I have chosen a winner! There was lots of good suggestions but @Dan Sacco got in there early with a risqué (for my channel at least) slogan of "The best Trials riders shave their pawls!". I chose this one as it really did give me a genuine laugh :P Dan there's no contact information on your page so could you please fire me a message on any of my social media channels and I'll get your postage information to send these pawls and springs your way :) Thanks to everyone else who commented and joined in the fun!
You're great, guys! Lovely smart mod and very simple to be done. The performance doubes from the two shorten paws and maybe doubles again because of the extra springs. You just inspired me to take angle grinder and the caliper from the garage, well done! Thank you! Wouldn't mind to send me some extra paws and springs if I mess it up (hope not). Cheers!
Even though I won't be doing this mod, I feel vindicated for doubling up my springs to get more life out of my Stans 3.30 hubs. As much as I like the lightweight aluminium construction, they just don't last. So re-using spare parts, namely the springs, from various dead Stans hubs I can get better spring action. Also (if you have more springs like I do), they can be shoved behind the pawls to fill the space that opens up as the hub body wears. I love these in depth modfication videos, you guys are so creative and an amazing workshop at Tarty.
If you want loud there's an easier way with less hub wear. ru-vid.comTEu-m0wtAPI?feature=share please like and subscribe for more bike mechanic tips and tricks
The video kinda gave me a nostalgia trip,I remembered when I was into trials. Ordering online from tartybikes , grinding the rims with an angle grinder, putting tar on your rims. The "TGS" times where Watson, Tunnicliffe and so were big. TRA also. The Beau memorial rides... I might need to get a trials bike again. It would be a shame if the sport dies out... Keep it up!
great work on all fronts :} it may be the case that doubling the springs on just two paws (long+short) would have the same effect of 'snapping' things into place but also keep the drag & wear to a minimum... (theoretically when one claw engages, it's pair should also lock in). imo hubs, just like exhaust pipes, are fun when loud for short periods of time.
I did this a couple of months ago after someones off-hand comment in the pub about it being a possibility. can say its so much better, still on the alloy free hub - defo ordering a steel one now- its fairly easy to do with a vice and a file.
The spring trick works on most hubs not tryd the double engagement trick tho great vid :) thanks for sharing it :) looking forward to seeing some more street trials to :)
Great info guys i have stretched the springs which work well also . To reduce rolling drag i every paper the id of the green seal to make it thinner with a biggger hole rolls way faster i will definately give this a go i,m what i call a hard xc trials rider emagine moto hard enduro on a mtb , and have brocken a few pauls and stripped a pro 4 drive gear and i do run the steel ones hope have been great with warranties , thanks again makes total sense .
I've been waiting for this since you teased it! I think you would just simply call it "Hope Pro 4 Pro" as a tongue-in-cheek name. I would love to buy a Hope Pro 4 Pro Professional Mod Kit.
Maybe not advised, but def still doable modding the alum driver, depending on both the weight of the rider and the load it’s put thru, if your were light or for the average person that rode about easy, it would be ok and it would still last a while modding the alum one, it would sit right where it should be between Alum/steel pros and cons.. I’d be interested to see if the average generic pawls work just as well compared to the factory hope ones. This was a great video and explanation of how it all works 2!
"Here at TartyBikes we bring Hope back 4 Pros" I still think Hope has the best hub sound. Ideally they would make a high engagement boost hub. The fact that this video was so anticipated proves that there's market demand for such a thing. The closest price competitive hubs I've found are Spank's Hex Drives. Call me insane but I'd still take the modified Hope as long as I could find a steel body that matches my prospective cassette.
In my opinion, hope makes some of the best hugs, but if they build hubs, Wich had more clicks, it would be awesome, or at least a easy tuning opportunity like bontrager!
@@mickenoss oh wow that makes me feel old thinking back to the days when ringle first came out, can you remember cooks bro, Paul and real engineering as well, I used to look at those and think how many hours I’d have to work on my huge wage of £2.01p an hour to be able to afford them
Hi Ali, commenting on a year-old video but I wanted to give you credit for this solid modification. ❤ Engaging half the pawls at a time, __symmetrically__, is so much more sound than the way I9 do it, with gradual engagement as the hub and axle flex. Hope axles don't have a reputation for snapping, unlike the ones from North Carolina that depend on flexing an aluminium axle to get those points of engagement.
Running a Profile Elite on my BMX has 204 POE, it's bonkers! Then I started seeing this mod mentioned on a few Trials Riders videos. Definitely interested to see what this is all about! Edit: This is definitely a very clever idea, taking from the newer Hubs design to update the older hubs. Can definitely see why this is a try this at your own risk/not at all haha. Part of me gets a bit nostalgic thinking about bikes BITD when you could modify your bike to pretty much whatever you wanted but of course now bike parts are made from lessons learned & you don't really need to do any heavier modifications to your bike anymore. Now you're dropping hints about a BMX too Ali! I'm absolutely in for this!! Im guessing a street bike with everything you do on the Trials Bike, gunna be interested to see what you come up with!
Not connected to the video just wanted to tell you that you Inspired me to finally order a trials bike, I’ve wanted one for a long time and watching your videos made me realize it was time to order one. I ordered a Inspired Fourplay Pro and am expecting it next week.😃
what are your thoughts on the double toothed pawls inside bmx hubs like a colony wasp or some profile hubs? what is your general opinion on profile hubs?
Cassette hubs will have a much stronger axle, which is supported by 4 bearings. A freewheel hub has two bearings and the drive-side end of the axle extends way out past the DS bearing. This increases the bending moment upon the axle. I havent broken an axle on an SS wheel yet, not that Ive really tried. My White Industry axle is 15mm steel though. Pretty big and strong.
Hey, Algorithm, Bluey and I had a great ride today, fantastic weather and 2234 feet of climbing, but we found a newly-opened cafe with millionaire shortbread to die for!
@@cliveramsbotty6077 hmm, I did not know that was stereotypical American. 😂 I like F1, Rally, the metric system, not going bankrupt due to medical costs, and trials.
As a US aerospace machinist, I dont approve. After he grinds the pawls, by the discoloration I can see he's annealed the steel pawl. That makes the steel softer! Not ideal.
Gotta love the angle grinder technique, especially when there's a mill sitting right there. I suppose the grinder is quick with zero setup but If your are gonna do a few and want them accurate the mill is the way to go.
@@Savagetechie Sure! You just need a good setup to hold such small hardened parts to cut them without caching and breaking the tool (or making a dent on the wise etc). Like you said before, It depends on the quantity.
@@rogeriocosta1035 By the discoloration you can see after grinding, he's annealed the steel making it SOFTER. Not 'ideal'. Im a retired machinist. I'd machine new pawls from tool steel, THEN properly harden them. Thats the proper way. To best control heat on such a tiny piece of metal , you'd best use a temp controlled oven. Not a kitchen oven!! None of this is rocket science. This guy's a hack. At the VERY LEAST, grind and quench in water to avoid annealing. We always keep a bucket of water next to our bench grinders. Precision grinders use flood coolant as well.
Those who remove lube from hub drivers, 😂(just to make them noisier) lack common sense. They'll get noisy alright. Then make no noise at all! Its their own hub to trash. They paid for it. Haha. Its 'job security' for us mechanics and pro wheel builders.
Great video Ali! Is it still strong enough for trials use? A lot of people have problems with their i9 hub with mini pawls as well. Thats why I ask. :)
@@nathananson5445 Adam might have to correct me here but I think the trials freehub body has two pawl pockets machined slightly offset to give the same result as two pawls being physically shorter. This mod isn’t needed if you already have the trials hub, it’s more for people who have the standard pro2/4 and want more EPs (in my case I couldn’t find a Fatbike hub with a decent number of EPs so this mod allowed me to double the number in the Hope fat hub)
So you’re doubling the number of clicks per revolution, but halving the number of pawls engaged at one time from 4 to 2? Kinda tricky, if you dont grind the pawls to the exact same length you could end up with only one engagement point… but sounds cool! 😁
By the discoloration in the pawl after grinding that I can see, hes overheated and cooked the temper out of the steel, making it softer when it needs to be quite hard. Not exactly ideal! Maybe thats why he doesn't recommend this!
I thought that this was a mod you did yourself off camera in your fat bike build video. For some reason I thought that one pair of the teeth would be ground down completely/ taken out so only one remains. Interesting stuff. Also; do the lads ship world wide?
So, if two short pawls and double springs was a product tv advert what would the slogan be? Best one wins the springs and pawls we made/used in this video 😁🤘🏻
Super nice video but..... You can clearly hear that those shorten ones doesn't engage at the same time . There are actually three clicks. Reason for that is because it's done by hand with not enough accuracy. You would need some sort of a jig to shorten those pawns equal. That means two things: 1. Those hubs actually work on one point engagement at time. 2. You could probably shorten three of them to have 4x the engagement form original. What do you guys think?
Since the fulcrum location stays the same, and the pawl is shortened by more than 10%, wouldn’t the tip angle need to be different than the stock length pawls?
Halo's come with more engagement mu friends had one and it wore out im a year where as the hopes ive got have been good for years no problems. Would 100% recommend hope components
no because the trial ss hub is basically a normal pro 4 that has a different freehub body that engages only 2 pawls at a time. so basically its the same as a modified pro 4 shown here (of course with shorter freehub body etc.). correct me if im wrong
Yes, you could get to 176 POE - though the mod would have to be slightly different. Also wouldn't recommend it as having only one pawl engaging at a time loads the axle and bearings in a sideways direction, which they aren't designed for. At least keeping 2 pawls engaged at once, the loads are opposed so there is no side loading.
got an email saying i won, not sure if the email is a mistake, but the email link and notification in YT are messing up the comment section when i click them?
I really don’t think you need to, plus I have a feeling they’ve upped the engagement points by essentially doing something very similar to what we did in this video