I remember when I was a kid, my uncle bought the soundtrack to Wrath of Khan and I was able to call the scenes just from listening to the music lol One of my favorites growing up. Still is.
The swearing was completely at odds with the whole ethos of Star Trek IMHO and really annoyed me. However it could be viewed as a metaphor for the slow disintegration of Star Fleet.
I remember the days when Paramount and some of the production staff for Star Trek (around the time of First Contact, Trek's first PG-13 episode...er, I mean "film") said: "You'll never see an R-rated Star Trek, nor will you hear an F-bomb in Trek." Well....never say never....I guess?
I love Paul Winfield’s Capt. Tyrel! His character gives you a glimpse of the rest of Starfleet. An officer tasked with largely routine assignments that are essential to the coherence of the fleet. But when crisis emerges is willing to sacrifice himself to protect others. Beautifully understated heroism that fleshes out the rest of the world Kirk and crew live in. I also think he’s terrific in the first Terminator movie as one of the police detectives. Paul Winfield always seemed to make his characters believable and vivid.
He was a fantastic voice actor too. He did a fantastic Don King satire character on The Simpsons and I loved his narrations on A&E's City Confidential. He left us way too soon.
I went and watched Wrath of Khan just so I could watch this. In all my days I would never have thought I’d ever cry watching a Star Trek movie, but alas cry I did. Shatner was amazing in this.
I believe I first watched Wrath of Khan when I was in middle school. My only exposure to Trek at that time was largely TNG, the Kelvin movies, and maybe one or two other movies with the original cast. Even with the lack of exposure to Trek at the time, it still made me tear up. I think you should get your son to watch it. I think the movie sets up Kirk and Spock’s relationship quite well in the movie so that you don’t need the context of what came before to truely get the emotional response of the end.
I am actually jealous that you got to experience it for the first time. I watched it at an uninformed age in high school. I had no attachment and knew that Spock lives because I had seen other movies. It was not until I was more emotionally mature and lost someone in my life that was as impactful, as Spock was to Kirk and Bones, that I truly understood.
Spock's death is THE best death secene in movies ever. only Kirks eulogy makes me cry more. When his voice cracks i'm right there with kirsty ally, blubbing like a little girl. edit. An i will love amazing grace on the bagpipes till i die :)
Darthdrezz Legit, I think ST2’s arrangement of Amazing Grace is the best that was ever done. The way it transitions from bagpipes to full orchestra is a thing of beauty. Star Trek is not the place you’d expect to find the greatest arrangement of all time of a Christian hymn, but that’s how it worked out.
When Kirk collapses and barely says no, it hits new that's he's just been through hell and has nothing left to mourn with. Also the way Spock adjusts his shirt in the radiation chamber after he stands up. Composed to the very end.
4 года назад
I used to play Amazing Grace for my Grandmother because it was her favorite song so it hit be even harder. Plus I've always loved the pipes.
Spock going about the task of saving the ship (while knowing it would kill him) and he still maintains his courage and focus is one of the most heroically selfless scenes ever.
I always thought undiscovered country was the perfect military/political aspect of the films of the star trek 80's franchise that brings kirk down from his bitter distrust for the klingon empire,to the realization that everything trek had endeavored to create and designed to uphold was at risk. Excellent realistic much like wrath of Khan. Thanks
3 could have been better, but let’s be honest sequels are hard to pull off well. 6 was the perfect send off, Generations is the worst movie ever made and never should have involved Kirk
@@frankknudsen842 I dislike the director's cut of Undiscoverd Country. That edit completely implicates the Federation while letting the Klingons off the hook,
What was brilliant when the Enterprise first encounters the Reliant is that is EXACTLY what pirate ships would do. Flying same flag of the ship they're planning to attack so they can get close enough to fire on them without raising suspicion.
It hadn't occurred to me that there was a real-life precedent for that, and it makes sense that Khan would be more aware of such a tactic than Kirk would. It probably didn't cross Kirk's mind that a Federation ship COULD be hijacked. Great comment.
@@RicardoAGuitar Not only did pirates do that, but in the days of sail military ships would do that to each other or to allow them to get close enough to capture merchantmen. Ever hear of the term "under false colors" ?
@@christophersmith8316 There were even German raiders around NZ during WW2 sinking NZ merchant shipping that were flying Japanese flags. It is a tactic of intelligence. A trick that anyone can pull off in a battle that is not dumb.
I was watching a video about the WW2 destroyer USS Kidd, and how on patrol in the Pacific came upon one plane dogfighting with another. They thought it odd that a US plane could be so far out, but didn't really pay it any heed. Turns out BOTH planes were Japanese, and they used to ruse to get close, and ran a kamikaze attack on the Kidd. Killed several seamen, and mission killed the DD. She returned to base under her own power, but the war was over for the ship.
Director, talked of using Navy battleship tacticz, azz nfluence 4 his battlez. He learned well, from George Lucas, who used old aerial warplane footage, 2 story da movementz of his Sci-Fi craft, n STAR WARS- Episode #4. A NEW HOPE. ( Da 1st STAR WARS. )
For me the best aspect of this film is watching James Tiberius Kirk struggling with the passage of time and the choices he had made after he sees his son as a grown man. Poignant stuff. Also loved the scene where the Enterprise comes up behind the Reliant like a leviathan rising from the depths. Movie ranks as one of my all-time favorites, and I'm old enough to remember seeing it in the theater.
What I feel is so great about this is that as time goes by and one gets older, the struggles he had and represented become more personal for the viewer who has grown up with the film. Makes it feel even more poignant when i watch the film these days, especially having to wear glasses.
Yes, that awkward hug between Kirk and his boy was wonderful. You could just tell this was something he’d longed for, but never thought he’d have the chance to do.
Listened to 15 minutes of this before I went to Amazon prime and rented the movie and watched it for the first time. I Won't lie, I was several beers in, and deep in my cups, and I cried like a baby when Spock died, and then again at the funeral. And Kahn quoting Captain Ahab's final words as he is stabbing Moby Dick; "From Hells heart I stab at thee, with my last breath, I spit at thee." Good God what a fantastic movie, how has the bar been movied so low in the production of movies today? What a phenomenal, perfect film.
You may know this already, but Spock was supposed to die, originally, during the first battle with the Reliant. He was supposed to die, originally, where Peter Preston died. When fans heard about the death, they rewrote the script, put the simulator scene in there with Spock's false death and that line to basically take the tension off of the idea that Spock would die.
A thought about the most clever piece of writing, which most fail to notice. When Spock gives Kirk the Bday present, Dickens' a Tale Of Two Cities, Kirk reads the famous FIRST line of the book (it was the best of times, it was the worst of times), and asks if there's a hidden message. Spock says none that he aware of except of course "Happy Birthday". But the foreshadowing message is in the famous LAST lines of that same book; the main character sacrifices his life, to save another and says "It is a far, far better thing I do, than I have ever done. A far better rest I go to, than I have ever known."
Kirk says, "I stayed away." He knew about the kid. Carol wanted him to stay away from their son, because she didn't want David to want to be with Kirk.
Scotty saying "He's dead already." Is such a powerful line and evokes the feeling of World War 1 and 2. There was a man on one of the British Battlecruisers during the battle of Jutland who flooded his turrets magazine. It was the last thing he ever did and it saved the ship.
Yes HMS Lion. Major Francis Harvey the mortally wounded turret commander gave the order to close all hatches and flood the turret magazine. Moments later there was a flash fire in the now isolated turret. Dead crew where found still holding the handles to close the hatches to the magazine after the battle.
Kirk: We've had it once your way, Khan. Are you game for a rematch? Khan...I'm laughing at the superior intellect. Khan's ego was his achilles' heel. I loved this discussion. I saw Wrath of Khan in theatres. I was a kid. My uncle took me. The creature that Khan put in Chekhov's ear freaked me the hell out.
Shatner gets so much shit for his acting. TMP look at how reserved he is TWOK look at how vulnerable he plays Kirk TSFS shows we can still play the action hero TVH nails comedy TFF ... well .... TUDC gets his send off with dignity
Yeah the ear creature freaked me out as a kid but the guy that died in the transporter, in the Motion Picture scared me. I closed my eyes every time I watched it. Also knowing it was a Vulcan that could keep his emotions in check, screams in distorted pain.
I always love the scene of Kirk's inspection, he takes out the white cloth, takes a swipe, no dirt and the grin on Scotty's face (basically telling Kirk: Not today buddy!)
I have never seen discovery, Picard or Lower Decks, and listening to you guys, I’m glad I can keep my pleasant memories of Star Trek’s golden age intact.
I’ve always believed Kirk knew he had a son. There’s no scene of him reacting to a revelation of that. Lines from Kirk to Dr. Marcus such as, “Is that David?!” and, “I did what you asked; I stayed away.” both make it clear to me that he always knew about his son but had removed himself, maybe against his own wishes.
It's obvious to me that Kirk knew about David when he and Carol Marcus are talking inside the planetoid. "I did what you wanted," he says. "I stayed away. Why didn't you tell him?"
The best line in ANY Rocky film occurs in II -- "He's all wrong for us, baby; I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man kept coming after you. Now, we don't need no man like that in our lives." Tony Burton's Duke is arguably the heart + soul of the franchise.
I liked the way in wrath of Khan the ships felt like these giant heavy behemoths they were slow and hulking. When the space battles kicked off it felt more like I was watching hunt for red October or any film about naval combat. As star trek progressed the starships started to act more like aircraft zooming around on screen and doing barrel rolls, having dog fights and what not while that can look cool , it works with a smaller ship like the defiant in deep space 9 but even the enterprise e in the next generation films it just never looked right. These are huge ships , larger than most sports stadiums here on earth. I just wish they'd bring back that slow and methodical feeling to space combat in star trek. The only other sci-fi shows that have a similar vibe I can think off are the expanse and the battle star Galactica reboot . And I guess that's the one thing the jj films did right, the enterprise felt heavy in those movie. In discovery and Picard , oh boy the discovery flies like an x-wing.
It's the "structural integrity field". Star Trek ships are contrived to be held together by intricate gravitic forcefields that cancel or synchronize inertial forces so the ship behaves like one a single point of mass when maneuvering. I'm reminded of a line in Mass Effect where Joker marvels at the fact that Sovereign managed to pull off a turn that would have torn _any_ other ship in half. You'll never hear that in Star Trek because of the SIF system hard-baked into the canon.
I just discovered another clever subversion in wrath of khan that I never realized until a few moments ago (even though I saw this movie in theaters nearly 40 years ago). In the begining when its kirks birthday, Spock gives him a copy of the novel "A Tale of Two Cities" and kirk reads the very famous first line "it was the best of times,it was the worst of times" and asks spock if thats a mesage. Spock says none that hes aware of. But the last line of the novel is almost as famous, a character sacrifices his own life, to sa e another, and as he heads to the guillotine says, "it is a far, far better thing I do, than I have ever done. A far better sleep I?go to than I have ever known." The book did have a message, but that theme is not at the beginning of the book, its at the end of the book. Just like Spocks death is at the end of the movie.
1:16:20 Kirk knew. He asked "is that David?" And later they argued, "I did what you wanted, I stayed away. Why didn't you tell him?" Kirk knew. David didn't.
Trekkie since I was a kid. Was in my early twenties when I saw it in a theater and I was blown away. This movie is still a masterpiece, hands down. I can never get enough of the musical score. It's the best score in Star Trek.
I always felt Horner brought back the serene austere of the Vulcans back with the music at the end in the long panning shot as the camera is finding its way to Spock's capsul.
@@rawheadrex1972 Horner was brought in as a replacement composer and uber couple James Cameron and Gale Ann Heard were riding him hard on a short schedule making insane demands on him till he stood up to them and made them back off. They made up eventually and Heard was proud that his music for Aliens was used in the trailers for many action films afterward. Cameron asked him to compose for his film Titanic and they made history again.
Bibi Besch that played Kirk's old flame Carol actually passed away in 1996. She done plenty more films and tv shows after Star Trek II. Advanced breast cancer claimed her sadly at only aged 54. Bibi was in classic film Tremors memorably killed off in her car getting swallowed up.
Mr Jones I remember her in Nick Meyer’s The Day After. Striving for normalcy and changing the beds before being hauled down to the basement by John Cullum, kicking and screaming before the big one drops
One understated juxtaposition is the new recruits in the first action and then how they act once Kirk comes on board again. They are bloodied veterans now as they calmly prep torpedoes. Now Kirk's words about him and the trainee crew at the beginning of the movie "we have gone through death and life together" is now really true. Also, got to love the detail of the guy vacuuming the floors in the background of star fleet command hallways. Just makes for a lived in world as CD noted in the review. Well done movie.
I went to see William Shatner at the Stranahan Theatre in Toledo a couple years ago and afterwards, they showed WOK. What a combo. If you ever get a chance to see him, go do it. He's gold.
The Prefix Code that Kirk sends to Reliant: translating that for today's audience, Kirk pulled up the root certificate for Reliant's OS in order to run malware through the uploaded file.
Its funny I feel like the term 'Prefix code' still works in its simplicity. Newtrek would say something silicom valley like 'OS and malware' to be hip but come off sounding very 20th century.
Definitely one of the few hacking attempts in film that actually stands well today. Frankly, an admiral being more familiar with the code and explaining it to an officer made that scene better.
I saw this in Theatre when I was 10, I left the movie in tears, Spock was dead. Holy shit this was an Amazing film, one of my absolute favorites. After listening to y'all discuss this, I'm watching it again for the 100th time 😁
Ive seen this Star Trek movie more than any other. It's cool to know other people have appreciated it as much as I have/had the same experiences and remember them to this day.
Yea Horner is very good. He elevates films. This film and clear and present danger are just 2 examples of great horner work imo. I get frustrated when people say his stuff all sounds the same because if it fits the scene it fits the fits the scene. It still works. You can say that about any film composer.
Well said. Some people don’t like First Contact much. There’s no accounting for tastes. The uniforms in TWOK are exactly right. Much better than the weird uniforms in early TNG.
I'm 50 years old I'm a combat veteran and I've been a fireman for the last 20 years and I still get teary when Spock dies. And I've seen the movie 25 times....
@@abbaszaidi8371 The " 'Sir, the mains are back on line' guy" doesn't get _NEARLY_ enough credit. (I was going to respond here, but I'll post it as a top-level Comment instead.)
A great moment in Star Trek (also proving that Vulcans can in fact cry) was STNG when Sarek is losing control of his emotions due to his illness, and he struggles to not cry while listening to a Mozart String Quartet. The intensely underplayed performance by Mark Leonard, the cuts to Troy feeling his struggle and the music make for a wonderful moment. You really feel Sarek struggling with his overwhelming grief and his loss of Vulcan dignity and control..
Picards emotional explosion during the mindmeld always puts a lump in my throat. "Did you knoww? Did you KNOW? How much I... I... LOVE YOOOOUUUU!!!!" So much repressed feeling underneath.
1:42:35 I'd say the Mutara Nebula is actually the protoplanetary dust cloud around a young star, before it had the time to coalesce into planets. When the Genesis Device pops off it pulls that dust into a planet and sweeps away the nebula to reveal the star that was there all along.
My mother has a VHS tape with the TOS episode "Space Seed" followed immediately by The Wrath of Khan recorded on it. Best way to watch, so you get the whole story.
This movie had a deep impact on my life in the 80's. This is by far the best Star Trek movie EVER. i shed a tear when I first saw the movie in the theater. An unexpected kick in the nuts.
The fact Khan and Kirk are never in the same room together and it completely works shows you how powerful good writing and acting can be instead of a good guy punching a bad guy until he wins..... Into Darkness cough cough
They did a test screening of the movie without the torpedo scene at the end and the producer said the audience left the theater like they were walking out of a funeral. So they added it in to give the audience/fans hope.
Wrath of Khan is probably my fave movie ever made. It's the best that Star Trek as to offer. I plan to make soms videos myself eventually and will definitely be covering this. Thanks Drinker.
Trek reaches a turning point when Shatner, who's acting has been dubiously commented on in the past, is made to look really good by a previously well respected character actor.
Shatner's "bad" acting is always over-stated. You watch the original series and most of the time he delivers a very thoughtful and serious performance, particularly Season 1 and 2.
@Lady Wanderer I can distill the major difference between classic trek and nu trek in that scene and how smart and well read the writers are when spock is telling kirk he has to make peace with the klingons. Only nixon could go to china
@Lady Wanderer Watching a lot of season 1 of the original series you feel what everyone, Shatner included, were trying to do. A very serious, for the most part, depiction of a future. They knew they were never going to get all the facts right, but the intention of depicting a future where humanity strives to be way better than it is today was always at the core. Shatner only on occasion hammed it up, and as he himself has said, it was a result of trying to put a lot of energy into the role. Kirk was never really meant to be a "person" unto himself, more of a representation. Really, that goes for every cast member. All of the ethnic specifics were intended as racial representations. Spock is a representation of the idea that the crews of Starfleet vessels are diverse and full of aliens and humans from all over the galaxy. Shatner was doing his part. Nobody else could have done that part the way Bill did.
I'm sure someone has already pointed this out but I always understood that when Kirk said "I did what you wanted. I stayed away." implied that he did indeed know that he had a child with Carol Marcus, but that he chose to abide her wishes that he not be involved with that child's life.
Thank you guys for this!!! I'm one of those nuts that can recite the dialog from this movie from, "Captain's log, stardate 8130.3" to "I feel young." There have been better movies made, but this is my number one movie due to being a Star Trek fan since I can remember and the experience I had going to see this movie. I snuck the car out the week of Memorial Day and went to the Showcase Cinema East in Monroeville to see this movie. I have never been to a movie where the crowd was so into the film. People applauded during the titles and it only got better from there. So many of things you talked about from the Kobyashi Maru scene to the eulogy at the end were story telling and Star Trek at its best. Thanks again!!! There is so much depressing things going on in the world today. It was great to listen to you guys talk about a production so well done!!!
Best moment in Star Trek for me. Kirk: Damn it, Bones, you're a doctor. You know that pain and guilt can't be taken away with a wave of a magic wand. They're the things we carry with us, the things that make us who we are. If we lose them, we lose ourselves. I don't want my pain taken away. I need my pain.
So, Nerdrotic you were 12 when the movie came out...I was born in 1961. I saw this film with my mates when I was in college in Greece from 82 to 84. Spock's death did touch me a bit, but you know the hardest thing to watch was the Enterprise taking damage--seeing the Old Girl get carved up like that by Reliant's phasers was almost a physical shock.
Actually (put in for Nerdrotic), if you'll recall the dialogue between Carol Marcus and Kirk, they discuss David. Kirk knew he had a son, he just hadn't really met him. Carol basically asked Kirk to stay away because she didn't want David chasing after him into Starfleet. Further, they both recognized that they had careers that neither was going to give up to make a family. As a result, Carol raised David and kept Kirk away.
With DS9 they probably don't like the part in _Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang_ when Sisko says he feels uncomfortable with the Vic Fontaine holo-program's setting (Las Vegas 1962), because of the racial strife of the era meant that blacks were never allowed to be customers at a place like Vic's lounge, only as entertainers or janitors. Kasidy is kind of shocked by this and explains that the program is not designed to contain any of the racial tensions of the 1960s because it's just there to entertain people and Sisko doesn't have the right to spoil their fun or be personally upset about something that happened hundreds of years ago between people who are long dead.
Yea if sisko cant get over that, why should anyone in europe get over the african enslavement of big chunks of spain and sicily over a thousand years ago.. its the same shit. But africans did it first. But sisko probably didnt even know about that.
@@chrissullivan6403 In the context of the 24th century, it's like if Drinker was emotionally invested about the Scots rebelling against the English under William Wallace. History buffs would know of it, but wouldn't be that emotionally invested. Considering that Sisko liked African art, I would think he'd be more interested in Bantu culture and maybe Cajun culture (because of his dad). American civil rights would only be a small facet of his interest in African cultures until Far Beyond the Stars.
Actually lads CG is WAY MORE EXPENSIVE than miniatures. The movie Moon (Sam Rockwell) needed moon buggys, moon buildings etc. and a Scottish company ended up making them for $47,000 dollars. The CGI quote was $500,000 dollars. The producer was so astonished that when he got the quote from the Scottish company he said "Are you missing a zero in this quote?" : )
Something nice about this (really good) discussion is that it's a positive discussion of things we love in film and film history. When there's so much bad cinema and storytelling, this is refreshing. :)
Please don’t ever take these down dude, the banter between you and Gary and recollecting the film is like being at a bar :) love revisiting them! Been a sub for ages and very glad to see your channel grow and wish you the best
You know, the problem with modern Star Trek is that it peaked with the 2009 movie. That was supposed to be a starting point for a new franchise. Problem is, JJ Abrams and Alex klutzman didn't realize that these characters and these organizations would eventually have to become the heroes and the establishments that we knew them as in the original Canon. It was okay to make the 2009 movie slightly more pessimistic, and slightly more morally ambiguous, because we're seeing the characters before they were the heroes that we would come to know them as. We were supposed to see their journey. But instead of showing a hero's journey to betterment, they just doubled down on pessimism and nihilism, and ultimately made everything that came after the 2009 reboot worse and worse. The original movies actually had progression of their characters, learning and growing and attempting to be better than they were before. The characters never grow in these new series, they never go on any journeys of betterment, they just stay the same self-righteous sticks in the mud that they were in the beginning of their journey. I really want to have hope for the new series "Strange New Worlds". it's literally the original incarnation of Star Trek that Gene tried to put out first. In any other situation this would be momentous. Unfortunately because it's still in the hands of Alex klutzman and his gaggle of hacks, I expect it to be an awful, terribly written and executed show with shallow characters and no development outside of virtue signaling. It actually makes me sad that we finally get what Gene Roddenberry was trying to give us and it's in the hands of such amateurs.
To his credit, Simon Pegg rather sloppily attempted some progression in Beyond but it wasn't a very good plot, premise or execution. Outside of humor he just isn't that talented a writer.
2009 was awful. It set the franchise up to fail. Exactly like force awakens did. They got the characters and mythology so wrong at the most basic level of could not be saved afterwards
Producers of good _Star Trek_ : today is a bit shit; let's give people a better tomorrow to strive for. Producers of bad _Star Trek_ : today is a bit shit - let's give people more of it.
A favorite memory of college is walking through the student union at 4 and seeing Star Trek playing on one of the few televisions there. All the nerds would just stand there and watch it. It was riveting. And if you heard the music you'd hurry for a place on the carpet to watch.
I love the "Sir, the mains are back on line" guy. He does NOT get enough credit. Total Wesley Crusher move. He saved the ship - saved everyone, actually. (Well, maybe not Spock.) I'm not even joking. Look how things actually went down on the bridge. When Spock fixed the warp drive, that happened down in the engine room, far away; it's not like it set off bells and whistles up on the bridge. The Computer didn't announce, _"ATTENTION:_ _you_ _may_ _now_ _resume_ _warp_ _speed"._ It wasn't like that at all. Our boy - I'll refer to him as "Cadet Superdrunk", a name I will explain in a couple of paragraphs - _wasn't_ _even_ _at_ _his_ _own_ _console._ The bridge engineering station was being manned by some bleached-blond trust-fund twit, who was staring thoughtfully at his controls, as though waiting for the system to unfreeze. Meanwhile, our hero, Cadet Super drunk, was standing to the blind guy's right. No, actually, he was leaning . . . actually, he was _lounging,_ like a boss, apparently just chatting with the blond guy. ("Ah, we'll be OK. So, this Khan guy, what a prick, amiright?"). But the thing is, Cadet Superdrunk isn't slacking off; he's keeping an eagle eye on the one display that matters: a primitive, inscrutable monochrome bar graph displaying current radiation levels in the warp core. (Apparently. That's what it looks like, anyway.) When Spock does his thing, we cut to a closeup of that display as it shows the core radiation levels begin to drop across the board - and thennthe display paints the word "NOMINAL" across the level bars. The word only flashes for a moment - it's gone in the next shot - and Blondie just states silently at it, like a moron trying to convert Fahrenheit to Celsius while his house is burning down. But our man, Cadet Superdrunk, instantly realizes what it means: they have warp-speed capability again, _right_ _now._ (I assume once the average of the radiation levels falls into a "nominal" range, the core automatically drops out of safe mode - kind of like how a heater's thermostat trips off once the thermocouple reaches a particular temperature. I don't know the exact details. But the point is, that's all Cadet Superdrunk needed to see.) It turns out I was slightly misremembering what happened next. Here it is: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-XeGRwe4g0ew.html The way I remembered it, our guy was covered with nervous sweat - unlike Kirk - and he whirled and shouted, _"Sir,_ _the_ _mains_ _are_ _back_ _on_ _line!!". But that's not our man's style. No, Cadet Superdrunk is cool as a cucumber - I swear, he looks like he should be holding a latte in one hand. He calmly turns his head and remarks, "Sir, the mains are back on line," in the same tone of voice you'd use to tell your boss, "Sir, they're announcing who won the contract." ( _Kirk_ is the one who's sweating, with a desperate look in his eye.) You know what would've happened if Sulu hadn't hit the throttle at _that_ _moment?_ It would've been too late. Now, I'll grant you, the film does not actually state this as fact. But I've read Vonda McIntyre's novelization - and as I recall, that does state explicitly that the _Enterprise_ just _barely_ gets away. (And then only because Sulu - the perfect helmsman - had pre-entered the course, so when Kirk barked the order, Sulu reflexively dart his hand out and hit _EXECUTE_ without looking. (I wouldn't ordinarily take this as canon. However, I'll make an exception for Vonda McIntyre - a writer whom Gene Roddenberry respected enough that he actually permitted her to choose Sulu's _first_ _name,_ the year before.) And that's the story of how Cadet Superdrunk saved _Star_ _Trek._ That dude is a pimp. Incidentally, do you know who _played_ the "Sir, the mains are back on line" guy? He was a then-unknown Bruce McCulloch. Did you know that? Americans probably won't recognize the name (even though he was briefly a writer for _SNL_ ). But every Canadian reading this just spit maple syrup on their keyboard. Because about three years after saving the _Enterprise,_ McCulloch became a founding member of The Kids In The Hall. And among many, many, other characters, he played my favorite: Superdrunk. The drunken superhero. (This is the sort of amusing factoid that IMDB.com really ought to call out in their Trivia section for the film. I can't think how they missed it.)
@@tk421zz M.A.D., you may be expecting me to challenge you on this; but in fact I am quite willing to believe that was Nicholas Guest. When I first wrote up that comment, I decided to try to nail down just who the "Sir, the mains are back on line!" actor was. Not because it had anything to do with my observations . . . but I've been wondering who that guy was since approximately 1982. So I had to at least _try._ After my0 first research attempt, using only IMDB credits and Google Images. My best guess was this "Nicholas Guest" fellow -- who was was listed as "Cadet" in the "Full Cast & Crew" list in IMDB, in what _seemed_ to be the right place for having a line in that sequence. I also found some contemporary photos of Guest (though I couldn't 100% guarantee they were of him), and he seemed to be the same guy. In fact, I even found this link to a late-2016 thread on The Trek BBS insisting it was Guest: www.trekbbs.com/threads/kids-in-the-hall-member-in-star-trek-ii.285061/ (In this thread it's even claimed that Nicholas Guest is Christopher Guest's younger brother. I have no reason to doubt this, or believe it.) What convinced me that it was _TKITH's_ Bruce McCulloch was -- you guessed it -- Twitter. Specifically, this late-2012 tweet by some unchecked fellow going by "Art Allen": twitter.com/punsultant/status/284872627959525377 I also found a couple other sources that hinted of McCulloch having a role in _STII:TWOK._ Here's an example: brucemcculloch.livejournal.com/553.html So I went with it. I'm so ashamed. (Although I would like to know what your source was.) Anyway, sorry for that. I still stand by everything else I said about that bad boy, though.
This might be the greatest thread of all time. From the revelation of Cadet Superdrunk bypassing the blind trust fund fella to being the brother of Nigel Tufnel of Spinal Tap????!!!!
2:54:10 In Undiscovered Country, Spock states that Chancellor Gorkon's daughter didn't cry because Klingons have no tear ducts, BUT.... In TNG: Birthright, legend tells of Kahless filling an ocean with his tears. Also, Worf's brother Kurn tears up in DS9: Sons of Mogh. 😭
My favourite moment is "Shut up Spock we're rescuing you!" - not the line itself, but how it represents the culmination of Bones & Spock's rivalry/friendship/animosity/resepct - it's great.
Since Drinker noted the naval/military feel of Trek in STII, it should be noted that Roddenberry pitched Trek as "Horatio Hornblower in space", and that Harve Bennett said he didn't understand Trek until he saw it as Hornblower. ST fans who like the exploration and character development of a leading commander, check out horatio hornblower. Also, Gary, "the whistle thingy" is a Bosun's Pipe; props to recognizing it!
Great podcast, Drinker. Motivated me to watch Wrath of Khan (free with Amazon Prime). Good to hear Gary on a channel with excellent audio (his own sucks). Enjoy the two of you together.
Nimoy said the uniforms tended to ride up when the actors sat down so it felt like a natural gesture to adjust his jacket before addressing his captain.
The Reliant (Miranda-class) is my 2nd favorite design. It was apparently based on the original design for the Enterprise where the engine nacelles sat below the saucer, then one of the model designers flipped it upside down and Roddenbury went, "That's the Enterprise!"
Would love to come back and hear you guys talk about the Search for Spock, Voyage Home, Final Frontier, and Undiscovered Country. Would be truly uplifting in this time.
This was one of my favourite films growing up but haven't watched it for years but after listening to this I couldn't help but put it on and I'm glad to say it didn't disappoint,!
