@Linda Moran - looks like i accidentally entered a gibberish comment when i was switching tabs or something. i am just seeing all of this and never realized that i did that and don't remember it. i assume it was a mystery you wanted to solve. your persistence paid.
Oh, Christians! We want an answer to our question from your wise. ...... If the Lord was murdered by some people. what sort of god is this? ...... We wonder! Was He pleased by what they did to Him? If yes, blessed be they, because they achieved his pleasure . ...... But if He was discontented; this means their power subjugated His!! ...... Was the whole entity left without a Sustainer who answers the prayers? ...... Were the heavens vacated when he laid under the ground somewheres? ...... Were all the worlds left without a God that arranges the matter of the creation while His hands were nailed? ....... Why did not the angles help Him when they heard him while he wailed? ....... How could the rods stand to bear the True Lord when He was fastened. ...... How could the iron reach Him and His body pinioned? ...... How could His enemies’ hands reach Him and slap His rear. ...... And was Christ revived by himself or the Reviver was another god? ...... What a sight it is! A grave that enclosed a god! What’s more weird is the belly that had Him in it! ...... He stayed there for nine months in utter darknes, and fed by blood! ...... Then he got out of the womb as a small baby, weak and gaping to be breastfed! ..... He ate and drank, and did what that naturally resulted in (defecation and urination). Is this a god??!! ..... Exalted and high is the Almighty God above the lies of Christians. All of them will be held accountable for their libels ...... Oh Christians, for what reason the cross is it exalted, and for what reason you blame whoever rejects the cross? ...... Isn't the logic to break and burn the cross? Since the Lord was crucified on it and his hands were fastened to it? ...... That is really a cursed cross to carry, so discard it Don’t kiss it! ...... The Lord was abused on it and you adore it? So you are one of the Lord's enemies!! ...... If you extol it because it carried the Lord of the worlds. ......... Why don’t you prostrate yourself and worship graves, since the grave contained your god in it? ....... So, Christians, open your eyes, this is what the matter is all about.
I believe there is actually one HUGE reason the Gospel of Thomas was not included in the Bible. It blatantly says that you do not need to go to a church! It says you can find God anywhere and everywhere. The early church would have looked at this and realize if people knew this bit of information they would be out of business!
Most of these early church leaders died for their beliefs. Would they really go against Christ by lying to us and then die a martyrs death? Also, do you really think Christianity would have made it without the physical presence and authority of the Church. If you do, explain to me how?
neil tighe I guess to get at the truth, you have to check the first century Church to see what the Apostles Church believed and practiced back then. I can help you with that!
How do you decide what's "most important" here? That being said note taking is probably the practical answer, though truth be told most of Jesus's disciples weren't educated enough to write down what they were taught. What they saw was passed on by word of mouth until someone who could write it down did.
Gordon Campbell actually Jesus Christ if going by regular archeological techniques was not a mythical person. He did exist the Romans have wrote about him and stuff but him being the son of God is up for you to decide. But he was a real person.
Gordon Campbell Christ wasn't a myth. That's the most ridiculous argument I've ever hear. Jesus Christ was the most influential man who ever walked this Earth. More than 2 billion people still bow to him and his teachings today. To say he is a myth is ridiculous. We have over 5,000 manuscripts that come within a few hundred years of Christ's death that mention him. The oldest coming within 5 years of his death! Yet you say he is myth?
It was a teleportation accident! The Beatles, all crowded into a transporter booth together, to get to a gig, but only one person stepped out on the other side. This guy!
January Jolly Thomas was right spiritual knowledge is the key and has always been,it speak of the does and don't to follow, it was the disguised Roman agent Paul that contradicted this as he contradicted most of what Jesus taught.
@@HerveyShmervy clearly you do not understand what spritual knowledge is ! Any revelation sent by God is spritual knowledge ,that is knowledge that is neccessary for understanding our role and responsibilities to God and the life needed to live here on earth.
I think its also important to mention that the Gospel of Thomas has a different theological stand point when compared to the Four Gospels or even the New Testament in general. Thats one major reason it isn't in the Bible.
Gospel of Thomas verse 114 - Simon Peter said to them, "Mary should leave us, for females are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "See, I am going to attract her to make her male so that she too might become a living spirit that resembles you males. For every female (element) that makes itself male will enter the kingdom of heaven." That sounds pretty standard to me ;)
@@swrl5275 - I'm pretty sure it has to do with the general Gnostic view of who Jesus is/was. The Gnostics believed that Jesus was a spirit and not flesh and blood. So when he says, "you males" in the passage cited above, it's a reference to His non-corporialness. The Book of Hebrews deals with that very theology in the first couple chapters. If Jesus wasn't one of us then He can't have died for us. That's pretty much the doctrine in a nutshell. Also, they must have had something against women or whatever. It's a strange group of people.
@@swrl5275 - That's an odd binary question. Is the sky blue or is it Tuesday? How do you answer a question like that? Matthew knew Jesus. John knew Jesus. Paul knew Jesus (the risen Jesus). I know where you're trying to go with your question but it is being asked from a complete lack of knowledge of the source material. Read the New Testament and then come back with a better quality question.
@@franceleeparis37 Ok, you start off by suggesting the one who posted this comment should sharpen their wit? Umm, you're the one who failed to comprehend their post within a couple of seconds of viewing it. I had no problems understanding it and I found to be quite amusing. I find the poster's witty humor to be clever enough. Who are you again to think anyone should take any advice from you? Ha! that's what I thought: nobody.
The Gospel opens up with the line "Whoever finds the interpretation of these sayings will not experience death." That is seeking salvation through knowledge. Which is the definition of Gnosticism
While this is true, it's also ignoring the difference in the recurring themes of Thomas vs. Gnosticism. In Thomas you see some symbolism of two becoming one, or an erasure of division. (read: make the inside like the outside, the lower like the higher, etc), whereas in Gnostic text you see the opposite: Things being divided into higher or lower, better or worse, good or evil. There's also no denial of Christ being an actual human person in Thomas, whereas some Gnostic texts express doubt on that topic. It's distinctly different from what we tend to consider Gnosticism.
What my Daddy (the wisest man I ever met!) would say regarding going to church: "If God is in your heart, you don't need a building. If God isn't in your heart, no building will help." 😏😉
Chennai is a colonial era city, before the British built Fort st.Gorge in 1640, it was a tiny fishing village. If some christian preacher came to South India in the first century CE they would have gone to one of the existing urban centres
It was Kerala. And there are Thomine influences still there from what I here. This might also explain why Joseph Campbell felt Thomas had some Buddhist influences which would be awesome imho
Finally there is a small glimpse into what religion for breakfast believes himself. He has a picture on his wall of tatooine. the man's a Jedi Knight!!!
@@TheOne-AslanI suggest you look up every word you just posted so you yourself can understand your own message. Such arrogance to think we know SOOO MUCH, when in truth we know so little.
St.thomas came to south india.I am from india.There are many sites in kerala and Tamil nadu related to thomas.we are one of the oldest Christian's in india and world. Earlier there was no constant communication from europe as of today.that was the reason why his teachings are not famous as others
I'm glad to hear from you, brother. But Thomas' teaching was no different from that of the other Apostles ..... and the South Indian Church is still in communion with the Churches of Syria, Egypt, Armenia and Ethiopia .... because the teaching is the same. I passed the Church near Chennai many times on the bus, in Mylapore --- but it was before I became a Christian, and though I wanted to go and see it, I never did. I regret it now ! Then again, it's catholic, and I'm Orthodox ! Still, if I ever get back, I will see it this time.
Thomas accompanied Jesus to India after his resurrection + 40 days. The Sanhedrin lusted for his life like they still perecute Christians today in various forms (woke media, trans proliferation, LBGTQ etc).
Probably going to have to read this Gospel. I always felt the Thomas persona as the “doubter” was VERY central to my gradual conversion and acceptance of Christ. If Doubting Thomas was a Disciple, then certainly there is room for me as a Christian.
It doesn't speak of the crucifixion, and the apostles were focused upon preaching the resurrection. It also encourages mysticism (looking within to find God). It's not considered scripture, because if people could find God without the church, the church has no use.
The church was certainly Useless in my search for Jesus..... I found Jesus through occult studies which lead me to the gospel of Thomas, I have the shroud of turin print on my wall and I don't celebrate the evil pagan holidays that the rest of the ignorant morons at the church do, all they do is sing.....
I agree with most of what you’ve said... but I found Jesus long before finding a good church with sound doctrine. I was praying to a Hindu Goddess when I came to Christ. I had out of body experiences, and met a rather interesting spirit because of this meditation, but I asked Christ to teach me the truth before I rode him off completely. You won’t catch me doing Kundalini meditation after what Christ revealed to me... that’s for sure! Jesus will reveal his truth to those who seek it from him directly.
Once again, a masterful job. Just my two cents. Among some in the theological there is the belief that the community that followed the Gospel of John did not like the followers of Thomas' gospel. Of the four gospels only John seems to give a "negative" view of Thomas. So much information.
The Gospel of John was basically a rebuttal to the Gospel of Phillip and the former is the only one to outright declare Jesus to be the Son of God. As I recall, the various gospels, in order of age, were Mark, Luke, Matthew, and John, with Mark being around 70? CE and John dating from the early 200s.
John is the heresy-killer. The three synoptics don't care that much about theology. They don't solve the problem of the nature of Jesus. God? An emanation of God? a particularly important prophet? John does it form the start. Jesus is God. He's eternal. He existed since the start of times. He's of the same nature of his Father, that's also God. John is the source of almost all the Nicene Creed. So it was written to solve some problem that started to arise in the Christian communities. Probably when the number of those that were direct witnesses of the predication of Jesus started to dwindle.
Lol imagine Thomas, chilling with his boy, Jesus, and every time Jesus says something meaningful and profound to him, he jots it down. 2k years later it's considered a holy gospel.
Personally, I beleive certain passages - like Thomas 77 - kept it out of the bible. Telling believers that Jesus, and thus God, could be found outside the Church would have been crippling to the coffers.
Douglas Thew Don't pick and choose what you want to believe, the early Christians didn't. they didn't include this in the Bible because it wasn't the inspired word of God. and not what Jesus taught to his apostles handed down to us.
@@anthonypalo8191 hang on why shouldn't he pick the four Gospels were picked buy a monk at the request of emperor Constantine they were just his choice
@@keithmahoney4390 this channel has videos on how no one chose the books in the new testament but intead early christian just read what they liked better. Even this video says so.
hence why i accept it more than the canonical ones. they all speak of salvation through those that can interpret it through his words. and who is supposed to know how to interpret them best?? the CHURCH...... hence only through them can you find salvation.
Here we have a scholar explaining something about early Christianity, and people in the comments completely ignoring him and commenting such nonsense ignorant stuff with such confidence, just amazing! EDIT: Please don't read the conversation below, for your own good!
jassLmhn You noticed that too. I've never seen so many people who don't believe in something hating on that something that they don't believe in so much. What none of them realize is that their "not believing" is just another "faith-based belief". Have a great weekend.
There are elements in the gospel of Thomas which simply don't rhyme with the Bible. The gnostic elements in it for example that we still can be like Adam and Eve before the fall if we choose so. If that was true, than we ridicule the sacrifice of Christ.
@@DonQ0 That's a common fallacy that atheists assume to be true and use it to argue against the bible. The bible we have today is 98% to 99% accurate with the originals. That's astonishing for a book that's thousands of years old.
Thomas sounds like a historical research document to me. Like someone or a group were doing historical research, collecting the sayings of Jesus/Yeshua (insert your preferred name) and recording them in one source. It makes sense to me that it would be older then, in that case. Interesting either way.
Wild Alchemical Spirit ... comparatively speaking, that is what the Hadiths in Islam are all about... the saying of the prophet.. but unlike the Gospels of Thomas, each Hadith was checked and attributed to a known person in the community... thousands of other sayings were rejected because they could not be corroborated...
I like how it doesn't say Jesus was divine, but it doesn't say he wasn't. When Thomas asks Jesus his identity, Jesus deflects and tells them to see what's in front of them. If Jesus was actually a human aspect of God, he definitely would have spoken in riddles the way he did in this gospel.
Hi Jonny. Jesus said he spoke in parables (riddles) so that some people might NOT understand him and be saved (Matt 13:11-13); (Mk 4"10-12). I can't figure it out, why do you think God would want to hide the truth? Cheers, PR.
Phillip, He only “hides” Himself to those who won’t seek Him. Remember that He first tells them, in answer to their question as to why He spoke in parables, “To you has been given the secrets of the kingdom but to them it has not been given” Matt. 13:11, And : “ For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him. Heb.. 11:6 And: “ It is the glory of God to conceal things, but the glory of kings is to search things out.” Prov. 25:2. And: “You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart, Jer. 29:13
@@CSUnger Thank you for your scriptural reply. Christians can't search too many scriptures because "all scripture is God given --(for our education)". (2Tim 3:16). However if Jesus spoke in parables in order to reveal truth only "to whom it is given," then where did that leave those disciples who clearly did not understand, (Matt 15:16-17) and needed the parables explained? In a later event "-many disciples went back and walked with him no more" and Jesus asked Peter if he would also go away. (John 6:66-67). Jesus definitely lost "many", not just Judas "the son of perdition" (John 17:12). More research needed. "It is the glory of kings to search things out" Thanks, I like that, it gives me scriptural permission to continue my exegesis. My middle name is Rex. Cheers, PRR
He spake in parables so that only his elect (those who have ears to hear and eyes to see) would understand. In other words, those who were spiritually awakened.
You’re missing a very integral and important part as to why this “gospel” is not in the Christian Gospel. The Gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. It is this proclamation that is the foundation upon which all of Christianity is formed. It is the subject of the four canonical gospels, and is explicitly mentioned in every single Epistle in the New Testament. The Gospel is contrasted with worldly wisdom by Peter and Paul. So, when a book comes along which proclaims to have “wisdom” without having any mention of the Death, Burial, and Resurrection of Christ, it does not meet the standard for canonicity.
@@angelogonzalez602 : Don't even worry about it Gonzales,,, death will prove or disprove all our beliefs, ideology or speculation,,, "And just as it is appointed and destined for all men to die once and after this [comes certain] judgment",,,, Hebrews 9:27 Amplified Bible (AMP)
They were both rejected for the same reason...the book of Enoch was not written by the Enoch of Genesis, and the gospel of Thomas was not written by the disciple Thomas, who doubted it was really a resurrected Jesus who appeared to the disciples after He was crucified and confirmed dead . No book falsely attributed to an author can ever be accepted as Biblical...it's very simply the easiest way to eliminate what is not inspired by God Himself.
@@robertrude3573 Today , when you want your 15 minutes of fame , you take a selfie with a celebrity...in and around 200 B.C. to 200 A.D. when you wanted your 15 minutes of fame you wrote a fictional manuscript that borrowed heavily from already existing authoritative scriptures from the O.T or N.T. or both , and you signed the manuscript with the name of an already established Biblical person. That's what Enoch is, a fictional manuscript using borrowed texts from the O.T. and presented as an authentic book from "Enoch"...the Enoch of Genesis...that's to give it "street cred " It is already established that the book of Enoch was written sometime between 200 and 150 B.C....and that people of the time knew of it's existence and that it was not to be trusted. Enoch might be interesting reading...but it is assigned to a fictitious author and therefore is not a source of guidance for anything.
+ReligionForBreakfast +Alby Oooh yes please!!! That would be great. And mention the Gospel of Thomas, because this two are both “sayings-scriptures” and it was the Gospel of Thomas that proved the existence of “sayings-gospels”. Because there were a lot of people who were sceptical about that.
ShiverSeeker you want to shiver, seek out the amanita muscaria mushroom and it’s truth that was stolen and you are blindly worshipping a twisted truth. Christmas is about the shaman Jesus.
Monica Merino I believe in the Bible. I believe in Jesus. I’m an ex catholic and ex trinitarian. I do not believe in the “new age” at all. I just study the biblical esoterics and instead of just following Jesus, I do what he did. Eg. meditation, fasting, prayer, isolation. All these things, Jesus himself did. All these things are necessary for the sacred secretion. I wouldn’t say that reading the Bible, meditating, praying and being sexually moral is “new age.”
Yes, the ruling party took the ones they like the most and sanctioned it with the label "approved by church of god". Anything they did not like was removed. And they very likely spent the next 1600 years editing the books they like so that the books fit their sociopolitical narratives. Such was the case with the KJV where King James ordered the clergy to edit the predominant Geneva Bible in such a way so that the Puritans would lose their sway in politics.
ReligionForBreakfast half of todays political problems is connected with religions. Well mainly one particular religion, lol. Because that religion is very political.
One very interesting take on the origin of The Gospel of Thomas is that by Nicholas Perrin in "Thomas and Tatian: The relationship between the 'Gospel of Thomas' and the 'Diatessaron'". Perrin makes a convincing case that Thomas was originally written in Syriac, not Greek, because of the unusually high number of words or figures of speech (502, specifically) that are distinctively Syriac in nature. Some of these distinctive words and phrases even appear in other Syriac works, such as the "Odes of Solomon." He also shows rather convincingly that the puzzling order of sayings in Thomas can be explained by noting that at multiple points, the sayings collections follow the order of Tatian's "Diatessaron." The Diatessaron was a gospel harmony written by Tatian, which drew its material from Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John...all four canonical gospels. Therefore this would explain Thomas' dependence on the canonical gospels, which many others have noted. If this theory is correct, then dating Thomas becomes easier, because the Diatessaron was written between 170 and 175 CE. And if that's the case, then Thomas must have been created some time after that period---long after its supposed author was dead.
Oh, Christians! We want an answer to our question from your wise. ...... If the Lord was murdered by some people. what sort of god is this? ...... We wonder! Was He pleased by what they did to Him? If yes, blessed be they, because they achieved his pleasure . ...... But if He was discontented; this means their power subjugated His!! ...... Was the whole entity left without a Sustainer who answers the prayers? ...... Were the heavens vacated when he laid under the ground somewheres? ...... Were all the worlds left without a God that arranges the matter of the creation while His hands were nailed? ....... Why did not the angles help Him when they heard him while he wailed? ....... How could the rods stand to bear the True Lord when He was fastened. ...... How could the iron reach Him and His body pinioned? ...... How could His enemies’ hands reach Him and slap His rear. ...... And was Christ revived by himself or the Reviver was another god? ...... What a sight it is! A grave that enclosed a god! What’s more weird is the belly that had Him in it! ...... He stayed there for nine months in utter darknes, and fed by blood! ...... Then he got out of the womb as a small baby, weak and gaping to be breastfed! ..... He ate and drank, and did what that naturally resulted in (defecation and urination). Is this a god??!! ..... Exalted and high is the Almighty God above the lies of Christians. All of them will be held accountable for their libels ...... Oh Christians, for what reason the cross is it exalted, and for what reason you blame whoever rejects the cross? ...... Isn't the logic to break and burn the cross? Since the Lord was crucified on it and his hands were fastened to it? ...... That is really a cursed cross to carry, so discard it Don’t kiss it! ...... The Lord was abused on it and you adore it? So you are one of the Lord's enemies!! ...... If you extol it because it carried the Lord of the worlds. ......... Why don’t you prostrate yourself and worship graves, since the grave contained your god in it? ....... So, Christians, open your eyes, this is what the matter is all about.
Actually?the first three do a lot of copying... sometimes word for word...and God only knows where the person who wrote the Gospel of John,got his information?
There are two constants that I see in all the gospels and teachings of and about Jesus that is to love and to look inside yourself for truth. I'm sure all the gospels contain some truth but the fact they have been retranslated several times and written by man which only means that there are most likely some imperfections. I have gotten closer to god now that i have learned to look within.
Adam and Eve disobeyed God. He did not punish them for their lack of love or their lack of internal wisdom. The Gospels do not talk of a secret hidden inside of us that can lead to eternal life. When the rich man asked Jesus how he could attain salvation, the answer was not suprising given all that we learned in the old Testament! Obey Gods commandments, give your wealth to the poor and follow me!
@@eamonnmurphy1844 ..Didn't Jesus said.. The kingdom of God doesn't come with observation. You will not see it here or there. For indeed. The kingdom of God is within you..
Apocryphal, potentially; along with the Book of Enoch, Shepard of Hermas, and the Didache. These last three were inches from being included in the bible canon at the oecumenical council.
The Gospel of Thomas is not in the bible because it didn't/doesnt present itself as being inspired by God - nothing do with the popularity. There is not a shred of evidence that popularity had any bearing on the selection of biblical texts.
@Diego Aguila Your right, but he is the one who appointed the Council of Nicea to accumulate any and all documents, edit them and propose the final draft that became the "Bible". And after wards, attempted to destroy all documents in which they sought the data for it. Obiviously they didn't do a great job, hence the finding of the Dead Sea Scrolls, and other such books.
@Diego Aguila the history that we have on the council of nicea is entirely one sided and there was very much a political agenda involved. Constantine gave the catholic church political authority which is almost entirely considered to be a power move by secular historians. Given that they did immediately attempt to stamp out any deviant teachings of the religion, it is increasingly unlikely that there was a single truth that the church could build its foundations on. If you're not skeptical of the council of nicea then you're suffering from cognitive dissonance. Protestants often love to challenge the authority of the catholic and orthodox churches, but they draw the line where they would begin to contradict their own previously established narratives that they received as a result of those two systems.
@Maka Maka Though the Roman's, Jew's and Greek's kept maticulus records. There's no mention in any history except the book called the bible. And then only in the English translations does the word JESUS exist.
@@SamAdamsGhost Really, Consatine was the emperor of ROME. After years of feeding unorganized Christians to the lione, using them as human tourchs to illuminate events at night, and practice for Gladiators. He had an epifini. Allowed them to become organized and made himself POPE. But had nothing to do with it, Hmmmmm
I think the 'secret sayings' may very well reflect the time jesus was purported to have spent travelling around with his uncle - where he almost certainly would have travelled through india
I read somewhere that Jesus learned things in his 20s while traveling which is how he learned to heal people. So maybe you’re on to something. I just learned some somatic expirencing practices (rewiring the nervous system to heal from trauma loops) aspects of it come from India so therefore that could mean that God is not the only source to healing but rather the reflection of what god is capable of.
@@skkhammuansangngaihte4989 The incense trade route alone was a big deal in the 1st century AD. If nothing else, Jesus was a rabble rouser, a disruptive element, so I reckon his messiah pants were itching from an early age (by at least 12 apparently). So why no disruption mentioned in gospel accounts, etc? It all kicked off when he was approx 30...time enough to travel and trade. There's no proof he went to india, but if he did, it'd make a lot of sense, given the marked Buddhist element to his teachings.
What it can't help you relate to the Living Christ Jesus... That makes no sense they are words of wisdom from Jesus.. not a story of his life. If you are a Christian you want to understand spiritually the Gospel of Thomas, which has huge spiritual significance.
Simon Peter said to him, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "I myself shall lead her in order to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who will make herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven." (Saying 114, Gospel of Thomas). I think the very last verse of this "gospel" discredits it entirely.
Imaginary Made-up characters never said anything like that--- and you'd have to prove your BS statement that they are from "Jesus"... Matthew Mark Luke and John aren't even the actual writers of the supposed books-- They are all anonymous works of fiction...
@@300MediaProductions the first verse- those who hear these words and understand it's meaning will not taste death.....I guess you don't understand the meaning of what Jesus means and quite frankly very few do
I identify with the figure of Thomas and [t]his Gospel. I do feel doubtful and feel a need to 'put my finger on it' and the sayings written really inspire a new type of faith, beyond 'just cling to these ideas'. Edit: I appreciate your take of looking at Early Christianity as an organic and complex development, rather than the common dualistic notion of "Gnostics vs Orthodox". The development of religion is an organic and gradual thing, derived from Humans relation to their own existence and a collective construction of meaning.
Truly appreciate these presentations. Wish you didn't speak so fast.... But great depth and breath. Will you consider further Wisdom presentations? Nocea, Sophia?
*An 'omnipotent and all powerful' deity* *has allowed his message to mankind to be misinterpreted* so that it resulted in many 100's of worship ways, that call each other's beliefs as being from the devil ! Yahweh/Jesus is the god of confusion !
@The Thing Out of *ALL* the 34,000 Christian religions, which *ALL* claim to be the ONLY TRUE WAY ™, and call each other's beliefs as being from the devil, which one has the ONLY true worship ways, and is the _ONLY_ pathway to salvation ?
I have come to accept the book of Thomas because it has enriched a few topics I had questions about. I've read Thomas at least 10 times and I really enjoy it. And I'm now able to explain various of those saying which at first glance appear to contradict other saying but after further studying they go hand in hand with the rest of the bible.
I wonder if he knew more about Jesus personal life! I wonder why they didnt put Mary Madlene book neither in the bible! I would love to read her writings!🙄
I can understand why the Gospel of Thomas (well, at least of my understanding) was not added to the conical new testament. Paul was a very influential saint for the west, with his writings and preaching and the gentiles he went, too.. The Apostle Thomas went east; into the India area Thomas focused more on the teachings and the model Jesus set - Thomas understood the Resurrection and Jesus' miracles as important, but it is beyond human understanding. There is no narrative, in my opinion, within the Gospel of Thomas, because Thomas did not focus on a narrative - which would have to include his miracles and his Resurrection, but humans can't understand the complexities of Jesus' miracles and Resurrection, but they are very important. Again the focus was in the teachings and model Jesus left. This is my opinion and has become my understanding. I guess you can say :I'm "Team Thomas!"
It’s just an early gnostic text with greater influence from the actual gospels than the other gnostic gospels , which came to despise the real church more after this . That’s why it’s just sayings and had non of the Jewish narrative which was important especially for the early Jews church .
As anyone who takes the effort to do some research will find out, it wasn't written by Thomas and wasn't even written during Thomas' lifetime. As someone else already pointed out it contains heresy so it doesn't deserve to be counted among the inspired books. That is the basic qualification, inspiration.
Feel like a book of sayings would sell pretty well in our society. I've been watching a bunch of these meme videos since the quarantine and it's basically 30 minutes of ADD videos. Kind of like just a list of sayings of Jesus
I enjoy your videos. I actually left atheism behind and became a Gnostic after seeing your video. I had a God shaped hole in my heart that left me depressed. I am much better today, so thank you!
It is ridiculous that the original creeds determine which gosple is "canonical" and the other is "heresy". If you have faith in God which leading to the pathway at the very end, and you also have a progressive and open mind, you should collect all the "ideas", all from "different" sides in order to have your truly "one" for yourself. At the very end, only god can judge you for what you have done even though what you have done is criticized by others. There are various means from going one place to another. If the person flying by plane judge the person walking by foot that their mean is much better and vice versa, that doesn't make sense at all.
It's more of a collection of quotes, very different from a gospel. If there is something redeeming I can point out about the Gospel of Thomas, I would say the intention to collect the words of Jesus seems important. There is only 114 collected quotes, so I would say that is kind of significant? Some of them do match the 4 gospels, maybe it's a mistake to dismiss the text? Do we not want to know every spoken word Jesus said?? I do! Thomas felt it was important to collect every word, it's definitely noteworthy.
Interesting theories, another very interesting theory is that the Gospel Of Thomas was originally written in Aramaic, not Syriac like many believe and was one of the Hebrew/Christian books (Gospels of the Hebrews/Nazarenes/Ebionites) suppressed by the early church.
@@donaldseigel4101 interesting I thought it was undecided origin? isn't Syriac and Aramaic a derivative of each other that branched off in different directions?
@@m-bronte Yes but Syriac was used in the Levant mainly among Christians (upper Syria, Iraq, Southern Turkey), Aramaic was used among many Christians and Jews/Arabs in Israel/Palestine/Jordan/Lebanon) and Egypt. Ian Phillip Brown argues that this gospel was written by the Hellenized Jews in Alexandria, but using the same theories it could have been written by the first Christians who were in Roman Syria Palaestina (Israel/Palestine/Jordan).
@@donaldseigel4101 Thank you for the revelation, I didn't know that! I accepted the one faction of information and didn't look any further, very interesting. thx for responding.
The 4 Gospels are a Roman Military Version of 'Christ,' of Jesus, as Julius Caesar. The Nag Ha-Magadi Scrolls are the Hebrew Version of Sri Yeshua Ha-Messhiach!
Oh, there’s bias here. Especially in not acknowledging the potential political reasons why Thomas was rejected or the historical circumstances that might have contributed to its falling out of favor. It’s as if he’s neglecting the diversity of belief from the earliest periods of Yešua’s followers up until the Islamic conquests. But it’s still a decent video.
Starts off the whole video by saying he doesn’t see how it’s a gnostic text, then proceeds to talk about how it just wasn’t as “common” as the other 4 gospels. Of course it wouldn’t be, it’s a gnostic text! The gnostics were severely persecuted as heretics by what came to be our modern church
My interpretation is that the universe was created without much rhyme or reason, rather than specifically designed for us. But the purpose of religion is to make sense of chaos.
@@98Zai Religion is to come back into touch with God, connection, communion, living in God's Spirit. Even the word says so. The word religion comes from Latin re-ligare, to connect again. You know the word ligare from the English word ligament.
I have a Latin "Codex Gigas" that I'm trying to get translated. Maybe we could help each other out? You get content I get a translation so I can read it
I love your explanations. They’re very straightforward. I find it interesting that the reasons for Thomas not being included as a canonical gospel that you cite have nothing to do with the veracity (or potential veracity) of the text itself. The fact that it doesn’t provide historical context, wasn’t circulated with other Gospels, was not liked by the higher ups, and wasn’t popular, does not mean it wasn’t true or isn’t accurate. (I fully acknowledge that it is hard to identify whether or not the text was accurate, but I see the overlap with other gospel texts as more than interesting ) I guess for me, it’s an insufficient reason for the church to not have accepted it. It brings a question for me, though. What was the criteria for any given book being accepted as canonical?
I enjoyed reading your comment, AJ, and since I'm becoming increasingly persuaded of both the early authorship and authenticity of the Gospel of Thomas text, I wanted to share a couple of ideas with you from my observations. (This paragraph got a little longer than I expected. Sorry.) It looks to me like the main reason the Gospel of Thomas didn't get included in the canon isn't because of what it says, but because of what it doesn't say. There's never a mention of sin, no talk of Jesus being the savior of humankind, nothing about a resurrection and nothing about a coming judgment. That leaves the reader to ask themselves, wouldn't these things have been mentioned if they were an important part of Jesus' actual teaching? Or did, perhaps, those things get added later by the authors of the canonical gospels? (That's my position, today.) To me, what points most strongly to the Gospel of Thomas reflecting Jesus' original teaching is the relative power I consistently find in the teachings themselves, when compared to each other. For one example (and I can produce several), compare Saying #20, the parable of the mustard seed, with the canonical version found in Matthew and Luke (Quelle). I challenge anyone to tell me a useful lesson from the canonical version, which mistakenly treats mustard as something intentionally planted and then developing into a tree! Good grief! It's a weedy plant that grows thigh high. The Gospel of Thomas, on the other hand, factually correct, teaches a sweet lesson about heaven being present wherever the humble (mustard seed) share of themselves (sheltering leaves and seeds) for others in need (the birds of heaven). That's my provisional take. Hope you can enjoy this ponder with me. Thanks for reading this and all the best to you in your ongoing enquiry. Neil Hundtoft
@@OffRampTourist Hello SF. Thanks for this and I will enjoy responding. I just sent you an email which you can now disregard since I'm back here on the RU-vid site now. I'll be in touch soon. Thanks. Neil Hundtoft
@@OffRampTourist Hello again. To me, the Gospel of Thomas brings a message of comfort to the solitary, the marginalized and the poor with a teaching of presence and of living in the here and now. For me, these teachings resonate more deeply than do their parallel counterparts in the canonical gospels. The canonical parallels, by comparison, routinely trivialize a teaching or give it an apocalyptic sectarian application. To me, these observations support the idea that the Gospel of Thomas was the earliest of the gospels to be written and also that it offers the most authentic version of Jesus’ teachings to become available to us thus far. Here are a few comparisons for you to consider displaying what I believe I’m seeing there. Saying #46 / John 7:24-28 One can be greater even than John. The saying in Thomas teaches that as great a man (as a mind/body/ego/person born of woman) as John the Baptist was, anyone who becomes a child (one who rejects the ego identity and returns to the non-judgmental awareness of a nursing infant) will come to know a greater peace than even John the Baptist knew. In the Gospel of John parallel, however, it appears that John is simply being excluded from the kingdom for being less worthy than the least of those who did make it in, though we aren’t told why. Thomas teaches a lesson. John expresses an unexplained judgment. Saying #86 / Luke 9:57-58 Finding no rest. This saying of Thomas speaks to the human condition and is Jesus’ equivalent of the first noble truth of Buddhism. It declares that In all of being, humans are uniquely and chronically discontent, the rest-less species. In Luke, the words are employed merely as a self-referential complaint about having a busy schedule. Saying #89 / Matthew 23:25-26 Washing the outside of the cup The Thomas saying points out that the true self, the one “not born of woman”, is already perfect and complete and therefore in no need of washing. Self-help programs, fasting, meditation, classes, yogas and disciplines all aim to improve, repair and cleanse the ego-self. Because all such effort is the ego attempting to cure the ego, it is as futile as it is unnecessary. Yet Matthew’s position reflects this precise view. While the author chastises his audience for their hypocritical behavior, he tells them to clean up their thinking and attitude first so that they can behave appropriately. Thomas reflects a greater insight into the nature of the self. Saying #107 / Luke 15:1-7 The lost sheep. The Thomas saying describes how, discontented with our “flock”, we wander away in search of truth and peace on our own terms. Having exhausted our search and never finding what we were looking for, we give it all up in despair. At the end of our wandering, when we are sure we are lost and all is futile, we quit and call off the search. It is precisely our stopping the wandering and our becoming still that prepares us to be able to hear the sweet comforting voice of the shepherd telling us that we are and always have been precious and priceless life itself. The audience and benefactor of this saying from Thomas is the tormented individual who is given reassurance and comfort at their moment of despair. But when we look at Luke, we see the audience has become the church leadership celebrating their successful missionary program in bringing a sinner back into conformity with the flock. I hope that this gives you an idea of how I’ve been approaching my read of Thomas. It’s difficult for me to compare these parallels and not be persuaded that the redaction by the canonical authors resulted in text lacking the spiritual gravity of the lessons we read from the Gospel of Thomas. As all of my study has been completely independent, I encourage and welcome any critique and corrections you have time to share. Thanks for the contact and for expressing interest. Neil Hundtoft
The canonical gospels place Jesus alone as the son of God, whereas the gospel of Thomas puts YOU as the son of God. To my mind that is why the canon rejects Thomas.
It is interesting that in the following verse, Paul quotes from a scripture that has preceded him: *However, as it is written: “What no eye has seen, what no ear has heard, and what no human mind has conceived - the things God has prepared for those who love him- [1 Corinthians 2:9]* Nowhere can we find such a statement in the Bible, however something very similar is found in the apocryphal Gospel of Thomas: *“Jesus said: ‘I will give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has not entered into the heart of man’” [Gospel of Thomas, saying 17]*
It is a quotation of Isaiah 64:4. If one follows the principles of NT quotation as per Solomon Glassius in ‘Phililogia Sacra’ , then Isiah 64:4->1Cor 2:9 is of the same type as Matt 4:10 or Rom 11:3,4. In such quotations, individual words are varied by omission, addition, or transposition.
@@BillyWayneMcCann -- Isaiah 64:4 begins similarly, but its conclusion is about evidence of other deities, not the rewards for following God. It isn't merely a difference of diction or phrasing; it's a major semantic difference.
What if you dont buy into the pauls conversion from Saul the enemy of the Lords original message?...if you don't follow that roman mythraism style reframing of the life of Jesus the. The gospel of Thomas who fled to india away from the draconian authories that killed our Lord seems to become much more likely to have real value, because its been in a tomb away from the romans for so long its likely to be the uncorrupted word of the Messiah possibly?...🤔
A nice short summary on the Gospel of Thomas. Though the Gospel of Thomas is Gnostic despite what some scholars say (and challenging what he says at 1:50-1:55); Gospel of Thomas Saying SEVEN describes the LION, which in Gnosticism represents the Demiurge, which any sane human wouldn't want to be devoured and eaten by; also Gospel of Thomas Saying FIFTY describes THEY, which represents the wicked Archons, which matches the ascent of the soul, stories, past the gatekeeper Archons in Gnostic literature; I cannot think of any other plausible interpretations for these two sayings from the Gospel of Thomas. This makes the Gospel of Thomas well and truly Gnostic, though a Softer form of Gnosticism, similar to Valentinianism as there are more optimistic elements of Hermeticism and Neo-Platonism to be found in the Gospel of Thomas as well.
I would imagine there were hundreds of different teachings, beliefs, and gospels in every section of early Christianity. It wouldn't really matter if we had undisputed manuscripts of Jesus's actual words. It wouldn't solve or prove anything. Man, prophet, God. The human race has been worshiping nonsense since the beginning. We aren't able to travel back in time to test the veracity of their beliefs. Worshiping a God that doesn't make itself known to everyone is ridiculous. It gets even more ridiculous when said God has no issue revealing itself to a chosen few.
I find it interesting that "Thomas" is derived from twin, Thomas is called "the twin" in the NT and the Gospel of Thomas calls him didymus Thomas - "twin/twin" - Greek/Aramaic - twin of who?
Apostle Thomas is Christian conversion of Thomaism religion. Like budism and mitraism, Thomas was son of God as every mediator between man and God. They say the mixture between budism, mitraism and Thomaism which is not Greek Gnosticism if not Greek steel this Gnosticism from Thomaism people as many other. The main character of Thomaism religion is Medeea which is not the Greek monstrosity . The Roman poet Ovidius Publius Naso exiled at ...Tomis, explained in Elegy no. 9 from Triste book, about Medeea. Which is a meditation method. And her story is almost identical as Christian myth of Passions. Including crucifing moment.
Thanks Andrew, informative and concisely presented as always. Lots to contemplate and as comments have suggested, the answer on inclusion/exclusion might simply, and basely, be...follow the money.
Kinda like the 7 books that were there for 1100 years but because of Luther they were removed. He also wanted to remove the Book of James and a Revelation
