I remember the line from the Hindu scripture, the Baghavad Gita….Vishnu…is trying to persuade the prince, that he should do his duty. And…to impress him, takes on his multi-armed form. And says…”Now I am become death. The destroyer of worlds”.
So is that guy laughing at the end this reality's version of the Emperor of mankind?! This scene has some very strong WH40K Exterminatus Extremis vibes right there!
I'm feeling you in terms of looking forward to it each week but didn't think much of this episode. Way too "death star destroys Alderan." The parallel plot with the mentalics was dragged out, felt like filler. I have a high bar: The Expanse, The Expanse, The Expanse. No action happens on that show unless it really advances the plot, the characters, everything.
What I love most about Foundation are the campy echoes of Ancient Rome, and honestly I wish they'd lean into that even more. There are more ways for an empire to fall than violence. Christianity and the "barbarians" changed Rome from the inside out. Fundamentally change the culture, and no more empire.
So far for me that still remains to only be The Expanse. Hell I get excited waiting to even watch Reactors watch the show though I've already completed the series. I've now watched the series 30+ times through Reactors and still get excited. No other show has managed and it'll probably be years before one does again!
Yeah the expanse was great. Battlestar Galactica is my all time favourite however. You can hear many of the same musical motifs from Bear McCreary in this which I love.
It’s crazy that Demrezel told him that she bed him to change his ways and soften his heart. Then apologized because she realized that even that wasn’t enough and regretted what he had become.
It must have been a calculated move by Demerzel, as this can absolutely lead to a direct confrontation between Day and Demerzel. So I suspect that Demerzel wants this conflict to happen. I can see two reasons for this: 1.) Demerzel somehow sees a direct conflict with Day as another step for her to end her service to the Cleonic dynasty and regain her freedom. Maybe she sees this as a step towards having the Cleonic dynasty destroy itself? 2.) Demerzel listened to Hari Seldon talking directly to her about what her goals are and should be. The Demerzel in the original books serves the good of all mankind, as he sees it. Maybe this Demerzel (of the tv show) wants to do that too, in some way, and has concluded that remaining close to Day no longer serves that greater good?
@@terraincognita3749 I take a guess that she might be heading home to mind wipe Dusk, and maybe bring Days clone out of the tank and implant older memories for him, changing him. The existing Day maybe named persona non grata. This might lead the General to have his revenge on Day and release the prisoners.
I saw this clip on random and was just mesmerized by the music, vfx and the sheer emotion. Then i watched both seasons of foundation and was so glad that I came accross this clip. This series did not disappoint
This is one of the best sci fi adaptations ever done. Apple is really paving the way for sci fi as a whole. I really wish they were the ones to get the three body series instead of Netflix. But if you enjoy this watch invasion, severance, and silo.
Not really up there with The Expanse for me (I don't think any show I've seen so far compares), but it's definitely capturing something we haven't seen since GoT.
This is not anything like the book. In the book Terminus was never destroyed. The Foundation hid from the empire for 200 years and by that point the Foundation was strong enough to seriously challenge the empire, they didn't have as many ships as the empire but they had better technology. The empire sent Bel Riose out to destroy the Foundation but Riose's fleet had to turn around at the last minute because the emperor realized that his fleet would be take a beating at best, might be destroyed and the fleet of a nearby planet would take the empire if Riose didn't come back to defend it. The book ended with the Hologram of Hari Seldom comming out and saying he had predicted this he knew Riose would never reach the Foundation. The next book started 200 years later, the empire had fallen, and the Foundation felt pretty safe because it now had way better technology than anyone else but there were strange rumors about a general called the Mule winning battles despite impossible odds against him. There was much speculation about how the Mule was winning these battles but the Foundation arrogantly thought their technology would defeat the Mule. The Hologram of Seldon warned the Foundation that another crisis was upon them and they needed the Second Foundations hope but most of the Foundations leaders laughed and were like what crisis? There were a few people from the Foundation that did take the Mule seriously and they set out on an expedition to find the Second Foundation.
Thank you for that summary. Hopefully the showrunners will find a way to integrate this story to the next episode. Perhaps in the next ap, the foundation actually survived, and something bad happened to Terminus. I still love what they are doing despite not following the books at all, and only taking inspiration from it.
Have you even read the books? Bel Riose had to return because the Emperor saw a possible contender to the throne when the latter had defeated Foundation. And Mule was never a part of Seldon's prediction, Mule was an unexpected entity. The Foundation books are way more subtle and smart.
No. The Foundation did not hide. It was just forgotten about and started to dominate its neighbours because it kept technology (because it was a bunch of scientists put together) and miniaturized it (because it lacked ressources). Later, Bel Riose went to conquer it, but was called back and quietly executed, because that victory would have permitted him to overthrow the emperor. It is explained in detail that it was not possible to have the Empire to attack at that point. Either the general is strong and he becomes emperor, or the emperor is strong and he stops the general. About the Mule, the hologram spoke about how they narrowly avoided civil war. The foundation dictator asked "What civil war? What about the Mule?" The representatives from the outside worlds replied "We planned one, then the Mule came." "You mean the Mule is not covered by the Seldon plan? That we are in uncharted territory?" They were defeated by the Mule, who was vanquished years later by the second Fondation.
I like that you can actually see a flash of light coming from the right at around 1:38 after i watched the finale i came back to the previous episode and noticed it.
"FOUNDATION" is further proof that AppleTV has been killing it on the Sci-Fi front. That studio pays definitive attention to production values. Yeah. One could complain about "FOUNDATION" not following the Asimov works. But that's why they're called...BOOKS!!! At least the studio has made the attempt. And it's paying off.
Yeah like dune and LOTR weren't adapted from BOOK, like you adapt harry potter and he is a youtuber abducted by werewolfes at 21yo to hogward the techno mage school to fight the death eater facists who are trying to explode the center of the earth to unleash the brother of voldemort the demon belzebuth.
You appear enamoured with what is essentially a breach in canon. The conflict in the book 'Foundation and Empire' was a recasting of the story of Emperor Justinian and the military campaign of General Bellisarius and the resulting political balance struck between the two. This tv adaptation destroys Terminus (and along with it the first Foundation) which is a complete break with the Foundation book series. The primary purpose of the first Foundation was to act as a living repository of humankind's knowledge of the arts, science, engineering and the humanities preserving this knowledge base during the fall of the galactic empire. This tv adaptation seems to have lost sight of this goal.
@@MrZlocktar You observed: "I think they overkilled the original. Their idea is infinitely better than original." I seriously doubt whether you have read the 'original' series of books from which this tv adaptation is based. For you to go on to state that the tv adaptation is "... infinitely better than (the) original ..." is hyperbole at its finest. P.S. When the Invictus battleship crashed into the planet Terminus just a few kilometres away from the primary settlement, how did all those thousands of colonists miraculously make it into the Seldon Vault in such a climactically short space of time?
Then he did his job as an actor/entertainer... a good actor can ease the emotions out of the viewer that is needed for the role they are playing (as an example of good actors Patrick Stewart and the one who played River in the movie firefly), a bad actor invokes hatred not for the role but for the person playing that role (as an example of bad actors Ezra miller and Rachel Zegler)
Very difficult book to adapt to TV. but they are doing a good job. The books cover thousands of years and it would be extremely difficult to create empathy with the characters if they changed in each season. very creative the way they resolved this situation these writers deserve the raise
@@bobhoskins-kl6ue I must confess I haven't watched the series, just this little video. OTOH, even the various versions of The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy don't agree with each other on very much. Clarke's string of 2001-2010-2016-3001 stories are - by his own admission - not exactly continuous, and even 2001 was supposed to go to Saturn, not Jupiter. The Disney films of the Chronicles of Narnia took a beating (if you're a purist,) or got a well-considered updating (depending on whom you ask. Losing Lewis' narrative voice was both unavoidable, and damaging, IMO.) It seems most books don't translate directly to film at 100% fidelity, though this can be an improvement...depending. Maybe the Vault will turn up somewhere else. Maybe the story is showing how change is both inevitable and frequently unpredictable. I suppose we'll see...unless the series doesn't manage to tell a 1000-year long story before it's cancelled.
I just feel bad all the dawn. Most dawn are like fluffball really a nice dudes can't believe they all turned into Day and become cruel one day. Still can't get over Dawn that was colorblind he just wanted to be free
@@letzsnuggzz That Day was almost redeemable, he took the very real risk of walking the salt path, he helped the other pilgrim on the path when he fell and he was willing to bend the Empire by letting the imperfect clone Dawn live. Still evil in plenty of ways I'd bet, but there was glimpses of good in him. Was sort of sad we missed seeing what happened him when we flashed forward to the future Cleons.
This was perhaps the biggest death fakeout in a series full of them. Very epic imagery, but the what little emotional impact was there is sort of drained by the fact that you find out one episode later that nobody died. Well except an entire fleet's worth of Empire's loyal officers and sailors... but nobody cares about the drones.
Agreed. I felt it cheapened the effect greatly, and it also made it so I won't emotionally latch onto the characters because they cannot die meaningfully.
i'm glad they add space battle even though the screen time is short. in reddit, 1:37 when the debris about to hit brother poly there's a white light from opposite direction (the vault)... could be a hint for something.... or not.
The title is a tremendous subtle joke, on an epic scale. It definitely recalls the space-dogfighting of STAR WARS 1977 (the first movie before it was ever a franchise) And the impact of “destroying Alderaan” in such an unexpected intense twist was mindblowing 🤯 With us knowing these characters more, and them all being played excellently. And the intensely moving use of the Bhagavad Gita, after its brief mentions in a few earlier episodes, that was BEAUTIFULLY done. That was a magnificent episode of this format of storytelling.
Foundation as of this episode has surpassed any Sci-fi show before it, in scale, emotion and Complexity for me..my jaw was on my desk this entire scene.. Damn... This episode felt like it's own season
@@12xenn45 What's even better is Apple in the talks to buy the right for "The Expanse" not to remake but to continue. This show without a doubt on my top 3!!!
@@12xenn45 I'm bias towards this lol, I grew up reading Foundation, I still have all 7 books, 2 of them Orignal print 😂. Expanse and Foundation Are Apex Sci-fi, expanse is more local future and gritty. Expanse has that 70s Sci-fi personality and galactic scale
THIS....nothing has touched The Expanse yet. While this episode was very good and the final scenes nice...they still don't touch what The Epxanse pulled off when it came down to devasting, glorious,and/or jaw dropping moments!@@12xenn45
Yea I still prefer the expanse for it's space CGI, combat, realism and overall story telling and characters. But foundation is definitely more thought provoking and more of a dune which is nice.
As explained in the Foundation trilogy (books). The Empire could not destroy anything. Because to would be to give too much power to a military commander who might overthrow the Emperor. The books make sense. The TV series does not.,
My guess is that the writers do an Alderaan here: the destruction of Terminus will serve as a rallying cry for the Foundation, against the Empire. If I am somewhat right, then the writers see Foundation as an idea, as a story, more than as a political entity.
I think the Vault and Poly will survive. Demerzel might have been called back by Cleon I to deal with the Empress. Spacers might revolt and jump Empires fleets to remote regions and strand them or straight into suns then chaos will ensue.
I think Poly survived too. During Poly's scene, as he is to be engulfed by the impact of the Invictus, a bright flash of light occurred from the direction of the Vault.
All foundation population and your tecnology was saved and the foundation won against empire. So yes, remain the same of the books despite terminus destruction.Obvious that will have a new terminus in season 3. The meaning remains.
I don't know if the meaning remains, I stopped watching the show when Salvor Hardin, the character whose quote is "violence is the last resort of the incompetent" stopped being a skilled and cunning politician and became a warrior/guardian...
The invictus being outclassed by a modern Imperial battleship just makes me giggle. They made such a big deal about recovering it, you would think it was lost dark age of technology warship. Just old and dated.
Asimov Foundation: **one man cannot bring about change** Apple: **hold my beer** What a train wreck of an adaptation. It had nothing to do with Asimov’s Foundation series, and completely changed characters. People are going to watch this tv show, never having read the books, then think they have an idea what Asimov intended.
I have no idea how those ships are supposed to work, like what's that beam doing ? It looks like it's restarting the old warship... but dayum, this looks so freaking amazing. And the casting ? And the music ? This is above Marvel even when it was it best. When that ship hits the planet you can feel it.
This is actually not new concept; it's ship, which for interstellar and further travels uses something called Kugelblitz. It's RL theoretical construct, which is essentially black hole made by concentrating truly astronomical amount of energy in one place. In Foundation, such object is then used to bend space-time itself _around_ ship in question, which allows it to "jump through" distance to targeted point. That's as far as I am able to imagine it. It's obvious that this technology is extremely dangerous; what Empire did, was somehow overload all safeties of this ship and generate black hole much bigger than what was "safe" to use. They then pushed ship during cataclysmic collapse event into atmosphere of Terminus, where unstable black hole did what it does best: started SUCKING IN.
These ships folded space by creating a Kugelblitz, The larger ship is the earliest possible model of that kind of ship and spacefolder, and the weapon forcefully activated it while also de-orbiting it. Because of how folding space works (which is really close to how it can theoretically be done in real life btw), basically everything within it in a sphere will be dragged into it and deposited into a set destination. And because energy wormhole, it has all the same capabilities as one would expect from a black hole. This includes eating a good quarter of the planet.
Because Apple TV didn't promote it. I mean, this is the Sci-Fi shows they boasted about, then in H-1, they removed it from the homepage. Not only that, but the people who watched Foundation is either purists, or those who didn't read the book. And it makes my blood boil, to be honest. Purists tends to feel the book is the masterpiece, and everything; and I'll agree. But for them to ask shows to be adapted as-is like the book, then it can't be called adaptation, it is called a simulacrum. Foundation is supposed to be ideas and not characters, yet that formula won't work in contemporary times where plot lines and characters are as vital as the plot itself. Of course, there will be changes and divergence, and it is inevitable. The same purists will think that the previous Isaac Asimov's adaptation is good, when in reality it is not.
At 1:38, a strange light some occur next to Poly Verisof, to my mind Terminus is perhaps destroyed but the Foundation still alive through the sanctuary and Seldon. He knows how to defend himself and probably protect all the people on the planet ! Anyway, even if the serie is telling the foundation story in a different way, it still Foundation from Asimov and I think the first Foundation has to still remain and prosper before the Mule appear and change everything ... . SOooooo, as It was the case for the resurected Hari Seldon who should be drown and dead, the first Foundation should somehow survive !
What a fantastic series this is. While I loved the "Expanse", Foundation Season 2 Episodes 8 and 9 have to be about the best Sci-Fi I've ever seen, bar none.
I was wondering where foundation would go, there were more than a few moments in S1 that were pretty young adulty, but holy fuck did they tighten things up in S2. I am seriously impressed with season 2 on so many levels. Can't wait for the rest!
@@spiralout112 Yes, totally agree with you about how tightened up they managed to get S2. I was almost going to quit watching in S1 but glad I didn't, S2 is some of the best and most rewarding Sci-Fi I've ever seen. (And this, coming from a huge 'Expanse' fan)
Space battle was tight, even though the ships suppended in space a la star wars is not my favorite, the Expanse’s every one moving at high speeds all the time, definitely looks better on screen
I don't recall Terminus ever being destroyed in the books... Oh right, that's because it never was. Terminus never was a threat to the Empire, just like the second foundation never was a threat to the first. The lesson, the whole message of the book trilogy is "It is better to focus on working to create something good, than to focus on destroying something rotten. Rotten fruits fall by themselves." Instead, it seems, we got a star wars pastiche.
Esta serie esta excelente, tiene una ecenografia fantastica, vestuario, guion, reparto actoral, banda sonora, fotografia, efectos especiales, esta magnifica...etc...etc. Espero con muchas ganas la tercera temporada. Saludos a todos desde Mexico 😃 🇲🇽
The Invictus was never meant to contend with empire, it was a deterrent from smaller groups and a beacon of hope. An ancient ship vs the finest modern vessels Empire could produce was never going to be a fair fight. Obtaining it was the end of first crisis because a nowhere settlement just got its hands on a looming guardian that could prevent more pirate and raider attacks that would have otherwise prevented a safe condition for the foundation to prosper under. The Invictus sat to allow the foundation to focus on its technology and innovation rather than churning out defenses that wouldnt have saved them from Empire anyway
the utilization of blackhole as source of energy is quite a unique and different iteration compared to most sci fi ships we had before and today. It is also quite fitting for a type 2-something civilization
I think this series and the Boys, have finally put the nails in the coffin for me for this mentality. I now thoroughly expect characters, and large parts of the narative to not survive adaptation, if the changes serve the themes of the original work better.
@@TheThOdOr1s yeah, foundation has done it in a more or less interesting way. Tbh some change are kinda not as cool as the original story for me, even if now I understand them, like the change in Bel riose character. But the cleonic dynasty is really the best changer ever.
If it had followed the books I think the series would have failed to keep the interest of people. Don't get me wrong, I thought the books were great, but the characters constantly changed as the story moved forward through the different eras. It wouldn't have worked as well - keeping some of the core characters has been vital to allowing people to both understand and develop empathy with what is going on in the narrative.
@@brianh9358 yeah absolutely right, but even if they didn't follow the architecture of the story they could have followed the basic storyline. But I'm not bothered by the fact they changed it, could be really interesting, plus it had suspens !
This was one of the best part of the Series; I think the director or the production team did an excellent job setting up this climatic event in the series. The Episode 1 - 8 was just all build up to this wonderful special effects event. Now I expect episode 10 creates the consequences of this event in (sets up) the aftermath for Season 3. I just have to remember that in the book the Foundation slowly moves into a Dark Age, kind of like the Fall of ROME. I don’t remember reading that the planet of the vault of the First Foundation was destroyed by the Imperium. I read the Foundation 20 years ago and this event in the Series is causing me to reread the books instead of enjoying the interpretation of the Book Series.
1:52 notice how the praetorian guard was initially holding back hober and constant but when terminus is destroyed they let them go. can't tell if it was out of sympathy or maybe just letting them go as they were defeated
no. But the genetic dynasty also doesnt exist in the book, its made for the series so people can bind with charakters that dont swap every view episodes. Its important for television, not for books.
@@a.p.e.x3195 "it isn’t even an adaptation of the books lol. Too different" Adaptation just means its based on the idea of the book. It doesnt need to have anything to do with the story of the original..
Lee Pace is an astonishingly good actor. Idk if this show can really survive without him. I love Laura Birn, so I hope the show recovers, since I thought this season was a bit dull and tangential. But they played off each other so well.
I have three questions about episode 9 that I'd like help understanding: First question: In previous episodes, we learned that Hober Mallow, with the help of the spacers, would be the reason for the fall of the Empire. However, the deal was based on Opalesk liquid that the Foundation had. Now that the planet is gone, how will this play out? Any suggestions? Second question: If Harry is a robot, how can Tellem read his mind or enter in his vision in the initial episode when he was dreaming? Can robots dream? Third question: Time slipping was happening to everyone who entered the vault. However, when Day and Damerzel entered, they were perfectly linked with the outside world and came out on time without any issues. Harry can trap them at that time ?
1.There is something missing. Let us see what happens in the next episode. 2. Robots in asimov lore develop conscience. If harry is in fact a robot, they should want him as close to the original as possible. Gayle also mentioned that she felt his (seldon) lungs filling with water. If seldon is a robot he is a bio engineered one. 3. Im guessing that If the fleet lost contact with cleon, they would assume that he was killed and that would trigger a early attack. For some reason, Seldon needed that interaction to happen.
@@iutlu 2nd Q: if his lungs filled with water how he is alive and back ? 3rd Q: if the general find out there is no contact they wont blow hole planet to the ground…? Thanks for the reply
@@DoubleGG4 2. We need to see next ep. To understand. 3. If they lost contact with cleon, they would attack, thats why there was no time dilation inside the vault. Either seldon needed to delay the attack or he needed something out of that interaction (for them to take the quantum computer, maybe)
I’m just wondering if this is what it would look like if Invictus was use to jump into the heart of Trantor. Or would it be more of a kinetic energy explosion?
Generally I like the show, but it is not as good as the books, and the inclusion of 'the MESSAGE' is questionable. Hober Mallow in the books became the 1st trader prince ruler of the Foundation, bringing an end the to dominance of the Galactic Spirit religion. In the books Bel Riose sought to attack the growing Foundation on his own initiative and was undone because the Emperor feared his success. The corruption and neutering of Demerzel is also disappointing.
Such a wonderful scene. Coming as a book fan, I was utterly shocked by how the director rewrote the second crisis and took it to a whole new level. Terminus wasn't even touched in the entire foundation series (except Mule made an appearance, but no hull damage). I was still counting on Terminus to reveal their final hidden weapon at last second before the destruction. The las time I got this shock was when Ned Stark was beheaded.
Where in the PERFECT BOOKS WRITTEN BY ISAAC ASIMOV IS THE FOUNDATION DESTROYED? For heaven's sake, this is HERESY AGAINST ASIMOV'S TEXTS! Terminus was INVADED IN THE BOOKS NEVER DESTROYED. This series is a literary massacre of an entire saga that is PERFECT. Besides, this is only ONE OF THE FOUNDATIONS, the one that Hari Seldon shrewdly makes public, the other always remained hidden in Trantor as we finally discover in the books when Ebling Mis is squeezed by The Mule before finally being killed so as not to reveal the secret. While the Tolkien fandom has defended tooth and nail the lore of his books, the Asimov fandom applauds like seals this nonsense of a series that is practically a rewriting of Asimov. Whoever reads the books after seeing this rubbish series will think that Asimov was a fool when he was one of the Sci-Fi geniuses of all time.
Let's hope this show will get season 3 (rumors has it was greenlit already) and many more to properly end tv series. Nothing impressed me more in sci-fi tv series especially emperors dynasty plot and Lee Pace's play. But seeing those people reviews on rotten and metacritic... atleast critics reviews mostly good. And those 2023 SAG-AFTRA strike which continues right now not good for the show.
"Some may question your right to destroy ten billion people. Those who understand know that you have no right to let them live." - Exterminatus Extremis
@@noturmum7967 In Chess, to "Castle" is a move where a player can have their King and their Rook chess pieces exchange places. It's also the name of the device that Hober used to swap places with the Planets ruler earlier in the season.
Realistic sci-fi at last… where an Empire crushes its underdog opposition like it should. Thank goodness for sanity… and you know what, the Empire is not inherently bad. Rulers can make it good or bad. People like Bel Riose who serve as stewards to the empire are what matters.
Interesting point about whether Empires are inherently bad. I would say that Empires tend towards becoming bad, because power corrupts, and Empires by its very nature concentrate power in the hands of a few. We can also approach this same argument from a different starting point. A core element of democracy - perhaps even THE core element - is the distribution of power among many: elected politicians, who themselves divide into multiple groupings; the judicial system; the executive system; civic society, ngo's and activists; businesses; journalists/ media and so on. By its very nature, Empire cannot be fully democratic: it seeks to control vast groups against their will - that is the core of an Empire - and for that it needs a powerful executive apparatus that can act with a degree of impunity to provide robust (often violent, even bloody) enforcement. And once there is a degree of impunity, evil can start to grow. Witness the corrosive effects of the white Empire in the US South up until the 1960s. The Russian Empire that we see now. The European colonial Empires. We humans simply have difficulty resisting the corrosive moral effects of power. That's how I see it.
@@michaelmacdonell4834It does feel realistic: the Empire controls tens of thousands of worlds and must have a star fleet that is immeasurably vast. The Foundation, for all its technological prowess, is at the best a minor loose confederacy of a couple of dozen planets. One would expect a fight much like Russia against Chechnya in the 1990s; maybe the Foundation could get some blows in against an all too arrogant, complacent imperial fleet, but eventually the sheer weight of the Empire gives it the advantage. If the Foundation wants to win against the Empire, it has to destroy the Empire from within: with a superior idea, story, myth. People will have to believe that the future is better without the Empire, and they will have to be willing to risk their lives to get there. The destruction of Terminus may serve exactly those purposes: it can be a dramatic story that can be used to tell people about the promises of the Foundation - science, freedom, progress - and the dangers of the Empire: stagnation, brutality, violence. I suspect this is where the writers go. Or to put it another way: I think they turned Terminus into the Alderaan of this galaxy.
Oh yeah because losing two of them wasnt enough to convince the empire that it was a bad idea to begin with. with how much money, resources, manpower, and kyber crystals (yes millions of metric tons of the stuff was used on it) they lost, they could have built thousands of ISD's or SSD's, or better yet, a more practical doomsday weapon. Like say a portable black hole generator.
