In Martin Scorsese's gangster movie Goodfellas, Tommy is whacked for taking out Billy Batts. But how did the mafia know that Tommy killed Billy Batts? Who snitched on Tommy?
When Tommy was killed it was clearly Tuddy (Paulie's brother) who was behind him and pulled the trigger. It amazes me how many fans of Goodfellas never picked up on that. Paulie ordered the hit on Tommy plain and simple
Billy Batts people added it all up and made Paulie pull off the hit. Paulie knew what was going on but Henry and Jimmy couldn't be implicated because they didn't argue with Batts. That's how you avoid a war, a little fratricide.
That's a great attention to detail. Also, after the murder, there's the dinner scene when Paulie asks Henry about Batts, and near the end of the conversation, Paulie does a nod, as if he indirectly got the answers from Henry
@@bhillboy37 Exactly 💯 Paulie did not want a war with The Gambino Crew so he had Tommy killed plus He was having an affair with Karen Hill while Henry was in prison and he found out that Tommy tried to rape her
They weren't alone when the altercation started, you're just mistaken about this detail. Batts even had friends present. After what initially happened, and after Batts disappearing, anyone could put 2 and 2 together.
The like button was a made man and the dislike button wasn't... We had to sit there and take it... It was among the executives... It was real RU-vid shit...
The real life Tommy was not small but actually tall. He didn’t suffer from little guy syndrome but more like I’m not a rat syndrome. His brother was killed from being an informant so Tommy constantly needed to prove himself.
It’s crazy to think in real life tommy was so much worse than Tommy from the movie… dude would just kill people because he was bored… and it was Paulie they gave up Tommy because he was having an affair with Karen and Tommy got tired to get with Karen…
I also gotta ask, why was Billy Batts all by himself by the end of the night? He was drunk, really drunk by the time Tommy rolls back in. The more I think about it the more I wonder why his “friends” left him there. Especially after that dust up with Tommy hours earlier. A real friend wouldn’t leave a guy alone, intoxicated, on someone else’s turf like that. Was there a set up on both men? Get rid of Batts then have the solid excuse to finally do something with Tommy? All in one go? I’d love to hear your response to those questions. Keep it up my man. Love your tales in these films.
@@owie4070 tbf, if that happened immediately after, there would be no protection, all three would've been killed immediately after as example. As monstrous and dim as Tommy was, even he could understand that. Hell, a couple more months and no one would have known it was them, but by that time the territory batts were owed would've been given back to him. The whole reason why Jimmy even wanted to do it was because he was the one that had the turf.
No. Paulie didn't inform on Tommy..he didn't have to. It was already obvious that Tommy killed Billy Batts because they got into a heated argument that night publicly in front of Billy's ppl. Tommy was heard screaming, "Keep him here". Tommy is a known psychopathic killer. The last time Billy was seen was at this bar. So It wasn't that hard for Billy's people, the Gambino family to figure out who did it. They just had to get the OK from Paulie, which he gave John Gotti after all his screw ups, including what he tried to do to Karen, to off Tommy, which likely took years to officially get.
What I have wondered all these years. Why was he there by himself by the end of the night? As drunk as he was and his people just left him there? I’d love to hear what our narrator says about that, he does his homework so he’d have a good explanation.
@@jpmnkybecause he was trying to get his shylock business back from Jimmy who took it over while Bats was in jail. That's why Bats said "I want what's coming to me!" right before Tommy came back
I liked your comment but I have just one thing to add: they probably would have wanted confirmation that it was Tommy and not some other guy that maybe they also suspected. For example, in the real mob, Vincent Gigante strongly suspected that John Gotti had killed the mob boss Paul Castellano without an okay from the other families but he couldn't be sure. If he'd been able to confirm his suspicions then Gotti would have been killed immediately.
It wouldn't be too surprising if Tommy gave himself up - while there are some pretty smart and savvy mobsters who know how to maintain a low profile and keep their mouth shut, most seem generally to be lacking smarts and intelligence, feel a need to brag about what they've done and don't know when to keep their mouth shut... can see an example of this from the movie itself when Jimmy tells the crew not go splashing their money around and then during the xmas party scene one guys shows up with a new car and despite Jimmy explaining it to him over and over again he obviously doesn't get it and then the next guy shows up with his wife/girlfriend in a new fur coat. So it really could have just been Tommy couldn't keep his mouth shut and had to go and tell everybody about what a big man he was and how he killed Billy Batts.
Tommy died more because of the Foxy situation. Varios crew had Tommy whacked. Bruno Facciolo escorted Tommy to his death. Vario actually told Gotti "we do our own dirty laundry." Then there's a story that Gotti himself shot Tommy
@@eagleman1542 The way it was shown in Goodfellas Billy Batts and Tommy’s deaths seemed to happen a a few years apart. But in reality it was 9 years, not to say people don’t forget but in that time there would be a lot of other mob murders and stitch ups etc that might take the attention away.
In real life, Tommy DeSimone disappeared eight and a half years after the disappearance of Billy Batts. But it was right in the middle of all the Lifthansa killings. It was a month after Stacks Edwards, eight days after Marty Krugman, and three days before Richard Eaton. Add in the fact that Tommy had lifted his mask during the robbery and was probably going to get arrested and it really looks like he was killed because of Lufthansa, not some murder from nearly a decade earlier. I think Burke used Tommy to kill Stacks and Krugman, then killed him to cover his tracks (and so he didn't have to share his haul). Henry Hill was probably mixed up in it and claimed it was over Batts to protect himself.
How in the heck did the real Karen sleep with Paul Vario. He is a dusgusting looking human being. WTH was she thinking? Had to be for money only. I doubt it was a real affair.
It makes sense that Pileggi knew a lot more about Henry Hill than was public knowledge. Hill was a huge blabbermouth, and often appeared on The Howard Stern show, running his mouth.
And that was public knowledge. That Batts just disapeared, made it obvious to look for who would benefit: Jimmy. And who had a public beef with Batts? Tommy. And who did Tommy work with/for? Jimmy.
I think in the film not showing who gave Tommy up add to the narrative and implies the mob are everywhere. I think it was an opportunity to get rid of a loose wire like Tommy and the fact he did it was coincidental and get the pressure off Paulie and show he ment business
I donno if the Crew this movie was based on, in real life, were this vile in real life but I feel like in no other gangster movie one of the five families was shown to be this terrible, like they were such dirtbags that they almost had no other trait to them, just absolute garbage
Something I've always wondered about mob hits on made men - see if you go to the bosses and request to make a hit and they say no, will you then be killed even if you accept their decision and take it no further?
From what I understand having heard Made Guys talk about it (Michael Francese, Sammy The Bull) No. If the request was made with business in mind, officially that will be the end of it. However, Michael also has said many times never be that guy in a sitdown first to recommend whacking another guy, because people will remember. Eventually someone will request a hit on you and those same bosses will remember how quick you were to shed blood and not be so willing to spare you.
You wouldn't be requesting to have another made man hit unless you had a serious and legitimate issue with the ability to back up your claim... if that was the case and they turned you down there would likely be some kind of reparation worked out.
It was said when Tommy was killed that Billy wasn't the only thing it was the final nail that cleared all doubt, the excuse they needed to off him, a made man's death/disappearance the same night Tommy made a scene and talked back trying to fight over some insults. It was obvious that Tommy did it but the important thing is it didn't matter if he did or not, they knew him being made would result in countless pointless infighting not only on the ranks but among the made men in his area and close to it. He fucked up, they all were worried about him and he gave them a reason to believe their worries were correct at the same time he gave them a situation they couldn't ignore and wasn't easy to point fingers in any other direction.
have been that guy Gino that was with Billy Batts that night in the restaurant he wasn't there the second time so it's possible he might have told somebody in the gambinos Jimmy had a problem with him earlier that night
It's the timing that's suspect,only weekd after he lifted up his ski mask and could jeopardize the whole crew...not to mention they don't have to pay him,the dollars always the fu!@ing dollars...that's when Paulie went to the Gambino people but couldn't just say ok now I'm goof so he asked about how they felt about him being made,knowing what Johnny gotti would say...and they get to save face within the crew, something like" well we wouldn't have given him up to the gambinos but he broke to many rules and it only came up nc.he was gonna get made" Paulie couldn't be straight up about it all so some stories finesse was required
Look up "Foxy Jerothe" and his murder... id say that's the reason Tommy got whacked. Billy Batts wasn't even made. It didn't help, but he was already marked by then anyway.
Nobody.. There’s no mystery with Batts, he was last seen at Henry’s place, insulting Tommy.. Everybody knew who did it, which is why the Gambinos were coming down on Paulie.. And BTW, in case you didn’t pick up on it, Paulie had to kill him, or the Gambinos woulda went to war..
There was also a theory i read years back. Batts was in the shylock business with Burke. Batts had went to prison and came home expecting some $$$$ Burke owed him. Burke stalled a bit. Batts did get into a beef with Tommy DeSimone but as dude said in this video didnt die that night. Tommy did this on his own a while later. Some speculated that Burke put the battery in Tommy's back to do it knowing DeSimone hated Batts. Burke didnt want to give up the $$$ and used DeSimome's anger. Batts soon disappeared and Tommy was always suspected. Because Burke was an BIG earner the Luccesse crew protected Burke but Tommy was at that point still useful and doing work with other crews also. However years later Tommy became a liability to the Luccesse crew and him killing Foxy Jerothe put him in Gotti's crosshairs. Ruggiero was once in jail and allegedly when asked about DeSimone told someone "we dont want him touched, we want him for ourselves". When the Lufthansa heist happened Gotti who was now heading the Bergin Crew gave some assistance to Burke to do what he needed but also extracted from the Luccesse crew Captain Vario that he wanted DeSimone. After Tommy killed Stacks Edwards and someone else they made this ruse that Tommy would be made. Al D'Arco said Tommy was dressed up and seen with Vario and Facciola and then never seen again.. story is that wherever they went Gotti himself with Ruggiero or another Gambino guy Tommy Agro. Supposedly Gotti got to pull the trigger. Gotti had a list of past indiscretions he wanted Tommy for. Gotti waited years for the OK to get DeSimone. Supposedly the Gambino crew wanted Burke also but Vario didn’t go with that. Lets be real. Burke had way more value so it makes sense Vario would balk at that. Tommy was not just shot, he was tortured.
There were two guys there that night with Bats, that i presume were apart of his crew. They saw the animosity, what happened, and what Tommy had said.. "keep him here". Its not exactly a mystery
Billy Batts wasn't a made man, at the time of his killing no one was being made, and the last year that people were made, Billy Batts was too young. Billy was an associate, it didn't warrant the killing of Jimmy & Henry, Tommy was whacked for many other reasons.
I like to think Jimmy ratted on Tommy. It shows the hypocrisy of crime. Jimmy told Henry “Never rat on your friends and always keep your mouth shut.” Then goes on to rat on his friend, but in his mind it’s different because he’s ratting to his family instead of the law. The only thing to disprove this theory is how surprised and sad Jimmy is when he finds out what happens, but maybe he ratted on Tommy and nothing happened. Then they learn they’re going to make Tommy, so he thinks maybe they aren’t going to do it. He knew it was going to happen, but didn’t want to believe. Why did Jimmy rat on Tommy! Just out of loyalty to the family and fear of his life and Henry’s life for protecting him.
Wasn't Jimmy looking forward to working under Tommy? He was almost giddy when they told Henry that Paulie was going to make Tommy. And like you mentioned, his grief was overwhelming when he learned Tommy had been whacked.
Tommy DeSimone was killed around 9 years after Billy Batts was killed. Tommy also killed another Gambino soldier named Ronald Jerothe who was friends with John Gotti. That is why DeSimone was killed.
Hill's book and the film made from it whitewash over many of the factual events in order to portray Hill in the best possible light. So much so that tbey may as well ne works of fiction.
Tommy D was a big dude over 6ft plus he was a coke head Tommy always had something to prove because his brother was a rat and was wacked also by Tommy Agro ,Billy Batts didn't have a button, Neither did Foxy Jerothe whom Tommy murdered both were part of Gotti's and respected now if Batts did have a button there would have been a demand for Jimmy Burke to get it but Jimmy very powerful and huge earner for the Lucchese Jimmy had taken over Bats Shy (Shylocking) business from Roberts lounge when Billy went to Jail,Billy was complaining to anyone who wanted to here it ! Gotti had the ear of Gambino under boss Aniello Dellacroce who was putting pressure on then Lucchese boss Carmine Tramunti in turn put pressure on Paulie Vario , Tommy Agro did the deed Made man in the Gambino family,
