My favorite detail of this fight is how in Vadar’s first phase, he has relatively short combos and only uses one hand. But after he’s burned, he starts to grip the saber with two, and is relentless in his attacks. Such a cool detail that shows how Vadar goes from nit really trying to using his full power in the fight against Cere.
Yeah and people are saying that cere is almost as powerful as Vader😂. She only almost killed him cuz she caught him off guard with the archives. If he was trying for the first 2 phases he would've beaten her without a ton of struggle
@@LucaBattiato-lm4rn lol what vaders forces ambushed cere's how is he the one getting caught off guard. Cere was in tune with the light and almost took out vader. Dont undersell the feat.
@Anjunabeast I'm saying he got caught off guard because he didn't expect cere to be as powerful as she was. Cere almost taking out vader would make her ROTS anakin level. She's not. So the only thing that would make sense is vader was toying with her, then she dropped the archives on him. Obviously damaging vader. So then he takes her out. There were multiple times in the fight where he could've killed her in the first two phases, and didn't.
@@LucaBattiato-lm4rn He wasn't. Just because he wasn't using his full power it doesn't mean he got caught off guard. You could say the exact same thing about Cere. The game does tell you Cere almost won the fight, but Vader got a slight advantadge at the end with a final move, and the game is "objective" with the data, no matter how things look from Cal's perspective. In fact, he leaves that fight really tired and limping, as a sign that Cere did damaged him at the end of the fight, when he was trying really hard to kill her. This is important, because the game is trying to tell you "hey, player. I want to let you to know that Cere is close to Vader's power level", but then people who admire Vader are like "no, no, no. No way. Vader was just playing with her. Cere didn't even had a change because I don't like her". Being biased could be a problem in the future, when we're going to be trying to figure out exactly how strong Cal is. I don't like Cere either. I don't dislike her, but I don't like her either, but she did have a chance to win that fight, and it is better to accept that and move on. She is dead anyways, so Vader doesn't have to worry about her anymore.
i just love how playing as Cere lets the player mow down the force resistant clones. Truly showing the difference between a Jedi Master and a Knight like Cal
@@Coonazz791 nah not near to Cere you finaly not get the whole Dark/Light side thing again, like the moste star wars fan who have wet fanfictions about the dark side. ^^ :P
@curious panda What do you mean I’m not even downplaying her if she was at the Jedi temple during order 66. It would’ve been prevented with ease it would’ve been in it would’ve actually changed the entire course of history. You’ve been seeing too many of those Darth Vader meat riders I understand.🤣
I don't think people understand. Having battles against Jedi like Cere makes Vader way more interesting than just having him stomp noobs all the time. He wins and strikes down an incredibly powerful hero. That's way more scary than “oh my gerd, he killed all the rebel troops so easy!”
Here is the problem. He fights random people who are Yoda level despite nothing hinting Yoda level brings exist outside the Skywalker family, Dooku, Palpatine and Mace. Literally what's the point of Anakin's chosen one level hype
I saw people complain that they didn’t respect Vader in that fight, however I think those people didn’t understand how powerful Cere is. I think her being around Ashoka Tano is accurate.
Yeah, people seem hellbent on Cal being super powerful, but they completely miss that Cere is still leagues ahead of Cal. This was made very obvious in both Fallen Order and Survivor imo. Cal has the potential to surpass her in the future, but he did not do that in Jedi Survivor.
I really can’t believe people get hung up on this. To me it doesn’t even matter how accurate the power scaling is in the wider canon. I can accept this game might depict the force and power scaling in a way not totally consistent with the universe, but honestly I think they were pretty spot on. I do not find it hard at all to imagine Cere Junda is a Jedi who would’ve been capable of achieving a master rank and she’s spent 5 years accumulating knowledge and wholly devoting herself explicitly to Jedi training. Totally worthy opponent to Vader. Hell she’s probably far more powerful than Luke was during RotJ.
@@LucaBattiato-lm4rn good he needs to be Bc in my canon he becomes the Next Master Vodo-Siosk Baas except much much more powerful than him and Exar Kun Combined
Cere’s final duel with Darth Vader reminded me of Vader’s engagement with An’ya Kuro in Legends. Kuro-also known as the Dark Woman-was a Human Jedi Master whose estimated to be over a century in age. The battle itself took place on a world called Cophrigin V. While Vader ultimately emerged victorious in that fight, the Dark Woman still gave him a serious challenge. She was able to compete with Vader in lightsaber combat, even using a power known as Plant Surge to ensnare his limbs with vines and actually disarming him of his red lightsaber. That is beyond impressive considering the duel occurred close to A New Hope, where Vader was said to be at the height of his power. I like to imagine the creators of Jedi Survivor took some inspiration from the Cophrigin duel when establishing Cere’s final stand.
@@curiouspanda873 Lmao right people act like Vader wasn’t getting his ass handed to him even in his canon comics, I’m a Vader fan and even I acknowledge that.
I love Vader as much as the next guy but if you read some of the comics (or watch videos about them like I did) you quickly realize that young Vader underestimated a LOT of his opponents and got his ass kicked on multiple occasions, nearly died a few times. Unfortunately for his opponents, the more unhealthy he becomes during a fight, the stronger he gets, since he can harness an incredible amount of power from pure rage and hatred towards his enemies.
What’s crazy yo think about is with how close Cere was, if Cal had just listened to Bode, Vader would be dead and they could’ve made a serious move against the empire right then and there and forgotten about Tanalorr entirely
This year Star Wars really had some situations that would have changed the game up completely none of them were on the same year but the impact would’ve been unfixable. Darth Vader almost died to cere, ochi was almost assassinated by the shadow collective, and saw almost took out Tarkin, krenik and hemlock. These arnt replaceable people. You loose them you loose their block prity much If cera stabs just a bit left the only person capable of replacing Vader that is not palps himself is the grand inquisitor, fith brother or seventh sister. They would have gotten themselves killed within a year completely wiping out the heavy hitter aka force user section. There is nobody I know capable of replacing ochi which would be horrible for palps as he’s his main assassin and secrets keeper. Ochi gos and exigal and the more out their places gets much more difficult to get to as can be seen when he does finally kick the bucket. While with saw if the bad batch were not there or just backed off he would have finished installing the bombs taking down the tower. Kreniks replacement is Tarkin, there are replacements for hemlock but none of them are that good. While Tarkins replacement is constitin who ends up proving himself to not even be a fraction as good as Tarkin and gets himself killed as he’s soundly outplayed. Also the Death Star might have ended up being a wash without Tarkin/krenik Just one of these guys going down and the empire is in the shits. The least impactful was ochi but long term wise the new order might never been able to form without his info. Unreplacable
@@kevind3974 I don't think Vader would've died, he barely used his force abilities, i think he just wanted a good fight and not crush her totally and wanted to drag it out. We both know Anakin loves fighting.
@@imbangmaynn5705 yup, he was just playing with his food, which is why he got buried in burning rubble during the mid point of their fight. Vader olive just force choked Cere and then stabbed her, but as you know, the Sith love drawn out fights so that they can break down their opponent comepletely
I hate how instead of thinking she's powerful, 90% of the fan base will go for "Vader got nerfed". We've seen him destory, Kanan, Cal and Reva. Do you want to see that over and over? Because i think its boring and want him to fight against someone who stands a chance
@@alexnobra6883 Technically speaking, the films only really state that Anakin/Vader was one of the best duelists the galaxy had ever seen, not that only Sidious and Luke could beat him in a duel. In both canon, and legends there are many Jedi who put up a good fight against Vader, although the vast majority end up dying, such as Cere in this situation. The ones that don’t die, generally barely escape with their lives. I don’t think we need to see every order 66 survivor put up a good fight against Vader, but the occasional really strong challenge I think is fine.
@@alexnobra6883 the Jedi order was 10,000 Jedi by the time of order 66, if even 1000 survived that is still a monumental success for Palpatine. It’s a big galaxy, of course there’d be Jedi around somewhere. As far as we know, the only Jedi alive during the OT outside of Luke; Yoda, and Obi-Wan is Ahsoka, Ezra, and Naq Med, that’s not exactly a lot of Jedi. Also, regarding the Cere battle, it was not a matter of luck Vader won. He may have been cornered, but that forced Cere to have to lunge at Vader, which, as we saw, was what killed her. Also note that Vader grabbed Cere’s lightsaber arm, there was no way for Cere to win this battle, she was outmatched the moment Vader started to take her seriously. We can see Vader’s change in attitude based on how he battled before being set on fire and after.
@@alexnobra6883 I think you misunderstood the outcome of a duel as the entire duel. Vader will definitely win ultimately, doesn't mean that he has to take two hours of his day getting @$$ whooped and delivers @$$whopping himself till that outcome is achieved. It's a duel.. Like a football game, a debate, or a chess game. The outcome is definitely measured in binary terms but it doesn't mean his opponents won't score... He just scores higher.
I just want to point out one thing people don’t notice when it comes to cere. When you play Cere she has a unique move set the light combo is a stab swing then overhead and the heavy sends you into the air while smashing down if you are in the air along with stronger versions of the force abilities. When Cal uses the dark side slow he replaces his move set with ceres move set exactly. I believe this is a nod to cere using the dark side to fuel her abilities the same way mace does. Usually light side users that tap into the dark are given a purple saber, and her fight with Vader shows how formidable she was. Vaapad which Mace used let’s a Jedi tap into the dark side to fuel their power along with the dark side of their opponent which let him easily dismantle sidious. I just love how you can see she still had darkness but has a outlet for it due to cal having her move set when he’s enraged. Just more context clues given via gameplay.
Nah Samuel Jackson just wanted a purple lightsaber, later they came up with that excuse. Although we can agree that it is likely both Mace Windu and Cere can use Form 7 and direct the dark side against its users.
It’s a common mistake that mace uses the dark side he was never known to use the dark side he uses a force technique to redirect the dark side back at the user but he never uses the dark side
Look. I (like any star wars fan) LOVE Darth Vader. And i think these games did a hell of a job respecting the character and his power level. You definitely feel like you're fighting with a Juggernaut in this game - in fact this was the boss fight that gave me the most trouble aside from Ogdo & his spawn in the force tear! Cere Junda was never my favourite character (didnt love her didn't hate her) but i respect her a hell of a lot more for the fight she put up against Vader. Cant understand why people just dont accept this fight for what it is
Well I will agree that this is a cool fight. I think the problem is that darth Vader is the chosen one, this means that no one is as powerful as him. The only reason he is “less” powerful than the emperor is because of his suit. If cere is as powerful as Vader, she is also more powerful than Luke, mace, yoda and leia. Maybe she could have been lucky and almost defeated Vader, but making it so that Vader was the lucky one he would have died if the lightsaber hit one inch away, I find it hard to belive. The cutscene is badass tho as mentioned
Actually in terms of gameplay, I think the battle against full-powered Dagan and the final battle against Bode Akuna were a bit more difficult. Vader's moves seemed to be more telegraphed than most and thus easier to parry. I finished the game in Jedi Master difficulty, currently running it in Jedi Grand Master difficulty. I'll say this now, Oggdo + Spawn of Oggdo in Jedi Grand Master, without the Purity perk is hell. Elden Ring has nothing on it.
@@jawsdan the suit isn’t the only reason the emperor is stronger bub. It would still take him years to even get close. Basically the way you put it is thus, mustafar, revenge of the Sith Anakin is emperor level, which means Obi-Wan is stronger than the emperor. Palps strength comes from his experience, training, but mostly, his knowledge in the force, Vader has zero knowledge of the force, Vader has raw force ability, which doesn’t mean strength in dueling, his lack of knowledge cripples his force ability. His arrogance is his downfall. Y’all only see Vader as a God and not a character. He has clear weaknesses all which Cere exploited.
I’d like to think Vader really respected her tbh. The fact she locks in with him, faces him without fear and displays unique power is notable. I think Vader was entertaining himself in the first two stages of the duel, but once she sets him on fire it’s over almost immediately.
I think he did really let his guard down when he started getting the upper hand for what must be the umptenth time for him...then she reminded him she's a JEDI MASTER not some stowaway Padawan.
the way he wordlessly just switches off his lightsaber and walks away without saying anything after he defeats Cere seemed to me like a sign of respect. Vader hated the Jedi because he perceived them as weak and cowardly, and Cere proved to him she was not. She was a true warrior, and that I think Vader respected.
@@iamblight707 Yea I felt like he was toying with her the first two stages. The brilliant move by cere was using the archive against Vader. He uses it against her earlier almost as if he's mocking her work. The thought that she would destroy everything she had been protecting for years probably never crossed his mind. Once she did that, all bets were off. He locked in after that, but was definitely caught off guard. To me, Cere was really strong, but she isn't Vader's equal at all.
I would like to see Dooku in all of his Makashi shenanigans, so proud of himself for what his duelling skills are, and then, in a break he looks over his shoulder just to see Cal doing Makashi shenanigans of his own but with a blaster. Now, I'm wondering : what was Dooku's opinion on fighting with a blaster, or anything that's not a lightsaber ?
@@blipbloups1466 I mean I'm not an expert but from what I've heard Dooku's opinion on anyone who didn't adhere to what he considered 'gentlemanly duelling' was an absolute failure in every conceivable way. So, my guess would be he wouldn't love it haha
@@blipbloups1466 Dooku thought it was beneath a swordsman to use 2 weapons and oddly enough he had a fascination as well as fear towards the one he referred to as the great Darth maul.
I think it's pretty clear that Cere is high Jedi council level aka maybe not as powerful as Obi-Wan, Mace windu or Yoda but in the lower end of the tier and could probably keep up with them by the time of her death in survivor. I do think however, that at the very least during the start of her duel with Vader that he was heavily underestimating her and playing with his food so to speak. Up until he had the giant bookcase smashed down on him based on his statement of her being stronger prior and almost sounding surprised at how attuned into the force she is despite already being on the other end of her prowess with the force in the last game which only takes place 5 years earlier.
Cere really grew on me as a character between the last two games, deep down i had a feeling she was gonna die in survivor though, theres no way for cal to progress in his story without doing it on his own, i love the send off too with the fight with vader.
Love this video, great to see Cere get the recognition she deserves. So many people have a hard time accepting Vader had to work a little bit but when you think about who Cere is and how far she’s come it’s not difficult to take in at all
Even people must realise Vader in this time period has alot of weakness, its in the same year, obiwan defeat him. But yea i truly agree Cere is way more powerfull as the Vader Meat riders think. That is what people who think dark side is sooo cool dont understand, a true Jedi who is one with the force is always stronger. And i am one of the people who realy love anything about the sith.
@@Alex-Irie Yeah honestly I definitely believe she could be on par with Obi-wan power wise who was relatively weak but made up for it with dedication and skill. She didn't surpass him, but having her in the same ballpark makes perfect sense to me, she was a Master and had made a ton of progress. Not to mention that its implied that the deaths of so many jedi allowed the ones who remained to become more powerful.
Now that you mention it yeah; the Master who failed their padawan and led to their destruction, overcome by guilt and cutting themself off of the force... lots of similarities, just with way better writing (and, admittedly, a lot more screen time to tell that story properly.)
Ngl, Cere got greedy with that big flashy jumping deathblow. If the deathblow had been a feint to set up an attack from a different angle instead of a dashing stab and she immediately force-reverses her jump mid-air, dashes backward, and transitions into a helicopter lightsaber throw or something, it might have caught Vader as he waited to counter her heroic move. If anything, Vader didn't even counter that by the skin of his teeth. In fact, I'd bet that when she did that, he was immediately reminded of his ill-fated jump on Mustafar vs. Obi-Wan and felt an emotion captured by the quote, "Revenge is served," before countering her deathblow. It reminds me of reading a take that says that Obi-Wan once discussed his victory over Darth Maul with Anakin regarding the jump move he did before cutting him in half, and on Mustafar, he baited Anakin to try it on him. Cere may have been unfamiliar with that little story and didn't know Vader would be extremely prepared to counter a move like that at the very end given his experience in lightsaber combat, especially when it comes to clutch deathblows, which Vader knows A LOT about. Man, if Cere had known that and baited him, it would have been a GENIUS tactic that Vader might have easily fallen for. It would have been hilarious if she used a setup like that to leave Vader's flesh intact but cybernetically limbless & under another giant bookcase, astonished and embarrassed.
I love how some Vader fans say that the only reason Cere got so close to killing him is because he underestimated her. In my opinion it isn't any excuse for Vader. Dark side and underestimating your opponent are connected with one and another. Dark side makes you stronger quickly but also makes you arrogant. Star Wars showed many times that dark side users often lose to objectively weaker Jedi due to this (for example Maul vs Ahsoka). I personally believe that by this time Vader kinda believed in his myth of being so powerful that he doesn't even have to try which made him lose to Obi-wan and almost lose to Cere. Even if Vader technically is better duelist and stronger in the force, the dark side ironically makes him weaker.
Stage 1 was intimidation and getting a feel for her approach to combat. Stage 2 he started throwing objects at her (common Vader tactic) attempting beating her into submission. Which is why he acknowledged her growth she had an answer for everything he threw at her (figuratively and literally).
One thing to note is that for the first three quarters of the fight Vader is making his classic mistake - being cocky. He is playing with Cere, not really trying very hard to defeat her. After she drops an archive on him and messes up his life support, he starts trying, but by this point he's already sustained pretty heavy damage.
He wasn't toying with her. You can tell by the fact that he uses both of his hands even after just 1/4 of his health bar. This is similar to the finale of the Obi-Wan series where he does a few swings single handed then realizes the fact that he is fighting against a fully-fledged Jedi master so he uses both of his hands. He was genuinely trying for most of the fight.
@@Trisitonhe wasn’t trying full on. He was still not going full out. When he was in danger, in classic dark sider fashion, he then decided to go full out, but by then it was almost too late.
Happy you are making more Star Wars videos. Here’s an idea. After the comic series The Broken Blade comes out, you should make a video on Porter Engle as you’ve talked about him being the strongest Jedi. The Broken Blade is seemingly going to show us why he is called the blade of bardotta so that’s why I suggest the wait.
she made it to masterhood, that alone makes her exceptional. she survived order 66 and captivity in an inquisitor base, that makes her one of maybe three to do both those things. she almost destroyed the inquisitor base twice single handed, throws ships from the air into the ground, and imposed her will to force people in onto her blade, and vader himself to his knees, this puts her in league with a handful in history including maul, vader, rey, palpatine, dooku, windu, plo koon, shaak ti, obi wan, yoda, valkorion/vitiate, malgus, satele, bane, revan, nomi sunrider, luke. what stops me putting ahsoka here is she does not have as much stamina and had only held her own against vader when he wasn't trying to kill her yet. what put her in a league of her own was how she managed to use the dark side so destructively, and yet return to arguably be a vessel and avatar for the purity of the light side, only enacted twice. once before by yoda in late 19bby against the most powerful lord of the sith who was using the full might of the dark side at his pinnacle, and in this 8-9bby time period by a resurgent obi wan. to put into perspective, not to our knowledge in the 800 odd years of yoda did he have to struggle coming back from the dark side so much that he cut himself off the force out of shame, but cere who is more than 700 years younger in her early 70s? did. cere having come back from that to be the polar opposite with her force connection and discipline, came closer to destroying one of the most powerful lords of the sith than yoda did in the same position and was prepared to do what needed to be done unlike obi wan kenobi in both his duels. in a way she nearly surpassed both those jedi in her trial against the sith. she was more dangerous than kenobi, she was even a potential danger to sidious.
I think that one thing people seem to be forgetting is that Cere was on the back pedal for a good portion of the fight. Yes Vader is very strong and intimadating, but he is not invincible, a force a nature sure. But he most certainly is not invunerable. The fact that people have a problem with him getting hurt at all in a duel is a bit silly. It's happened a bit before in the comics. And yeah sure it was obvious that Cere was going to die at some point, but if she died 5 seconds into the fight do you know how much of a buzzkill that would have been at that point in the game? Remember people, Vader is still a person inside of that suit, granted a very strong person but that doesn't mean he can just win literally every fight against a Jedi and come out of it completely unscatched. That's honestly just an impractical way of thinking.
Not unscathed maybe but not on the back foot. the point of Cal chasing Bode and not being there to support his friends a storytelling device to show just how screwed they are now that they are separate. You’re telling me Vader loses and dies if Cal stays and fights? Hell if anyone helps Cere fight? Cere was one (stupid) lunge/jump away from killing him so he’s just that weak here? Yes Vader isn’t invincible but he’s supposed to be a symbol of the end, or impending doom. He’s on another level of power and his use should be overwhelming and fearful.
Yes Vader is very powerful symbol of terror. But even if Cal had let Bode get away so that he could help Cere, she would have just told Cal to run away like she did years ago when they encountered Vader for the 1st time. Cal would have only been a hindrance to Cere in that scenario. Either way he would have had to find another way to track down Bode anyhow. In all instances that I've and heard of with Multiple Jedi trying to take on Vader it never really ended well regardless. And yes while Vader is the embodiment of hopelessness and fear for all the remaining Jedi out in the Galaxy. It doesn't mean that every fight is going to be an curb stomped into oblivion. Vader is literally a walking life support machine that limits what he can adapt to in different situations. So although I'm pretty sure he can win in the majority of his duels it doesn't mean that he will have an easy time claiming a victory. Nobody's trying to sell Vaders impact short here.
I have no real comment of substance beyond saying two things: 1. I love the characters and stories these games have introduced into canon and think they’ve been developed incredibly well; and 2. Why couldn’t the folks responsible for the games have been in charge of the sequels?
The amount of Vader cope in this comment section is laughable. If it hurts your ideal image of your daddy so much just ignore this instance of him struggling like you’ve always done 😂
I think people confuse powerful with invincible. The best thing about Vader is that underneath it all, he's still just a person. When Luke takes off his helmet, and you look at the man who's deeply scarred and whose face is freaking bleached .. You realize his life was not pretty, and it's just.. sad. It's okay daddy, it's okay, mommy and the fans are here for ya! 🤣
I didn't like how she just randomly became incredibly powerful in the force at the base after not using the force for like 10 years. Like Cal had to slowly re-learn everything. She just went right back to a powerful master without much character development. She just went "I guess i'll use the force again" and just easily destroyed everything in her path including bringing Vader to his knees
I think Vader just really underestimated her and because of that he got completely caught of guard with that stuff falling on to him doing more damage than he predicted. Wouldn't have changed the outcome anyways but she's definitely up there with the other Jedi masters
@@johnsonjohnny675 He is still young and arrogant. During there fight (with Cere) he blocks her lightsaber then pulls his own away showing he blocked her swing using the force alone. He toyed with her and it nearly got him killed. I'd say that is actually showing why he is very brutal and efficient later on in canon.
@@demonintellect9834 eh we dont know who he is in cannon. We did know. Eu vader is a monster post Disney vader like Kylo seems more bark than bit. Cere hanging with a 10 year in darness vader just seems off. Good for the story and great moment for the game, damaging to the lore overall imo
I was just playing with her, then I got a pretty bad cramp in my leg so It looked like I had a limp when I walked away. I also wanted to have a fight instead of just force choking her.
For everyone trying to claim Vader was nerfed just remember that he was bullying Cere in the first game (Until Cere embraced the dark side and folded him with the force) Vader wasn’t nerfed, Cere only got stronger over the last five years in between games, she let go of her fear and got more powerful, progressing as a force wielder just as other characters do throughout time and experience.
I don't think Vader really considered Cere a huge threat until she takes advantage of the burning rubble and crushes him. Then he acknowledges that Cere is serious and actually has to try because she just heavily damaged him.
So basically, cere with her incredible prowess, harnesses the power of the light as the single paragon of the Jedi order . Yoda hiding, obi wan hiding, the only one who had truly become the next grand master; Cere Junda.
the first time i played Fallen Order, i legit thought Vader killed Cere when he yeet’d her off the edge, as though tossing her into lava. of course was relived to see her less than 5 minutes later, but with how much of an unstoppable monster Vader was presented in that game, i believed it Her death in Survivor was very well done,allowing Vader to be a fightable boss, but ultimately unbeatable
one thing that i hated was taht Cordova died so easily. He could sirvided and then teahc ways to call on how to control his darkside and then died in the next game.
For some reason, I saw ppl trying to compare the fight between Cere and Vader, to the fight between Vader and Starkiller from Force Unleashed even tho it's a completely separate continuity. They were saying the version that fought Starkiller was nerfed 🤨
I picked up on something maybe helping making the case for Jedah being a light side nexus/vergence. If you talk to Sister Taske in Survivor Cal says that Jeddah reminds him of Illum in the way the force feels on the Planet.
The only reason she almost beat vader is because he was not really trying at the start, but when she dropped the archives on him, he started to take it seriously and won by the skin of his teeth. She's a rather average jedi master tbh. Plus you said cal "struggles" against purge troopers. But thats only gameplay. You can see cal one shotting purge troopers in cutscenes.
If cere didnt lose to her emotions i believe she would have fought a serious vader using the force to put her down just like he did to obiwan. you seriously cant jump like that into a enemy that was trained by kenobi in swordfighting as well as sidious in the force.
I got to meet Debra Wilson about 2 months after the release of Survivor, she's a wonderful woman who knows what grace and strength her character has, honestly one of my favorite characters in star wars
I think its a good thing that the fight went as is. As a Vader fanboy myself, you can see the ocerconfidence that we all know vader has in the first 2 phases, showing his arrogance and disdain in cere from their previous meetings, but once she landed that bookcase move, he realized that he messed up, and fixed his attitude and focused up. Personally i loved the fight, and cere did great in her final battle, and this fight helps both characters by showing that vader isnt perfect, and that he still has a bit of anakin ego in him
@@thedreamer5049 The thing is imo Vader's cockiness is a part of him, it's not a limitation on his abilites, it's literally an inseperable part of both Anakin Skywalker and Vader so I see saying "if Vader controlled his ego" to be similar to "If X Jedi was a better fighter..." Well, yeah, but then it wouldn't be the same person, you know?
@@Trisiton not exactly how that works in terms of true psychology. He is clearly arrogant, overconfident. And he does maintain that throughout the fight, but he becomes far less apparent as it progresses. The arrogance is what he starts the fight, completely, until the middle where she drops the bookshelves on him and he catches on fire. He’s no longer carrying himself in this fight with pure arrogance, it became anger and hatred. While he does still have his arrogance in him, it holds less weight. He’s no longer fighting with his ego. He started to fight for his feelings. More so his anger and hatred of Cere. It is an obvious character trait, but to say it’s always present, more so always clearly apparent, is incorrect. You don’t take away a character trait, but you add another one for a specific purpose that takes hold over the first one. In this case, hatred over ego.
@@dianabarnett6886 yes. this is a "younger" Vader, he still has this arrogance which brings in in easylie avoidable situations. A few yrs later towards ANH he lost this weakness.
I feel it’s interesting to note how Cere likely wasn’t at peak strength when fighting Vader too given how she was holding off the Empire before the fight and nearly passed out after dropping part of the Archive on Vader. Maybe she was at full strength given the whole Meditation points, but I’m not sure if that should just be considered a game mechanic or not. Just an interesting thing I thought of after finally getting to and beating the game lol.
I think Cere is one of the most powerful Jedi we have seen. Vader didn’t beat her because he was more powerful he beat her because of a tactical decision she made.
At first I wasn't a fan of cere matching Vader, but with jedha being in my opinion a clear light side nexus it does make sense and it seems i missed just how powerful she clearly is. Good game.
cere put a more than honorable fight against vader, had goosebumps for the whole time. Vader taking hits and always getting up is something i like far more than him being always super clean and no diffing everyone. Its cool when characters are relentless and seem like they always come back no matter how much you damage them.
Considering that the force is such an individalistic and spiritual thing. I hate that people try to power scale with it and quantify it, it just feels like counter to the entire meaning of the force as a concept
I've been building up my skill tree to fight Dagan thinking that was the end boss but i was wrong lol -- I've been able to fight Dagan for the last week but I went and did a lot more rumors and big kills to get more skill points to fill some branches -- Today I'm just outside the chamber before the fight with Dagan - then I'm looking forward to the rest of the game. Looking forward to playing as Cere soon after that though, even though I know the outcome since you cannot kill Vadar in the game lol. I've always really liked the Cere character, I hope they do bring her back for Jedi 3 as a Force Spirit/Ghost to guide Cal. I've not even finished Survivor yet and Jedi 3 is years away but I'm already excited. Have absolutely loved Jedi Fallen Order & Survivor. I got God of War with it being out for the PC finally at the same time as I got Survivor after finishing Fallen Order and I haven't even started God of War yet due to how much commitment I have to play Survivor! Thanks for all your videos, they're great!
I’m assuming this is concurrent with the cannon comics? In legends he gets hurt sometimes by Jedi masters. I Fr hate calling it legends when it used to be cannon.
I definitely think that the cere Vader fight wouldn’t have been nearly as close had Vader taken her seriously from the start of the fight. Not to call cere weak just don’t think she’s quite on Vaders level.
Honestly when she said "ive been waiting" and the arena changed , i tought she had a trap ,like drowning vader or some kind of mechanism to stop him or something. But no...
Not sure if its relevant but if Vader would've never had his limbs amputated and lost a lot of his mobility he almost certainly would've won the fight against Cere
And the fact that she lost her master and displayed such focus with the light side should also be looked at she definitely a master anakin the chosen one couldn't even resist the seduction of the dark side she has more decipline then most jedi the fact that she stop using the force after she got a little taste of the dark side speaks volumes alone im pretty sure call not gone do the same
Because the force defaults light side I’d say anything that isn’t explicitly turned into a darkside nexus should be assumed to be a lightside vergence. It’s probably pretty similar to the new cannon on corrupting kyber
@@KeyIssues Your awesome! thank you for your responses! > I’m also curious on dagan is he a Jedi master? & what does that say about cal scaling after defeating him is he still a knight?
@@KeyIssues wouldn’t say he’s a stronger version of cal. He said he knew all of cal’s moves and I’d assume cal was holding back for their first fight and bode was using the dark side for the other part of their fight.
Star Wars has a really weird power imbalance where people now seem to think that only the originals are capable of having power or at least holding the top of the power scale. It feels really limiting as well as gatekeepy, and it’s not even accurate. There was an *entire Galaxy* of Jedi. How is it so surprising to think that maybe a few were also just really good? Also, it’s not like she makes a wimp of him. He’s still an incredibly difficult fight and literally wins at the end. Who cares?
