How The NBA’s Most Anticipated Duo...Failed

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Penny Hardaway and Jason Kidd were two of the most exciting NBA players to watch back in the day. When Hardaway joined the Phoenix Suns in 1999, they formed "Backcourt 2000", a duo that was supposed to take the world by storm. But what happened?
I make all kinds of NBA videos which include analysis, player stories, countdowns, and mysteries. Make sure to leave a like and subscribe if you enjoyed this video!
► Twitter: @AndyHoopsYT
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E L L A - Chill Hip Hop Beat • E L L A - Chill Hip Ho...
Basic Implosion by Kevin MacLeod
Available under the Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license. Find all of his songs and download them for free here: incompetech.com
► Sources:
Stats and box-scores from Basketball-Reference.com, NBA.com, Statmuse.com

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16 июн 2024

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Комментарии : 319

@davidarrington4144 2 года назад

Suns also nearly had a dynasty at one point with a core of Steve Nash, Joe Johnson, Shawn Marion and Amare Stoudemire, all entering their prime… Damn, still hurts just as bad looking back

@melenzoferrer4786 2 года назад

Coz Sarver was/is a cheapskate

@rapgodreloaded9259 2 года назад

@@melenzoferrer4786 And racist

@jaimerafaelledesma3488 2 года назад

Spurs did them dirty. Love horry but his play took the suns out of the series.

@melenzoferrer4786 2 года назад

@@rapgodreloaded9259 Oh I forgot, oops.

@melenzoferrer4786 2 года назад

@@jaimerafaelledesma3488 He lowkey played chess coz he thinks that the bench might go ape crap and leave the bench (which is a mortal sin as we know)

@temerairetom1657 2 года назад

Penny is just one off the biggest what ifs in nba history

@dazzzzz4254 2 года назад

Imagine if he stayed in orlando Never got Injured Teamed up With T Mac And Grant Hill didnt Get Injured Shit Magic Would of ran The League

@dazzzzz4254 2 года назад

@@LoKKoD1Cal8 i mean Hill McGrady And Penny All healthy would of been enough

@williefaulker 2 года назад

Waives in grant hill and Derrick Rose

@kwekack4035 2 года назад

@@williefaulker I feel like grant hill could’ve been a top 15 all time player if he wasn’t injured

@juniorhernandez3347 2 года назад

But he was already great so his career trajectory is the biggest what if not Penny Hardaway himself.You have to watch the way you write the narrative in this era.

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

Hey Andy, can you please do a “how good was Mike Miller actually?” Video , he’s still one of the most underrated 3 point shooters of all time and he shot a 3 pointer with only one sneaker only

@dubsackbenny6779 2 года назад

I remember watching that game Live. He was a big part of the heat championships they won back then.

@richardnelson7442 2 года назад

I feel like this video exists already. Could be wrong.

@outforthecount7027 2 года назад

He wasn’t that good

@rashaudreece383 2 года назад

abs bring up where he’s from, i went to where he went

@justicestyles 2 года назад

@@outforthecount7027 he was ROY … he was good in a different era … they didn’t prioritize 3 point shooting

@samuellancelgarcia9869 2 года назад

i always love the transition of the suns having 2 dominant guards, once i saw a roster of the suns in wiki with dennis johnson, penny, steve nash, jason kidd, stephon marbury, up until 2000's nash and dragic together, then isaiah thomas, dragic, and bledsoe, then present cp3 and booker. Suns have the array of the best point guards in NBA history

@Bugga-Ray-Dudley 2 года назад

Only the real ones remember the slash brothers

@juniorhernandez3347 2 года назад

Booker is not a “great pg” he’s a SG. This era of suns is balanced like the one with Barkley except Barkley is an actual MVP. This era of suns actually got to the finals (albeit every opponent lost their star player) unlike the suns that think having 3 starting PGs is a great idea.

@johnnytimestamp8224 2 года назад

*Kevin Johnson

@MadSnake123 2 года назад

Let's be fair ... even with a healthy Penny , they weren't going to stop Lakers that season... nor the next one, that's how dominant Shaq was.

@allanhouston3679 2 года назад

Post-injuries Penny Hardaway outplayed Kobe Bryant in the 2000 WCSF. But they had no answer against Shaquille O"Neal. Shaquille O"Neal was a monster.

@zipzipzommin4329 2 года назад

The all star game voting rule was inspired by Hardaway... He was arguably the most popular player in the NBA

@youtuber3328 10 месяцев назад

if i'm right 14 all star selections occured for hakeem olajuwon

@FAlynn92 2 года назад

A long time ago my dad gave me a bunch of basketball cards, and among them was Jason Kidd. I was just a kid at the time myself so I found it funny that his last name was "Kidd" and my dad said that he's actually really good. This was following the 2000-01 season. I started watching any Nets game I could just to see it for myself and it was true. They also got to the finals that year so I got to see him on the biggest stage right away. From that point, he became my all time favorite player, and what I expect the point guard position to be played like. This video was like a blast from the past even though it was about the prior two seasons to when I started watching basketball again.

@SuperNASCARrocks 2 года назад

From injuries to a young Jason Kidd still trying to find his place in the league it just didn’t work out. Penny was one of the most fun players to watch in Orlando. When he got traded to Phoenix to get paired with Kidd they were supposed to be a great duo. But knee injuries and them not getting much chemistry together on the court prevented that.

@allanhouston3679 2 года назад

Penny Hardaway was an incredibly talented player, and if he hadnt suffered a serious injury, he would have been one of the greatest players in Nba history. Post-injuries Penny Hardaway outplayed Kobe Bryant in the 2000 WCSF. 2000 WCSF: *Penny Hardaway=21.4-ppg. FG-48.7%. 3.6-rpg. 5.6-apg.* *Kobe Bryant= 21-ppg FG-45.2% 3.8-rpg. 3.4-apg.* But 33-year-old Clifford Robinson had no chance of stopping Shaquille O"Neal.

@darkangels119 2 года назад

Yeah almost exactly what Andy said

@Desolateinfinity 2 года назад

I remember going to the games when my dad was entertaining clients. The pixelated graphic "backcourt 2000" was thrown on the jumbotron at every opportunity. Danny Ainge's departure came as a shock. In my eyes, it was a steady slide downward that started with the Skiles era.

@kenrickeason 2 года назад

You can tell Andy Hoops love this game.. Dude is very passionate about it.. I love that cause it makes the videos have heart.. 👍🏿🔥🔥🔥❤️

@Iverson1590 2 года назад

I am so happy that you've started using the Basic Implosion track again, it's so hype.

@JahNuhThunDeeTheOneAndOnly 2 года назад

The Suns might be an all-time great franchise for PGs

@cowboytanaka6675 2 года назад

“How good is Andy Hoops actually?”

@NewEarthSon 2 года назад

BackCourt 2000 this is nostalgia. Now both are Coaches now in 2021. my my has time flown

@euroteknique12 2 года назад

Great video. You should do a video of Grant hill/Tracy McGrady and how everyone in the league wanted to sign hill

@jjd2389 2 года назад

DEFINITELY!!!

@edwinthaartist 2 года назад

Great Video as always Andy! Brought up some great memories. Kevin Johnson came out of retirement to replace Kidd after he broke his ankle. Also Kidd Dyed his hair blonde when he came back from injury. They had no chance going up against the Shaq and Kobe. They had no answers for those two. They had no chance going up against teams with a dominate big man. As much as I was a huge Jason Kidd Fan. The team was a few pieces away from being a contender. I think an interesting video would be The NJ teams with Vince Carter, Kidd and Richard Jefferson. Thanks for the flashback! Great time to be an NBA fan. Great NBA Legends in that era!

@allanhouston3679 2 года назад

They had no answer against Shaquille O"Neal. But post-injuries Penny Hardaway outplayed Kobe Bryant in the 2000 WCSF.

@rotemashkenazi6035 2 года назад

I really did not know this was a thing, thank you for this video!

@AggravatedMan365 2 года назад

I don't recall Penny being compared to MJ. He was always compared to Magic Johnson

@twentyseven2948 2 года назад

Most anticipated duo??? I don't know man. Penny was a shell of himself in the final two years with Orlando, and he missed the entire 1998 season. I am a diehard Magic fan since the inaugural season and even we knew Penny will never be the same again. Sure, the Penny + Kidd duo created some headline and excitements. But most anticipated was such an overstatement.

@deanbenford7363 2 года назад

Correct, andy engaged in a rubber-band level stretch with that video title

@allanhouston3679 2 года назад

Post-injuries Penny Hardaway was still very good. 2000 WCFR: *Penny Hardaway=19-ppg. FG-43.5%. 6.5-rpg. 5.8-apg.* 2000 WCSF: *Penny Hardaway=21.4-ppg. FG-48.7%. 3.4-apg. 5.6-apg.* *Kobe Bryant= 21-ppg. FG-45.2% 3.8-rpg. 3.4-apg.*

@danielvasquez3758 2 года назад

Penny really played with a top 10 player of all time only to have him leave and his body fail him just a few years later smh. What could’ve been.

@johnnytimestamp8224 2 года назад

ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-_grPmBaqL1o.html What If Shaq Stayed In Orlando

@gregs3173 2 года назад

I literally cannot believe someone hasn't hired you to make mini documentaries for ESPN. This is the best basketball content on youtube.

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

All right a dope Andy Hoops Wednesday video YESSIR 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟

@centocerez 2 года назад

Man, I remember prime Penny and he was incredibile. Future MVP, top 5 ever calibre talent. But in Phoenix It was already way too late, everyone knew It. Maybe if Shaq didn't leave he wouldn't get injured carrying a whole team by himself and they surely would have been the dominant force of the 2000, not the Shaq Kobe Lakers.

@matthewbartke4424 2 года назад

A lot of what makes someone a great that everyone remembers is their body being able to hold itself together long enough.

@juniorhernandez3347 2 года назад

You mean to be able to extend the longevity of your greatness your body must be able to sustain it through out your career?

@higherheights3105 2 года назад

I actually met Penny around 97' when he was on top. When he joined the Suns I didn't hear from him anymore. #1

@juniorhernandez3347 2 года назад

Wtf is that supposed to mean? How high are you bro?

@higherheights3105 2 года назад

@@juniorhernandez3347 just wtf I said move around with that nonsense

@juniorhernandez3347 2 года назад

@@higherheights3105 so that was your nigga? Damn i didnt know you and Penny was tight.

@kimjongun2946 9 месяцев назад

@@juniorhernandez3347WTF are you talking about man really? Are you done or what?

@juniorhernandez3347 9 месяцев назад

@@kimjongun2946 😭😭😭 Since your kim jong ill eyes can’t see, this meaningless back nd forth was done about a year ago…..

@VenomousStare 2 года назад

Great vid as usual Andy. Wish Penny stayed healthy

@marshae8089 2 года назад

Fast forward Suns got Booker/Cp3 it still worked out well for them. But that season with Amare, Nash, & Shawn is what haunts me.

@Emma-dh1lx 2 года назад

Say 2005 Spurs in the mirror 3 time's.

@charismatic9904 2 года назад

For me the kidd/Hardaway failure is exactly like the Tmac/Hill failure.

@youtuber3328 10 месяцев назад

please tell me why you said that

@user-vh8lk1kc5k 2 года назад

What about Kevin McHale s legendary career?

@TorreEdwards 2 года назад

Nobody compared Penny to Jordan. The comparison was to magic...but with more athleticism. He was a pg through and through

@ernstbtmn 2 года назад

As a Phoenician (grew up in Phx, AZ), I know this story well... It was like watching someone stick a dagger in you. And all you could do, was watch it go in...

@ankledrew8150 2 года назад

Because of this video I got curious and watched a video about Kidd, Johnson, and Nash, which was actually cool as hell. Imagine if the pulled a houston rockets and had all of them starting lol, maybe not winning a lot but a lot of fun to watch for sure.

@demonkingbadger6689 2 года назад

Yeah, kidd and nash i dont see as a combo that would work. Hard to have 2 double figure asts guys work together.

@xavierwashpun951 2 года назад

Cade-Killian and Shai-Giddey duos are truly reminiscent

@rdubb6592 2 года назад

Eh not so much Cade-killian. Killian weighs that duo down so much. Now giddey-Shai that duo is going to be the best backcourt in 5 years if still together

@eduardsimsotto3629 2 года назад

Nice vid as always. I hope you can do a "How good was KG Actually" video Andy

@t99155 2 года назад

T Mac and Penny def up there in Top 5 with the what ifs….D Rose etc..

@GHOST91141 2 года назад

Jason Kidd is my favorite point guard of all time

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

Interesting that Andy hoops has said this about Jason Kidd before , if u saw his Dallas Mavericks video and his other Jason kidd videos in 2018

@RicardoAGuitar 2 года назад

"Two perimeter players who can't shoot from the outside? Yes please!" - Phoenix Suns FO, 1999

@andrewharvey3282 2 года назад

"Was it all out of their control?" This. This is why these are interesting.

@xlexma 2 года назад

Hey Andy can you make a video on how good was Eddie Jones?

@KingKlose82 2 года назад

Thank you 🧡💜

@notmytruthTHEtruth 2 года назад

I've enjoyed all of your videos on the Suns BUT can you please do a video on their success over the last two seasons since the bubble? It will help equal out the pain of reliving our bad years 😆

@davidkoo6236 2 года назад

Allan Houston next please, as a Knicks fan surely he's up there for you ;)

@Emma-dh1lx 2 года назад

Legend has it, The Knicks are STILL paying him that ludacris contract.

@neilbryanbucsit197 2 года назад

Can you do a video about Antawn Jamison and Wally szczerbiak? Two of the most forgotten all stars of the 2000's

@gerdanbombales 2 года назад

The Arenas,Butler,Jamison Wizards as a whole though is interesting

@deanbenford7363 2 года назад

Too much of antawn's #'s came on garbage teams.

@adammaxwell5250 2 года назад

This is a good one Andy!. I don't really remember I gave up NBA for a while after Jordan as I felt like I had already seen the pinnacle of basketball!.. I was right!!!..Lol anyway what about a video on triple J's Dallas Mavericks!???. Years in the basement as the the NBA's laughing stock and finally it all seems to becoming together on their way to becoming one of the top teams in the NBA but then!???...

@mentok3027 2 года назад

Toni Braxton happened

@FAlynn92 2 года назад

Same. When I was little (Bulls fan in chicago) and didn't understand what happened to the 1998 bulls in the offseason, I stopped watching basketball. I eventually started watching the NBA again for Jason Kidd.

@xpotatohamster7051 2 года назад

there will never be a pinnacle tho, itll always evolve

@NotDexFlame 2 года назад

hey andy, you should make a video about the ‘run tmc’ trio in golden state

@jaba1108 2 года назад

The hype was unwarranted penny was already done and injured riddled ...hes my favorite player of all time and jason kidd is one of my favorites also but i knew that it was the media trying to make some excitment and a story line after jordan was lost. Same as mcgrady and hill we knew hill was also already done .... sad all my favorite players went out bad and declined from their peaks so quickly ...

@SayAhh 2 года назад

Everyone always wondered about the Chris Paul to Lakers' "what if," but I've wondered about Jason Kidd to Lakers and playing with Shaq and Kobe.

@ryanjapan 2 года назад

How can you say that quick-paced, guard-dominant offense didn't really get going "until the 2010s" when Steve Nash won his MVPs in '04 and '05 with the Suns' 7 Seconds Or Less offense?

@imdbtruth 2 года назад

I'd like to see a video about the original Kidd trade from Dallas to Phoenix, and what might have been if Dallas hadn't traded him for Michael Finley. Heck, do a video about the history of all three Kidd trades, I mean it's rare for an all time great like Kidd to be traded 3× for the likes Finley, Marbury, and Harris... And every team Kidd got traded to vastly improved, meanwhile his former teams always took a step back.

@lavaismylife3295 2 года назад

The Suns should have kept Jason Kidd and gotten him a therapist to resolve his anger issues. Being a huge Penny fan and seeing him play live a couple of times in the 99-00 season, it is sad to see that they never reached their full potential. If they would have been healthy, they could have beaten the Lakers once during their title run!

@josephjohnroe3735 2 года назад

It is sad that they didn't reach their full potential? That's the "sad" part?

@ponypower8 2 года назад

Penny was my personal favorite in the 90's. Then as I got older, J-Kidd became my favorite player during the 2000's. Up to now, I still believe that Penny could have been an all-time great if he didn't go through all those injuries. I think AN INJURY-FREE Penny was on the same level as prime Kobe, AI, Vince and T-Mac.

@nefariousmex2352 2 года назад

I think he would've been better than Kobe

@skywalker2676 2 года назад

@@nefariousmex2352 how so?🙄🙄

@cmlosaria 2 года назад

3:10 "he had a heavy hand" ooof

@enanebres6481 2 года назад

Nice video

@thebigwarthog 2 года назад

Colangelo should have kept Kidd but he shipped off anyone that had any hint of offcourt drama and he quickly shipped off Kidd and Cliff for their off court transgressions. He also failed to surround Kidd with the right talent so they were almost always first round playoff exits.

@david328ci 2 года назад

Penny was phenomenal, but everyone pretty much knew that he was too injured and done when he left the Magic.

@melvynsngltn27 2 года назад

Once Shaq left he was done

@prlysis 2 года назад

@@melvynsngltn27 He was still balling for a little while after Shaq left, even while hurt

@coreyrowe4119 2 года назад

Penny was still pretty good his first year in Phoenix. He got better as the year went on and especially stepped up his game when Kidd got hurt late in the season. It was all downhill for him tho after he did that microfracture knee surgery in the offseason after 99-00. Any explosion he still had was pretty much gone.

@AirRusher1992 5 месяцев назад

Even without all the circumstance surrounding this backcourt, the Lakers are still a team to beat.

@funkeepunk 2 года назад

andy hoops please do a video on goran dragic

@lostone9700 2 года назад

penny hardaway got hurt...the end.

@lrkcm373 2 года назад

An interesting situation, where one player is too old/experienced and the other isn’t old/experienced enough.

@davedungo1137 2 года назад

immediately remembered Jason Kidd with the bleached hair

@adali1355 2 года назад

Andy, please make an analysis video on why cavaliers this season is actually good.

@Noob_Guy2k 10 месяцев назад

Penny and grant had sm potential man

@edgarmedina1954 2 года назад

"How GOOD was Kirk Hinrich Actually?" - would be interesting to know.

@dwil8621 2 года назад

Nah, by the time Penny went to Phoenix we all knew he was cooked

@corey2232 2 года назад

Didn't the Suns (and also Orlando) have another "future MJ" derailed by injuries with Grant Hill? I remember him being extremely popular, even after leaving Detroit, to the point where he was voted to the All Star Game simply for making it through a season healthy again lol

@lennyzhou4623 2 года назад

Was T-Mac and Grant Hill the most anticipated duo?

@chrisisslick 2 года назад

Definitely would've at least gone to the nba finals if hill was healthy.

@3serio 2 года назад

You know how mad I’d be that the franchise changing player would be the same guy we drafted back in ’96!?

@rapgodreloaded9259 2 года назад

Kidd and Penny would've been title contender if they were healthy.

@hansgabrielt.cabatingan221 2 года назад

Hey Andy, can you please make video about Dirk Nowitzki

@mdp5775 2 года назад

Back when adding the word 2000 meant futuristic.

@theophilusjones6024 2 года назад

Baron Davis or Latrell Sprewell or even Alonzo Mourning video gotta come soon 👀

@jackal8748 2 года назад

Jason Kidd rocked the slim shady hair

@wesleyflocka 2 года назад

Do a “what happened to Norris Cole and Mario Chalmers”

@kingofdetroit358 2 года назад

How good was Allan Houston....he put up great numbers in the 2001-02 n 2002-03 seasons....

@Noob_Guy2k 10 месяцев назад

It’s so interesting to me this was pre nash teams

@Mystery_Man84 2 года назад

It sucks man. I hate injuries.

@homerthompson416 2 года назад

Gotta completely disagree with the premise of this video. Back when Penny signed with Phoenix he was already viewed as damaged goods and the duos people cared about were Shaq & Kobe and Duncan & Robinson. I didn't know anyone who was surprised when he was disappointing in Phoenix after how average he looked in Orlando in the 99 season. Everyone knew that Penny we saw his first 3-4 years in Orlando was never coming back.

@braxtonslife7779 2 года назад

It’s annoying that he used Fastbreak, a magazine by the Phoenix Suns, as proof of them being hyped and named Backcourt 2000. Teams hyping up their own talent isn’t a great source of information.

@FlyingV555 2 года назад

@@braxtonslife7779 of course because those are all about hyping up their own team and will eschew some facts to make their point.

@kimjongun2946 9 месяцев назад

Penny was forgotten by '98. All eyes were on Kobe vs. Jordan in that ASG at MSG. The league completely passed Penny by way before this Backcourt 2000 horse shit.

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

For sure that Phoenix Suns duo in the early 2000s man for sure was a huge “WHAT IF” scenario , but unfortunately, it just couldn’t work out and that’s due to because of Penny Hardaway’s knee issues and the style of play couldn’t work out

@ivanraypclarin 2 года назад

Hi, can you do a role player first five? Thanks

@bigpasty1582 2 года назад

Any team in the west back then seemed so secondary compared to the Lakers and spurs(if healthy). Like maybe someone else could make it to the conf finals but only if spurs and Lakers played in earlier rd or something

@mostdeadlygeist 2 года назад

ironic to trade away 'hot headed' kidd for marbury lol

@williefaulker 2 года назад

It seems like whenever a superstar orlando magic goes to another team to form a duo/ superteam it fails ( 2012 dwight, 2000 penny, 2000 grant Hill)

@jaychulo223 2 года назад

Rule number one leave while your still in your prime 😭😂💯

@corey2232 2 года назад

Except for Shaq. Even when paired with Nick Van Exel instead of Kobe, he was great.

@alwayssmiling4537 2 года назад

Can you do a Grant Hill and Tmac

@bluearrow_001 2 года назад

Hi Andy

@nunyabizznizz7326 2 года назад

injuries 2000.........was hard to watch, but it happens 🔥it down, start over🤷‍♂️

@danielvasquez3758 2 года назад

Does anyone know where Penny the nickname came from? I’ve never heard anyone refer to him by his birth name. I guess that’s one story you could say about him.

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

Daniel Vasquez yes that’s also true and that’s another video Andy hoops can also honestly do as well

@DanTheGreat 2 года назад

His nickname came as a result of his grandmother's calling him "Pretty" with a southern drawl, thus sounding like "Penny" - from wiki

@eazystackz1008 2 года назад

His real name is anfernee my guy

@rapgodreloaded9259 2 года назад

Andy can you make a video on why the Pelicans mismanaged Zion and Lonzo's NBA careers?

@jacobcrsn 2 года назад

Zion mismanaging his own career

@rapgodreloaded9259 2 года назад

@@jacobcrsn you're right about that unfortunately 😔 😕 😪

@XObimmer 2 года назад

Young J. Kidd reminding me of Baby Bash

@jknumber5138 2 года назад

Kidd was the man💯. Penny needed those early 00s year's to enter the hall of fame. Unfortunately, he got hurt. That's why he'll never make it

@aldenencluna6409 2 года назад

Nice.

@brucelau2023 2 года назад

I don’t even think if the Phoenix Suns in the early 2000s prior to Steve Nash arriving would’ve made a huge difference because of the emerging teams such as - Los Angeles lakers - San Antonio Spurs Etc they would always get in their way and I don’t think there would be any much they could if penny didn’t get hurt or Jason Kidd’s off court drama

@JahNuhThunDeeTheOneAndOnly 2 года назад

They would have had no bigs to contain those teams

@PBMdanya 2 года назад

No Bruce

@spaxeghostcasper1050 2 года назад

Dam the starting 5 only played 13 games

@torachan23 2 года назад

Imagine breaking up a potential super team all because you were jealous of how much attention your co-star was getting. Shaq has always been an insecure man baby.

@Ma1q444 2 года назад

Dude it was Kobe, Kobe wanted to win without Shaq

@ajm5154 2 года назад

@@Ma1q444 I think he was talking about how Shaq started to get jealous of Penny

@Ma1q444 2 года назад

@@ajm5154 oh

@deanbenford7363 2 года назад

@@ajm5154 Well shaq became an m.v.p. and multiple time champion while Hardaway went nowhere.

@UrinalUser 2 года назад

@@deanbenford7363 And turned out to be dominant player ever but he gets too damn jealous though

@albaestrada8603 2 месяца назад

Could have been so exciting and elite if penny could have somehow stayed healthy but he likely wouldn't have been traded or a free agent in the first place if he was healthy to begin with. The passing and unselfishness they both had with the switchability. If penny became the defender he could be with kidd on the fast break, they could have been a real problem to play against. Still need a big for the likes of shaq and duncan out west but they could out run those bigs a bit. Timmy vs the suns Nash proved he could play against the fast teams and beat them.