miscarriages.
God is love and he completely loves us, I have read for years, but slowly forgot it as I focused on my problems, single, gay and old. I had lost sight of a God who loves me and everyone unconditionally and instead was severely hating myself. Coming out of a serious depression that gave me an understanding why people end it. I believe it was a gift, because it has reset my brain. My battle is to remember and live in God’s love. The enemy of God’s creation wants us to believe God is angry, vindictive and would prefer that we be miserable. Not true because its the language of the fall. (Ann Voskamp) from her book, (One Thousand Gifts), 1. Discontentment, 2. Self Condemnation, 3. Critical eye, 4. Never satisfied. Is the ongoing language of a fallen race. The book, One Thousand Gifts, I found in a free box. 1. through 4. had been my daily mantra and practicing that daily caused me to be closer to suicide than I’ve ever been. I had forgotten to be grateful to and for a loving God, first for my salvation and Christ dying for me to save me from my sins. In the state of depression, I could barely walk or think and was contemplating help, even use psychedelics, but finally arrived at a safe seashore. The book reminded me not to walk ungratefully, open my eyes in his beautiful creation, and what a difference it’s made for me. There is beauty all around for us to see and appreciate and be grateful for, without his condemnation or mine. My sick brain is healing and grateful that I can lift my head, and see again. I look for reminders that He’s with me daily and glad to be aware of the ungrateful gorilla that is angry because his life isn’t normal. Thank you Shaye and Amanda, your honesty and coming forward to share your journey with all of us is awe inspiring.
God loves us and is also a holy. People tend to either view him as lovey-dovey and weak or angry and unable to be pleased. God is a balance that wants us to all come to him and makes a way to do this through Jesus despite all of our sins.
Thought question for anyone who watched: What does a loving God who has "healthy boundaries" look like? I think that would be a great "on the street" question.
Some people may love us for who they want us to be. But also, some people love us for who they understand us to be. I'm very glad to see the love between Amanda and Shaye. The judgment of "others" happens only in their heads. Don't make the mistake to identify with it and them. Even they stumble through life as well as possible.
@@mormonstories You're welcome! I can't believe how quickly those hours flew-you know it's good content when you are finished but still want to hear more!
The part where Shaye talked about standing up in church and saying you shouldn't attend gay weddings, but the Bishop disagreeing was very surprising but also very moving, really shows how things aren't just black and white even within the church
"What do I know at all about anything I perceived?" That was perfectly said to describe a paradigm shift in perception when it occurs suddenly. Thank you Amanda.😊❤
While I’ve never been Mormon, as a queer person who grew up in a fundamentalist community, I relate a lot to both Amanda and Shaye, but Shaye especially. Especially the feeling of being unnecessarily cruel or stubborn about queer issues because of internalized hatred is something I’ve had to struggle with too, knowing I’ve said hurtful things because of the fear that validating them would mean accepting I’m queer too. I’m especially happy that Shaye, despite still presenting as man and using he/him as of this point, is still trans, is still trans supportive, and is still part of the community, because that’s still his community in many ways. Sadly it’s really common for people who experience dysphoria and got over it, who detransitioned, or who otherwise don’t feel right away the need to medically or socially transition, to use that against trans people. As if one person having a certain journey means everyone with dysphoria can easily follow that path. It works against care for all the people who have been or are gender non-conforming, who have gender dysphoria, who have transitioned or thought of transitioning. We’re all hurt by the same systems. I can relate a lot to experiencing dysphoria most of my but not going on to “transitioning” in the traditional way. Funnily enough, even though in some ways I’m closer to the traditional view of trans people than Shaye (I’ve changed my name and go by all pronouns) in other ways I’m less in the traditional view, such as not taking hrt. I’ve come to understand that my gender can’t be put in a box, because like all gender it’s mostly made up. And that’s okay. I can like or dislike whatever about my body. I can like or dislike any hobbies or fashion or pronouns. It doesn’t dictate what box I should be put in. I’m comfortable at this point in my life with being called a woman, despite being trans and afab, because I’ve processed that being a woman or not doesn’t matter or invalidate my feelings of dysphoria and trauma. Just like I can accept and be comfortable with being called a man, or non-binary, because being those doesn’t invalidate the things I enjoy about womanhood or the experiences I’ve had from it. Labels matter to some people, but they don’t have to. For some people a label and a new name and pronouns and medical treatment do a lot, but that isn’t everyone. Transitioning can be helpful for many people, but it doesn’t look the same for everyone. Maybe one day Shaye will go by she/her and identify as a woman, maybe on day I’ll be a hardcore trans man and get top and bottom surgery and hrt. It isn’t a set road. Anyone can be trans, in any way, for any amount of time. What matters is fighting together to make life better for anyone who might experience what we have. (Also side note I’m happy for Shaye getting hrt! Especially in the US it can be hit or miss getting hormones, some places it’s really easy *unless* you’re visibly trans and some places it’s only accessible *if* you’re visibly trans)
I’ve been watching this couple for quite some time and appreciate the openness. I can understand their religious background and the frustrations associated with seeing all the wrong and sinful acts, interpretations, and statements done “in the name of god”, that indeed hurt the church and those outside of the church. I think acceptance and love is what we all want. I know Jesus is all about providing that. At the same time I believe in a will and plan for our lives. I guess for me the hard part is making things about us, instead of about HIM! Are we glorifying God or man with our life!? God IS a jealous God who gave us unconditional love through Jesus , yet we are in constant renovation of our minds to align with the rebirth of our Spirit! What that means to me is that we are constantly denying ourselves for HIS GLORY. I have had to say NO to many things in my life, because I know they don’t align with God’s will. Today, unconditional love has been defined as accept me for who I am and don’t try to change me. The new language is, everyone’s caos brokenness and trauma is ok, don’t judge. i have nothing to fear from this but it really concerns me for future generations. I think identity is everything! And seeing such an evident struggle for identity makes me sad. It seems as if Shaye saw himself as the servant of God but never the son- “I need to “perform” for His approval and others. “ My only fear is that we go down this new “freedom” path, and it turns into a slide at some point. what appears to be clarity and open mindedness , inclusion etc… becomes the very thing that separates us from God. This clearly isn’t eternity- one day we all will pass and be accountable for our actions and decisions. I continue to pray for this family. That their maker reveals His plan and desire for their lives.
Shaye, I see you, and know you without knowing you. You are made perfectly as you are. Amanda, you are amazing and I am proud of who you are. Thank you to the both of you for your story and your help!
Feminine things are important to learn, but I do think I might've had less social anxiety if our yw did try to teach us leadership skills & taught us it was okay to challenge authority. I wonder how yw feel with the new program the church is using.
The thing I never understood is how people in religious groups thought it was their business how someone else lives their life. I get you may think what they choose to do is wrong..that is human nature but to make it your business is completely inappropriate. Their relationship with "heavenly Father" is nobody's business but theirs
He should become catholic. He could talk to the priest and learn the truth. They both seem broken and vulnerable which is understandable, but are still young. They should take their time and think. Not jump into something else which will also have them chained and not free. We all have crosses to bear. Her take on feminism is very culturally influenced. teachers are being taught to think like this, which is why schools accept everything these days. They talk about God and love, but love is truth.
I really appreciate John asking to explain a non traditional trans experience. I'm a trans man who is pretty masculine, and so often some in the trans community try to gate keep what a valid trans experience is. Note on my background: gay trans never Mormon, but came out in an Evangelical world on the path to ministry. Managed to salvage my relationship with Jesus with the love presented. Had a former partner who was an ex Mormon who was outed by their bishop.
This is most definitely my favorite Mormon Stories so far and I think the way this couple expressed themselves and how willing they were to be vulnerable and talk about what needs to have the light shined on it is a gift to so many people they’re going to help. Thank you so much for sharing this interview. I love your channel.
What an incredible story. I so appreciate their vulnerability with sharing something so deeply personal. I admire their strength and hope that they find peace and healing in their journey ahead.
Thank you for an excellent episode. I wish you all the best, Shaye. I will follow your journey with interest and hopes for your family's happiness. And, Amanda, as a fellow English professor, and author of many novels, I LOVED what you said about the value of reading fiction! !
Amanda is killin it, they both are ❤ I appreciate this, the opportunity to learn. I have learned so much here. I wish you two and your family all the best, and look forward to hearing how you are later!
I love this channel. So insightful. I resonate with so much that is being said. My mantra has been unconditional love and live your truth. Thank you to everyone that share. All the best Amanda and Shay 😍
I’m so inspired, thank you all for your vulnerability❤ I really feel like being on this podcast has got to be so therapeutic. To actually be asked what your experience was and why you left. Keep up the great work!
Ok, the bishop at minute 36, I want to vomit. But this is totally part of the taught culture. I’ve heard this kind of comment from men/boys in several circumstances throughout life, and still today. Horrific.
