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I'm curious. Charlie didn't see her mother in 7 years and Alastor was gone for 7 years. Either the writers just like the number 7 or something important happened 7 years ago.
Imma be real, if it weren’t for the leaks I wouldn’t be checking it out. Vox and Alastor’s song actually made me far more interested in the show than any of the marketing did
I think ep.1 suffers from "second start syndrome." It has to balance firstly reintroducing all the characters naturally so that any new watchers who just see the show on Prime can be all caught up without watching the 2018 pilot, while also making sure the original fans who *did* watch the pilot are entertained and that it feels like a natural continuation of the plot. That's not easy to do.
While I agree, this show is not going to be marketable to a lot of people. It's got a trendy cringe style that is on its way out. And the songs are musical theater pop-y copies.😢 Yes Alistor songs was good, but it's giving, random musical number because we feel like it and not because the story demands it. (Where the moment is so intense we have to sing cause words are not enough.) Also Happy Day in Hell, just really disappointed me, it's the kind of subversion of expectations I expect to be inventive 5-6 years ago when slightly vulgar shock factor was a thing. It's all really juvenile and so far they done a whole exposition dumb but the world building isn't mathing🤷🏾♀️
To be completely fair, my favourite adult animated show ever, Bojack Horseman, had a rough first _season_ and I still adore the show so, you can still have hope.
Bojack made me much more willing to give shows a chance for longer/go back to shows I'd originally not gelled with because of how rough the first episodes were. Like, watching episode 1 you would never imagine how amazing of a show it would become.
God, Bojack Horseman is THE perfect example of how to do an adult show. An adult show doesn't have to be just gore and swearing and sex, I love when they touch dark and psychological concepts in ways probably no kid or teen would completely understand
Agree!! Although the 1st EP was definitely the hardest for me. It's funny how a show that played a part in me finally starting therapy and changing my life is one that I would have given up on immediately if I wasn't told how great it got lol
I completely agree! I almost gave up after barely managing to finish season 1, but a friend told me to continue and it was absolutely worth it. It's one of my favorite adult cartoons.
Okay so I actually really like that Val switches accents (also that’s not British that’s a Spanish accent) because he’s already been confirmed to be very manipulative, so it’s clever that the accent changes with his personality. When he’s angry (sometimes) and/or wants to be charming with Vox or Angel, he uses the sultry Spanish, when he doesn’t give a shit, he uses his natural American accent.
Ngl when Vox did it, I at first thought it felt a little weird but then I thought about it and as someone who is Mexican American, when I talk really fast my hispanic accent shows but when I may be more serious it'll go away so I'd say it's pretty consistent
@@zvzoomin807 I thought he sounded Italian, not Mexican. I didnt know until afterwards. Let me guess: Val lied about his ethnicity and nationality. Hmm sounds right. My dad did that to my mother.
@@valentinkambushev4968 I dont know if Helluva Boss was planned as a side project or not but right now Hazbin Hotel is the side project and Helluva Boss is the main one. I am just afraid that they'll neglect Helluva Boss for Hazbin Hotel.
Also I agree with you about the intro. Saying "the extermination is to prevent hell from dethroning heaven" so early on is ridiculous when it's supposed to be a TWIST. Why does Charlie act so surprised when Adam refuses to let demons ascend when SHE SAID IN THE OPENING that those who were deemed "sinners"/who acted outside of the will of god were never meant to gain power or influence. If she actually bought the "overpopulation" excuse, THEN her plan would actually make sense because overpopulation is an issue of SPACE (which hell presumably has little of and heaven presumably has a lot of), while "undesirables can never gain strength in numbers" is about PEOPLE and POWER.
I mean considerin how picky heaven seems to be when it comes to what counts as a sinner, the number problem could be alot more than initially mention. In that because heaven is rigged to the point of makin heavens denizens numbers become extremely outmatched by hell, and also the fact that from lutes explanation of angels believin they make No mistakes, would have them puttin the number imbalanced to be blamed Solely on hell and its sinners, thus extermination. Ie, theyd rather murder a bunch of sinners than admit they've been too extreme on who they considered to be worthy of goin to heaven cause theyd have to admit they're wrong and are the reason heavens numbers are low and hells is stupid high.
Even if she genuinely believes in the overpopulation issue, her plan doesn’t make sense. Sending people to heaven wouldn't address the problem; in fact, it undermines the concept of eternal punishment in Hell if one can simply escape to Heaven. Moreover, it fails to clarify why Heaven would be concerned about Hell's overpopulation to the extent of conducting regular clean-up missions. Additionally, considering that Heaven might be smaller than Hell, the perpetual cycle of people dying on Earth suggests that the overpopulation will be a constant problem for everyone.
If anything, this just makes heaven also one note. The big bad they need to crush. Meaning there isn't anything to gain at all in Charlie's attempts. If this ends with Charlie taking place of God, then I'm not sure how ima take this
Also i wanted to add, i just realized that this aldo would explain how some exterminators are determined to eradicate so many sinners. Like imagine growin up in heaven with the propoganda that not only are angels perfect and never make mistakes, but comin to the conclusions that the numbers are low is cause of Hells influence rather than their own broken system of what they consider innocent. Rally enough angels and you get a group that feels 'righteous' on erasin these sinners that have quote 'skewed the balance' even though by all accounts, its in their control that the numbers are like this. Add to the fact that in their eyes, the sinners 'dared' to fight back against their righteous crusade, and you have the current mess of the angels ampin up the genocide. Now im not sayin hells completely innocent here. After all we have the bit about lilith growin and thrivin her kingdom which we dont kno How that works and other weird stuff like where the hell is Eve, the second bride of Adam that I guess they're not together since in his schpeal he mentioned him tryin to date other angels, so then where is she? But point still stands. Genocide the sinners instead of admittin faults in the system.
The only thing that would make this start even more rough if it was overshadowed by some RU-vidr paying 50K for a kinky video of Charlie and his Avatar.
@@justmilky5358 His name is verbalase. The video itself is... let's say it's very soft porn. Charlie drools over him, chases, ties him to bed, and then puts on sexy lingerie. Curtains right before anything happens.
For context: You guys know the beatbox guy that did Tetris Beatbox and those animated pop culture character beatbox battles, Verbalase? Yeah, he did a 50k commission of an NSFW animation featuring him and Charlie
I feel like that whole intro about Hell's formation is... too perfect. Like it paints both Lucifer and Lillith in too good of a light and the Angels in too bad of one. Granted, we haven't seen any other angels outside of Adam and his Executioners and they all suck but I can't help but think Charlie doesn't have the whole story and that will come into play later.
Adam's line about "The Rules being Black and White" seems a bit suss as well. I get the distinct feeling that Adam is either acting without the knowledge of his superiors. Also, I get the sense that Lucifer might very well be depressed due to what he did, but Lilith might be using this whole situation to her advantage. Almost like a bitter ex-lover wanting to stick it to her old boyfriend.
To be fair, it was confirmed that aside from visual changes, the Pilot is canon. Edit: Livestreams. Outside Sources. Quite a majority of other Content Creators have stated this while sourcing a livestream that I believe came out a few months ago. That is where this information comes from.
It's literally not, they've said that Episode 1 is the new retelling of the Pilot, meaning that the Pilot is not canon anymore It can't be canon if it shows stuff like Lilith and Charlie talking when in the actual canon Lilith has been missing for 7 years
I agree with pretty much everything you've said here, ESPECIALLY with the whole "dragging out the joke" stuff. Adam being a dudebro went on WAYYYY to long, especially since it was mostly him talking to himself. For me, dudebro jokes are funny when the bro in question is playing off a straightman. They tried to do that here, but it was mostly just Charlie stuttering and mugging for the camera instead of actually talking and bouncing off of him. And like you said, there are too many jokes where the punchline is that something unfunny is being repeated. I also dislike the way Adam was characterized in the first place. Like, I get the point that it's supposed to be "angels are just as bad as sinners, they just have more power!!" but like the point of the "x is just as bad as y" trope is that it's supposed to be a SURPRISE. It would've been so much better if the angels appeared well mannered before revealing their cruelty. It would also show how those in power weaponize aesthetics to justify persecution. "See, we don't act crass like THOSE guys, so we're clearly superior!" It would ALSO make the Angels more threatening if they were smug and distant in their cruelty instead of revelling in it like LITERALLY EVERY OTHER VILLAIN IN THE SHOW
But the Angels *aren’t* as bad as the Sinners, as far as we can tell. Also, Angels aren’t the people that make it into Heaven, those would be the Heavenly equivalents of Sinners, and *they* would be the ones expected to be “perfect” and whatnot. Much like Demons born in Hell like Charlie can be nice and friendly, Angels created in Heaven can be crass like Adam. At the end of the day, Hell is a punishment for *humans* and “fallen” Angelic beings. Adam and the Exterminators are well within their rights to act like they do.
Yeah, Adam dragged it out too long and at this point seemed like an annoying third rate scumbag rather than a Villain. It would have been great If he was a bit salty about his and Lilith relationship and took it a bit out on Charlie(like comparing her to Lilith). His general felt like a decent Villain however, not the Best but decent(knew how to put Charlie down with a few words). The cherubs were better presented( like willing to help people but only for their own selfinterest and don't care If the person they tried to save is really good or not, because for them everything goes as long as their job is fullfilled
You can't say what any character "is supposed" to be or do, as long as it's not your story. I get, you mean that, if it were your story, you'd spin it that way. But not everyone writes his stories the same way. There's just no right or wrong here, just you like the plot, or you don't.
@DrDeadsy42 I'm saying Vivziepop failed in what she set out to do lol. "X is acutally just as bad as y" as the moral conclusion in your narrative needs to be built up to instead of explicitly stated at th beginning because it allows the watcher to go on the same journey as the characters. We can tell based on the trailers that the conclusion of the narrative is Charlie abandoning her redemption plot in favor of a war with Heaven, which means at some point she must conclude "Angels are cruel and have no interest in helping us, we must emancipate ourselves forcefully". Anyone with half a brain who watched Adam's whole display would come to the conclusion instantly because HE SAYS HIS WHOLE DEAL OUT LOUD So even if you haven't watched the spoiler-y trailer you'd know what the "plot twist" is going to be and are waiting for Charlie to catch up and release her efforts are fruitless. This is boring and completely defeats the point of having Charlie need a change of heart in the first place instead of the war on heaven being the plan from the beginning. Vivzie wanted a perspective shifting revelation and she failed :]
I never thought sir pentious would join the hotel. Thinking back a few years ago I just assumed he’d be a recurring villain. But this has potential to be fun. I can’t wait to see where it goes.
I expected it to happen, only not so soon, and if you look at the trading cards and the voice casting, you can make a logical prediction of what's about to happen to Sir Pent.
He wasn't originally supposed to, but he was such a popular character that they added him. I have mixed feelings because unless he gets put in season two that means we might not get Baxter (he seems to be filling the role that Baxter would have filled)
Honestly I would love to see Valentino trying to shoot the Hotel and just get curbstomp by Charlie. A great way to show Charlie's overwhelming power. Edit; Holy Shit guys what are ya'll doing here O.O
Or Alastor can just shoo him away like he did with Sir Pentious xD. I am curious to see what is Charlie capable of but i feel she normally keeps her powers in check
Yeah, but as someone who hasn't seen the series yet, I'm kinda worried about the comment of "Val being stupid" at 19:53 ; we already have multiple silly villains & the dude is S/Aing Angel & he's "being used for laughs to this extent!!" Moreover, it doesn't help that fan works & even some older Pilot stuff (I.E the Angel Dust Dirty Healings comic & the iffy Insta accounts) made me feel like he would've been more serious; sure, the show is obviously separate from the fans' ideas on it, but when you make Angel's abusive controlling overlord dude into a goofy douche like everyone else, it's gonna lose me. *Let's just hope that Valentino gets to have more serious & threatening moments & such, & not let any headcanons make us negative to the show as opposed to looking at it for what it is.*
Just waiting for the Lucifer episode and I am PRAYING they show how powerful Charlie is. I like Alastor as a character but I feel like we only see him as this unstoppable powerful overlord 24/7 when he’s just one of the hundreds of overlords? Above overlords are Goetia, the sins, Charlie and Lilith then Lucifer, but Charlie acts like a cliche sinner and never shows any power. I really hope they show her power because she’s probably 50x more powerful than alastor, maybe even more
I think that’s the point. Alastor is 100% on guard at all times, shown by his smile. He believes smiling to be a show of strength, so the fact that he never drops his is alluding to how he constantly broadcasts how strong he is and how he wants everyone to know it.
Alastor is known for killing other overlords, so him being this “unstoppable” force of nature is kinda the whole point. And they confirmed that the Pilot IS canon.
I really hope we see Charlie's true potential. She should be classified as a nephalem( angel-demon hybrid) that should be stronger than most angels and demons. Especially since She is the offspring of Lucifer(archangel, one of the strongest angels) and Lilith(the mother of all demons and the first demon). In my opinion She should be able to even equal or even beat Lucifer at full power/maturity.
Once again, Vivziepop’s problem is pacing and trying to do WAAAYY too much with in one episode, just like in Helluva Boss. I honestly thought the whole “sir Pensious is a spy” would last wayyy longer, maybe all throughout Season 1 But it’s dropped in the same episode. EDIT: thinking back on it, Charlie forgiving him even after finding out he was a spy REALLY speaks volumes of her character, and the first bit of true sympathy Sir Pensious has probably ever felt, finally finding a place where he feels welcomed. Episode 4 is the best by far. I take back what I said, this shit’s good, still clunky, but it’s way better and better by the episode.
True, I expected his uncovering to happen way slower. But I see another development for Sir Pent coming along, which means, we better not get too used to him.
@cassiushellsin6243 to me they had two different stories going on in the first episode that didn't feel rushed at all and it led right into the next episode which to me was good pacing
Not a fan of them deciding to go "Heaven is actually evil" since the whole premise is getting characters from Hell, who are as evil as can be, trying and mostly failing to be better to maybe get into Heaven. Making Heaven comically evil, to where Adam acts like a Frat Bro is just so lazy.
@@tylere.8436it wouldn't shock me. They already do that with a lot of adult animated comedy shows so I don't see how it would shock most if not anyone.
i really hope this is just an exterminator/adam thing,and not an angles as a whole thing. Heck I had an idea of Charlie running into angles/exterminators hideing sinners from the others because they hate what they're doing.
even panty and stocking had a more interesting version of demons/angels (i.e. demons being rule and order obsessed, and angels being freespirited and disorderly)
There's a reason why all of the voice cast have such good speaking/singing voices: Most of them are Broadway-caliber performers. Adam/Sir Pentious: Alex Brightman - Beetlejuice Charlie: Erika Henningsen - Mean Girls, Les Miserables Vaggie: Stephanie Beatriz - Encanto, In the Heights Husk: Keith David - Hot Feet Carmilla Carmine: Dapne Rubin-Vega - RENT, In the Heights Valentino: Joel Perez - Jesus Christ Superstar As a musical theater nerd, this cast absolutely blew me away!
Don't forget that Keith David was the original voice for Dr. Facilier in Disney's Princess and the Frog, and Vox was voiced by Christian Borle who was in Legally Blonde, Falsettos etc. The amount of vocal talent in this show is just staggering!
Given Vivzie's pretty thorough knowledge of demon lore, I fully expect that the lie from the storybook intro is going to be that Lilith isn't an equal-rights boss babe, but genuinely evil. Lilith in Jewish mythology is the embodiment of miscarriage and infant mortality. She's literally a baby-killer. While she did get evicted from Eden for refusing to be submissive to Adam, the idea that her whole deal is gender equality is a very recent addition to the myth (as in the last 100 years). She is death come to those who least deserve it; mourning come to steal away joy. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the big reveal about Lilith is that, while Lucifer may have genuinely wanted to grant free will to humanity, she only ever wanted them to suffer.
Throwing in Jewish mythology into an inherently Christian belief system (heaven vs hell afterlife) is an......odd....decision to say the least. Really goes to show the TikTokification of religion amongst young people
@@shifty_dragon3679This is kind of a weird reply to give to somebody that's aware enough to know of this section of mythology to begin with? But even more than that we're talking about simple fan speculation about a completely fictional universe, who knows what the writers have taken inspiration from? There's no rule saying they must only use Catholic influence and nothing else ever. It's really not that serious.
@@yfrit_ggyou're the only one talking this seriously? Like bro..... All that was said was that mixing religions was a bit weird. Whether you agree or not is a different conversation. "Who knows what they've taken inspiration from"....... The religions? Not sure why you're so quick to jump to their defense when nothing inherently bad was even said.
Charlie’s pilot song was really perfect as an introduction to her plan and motivations and why the audience should care. It did everything right and was beautifully animated. I’m still very interested in the series but it’s a real shame the first episode fell as flat as it did
I've been crafting a theory myself that I'm hoping to get more evidence on when the new episodes air. You see, I noticed a pattern in the two episodes and you mentioned half of it briefly. In episode one, we learn almost right off the back that Charlie's mom has been MIA for seven years. At the end of the episode, we learn that (like never before) an angel is found dead after the extermination. In episode two, we also learn that Alastor disappeared from public view for seven years and only just returned last week. There's a few things with that. At first, I only really realized the fact that both Alastor and Charlie's mom have been gone for specifically seven years. I think that whatever happened or wherever they went, they went together for some reason. They're partners in a plan and I think that plan is to be able to fight against the angels. Alastor only came out of hiding because Charlie's mom knew the angels would retaliate. She wanted to make sure her daughter was protected and knew no one could do it better than Alastor. I only think they're doing this to fight against the angels because the symbolism behind the number seven. While the number six and even three sixes in a row is symbolic of Hell, the number seven is specifically a heavenly number. It's almost poetic, for them to choose the seventh year of their absence to be the unlucky year for the angels. That's just a taste of my theory, though. I'd love to hear someone talk about this further.
I have the exact same theory. Which, if we’re right, it forces us to ask an even bigger question. Did Lilith make a deal w/ Alastor? If she did, what was it? I don’t trust Alastor. He has his own goals, for which he is dangerously close to being able to use at least one member of the royal family for. I wouldn’t put making a deal w/ Lilith past him. However, I’m thinking it might have less to do w/ their societal goals regarding rebelling against the angels & more to do w/ protecting Charlie. Lilith is second in power only to her husband. We know that an Overlord, like Alastor, has no hope of defeating her. But, even if he could be forced to help her w/ her societal/political goals, he couldn’t be forced to do the same for protecting Charlie. Thus forcing Lilith to make a deal for him to help her daughter. Vaggie is right to be suspicious of him.
what i find interesting is the fact, that if this theory is correct (which sound very plausible), Lilith chose Alastor to be her ally, considering in the ranking he is below, for example, Ars Goetia. Like, why him? Why bother working with him, if he is just a sinner? Of course, she might still be working with someone else, but still. So what I am getting here, is that Alastor is a lot more powerful than everyone might think. Like, we all seen what he did in the end of his rap battle with Vox, turning of all the power in Pentagram city, except his speakers? That's rad. Maybe he breaks the ranking, which is interesting. And of course I wonder what is his goal. I doubt he wants to defeat angels for some righteous reasons. I will definitely watch the show just for Alastor's and Lilith's dealings alone.
i disagree. I think we all forget that in the grand scheme of powerful hellish beings in hell Alastor is only just a overlord. And in Lillith eyes all he is, is just another sinner.
I've grown very used to all the changes. I saw the trailer and was a bit worried, but the new cast quickly grew on me. I LOVE Vox's voice. And Keith David is perfect for Husker.
Alastor and Vox's song was definitely my favorite part of the 2 episodes. It's great to listen to, fun to see the 2 bounce off each other, and shows Vox's flaws. Despite him being the one to stop Val from doing something stupid to go after angel dust he ignores his own advice when it comes to Alastor. He unintentionally gave Alastor a lot of attention, a way for Allastor to sow the seeds of doubt about how strong he really is for the citizens of hell, and let his anger give Alastor the win of that confrontation.
Charlie honestly isn't engaging for me. Angel dust ended up being my favorite character and I find him kinda relatable. I find his struggles with his addiction and trying to break away from his old life feels very real. Husk is hot also.
Charlie is currently pretty one dimensional. She's an Adorkable Disney Princess trapped in the bowels of hell and trying to make a difference However, I do believe it works well enough since she's still being introduced to the audience. Over time though, she needs to grow up one way or another Yuji Itadori style.
I remember seeing someone's comment saying that Vox and Alastor have a full on Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck relationship. Where Vox is trying to show up Alastor but Alastor keeps trolling the fuck outta him.
In hindsight, i feel like it's pretty awesome that all the villain songs are such massive bangers after going through an era of crappy modern Disney villain songs. Big showstealer villains are always a treat to see and hearing that the Vs are exactly that is more or less a big selling point for me personally.
As much as Pentious was adorably pathetic I'm still giving him the side-eye. This dude has been in hell---and survived it---for well over a century. I feel like he should be a lot more hardened and it should have taken longer before he started to crack. I'm actually wondering if him getting caught and Vox chewing him out was a setup to earn Charlie's trust. He is a snake, after all, and he proved he can act.
Honestly... not really? Not entirely? Sinnser can't die unless killed by angelic weapons. So he just has t oendrue other people's bullshit and not be stabbed by an exorcist. Its possible his inventions got him pretty far though but when he has to deal with direct threats he ends up getting wrecked.
The show may have its problems but I think it’s going to improve over time and be a successful show. And don’t forget that all shows has problems at the start and then gets better over time. Sometimes it’s the opposite or sometimes they’re always good.
this, per example, The Owl House is great but the early episodes of season one are weak compared to the rest of the show, the same can be said about amphibia
Some great series start strong and masterfully done and remain the same or even improve. Some get worse. So no, not all shows has problems at the start.
I mean, even Helluva Boss' first episode wasn't great looking back at it and it's still one of my favourite shows, Hazbin Hotel's first episode is better than Helluva Boss' first episode in my opinion so I'm still optimistic for the future.
A friend of mine bought the early access package and streamed it with me so I could watch it as well. I had fun with the show! It was nice to see that the original pilot is still canon! I am sad that Katy Killjoy's original VA was swapped out with Brandon Roger, I liked her work and her voice. Thought it was SO fitting. But it'll be interesting to see what Brandon has to offer! I wanna see more of Tom Trench though!
For some people, NOTHING was going to live up to years and years of speculating. I am sure it'll find its footing soon. (I hope it for Spindlehorse's people, they deserve the work and pay.)
I've never watched HH and HB for the humor because it's not for me, but I love the world and the characters! I'm excited to hear all the awesome music and learn more about everyone.
I thought the first episode was alright buy I LOVED the Vox scenes, he became one of my favorite characters immediately. Angel is nice, Husk is suprisingly alright with the new voice, Alastor is great, Charlie is fine, and Vaggieee... is okay I guess.
Vaggie's new voice actress sounds so monotone and stall compared to the original. Even though this is the same chick who voiced Mirabel from encanto. XD
I've seen the first two episodes and I have to say, I actually like the new voice cast more than the OG. Not that the original voice cast isn't great, it's just that this one is so much better. Something about the way the voices, animation, and designs meld together makes me see actual people instead of characters, and that's no small feat.
Sincerely, my only problem with the voice cast are the 3Vs. Like I was expecting Vox to sound more like an news host with some sound effects from the TV or more electronic(like AI generated). Velvet I was expecting to be more child like( like that spoiled brat kinda Voice) while Valentino just sounds a bit off to me. They are not bad, but not what I was expecting. Aside from that, the cast feels pretty solid.
Honestly, I didnt enjoy episode 1 but Episodes 2-4 are actually really good. The highlight is Stayed Gone as both Alastor's and Vox's VAs are amazing singers and the execution is an amazing song.
I actually like the fact that they kept it vague as to whether or not Adam was just an A hole or he was strategically pretending to be an A hole just to hide the fact that one of their angels were killed which is why they are rushing the extermination. The vagueness makes him more intriguing than a clear cut answer.
Speaking of Hazbin Hotel did you guys see the tweet about how the cartoon beatbox guy spent 50k on an animation that’s him and (Charlie I think that’s her name) doing the devils tango unconsensually and supposedly that brought him to bankruptcy?
I find it weird that there wasnt a disclaimer at the beginning saying to watch the pilot on youtube, it's free! And remind the audience that the events are canon but other parts changed during production. Since it seems like a continuation
Honestly, of everything from these first two episodes, I mainly hope that we get to see Velvette's new-hairstyle-every-scene thing continue for the rest of the show, I love it!!!
ok, so here a fun thing. Lilith go missing 7 years ago, and Alastor also go missing 7 years ago, she is basically hell number 1 singer, and her is all about radio, so the day after someone kill a anegl, Alastor show up and offers to help Charlie. also based on the intro, we know that Lucifer is the creative side of the duo, he is the guy with the ideas, the artist, but Lilith is the one with the will, she is the rebelious one, Brain and Heart. yeah i see this same story before more than once, will no be surprised if Lilith Return with some plant to destroy heaven or something like that, and she was playing "missing" while working in some type of Rebelion 2.0
Or because tis what Charlie is supposed to do and she needs to make herself absent to stress charlie out more, make her act. Not a thing she does happily i imagine but does cause she feels its necessary.
Another SC video that aligns just perfectly with my thoughts Everywhere I looked I've either seen fans saying it's a 10/10 or haters saying it's 0/10, no one seems to admit that's it's ok, but has some issues.
I think the problem is people are trying to give it a score. I just enjoy the stuff that comes my way, I'm not trying to grade it. The only metric I use is how much fun I had, and as of now, both episodes were a LOT of fun.
I feel like it's too early to really judge the show? Inevitably yes people are going to be disappointed, it's been a 4-5 year gap from the pilot where people have had time to speculate and come up with head canons originating from barely any source material, so of course when the source goes a different route from people’s theories and ideas there is going to be disapproval. Along with a new voice cast, stylistic changes etc… it will take time adjusting. But I think with the people jumping in saying- this character isn’t written well, or I don’t like their story- I think we need to hold off on those views for now…
Yeah that’s what I thought as well, like you said people have had years to build up their headcanons and theories to the point it’s widely considered it be canon in some regards. But the show takes things in a different direction than that and people are gonna be upset it doesn’t align with what they’ve seen as “canon” for so long. Essentially people with those expectations need to cast them aside so the show can be judge fairly and not based off of the headcanons that have sprouted.
@valentinkambushev4968 it is the same, just different characters. HH was supposed more serious comparedto HB, but it's not so same thing different shape
I have to say I love Angel Dust's new VA much more. In the song Addict, it is very much JUST autotune. It overpowers everything else and makes it hard to enjoy tbh. But with Poison, you really hear that talent behind the VA's work. When he has to hold a note you enjoy it. The way he's able to have this cadence that feels very LMM but still their own thing is hard to do. But it's done well and the way his voice cracks at the end is incredible. And I'm also really loving the new VA for Alastor. You can tell he's having just a blast. I'm also intrigued to whatever happened 7 years before the show, cause Vox saying that's how long it's been since Al was seen is crazy given...IT'S ALASTOR. It's also the last time Charlie spoke with her mother so. It had to be huge. Color me intrigued. I'm excited to see where it goes.
Angel OG voice actor is literally the best and fits the role way better. Addict is better than Poison in every aspect. I don't know why people saying the newer is better? Kids these days,
I loved all of it! I think the characters and story are strong enough to make up for the mistakes. There’s so much they’re building up towards. It’s definitely going to get better.
All of the singing honestly got on my nerves except for the songs by Angel, and Alastor and Vox. Alastor is the MVP for the whole series imo, right now. My biggest complaint is that as soon as i get invested into the story, they hit you with a lot more singing.
i kind of wish they'd let pentious stay a double agent for a couple episodes, so that his eventual reveal and repent could've been more emotionally resonant. i need this show to hit the feels hard the way helluva does.
My one opinion: I adored it. Everyone will have their opinions and small nitpicks but overall, these two episodes blew me away. Four years is a long time and until the whole season is out, I feel this show deserves every bit of love it gets because it’s been through so so so much work and mean critique that for it to come out as beautiful as it did is such a gift. ❤❤❤ Amazing job, Viv. Not everyone can say they’ve achieved this much after so long. ❤❤❤
I agreed with pretty much everything that you said in this video. I gotta say, so far, Vox and Alastor's song is my favorite part of the series so far and couldn't stop listening to it, if it wasn't for someone who leaked it. Speaking of Vox, he's already my favorite HH villain. It's also very nice that Val can switch on different accents he speaks in, which is pretty interesting. And also, Brandon Rogers was just fantastic as Katie Killjoy, after replacing the original voice actress from the pilot.
Honestly, I loved it. It felt like going back to a loved book I hadn't read in years. I also really appreciated how despite it being a musical, I genuinely kept forgetting it was and was pleasantly surprised every time a song started.
Heaven being comically evil is not the play IMO. You like the “sinners” in the show because you know they are bad, but they are funny and there’s a sense of hope in which you think they can rehabilitate themselves and make it to heaven. There is literally no difference from the characters we’ve seen from heaven and the ones we’ve seen from hell. TBH Adam was more of a dick than most of the hell born demons. It messes with the idea of the show. What even is Heaven? Hell, but it’s mostly white instead of red? Idk maybe I’m looking into it too much and should just enjoy the show. It’s probably just a criticism of the ideas of Heaven and Hell, I just feel that they should make that more clear
Di- Did you just?? Used Ntsg's leaked footage of the first two episodes????? I can see the little blur hiding his name, the full premiere comes the 19th man, I don’t think you should be showing this footage 💀
know everyone’s already talked about it, but the story of this show going from a popular RU-vid pilot to an getting picked up by a major studio is still just so impressive. Hopefully it does well enough to open a door for other online independent animations to be supported and financed.
I've noticed there seems to be a pattern in Vivienne's shows where there's a rough start but then executes its best in the second half. Helluva Boss' first episode got the job done in reintroducing the premise but was very bare bones and was nothing special. Everyone liked episode 2 but after that there was a lull (and the heavily disliked cherub episode) until episode 5 started showing plot, then episode 6 blew everyone away. Season 2 had a very slow start which was not helped by the nine month hiatus thanks to the Kesha legal debacle. It wasn't really until the two most recent episodes that it managed to win back the crowd. HAZBIN SPOILERS BELOW Hazbin's premiere I agree may have been trying to do a little too much. First episodes are burdened with more exposition since you need to both get your audience engaged AND make them understand what's going on. The writers did put in a couple things that should have been saved for a later episode. Namely that very last scene showing the motive for the angels moving the extermination up. At least the perpetrator of that incident is still a mystery. Hope its worth finding out whodunnit. I did like the Adam's rib joke. That's pretty clever as it centers on a small detail in Genesis that a lot of people don't remember or paid attention to. Other than that though, I've disliked Adam from the moment his design was shown a year ago. I don't like his design (I like the blue and yellow color combo but hate that he was given the same head and horns look as Blitz.) I like the concept of having him the leader of the exterminators but facepalmed at the choice of his personality, which I could see from that design poster. Instead of going for a more sinister and threatening kind of villain, he's yet another annoying douche character; we have too many of those in the Hellaverse already. It works for Mammon, but I really didn't want that for Adam.
I'mma be real here, chief An angel being OPENLY AS BAD AS A DEMON just doesn't sit right for me. It literally defeats the purpose of... Well, Heaven and Hell.
i dunno i like it, it seems like they're making a point about hypocrisy and doing it well. Like i think you're right it defeats the purpose, but i think the show itself is pointing that out intentionally
20:22 Something interesting about this is that the presentation of Valentino depends on who he is interacting with. He is absolutely terrifying if we're following the perspective of someone below him like Angel, but he is just a whiny man child when he is next to an equal like Vox.
The camera work is my biggest gripe, I have a condition that makes me easily prone to get dizzy/nauseous and I quite literally can't watch the majority of the show because of this. I'm hoping it dies down a lot and maybe is even gotten rid of in season 2 because that seems to be the one thing that EVERYONE can agree on, the camera work is too much.
I really enjoyed it! I wasn’t expecting much for the first two episodes, it got me hooked and that’s what matters. I feel like some people are holding it up to too high of a standard because they’ve been waiting for so long. But it’s still a fresh show that’s been picked up by a big corporation. Regardless of how long it’s been in the works, it’s still new and finding it’s footing.
I like it! I will say, Charlie's first song needed some more build up before she started singing. Like, that old saying "when the character has so much feelings, they start singing" or something like that. The second song did better with the build up, and adams entrence was good. The second episode was a lot better! I liked Vox's and Alastor's song! They were so good! I feel like im kicking a dead horse, but the song were much better than Wish's songs. They moved plot and were just filled with characters! I also thought the edits on their voices is so cool! I can't wait to see more Edit: i rewatched the episodes and I just remembered. When Valentino asked Vox what gun makes him look better, i fr thought he was gonna send Angel a picture of him threatening to off himself. 💀 I should not have found the thought funny, but it's definitely something an abusive partner would do
I'm so torn on this show. I want to support indie animation studios, but there's a LOT of controversy around Vivenne's treatment towards her employees, how little she's payed them, and the way she speaks about others behind their back. Lots of stuff has come up on Twitter recently and it's uhh, yikes. Her art style is so fun and unique, (sexual themes are a little too raunchy for me, but I put up with it), but if she really is the way she is, then I'm gonna pass. Good treatment of employees is more important to me than a highly anticipated show.
I stopped watching either show myself a while back after finding out some stuff she has done in the past, and not being able to find anything that properly addressed it or proved it was fake. With the only argument people made being “it was in the past” which is kind of a copout. The poor treatment of workers is just a whole new layer of fucked. Currently I am more excited for shows like Lackadaisy who put out a pilot a while back. I have not seen anything that shows them to be unethical. I believe that if you treat your workers poorly than any possible positive from being an indie studio is erased. Because at that point you aren’t more ethical, just less powerful. Supporting small businesses and indie creators is good because it allows for a more ethical consumption if that endeavor commits to ethical production. Massive corporations are able to get to that size because of ethical apathy. Small buisnesses have the ability to have an ethical stance but not necessarily a guarantee.
I feel exactly the same way, word for word. I like Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss, though like you sexual themese are a bit too raunchy, but I don't like the creator.
A lot, and I mean *a lot* of the controversies surrounding vivziepop are fabricated entirely or twisted to try and tear her down. For example, the 'how little she's payed them' one of recent was entirely misconstrued. it's $35 dollars per second, not for a entirely completed second of animation as the person tried to make it look like, but for a stage of it, the rough drawing if you will, which falls in line with industry standard.
@@MrTalithan I know there are plenty of people that hate the creator for the sake of hating, but there are plenty of people that also idolize the creator and will bury any allegations or inappropriate actions under the rug too. I do like Hazbin Hotel's art, world building, and characters, but I dislike the artist, not as an artist, but as a person. I really do hope that the allegation of the little pay is misconstrued because I do wish that animators are paid higher, not just the industry average, but above that. I won't say that what you say is the truth, because I'm not sure without seeing factual information from the creator in reply to those that may have tried to inappropriately knock them down. I hope for the best for the animators and writers behind Hazbin Hotel and any future projects that they develop.
saying it has a rough start is a beyond an understatement, over half the people that've seen it sailed the high seas and far too many have been tearing the show apart because of all the changes.
@@falconeshieldYeah, but anyone can do that. Valentino doesn’t seem particularly threatening other than the fact that he’s prone to random and insane acts of violence.
I mean we do see the man able to get his way a bit when he realizes he can get vox to pay attention to the hotel by mentionin its one resident, alastor. You see it most clearly when after his rant about angel flirtin with one of the voodoo... Strongmen?, that he immediately takes advantage of how pissed and insecure vox is feelin on alastor bein back. So unlike stella, he's got some manipulation tactics that stick. Itll be interestin to see it play out when it comes to how he treats angel dust and others.
I loved seeing the dynamics of the Vs.Vox is so far my favorite character, just because he has this mentality that he needs to be on top at all times, but as soon as Alastor comes out that facade breaks down fast. His song with Alastor is so good i loved it so much. Kinda wanna see Charlie's power in later episodes as no one really takes her seriously so I wanna see that shift in dynamics of just how powerful she really is but she holds back a lot.
Can't wait for you to talk about the 4th episode. Ive heard people trashing on it because it includes an SA scene between Val and Angel that people were saying was super graphic and not handled well. I've also seen confirmed that the storyboard artist for that episode literally made dub-con NSFW art if Val and Angel and called them their 'r*pe ship'
@@colorbar.s Some episodes have been leaked and I've seen people on Twitter warning about episode 4. I can't confirm that because I haven't and quite frankly don't want to watch it but the only thing I can confirm is the board artist for that episode has made disturbing stuff about Val and Angel and ships them
Knowing Twitter I think it's just safe to wait until we see the episode because all I've seen is something that lasted like 2 seconds and wasn't very graphic at all
yeah, i unfortunately got exposed to the hazbin hatedom and i saw this circulating, which is kind of oof if true (it just feels really untactful to have a fully graphic SA scene with how they handled it in the Addict music video) can't really talk about the storyboard artist as i'm of the opinion that it's none of my business what they ship (toxic yaoi has also been on the rise in the past year, so 🤷)
Honesty I just hope that there are at least some good angels in haven, because having everyone in haven be bad kind of defeats the purpose of it in the first.
Even if there were some good angels, it will probably be a thing where only a few outlier angels see how bad heaven is, with most of heaven still being evil. They won't be enough to make heaven good though.
Regarding Adam, we knew he was gonna be a misogynist from the opening story w/ him & Lilith. Not to mention he’s the leader of the Angel army. So, him being a tactical narcissist is believable to me. (Also makes sense why he wouldn’t want the higher ups to find out about the dead exterminator.) His entire interaction w/ Charlie feels right to me. I completely buy it. Charlie is trying to play into his ego & be respectful so he’ll listen to her, but this involves letting him drone on about whatever he wants. It feels like the buttering up part of a big business deal, which is what Charlie is trying to make. Adam is being his annoying self in the meeting, but when Charlie starts to speak her piece we see just how bad he can be. His song shows us that Adam is dangerous. He’s comically annoying, but he is not to be messed w/. It also shows us he’s a massive liar & a hypocrite. Eve, you can argue, was tricked into eating the fruit, but Adam wasn’t. Eve offered it to him; he saw what it was, & he ate it. Adam conveniently wanting that to never come up makes sense for him. Such a truth is a big blemish on his record. I think it being used against him (possibly by Lucifer) is too perfect not to happen. Overall, I like him as a villain.
I really appreciate the first 9 minutes being spoiler free while you still voice your opinion. I look forward to coming back after totally legally watching the show
Watched the first two episodes very legally and I can’t wait to see the rest! Episode one was a bit odd at some parts, but I still love it to bits! Can’t wait for Friday to arrive!
Episodes 3 and 4 just came out today and wow I am this show just keeps getting better. Husk and Angel are a really good duo and I cannot wait to see more of them.
Yea that "so hell would never rise up against them" is way off of a line. But for me the line that made me really question what the rules of heaven and hell are was actually the line "so there was this virtue chick....anyway we fucked" was off-putting bc it comes off like we're making Adam look awful for the sake of it. Bc he should still be married to Eve, and idk if Eve would be in heaven bc of the apple thing but Adam also ate the apple and he's in heaven so I'd think she'd be too, which means they're still married, which means Adams committing the sin of adultery in heaven by fucking around. And this whole sexual purity thing is alter reiterated by Sir Pentious' line (written by Charlie) about not having sex before marriage so I'd think that sexual purity does play a role in ones sins. So how is Adam committing sins in heaven?? It may seem like a contrivance but considering the whole theme here is sins and forgiveness I feel like this line shouldn't have been there
Overall, I really enjoyed the first two episodes. The only thing that took me by surprise was Velvette. I didn’t expect her to have a British accent, and I didn’t expect her deal to be fashion (but rather social media). First impression, not a big fan, but I hope I’ll get used to her and start to like her as a character. My perception of Velvette from the pilot and the Instagram stuff (which I know weren’t entirely canon) was kinda the complete opposite of what we’ve gotten. I’m sure if I had no expectations for her, I would’ve loved her (I love British accents). I was worried people’s headcanons would disappoint them when they turned out to not be canon, but I never considered my own subconscious headcanons lmao.
I honestly thought she was going to be like this perky Harley Quinn girl type character who has a thing with social media not fashion. Because we already got a character like that. Rosie. And I believe in her wiki it also said that velvet specializes in potion making but I guess that's gonna be retcon. And that deep gruff British accent just makes her sound like Stella from helluva boss.
Honestly, I personally think the voice they used for Killjoy was actually not a good move. Because, I don't know if it's just me, but the voice doesn't match the face. I love the voice actor. Just shouldn't have been Killjoy.
Selling HH to a company was a fatal error. Now Viv has no control and no creative input, and its legally not even her IP anymore. And she will be kicking herself black and blue for this in a few months' time. *Never. Let go. Of your creations. Never give them away. Never relinquish control.*
Nah, these are just the same mistakes that Viv did in the original pilot, i don't know if you remember but when it came out it got a lot of backlash but it seems like she didn't learn anything, helluva boss also has similar issues but the only difference is that it's still her IP
Personally, I think it's already ruined. They did the "heaven bad, hell good" crap that's been springing up, especially with Lucifer and Lilith being these nice people who were wronged while Adam is a misogynistic prick. The show loses a lot of nuance in that sense, and already throws Charlie's goals out the window, if Heaven is so bad, why try to redeem sinners to get them there. I'm also not fond of how "naive" Charlie is. I was hoping for her to be more street smart while projecting her "Disney Princess" esthetic, but no, she really is that naive. Most demons don't give her the time of day, despite her being the 3rd most powerful being in Hell, the V's don't even factor her in on why messing with the hotel is a bad idea, they focus on Alastor, like she's not going to go postal if they did anything like that.
Some spoilers 1. There will be severak good characters in heaven with good intentions. We know that from leaks. Also the Story at the beginning was told from Lucifirs and Lilliths perspective! The woman hasnt seen her own daughter in 7 years! There is something fishy 2. They need to get redeemed so they dont die? Charlie just wants to save them 3. No one respects Charlie because there are no consequences. But i totally get that her naivity can throw off people. I like it and i can relate
I might be giving the creator too much credit but I want to believe that the story from the intro that Charlie read in her book was just a manipulated version of the Genesis and the twist could be that her parents lied to her all this time for the origin of Sin which would make the most sense.
I really loved both episodes though I do agree the first should have been longer to let it breathe. I feel Charlie’s story was wholly told to her by her parents so it is all suspect including the bit about the exterminators. I loved the Vs and am excited about seeing them more but hope Heaven’s characters aren’t so aggressively awful people like Adam I also felt Vox was the surprise MVP of the show so far and the scene with Alister and Vaggie was my fav non singing scene
our first glimpse into angels were the Cherubs in hellvua boss. While good intentions they WERE try to scam a asshole dying old man out of his money by trying to convince him if he became charitable and donated his fortunes to good causes he'd get into heaven. heeee wouldn't have from what we can gather. they were gonna exploit him to make the world better. Ends to justify means... The fact that the cherubs were banished so easily for something well outside of their control also shows how... unforgiving heaven is, or has become too.
@@taddad2641. I don’t really see what they were trying to do as scamming especially since we haven’t gotten clear rules on how to get into heaven so we don’t know if that would have worked in this universe I just would prefer heaven to while having problems not necessarily be completely full of assholes and if it is they still not have everyone overtime dipsh!ts
Okay im going to say it. I enjoyed the first two episodes BUT the voices for Katie Killjoy and Valentino are not it.. i love brandon but Katies voice in pilot was perfect. So hearing him was just off putting (like watching a bad dub) Valentino is just not what we were shown in the Addict video. That voice needed to be calm and much deeper
I honestly don't blame him. He was giving it his all, it's just the team at Spindle, should have realized his voice is too distinctive, the fandom can only hear blitzo when Katie speaks lol
@@michellewilliams9895 If he was able to sound like a girl then I think it would fix the issue but if it's like "madea" and you can clearly here this "woman" doesn't really sound feminine then ... It's unfortunate :/
Adam gave me the most Chaz vibes in the worst way possible, i really wished he would even try to look superior and better than Charlie, not necessarily good but the Sarcastic one, like the deer cherubim. He honestly just look like any other demon with a halo :/
I loved both episodes but Alastor and Vox are by far my favorite parts of it and I think they really are what made it so good. They could literally just do a mini spin off of Alastor’s life and throw Vox in there with background info and I feel like that would be a hit. But I’m also loving the whole Husk and Angel’s back and forth already too. I have such great hope for this show and can’t wait for the rest
