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I'm a tech in the Washington Baltimore area of Maryland and wouldn't call myself expert on heat pumps either but If you can force it into defrost by jumping the test pins on the board it's the sensor that's bad. It's better to be safe then sorry and get the kit that comes with it all. Love your videos keep up the good work
I work for 486. Plumbers fitters and service techs. I used to do residential but always want to get more involved in service. When doing heat pumps they really challenge my mind. I just don’t understand all of these lockout switches, defrost modes. I don’t get it and it bothers me because I feel like I should know it. I’m an apprentice so I’m trying to ask all the questions I can while I’m learning. It just really challenges me. It’s like I’m fine with straight AC and Gas Furnaces but when it comes to heat pumps I just get lost.
Lots of heat pumps down here. The ‘D’ terminal on the board is what energizes the heat strips when the unit goes into defrost, not a call for defrost. If the thermostat was calling for auxiliary heat you would have had 24v from D to common. The lights on the board were DS1 ‘off’ and DS2 ‘slow flash’. I can’t find what they mean online, but it would have told you right off the bat what to look for. Love your videos, just trying to be helpful so don’t take this the wrong way and stay safe out there
That defrost board was in Low Pressure Lockout mode as indicated by the two LED's on the board, LED 1 off, LED 2 flashing. You reset the Low Pressure Lockout mode on the board when you shorted the test pins. it also went into defrost mode and came out of it when the coil sensor was satisfied, which indicates the defrost board was functioning fine. Also, the two LED's were flashing together afterwards showing normal operation of the board. See below for a clearer understanding. You can re-watch your video and see all of this. We all live and learn, I enjoy your videos and your humor, Steve. Control Board Status LED 1 LED 2 OFF OFF No Power ON ON Coil Sensor Failure OFF ON Ambient Sensor Failure FLASH FLASH Normal OFF FLASH Low Pressure Lockout (short test pins to reset) FLASH OFF High Pressure Lockout (short test pins to reset) ON FLASH Low Pressure Control Open FLASH ON High Pressure Control Open Alternate Flashing 5 Minute Time Delay Low Pressure Control (standard) - Provides active protection in both heating and cooling modes at all outdoor ambient temperatures. The low pressure control is an automatic reset type and opens at approximately 15 psig and closes at approximately 40 psig. Operation is slightly different between cooling and heating modes. Cooling Mode: The compressor and fan motor will stop when the low pressure control opens and will start again when the low side pressure rises to approximately 40 psig when the low pressure control automatically resets. If the low pressure switch opens 3 times within a particular call for cooling operation, the defrost control will lock out compressor and outdoor fan operation. Heating Mode: The compressor and fan motor will stop when the low pressure control opens and will start again when the low side pressure rises to approximately 40 psig when the low pressure control automatically resets. If the low pressure switch trips 3 times within 120 minutes of operation during a particular call for heating operation, the defrost control will lock out compressor and outdoor fan operation. If the lock-out due to low pressure occurs at an outdoor ambient temperature below 5°F, the defrost control will automatically exit the lock-out mode when the outdoor ambient temperature rises to 5°F. This feature is necessary since the low pressure control could possibly heave opened due to the outdoor ambient being very low rather than an actual system fault. Exiting Lock-Out Mode: To exit the lock-out mode, remove 24 volts to the defrost control by removing power to indoor air-handler/furnace or by shorting the two defrost control test pins together.
running the heat pump, even in heating mode, in an ambient outside temperature that is to low, which provides no efficiency, as well. That is why you don't see as many heat pumps in Steve's area of our country, like you do down south.
@@bornin59 Great information. So what you're saying is that the board and sensor may have been ok, it's just the capable efficiency of the unit and the low temp environment that is more likely to be causing the lockout? Or in otherwords: heat pump in a really cold area. And I assume after a certain amount of time it'd come out of lockout without the customer having to reset anything, right? They could have potentially just kept using emergency heat most of the winter and heat pump would have kicked in on the higher temp days by itself. Someone let me know if my understanding is right. Please
@@themayorofairconditioning2868 I believe your understanding is correct, and I was saying this all to myself from the very beginning. (However it may have required a power cycle on the breakers to get it out of lockout, or at least it has been in my experiences). But anyway the flashing sensor code clearly shows a LPL and that was likely due to being so very cold out. It didn't really need a new board it was just that heat pump was being run in conditions it could not handle effectively. That's why the emergency heating kicked in and that's why it would have been better to explain this to the homeowner rather than charging for a new board and sensors.
Good job !! Steve to remove the board from the pins , i use a BIC pen , remove the refil and , after that just push on the pins and it free up the board Or a little cooper tube. same size over and bingo !!!!! Thanks Serge ( from Mtl )
I would have tested the 24 voltes comimg out of the low pressure switch, i bet thats the problem.. Either way i absolutely love this channel.. I would love to see you do a video on charging by using subcooling or superheat. I know how, i just wanted to see you do it cause i enjoy this stuff.. Great job Steve.
Good instructional video for new techs on changing out control, will encourage all my techs to watch your videos,air to air heatpumps work great out here in Phoenix and are efficient,can't believe they would install them in the Northeast.
Steve you have to look at those flashing lights and see what the fault is. Should say on the board. I knkw it came as a set board and sensors but for next time really helps out and makes troubleshooting faster
Steve down on the island we have a ridiculous amount of H/P . Why people choose to use these units in the northeast is mind blowing . I’ve noticed a lot of the time it’s the outdoor thermistors that fault . I had a customer two weeks ago . She waited a month b4 calling , kept her unit in emergency. Her bill was over a $ 1000...
I believe that code was flashing a low pressure lockout. Shorting the pins just reset the board and cleared the fault. And those thermistor sensors can't be cut and wire nutted, they have to read a specific amount of resistance to work properly. Don't know what was going on with that? It's possible there was a TXV problem that pulled the pressure down low enough to go into lockout, maybe?
Michael Foller we are dealing with demand defrost here, not time and temperature. Those are thermistors and change resistance with temperature, the colder it gets the higher the resistance you will measure on your ohm meter. The sensors cannot be "jumped out" to simulate being closed. You will short them and their toast. You're using one thermistor to measure outdoor ambient and one to measure coil temperature. The board will only go into defrost when multiple parameters are met. All manufacturers are switching to this style of defrost. The time and temperature days are coming to an end. 👍
ok, i tried blue gloves today. when i pulled on the left, i tore off the top. then i ripped off the right finger when it got caught in a pipe thread. and my hands got all soft and sweaty. you bang away on yours and they never tear or fail. skilz baby, next level.
if your hands got sweety you have had them or to long . mine hardy ever ripe .buy a better brand of gloves .they do take a bit to get use to .but i use them because of all the nasty stuff i would be touching .to me it makes good sense to use them .if i go out to truck for part i usally change them .before opening the door .
You gotta love it when both the Chinese and Mexicans come together and build a product that you have to stand behind. I just get a hamburger bag and cut some eye holes out.
If you hit the test button on the defrost and it runs the full cycle its usually the sensor and you don't need a hole new board. Save that board Steve it might be good.The test switch just bypasses the defrost sensor
@@Bryan-Hensley -- I quit selling used parts. I got burned when they failed and had to go back for free and get it running and then go back and put another used part on again if I didnt have the new one. I only put used parts on as a temporary fix IF NECESSARY, until the new one comes.
@myronsmith2114 I can almost guaranty you he will never see another heat pump that uses that exact board again. Probably should've just given it to the customer to keep in case the new one ever goes out. I think the old board was good.
I've installed some heat pumps (mitsubishi Eco Dan models ) here in the UK and all I got was post install complaints about huge electricity bills They are also a nightmare to diagnose and repair when they break I gave up working on them I just stick to working on gas boilers
Had my New a.c. unit installed inside and in Texas . Sorry way to heat a home. Bottom line if it's very cold outside you better break out your portable gas heater . Wish I would have gone back with heat strip unit. Costs little more on my electric bill but at least it warms the house.
It is 30F right now where I live but it feels like 19, but it can go to -20 and sometimes -40F. Regular would be in the single digits to upper 20s. I have a Goodman heat pump I guess a 3 ton for a 1,634 sq ft home. I bought the house a year ago and I cannot get used to how cold the house is with the heat pump I recently bought a laser thermometer to check on the air temp coming out of the vents. there is only one vent that the temperature comes out at 92F, the rest are reading 75F and one of the farthest one from the heat pump is reading 82. The ones in the living room read 74 and 75... of course the living room is the coldest and to top that problem I have cathedral ceiling. I have new double pane tempered windows, I see or feel no air drafts. The house was built in 1974. I just got an Ecobee 3 thermostat and I feel that it has gotten even worse. The heat pump won't reach the set temperature unless I engaged the auxiliary heat. When I do then the air temp from the vents are over 100F, but my electric bill will be over 300 dollars. The very first month I moved I had to pay $480 for just one month. I think heat pumps are a POS or there has to be something wrong. I had a company to come check on it and they told me it was working the way it is supposed to. My heat pump has been running non stop for the last 2 days because it has been cold, but just using the compressor, no auxiliary heat. When is a little warmer, like 40F, it will reach the desired temperature after working non stop like for 2 or 3 hours, then it stops for almost 1 hour until the temperature drops, by the time the temperature in the house drops, like about 2 degrees down the desired temp (weird because it is supposed to be just 0.5 F drop before the heat pump kicks in), then it takes a long time to reach the desired temp or it never reaches the temp unless I engaged the auxiliary mode that I really don't want to because, again it is too expensive. I still think it is because the heat pump is blowing only 75 to 76F in 98% of the house. Sorry, too long of a message... Any suggestions?
If you program the T-stat properly you can have the backup heat coils activate automatically with a certain temp differential then you will not have to do it manually and also it will shut off when the stat is say within 4 degrees of satisfy. When people buy these heat pumps you can buy them so they are programmed for a colder climate. BTW Eco Bee is a POS for heat pumps. It sounds like you elec bill was high and your system wasn't operating properly because it was not wired and programmed correctly. I specialize in wiring , repair and diagnosing integrated controls on heat pumps and other various units. 90% of the time it is just a lack of installer education. I always recommend that people take the free courses their distributors and reps provide on controls. just because someone has been in the trade 100 years does not make them a new age tech .The techs of today and the future have integrated controls and diagnostics that people could only dream about 25 years ago.
Nice job, Try working on a poolpak climate system. Which is nothing more then a over engineered heat pump with no AUX heat with a carel PCO1 micro controller and a PDG1 Keypad that uses nothing but these stupid sensors in it. I just replaced the $1900 PCO1 controller which was fun. Oh and requires a 400/150 Charge and if the Low side falls below 100PSI on a 15 degree day it shuts off. The a/c charge guy cant figure it out. I told him to overcharge the SOB to what the sticker charge pressure says. He wont do it.
Shouldn't of had to changed board out. Codes on board would have told you what was wrong. Hitting test pin just reset board and eraced code. meaning for flashing lights are on board. Work on these units every day.
Hey Steve look at the led lights it looks like the ds1 is on and ds2 is flasing but hard to tell in video if ds1 is on or not but if it is you look on the lower part of the board and get the code I think its low pressure lock out if you pull lose the common or the red it would reset the board and you could see whats going on that way to see if low on charge or what ever. Hope this helps
I’m just curious, I wonder why the thermostat didn’t automatically call for emergency heat without her have to turn it over. It should have. I noticed it’s a programmable stat. I’m wondering if the installer didn’t set it up rite.
Ps, I’m like you I don’t care how much I think I know, I do it one wire at a time, like you said that way you don’t have to wonder did I get a wire crossed.
Usually if you want to test the different board components you have to jump the reversing valve as the energize in heat mode on Ruud I believe. No matter the result is the same you have to change the board. Great video the part should have been under warranty.
Steve got any stories of people trying to steal stuff out your truck ! Oh oh I’m just looking for a back flow preventer oh oh oh come on it’s story time with Steve lav !
You'd have to "jump in" a resistor of a value that approximates the resistance of the thermistor which the control board is looking for (at whatever the operational resistance the board expects to see, (otherwise, it sets a "fault"). I carry a "dedicated testing" set which contains each of the five thermistors used in our units. The I.A.T. (Indoor Ambient Temperature) thermistor is the most prone to failure, followed by the discharge air temp thermistor. The next most prone problem involves a 2µf "matchbook non-polarized electrolytic", which is the start-run cap for the discharge fan. I've seen those go completely open.
Wayne Miles No you can never jump out those thermistors. They have 5 VDC coming off of the pins & you will short the board if you jump them. I will put a link to a video showing how to properly ohm out the thermistor below. There is also a link below that video where you can save a picture of a resistance cart to your phone to use in the field 👍 Demand Defrost Sensor video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-7Pv7zxCmKiA.html
Congratulations, sir, you have installed a truly energy efficient system. Because after all, a broken heat pump consumes zero electricity. Another customer who uses this technology and gets to freeze her ass off in the winter.
It's a perpetual motion device,you get more energy out than you put in,the only downside is :4 times the cost of a boiler,bi annual service,expensive parts ,those smart enough to fix these systems aren't tradesmen
@@gimmieliberty6514 I feel like there is a bad stigma attached to heat pumps because they are not controlled, programmed and installed properly. I love the Mitsubishi Universal line they are hi-tech and can go with any orientation with a 12 year warrante
Heat pumps do not work well in cold climates. That's why they are mostly found in the sun belt. And now the environmentalists want to get rid of gas and oil heat and use only heat pumps. :(
Steve I would have compared ohm reading on thermister with a temp chart ( example at 70 degrees themister might read 100ohms) you could have compared the reading (ohms) with new and old themister. I am guessing that that old board could be good. An other thing is why did old themister connected with wire nuts( that could have been your problem, wonder why it was cut) its all just a thought. Keep up the good work. Have a blessed day
Shannon Knight - That's a temp switch either its open or closed it doesn't work off ohms .Wire nuts wouldn't effect it unless the wire nut were loose or corroded
I have a heat pump in my house in Texas and they said that if it's over under 40 degrees the heat pump goes to emergency heat well that's a bunch of b******* I think what do you think my electric bill without the heat without the heat pump is about a hundred bucks a month but when it's really cold it's like three hundred bucks a month
Heat Pumps work by collecting leftover heat in the outside air transferring it to the indoors by refrigerant, sort of like an air conditioner turned backwards, but what they are talking about is if the temperature is under 40 degrees and going below freezing, the heat pump is going to struggle and work poorly as a stand alone, so it requires AUX heat in that case which could be ether a gas furnace, or electric heat strip furnace that is on standby.
if you put that heat pump in shouldn't the parts be under warranty? do you deal with these Bard wall hung packaged AC and Heat pumps. they are common here on mobile homes and telecommunication areas.
Can't see how they would work in Minnesota. They say they can but I doubt they could recover much heat when it's -20 or so. We do have them with geothermal systems.
Don't waste your time, too far north . hydronic heat is best gas, oil or wood fired is even better. I live north of Philly and the heat pump is not enough when it drops below 15 or really 20. but, when it's like 35 and up it's better. Geothermal could work but, major job.
I'm sure they have progressed. Just can't see them pumping warm air at a -30 design temp. I've seen -32 below with a high wind a number of times and I'm in southern part of the state. Cold enough to have multiple sources of backup heat.
Went to a job one day and the guy had a ac not running and he said another company came and checked it and said it was shot turns out the disconnect was pulled!
Baby dog is working again y'all Steve please don't tell me you're eating another shit sandwich today LOL great video I can't wait till tomorrow video peace
Hey IT guy,electricians don't take advice from 5 volt sparkies,,here in the UK that device would be protested by an rcbo with a disconnect time of 40 milliseconds at earth leakage of 30 milliamps,scared? Get back under the desk
Yeah only one led was blinking, other wasn't. Chart showed which sensor bad. But same token to I guess sometimes just replace it all so he doesn't get called back...
It's basically a refrigerator,compressed refrigerant gasses that get hot heating the house(like the back of a fridge)then go outside and cool(the inside of a fridge)massively expensive,unreliable,total con
May want to carry these in truck, save time hunting for a specific board. www.emersonclimate.com/en-us/Products/Controls/residential-ac-heat-pump-controls/Pages/defrost-control.aspx
It is 30F right now where I live but it feels like 19, but it can go to -20 and sometimes -40F. Regular would be in the single digits to upper 20s. I have a Goodman heat pump I guess a 3 ton for a 1,634 sq ft home. I bought the house a year ago and I cannot get used to how cold the house is with the heat pump I recently bought a laser thermometer to check on the air temp coming out of the vents. there is only one vent that the temperature comes out at 92F, the rest are reading 75F and one of the farthest one from the heat pump is reading 82. The ones in the living room read 74 and 75... of course the living room is the coldest and to top that problem I have cathedral ceiling. I have new double pane tempered windows, I see or feel no air drafts. The house was built in 1974. I just got an Ecobee 3 thermostat and I feel that it has gotten even worse. The heat pump won't reach the set temperature unless I engaged the auxiliary heat. When I do then the air temp from the vents are over 100F, but my electric bill will be over 300 dollars. The very first month I moved I had to pay $480 for just one month. I think heat pumps are a POS or there has to be something wrong. I had a company to come check on it and they told me it was working the way it is supposed to. My heat pump has been running non stop for the last 2 days because it has been cold, but just using the compressor, no auxiliary heat. When is a little warmer, like 40F, it will reach the desired temperature after working non stop like for 2 or 3 hours, then it stops for almost 1 hour until the temperature drops, by the time the temperature in the house drops, like about 2 degrees down the desired temp (weird because it is supposed to be just 0.5 F drop before the heat pump kicks in), then it takes a long time to reach the desired temp or it never reaches the temp unless I engaged the auxiliary mode that I really don't want to because, again it is too expensive. I still think it is because the heat pump is blowing only 75 to 76F in 98% of the house. Sorry, too long of a message... Any suggestions?
@@Kikin111976 my friend works for a housing association that is using heat pumps on a large scale, they can't keep up with the servicing, breakdown cost where so high that they had to take it "in house'.the initial cost,servicing,breakdown and sub zero running costs just don't make financial sense
Ian Robinson yes is a pain the butt, I haven’t had any fixing problems so far thank God and during the mild and hot weather, say from may all the way to almost December I had been only paying about 60 dollars per month on electric bills. That is not bad at all considering that everything in my house is electric. I wish I had a gas furnace as a back up, and was already considering it, unfortunately I just lost my job two weeks ago and now I am screwed
