How Do I Start Load Development? - Testing COAL with new Brass 

In this day and age you start your load development with whatever components are available and make the best of it.

I spoke to a Berger technician a year ago about a recommended load data (unpublished by Berger) for the 7 mm 195gr EOL, using in my custom 28 Nosler. We came to this particular point in the discussion of load development. He said that he likes to start with the lowest powder charge and begin by finding COAL. That tells him how much case volume he has to work with to begin best powder charge. The question in my mind (chicken or egg dilemma) is whether the charge affects the COAL (projectile relationship to taking the lands)? I began testing this with a IMR 8133 to compare to my existing load (.010" off lands with H1000). Interesting that .090" and .050" stood out as more accurate with the lowest recommended powder charge (was using Berger's method of .040 'bands' to find a general COAL). I wasn't able to finish the experiment by changing the powder charges. Just thought I would share the reasoning of the technician.

Thank you for sharing your research

Very Very interesting 🤔 ? Waiting for next video on this topic. You channel is me alot with reloading. Keep up the good work. 👊👍🇿🇦

I find the same problem in a lot of new factory rifles, so the assumption of it being caused by the firing pin is real low, but possible in some cases. I do a lot of testing out of a Howa 1500 26" BBL 1:8 twist 6.5CM with RL-26, and H-4350, Lapua large and small RP cases. I use CCI 450 mag primers in the small RP cases and Federal #215 mag LR primer cases and I have found that this problem happens across the whole spectrum. Even in the new rifles that I get to play with from my buddies out on the range. In factory barrels, I have almost concluded that this is the nature of the BEAST. My FIL and I just changed out his Howa 1500 6.5CM barrel with a Preferred Barrel Blanks SS 27" Palma barrel with the Eric Cortina Break tuner. We are in the process of breaking it in and fire forming the cases. In the next two weeks I will be able to report back on my finding. I love your channel and your data driven love for putting numbers behind your findings. From one data junkie to another. Thank you for your hard work and keep the data flowing.👍👍👍👀😎

This is highly relevant to me today, thank you mate. Got a small ring 98 in 6.5x55 that's going to be delivered in the next few hours :D

First on Sunday! But seriously thanks for content brother you’ve helped me tremendously and many others I know. Now about my new lapua 284 to Swiss 7.5 project…

Bean watching your channel for quite a while now great content I’ve found a point that might be of interest or to be past on.I have a forester press notice that on the down stroke that the stop luges one had over .0025” of clearance cleaned off the paint an a little metal to .000” seats bullets more consistent

Haven’t even watched yet and know it will be good.

Interesting. Please explore the lock time delay. I imagine production rifle actions have more issues with lock time delays when compare to fancy custom actions.

This is a deep dive for sure. Like to watch the channel for ideas. Gotta be honest though when I’m working up loads I just go 0.2 grains at a time until I get the best group. Usually it’s somewhere between 0.3-0.6 moa which is good enough for me.

I think you just might be on to something, 1st I would change spring then do exact same test loads, if no delays great, if still delay, try same primer different lot number (I know that's almost impossible right now), next just for giggles try different powder just to see if theres a delay if so go to different lot number on powder. Excellent information, all I ask is for an old guy I had to watch couple 3 times because you were speaking so fast. Stay safe, God bless and happy loading.

I recall an article by or interviewed from Litz regarding reloading for long range. Go up until you see pressure/max, dial back a grain or two so you don't ruin the brass, and find COAL that shoots. Done. Max effective velocity, decent brass longevity. and tight groups. What more could a reloader want? I still can't bring myself to do that. I still do a few spread powder weight groups near where I want to be, then attack OAL. If I don't test at least a 1.5-2 gr spread I feel like I'm missing something.

Really like the pressure trace data it would be cool if you could measure pressures untill you get hard bolt lift to see if it match's saami pressure's

Since you were fire forming brass, maybe an inconsistent case volume effect, neck tension, or flash hole consistency. You used Lapua so unlikely but maybe repeat with the same brass after fire forming before you introduce the change in pin spring. Thanks for sharing. I didn't think of a delayed ignition being a significant cause of variance.

Hopefully Tubbs makes firing pin springs for the RPR one day.

This is the third time that I've seen an issue with that spring mentioned in the last 6 months or so. I think that F class John, and winning in the wind has mentioned the same issue. It sure makes me want to replace mine just in case. I like your style 😎 👌

ive been trying to comprehend this COAL length first approach for a bit now, and i think i must be missing something. i have not tried it yet so maybe thats what im missing. my question is wouldnt you have a perpetual end goal? for example, lets say you start with the COAL length testing, and you test a single power. then you run with a single COAL on multiple powders. then you pick a powder, and test multiple load grain weights. then are you done, or do you go back test COAL length again on the chosen powder? lets say do you retest the COAL length again, does that imply you would need to go back test COAL on every powder to have an accurate powder picking test? kind of creates a conundrum in my head. i'm just hoping someone can breakdown the intended approach when doing this. i was originally taught less bullet jump is better, so i've always loaded with the use of the hornday OAL length gauge to get close to the lands to set my COAL prior to load development. i've seen the erik cortina video and your video on stop chasing the lands but im still scratching my head. i guess what is confusing me is that there are two variables at play that both have an impact on the same thing. COAL and powder charge both have an impact on case volume. how does one choose where to start with a COAL, and the topic being addressed in this video, COAL or powder charge tests first. seems like a chicken and the egg situation, or a problem that each new solution creates a new target. in finance we often call this a moving target.

What kind of lubricant do you use on your firing pin?

Maybe not just look at the firing pin spring maybe look at the entire assembly? Perhaps you could check the firing pin fitment and protrusion in the bolt body? Or perhaps you may have stumbled onto the fact that despite modern manufacturing primers aren’t as consistent as we think they are.

Check Wolf spring.

We used to start with coal but has since moved to nitrocellulose based loads. :p Regarding the delay, the primers are firing so it should not be an issue with the spring. Perhaps a powder kernel gets in the hole and causes this slight random delay.

Hey do a video on the road unloading tool known as grtools

How far forward did the shoulder move when you fire formed the brass? Excess head space could cause erratic ignition.

But doesn't charge weight affect barrel harmonics which would then change the appropriate seating depth?

I'm currently staying at max mag length and therefore max case capacity. Then going up the charge weights to look for pressure. I intend to then back off on charge slightly and then reduce CBTO slowly and see what shoots best. Not the way I've seen others following so I'll see how it works. I'd like to know what reduction in CBTO is equivalent to what increase in load. Both increase pressure, what's the relationship?

It was also interesting to see the SD and ES change as you gor farther from the lands as well. Although, when you are corking the lands it isn't surprising that you got such velocities. Side curiosity, you showed your numbers for measurements for the 142 gr sierra. Were these new measurements taken or original ones when you got the barrel?

Winning in the wind channel talks about bolt maintenance

Can you replicate the ignition delay with annealed once fired brass? I'm more inclined to think this is brass related given how variable even Lapua is.

Are bullets perfect ? I wonder how much variance there is in a box of 100 bullets.... Is COAL as accurate as finding that CBTO and making them all that number? Just in case the bullets vary in any way ? Reloading is the most interesting thing Ive ever done as far as hobbies go. You can measure every tiny aspect of everything. As a beginner , i just muddy the water more with my dumb questions I suppose , hehe... Love this channel

This might be dumb but what about the primer seating depth, could there be a variance in the ones that were off ?...Just thinking out loud..

Question, how are you able to see these ignition delays in quick load? Are you using an actual pressure sensor or is this something that quickload can figure out through theoretical data? I haven't used quick load but I've had a lot of interest in possibly investing in it you see what it has to offer.

Thanks for this one! I have new 6.5 CM Lapua brass small rifle primer and Hornady 140 grain Match that I want to fire form for my new (unfired) rifle. My plan is to load H4350 and Staball 6.5. Since the rifle is new I am going to load all the rounds at 2.80 and not worry about seating depth. My question is should I load all rounds at a charge midway between minimum and maximum for each powder? I plan to use my new chronograph for all loads to see if I can see some potential nodes for further development. Thanks for all you do for the reloading community!

I want to find out if new spring fixes the issue. I’d have no way of finding this problem till it got real bad and the spring would probably be the thing I think of.

How can you start with COAL ? Doesn’t powder weight/pressure difference change the harmony at which the barrel vibrates, ergo when you change the powder load you are back at searching the right harmony with COAL. Nevermind you the speed variations/spikes in speed at different powder loads.

I am a newbie and have no issues how you measure ignition delay. How can you measure that?

Whatever happened to the 6.5 guys? That was a good RU-vid channel.

I feel like this test needs redone for an auto loader preferably with untouchable lands at magazine length.

My friend ! Help me. Look at Matt Dubber . The BEST reloading dies according to him is something "Xece..." .Why don't precition shooters don't use it?

Are the 6.5 guys still shooting?

If you're gonna replace that spring, you might want to think about swapping out that end pice, seen a couple break. I just can't remember what it's called.

How do you measure chamber pressure? Sorry for the moon question.

Newer reloader…I thought we were supposed to FL resize all brass. Even new brass. Why only a neck mandrel? Because Lapua Brass is superior?

Two points: 1. Choose less words. 2. Slow down. Same info but better experience. Thank you

I think Erik Cortina has the right method. This is not.