Man I've been collecting these old engines for ever just for the usefulness of them. Parts are getting hard to come by; being 65 years old this just opened up a whole new world of tinkering. Thank you!
I did what the video showed and had miss-firing and the engine ran very poorly. So, out with the timing light and found that the spark was jumping all over the place. I was a mechanic for 40 years and now retired. So, the next step was to cut off the shorter second firing pin but that didn't help. What to do next. I checked on-line and found EMI = Electro Magnetic Interference. My son is an electrical engineer for Motorola and suggested that I use coaxle cable to help since the coil puts out high voltage and might be affecting the wire from the magnetic sensor to the module. Sure enough after hooking up coaxle cable from the sensor to the module - everything is perfect (you must ground the outer body shielding wires of the cable). The engine runs at high rpm - idles like a dream and checking with the timing light, the spark is dead on an not jumpy. Another youtube video thought that it needed a higher RPM module - that is quite silly because a good old GM module is good for very high RPM and my engine had a jumpy spark even at an idle. Also widening the gap on the magnetic sensor helps. - - Don
Great comments. I found my sensor was bad. It wouldn't open. Replaced it and things worked out. Question..... OH120, looking for a number to replace the Walbro LMR carb. on a other tractor.
I purchased the parts and tried this system with my OH160 on a Miller blue star 2E. Now I have spark but it's having issues where it runs a little hard and missfires. If you have any tips they would be appreciated :)
The last magnet on the flywheel is the trigger. Position a pickup over it as moving it forward or back 3/8" to find good timing. I would say use a timing light before, but no spark, no light. The pickup has to produce 450mV to trigger the GM ignition module has a protect power switch transistor the keeps the coils primary on. Once open by signal, field collapses and sparks. A battery is required. Those with starters have batteries. Under the flywheel is a stator, diodes and magnets to create alternator to charge battery. Diodes are one way gates, Digital multi meter has diode setting or ohms can work. Open one way, thru voltage the other. Delco created a simple module used on Mercury V6 & V8, but used the two input wires to monitor speed. This caused advanced. Normally, timing is retarded to start the engine, fine. But this limits how fast RPM's go. The V6 has a higher advance circuit than V8. Grab one and adjust the carb & throttle. High or main jetting to larger size. A torch wire cleaning kit can help measure before enlarging. Now (Caution) as not only 4-stoke engines with oil in crankcase has a limit on angles like sideways on a hill. Oil moves to one side, the engine get air, not oil. Many are 30 degrees. Same with speed as wrist pin, rod and crank will flex. Springs on valves will not close as fast, this is valve float. No reason to exceed this unless you are racing your rider! Safe repairs & mowing.
@@will7its All I/O's, not outboards. Mercruiser changed their name to Mercury & no clue why. As service manager I have outboard mechanics, and a few on just out everything. One was the only tech in his Dads small dealer, but I considered the best. Will timing lights are not common, but with tach in one hand & timing light in other, at 1k RPM, 2,5k RPM, 3k RPM, the advance was quicker and higher that a V8. These were 97-2000 boats even though the engine could be older or newer. These GM engines have serial numbers for getting the correct parts and theft. Remember the primary side of the ignition coil in on all the time with key on. The power switching transistor (N-type MOSFET) and fires when off as magnetic field collapses, then spark. I am sure load testing on a dynamometer before finding a sweet spot for torque. Working on HEI after 72, but EFI in 76 on two cars (76 Cadillac Seville w/350, Bendix Bank Fire) and (76 Datsun 280Z, 6 cylinders but 7 injectors. #7 was controlled by a "Thermal-Time" switch that screwed into the coolant jacket / acted as choke) This ignition module creates heat and requires a heat transfer paste under it on flat area otherwise it will fail fast. Best of luck.
Very cool, I have an old mini msd box I got off an old tractor. I had to see what was inside of course. I opened it up and there was a gm hei module in there. That was it. Nice video
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience. I am no mechanic by no means but am not afraid to try something. I have a 1966 Colt 2310 garden tractor that has the Tecumseh HH100 engine. I will be using this to try and get it running.
Glad I could help! Please check out this restoration that has got started this year on this tractor. There is going to be some cool stuff I do with this engine as well.
Great video just picked up a sears gt14 with solid state and while it does run I wanna be prepared to keep it running saw lots of form posts that showed the ideas but having a explanation in video form helps alot more
@@arturochavez3134 I used a small piece of angle iron to mount the sensor then if I remember correctly I bolted the HEI module to the side of the tins. I sold the tractor so I cannot see it to verify.
You failed to mention to use the heat sink grease under the module, and be sure to ground the module. Failure to do either of these will result in very short life for the HEI module. But nice set up. I'm currently using GM HEI to power my Dodge
Just a little info for ya. HEI module is great for being compact, but Ford Duraspark II has variable dwell to really help with that advancing the timing. Food for thought. Looks great. I'd probably consider trying to use an HEI coil to boot. Nice powerful spark. Thanks for sharing this.
I purchased the parts and tried this system with my OH160 on a Miller blue star 2E. Now I have spark but it's having issues where it runs a little hard and missfires. If you have any tips they would be appreciated :)
@@bernardomeza7541 Sounds like the timing is a little off. May have to adjust the pickup from one side or the other to bring it in. Also check the gap between the pickup and the trigger. It's usually around .010"
@@bernardomeza7541 I did this on mine but I use the points so same problem this module don't have the advance so probably the second pin it's for the advance
Thank you for sharing this information! You really made my day. I didn’t know what I was going to do to get my old miller welder working again. Now I can fix it with parts I have laying around my shop except for the sensor and pig tail. Thank you thank you thank you
That is awesome i have a 16 hp overhead valve techumseh in a ss 16 suburban Sears tractor and the coil is bad. I'm going to try this !!! Thanks a lot !!!
My local JD dealer would not even take a look at my machine and told me that the coil was obsolete, maybe I could find used parts on the internet. "WRONG" I got the parts as described for about $85 online and used scrap aluminum pieces for mounting plates. It was easy to do and has a very strong spark. Thank you for this information.
I have never seen a Van Norman Rotary Broach that small. I used to use a "normal" sized one for planing cylinder heads, block decks and intake manifolds when I worked at an automotive machine shop. Great machines.
You can see the Van Norman in action in my Farmall tractor video segments. Here is a link ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-cCKqmCseNy8.html
I just went ahead and got the used ignition module. It runs like a new one. I'm sorry I can't be of help with the conversion parts. Good luck with your system.
I thought your presentation was very informational. I have several of these old engines in various tractors. And have wondered what I was going to do and they finally gave up. Also I like your attitude about the customer in the sentiment. I'm a 60 + year old guy myself and still remember my grandfather in the phone this I had for his equipment. So good on you and keep it up
This is probably why many of these aren’t around hardly anymore. When that coil fails it gets scrapped. I was lucky, & got 1 that does run but since I knew abt this already I just put a different motor on it, & at the time I was tired of fixing these old engines. Not charging, dead battery, & the constant fight, vs just putting a predator on it and setting the old engine aside for a project. I’m contemplating on doing this to my OH160 that does run good, the old coil works but I might as well just do the conversion cuz it’s a ticking time bomb when it stops sparking. By the time I fix the engine I’ll have as much into it for wiring and parts vs just using one of my Kohler K-series engines thats better or my M18 thats been waiting for a tractor. Turns over good, feels good & tight. Needs a coil, and a carb to run hopefully not a starter. I’ll probably find something fun for the OH160. Good engines, just wished they used the magneto instead of that.
How did you determine the location of the pickup in relation to the timing. The tall trigger pin I assume is Top dead center but how did you determine when the exact time the pickup would trigger and index it correctly
That is very cool, thanks. NOW the 3 wires for the charging system, all I have is a one over 2 plastic connector from the stator, what do I need to charge the battery? thanks.
You are going to have to get you a Kohler voltage regulator rectifier. You should have 3 wires coming off your plug from the stator. 2 that are AC voltage and one that is magneto kill. To charge the battery, you need to take the AC from the stator and turn it to DC. That is what the regulator will do. I will be doing an update on this video because I am putting this tractor back together as we speak.
The Solid State ignition unit was never meant to go bad. Some of these units are over 40 years old and they still work. That right there alone should tell you something about these units. What burns these units up is the old wiring on the Stator or bad worn out ignition switch.
@@Guns_N_Gears Condenser? Your talking about this video. Yea that coil and that condenser will go out on this set up over time but it is still the cheaper way to go but if you just take care of the old set up and it will not fail. Ever. Neglect is the culprit every time.
I was given a 1970 st 12 hp tecumseh sears suburban with deck. Restoring this milestone dinosaur everything was cheap till I got to the engine Yep cast iron solid state ignition ......87pounds of oh hell yes I'm heavy and I'm gonna be a freaking nightmare.......Well it sits all rebuilt from new crank to piston to head new valves everything redone got all that ugly yellow burnt paint off.now it's a beautiful no paint motor.the only down side is the ignition.ive been messing with this for 3 yrs and your idea is ok just have to upgrade the h.i.e module to an excel because at high rpm mine backfires so this motor sits on a log splitter does a great job because I couldn't get the charging system to work properly.so I took the second pulley in and ran it to an alternator.and then to a voltage regulator then to the battery works like a charm at any rpm .........what happens to the tractor I took the mower deck off sold it fairly added a 40hp briggs o h v V twin and made one bad pulling tractor out of it I'm in the unlimited class and she pulls wonderful.just to let you know.
Thanks for watching! Be sure to like and subscribe. I have started the restoration on this Sears and you will be able to get notifications of this project. Very excited about this one.
Hey Shaw, IMPORTANT QUESTION: Any chance you can tell us guys that have solid state ignition (no dowel pins) that want to convert over, where to drill for the long dowel pin hole in reference for the keyway. I have a 68 HH120 that I want to get functional and freshen up for my sister as it was my parents from when I was little. I was thinking using the calipers lower jaws with one in the keyway (against the side closet to the dowel pin) and the other jaw would be touching the outside of the flywheel and then using a fabric tape measure, measure from the edge of the caliper to the center of the longest dowel pin. I don't think the measurement to the shorter one is important (not sure it's function) but if you wanted that measurement could be recorded too. I have scoured the internet and tore two tractors (friends) down to find out they didn't have any dowel pins either, ugggh. Anyways, GREAT VIDEO!!!! You remind me of a friends dad when I was growing up, he ALWAYS thought outside the box and his favorite question was "Why won't it work?" Dave
Thanks for watching! Drilling flywheels for pins that dont have them is tricky. I dont have a 100% accurate way to do it. I am still playing around with that one.
Shaws Garage Hi guys, I also have a non-pined flywheel! Have you found a precise way to drill the flywheel at the right spot? How many degrees it need to be before or after tdc? Thanks in advance! Any help will be awesome!
Well it almost doesn't matter where the trigger or pickup are on the flywheel circumference. As long as they meet at the specified deg of ignition In relation to TDC. As far as initial timing goes. But for advanced timing if its supposed to have that. The figure out what the total advance timing is supposed to be in deg. Then measure your flywheel diameter and divide by 360 for inches per degree and then stab the advance pin in based on that.
ok soo you can take the old ignition module cut it down mount the pulse signal unit to it . it will have perfect drilled holes for moutning and be adjustable.
Shaw , I installed parts as per your video. Starts and runs again, very happy about that. I was hoping you made video of how you wired an original new switch. Also what part number switch since eliminating solid state. In using my old original switch , won,t shut off engine. Again Thanks for this video.
As I am putting this tractor back together from the restoration. I have video's on this about the progress. I will be doing a follow up on this and the finishing touches to it. Make sure you subscribe to get notifications on this build. As for the shutting off, you just need to run a wire from the keyswitch to shut the 12V power supply off of the coil. You can use either a 5 or 6 blade keyswitch.
I just purchased a tractor in which the previous owner did this modification very poorly. (By poorly I mean the bracket is an angle iron with misaligned holes and washers to create the air gap. I did my best to re-align it and it runs now, but only at high rpm. The engine doesnt not start easy and backfires. Will only run at high RPM where the momentum forces the motor in the right direction i guess? So my question is: How do you set the timing with this setup? Also why do you need the 12v switch? Why can't you just use the 12v run position on the ignition switch? Lastly according to the previous owner, this mod stopped the battery from charging properly and the battery will eventually die and so will the engine. Any help would be appreciated.
Hey shaw. How can a person keep it all AC Current for firing the engine? I mean, Where can a person get a module for AC? For example: You have all three of the parts in a 610748, 610855 and 610906. They are a MAGNETIC PICK UP, A TRANSFORMER (We will Call that a spark plug coil) and a Module. A person Could keep it all AC by using the 610760 Transformer (Coil) . a Finer magnetic Pick up from a electric guitar and wherever to get the AC module. The reason You cannot use the two pole one wire coming from the stator is because the two poles on the stator make AC current. All the rest on that stator generates AC current as well but they are separate from one another because the other ones go to regulator to be switched over to 12v. The Two pole one wire runs up to the module inside the coil pack and the other wire coming off that two pole goes to the M on the ignition switch to kill the Two pole juice so that it does not travel anymore juice up that tiny wire to the module inside of Original Coil pack (610748 Original to that engine You have here in video). Should never throw them kind of units out because the Transformer inside of them could still be good or possibly even the module in it is good and the transformer is bad. Could always take two and make one. I know what You are thinking. lol. There are two You can get apart fairly easy and two that You cannot on the 748, 855 and 906. Two that were made was one with Red Rubber and black rubber. The other two that wont come apart no matter what You do is Cream color epoxy and black epoxy. Sometimes people twist that dang post on the SSI unit as well and dont even notice when they did it which will cause it to break that tiny wire thats soldered on to the post. I have repaired on like that before. Yea. If You happen to know of a module holla. lol. Thanks.
I made the conversion on my Tecumseh HH140, which is the power plant for a Bolens H14. All I get is backfiring at start. The engine won't run. It appears the timing is way off. Any ideas how I might correct this problem? Thanks. Eric
hey i have one of those but it has points and a big magneto...do u think i could do this and make it work using the big magnet on the flywheel instead of the 2 dowels thay are in the video
Nice video. I have some videos doing the same thing on some 1970ish single cylinder Onan NB engines. Does you sensor ignore the short nub on the flywheel ? I think the OEM module used the shirt nub so change the timing on startup....
After doing this conversion on my 1975 16hp Sears tractor, it seems to run just fine, but now it wants to overcharge the battery after setting it at high RPM. Amp Gauge Go's max and ignition switch wants to start on fire 🔥 😂. The tractor has a new voltage regulator. Didn't do this until I changed the ignition. What's up with that? Any help please 🙏.
I have seen many "new" voltage regulators be defective. Especially China made regs. I use the OEM Kohler 3 terminal reg on my HH100 . At 3400 rpm puts out 13.4 volts. This is a good area to be at because at idle to mid throttle, it ranges between 12.9 to 13.2 volts.
Think of those 2 pins as a switch.That has to turn the spark on and off in the relation of the theory of how a 4 cycle internal combustion engine operate.
I was wondering do dome of those Tecumseh,s fit Into a old Narrow Frame Cub Cadet??? - I am thinking of doing a transplant - old Kohler k-181 is worn ~out!!!
any chance you can tell me where the 2 pins on the flyweel are located at? im assuming one is at tdc but where does the other one go? to the right or left of tdc? at what degree. i could really use that input.thanks
I have decided to do a follow up video on this, due to I have been getting so many questions about this. It will be easier if I explain with references in another video. You are correct the 1 pin is TDC and the 2nd pin is spark advance.
iam trying this on a old cub kohler ,will this sensor work with your setup, {1pcs TL-Q5MC2-Z Inductive Proximity Switch Sensor NPN Normal Close DC 10~30V }
I have not tried this on a Kohler. But I would be curious how the engine would respond to this approach. Might be something I will have to experiment with in the future.
Is there a way you can put a kit together or get me a list of PNs? I got a 66-74 JD 112 with the tecumsah from my grandpa who has passed away and I’m going through it. Trying to find video on lash adjustments too, but not having any luck.
The pin should not be magnetized. You need to verify if the sensor is working and isnt defective, you need to hook up a ohm meter and when the pin is under the sensor you should have some resistance.
dumb question but the pins on the flywheel are they magnetic? or just steel studs? want to do similar thing for my Wisconsin 10hp but the flywheel has the steal or magnets behind the flywheel. But it would be easier to adjust like your set up.
Great video! I have a question does the mounting location of the ABS sensor change timing if it’s moved L to R? Did you just guesstimate general location as to where the original SSI trigger pin sat? Thanks
@@bernardomeza7541 I googled RU-vid Hh120 ignition. Forgot the site but he has a yellow tractor. The best I found. And mine works great. I used a 1" angle aluminum. Made it easier to make mounting slots for adjusting sensor gap
I'm looking to convert two HH70's and wondering what the electronic ignition options are. Any ideas by chance other than this or other options with this method to look out for? Man, this will be nice to know to keep on my mind when I'm out at the salvage yard next. Thanks for sharing!
so I got all of mine same way and i get spark but wont run. does it matter where i mounted the sensor? i see it flashing but no start also do i need a second pin? i have a Wisconsin tr10 and i have no pins. i put a small magnet at the spot between the orginal 2 magnets. but on top of the flyweel ,the orginal magnets where inside the flywheel. is that correct or should i be putting my magnet at the orginal timing mark on flywheel? but thats not where the orginal magnets went. sorry im confused and really like to get it running
This video is for the Tecumseh HH100 engine that already has the timing trigger pins from the factory. I personally have not done this on a Wisconsin engine. But where I would start is, determine where the true TDC is on the engine. That can be done with a magnetic base stand and dial indicator that goes on the block. Then I would look into if I could drill a hole in the flywheel to put a pin in, maybe some SBC block pins would work for this, so the sensor knows where TDC is. Then I would put a degree wheel on the crankshaft to determine what degree of advance I would need to install a 2nd pin. Tecumseh engines are easier to do, but it isn't impossible with a Wisconsin. It is just going to be more work and be prepared, for a little trial and error to get it right.
Does it matter what hei ignition system u use like does it back fire at high rpm say above 2000 or is just a generic hei system from the parts store ok
You have to have an open circuit somewhere if you are not getting spark. If you are doing this on a Tecumseh HH100. Possibility the trigger sensor is defective.
Do you have a parts list with part #s for each part? I went to a parts store this morning said he needed part numbers because the ignition mod needs to be more specific Thanks Dean
Sorry I do not have a parts list. If you go to the parts store and tell them you need a Ignition module for a 79 chevy malibu with a 305 or a 267 V8. It is impossible for them to get it wrong, Same as the rear wheel ABS sensor for, that is for a 99 F150 Extended cab.
Jeremiah I haven't tried that on that type of system. I would be curious if it would work myself. It would be a good trial test to see if it does. Give it a shot and if it works show us how you did it.
I bet you were taught that by a old mechanic, like me, I was doing this in the late 80's Crankshaft pickup will also work, I tricked a mechanic, Took a 71 dodge small block distributor put a chevy mainshaft , did a outside mount module , told him to go get me a cap , he was gone for hours, Came back said no one knows what cap to look for, what is it, Blow there mines.You can also use scooter pickup with Module
Hey Shawn thanks for this awesome video. I do have a question for you though I tried to do exactly what you did... on my 14 HP Kohler engine. Unfortunately I have no spark everything is exactly the way you set it up. The only thing I can think of is I only have one trigger high spot on my fly wheel and your Tecumseh had two trigger pins. Any help would be awesome. Thank you
That is really cool I am wondering about timing you have to adjust for that or check it somehow or is it close enough just being in the center of The mounting bolts
Put it straight up. It doesn't matter on position of sensor because.... keep in mind there is no centrifugal mechanical or vacuum advance in this system.Just be sure the flywheel key is good and not starting to sheer. And you have no more than a .010 air gap.
I did this conversion and it has failed I am looking for any help. I used all new parts and the engine will idle and then die in about 30 seconds. Try to throttle up and it backfires through carb and dies. I am at a loss to fix the problem. Thanks
