No, they keep neighborhoods clean and safe. Just because he was a problem, that’s his problem. And what a laugh, criminalized? Lol HOA’s can’t and never will. If a board member does wrong, embezzles money, that’s the only person who would be a criminal. I live in a HOA community for over twenty years and never had one issue with any neighbors and I would never get into any neighbors face or property. If a neighbor isn’t happy with the people next door or across the street, it’s their business to report it to the people working at our community’s HOA’s main office. It cracks me up when people see one person or a couple being all crazy in one video, I see comments like yours like it’s going to solve world problems. Lol 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
@@HappyGirl92593 HOA's don't keep neighborhoods clean and safe. What a crock of ____. All they do is pester people with tons of stupid rules and turn neighborhoods into fascist hellholes. Not only should they be criminalized, but the people who start them should be prosecuted under the 14th amendment and thrown in prison.
@@HappyGirl92593 HOAs do not keep neighborhoods clean and safe. That's a crock. What they actually do is pester the neighborhood with tons of stupid rules. Not only should they be criminalized, but the people who start them should be prosecuted under the 14th amendment and thrown in prison.
It is a blessing to live in a country where everything is not owned by the state. You have no freedom there. You cannot own private land that gives you the ability to restrict access to your property by people who insult you and abuse the privilege to come onto your property.
@@jackfanning7952 True. And it's a blessing to live in a country where everything is not owned privately, especially by an HOA. So glad my local parks and open space protects stuff like this.
Oh no, Florida is the land of free… funny how people believe so much bs about a state where old fuckers with too much time on their hands, do all they can to harass people minding their own business!
That may not be totally correct. In Colorado, the landowner owns the bottom of the river. You can float through someone's property but not get out and wade. I have no idea where this guy is fishing.
High water mark is public easement in Idaho if its "naviable" You cant tresspass over private land to get to it but if you enter at a public road you are good@@ML-ks2lj
the one river in Virginia comes under the old king George grant.the folks their owns the water and the land under the water.wrong but that's the way it is for those "ELITE" folks.
Ive seen worse Karen"s. But he still needs to make sure he knows the law before confronting someone like this. How I deal with these types is I simply say, "call the game warden, if he tells me to leave then I will leave.. Until then, I do not want to discuss it any further. We can talk about the weather, but not about if I can fish here or not".
bingo. sounds like a white person in idaho. some of the most racist people and retarded people ive ever met. Its the illegals thats our nations problem. proceed to hire a gardner housekeeper etc that are all illegal. think their kids are too good to work dairies.... all illegals. americans need to stop being pussies and we will be alright
Are you stupid enough to assume you are not trepassing when someone tells you you are on private property? Take your chances. Roll the dice and see how that works out for you.
You read my mind! But I’ve noticed that some people have boundary issues. Like serious boundary issues. It’s an instinct that’s probably been reinforced too often.
If someone breaks their ankle while burglarizing your house they can sue you. Same principle applies here- plus the trash people leave behind is dangerous to wildlife and hurts the looks and environment. Boatless bank trash need to police themselves better.
@@cuivre2004get happier buddy. I'm sure you leave a paper trail without fishing. Why do you do about what you complain about? You just whine about "boat less bank trash" littering but you know you can't stop it so if it bothers you that much, do you go do park clean ups or pick up trash you see? If not then stfu unless you're willing to be the difference. My fishing pack has 2 30 gallon trash bags in it. I don't complain about the trash I just pick it up. Once you realize you cant control other people your life will be much better. And you'd be surprised on just being the guy to show up with his gear and before he leaves he takes a half hour to clean up the area, the domino effect that has. So nut up or shut up cake boy
Years ago, Californians started buying up riverside properties all up the Elk River, here in Oregon. In places where local people had for 100 years walked a short ways off the public road and down a bank to go fishing, even if they were hundreds of yards from the landowner's houses, they put up high chain link fences to block the access and put up no trespassing signs. Guess they didn't realize that rural Oregon isn't downtown LA or Oakland, and you don't need to lock everything up like Fort Knox with barbwire and machinegun nests. Not very neighborly.
As a retired Forest Service officer you are correct, any navigable waterway can be used by the public below the high water mark and can not be posted below that, even if your land surrounds a river or stream. That is a federal law in every single state , weather someone likes it or not. I've run into the same thing before while looking for arrowheads along stream and lake banks. I do understand in a way why people don't like it ,, but let's face it some people are just pigs and leave mess's everywhere , but that issue can be resolved easily by law enforcement and the fines covering that infraction are much more serious than any trespassing charge, which in this case wouldn't apply anyhow. Now if someone was leaving trash and fire pits all along the bank , that's an entirely different story , then they can or could be charged with polluting a waterway or fishery , which can be a pretty hefty fine . I've written up more than one person myself for doing that in my 16+ years of service , and it's for a very good reason . If your the kinda person that does that , you just don't realize the impact those things can make on the health of a fishery or on the environment itself . Sadly there's dummy's and Kens and Karen's everywhere that don't know any better.
@@user-oq8zy3zg5u Generally speaking , if you can go down a river or stream , even on a inner tube or kayak , it's considered to be a navigable waterway by law. Hope that helps answer your question .
That is not the law in Ohio. The landowner owned the land below the water. It is legal to float, but the second you get out of your boat you are trespassing if you do not have permission
The fact that he saw you there with your child, minding your business, being a good dad and he STILL felt the need to ruin your days is pathetic. That old man is just straight up not a good person.
As someone that has lived in the boonies my whole life, the concept of a homeowners association dictating how your home can look and what you can have in your yard and harrassing people fishing on a public river just boggles my mind. Hope you and your daughter had fun anyways. Take care.
I'd tell him to contact the DNR and send them out if I need to move. He has no jurisdiction nor ability to make you move. He does have the ability to be charged with harassing someone fishing.
If you are below the regular high-water line and you did not trespass to get there, you are 100% allowed to fish. The road's a stones throw away. Is their front porch the reeds or the bank? No. I guarantee the water line goes up at least a couple feet at least once a year, if not more. No one would ever build their house there. no matter who owns the property, that area is 100% legal to fish.
Ever notice how fish seem to congregate in waterways that run through land owned by entitled assholes? Been thru this same scenario too many times to count. Glad you stood your ground man.
If it’s “waters of the US”, which this is, the public can use the water and the property owner can’t regulate that. However, the property owner can regulate “access” to it if the public trespasses on private property to gain access to the water. This is why it is legal for boats and kayaks to gain access to this specific spot via upstream but not legal for people to bank fish after trespassing across private property.
You, sir have a lot more patience than I do. A wise old man once told me “Do you know what gets people killed? Other people’s business. So you best just mind yours.”
Problem is... the infestation of Social Media and being in everyone's business has created people like these who feel they're entitled to stick their nose in yours at every turn. It's absolutely sickening.
its a strange world indeed. Because Private land may be owned but in many cases, the water is owned by U.S. government according to LAW. So the only way a person can stop you is by taking the land right away from you. This is always true of course but it's mostly what America's law is.
Properly placed posted signs along the road side of his property could stop you by trespassing you if you cross his property to get to the highwater line. Unless there is a right-of-way road/path for access to the water. But you could still enter the legal area from up or downstream. It's a shame people have to make such wholesome activities a pain in the neck.
Did you get that guys name and contact information? Fish and Game will have plenty to say about this. Would you please keep us updated on this situation? Thx.
Here in Texas it's actually a jailable offense to interfere with or harass a hunter/angler. We also have water rights. Unless your property is completely surrounding the body of water there is like a 5 foot public easement to the navigable water. I ran into someone like this recently at a community lake. Now that I know the law, I'm just going to tell him to leave me alone or I'm calling TPWD out to cite him. I suggest looking into your states laws regarding this. If it's illegal where you are, then just call the wardens out to deal with this guy next time.
@@penguin12902 I totally agree with you, I was just saying to call the police to so everyone gets an education from the gamewarden and the guy harassing the fishermen gets to feel like a dip shit in front of the cop and gamewarden and the fishermen.
If you are 100% confident you are in a legal spot, the answer is always "Let's get the game warden out here, and if I am correct, I will be asking to press charges under the state's harassment clause." Let them put their money where their mouth is.
Quit blaming “Californians”…if they can afford to buy that land,then they deserve to own it.Money talks,and bullshit walks.Save your money,buy your own land,and quit crying.
@@redman840oh, so you haven’t lived in an area where the locusts came up and bought everything, pricing all the locals out of their own towns. Or you’re just one of the locusts. There’s a reason why everyone in the entire country hate to see California or New York plates. Every single person hates them for a very good reason. So nah, you can go screw yourself cock sucker.
I don't argue with people on this. I have had many interactions with these types of nosey Karens and Darens and I just keep it simple. "If you think I am doing something illegal, feel free to call the authorities. Otherwise, please leave me alone or I will call them and file harassment charges against you." I also carry a cheap body camera that I carry with me just in case I have those interactions, because as we all know, Karens and Darens will straight up lie to the authorities in an attempt to get their way. Then you can get them for filing a false report and likely other charges as well. Eventually, they can lose their waterway access rights if they have any.
How you access the river is definitely important. If you crossed his property to get to the high water mark then you are in the wrong. If you waded the bank to get there then I’d say you’re good.
I know that in Ohio people were putting in fences that went all the way into the water, and the game people came by and told them to pull up stakes and allow public access. That was in a place where private citizens owned countless homes, all up and down the river bank. People do not own the river, regardless of what they think. People have a reasonable right to access the bank and move along it.
Been in real estate for a long time and I tell everyone looking to buy a house, never never never buy a house with an HOA your life will be a living hell.
When you come across people like this no matter what you say they think they right. You can pull up the law on Google but even then most won't admit they're wrong or they simply can't comprehend it. All you ever need to tell them is I'm not leaving until the game warden says I'm breaking the law.
These days My response to Karens that keep going after they can't bully me is " well if you honestly believe that your right, call the police. In fact let me call them for you!" They generally run when I actually do call them, and I do!
F him .I can't speak to Idaho laws but I know in many other places if you access the water from a public easement and are standing below the high water mark they can't say shi$t. If you are on navigatabl water they are also s o l . Good on you for being calm and cool.
Navigable vs riparian is one debate. High water mark is the navigable standard, center of the river is the riparian standard. This being a navigable discussion, the HOA guys point may have been one about egress. Egess matters even in navigable water. That said, everything I saw in the video was legal. The HOA's next step will be address the access if the trails to the stream go across private property. Trail cams are used for this regularly.
I can only speak for Ohio laws on this. Private land and it's lots run to the edge of the water, signs should be posted if someone doesn't want someone trespassing, fishing or hunting on their land if they're going to be serious about any of that. This includes multiple lots run by an HOA. High water marks mean little due to flooding,which can leave a high water mark a lot higher than a true high water mark and you would have had to walk through private property to get there. Roads having names don't mean anything and the land would be owned by the developer until sold to an individual, so would still be private property requiring written permission. Now that covers the private land. Private man made lakes must be marked as such as well and must be registered with the county Auditor. Any waterway that connects to a natural water source that isn't posted is considered public/state owned. The state basically owns the water, so no matter if the land itself on both sides of a waterway are owned, they do not own the water and people can boat or wade down them as long as they don't go to shore on private land. Any bank fishing on private land needs written permission, just like hunting on private land, if you don't own the land. Whether you've had problems in the past or not, once proven to be on private land you are at the discretion of the landowner. Best bet is to call the Warden, they will make sure of everything and solve the situation. Arguing with someone just isn't worth it now days, let the Warden handle it, the worst that might happen is you'll be told don't come back. Just because you see all sorts of people breaking the law doesn't mean you can or should. Sorry dude, but he was being polite and just giving you information, he didn't get loud, he didn't tell you to pack it up and get out, you seemed to be the confrontational one, giving excuses why you should be allowed to be trespassing in this instance, so your assertion that he was a "Karen" is incorrect.
When you said 25 years of tenure there, he should’ve just shut up, turned around and walked away. I’m not too familiar with Idaho’s laws because I only ever fish in Clifton, but here in Utah you must have no trespassing signs or a gate in order to actually punish people who step on your land. If you really want to piss this guy off, start fishing from the bridge road, that’s a federally owned road and you have every right to be on it, fishing pole or no fishing pole. I agree with you on land for recreational fishing is slowly disappearing, it’s the same here with places to ride dirt bikes. I dislike rich people who think they own the planet because they earned the paper for it.
Find out from the DNR if it’s navigable and if it isn’t then research to see how it was used. Commerce is the main criteria for declaration and not if it was floatable . If it hasn’t been declared then you may want to present your research to the State to consider a Declaration
In my blue state in the Northeast, you have to purchase a trout stamp in addition to a fishing license to get trout. Oh, and you need a fishing license to fish on the shore of the ocean. You never needed a state license to fish salt water before. And they wonder how to get people in the sport of fishing?
The old man hasn't lived there his whole life. If he did, and that's a big if. He would know millions of people fish all parts of the snake. And he can only stock a lake that is private if he pays for the fish himself. I never heard in Idaho where the fish and game just up and stocked private property ponds. Unless you payed for them to do it. He's from California no doubt.
Screw that Karen dude! People fish the river on my property all the time and I can't do anything. You cannot own navigable waterways In Alaska. Keep on fishing.
See the tide it’s a river or bay !! This old guy look how clean this area is no trash shows me nothing but respect for the environment !! Fishing with your kid and someone is trying to ruin it !! That’s just ludicrous that this old guy would talk you should have handed the fishing rod to with the fish on so he can see how much fun it is !!
That's only partially correct, if you can go up or down a waterway , even on a inner tube or by kayak , property can not be posted below the high water mark. It's a Federal law valid in all 50 states.
@@twa2471 not sure if what I read pertains to easements only but the Code was separate from the navigable waters code which I am aware of, the former code seems logical because if John Q taxpayer has a fishing license he by all rights should be able to legally fish that body of water if indeed it is stocked by the state where John Q and the body of water reside. Not sure if this is a California only code because that is where this John Q lives lol.
@@noel3422 Those were just a couple links that came to mind, there's defiantly lots of other links and CFR's that might be a bit more concise I'm sure . There is allot of them and ,,fairly,,easy to find with a bit of searching. A few years back in the Winter months I worked with Clam Outdoors as a Pro Staffer and traveled the ice belt from Maine to Western NY , doing ice fishing / kids fishing clinics with Fish& Wildlife often, tons of tournaments,and did presentations at all the major sporting goods retailers like Bass Pro Shops, Cabellas, Gander MT.,,,ect so I had to put up with landowners misconceptions then too. Not only while working with the Forest Service on the enforcement end . There are different regulations in different areas for sure though , but there are basic CFR's that apply nation wide still when it comes to waterway travel . Generally speaking land can not be posted below the high water mark along a passable water way is the rule of thumb by CFR's other than in a few rare exceptions ie; soft turtle nesting areas, Loon nesting areas ect . As I warned , it can become a rabbit hole to find all the info you may be looking for and takes a heck of a long time finding it in all those CFR's I know . But with some searching you'll get better answers than from those I cited, those are very basic and don't really cover everything. Just talking to the Fish & Game guys will allow you to know what applies in your area more than anything ,so that would be simplest route to go IMHO. I did allot with them both while with the Forest Service and at Clam both and there a great bunch of folks,,,,until you mess up of course ,,,LMAO !!!!
Problem is land owners try to block access points to the water, there are regulations stating that land owners cannot block access. Wealthy landowners make sure those regulations aren’t enforced. Just look at Martins Beach in San Mateo county.
In Wisconsin the landowner owns the bank so you could get nailed for trespassing unless you stay in the water wading or in a watercraft. In Illinois where I use to live, the landowner also owns the land UNDER the water so you can get nailed just for wading! Most farmers, landowners don't mind but you could get asked to leave or charged if the guy wants to be a dick!
Every state water way laws differ here in Alabama if you launch in a public place (boat ramp) and you go 10.miles down or up river and see an opening of a creek channel and can navigate your boat through it with out passing through a gate that closes the creek a gate now I remind you and it opens up to a lake you are permitted to fish it regardless if it's privately owned or not due to the fact you entered through it on public access so if you own that lake and you have people enter it through that channel you have to get permission to place a gate not a fence or cut a tree down but an actual gate that can be locked and put a no trespassing sign on it to legally keep people out of your private lake
The issue is not the fishing, but the land. If you’re on the land, then you’re on private property. In some places it even the bottom of the river is considered private property, you can float through it, but you can’t put your feet on the bottom.
You couldn't be more wrong ... I've done the research and every state in union has laws protecting the fisherman's rights with easements to access all navigable waters !!!
I don't know who the hell told you that but you are 100% wrong... and if someone's trying to enforce that BS it's against the law and you should be suing the piss out of them.
Not wrong... In Connecticut if you own the land on both sides of a river, you own the river bottom as well. Fishermen could float down the river but standing in it would be considered trespassing
For years we used to fish off the side of the road as long as I can remember about 10 years ago they put signs up no fishing nets because people were leaving trash lawn chairs s diapers And ruined it for all the people Used to fish there and took the trash home with them
@@dustyflairthat all depends on the state buddy in my state the state owns 5 feet from the high tide mark and all the water and land under it is state owned
Here if your within the regular level of the river you can walk and fish.... go on the bank or above normal crest than your trespassing on private property.... any area you can reach from a public road you can fish that small road width from the bank but nothing more... this is Tx laws though always check your state laws
I see comments about crossing the private property to access the waters edge. The “Rivers and Streams Act” I believe allows 50 feet from rivers edge and 25 from streams edge to fish. I have only been told this but not seen it in print.
As a fellow dedicated fisherman, I can tell you that most of us think we’re experts on riparian law, when in fact, it can be very tricky, if not complex. Riparian law is completely different than conventional law. Yes, certain laws apply to “navigable” waters, but what is the legal definition of navigable. It not only has to do with the obvious, that a boat can navigate it, but other criteria apply as well, such as width, depth, length, source, naturally occurring or man made, etc. What verification do you have that it is navigable other than assumption or word of mouth? Rather than all the tit for tat, simply contact fish and wildlife and request a meeting with the officer at the site. Beforehand , go down to the courthouse and spend a couple dollars and get a copy of the plat of the related subdivision and bring it to your meet. I don’t know if it is or not, but if that was a man made channel, maybe many, many years ago, it’s entirely possible ( not probable) the developer conveyed ownership of the lot to the middle of the stream bed. (An example of the complexities of riparian law.) You could be dead right, or, dead wrong. If you’re right, you should stand up for yourself. If you’re wrong, lesson learned, and move on. I’m on your side, I just think you need to get all the facts. It seems there are 2 types of people One that actually wants a resolution to an issue, And the other that is just to looking to express themselves. Decide which type you are and base your actions on that. Thanks for listening :)
Life long resident and avid fisherman/ hunter in Idaho, and I think you nailed it. Might not be as cut and dry as alot of people think. I'm sure this is going to be hashed out in court more often in the near future. I would be curious as to F&G's opinion in this instance, as I've been threatened with trespass to hunt or fish by F&G on Pend Oreille lake under the high water mark. I've also had a freind threatened with the same on some smaller natural creeks that probably weren't navigable. My experience has been F&G hasn't been on the side of the sportsman. I know for fact they won't lift a finger for hunter harassment.
Certainly no expert, but I believe riparian rights apply to land/home owners rights to have things like docks, rafts, moored boats, etc within waterways. Has no effect on the publics right to access public waterways. If you block access to waders with a dock the public has the right to cross the dock. It does not give them the right to fish from it. *I think*
If it’s navigable it doesn’t matter if both sides are owned . The nav rule has nothing to do with floating a boat or raft but has everything to do with how it was used with commerce and it goes back to the conception of our Government.
OR, from below the high water mark as well is perfectly fine . Property owners can not post below the high water mark, period whether there land encompasses both sides or not .
I'd be tempted to ask the old fellow what his point is & to eventually go kick rocks. You're not bothering anyone. And as far as I can tell, you're not breaking any laws.
If it is covered under the federal rivers and streams act the older gentleman that is questioning the fishermen is guilty of harassment under federal law and can be told to go away or call the game warden on them. They can cease the harassment or be arrested and charged a felony.
I dwell on the shore of Gulf of Mexico. Lots of questions I don't have answers for. I don't want anyone telling me where to go but I also don't want parting Spring Breakers setting up in what is essentially my backyard. Legit Concerns from both sides. In the end I think ownership, of land, will always trump "right to public enjoyment". Not in 100% agreement. I just respect others. I stay away from other people's shit. I don't mix pleasure with fighting. High water mark... come-on... if you have to use that in an argument you're gasping for air.
Reminds me of the time I was at my local sheriffs office on a Saturday morning, and the people in front of me were trying to file a report on a father and son were fishing from a public area into a public access lake behind their house.
We owned our house, and property long long long before any HOA invented their claim to rule, in my neighborhood. I live in Texas where slapping OR punching someone, is only a misdemeanor. UNLESS they’re disabled, elderly, or a minor. And this whole town knows. If you come at me, you will be sorry. And I WILL be out of jail in less than 24 hours. Hell might even get a medal. For “standing my ground”. R.i.p. Cutty. A young man killed by a elderly man, who did not even own the land he allegedly was defending. The elderly man was acquitted for the murder of Cutty. Using the “stand your ground” law. Cutty and those other kids. Never went anywhere near that old man. Cutty was a scrapper. Picking up junk left out for the city wide pick up. That comes every other month to pick up junk, ppl drag to the STREET. The old man shot at the car Cutty, and his friends were in. As they pulled off with scrap metal from the roadside junk pile. One of the bullets struck Cutty. Killing him. Again not located on the old man’s property. Wasn’t anywhere near the old man. Never said a word to the old man. He killed Cutty, and got a Fugging medal 🏅.
The homeowners association might govern the properties but they cannot govern Open Water right of ways. He can tell you, you're standing on private property and ask you to leave. But now if you are in a canoe sitting at that same location in the center of the canal there's nothing he can do about it. You can be trespassed off the land but not the water.
Life is too short to worry about about stupid stuff like a couple people fishing. Especially for that old guy, he should do something worthwhile with what little time he has left.
