The tier set's are good, considering we have all these new shiny hero talents and regular talent overhauls to play around with. Having traditional tier sets that pigeon hole you into playing a specific talent build during season 1 would feel really shit.
Would rather have no tier, with no mandatory check box, and the ability to choose secondary stats on my gear. If it doesnt affect the way you play, then its just there to lock 4 of your gear slots for no reason.
@@jackmango5603 They should never remove tier-sets ever again, except maybe for special occasions or end of expansion patches. They did before and most people hated it for good reason.
No, there is no 'playing around and learning'. When will people ever understand that with this game? It doesn't matter how they dress up a talent system, they're all solved before content even starts.
In BFA many spec played the same talents the entire expansion. This is why tier needs to exist. Because it gives the devs an easy way to revive dead talents.
agreed, but this expansion launch is literally every spec has 2 entire sets of changes lol. i think this is fine as it gives time for people to setting in to their characters with all these changes and gives blizzard datas on how well classes are working on their own on a large scale.
our tier buffs two abilities in our entire kit, and one is solely a 5%. Its looking mighty weak once again for another tier, lets just hope that next week's talent update gives us **sommmmmmmething**
I actually kinda like this. The idea that season 1 tier set is simple so the classes new talents (Hero and base) are the things you experiment and play with. Then the next season you can see what the players were playing and build sets more in tune to those ideas.
Instead of calling it a rework you should call it a restructure. The whole idea behind the class at the end of the tree is relatively the same but how you get there is different
I didnt go into the post expecting basic bonuses and went straight to havoc, so I rolled my eyes HARD at first when i read it. Having played it in a few dungeons though, the blade dance reset actually feels really nice and I already want it in s4.
The only complaint i have with it is that, despite the post saying the dont want to push us into 1 hero talent tree or the other, this tier HEAVILY favors aldrachi reaver over fel-scarred
That Mistweaver 4 set doesn't sound bad to me as someone that has played the spec a lot, but would need to check the numbers. Anything that extends Renewing Mist is massively valuable in raid as your healing scales wildly with the amount that you have active, especially during ramps.
@@derpderpin1568you must be blizzards biggest fan if ur spamming people being optimistic, classic "I have no problems thus I need to make my own problems"
@@derpderpin1568 I dont understand your argument. They are gameplay changing things being added to the game. Tier sets add in more complexity when we are just playing with other stuff
"Rework" to me means bringing specs up to par, remaking 'pathing' in the talent trees, and changing talent nodes. "Re-DESIGN" to me is what they did to enhancement in Legion, what they did to warlocks in MoP, what they did to ww monks in Legion. Redesigns in my view change the fundamental core of a class or spec and make it nearly unrecognizable from its previous gameplay flow.
I've gotta be real: I hated the look of the pally set when it was revealed. Now that I've gotten to see it in game on my character, it looks a hell of a lot better & pieces of it will definitely be in my mog rotation.
My Hot Take: The first tier of each expansion SHOULD be bland and almost flat % increases, and while the numbers might be low on these tiers I think they do the right thing. Between expansions there are nearly always a whole bunch of class changes, be it reworks, adding hero talents or what not. Not to mention a lot of people switching mains etc. So the first tier should be playing with all the new toys characters got with the expansion. Then tiers 2 and 3 should be where the devs cook with getting funky, those tiers SHOULD be all about creative ways to change up how specs play the game because by the end of the first tier everyone is "done" with all the new toys, so are more invested in what tier sets change up for their spec.
Some tiers are so bad that some of them might not even be bis, depending on secondary stats. I get that hero talents are the spotlight, but a chance to proc a 5% dmg increase for 6 seconds on a 4pc (Destruction warlock) I might rather more haste or mastery like that's rough. I get that tier is just numbers rn, but they should at least give you a 5% overall passive dmg increase to at least feel like you acquired the tier set. Now its not even noticable.
I’m a monk main. I like Brewmaster’s tier. The windwalker tier seems weak and not fun. And mistweaver plays so well at the moment that simply having a boring tier bonus is fine.
I bet dratnos was turbo right when he said they would go basic tier sets for s1 and ramp over the xpac because so many times people were keeping on previous tier sets in DF because even at lower ilvl they were just way better still.
I think the real reason we get such boring safe tier sets in the first season is that the people making them don't know how the classes are going to play yet. If they made an entire tier set around Decimating Bolt, and then three months later it gets removed from the game now you have to come up with something completely new. Making generic builder/spender bonuses is just the safe bet.
Re: @38:41 Am I missing something, as I just came back to wow a lil bit ago, so maybe they're craftable.... but who has a tier set going into their first dungeons and raids? I mean sure, the mention was "first season", but that's an awful long time to "get used to" your hero powers if that's the case. I feel most people would have that down by the time they got, if they ever get, a tier set. Or maybe loot tables are different than I remember and loot is guaranteed now. What am I missing?
Boring tier sets make alot of sense for balancing, but in all its an absolute mistake since thats what most people look forward to. Gearing is suppose to be fun and something you are excited about.
Tiers should exist but they shouldn't force you to pick certain talents etc imo. They also shouldn't be too powerful. I think they being like 8% of your damage is a good balance. 13-15 is too much and 5 is too little.
20:05 it's been nearly a decade and hunters are still asking for Tier18 back.. they wouldn't even give it back to us as a legendary. it's so comical how fucking awful they mistreat hunters
if tier sets in S1 of tWW are looking that weak, we can only assume all tiers in all seasons will stay this bland. So that in season 4 they all will have equal chance when people vote
The mage arcane 4p is absolutely awful, in ST where it seems we are likely to play big barrage harmony builds the 4p makes it so you dont care about harmony stack and just send proc on cd, and is completely useless in AoE due to how orb barrage works with arcane charges.
even if tuning meant it so that we did hold to 20 harmony stacks for barrage, that would mean that we would ignore 4p proc which is also bad design. Love a good Loss-Loss situation of a turbo ass 4p
Bring back azerite and corruptions, if this is too boring, but if they did that, it'd be too much, where tf is the middle ground? No sht they're boring when we have literal talents that defines classes, no need to bring in tier sets that does X when u do X too, keep it as a stat stick and leave it at that..
I like the idea of tier sets not being super OP - means you actually have a choice whether to hunt tier, or just gear with better stats. Tier being default BiS is kinda boring now that you can get it from anywhere. It made sense when you could only get it from raid, but now that you can get it from a bunch of places, give us a choice.
There's a thin line between "Safe set bonuses to feel out the changes with talents/hero talents" and "we didn't put any work in your shit". Your tier set being indistinguishable from a line in a random tuning hotfix is weird.
Garbage tier sets almost top to bottom once again from Blizz, but it does look like my new Enh Shams might be getting some play. So that might just be fun. Sitting in queue with no one joining my +2 on Day One of Season One is gonna be epic!
People falling on the argument that 'reworks' and hero talents exist are the absolute worst people in this community. There is no 'playing around and learning'. When will people ever understand that with this game? It doesn't matter how they dress up a talent system, they're all solved before content even starts. There's literally nothing new there, you're just gonna play your class ever so slightly differently than before. That's no reason whatsoever to make horrendously awful boring tier sets.
Max with another shit take they explicitly said Tier sets arent supposed to be the game changers. HERO TALENTS are where its at. Honestly they shoudl have removed Tier sets completly that addon.
No, they should never ever remove tier-sets again, except maybe for special occasions or end of expansion patches. They did before for some time and most people hated it for good reason and thats why they brought them back. The tier bonuses not being game changing is no problem at all, its still a class fantasy thing and also is just another sense of progression on top getting new items - completing 2 tiers of bonusses. This is such an L-take to remove tier-sets if they dont change your rotation.
I know I'm late to this party, but it was a major part of this video. Go back to all the tier sets. Blizzard has stayed that the first tier of any expansion will be "non-rotation changing"
They prob made them less impactful to see the effects of hero talents. Plus, it's season 1 so I would think the tier bonuses would get better as the xpac goes on.
