Hornby vs. Bachmann Hall Class | Who Makes the Best Model? 

If this is a (somewhat) regular series, then instead of head to head or anything like that, a proper series name could be 'Buffer to Buffer!' Something a bit more exciting XD

For me, performance is more important than appearance. You can always add details, but, usually, very little can be done to up the performance.

The bigger question is: are you running out of storage space for all these locomotives? Are Crocs back in style?Lol. Form follows function so Hornby wins.

A comparison involving the old Triang-Hornby Hall class might have been interesting too, to illustrate how standards and performance have evolved over the years. I suppose you could do this with any class really !

It's clear to me - performance is king...and price is never "not a factor!" Then there's customer service, and Hornby are in a different (and higher) universe there.

You're right about those lamp irons on the Bachmann Hall. They're about 1.1 mm in width making them equivalent to over 8 cm wide in real life. That's not to scale and about twice the size of lamp irons on some Hornby locos I measured

Brilliant video Sam! Love the comparison. I bought the Hornby hall based on your review ages ago, and then more recently got given a Bachmann one, I run my layout on DCC and the difference between them is a lot less noticeable. Think it’s very close between the two but I find myself running the Hornby one a lot more…. I think you’re right to compare old tool models to new tool, another reason companies do this is to recoup their development/tooling costs. If they can turn out a model for 20+ years their margins are going to be pretty good at the end. I often wonder whether the super-detailed models released today are funded by them keeping old ones in the range too! Even at the high prices we see now, I bet new model’s margins are A LOT tighter than we would think, or Bachmann would be willing to admit to…. :p

Hi Sam, interesting comparison. I still use my old Witherslack Hall from the 90s which I bought for 40 quid about ten years ago and I must admit she runs just fine for me, as does my Pitchford Hall by Hornby (got that train pack 😜). I took the plunge, bit the bullet and went for a “New Tool” Witherslack Hall which arrived the other week. Annoyingly I haven’t been able to run her in yet 😖 Initial impressions are that the body work has improved remarkably. I am slightly nervous though now about the test run- not least as 6990 is my favourite “real life” loco”- but I have time off coming up…wish me luck 🍀🤪🍻👍

We're into European H0 but it seems from many British model channels that Hornby always wins for Steamers and Bachmann for Diesels. Hence, this wasn't much of a surprise really. For continental rolling stock we usually do have a choice of many different makes for exactly the same locos; often a choice from 4 or even 5, e.g. ACME, Brawa, Fleischmann, Roco, Trix/Märklin (e.g. Traxx loco). Some do shorten their Multiple Unit Sets and some provide real length scale. Some are into stock from certain countries as a niche or to fill a gap. Some offer a higer grade of detailing, some less but still run after 60 years (Märklin), etc., etc. It's an interesting world we're diving into :)

Excellent video Sam. I've been looking forward to this Hall comparison. Your last review of the Bachmann Hall convinced me to buy the hornby version. I've mildly weathered the new Hall which really lifts it as a model. Another good comparison would be the 08 shunters...or a comparison of bachmanns LMS 4-6-0's from either supplier.

hi Sam great video again... Hornby wins for me as the "playability of the locomotive" is further up my list than "it looks great in a wall unit display... keep up the amazing work Sir... ATB Neil from France

I think that the practical questions that every railway modeller faces when choosing a loco are: what are my options, how much do they cost and what is the difference in quality. Given these questions, evaluating a model has nothing to do with which tools were used to make it, and everything with what you get for the price. Many buyers won't even think about how old the tooling is (I don't). They just see a model in a shop and decide whether it's worth the price. In other words: given the practical situation, it is completely fair to compare a loco made with old tooling with a loco made with new tooling. You can even validate comparing second hand models with new ones, as long as the prices were determined at the same time.

hi sam. an interesting comparison test.. a real dilemma . on one hand you got looks and on the other you have a decent work horse... if you want a model as part of the scenery i would go for bachmann. but if you want a model to do what it is supposed to do and for that sort of money then hornby would be the choice.

Whole explanation sequence done for people who have different perspective on the review, nice. appreciate the effort. I love the concept of vs. review, making each manufacturer's sin or slack pop right up much better. Ah it comes down to price, it always dose the value proposition of more expensive one is just not enough to offset its mediocre performance.

your videos are amazing sam!!

Interesting comparison, I’ve now had a Hornby Hall for four years and it’s been great, even before I shoved a DCC decoder in.

I wish you’d do a head to head between the older Wrenn/HD locos and the modern versions. Starting with the 8F and the 4MT 2-6-4T. I have HD and Bachmann versions of the 4MT. I still prefer the HD version because of its weight and « presence » though on detail Bachmann is clearly better. As far as finish is concerned I think we’re still in the 1980’s idea that Matt or satin finishes look better than gloss. I’d disagree - ex works locos were always highly polished (as they are today in preservation) and in this respect the Bachmann model wins hands down except for that hideous seam line on top of the boiler which for me is totally unacceptable. In this case I’d go for the Hornby model on the basis of its price and superior performance. But I’d probably give it a coat of gloss varnish!!

When you were looking at price comparisons at the beginning of the video and said that the earliest reference you could find was the one of 'Witherslack Hall' and said there were some differences in detailing was correct as this is a 'Modified Hall' designed by Hawksworth, rather than a Collett Designed 'Hall' which the Modified Hall was based on with as the name suggests had a few modifications. I don't know what these were either as mentioned by an earlier poster. Good comparisons though.

I love it when you do this, please compare models more often?

More comparison videos, please! I enjoy them!

So, I missed the design clever era, but it sounds like “we charge you more for us doing less work”. Is that right?

Perfect Hall class model: . Bachmann livery application . Satin finish . Combined details of both H & B . 5 pole scew wound motor and flywheel . All wheel pickups on loco and tender . DCC socket in tender . Dapol mogul style loco to tender coupling . Opening smoke box door . No seem lines . Optional brass nameplates & number plates . Cheap price within €150 with optional free weathering

I would chose the hornby one because I would easily be able to fix some of the loco’s livery and detail application

Nice video! I do have a question, not on these two locomotives, but on another manufacture. Have you ever heard of ACE Trains, and, if so, what do you think of them? I am thinking about getting one of their Black 5s, but I wanted to do some research first. Thanks, and happy railroading!

Just like with your Bachmann Edward vs Hornby Edward review, the roles switch around when it comes to detail and mechanism with the Hornby Hall Class and Bachmann Hall Class. I’d say l like the Hornby one better because of the price and the better mechanism.

Fantastic video. Very interesting to see the difference but I don’t have a hornby hall class. Only bachmann Are you gonna try to do a review on the hornby class 50 diesel ? I’ve noticed you haven’t done one yet

Awesome video! I enjoyed it!

This is a fantastic video. Very informative

One thing I can never fault Bachmann on is their paint. I'm looking up at my Regional Railways and Large Logo 37s with their rakes of Intercity and West Highland coaches and the finish on them is just outstanding, especially when they come with painted axle boxes and springs on the bogies. I think I'm one of the few that prefer Bachmann models left in pristine condition just because they look so good right out of the box. In fact I do have one medium weathered 37 in Large Logo and it loses so much of its appeal to me. That one's been relegated to freight duties. Now all of my Dapol models - Get the airbrush out! Horrid flat matte paint with awful lines and paint spill everywhere. I'd be more than happy to cover them in dirt!

Not sure if this would be possible, but I had a neat idea for a possible project: What if you could combine parts of both models to get the best aspects of both? (Which would probably just be the Bachmann shell/body over the Hornby chassis, but I'd imagine that'd require some modifications). If you wanted to get really advanced you could even remove some of the worse details of the Bachmann body and splice the Hornby ones in place of them, but that might require cutting them off and gluing the others on.

When my Bachmann Hall runs slowly I just crank up the power! I'm not too concerned that another loco might run faster at the same power level. Also, I fitted the DCC decoder in the the tender which avoided removing the weights

hi sam its me again and keep up the good work and u were the one who got me into model train and i just want to say thanks

You should do more comparison videos of specific hornby and bachmann models. Example: Standard 4

I got a Bachmann Modified Hall "Mere Hall". I got it yesterday (2.1.21) at Bewdley (On the Severn Valley Railway) For £70.

I bought the Hornby Railroad version and was delighted with every aspect of it and it pulled 8 coaches with no fuss whatsoever!

Hornby did release this in the Railways range. It was pretty much the same but with a few more detail parts for a much higher price.

Do people really still complain about comparing a 20 year old tooled model to a current new one??? You're argument is really good. A 20 year old model should be reflected in price, or should be upgraded. Thanks for another great video.

Well put together Sam and unbiased as always. I think some of the motors in many Bachmann and Hornby locos these days, are nowhere near as reliable as some of the old Tri Ang and Lima models of "yesteryear". Maybe where they are now made? Only 10 per cent is back in England again. If they make model loco engines in China the same way they make motor vehicles, no wonder models break down or struggle.

I always enjoy your philosophical musings on the subject of Hornby versus Bachmann. It is a fact that Bachmann locos often look better but don't run very well. Hornby know their locos are going on a layout. Bachmann are catering for glass case layouts. Thanks for uploading.

Haven’t even finished the video yet but could not agree more on the price comparison demonstrated by chavvy Sam and his £1k camera. Spot on once again… and in that context, these models should be bother becoming exceptional AND cheaper, not doubling in price…

I've been looking at getting a Hall Class and the precise one I'm looking at is "Witherslack Hall" (a modified hall}, Bachmann produce it but Hornby doesn't Would it be possible or a good idea if I get the Bachmann model and replace its chassis with a Hornby chassis?

Superb video Sam. Yes I think Hornby wins, performance and price. Railroad versions sometimes are still better quality than the Super detail ones. Personal choice is performance. If a model is £150 , it should last a lifetime. The older models are still running provided they are looked after. The super detailed ones are invariably the ones that the rivet counters and ones who display them and never run them want, and fine, that’s what they want. I want locomotives that performance is good and if I want to add extra details, I will add them with the items I think are suitable. (No buffer beams fouling) . Good one Sam.

My favourite GWR 4-6-0 Class, The Hall and Modified Hall Classes, they are incredibly lovely locomotives and I have stood on the footplate of 4953 Pitchford Hall, at the Great Central Railway in 2010, and she was brilliant and they are always my favourite GWR locomotives! Can I request you to do a Hornby VS Bachmann LMS Black 5 or 8F, if you can?

When practical, painting light colours first and then progressively darker should eliminate most or all of the colour bleed through

It might be interesting to do a similar experiment that also includes second-hand locos at different price points: what loco can you get at which price point: Tri-ang loco, old Hornby/Bachmann loco, modern locos with budget DC, detailed DC, DCC, and DCC sound. Probably most easily done with a very common loco, like the A4, or the Scotsman. Alternatively: set a budget of, say, 200 GBP to buy a passenger train of a kind that has general appeal and explore what you can get: just the loco, second-hand loco plus coaches, maybe even a complete train set? Is digital possible? Is sound possible? All relevant questions that buyers face unless they have an unlimited budget. You might be able to do these by looking up prices online, but demonstrate locos from your own collection. You seem to have a very wide range.

Hi Sam, very interesting, bit tight but Hornby get my vote, (what about class 37 ??) All the Best Brian 🤗

So when are you doinga frankentrain and combine the best part of each of these?

Thanks Sam. Do you take into account the availability of spares at any point? Trying to get Bachmann parts is a nightmare.

I prefer the Hornby one mine runs really well I'm finding on my garden layout all of my Hornby locos run well some Bachmann locos need extra weight in the tenders as they are so light and they sometimes stall due to the lack of tender pickups and I am not happy where the tender is loose from the loco especially if you have wires going to the tender I tend to drill and screw the pin so they are joined together surprised to see you had Colletts models from Exmouth where I get nearly all my models he is filled to the rafters and great prices.

Who would have guessed. A Hornby Thomas has a feature that the Hornby Hall doesn’t. *BEARINGS*

Thankyou for this comparison Sam.. For me, there is no contest. Hornby all the way, especially as I followed your 2019 video and secured Adderley Hall for £49.00 from Hattons. Phew! What a bargain. All the best..

Hornby for me Sam especially as i bought it new from Hattons two maybe three years ago for under £60,i still do not own any Bachmann loco's as the prices they charge is amazing! I would rather have a cheaper loco that runs better but may lack a bit of detail over a better looking finish etc that doesn't run as well.Great review though Sam how about doing the same sort of review for a Class 37?

I think Hornby should bring back the railroad range because it was good for beginners and modelers on a budget I just prefer the railroad range over the current range because of the prices

The hornby hall did initially go into the main range with full lining etc but otherwise the same standard of detail (including molded tender handrails) and went down like a lead balloon with people who bought it as it was simultaneously in the railroad range at a far lower price…

Here in the States Athearn was offering a USRA Light Mikado the at the same time Trix was.

hi Sam I have hornbys rood ashton Hall which is a main range hall class not railroad

because of your channel i got 2 train sets both batterie powered

Where is your power as distance will affect the performance further awy from power point ?

I definetly prefer working models over good lookers. Plus, it's so much more fun to add details that you want to add anyway!

I've said it before; our hobby is about running trains, give me a loco that runs well over one that (may) look a little better any time; and as for the price difference........it's a no brainer.

Speaking in reference to the hall class. The Bachmann one for the Harry potter series which i was looking at getting is not even worth it being it has split chassis and according to Bachmann in the US is discontinued. To that surprise I would go for the Hornby one where its not prone to split chassis and has updated it to dcc ready etc. Bachmann that split chassis which I wish Bachmann never did this, but years later the fact Bachmann never changed much in the diesels I have which only one is currently running. Bachmann made a FT A unit diesel and one day my loco stopped moving. To my surprise the driveshaft connector is splitting because its on a metal piece that goes to worm gear. I had to move it back to make it connect to driveshaft . Has Bachmann changed last i looked online no which sucks.

I think I have an idea, get a Hogwarts Castle loco and a second hand Bachmann Hall and transplant the best of both worlds into one loco, you get decent performance with aesthetic detail to match, and because it's Hornby you can use the DCC sound decoder specific to the Hall class

I have to ask. YOu have a building on your layout that has an arm on top that moves back an forth. What is that???

24:04 i saw some wheel slip from the hornby i had to slow it down

If I could take the detail off the Bachmann Hall,(etched name and number plates included), and stick them on the Hornby one, I would.

hi sam interesting video. bachmann seem to be able to make fine diesel locos and not so good steam locos.for me i think the hornby is the one to have or two for the price of the bachmann. cheers tom.

Bachmann’s mottoshould be looks or deceiving. Great vid

Please make more of this type of video.

How is the lining done on mass produced models? I can't imagine its all done manually, surely that would make them prohibitively expensive?

The performance must be due to the difference in the motors and gearing. I wonder if it is possible to fit the Hornby motor into the Bachmann loco?

Hello sam can I suggest you to buy a Famous locomotive Pere Marquette 1225 N1 2-8-4 Berkshire pls

Hornby and Bachmann both announced a Hall class mid to late 90s. Model Rail talked Hornby into making a Grange instead which they did. Later , Hornby bought out a Hall as well.

Hi Sam. Very interesting. Would agree that the Bachmann is the more striking. The sheen is just much more classy than the Hornby pea green, but like yourself good running trumps all. Hornby win it for me. What about more head to heads, except extend it a little to similar era and function? Eg. Pre 1900 shunters. Big four expresses. Diesel 0-6-0 shunters. Or even, I have £200 to spend, what’s the Best Buy? Just some thoughts. Keep it up! I’m beginning to annoy the kids with Sam’s dulcet tones wafting through the house on a Wednesday evening!

I believe there’s a flaw in how you weigh the engines. The weight of the coal car should be excluded or even treated as a negative. The weight of the coal car doesn’t add to the weight over the wheels which are pulling, so it doesnt contribute to the number of cars the engine can pull. In fact, it just adds to the load.

I still vote for the old Tri-ang Lord Westwood

Great video as always Mr Warwell! Of course the real winner is the Tri-ang Hall!

How long does a tooling last for an UK locomotive? Roco decided to replace the Br38 they inherited from Fleischmann this year after some 40 years of service.

I don't know how you can compare locomotives with their age difference.....not really. It's good to see these differences because I like older locomotives and comparing them to newer ones is interesting. I have newer Bachmann peaks, and I do expect them to perform they aren't cheap. I am deciding between class 20s?? Cheers 🍻 Sam another good video 📹. Sooooo £1,000 fir your camera 📷......do you sell many???🤪

My hall is a bachmann split chassis modified hall, like the one shown. The details may be different because its a 6969 class, not a 4900 class. I've had to replace one of the valve sliders, and the body screw isn't engaging, but it runs ok. I will be after a 4900 class hall at some point, and probably would go for the hornby one. I agreee that it was probably a design clever loco that was demoted to railroad (for which they mustve just ditched painting the cab to save money). The bachmann one has a better shade of green (hornby's GWR/BR greens are never right and are getting worse (a2/2...)), but the mechanism isnt as good. Very surprised hornby's lacked proper bearings, but tbh with hornby's record I doubt it would make much difference. A great video. How about one comparing the new bachmann and slw 24s, or the bachmann and heljan and slw 25s? Or the new bachmann and heljan 47s? And comparing the hornby/cavalex/accurascale HAAs when the latter two are released like you did with the PO wagons? (I just got 3 hornby HAAs with canopies, so I can get the same models from the other two manufacturers later) Your analogy is mostly ok, but the camera would have to cost around £4k now to mirror the fact that new models double in price every 10 years.

You should compere the latest mechanism of both hornby and bachmann

I am not trying to derail your test at all here, but what would the comparison look like with the same models dcc fitted? I don't expect you to do this test. The models were sold without dcc chips, they should be fit for purpose as is. This is just a curiosity question.

How about Hornby Railways Grange vs Hornby Railroad Hall 4-6-0?

Hi Sam got train set mainline stream are the loco any good looks like baby flying sscotsman

I also don't get that "It's an older model, so you can't compare it" argument. Some of Atherns old Blue Boxes have the same tooling as the new rolling stock, just updated wheels and road names/paint schemes. Nice video.

A very clear argument Sam...can't believe it confuses people.....have you still got any cameras for sale BTW!!!! 🤣🤣🤣

Hi sam Hope you are well? In the Bachmann cab they was very very lazy with the painting. This is a great video fantastic idea Any chance of A4 vs as you got hornby Bachmann dapol. Or 08 Keep safe arp

Very interesting video today Sam I would have to go for the hornby one because it is a better performer

I wonder if Sam will ever review n gauge

I have both Bachmann and Hornby BR Standard Class 4. There is no doubt that the Hornby mechanism is better.

I think the Hornby barely edges out not counting price, and blows the Bachman out of the water when price is considered. Whenever I see you do something like this, I alsways wonder how hard it would be to modify the Bachman shell to fit the Hornby chassis, although in this particular case, the Bachman shell has issue too, like the parting line.

Interesting comparisons which bear out what we know about Hornby making better mechanisms but not always the best detail. The moulding line along the top of the boiler is inadvertently accurate as the boiler cladding on locos joins at the top and creates that effect, just not that proud. It should certainly not be smooth as it would suggest one piece cladding. Tractive effort is influenced not just by power and weight but also the friction coefficient of the wheel rims which may be made of different materials. Controller setting of 50% is not the most accurate way to judge performance due to different gearing. You need the locos travelling at the same speed heading into the curves to judge their relative performance.

Im wondering how the Manor locos will compare when both respected brands release them however i have an interesting idea for you sam a Hornby Jinty vs a Bachmann Jinty

Hey Sam, I agree with your argument completely, but really, how can you compare a locomotive made in the 1990's with a digital camera made today? ;)

Do you know thers 2 types of hall the normal hall and thers the modified hall is dont know what the difference is

I am sure the Hornby Hall did end up in the main range under the design clever idea as I do have the catalogue. Still the new Hornby Hall class is a great looking model for the money.

Hornby’s the winner for me Sam … plus … I would never spend over a hundred on a loco … just can’t afford it … good idea for this video Sam, Best Wishes, Nige 🙏

the animation with sam with the camerea is quite funny

Heres my thoughts: being an owner of both Hornby Pros Power Price (MSRP) Cons Limited liveries Innacurate models (sometimes) Hard to find for a MSRP Bachmann More variety in Liveries More accurate and detailed models Cons Underpowered Overpriced Personally i like the detail of the Bachmann and I prefer them over the Hornby Halls Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk

What if Hornby and bachmann would work together Bachmann make the tooling and paint the body and Hornby would design the chassis

Triang made the Best Hall ,My 1966 version, Made in Great Britain it still pulls 10 coaches at speed and it still has all its detail it was manufactured with rather than it loose half its detail the first time out of its box .