Five BIGGEST MISTAKES I Made Building Little Wicket Model Railway 😩 

Hi Robin, I'm building a model railway based on a junction station on the main line from Brighton to Portsmouth in the 1960's I have noticed that on the real rail that we are all copying one way or another, the Southern Region or later Network Rail do not, or only lightly ballast between the sleepers where the tie-rods are located. In fact 2 or 3 sleepers either side of the tie- rods are normally covered in thick black grease or oil. On my model I decided that early on, due to the very high cost of turnout motors in New Zealand where I live, I would operate all of my turnouts by the wire- in- tube method operated by a simple and cheap DPDT slide switch. My first turnout operating units were located under the baseboards connected to the turnout above by 2 lengths of 25mm wire through the baseboard to the turnout switch blades. Later when I realised that Network Rail do not dig a 6 foot hole under their turnout to operate them, I now operate all of my later installed turnouts with the turnout operating units conveniently located on the top of the baseboard between a pair of sleepers of the turnout.

Even before building my first layout I had it in mind it was a 'Learning Layout'. Having done it, I would advise anyone who is considering a large, complex layout to do the same. Build something small to learn what to do, and more importantly what not to do. For me, 5% is now 2% :) Nice video, thanks for sharing!

The width of baseboards is good tip especially for the senior modeller such as myself!

Very good list. I have the large baseboard issue. My next layout the boards will be 600mm max in width and run round the room with a peninsula into the middle. Mistakes I have made, and that would be all of them... Plywood (here in Australia bought from our mega hardware chain) can be really variable. Chipboard (particle board) is far more consistent. MDF is a disaster if it gets wet, and in a slightly humid environment it swells and goes spongey. I had a lot or unexplained derailments and it was because the plywood undulates. Make sure that the buss cable that is you main power feed is *clearly marked* for polarity. I have cable that has tiny tiny writing on one side of the figure 8 to indicate polarity. Climbing under the baseboard to wire something up and forgetting a torch is a nightmare. This one is a killer for me at my age. Less is more when it comes to point-work. Complex point-work can be a nightmare. I was tempted, and crammed too much in. I think this wold be OK is I wan't using solenoid motors though. Peco products are a rip-off. The points and track are great, but the accessories, point motors / polarity switches / dpdt switches to set the polarity of crossings means that cost adds up fast. I use relays instead on the peco pl-15 twin microswitch. Far cheaper, easier to replace and more reliable. I would junk the lot and go for servos, but it's too late (or is it?) I use cheap $4.00 microswitches super glued onto the peco solenoid point motors instead of their pl-13 switches which aren't great. It took me ages to twig that the whole point mounting eco system from peco is putting Mr Peco's kids through Eaton. Cheap microswitches work really well and are super reliable. Inclines as well, this one is important. The DCC power base isn't great. Some locos hate it. My Hornby Black 5 won't run with the powerful magnets added to the keeper plate. I think it messes with the motor. Bullfrog snot is just PVA in my opinion, and is essentially a really annoying traction tire. I think plan a layout knowing that you don't need it. Rob has covered some of the other major issues. Be careful of battens when planning point work, that one is a killer as well.

Thanks for sharing. My best advice to newcomers building their first layout is keep it simple

Its such a great idea covering your mistakes rather than hiding them, really instructional!

Hello! Dave here. I own Artisan Home Railroads. I build layouts. Your idea of painting the glue in and around the sleepers will work. BUT!!! You will need a small detail brush (like a 3/0 or smaller with stiff bristles) and a lot more time than you spent loosing your turnouts. Get your self a good set of dental picks. When you ballast a turnout sprinkle just enough by the hinge points and brush it down (lightly in the amount) towards the throw bar area. Before you glue (and your gluing method is spot on) use the dental pick to clean between the points and in/and around the throw bar. A 50/50 mix is a little thick but will work. I mix 2 parts water to 1 part glue. Luke warm water helps in the mixing and in the flow of application. If using an eye dropper and/or a pipet try not to let "drip drops" happen. That just splatters your ballast. I could go on and on but so far if this is your first try not bad. Keep at it.

Blocks are typically the length of the longest train you want to run. Looking at your layout, you're probably looking at maybe 3 or 4 blocks at most per loop, assuming you are running an 0-6-0 plus a couple of coaches? Just buy a rotary tool like a Dremel, cut the loop in 3 places and tap into your existing droppers? You don't need to shim in plastic rail joiners, you just need a non-conductive material. Get a tube of silicon transparent caulk and a toothpick, then paint it up when you're done to match your track weathering. You could have blocks on your entire layout in about 20-30 minutes. As for sensors, there are dozens of ways to detect trains without needing to use expensive current sensors, plus they don't work for coaches and freight that don't draw current (you would have to solder resistors to your wheelsets which is a pain). As for gluing points, don't use straight glue, instead use the water and PVA mix on your baseboard, and sprinkle the ballast on it. If you use straight glue, its a lot harder to remove later if you need to. One of the reasons water and pva mix is used is so you can easily remove the ballast later with just water. The problems you are having with the solenoid point motors isn't a problem with the motors themselves, I used dozens of PM-2 motors and H&M motors, the problem is with the Hornby point controller, if you can handle JMRI, you can definitely build your own CDU, use bigger capacitors, and you won't have to wait. Mine take about 2 seconds to recharge, and you can throw points in pairings (I've got some junctions that throw 4 pairs from one CDU that just cost a few quid to build)... :)

I manged to learn of the problems with ballasting points before I started, and the simplest way to do it is lay the ballast dry, then you can removed all ballast from the points, and glue the ballast, being careful around the points. It's interesting to compare my mistakes with yours and others too.

We all learn something with every layout we make. My last layout was FAR too small for the amount of trains that I had, and same as you was hard up against a wall so access was impossible. SEEP point motors are in my opinion the absolute best for simplicity, they just work. Easy to wire up, and if you buy the right ones you dont need to buy an accesory switch that costs extra and glues to the bottom (cough cough peco cough cough). I went down the road of DCC Concepts point decoders and found out that you can fire two point motors at the same time from each decoder output. So if you have facing points or loops you can change both points at the same time with only one decoder.

My tip is invest in electro-frog points. Insulating the exit/entries can be a pain but beats isolated frogs for long running reliability.

The one thing I loathe about model railway "tables" is working under the blo&%y things. So your point 1, spot on. Except I would highly recommend a modular approach and be able to tip up or remove a section to work on comfortably. Point 2, turnout control, electro magnets are as old as the ark and should be banned. We worked out long ago that stall motors with all their contacts and "smarts" were cheaper, kinder, and easier to install than pl 10's etc (and the junk to make them smart). It so happens you were spot on with your 5 points. Well done.

I hear you brother, my biggest mistake was going big, slap down track and find it ain't gonna work. Starting again, but this time, one board at a time. Having said that I read the back of a Peco point packet about where to attach cables etc., and found that one point was at the end of the board just above an outer beam, damn. Then a lightening bolt, I drilled down into the beam for about 15mm, then horizontally across, fed the wires through, and bingo, all is well. A bit of a struggle but I got there. I'd send you a picture but don't know how to attach it.

Thank you for sharing! Your info on 3D printed point motors was really insightful, I will definitely have to try them out!

Great video , very helpful. Some of the mistakes I’ve also made, and have yet to ballast or add inclines so will take your advice . Thanks again.

I mean, even if you're not doing automation, insulated blocks are often advised if you plan on running multiple trains. Especially if you're doing it analog.

I’ve subbed you because of your honesty! 👍 Thank you for your warnings to the rest of us 👍

Thanks For The Tips! Im Currently Planning on Making A Little Layout and This Should help!

Deluxe Ballast Magic is great for points inside of using glue, just mix the powder with ballast apply around the point once its neat and tidy, apply 2-3 sprays of water on top and it sets, really good stuff.

Thank you, some useful tips in there. I'm in the planning stage for my second layout and there are definitely some gotchas in this video that I can identify with. The block occupancy though, thank you. I'm undecided, thinking 'not yet' but I'm a bit of a teccie geek so it's definitely something I'll probably get around to. So since it's going to be a reasonably large layout, and I'm planning on soldering droppers to every track section anyway, I think isolating sections is great advice. Thanks!

Probably the best video series for beginners

Very good and apt. Point 1 access. I considered this very much when building mine in a limited space. In imperial large radius requires 3/ft 4 inches, thus 1 inch or 2.5 cms on each side gives 3ft six inches. This is about Arms reach. 2 covered areas. It does pose problems but I decided that practicality outweighs everything, so there are no covered areas. 3 Gradients probably a bit steep but I chose 1" for every foot. However I can get some rather spectacular double heading. 4 Turntable. I could have had one but very limited space. So I opted for a triangle to the engine sheds. This has turned out very practical. In short I get 3 full circuits with five variations and the fewer points on the back wall. Lastly My last model railway was some forty years ago, but I missed it. So it's made from all the remnants I have stored.

The ones that cost you the most money or the most time...(not to mention the most frustration!!) (1) I had the same kind of problem on my layout, where a set of turnouts were out of reach. After a frustrating number of months I simply redesigned the track plan and put all turnouts within easy reach. It was worth it. Flexibility in your track plan is helpful! (2) I've used manual point control (giant hand action), but am now moving to servos. (3) I haven't got to the point to ballasting track on my current layout. In my prior track laying I found it a frustrating mess so I'm holding off. (4) I have enough room for 2.5 % grade on my layout. I'm lucky to have the room. I find it a pain to build a consistent grade, however. (5) My layout is a one person operation, mostly. No block detection or signals (yet...). A mistake I make is that I read the methods that other modelers use and try to follow them, but they often don't work as well for me. I think the lesson here is that you need to start somewhere, and following the methods of another is a place to start, but you need to realize that one person's methods won't necessarily work for another and you will need to modify, adjust, study, and learn to improve what you are doing to succeed. I hope that makes some sense.

Thanks for this video Rob. I still haven't started laying track ..... or even decided a plan. It was your videos on Arduino DCC and it's associated that has inspired me. Have been hacking away at AnyRail before committing to any woodwork. Keep your videos coming

An excellent video. Hello from the Tracy Mountain Railway in Colorado. 💙 T.E.N.

Thanks for the good tips ... timely since I'm just starting out ...

I think if you can reach the point yourself point motors are pretty useless and an un necessary waste of time when it comes to putting them in and the wiring etc. I certainly won’t have any point motors in accessible places on my layout when I come to build it. Your layout is beautiful. I really enjoy your videos. 👍

Some really great tips. Thank you

It does look like a brilliantly involving layout none the less!

I recognised quite a few of these! :) I'm new to your channel, but am glad I found my way here.

Firstly I congratulate you for making the effort. Checking out others like Charles at Chadwick also a good idea. But going to your own local Model Railway Club or even the local shop is another great reference. Visiting places like the Hornby Shop, its big and the guys there are just as helpful with common and complex problems. Have a think about the space and the placement of your layout it maybe as simple as turning the layout 90 degrees. Finally I like what you've done.

Great video. Have picked up lots of tips from your channel. I am currently into a major rewire of my DCC track feeds to add blocks so I can have JMRI controlled signals and possibly some automation. It is so easy to do it on initial build and adds little cost as you just join all of the DCC feeds together until you need to add occupancy sensors. I'm also relocating all of my control electronics to the front of the layout so no more lying under to wire things up. Thanks again Andrew

My big mistake was ballasting. I took all those videos on youtube at face value. The ones splashing tons of the 50/50 everywhere. Sadly after it was all dry I found that the 50/50 mix is very seeking. It loves points and fishplates and insulating them! I had a dead track. Cost a fortune to put right.

Another brilliant and info-dense video, Rob.

Excellent video! We are probably all guilty of making fundamental mistakes in either planning or construction of our layouts , at least I know I am! I was in too much of a hurry to get trains running and my planning was flawed, now I have an impractical layout that I constantly find frustrating... hindsight is great thing... cheers from Melbourne Australia 🇦🇺

Excellent video James. Very informative and explained well. Thank you.

Great video - thanks for sharing

Great looking layout with loads of details.Take care.

Very Good tips..I have no problems useing soleniod fleischmann motors (50+ motors use for the last 10 years).

You forgot the 6th one. Buying the Frankenstein Class 25/29/43. :D

Excellent advice - thank you for sharing.

1:40 on a reasonably straight track, 1:50 or shallower with any significant curves note when the smaller locos are going up, and many will manage a 1:30 or 1:25 the motor is under more load (they would actually be better if the wheels slipped), they can cope but the motor draws more current and gets warmer. having burnt out a couple of locomotives on steeper gradients its much cheaper to have shallower slopes. keep in mind you can have your "main level" higher than the lowest point so tracvs can dip down as well as lift up which helps with hidden sections

I have a 5x10 layout and the mainline run is only on the original 4x8 section, my mainline is double track but I can't run 2 trains at once because I didn't check the clearance between one of my curves so if I try the trains snag on each other. Check your curves people!

Great video. My biggest mistake was using hornby track and ballasting it. As when I went to rebuild. Most of the hornby track broke. Also I agree on the gradients. Keep up with great work.

Very good video. I recognise the problem with isolated blocks… I have forgotten them too on my layout 😢 I only have one isolated station area and sidings… As for the ballasting : I have done all my ballasting “controlled”, so I used a brush to apply glue and then added ballast and removed the ballast that would not be fixed in the glue - I still managed to almost ruin a few switchpoints 😏 My biggest mistake is probably not to work modular, my layout is removable but since it’s in one piece that’s not very easy to do…

Hi Rob. Very useful information. Nice and clear style of presentation. Have subscribed and will be looking at more of your videos.

Very recognizable. I made some of these mistakes too, like de glued points ;-)

Hi Rob- absolutley great points !! and i,m sure we have all made the same mistakes over the years (as have I lol ) but if I may be permitted to give , some advice on what i,ve learnt (the expensive way !! lol) over the last 50 years of enjoying the hobby-,would be ,firstly DONT cut any corners ,and aim to do each job as best you possibly can ,starting with the construction - by buying/using the very best tools kit ( jigsaw,s drills sprit level ,try-square,s etc etc ) you can afford ,then using these tools to be patient and properly construct a top-quality baseboard and frame thats super strong VERY FLAT and VERY LEVEL again ,using the very best quality wood you can afford ( I use 19mm marine ply boards screwed /glued on a on a frame made of12cm x 5 cm battons ) then , again BE PATIENT !!- and by frequant use of the sprit level and try-square make sure everything is solid, level and square and when finished the boards ,checking again for smooth joints ,no gaps and its mill-pond level. - next-- the dreaded track-laying ! - plan your layout in your head or on a sheet of paper then ,that way you can experiment at will with your ideas and STAY AWAY from any computer aided design software as your own brain works far better and is only limited by your imagination !! now when you do get around to actual track-laying - really take your time- be super-patient and dont rush it and do it properly , ( if your using "flexi" track then i find rather than using a junior hacksaw or those "track cutter pliers" and risk bending /buckling the track ,a Dremel cordless hobby tool with cutting disc is a godsend for cutting the track to size and it makes a far neater cut !i) if you do decide to use flexi-and do have to cut your track ,then measure at least twice before cutting - keep all you curves and points to as large radius - and gentle as you possibly can I have also found that just lightly "tacking" your track down with P.V.A glue works far better than using pins as if your pinning your track down then a "missed hit" with the hammer can quite easily bend/kink/buckle the ttack EVEN if your using a very lightweight hammer - and last but not at all least - be warned !- I wouldn,t take to much notice of "Charlie" of Chadwick for any advice as he isn,t quite the expert he likes you to think he is !!- he appears to come across as very condescending at times and believes he is a authority about model railways but doesn,t actually even come from a railway background !!! anyway- here,s hoping these few hints and tips will help anyone in the hobby and Rob - your layout is cracking and coming along well- best of luck with your project buddy !

Excellent and honest video, it’s good to see and learn from small to big things. Sometimes it’s only after it’s all done do you find something you want to change, could have planned in.. do you have any first radius curves? It appears to have been a topic years back, I used to have them on my first layout 20yrs ago but now looking to re construct it do I change all up to 2nd and all else... was only for inner loop, but it had the engine sheds.... oh the choices. Great video looking forward to the next one in this series...👍

Really interesting, thanks. Just in the process of wiring up and fitting my solenoid point motors 😬

Rob, glad your move is going ahead. What size/shape have you got to put your new layout in? If you have a dumbell shaped circuit a reversing loop will look lilke a cross-over junction.

Hi Robin, just subscribed so another follower for you. Enjoyed your video and you not on own I've done silly mistakes on my layout 🤦. Look forward to future video's.

Interesting video and very honest.The problem i had was i have a small box room which was given to me by her indoors,;) and to make the layout as large as possible i boarded straight onto the wall right around the room.Add a old desk as a work station the space soon goes and in some places it can be a struggle to reach,however i learnt that standing on an old plastic beer crate improves the reach and i also have a long handled litter grab that never leaves the room.But i do manage ok and i have made the scenery from the furthest point in.

That brought back a few memories. I'll see your glued up OO gauge points, and raise you my glued up N gauge ones! :D

Some great tips for newbies to learn from. My biggest mistake is start a large layout without making a small test layout to try out all the arduino and jmri stuff first. But with all your other videos I am getting by nicely.

Yes indeed 4x9 HO back of the layout my worst zone to reach the most issues / cross over to close to turns , I to keep it out from the wall ,loose 18 Inc if space ...

Great video and thanks for the shout-out. Regards Charlie.

Great vid. Very useful. Subscribed.

Would love to see more. If there’s a mistake to be made I’ll make it. My biggest mistake so far is buying the locos and rolling stock but not buying anything more than the base board for the layout.

Very interesting and informative video. Almost by accident I left access around the back of my layout. So glad I did. My layout is about 7.5’ x 5’ and my baseboard is so heavy it’s just not practical to move it. I’ve changed my track layout many times in the 5-6 years I’ve been operating it and I’m still not convinced it’s my final layout. It may also be that I’ve never ballasted track and am more than a bit concerned that I lack the necessary skills to do it properly without ruining my layout! 🙈

Thanks mate

Will be using your suggestion on ballasting points

I can empathise about having to shift your whole layout to get to the back of it. My Frist layout "north end Sidings" was 8x4 double loop. Couldn't get to the back at all, so a decision was made to rip it apart and rebuild ass new modular layout. It's still a round-e-round but this time with ONE Track instead of two (found myself never using both rails at the same time..) The layout is now about 10ft X 6ft BUT I operate it from the middle now :) So much easier to get k everything and build it! Plus because it's made from 4 modules I can swap out one section for another, essentially giving me an infinite number of layouts 🤣 It's not also future proof so if I do want to automate I just pull the 4 sections apart and fit insulted rail joiners :) 20 minutes job!

I have a layout in n scale to access the back of the layout I put the legs on castors which makes it very easy to move .. Peter ( Australia)

Some great advice.

Very nice 👌 work bro.👍👍👍😃✌️

Everyone gets glue and ballast on their points, thats why I use ballast mat

You should give a N gauge a go, must bigger more realistic layout in the same space as oo/HO. I have a 4 minute mainline run at scale speed,

The Part about the gradient... The big problem is that as soon as your track has a curve... You can half the tractive effort. Meaning you can't take anything with weight up the gradient. (Me and dad also made the mistake of a steep grade across the back of the layout. We used steel rails and magnetic wheels. nb:rest of railways was nickel silver.)

My 6ftx4ft is surrounded by walls on all 4 sides. I never thought about access till it was too late. Im thinking of putting the legs on caster wheels so i can slide it out

Gluing points - done it ---- swore a lot

That’s an interesting video. I agree with the access challenges, although my layout is only two feet deep, I have mounted it around 110cm from the ground I find it difficult to get into the corners, so take that into consideration as well. When using servo motors for points do you need a DCC decoder? Thanks

Hi just found your channel subbed 😀

I am about to ballast my layout and your tip is timely - thank you. With regards to block-occupancy with JMRI I recently created a system which I put up on instructables web site which uses a wifi connected raspberry Pi to host an MQTT server which JMRI can talk to along with a web camera. This means that with no layout wiring, no track cutting and no rolling stock modifications you can have loads of blocks and individual sensors to detect locomotives or just coaches and wagons etc. and it even detects them whilst they are stationary meaning that when you switch the layout on it already knows which blocks are occupied. The version I uploaded first does suffer from strong shadows cast when coaches on neighbouring tracks cause mis-detection but I have an improved version I will be uploading soon. Perhaps something like this could help with the little Wicket. www.instructables.com/Block-Occupancy-Detector-and-Position-Sensors-for-/

My biggest fail was bulding my layout "to fast". Take your time for each section and it will pay out.

GO YOU 'R'S!!!

build it in moduals 2x4 all around the wall and you can add yards and industries I lived in an apartment and the celler was probably 24x30 maybe and I was running s scale it is between o scale and ho scale one guy had a room 56x85 feet and ran ho scale or oo in England and I thought it was impressive

Have you got any complete newbie tips? I'm leaving school in a couple of months, and I'm thinking of making a tiny layout with just two small stretches of track that I can put on a shelf and display a couple of my locos

There are never mistakes it's all a learning curve

Hi what's your opinion on the train tech block signals, they look simple to install & wire up. (Very obviously expensive 😅)

Doh! Coulda told ya all of those before ya started! Check out DIY and Digital YT channel who has cracked the cheap occupancy circuit for Arduino! I use blue tac to cover the mechanics while ballsating!

Why seperate blocks if not automating? One word: signalling. Even if it's just asthetic, there's a good chance you will want to look at signalling in the future.

can u do those servos under the base board?

Sorry, the Mersey Railway Tunnel has a gradient of 3.7%, making it steeper than the Lickey Incline's 2.65%. The absolute max incline for adhesive traction using mainline trains was the now closed 7.1% Hopton Incline, but that was only used for the occasional enthusiasts' trains. The steepest lines to carry regular passenger services were both in Scotland and had gradients of 4.3% and were on the Ballochney Railway and the Slamannan Railways both which lost their passenger services in 1930. Gradients on curves are your 6th mistake. The curve increases the effective gradient.

Hi Rob - Excellent video and yes we all make mistakes my most costly one was buying tech I didnt need (see my latest video) Cheers Kev

The thing about block detection, is that is doesn't tell a computer where a train is, only whether or not a block is occupied. So either you need a lot of blocks so that a computer can tell if a train is in the right place to stop in a station, or you need some other form of sensor like a hall-effect sensor or photoresistor. And the thing is, both of those are a lot cheaper. Which is not to say you couldn't use both, of course. Block detection plus sensors for precision maneuvers.

Got to disagree with your claim that a 4ft-wide baseboard allows "large radius curves". 2ft radius corresponds to a real-life radius of 2.3 chains. A class 03 could get around that but even a class 08 has a minimum radius of 3.5 chains. Thing is, you mentioned in another video that you want to have trains running round and round, so that pretty much requires a 4ft width, unless you make something with a hole in the middle.

Hi Robin, thanks for sharing your experience, very helpful, as I am in the process of planning a re-do of my Marklin layout I just threw together to run some trains: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-zuBqR5MAxss.html. I plan to take everything down and build a shadow station on the current level with a 3% rear ramp going to the 2nd level with station, yard and depot and a 3rd level turnaround.

Math? .... Really?