History of Antique Black Mantel Clocks - updated version

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Antique black mantle clocks are probably the most plentiful type of American clock you will encounter so lets learn a little more about them. My name is Ab and I love sharing my passion for old clocks with others. Thanks for watching my video and I trust you will have found it to be informative.

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11 июл 2024

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Комментарии : 39

@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Год назад

Thanks for the video! Recently got into clocks and started with a slate/granite Frenchie from the mid 1800s. Then a slate/marble Ansonia. Then a Porcelain Ansonia. Then a very early Gilbert Kitchen clock. Then a Gingerbread Gilbert Calendar. Then a Sessions small case office clock(1900). Then a gridiron Frenchie wall clock, then a Calendar/alarm Gilbert Ornate kitchen clock. Then I decided to buy a quintessential Ingraham black mantle clock. And yeah, the materials are inferior to the others I've acquired, but honestly, they look outstanding and are easy as cake to work with. I don't buy more than 1 or 2 of the same style, so found a Mahogany quad column Ingram, a small ornate patinated factory wood finish Ingraham (1890s), and most recently an oak Ingraham with a pendulum window(fancy pendulum) and very ornate all brass dial(very early '79 pat'd mark). I have a Tambour very early manual start electric Sunbeam Eternatime, an Art Deco tone rod Seth Thomas walnut mantle clock, a large early (wood peg assembly dial bezel) regulator style(rectangle window design), and many other styles. Currently sourcing a spring for a German (unbranded) chime/strike(time train has broken spring). I have serviced all of them(sans German chime/strike), so the house is filled with different BPH tik-toks that makes for an oddly relaxing environment. And so many lovely chimes of different tones(from wire gongs, flat wire gongs, wrought iron gong, tone rod, and bells). I get really miffed at "oh, it isn't investment grade" guys. If you're a real collector, you don't buy to sell. Selling is only done as necessary if one is a collector. Investors are not as much as enthusiasts as collectors are. Enthusiasts appreciate everything about a clock, including what made it beautiful, yet affordable. Lets be real; who, that truly loves all types of vintage and antique clocks, is buying them specifically to sell at a certain point? Not collectors. Just my $0.02 on it. I have so many clocks accumulated, I let a friend take my Mahogany Ingraham home to borrow, since it was the clock's 100th birthday (October '22 stamped original movement). I'll add as well, amatuer clock makers will not enjoy working on antique french clocks. They're 10x more finicky than the American clocks(my gridiron pendulum wall clock and slate/granite were real brutes with the fine taper pin construction and such. Parts almost always handmade, which if you break something, your hands will be bleeding from using needle files to make a part if you're up to it. Ingraham, Sessions, Gilbert, Ansonia, Seth Thomas, etc are all easy to source parts for and relatively easy to set the escapement in proper orientation with some practice. Quality:Cost for collecting is probably Ansonia in my opinion. They, like Welch, made clocks easily competing with French clocks.

@time4clocks Год назад

Thank you for your nice comment, Alex. I have pinned it so that others may benefit from your insight regarding clock collecting. I try to appreciate an item for its own merit and uniqueness, not for what it is worth. In fact, most of the clocks I have would probably be dismissed by a more "sophisticated" collector. 😁I've seen comments dismissing American clocks as "mass produced." All aspects of collecting seem to involve some form of snobbery. I say, collect what you like, surround yourself with what gives you joy, and don't let anyone take that from you. Best regards, Ab. 🙏

@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Год назад

@@time4clocks So glad I found your channel, Ab! You're certainly welcome for my thoughts on it. I am coming from the antique fan world and it suffers snobbery as well. Unlike clocks, I own some snob fans. And sadly, they're not really any better than more common stuff. Once all factors are considered. Mass produced just means "something we won't have to worry about wearing out or finding parts for". Haha. Wonder how the snobs feel BEGGING for parts for an 18th century Frenchie, and having to display it not running for 5 years. Oh wow, I could never put a clock out for display if it didn't run well. Same with everything I've ever collected. Half my fun is winding them every week. :D Sophisticated? Nice word for wealthy people who are not intelligent enough to appreciate the merits of things they proclaim to dislike, and probably have never owned. 😅 And hot take: French clocks may technically have better construction, but they never run without some serious intervention. They're much easier to damage, so the "better construction" is debatable in a restoration sense. I don't argue better looking movements and nicer made parts though. I see that with both of my Frenchies. Absolutely, you're right. If it appeals to you, surround yourself with it. I'm not well off, but can occasionally find junked higher end stuff I can bring back to life. But, really and truly, I'd just assume have a black American mantle clock than a French one. My French slate was a gift from my mother years ago. It was just not long ago I decided to get into it and see if I could make it run well again. And the French only fellas obviously never worked on a higher end Welch(Albany NY made). I had the pleasure to do a full restoration (slat/marble case resto) and movement overhaul (machined wheels and barreled springs like French clocks. Exhibition escapement with Ruby jewels and machined polished brass escapement. Sadly out of my price range, but man was it a stunner. I still feel it was the highest quality clock I've ever worked on. I'll be watching more of your content and hopefully learning more about all clocks, and not just some snob in a video tossing a busted Ingraham on a table calling them "common junk". If you're gonna crap on something, get a nice example. The snobs never seem to have a nice American mass produced example to show when running on about the immense superiority of French clocks that will stop when there is a draft, and break of you look at them wrong. 😅 Glad you love all the old clocks! And I never bow at the alter of snob either. When it is all said and done, I find people with modest collections enjoy theirs more than the snobs. Every single time. :) Best regards to you, Alex

@time4clocks Год назад

@@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Thank you Alex, very well put. 🤓🙏

@pepperdog3761 6 месяцев назад

"but if you like clocks the way I do"...........lol....totally understand

@time4clocks 6 месяцев назад

🤣🤣

@sgtcote1 2 года назад

Thank you I just started collecting antique clocks and today I purchased my Ingraham flat top black mantle clock. It was missing the key and pendulum, but the movement looked great, and the case was is good to very good condition. I happened to harve an extra key that fit and I ordered a replacement pendulum. As I was trying to learn more about my new "1911" clock I stumbled onto your videos. I now know so much more about this clock and now want a topper for it. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us all. These old clocks are amazing time keepers and are great pieces of American craftsmanship. I'm proud to be part of the community of antique clock lovers.

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Appreciate your nice comment, Sgtcote1. Antique clocks are a great hobby and tie you in with the history. You now own something that other people have had in their home for generations and are probably all deceased now. I give the clocks much respect and hope you enjoy yours as well. Any questions, feel free to ask. I'm no expert but will always try to give a good answer or point to others more knowledgeable. :)

@donaldjones8920 Год назад

Thank you for your video. I have been buying these clocks, collecting I guess you could say, for years. I have about 2 dozen. None of them working. LOL. I just like the look. Been watching videos on clock repair and I may try to get some of them working again. Thanks again.

@time4clocks Год назад

I like the way they look as well, Donald, running or not. 😁 They are a tribute to a bygone age. Once you start tinkering you might like it. Cheers!

@martinasd4911 2 года назад

Glad to see your channel's back, was my favorite channel

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Thank you Martin! That means a lot and I appreciate it!!

@delbertreno8089 Год назад

Truly enjoyed your video. I have always loved the black mantle clocks! I have always been fascinated by all the columns and statues between the columns and the elaborate ornamentation that was put on them. I personally think they are a thing of beauty. I am fairly new to clockmaking and working on getting all of mine running and striking the way they should. Running is no problem usually but the striking is something else LOL! They strike but getting the count right is a pain but I am sure I will get there. Loved your video! Thanks

@time4clocks Год назад

Thanks for your nice comment!

@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Год назад

Hey Ab! Your little "Pearl" inspired me to get one. Found one and finished the restoration today. Love it so much! I polished the black and refinished all the gold metal work. Unfortunately the origin 1903 movement needs a ton of work, so a temporary 1922 movement went in I had used as a practice movement that runs well. I'll rebuild the OG movement at some other time. But, your little Ingraham Pearl is definitely worth the effort in restoring. Some patina'd clocks look good, but not the Pearl. Very elegant, and not overdone. I repapered the dial and patinated the paper. Had Roman numeral, and I found the identical face online and printed on "aged paper" with some sepia applied. Will post a video soon! Thank you again for the video that made me want to find these little gems that won't make you bankrupt. 😀 Also managed an open escapement movement for my French slate/granite clock. Needs a major overhaul, but it the first movement of that style the speed adjustment gear wasn't stripped. Good springs and escapement jewels in good shape. Polished escapement and very high quality. I'm on the wall though, as the slate/granite Frenchie was my first antique mechanical clock. I'll make the swap using the original dial ring, door frame, and pan.

@time4clocks Год назад

I am quite envious of your being able to work on those nice clocks, Alex! It sounds like you are very proficient in your restorations and your enthusiasm is inspiring to me. Thank you for keeping me updated and I'm glad you found a Pearl of your own. 😁 Hope you had a nice Thanksgiving. 🙏

@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Год назад

@@time4clocks Thank you very much for the kindness. I've been in restoration for 20 years. Mostly furniture and lighting, but that gives me a lot of prerequisites and tools to branch into other arenas. The clocks were not intentional, to be honest. I started a lighting business and somehow people figured I worked on clocks. So, after Benin asked so many times, I started buying junked up clocks and making myself tear them apart reassemble them. Then learning the importance of impulse and power to the escapement. I don't claim to be a clockmaker by any means though. Just someone stubborn enough to weed their way through. 😅 And along the way, I fell in love with clocks as something to pursue personally. Among many other hobbies stepped into the same way. Please keep up the good work and Channel videos, Ab! You're a much needed calm in the storm of the world.

@time4clocks Год назад

@@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Thank you Alex! Your skillset and experience seem a perfect match for clocks and puts you a few steps ahead of some of us amateurs learning from scratch. It is good fun though. My biggest challenge is actually getting out to the workshop and just doing something as something always comes up. I was out there for about an hour a couple days ago, puttering and listening to Dean Martin, and it was just sooo nice. 😁

@antiquesandlearningtolive4369 Год назад

@@time4clocks You're certainly welcome, as always, sir! Every clock runs for somebody sometimes, right? 😁 I just love working on electrical and mechanical stuff. Functional antiques, as it were. Wish it was something that could provide a reasonable income, but alas I live below the poverty line. Though, I never get pitiful about it. We know this work, done by so few now, will be instrumental in lowering the amount of clocks headed to the landfill one day. Still trying to master just converting this pile of recoil strap pallets into excellent deadbeat pallets. Tonight I did my best one so far. The power is so strong, I used a large swiss army knife as a test pendulum. So much power got to it, the darn thing swung and kept on. Haha I really need a spare pendulum..😅 It is prep for installing the guts and rear plate onto the 1903 plate after I fix the outboard bushing things. I haven't done real bushings yet, but soon. However, I don't see any shame in use the outboard solder(or screw) on thingamabobs. They look nice done correctly. I am hoping to get a video of Pearl going Monday. She has been running days on the first converted pallet I did. But, it is far too sensitive to level(5x more than an Ingraham should be). My suspension springs I bought are too strong for starters. But, the converted pallet it not very good, even for amatuer work. This newer one is ugly(had to drill closer to the base of the strap, since it was originally a recoil pallet). But, the strap surfaces I took to my belt sander instead of hand filing. Got the mean and sharp. Then used my polishing wheel to make them smooth as silk. It is cathartic to me, in that I don't enjoy working on certain items I restore for others, but love doing it to my own stuff. A certain part of not worrying about a phone call regarding something not working is absent, which makes it nice. If my own stuff stops working, I don't lose money fixing it. Customer clock stops running? Oh boy. None have yet. But, I have a clock maker produce pieces for customer clocks, and perform the adjustments in the strap pitch and entry. And I don't take clocks in with more than minimal play in the pivots or nearly gone clicks. Having a few parts movements, I have spare springs and good click/wheel assemblies for a few brands. It is understandable the having time to get to the workshop. Half the time I work on clocks in the kitchen. My workshop is geared to fan resto, and not a good environment for clocks(metal dust, dirt, grease, saw dust, crude, etc). Imagine oiling a clock and assembling with steel dust everywhere. It'll be all up in every pivot, springs, etc. 😱

@52dislikes 2 года назад

Beautiful clocks. I like that American clocks sometime have a chime and a bell. I think the unrestored are more interesting. Loud tickers so you knew they were running. Gilberts are my favorite with a deep chime.

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Gilberts are a favorite of mine as well. Nothing like a resonating cathedral gong to make a room feel....awesome!! Thanks for the nice comment, 52. :)

@fabienlamour3644 2 года назад

Hi! Ab I've bought a Waterbury Buffalo c.1891 last week...great condition, recently serviced... You've made me sick about those old ladies....thank's.⏰⏰⏰👏👏👏👏

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Nice walnut case kitchen or parlor clock, Fabien! Waterbury had another Buffalo come out in 1904 with the same case but with a calendar dial and plain glass. Yours is probably the first model from 1891-1893 and should have nice stencil on the glass. Nice!

@fabienlamour3644 2 года назад

@@time4clocks thank's for the information...i like to learn about this famous clock's world. 👍👍👍

@fabienlamour3644 2 года назад

Oh! After reading better i think i have the 1904 with,as you discribed, the calander and the plainglass... Wow very precise knowledges. Thank's again.

@time4clocks 2 года назад

@@fabienlamour3644 mon plaisir mon ami

@OddJobFix Год назад

After watching I realized I had watched this before. When you got to the toppers, I remembered. Still learned more the 2nd time. But how would one know a topper from just a sculpture?

@time4clocks Год назад

Hello friend Zeke! Hope you are well. Can't remember if I showed any toppers in the video but there are three of them in my living room video. The ones with animals usually have a flat rectangular base, all one piece, and the ones of people generally have a round base, again all one piece, but all generally made of spelter or pot metal. There are also better and lesser quality ones. Many are finished to look like bronzes. In any regard, The toppers are just statues/figures that go can go on top of the clock but other statues not made for clocks can be used as well. Hope that helps! Best regards, Ab.

@jordanbusby6231 2 года назад

What is the value of the ingraham wizard in today's market in your opinion?

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Hi Jordan. Right now there are 4 Wizards on ebay. One at $65, one at $75, and 2 at $200. In good running condition and with the gold detailing on the front, maybe $120. Not running needing repair or case in rough shape maybe $60-75. It all depends on what someone is willing to pay. The people that want $200 are delusional in my opinion.

@thisisdvd8094 2 года назад

I found one of these at an antique mall (sort of like the one at 2:33 in shape), but it was missing the hands and it was very dirty. There was nothing visibly wrong with the movement, though, and the gong sounded great (it was made of nice, thick metal). I didn't get it, but now I kind of wish I did. It was actually the same model as this clock here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-SZHv0uB3Yos.html )

@time4clocks 2 года назад

I saw the clock in that video. Nice design. The case was from 1915 but the movement was from the 1920's. The 1915 clocks had an adjusting wheel to turn on the front of the dial to make the clock run faster or slower. All those clocks have great character and if you can get a dirty one and clean it up that's a good way to save money. 😀

@1AEROSOL.1PUFF Год назад

I JUST PICKED UP A HOWARD MILLER GRANDFATHER CLOCK, NO FLAWS, AND WORKING, PAID $140

@time4clocks Год назад

Very nice! Sometimes you need to be at the right place at the right time. 😸

@fabienlamour3644 2 года назад

What's going on...i though you were gone for ever...my gosh!!!! Don't do that... My poor hearth!!! So you are there..let's keep on clockking!!!!.

@time4clocks 2 года назад

Hi Fabien!! I restarted the channel for a fresh start, reboot. Am editing and updating some of the videos before I make new ones. So happy you found me again and hope you and your wife are well!!

@fabienlamour3644 2 года назад

@@time4clocks 👍👍👍⏰⏰⏰