A similar one of mine died and it's really hard to tell what is wrong with it I believe one of the MOSFETs is not working. It's a shame it only worked about 1 year maximum.... Not a very good ROI
And if possible, split the load between both phases/legs of power coming into your home. 2 single pole breakers next to each other would be on different phases.
So one of these inverters, each dedicated to their own 15 amp breaker, would be the way to go? And you must have a net meter so you don't get charged for what YOU generate, right?
After considering the cost of the equipment and the time for the return of the investment, it does not seem a great deal. You save energy but you don’t save money.
@@bendy1808 it's different everywhere so you should check with the electric company and wherever you get permits at where you live but most places seem to have some kind of policy in place to allow you to get a second meter from the electric company. This meter counts how much power you generate so it doesn't run backwards. When they read your regular meter they read the other meter as well and subtract what you generated from your usage. This system can also be used on demand to slow down your usage from the electric company. If you actually have everything off in your home then yes you will generate power that you will probably either get credit for or possibly a check for if you make more than you use. I don't think most places use a single meter anymore. I could be wrong though. You do have to take into account the fee for the second meter. Usually this is a maintenance or utility fee. In my case it's $25 per month per meter. So no matter how much electricity I generate I need to subtract roughly $50 in order to actually break even.
@@bendy1808 I sure wish this would be addressed.....very confused about this as I have always been under the impression that grid tied meant that one was selling power back to the electric company
Only Net Meters will count backwards for those that might not know. Most modern digital meters that are not Net/DG meters will NOT run backwards on the kWh measurement. You'll never realize any credit or $ benefit on the meter side with the Net/DG meter installed. This system you installed will supplement your power consumption though. Nice job on the video!
so most all digital meters, that are not made for net metering wont show running back wards, but have to be care ful that we dont have no power going out or the meter will think ther eis a device there and power it as consumption
@@mattrowe1229 If you have a standard meter (that only shows forward/consumed kWh), having solar has some benefit, as it will either slow or hault your kWh reading on the meter provided that your solar is keeping up with your current usage or at least a lot of it at peak times. But to get a true benefit, you need to get with the electric utility to get a meter that shows energy going both directions.
@@Tortuga89R yes, i cant get uyility ok because its an older mobile home, ect, but all i want to do is compensate the peal load a little and conter the kwh down some to lower my bill, i am fighting cancer and on ss check because of chemo cant wor, hard to pay all bills,if i could just save 20 dollars a onth would help with gas to get me to my doctors appat ans such,thanks for the response, and my utility co wants all new, ul listed, blah blah blah, and im going all used, i might just try it and watch meter with just 2 panels so i cant go over my usage
Thanks James, great video! I've always wanted to go solar, but I didn't want to spend $30,000 and I was afraid. I really don't like giving the overpaid power company (monopoly) my money. You clearly explain all the necessary steps to install a high power system at an affordable price, so even an average person could easily do it.
I didn’t know that if you don’t set it up correctly that you will still be charged as if you where using the electric company’s electricity even though the extra power is coming from the solar panels, thanks for the info!
I have the same inverters, they are awesome. No issues, they stay cool. I recommend them for anyone looking to try lower their bill. You cant use them in an off grid setting but for what it is and the price you cant go wrong. Literally plug and play. Great video BTW.
@@TheRainHarvester technically there is a circuit breaker in place (at the breaker box) but since you are reversing the flow of electricity, The circuit breaker cannot accurately tell whether the line is overloaded. This is why you must carefully measure the amps passing through the line that you would be grid tying
@@TheRainHarvestercorrect and sorry, I guess I should have said, "feeding electricity back into the grid" instead of "reversing the flow", but nonetheless, total amperage flowing through the wire must not exceed the rated amperage of the wire, and while back feeding there is potential to exceed the amps without tripping the breaker (which could cause fire)
some people suggesting battery installation. Trust me it is an expensive option. Because you will have to replace batteries when these die. Better go with net metering option.
Interesting, I tried something like this a few years ago and I didn't consume all of the power I was using (like less than 100 watts) and a few days later Joe from the power company showed up at my door with his wire cutters in hand! Check to see if your power meter detects a back feed and what the power company's policy on backfeeding power is.
@@Zomby_Woof That's true, but keep in mind they set the game up to their advantage all the time. If you go through all the "correct" procedures to monitor back flow of electricity, depending on what time of the day it is, you're going to sell your excess at a lower rate then they charge you for their power. They may tack on additional fees to your monthly bill as well for different equipment required to monitor back flow too. In my opinion, you're better off just to make sure the system is only providing power to you.
@@ElationProductions Depends on what your net excess is For someone with large surpluses, particularly if they are seasonal, it's a good way to get power you'd otherwise be billed for at times when you can't provide it.
Great video! couple of questions - I cant find panels that are rated 32V/300W as you mention in your video. maybe things have changed since you made it? I see most are rated 11v to 20V which should still work with the grid inverter. Also - why didn't you use the solar controller and battery bank to run the inverters? thanks again for taking the time to make the video - very helpful!
if you had a tiny 100w inverter and a battery you could activate these grid tie inverters with a reference ac phase/signal during the day when the grid is down
Some interesting ideas but a little too "home brew" without enough code compliance. I believe most areas will NOT allow use of flexible metallic conduit outside. Better to use solid metallic conduit (allowed by code) or non-metallic conduit. All codes that I am aware of require a tag at the meter stating there's a grid-tie or other power supplement. (stand-by gen sets, inverter / battery, etc) Most of this falls under NFPA standards, not typical building codes. They also require a DC disconnect in line between the panels and inverter. (and close by so it's obvious) Many local codes will require these safety items be located close to the power company meter as well. Yes, I know an outlet can qualify as a disconnect point but if it's inside a cabinet you may need to have another on the outside with a tag stating so. Might also help to use a UL approved outdoor R-rated (rain proof) cabinet to protect your goodies. Yeah, all this just raised the cost of your project by at least $500, but it's all about safety and protecting your investment.... and the possibility that your home owner's insurance may not be valid if it's not up to code. BTW, there's code compliance for the info on the tag at the meter. Must state type of equipment, location of equipment, and locations of disconnects. In some areas this tag can be printed and others want it engraved on a placard. (printing fades with time) Must also be glued to the cabinet / meter because extra screw holes violate the UL approval of any listed device. (I once saw a seasoned electrician put a zip screw through a meter cabinet and into a 200 amp SER wire!)
Wow . That's no fun. Some times is easier to ask for forgiveness then permissions. What they don't know won't bother them so much. What if no power is exported ? How would they ever know ?
@@pulesjet … Would you believe insurance companies do periodic random inspections via drive-by and so does your local building inspector? They may not be a scheduled inspection but they notice things when at a neighbor's home or on the way to another job. Could also be when they do evaluations for taxes or census. I got pinched for an extra tax assessment when they noticed I closed in a porch. It didn't require a permit but that did raise my taxes. Many years ago I also took out a permit for a new electrical service and boiler that passed inspection but living in a 100 year old home the inspector noticed when he was in for a water main inspection. (not the same guy) He mentioned it was nice that I had pulled permits over the years. Then there are times when people sell their home (eventually) and someone digs up changes without permits or notices something is not up to code. Banks that loan money on a home will also want an inspection in most cases.
pulsejet... There's no problem till there's a problem, right? You likely wont have an issue unless the owner of the trailer park decides to sell the property and somebody's bank does an inspection to see if everything complies with code. Yes, trailer parks have code in most areas. If nothing else, banks have their own rules when it comes to lending money.... just saying.
Another point. I had a remote shed using off grid system. It got hit by lightning and caught fire. I lost the building and many electronics including my entire solar system. The insurance company refused to pay for the damage even though the fire started from lightning during a thunderstorm. The Fire Inspector hired by the insurance company could not "PROVE" where the fire started even though the Fire Department certified the fire started during a thunderstorm. The Inspector could not rule out a spark from the unapproved system. My policy states all building/plumbing/HVAC work is to be approved by the local building department. I tried to take them to court but my Attorney told me that I would lose. Now, I get a permit for EVERYTHING: changing a receptacle, light switch...EVERYTHING. Sometimes the Building Department tells me no permit is needed. I lost about $25,000 because I did not get a $100 permit. It was not worth it. So please read your policy if you are not going to get a permit. In my state, all the policies are written this way.
Hi James, check those ends on the mc4 connectors internally they eat up after year or so if those are the ones from amazon that are very common.... do a load test on the cables u will be surprised
first those wires should be double crimped and heat shrinked. second those inverters need zero export. third those inverter run better if run at 80+ percent. the higher the use the higher the efficiency. also three panels per inverter would be better for you and you really want to have more panel power than the inverter can handle. so three 400w panels for one 1000w inverter is the norm. any extra watts gen just gets clipped but you will come to full power more early and gem more consistent power thru out the day.
where did you get the auto relay disable relays fom, and what is the box calledheir plugged into,i cant find on amazon, th ones on the right side of the video
@@jamesarevalo1626 www.ebay.com/itm/New-1000W-Solar-Wind-Turbine-on-Grid-Tie-Inverter-with-Power-Limiter-PV-system/362126614006?hash=item54506d9df6:m:mbS-UD_xJqjFFiFW2huyfGA These are readily available on ebay and amazon however not UL certified. I'm not net-metered so not really important for me to be in code.
I’ve heard someone talk about a “limiter” or else the power company could charge you for going backwards. Can I look at my meter devise to see what kind of system I might need ? Mainly just want to use a grid tie in to help lower my cost
Research your utility company's policy first. Many will support net metering for small systems. Though for net metering they may not approve of DIY systems
@@jaycharles9548 Are you planning to disconnect from the grid then? Or just try to fly under the radar? If your solar is connected to the grid, leaving the utility company out of the conversation opens you up to potential problems
@@ThomasBomb45 this is not true. You can install an inverter that has a current sensor on each split phase of the panel. The system will only allow electricity from the solar to match what is being used in the panel. This will not allow power to back feed to the grid and doesn't require a net meter . The utility will just see less usage during solar production where it is offsetting the load in the home. The downside to this is of there is very little load in the home and alot of available solar energy , the system will be throttled down . This scenario would be best with a battery bank to take that energy during these situations.
Excellent video, James. Very useful! I have a question, how do you know you are getting 32 vdc out of the solar panels, and how do you pick the right inverter? My concern is not selecting compatible items and mess around the circuit. Thanks a lot for sharing your knowledge and time!
@@drthik1 - Backfeed is when your power "device" (gen, inverter, whatever) starts to shove power back down the line into the main grid. Then some linesman who thinks he's on a dead circuit ends up going -poof- and you get to explain to his spouse why you needed to play Xbox so bad that it killed him. Ok, that's an extreme, but you get the idea. IF you are savvy enough to have a mains disconnect (transfer switch), then you could fire up a generator and the inverters would then do their normal thing, including following the typical unstable frequency of the gen. They don't care where the power's coming from.
I've got 2 questions. First being the safety aspect. The grid tie inverter turns off if the mains ac power is off right? But if the mains AC is off, a normal individual inverter should detect this but because you have multiple would each inverter act against each other and detect ac so therefore continue to give power? Second question. Are these still working? I hear that particular inverter only lasts about a year and I'm guessing it will take a few years for you to brake even. Nice video though. I'm just researching my options. This helps.
@@TheColorField oh thanks. I'll assume they solved they problem of multiple inverters triggering each other so as to stay on. What I really want to know is how long these inverters have lasted for others.
I have had two of these. One went out on me after just 11 months. The replacement has been going strong for three years now. I'm running 800 watts maximum, but I have never seen it get much past 700 watts during optimum conditions, usually it is much less.
I have 4 of these same types of types of tigrids and verters but nowhere can I find on how much amps can run through these machines we know how much voltage can run but how much amps can you put through these machines I want to know if I can take a 48 voteight 8 vote battery called Reynold rhino from big batteries Which has 276 AH Is that too much amp hours or is this OK I can't find in the destructions or any RU-vid videos to tell the capability on how much amperage can run through these machines
If AC turn on at the night time(no sun - no power to the inverter), will the grid tie inverter broken? Its manual said do not connect AC line in before solar panel or it may broken.
I did 7 of these but 22-50-220V if one dies the other keep working until it is replaced. I do not trust those Blue ones yet. Here is a good ref. www.imeshbean.com/category/Home-Garden/Grid-Tie-Inverter/Power-Inverter/
Great video James. Have you ever see this done using Wind (PMA or PMG) as the power source to the Grid Tie Inverters? My thoughts are you would need to run thru a Charge Controller to Battery Bank to the Grid Tie Inverters. Thoughts on this? Thanks.
That's one of the shortcomings I can see with this system. What he could do is shut off the main breaker to his house, get some sort of additional generator to provide power and the solar would supplement it (in the day time at least). Not useful as a stand alone backup, but could assist a gas generator during a daytime outage.
I have a question we installed solar but it is tied to the grid, in our area we get alot of outages , I'm wondering during an outage when there is daylight can I turn off the main grid breaker to stop feeding the grid and run the house on solar like we normally do, the only time we actually pul from the grid is at night the rest of the day we our feeding . I don't have a budget to install a back up generator and just wondering if there is a way to stop feeding the grid during an outage without a generator or batteries
There should be a disconnect from whatever self generator source(solar, wind, generator) to the grid. You could and do have have a switch(breakers) that will turn off the house power main from the utility provider and turn on your backup power source so that you may run off your(solar, wind, generator) to your home without back feeding to the grid. I fail to remember the name, but they have an integrated toggle so that it is an either or situation. Ask your local supply house people and they can set you up, I 'm sure.. Take photo of your main breaker box to take with you. They will need to know things like the brand of box and if you have room to mount them.
One question though... plugging a cord into an outlet to backfeed seems like a huge no-no to me, isn't there a way to wire it with Romex and some type of breaker?
THIS. Just because it works doesn't mean that backfeeding through outlets is cool. Im' certain that's not up to code (NEC). But, it does pose an interesting scenario for *off grid* use. If these inverters sync to the phase of the grid current sine wave, then theoretically it should work that these individual inverters would all sync together on the same single phase circuit -- each inverter providing up to 1000 watts of power -- such that you could easily scale up the power delivery capacity by 1000 watts for each one of these inverters you plug into the circuit (say an off grid cabin, tiny house, etc). If so, then the question is if any single one of these inverters will output power on it's own (no grid power), or would it require an existing source to sync to (like a master inverter outputting a sine wave to sync to)? Anyone know?
a weird physics thing with heat is that if you dont have forced air heating and are only relying on natural convection, a matt black coated heat sink will stay a lot cooler than a shiny metalic one. metals have basically no emissive cooling, where as a perfect black body has a lot better cooling from radieation. even a dark layer of paint will keep those inverters cooler. wish they came in black yo. not a lot of engineers know this coz they didnt take advanced thermo
Why do you say that you should not run grid tie inverters at full power? In fact, in many cases prople recommend sizing your inverter with a smaller rated wattage than your solar panels, since they rarely perform at max performance and it can save money. In your case it would have been worth considering using only two inverters, would save some money on the electronics
I hate to tell you this but whoever told you that from the utility company either didn't know what they were saying or they lied to you because all grid tided inverters have a safety feature, if the grid goes down they automatically shut off so they don't put a utility worker at risk.
Hello, any problems with the fans on the inverters? I have seen some videos that say these fans burn out in about 1 year and need to be replaced. Thanks
Hi Sir, Just want to double check, at 2:15 it seems that you connected the positive terminals of the panels to the black wire and the negative side to the red wire? Or did you change the connection of the wires from the pv?
Yeah he wired them in series although he said parallel. You take the positive and hook it to negative of other panel. Then run the positive and negative of each panel to the grid tie. It’s a series circuit and not parallel.
@@reddevilxt716 oh I Wondered about parallel: if one shadow on a single panel, it seems like the other panel would dump it's load on the shaded panel and burn it up! Edit: it looks to me like he wired in parallel after all.
I priced out doing this with an 800w set-up and only 1 inverter. It would take between 3-7 years depending on where you live. In michigan I was looking at about 5.5-6 years.
Is this legal , did power co. let you connect to grid without going through the insp. by the city and any paper work and approval . I am taking classes on solar in a local community college and to tie to grid , one has to go through so many steps , city,state and power co..with a lot of paper work including set of plans of solar panels
Since it is run to the outside of building you can. If you have extra breaker slots you can run a new line(s) to outlet(s). Big thing is to have a breaker between the inverters and the electrical panel so the power from the solar can be cut off. Prevents technician from getting electrocuted not realizing there is power coming in from the panels.
@@kris4786 There are only a couple of holes in that theory. Number one. If you don't get the permits, and notify the electric company that you are putting power on to their grid. The technician does not know the switch is there. So how is he going to shut it off? Number two. If you were using UL-listed inverters, and got a building permit, the system would turn itself off automatically if they were working on the power lines in the neighborhood. Sorry. Epic fail.
Let's see, I don't have any agreement with the Grid Company, but my Meter is running in a backward mode, so it should be put a whole needles on counterclockwise! With this, the grid will charge me anyway? Thanks
If the numbers rolls back, it may be working. Your electric bill may not reflect it yet but just send them the numbers if it does not. ( since you seems to be on an old meter )
Hey, man. I loved the video. Thanks for the help with getting me started. I set up an even smaller system than you with only one of those inverters. The inverter stopped working after about 1 month. I was wondering if I just got unlucky or if that brand is actually unreliable. Based on some of the reviews I read, it’s probably the latter. I wanted to check in and see if yours are still working well.
@@ShyRage1, I had to email my electricity company to get approval for “net metering”. They asked for diagrams and I had to fill out some forms regarding how much power I planned on producing. They sent someone out to look at the system after I had it hooked up and the guy who came out was blown away. Lol. I did all of the work and paperwork myself, and I’m not an electrician.
Hi James, It was nice video but I want to know how set up the OnGrid Power system with the BGE meter in Maryland, USA? Should I need extra meter or not? If so, what is the process?
I can see a few potential issues with this system: pv panels are not grounded, there is no disconnect on all panel leads, screws used on the roof are too small and if not attached to structure below (trusses or rafters) will most likely fly away in strong winds. Although it is an interesting project I doubt it is legal in any North American jurisdiction .
