This is a really great video! I'd only keep in mind one thing: Tipper Shield Breaker. The move's KB Growth is better after a certain threshold (off remembering an old Tweet from Pugwest, it should be in Marcina Discord and Neo Altea): 45% for Lightweights 50% for Midweights 60% for Heavyweights twitter.com/pugwest/status/1073382393325731844?s=21 Still, HIGHLY useful information. This is going to be another thing which separates good Marths from great Marths. I'm usually pretty consistent with eyeballing it already, but this will be really helpful for those really early breaks I get from time to time. Subbed to Hangetsu. Thanks!
Definitely. Especially compared to Melee where it wasn't too difficult to land but it also wasn't too easy. And also the fact that Marth doesn't have his amazing spike from the game, that covers the whole tipper hitbox and is easy to land
This is really amazing, great vid. Im glad you took the time to translate this we marth's are really grateful for showimg use how to kill consistantly with our most iconic move.
Nice! I always enjoy your videos, great work! Thanks for sharing your love of Marth! I still love playing Marth much more than Lucina, whatever they say about tipper!
Wow, this is great ! Now i'll hit 100% sure ! And I did look a bit for the K.Rool case, if i'm correct, the way to tipper him is to attack him from behind. Not too complicated to place with a shield break, but I can see it be a problem if he is not positionned well.
This is what i wanted now i am confident and i feel like i am able to conquer the World. But the chart for leaning backwards or forwards is kinda bad for me because i have a colour weakness, change pink or blue to another colour like yellow or so
@@atomu27 I'm not able to make a new image just yet, I may be able to get around to it at a later point. I did finish up the spreadsheet version though, so hopefully that helps! docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Pg6GoJct77sc_3zpKMydw4qxD4RIEVDSFWwtqg7CH0E/edit?usp=sharing
Hey, I finished up a spreadsheet version, hopefully this helps you out! docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Pg6GoJct77sc_3zpKMydw4qxD4RIEVDSFWwtqg7CH0E/edit?usp=sharing
You would be right once you pass a certain threshold. If you pop a shield at the 30 - 50 range then f smash is going to be stronger. After that then shield breaker will suffice, and it's easier to land. (Don't quote me on the exact numbers, but the principle is true)
i think they should just fix marth's hitboxes. ive played him a ton in ultimate and my final opinion is that hes just lucina but doesnt like winning. i love him as a character but if theyre not going to adjust hitboxes on attacks like fair, bair, or fsmash, then i'm honestly just going to main roy.
I know what you mean for sure, it's really hard to keep maining Marth when you see all of the games you could have won if Marth's hit boxes were just a little bit better or if you were using a different character altogether. I really don't blame you, I just use him because I have a passion for the character and I'm very invested at this point. Lol
@@enduringidealist bro i know. been playing marth a lot lately and it's perfect. i don't feel any need to play lucina anymore and i still suck with roy. 😀
And that'd be the better thing to do past, I'd say about 40 or 50%. If you're trying to get those cheese tipper smashes that kill at 35 then f smash would be better if you push them to the very edge, of course be wary not to push them off.
aw goddamn it i thought the title said out of shield :( still, great video! i whiff it just about every time lol do you know if there's a timing that works for shield breaker?
That would be great, wouldn't it? lol Hmmm, I haven't tested it out, but I'm sure you could probably find a way to line it up. Especially if you play around with b reverses and wave bounces.
@@10cheesburgers i'll see what i can do, and maybe get back to you if i find a solution! i wanted to know since shield breaker is slightly more effective at higher percents
@@10cheesburgers i did a bit of labbing(!), but i need to provide some context first. i can't confirm whether these work in the context of a shield break. i was labbing with no extra controllers to set up a shield break (and trying the tech with a single joycon just sounds like hell on earth), so i was hitting a normal idle target. the method described in the video for hitting tipper fsmashes did work (almost all of the time) on such standing targets, however, so i figured it was better than nothing. the short answer is that the same method works: dash forward, dash back, b-reverse shield breaker. (funnily enough, reverse ftilt works as well. real disrespect hours.) it might be possible because shield breaker's tipper hitbox is slightly bigger. the targets i tested it on were pichu, pac-man, hero, and bowser (should've thought to test it on mario but it slipped my mind). pichu: fairly consistent. when i missed, i always missed pichu entirely. pac-man: fairly consistent. when i missed, i usually missed pac-man entirely. hero: pretty much always. when i missed, it was usually a sourspot. bowser: somewhat inconsistent, but so were the tipper fsmashes i tried to land, so on a shieldbroken opponent it might be fine. again, these were against standing opponents as opposed to shieldbroken, so this warrants actual testing, but it's highly likely that a b-reversed shield breaker will hit just the same as a reverse fsmash!
@@vecvecvec Nice work, good to know! I appreciate that. Using that and this together will be very powerful. Since you brought it up, it's also likely that you can get some nasty punishes if you dash into an opponent to bait a grab, and dash into F Smash / Shieldbreaker range. Also, about Bowser, that is to be expected. In my experience the larger a character is, the more inconsistent spacing becomes. On those special cases, where you would want to use SB on a bigger character, it might be better to manually space.
That's true after a certain threshold. I'm not sure right off, but I think it's around 40% or 50% when shield breaker becomes the better option. Prior to that F Smash is def the way to go though.
@@10cheesburgers If you have rage even more so. The gap is clear in F Smash and Shieldbreak at those "early" (35 ish to 45) percent; with rage, at the ledge, long charge, etc. Each condition you add widens the gap more, you're absolutely right.
Hey, I can't say I've tested it on the newest ones, but it should be pretty easy to figure out. Just take them to training mode, break their shield, and see what part of the dizzy animation gets you a tipper.
