He Who Moans Doctor Who Editorial: My Problem with The Day of the Doctor's Time War Solution 

You were the doctor on the day it wasn't possible to get it right... Oh wait we just got it right.

Day of the Doctor felt like a celebration of New Who only. Not a 50th anniversary for the whole show. The War Doctor felt pointless and Paul McGann would have been better in the role.

I'm not gonna lie Stuart, your revision of the ending had me tear up a lot more than the actual episode. If your goal is be a screenwriter, you should totally do it.

The Time War was not removed - just the last days prior to the Moment being activated. I never liked the Time War idea but it did bring great depth and responsibility to the character of the Dr (thus repeating that "he's a renegade" is pointless, moot, as the character has long changed (see war doctor) etc. But RTD did set it up that the Time War (note TIME war) made the Timelords mostly mad, which you could see happen. I think End of Time is brilliant if you ignore all but the climax, and in that climax you really see the fear the Doctor has of what became the Timelords (sure not all of them granted) but 99% of their elected leaders were insane at this point, so go figure. The Timelords created all sorts of hellish machines and monsters and the Time War had destroyed huge chunks of the universe. Moffat ignored all this. His tiny brain decided that Time War = A single battle on a planet. He even had the Daleks destroy eachother in a crossfire.... If the Moment isn't activated then the Time War (which still happened up until that point) is no longer time-locked thus people can just go back in time and change what happens. How Moffat did not realise this, I don't know...

I thought it was good fun but admittedly it’s biggest problem is that there are no classic Doctors (Tom’s cameo doesn’t count) involved in the plot.Peter,Colin,Sylvester and Paul are just as much part of the show’s legacy as any Doctor.I personally would have loved to have seen Seven and Eight come back and interact with Matt and David.Now I’m gonna be controversial with this statement but John Hurt shouldn’t have been here,I love John Hurt but his presence felt like Moffat pressing the reset button.Paul McGann should have been the War Doctor,I find it cruel that he never got his chance to stand shoulder to shoulder with other Doctors.

I interpreted it as this: The Day of the Doctor is a divergent timeline. The Doctor has seen one timeline where he destroyed Gallifrey. That is from 9's perspective. There's a divergent timeline where he went back and unfucked Gallifrey. So, yes, by this logic, he still has every reason to have immense fury and anger from all the events that transpired. He merely saved one Gallifrey in one timeline. In the other timeline, it is still very much destroyed. He still has the weight of what he did on his shoulders. He decided that he wanted to go back and undo it. Does it fuck with the own internal laws of time travel that the show establishes? Yeah. Time travel story telling will ALWAYS be messy. But does it mean he has no reason to still feel the way he feels? Absolutely not. He still did it. He just undid it. Divergent timeline. My own headcanon, though. I guess the best way to describe it is via 10's words. "Big ball of wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff."

Your version of the ending would hark back to the dilemma the 4th Dr had in "Genesis of the Daleks" good choice my man good choice lol

Stuart, if you were offered to become the showrunner of Doctor Who, would you take it? I'm finding that I trust you more with the whole thing.

God damn it, stewart! I liked the dotd plot until now! Why did your ending have to make so much more story and character sense?!?

*He should have destroyed Gallifrey but saved the children* - relocating them to another planet. Russell's character progression is preserved, but the Doctor can put it behind him (because Steven was clearly sick of the arc). It looks back, whilst also looking forward - maybe 12's arc could have been looking for the Lost Children of Gallifrey.

I feel they could have fixed this issue with a few throw away lines. All that needs to be established in these lines, is that the freezing of gallifrey is a very high risk strategy, and if done wrong will cause some kind of great pain to those who live there (far far worse than the pain the moment would cause them. Think eternal agony, which isn't that much of a stretch for a device that freezes time.) The war doctor then needs to be shown rejecting this idea. if he got it wrong he would have caused all on gallifrey to suffer all eternal, and he cant deal with that. The 10th doctor needs to be on the fence about it, showing that living with the guilt has changed his stance somewhat. The 11th doctor then needs to be all for it, saying something along the lines of "I can't take it anymore, the guilt of what I did, I may as well have caused them eternal agony. You'd think over time the guilt would fade, even slightly, but it doesnt, its always there. The only thing that changes with time is that I've had more time to think about it. I can't live with it anymore, I have to take the chance" That way the character arc that the doctor goes through as a result of the time war is crucial in his ending it. That way we still get pay of from the arc, because without the arc there would have been no solution to the time war. Those are just my thoughts though

"human shaped piece of scenery leaking fluids" This is probably the best description of Clara I've seen yet

While I agree the Ian cameo should’ve been a no-brainer, I beg to differ on two key points here: first, the Doctor saving Gallifrey doesn’t null and void all the stuff he’s been through in the past decade of NuWho. As he himself says, he saw it burn and he doesn’t want to see it again. He has taken on board and lived with the ramifications of such a choice for a long time, and now that’s he presented with an opportunity to try and make things better, it seems like a very Doctor thing to do (And this coming froma guy who wasn't exactly swept up in Day like many were). As for Susan, I can’t see how her cameo would even begin to make sense (no disrespect to Carol) unless it was a byproduct of Gallifrey’s salvation. Wouldn’t it make the Doctor look like a colossal idiot if in all this time he couldn’t find her? (in fact, I assume she was probably the first thing he looked for after Gallifrey’s original destruction, and NuWho alludes to the fact that he was formerly a grandfather, so she is probably gone, sad as that is.)

This will seem an odd thing to say. I really enjoyed Day of the Doctor. However everything you said here I 100% agree

When you were talking about the two different parts of the Doctor Who Fandom. I thought it was interesting. At first I started out with the new series back in 2005-2006 but when I learned that Doctor Who was on for a longer time than that I began to look up Classic Who stories and eventually started liking Classic Who more than NuWho. I guess because of the lack of effects back in those days, the episode had to be carried by the story instead of flashy CGI crap. Oh and yeah the 7th Doctor is awesome. And the 8th. and the 3rd. and the 4th. =3

Shouldn't Clara have already known all that happened in the War given she's bounced her way across his entire timeline?

I would really love to see your version of this Episode. The Doctor wouldn't even have needed to travel to the sixties, as William Russell could simply have played a present day Ian

I wanted some of the other stuff in the time war mentioned. The never-weres, the nightmare child, so just the darlics was a disappointments. Also should all that stuff get out. Also the End of Time showed how crazy the timelords were both were crazy and nearly destroying. Heck even the Night of the Doctor even talks about that.

Think about it like this: The Time War itself still happened, aand for hundreds of years the Doctor was certain that he killed all the Time Lords, so all of the charecter development he went through still happened. He didn't unlearn anything, he still knows what it feels like tp be the destroyer of his own people, and the arc of the Doctor going from a guilt ridden ex-soldier to a hero of the people and rebuilding his life (which, let's face it, it was pretty much over by now) still did happen. And even without the Doctor destorying Galiffrey, the war still happened, and he still has his trauma from it, he mentoned before how "the war turned into hell", so even without the tragic ending, this is still a big deal. That's how I see it, at least. Although I have to admit, your version of the ending is a lot better than the actual one. Now I wish they had done that...

Personally, I think the reason that Moffat decided to have the Doctor save Gallifrey was to have this awesome scene (which I think many believed to be awesome) where all the Doctors show up to save Gallifrey. It was a good surprise, especially with the surprise inclusion of Capaldi, but I understand your opinion. Although, the whole whining about the Time War and Gallifrey in past seasons still works, because the past Doctors forgot that they did it. Some fans believe Eleven forgot as well, but I think he still remembers it, which might be why Capaldi shows up in "Day of the Doctor". But I have to say that I love your ending. It would have been great to see William Russell and Carole Ann Ford reprise their roles as they're the only two actors - as far as I know - from the first ever episode that are still alive. In fact, when filming pictures revealed Ian's name on the sign of Coal Hill School, I was hoping for a brief cameo from William Russell. Something like him watching Clara drive off or so. I was a bit disappointed that it turned out that Ian was NOT in the story. Moffat could've done something great there.

The time war still happened, the doctor still did horrible things. It's just the ending that changed, and the doctor didn't even know it changed until it was 11's turn to live out day of the doctor.

interesting ideas brought up, I would say that doctor who has been more fairytalish in the Matt Smith era

This reminded me of The Doctor Dances in which a grim tragedy got so big that they all but needed to retcon everything to make it 'all better'. You know, like early episodes didn't have to. New Who has that problem of suffering from power creep. Great review! You have another follower :)

From the start I thought this was a bad idea, but then I loved the concept of the Time War. Adding this to the character assassination of the Tenth Doctor, and I really begin to see Day of the Doctor unfavorably, and it holds up less every time I see it.

I actually read Russell’s book and the reason he had a credit on the waters of mars was because he had to rewrite Phil Ford’s originally all script. Everything to do with the death of Adelaide was completely Russel. I wouldn’t normally point this out but it seemed like you were just like: well Russel couldn’t have written something actually good.

i don't like your assumption that Moffat brought back Gallifrey just cause it was a celebration and stuff. having the Time Lords still exist opens up a lot more possibilities than if they were still dead and THAT benefits the story.

just gonna repost this comment I made on a forum as I think it's relevant. I also think the value of hope was portrayed pretty well in Day of the Doctor. A lot of people were pissed that Gallifrey turned out to be saved since it kind of undermined the Doctor's PTSD and guilt. Fair enough but I think they also replaced it with something else entirely. Hope for the future. The Doctor didn't really have a whole lot to look forward to at this point except doing some more travelling and stuff and eventually die (particularly at the point he was in the show). But with Gallifrey being somewhere out there he had himself a purpose more so than in a long while. And so did the Gallifreyans being more or less trapped somewhere with little chance of escape. But they did have hope and that's quite a valuable thing. All in all a pretty valuable point for the 50th anniversary of a show.

Did you do a review of the day of the doctor?? I can't find it:(

I actually agree with this. And to the argument of “doctor who is a kids show” no it is not. Doctor who is a “family friendly show” that’s why it’s traditionally on BBC One on a Saturday at 7pm. Family friendly and kids show are not one and the same

I know I'm *checks watch* 5 and a half years late to this comments section, but in no way does Moffat respect the shows legacy. He twists the shows legacy just so he can have his bootprint on there. Oh, the doctor only has his specific tardis because CLARA told him which one to take... despite the fact we were told previous the Tardis chose the Doctor.

Your video has just summed up everything I thought about this whole episode. It was just a mess, and it made me very disappointed. I was expecting so much more from that everyone has been telling me since it came out. Amazing videos you got here :)

The reason The Doctor destroyed Gallifrey was explained in The End of Time Part Two. Rassilon was going to destroy the Time Vortex (which would have destroyed the universe), so the Doctor stopped that the any way he could.

it depresses me to hear fan fic better the actual material because now i know how much better it could have actually been...

you could make the argument that he needed to go through his angst in order to become the person he needed to be to fix what he did. and also the time war still happened and screwed up a lot of stuff and clearly its something that the universe wants to avoid in the future as seen in time of the doctor. also the tom baker guy was there pretty much to confirm that gallifrey did in fact survive getting moved (afterall there was no guarantee that it would survive) and to possibly justify the painting's existence.

You know prior to this episode I had written an Doctor Who fanfic I called "The Isle of Time" The doctor discovers ledgends of a floating island in space at the edge of the universe. This island turns out to be real (though he spends a stupid amount ofbumbling around trying to find it) it turns out a TimeLady named Miranda who used to be on the council of Galafrey went behind Rassalons back and built a sort of arc to try and ensure that at least some small part of thier society and culture would survive the war. Miranda went through a traumatizing experince at the hands of the Daleks and when she was finally able to get home she lost her position on the council for speaking out against Rassalon (who can gone mad by that point) and trying to insist they attempt some kind of retreat. After being kicked off the council she built Galerek with the help of some of her supporters, loaded it up with as many people as it could support, and fled Gallafrey before the Doctor blew everyone up. It is explained that Miranda delebratly had been trying her hardest to hide Galerek from the Doctor because she considers him a threat to the people's saftey and he's not particularly welcome there. The episode plot involved the Doctor accidentally leading hostile aliens to Galarek and having to help Miranda fend off the attack. Miranda would kill the attackers while they were retreating against the Doctor's wishes by the end off it and insist he never return to Galrek. The episode effectively gave us Timelords that could be used for future stories and a little slice of Gallafrey that could be revisited some time in the future. I was a high school student when I wrote that and this episode had me throwing that whole story in the trash (I'd also created a pair of timelord twin brothers who would turn out to be Susan's grandchildren who would end up travling with the master for a while before one of them would go off on his own for a bit and eventually inherit the Doctor's tardis and titel when he dies seeing as how we were getting close to the 13 regenerations limit but then we had to go and pull unlimited regerations out of our ass and that charecter and his whole arc with the Doctor were rendered moot as well) I feel like there's a problem when a teenage fanfic writter could pull off bring back the TimeLords better than the actual show. Critize The Isle of Time if you want but it didn't completely absolve the Doctor of guilt or undo what came before and I thought seeing what few TimeLords remain live in fear of him and treat him like the boogy man in stories they'd tell the children born on Galerek stung pretty hard. It was a bittersweet episode that left the Doctor happy to see some of his people were still around but assured that he would never be one of them and no one was going to forgive him for what he did even if it was the right thing to do.

You have some good points there, and your idea of how this would be better is actually pretty good.

This is one aspect of The Day of the Doctor whch does distinctly bother me, although I think overall it was still a good episode. It was the same reason why I had huge problem with the Daleks losing all knowledge of the Doctor at the end of Asylum of the Daleks. When you've built up a deep, complex emotional dynamic between characters one thing you shouldn't do is then spit all over that development by retconning it in this way. The worst thing about the Day of the Doctor resolution is, as you pointed out, that it removes any consequences or long-term implications from the Doctor's actions as he can just go back and fix it later. However what made it more tolerable was that I don't think it was treated as a quick-fix easy solution, after all it did require all 11, sorry 12 Doctors to get it to work, and it was the 50th anniversary so a big deal was made about it.

THANK you! Not enough people seem to realise how day of the doctor completely negates a lot of what happened. It's what bugged me most about it That and it being boring!

You know I’m digging deep for content when I’m watching one of your videos from 6 years ago

Totally agree, Steven has written a lot of my favourite episodes but has also written a lot of episodes that really frustrate me. Like everything you said here with the anniversary, changing the outcome of the war and what it meant, I liked the idea what you said at the end better. I personally would have liked Christopher be in place of John Hurt, but yes I know he refused, so then I would have preferred it to go to Paul, i've become a huge fan of his doctor in his audio series and with his loyalty and still love for the show all these years, i think it would have been what he deserved to take a centre stage in the anniversary. And from what I gathered on why he wasn't asked is because Steven "couldn't see the 8th doctor fighting in the time war". I guess a lot of things I mostly hate is changing or writing too much into other eras, which Moffat has done a lot, he changed the whole "weight of the time war" arc through all of Russell's era badly, and also choosing why the doctor chose his tardis which completely ruins a beautiful line i liked in the doctor's wife where the tardis told the doctor while he chose her, she chose him too, which isn't true if clara was the one who told the doctor to take it. And I won't even start on how he wrote the 1st doctor in the recent special, especially if people havent watched Hartnell's run and only seeing new-who, they'd think that such a great doctor is just someone who is sexist and ageist, even though he comes from a race that can change genders and can live to thousands of years old edit: oh and the waste of the huge story of being unable to regenerate again, which a lot of fans who come from the 70s probably have been wondering and waiting to see how that would be addressed for all these years

Stuart Hardy for future BBC showrunner!

I don't think the Time War cancelled the Doctor's character development at all. Go and listen to his speech from the Zygon Inversion, if you think it doesn't still keep him awake at night. Hell, pretty much Twelve's entire arc has been about whether the Time War means he's just an irredeemable monster, or if there is still room for him to think of himself as a decent person. The world is not as nice a place now, as it was while classic Who was airing. We are a lot more likely now to just accept an ongoing, perpetual background level of violence as a supposedly unavoidable part of life. We also are a lot more authoritarian in our thinking, and so we tend to want said violence and authoritarianism in our media. There's a reason why new Who spends so much of its' time wandering around dark space stations with either astronauts or military types who are from dystopian, hyper-Capitalist societies. The classic Doctor was a much better and more principled person than what we want or can relate to today; and he was certainly a much better person than the corporate suits who are running the show, have any hope of relating to. So he has had to change. To a certain extent he's had to become violent, and what a surprise that he has also become the "President of the World," in times of emergency; I can just imagine Hitler licking his lips over that idea. Because some of that old, good character is still there though; that is why he is tortured. That is why the Zygon Inversion and the Doctor Falls speeches happened; because again, the Doctor is a much more principled person than what we as viewers want him to be. We have made him bad in order to cater to our own contemporary preferences; and the character is left dealing with the consequences. Given what we have done to him, if he didn't experience post traumatic stress disorder now, he couldn't be called a living character at all.

I agree 100% - I was disgusted when Moffitt effectively erased the time war in this episode. The arrogance of it, for one thing - that he could make such a massive change to the canon. But most of all - like you said - that it destroys an essential part of the Doctor's character arc. Just wrong. And now we're stuck with it dammit.

I mean, Steven went out of his way to emphasise that the Time Lords had become just as bad as the Daleks. So why save the Time Lords if they're so evil? Why kill the Daleks if they're potentially redeemable? It really goes against what the Doctor stands for.

'He Who Moans,' I just want to thank you for what you have done for the internet. I didn't become a doctor who fan until 2012, and I wasn't caught up with new who, until 2013, around the time that this episode aired. At first, I found you reviews as cute, and while I always look forward to hearing your ranting, I never really took it seriously. However, ever since: 'Hell Bent,' aired, I started seeing a whole new level of actual seriousness, on all of your reviews. It's because of people like you, that people can step up and admit that series 11 wasn't good, at all. Once again, thank you! Good luck with the rest of your reviews! I'll be working on mine, as well! :)

That was a great analysis, and you made it very clear and entertaining ! I loved the episode, but there was absolutely no need to create the War Doctor and saving Gallifrey was too cheesy (and harmful to the previous seasons, like you explained very well).

Your way is much better,good job Stuart!

Have you actually got an idea on how to bring back the Timelords?

I completely agree with everything you said, and in fact if you think about it, it was made even more pointless to save Gallifrey when you look at Time of the Doctor and the fact that if Gallifrey ever returns to this universe then the Time War would instantly start up again. This means that Gallifrey is completely stuck in that pocket dimension with no real chance of coming back unless all of the Time Lords get into their TARDISes (after making sure they don't need the Eye of Harmony anymore), come into our Universe, and find a new planet to repopulate and stay quiet. So really over all it's just completely pointless. God damn it Moffat.

Sir, you're spot on. As for the eyeball rape comment that you requested - I will request that anyone who wants to rape your eyeballs please get the hell out of the gene pool. That's about the best that I can do with that not-really-a-request. Well, it amused Me. That's all that matters. Your review was great. I'd only disagree SLIGHTLY, in so much as that Error of the Zygons doesn't invalidate the whole war. It invalidates the last day of the war (unless you refer to its impact upon The Doctor, and not the actual war itself, in so far as its occurance), but yes, it's still an utter shit way to do it. I could have brought back the Time Lords while drunk, and would have done a better job at it. Why do I call this episode, Error of the Zygons? The Zygons first appeared in Terror of the Zygons. Their use in this episode (not in Terror!) was complete shit. Aside of contradicting their own rules on the shapeshifting, they made the Zygons into morons. Let Me explain that: The Zygons, in this story, were all but completely in control of the most powerful empire of the day. If they really wanted creature comforts so bad, they could have easily steered Great Britain toward becoming what they need. This would be safe and easy for them, whereas they instead chose to come to a time, when we can lob nukes at them if need be, just so that they could have comforts that they could have taught the people of the prior era to make for them. They endangered themselves in the name of being spoiled. That is seriously moronic beyond words, hence why this episode should always be called, Error of the Zygons.

Once again you got me wanting to watch your version of an episode, the only thing I would change is having Susan go, "Well I'm serious Gallifrey could be somewhere out there. After all how could you be talking to your granddaughter at this point in time, last of the Time Lords?" (To justify him calling himself the last of the Time Lords for so long and not counting Susan who in his perspective should have been dead) and then the Doctor gets excited and runs back to the Tardis, and you know sees the crack like you said. Unless the Doctor just didn't want to face Susan after what he did and just pretended to be the last of his kind which I can also kinda see.

You never did say how you'd rewrite Time of the Doctor.

Personally, I enjoyed the Day of the Doctor. I thought it was interesting, and at least slightly more provoking than most of Moffat's crap. In fact, I was about to criticise you more than this, but then you revealed your version of the ending. Now, I can tell you, hands down, that your version of the ending would be far more interesting for anybody. But for us fans of the show, the ones who have seen Ian, and know Susan, and understand the minor plot points... that would have been a far better ending, and it really lays on the idea that this is a 50th anniversary special, not the 10th anniversary which came a couple of years later. You should, despite the fact that I disagree with many of your criticisms, be working for the BBC, as you would bring diversity and interesting, actually dark (not just 'oh let's have a confused angry alien doctor and call him dark') stories to the show.

Personally, I viewed it more as putting the time war behind us. We'd seen all the drama that we were going to get out of it and it was getting a bit stale. I think it was a good move to bring back Gallifrey because it meant that we could open up the show to new possibilities. A lot of us hadn't seen any classic who, so the idea of the time lords being back and Gallifrey being a potentially recurring location felt new to me at the time and it was exciting. Obviously, what they ended up doing with that potential is another matter, but that isn't a problem with this story.

I think what should have been done was that Gallifrey gets destroyed, but then The Doctor finds a clue of some sort indicating that there are surviving Gallifreyans out there and his quest is to go find them and rebuild the Gallifreyan and Time Lord cultures.

Why don't you have a review of Day of the Doctor.

The problem is as later episodes showed blowing up Gallifrey did *not* get rid of the Daleks (see Bad Wolf / The Parting of the Ways; Army of Ghosts / Doomsday ) By the time The Day of the Doctor had come around the sacrifice of Gallifrey stop the Daleks had been rendered pointless.

10:58 what is "breif"? Is it German?

Just found your channel. I think I have found a kindred spirit in critical thinking on modern storytelling. :)

When did Russell T. Davies edit previously stated lore? 9:27 - 9:38 I actually didn't think 'The Waters of Mars' did a good job there as it contradicts the idea of fixed points in time that had been made a big deal up to that point in the era. While Adelaide Brook still kills herself she does so in a different place and presumably by different method thus changing time. That's an interesting idea of how it could have gone though I'm pretty fed up of the crack in the wall arc at this point.

Hahaha "and then the Doctor woke up and it was all a dream." And now Moffat did precisely that at the end of Extremis.

"So before we all die of old age..." Best part. XD

"I studied Screen Writing at University" *Looks at University application.....* "Fuck"

I think this episode special was what ended my excitement for Doctor Who. I stuck it out to the 11th's regeneration and tried to watch 12, but couldn't get into it.

The other problem was Moffat's depiction of the Time War. Mostly I think he didn't understand the concept of TIME War, as all the shown footage of it is Time Lords with guns Vs Daleks (with built in guns). Remember when the Master cracked the time lock and the horrified Doctor starts describing the things that will emerge from it? The Skaro Depredations, the Horde of Travesties, the Nightmare Child, the Couldhavebeen King with his army of Meanwhiles and Neverweres. We never actually got to see what any of these were, which in and of itself added to their malice. What we're basically shown is a scifi themed WWII ransacking of a city. Nothing special, nothing more terrifying than any other normal war. The comments made by the high council the End of Time indicate the nature of the war. They say that they are the edge of the time war but at it's heart millions die every second, be to resurrected by time itself only for it to find new ways to kill them. This to me meant that the time war was paradoxical wasteland of possible and undone futures resulted from both the Time Lords and Daleks going back in time over and over and over again to influence the events of a battle. Imagine that, the bleed through of thousands of redos of a battle and even if you manage to win, it never happened. Living that over and over and over again. That's why I always thought the the Time War couldn't end, by it's very nature it was impossible for either side to win. That's why the Doctor had to destroy both sides and time lock the events, otherwise they'd simply start to play out over and over again. The Gelth described the war as invisible to lower beings but devastating to higher lifeforms which supports the idea that it didn't take place purely in the physical realm. Nothing that was shown even approaches that. It just wasn't anywhere near the threat or terror level that the entire run of the show had built it up to be. On top of that the ending doesn't actually work. The war can't have just taken place on Gallifrey. The high council claimed to be at it's furthest edge yet they were in Arcadia one of the planet's great cities. If the war only encompassed the planet then the furthest edge would have been a couple of million miles away, far too close for the horrors that the time lady spoke of to not effect them. So if the war is more than just the one planet removing that planet and destroying the Dalek fleet surrounding it wouldn't have done very much to the overall course of the war. The Moment would still have been needed and a time lock would have to be placed to prevent the whole thing starting over again as that's kind of the whole nature of a time war. In Moffat's version the planet would have vanished, that particular Dalek armada was destroyed... and the rest of the war should have ravaged the universe without end.

enjoying your videos. I was under the impression, storywise, that the fact the War Doctor could not recall saving Gallifrey instead of destroying it meant that all the post war angst felt by 9 and 10 was still valid, just based on a flawed assumption. the fact he regenerated right after leaving the gallery would probably garble his memories up a bit, and if he checked on Gallifrey, all he would find find is Dalek debris or no planet. unless of course, removing the planet was the key to the time lock anyway, thats sad fanboy speculation.

6:20 I think Stu is a Fortune Teller (Hell Bent)

The main reason the doctor saving gallifrey doesn’t bug me is because it’s soooooo in character for the doctor to save the world but spend his life thinking he hadn’t and using that guilt as a sword to do battle with

I liked the resolution in the Day of the Doctor. I personally just saw it as "since only the 11th Doctor will remember it, it doesn't take away from his development because as far as the War Doctor, 9, and 10 believe, he blew up GALLIFREY." However I do love your ending a bit more. I thinks it's just because despite destroying the Daleks, they were pretty much everywhere (though Russel handled that a bit better than Moffat), and it almost came off as pointless to destroy GALLIFREY (apparently that word is always in caps when I type it) if the Daleks were still out there.

Human-shaped pieece of scenery leaking fluid.....I FUCKING LOVE IT!

It doesn't make sense either, was EVERY Time Lord on Gallifrey, there weren't any renegades hiding on distant planets like Susan or the professor from Shada? And was EVERY dalek attacking Gallifrey, no one was supervising mining colonies or conquering other planets

i was made to think about this gain due to comments surrounding Billy's recent fan service vid on FiveWhoFans and looking at it objectively I don't get why you and others say there was no reason for Tom to be there in the story. Not only does he confirm that Gallifrey is indeed out there but also he was the one who brought Gallifrey Falls No More into the existence of the adventure so that any of this makes sense at all. you can complain his character's background was confusing but he is actually a fairly important piece in the episode and having him be Tom Baker is just icing on the cake.

why aren't you the showrunner 😭😭 your version is AMAZING

Honestly with everything that's happened since the 50th I think this was the tipping point where the writing started to properly break down. I found myself quitting the show about 2 years later and have had no desire to go back. It completely threw all the emotional investment out the window and had the Doctor acting as though he's still this ptsd stricken war vet when he went back and saved everyone.

its said that in series 9 he will search for gallifrey. i hope that when series 9 ends in the last few 5-10 min he finds gallifrey and just is in a large city in a huge crowd of people and the doctor just looks around and is amazed. also it would be cool if a tardis mechanic saw the doctors tardis and said he can fix it for free and the doctor declines the offer.

Tenants Doctor made the time war seem like a 40k style horror show. Nightmare Childs all the horrors in between

I like the concept of Time War a lot and I think it was a clever way to restart the show and address new audiences. I found The Day of the Doctor very entertaining. In all other respects I agree with you completely. I find myself agreeing with you a lot. (BTW, don't even get me started on how much I'd prefer a very nasty, embittered 8 to the pleasant grandad Doctor. Damn, I feel so ambiguous about War Doctor. I like the character and I love Hurt's performance - really looking forward to the BF time war series - but I would have liked McGann as the time war incarnation so much more; and, given the history of Eighth Doctor, wouldn't it be beautifully heartwrenching...? Having him realize that, yeah, sometimes it actually *is* a numbers game.)

Or what about have one of the Doctors go to Gallifrey and save a bunch of kids and take them to a new planet to start a colony from which the new Timelords will live? Like the ending of the Fires of Pompi? So the bulk of them are still destroyed but this tiny handful lives. So still has impact be he's made it a bit better. That way everybody wins.

I think the character arc is well intact because before he saves gallifrey he goes back to help the war doctor blow it up. During the entire series of new who The doctor has been running from he did, He has lines about how he's never really come to terms with it. But now he accepts himself. Thats the arc, Its the denial repression and self hatred its far more emotionally complex than what you suggest it is and it resolves here brilliantly.

This episode is good until the 1 hour mark than it becomes so bad that it ruins everything that already happened

I mean, considering the time lords can travel time, the time lords being "dead yet" doesn't mean anything. Those are time lords from the doctor's personal past, they are dead. But they are trying to travel to escape that.

You know what? As a fan and defender/devils advocate of NuWho you’re absolutely, completely right and your criticism is incredibly valid. I respect you as a creator and your opinions are always refreshing, let no one tell you otherwise Best of luck in all future endeavours

But in the way that the Time War was reversed due to the events of the Day of the Doctor, it updates the metaphor for how the Classic Series is seen now. Instead of being a joke of a relic lost in a bygone era, it is now seen as something which spurred the creation of the new series but in a positive way.

While watching Day of the Doctor was entertaining and all, I understand your point and I think your version of the ending would've been more justifiable. I've been wanting Ian and/or Susan to come back for a while now. Stephen Mofffat is nothing more than an overgrown fanboy writing fan fiction. I was done with him after "Day of the Moon" and "Let's Kill Hitler". :P

It was mentioned in the special that when Gallifery disappeared, the daleks killed themselves in the crossfire. Which is a bit dumb, but not dumber than saying that blowing up Gallifrey killed every Dalek in the cosmos.

Holy shit, your alternate version would have been incredible.

I love this video and agree with practically everything you said bar the jab at the return of the fourth Doctor. Moffat’s reasoning behind this was the fact to so so many people he was THE Doctor. As much as I like Ian Chesterton a return probably wouldn’t make much sense.

I agree that the Time War has always been a crap as presented on the series. But mostly because I thought the concept yielded some imaginative stories in the Virgin novels. It was not just a battle on Gallifrey for drama. And not even against the Daleks, but against an enemy who was basically indescribable. For an idea of the original scope, check out Lawrence Miles' "The Book of the War", and/or Magic Bullet Productions "The True History of Faction Paradox" series of audio stories. Quite a mindfuck, indeed.

Wait wait wait: I *never* believed for a second that the Doctor actually "blew up" Gallifrey. I *always* thought that he did something desperate, "pushed" Gallifrey out of reality, but he thought it was so thorough and complete that it was effectively gone. It could be said that both sides committed numerous temporal attacks against each other to the point of actually damaging reality. Pushing Gallifrey out of reality could easily fall into that category. Manipulating time, artrons and space and planets could be so complicated that he thought Gallifrey was lost forever. It's been a while since I saw a number of these episodes, I can't remember various goobledygook sci fi details about these events. But I never thought he actually destroyed Gallifrey. I could also point out the Doctor Who Pre-destination Paradox of Awesomeness or Somesuch where an event plays out one way, but - lo and behold - the event is temporally modified through the Doctor's actions to change it, yet the timeline is still OK. In other words, *the Doctor was meant to make a correction in the universe* through his actions. DW is a live action comic book, and I'm not actually defending it. I have said before, DW is one of the most frustrating sci fi shows I have ever seen. But I also like to provide *possible* explanations for things, even if they are "fanfic" explanations. Some of these kinds of explanations will never see the light of day. They never talk about certain things on screen, so you are left scratching your head.

I don't know why you shit on Davies so much. He's a much darker writer than he's given credit for.

This is how I prefer the episode could have gone: The episode should be about Eleven coming to terms with his actions at the end of the Time War. Eight replaces the War Doctor (no disrespect to John Hurt. I just feel Eight deserves more screentime than what he has had so far). Tom Baker plays a personification of the Promise who accompanies Eight and Eleven. The final act involves the Doctors witnessing the First Doctor make the Promise before leaving Gallifrey, followed by them activating the Moment together. Clara would doubt the Doctor's actions also, but has a chat with Ian Chesterton who talks to her of what the Doctor stands for, in other words we see an assessment of the Doctor's constant fight for the greater good during the most challenging stage of his life from the eyes of a companion. If we should have a villain, it should be the Daleks, if only to try and make them a threat, thus redeeming them after suffering from years of losing their credibility as a villain. Apart from that, I cannot think of anything else. The episode is about the Doctor coming to terms with himself. It would feel unique as a multi-Doctor episode. One could involve Ten and the Classic Doctors (which I leave for someone else to do), but only if they contribute to the plot somehow (and not through the use of archive footage!). So far, I have only managed Eleven, Eight, One and Tom Baker in some form, which certainly seems original in a way; personally, I couldn't see how I could involve more without cluttering the story. But yes, this is my ideal version of the special, more or less. It's not perfect, but there you go. I may cover this in greater depth if I ever write an article or a blog post on the subject.

you got it right Stuart, anyway it was Faction Paradox not the Daleks

3 years later moffet says doctor who should always have the happy ending ie, fairy tale so rip,

Speaking of,what really gets me about the whole 'save Gallifrey cause of the kids' thing is that Adric was a kid,no one saved him,did they? Yes,I'll admit I'm still very pissed off/upset about that. No body saved the child/teenage Alzarian who wasn't even in his own UNIVERSE when he died. They tried,but after the console was fixed,he wouldn't go back. What's so different here? It's still changing their own personal history. If The Doc/s could save Gallifrey here,what was stopping him from saving Adric all those years ago? Why do that? It's like saying to somebody 'you can't do this because of reasons' then letting them do it the next day. It's nonsensical and completely undermines what was said the first time. I HATED that plot point. HATED IT.

I like having the Time Lords back, but I hate Day of the Doctor (actually I just hate Moffat in General); so I ignore pretty much everything since Clara came along and pretend something better happened in it's place

Suspending disbelief has never been an issue for me. I suppose, rather like a pleasing tapestry, I enjoy what I see in front of me without spending too much time thinking of the loose threads in the background. I think some people that watch Who in adulthood find it hard to suspend disbelief and crave those halcyon days of the era they viewed when young. The truth is that Dr Who was always full of plot holes but the classic era has now been forgiven for theirs. I understand that you are viewing Dr Who technically and with a script writers head on and I imagine it must be very difficult to overlook plot holes or obvious devices when you see them. I, however, still love it and I actually love what Moffat has done with it. A bit of escapism for me but I do enjoy listening your take on it.

Telling Galifrey to duck so the Daleks shoot themselves is something you wouldn't find in the worst fan fanzines fan fiction pages, what was the point of having the

top it off the lady who shot herself is extremely insane, just so her granddaughter be in space for "human advancement in space" while AT her families home where they see her dead corpse in the living room, that is a horrible way to end, theirs no reason why she needed to do that. doctor could said "their are other ways to go in space" or anything then " your granddaughter will go in space on warp drive for mankind from your death, so don't use that convenient gun in your hand on yourself while you enter the house". As much as I dislike British way of resolutions, endings like water on Mars is a hollow bitter way of crossing over a river, instead of finding a different way, you had the characters drown themselfs to make a Bridge.

The Time War was a great concept!

It was unremarkable, AND, if you have Nine as 'your' Doctor, which some of us do, it was gutting as all frak.