wow that was INCREDIBLE. FINALLY someone doing it the RIGHT WAY! Worked on a 03 Chevy S10 (a little different but the same therory) b/c I couldn't find the right ratio anywhere so decided to work on the original (service manual pretty much backed up EVERYTHING you said). Even found out I had an old post-type torque wrench in My Dad's old toolbox. THANK YOU!! LIKE NEW results!!
It's really a pleasure when someone takes the time to show adjustments as they should be made. Not only it's the best way, but there is also a safety factor which is so very important. Thank you for taking the time to show folks, like me the correct way..
Dude! You are absolutely the only 1 who has posted a video with this as a true adjustment. Everyone else does exactly as you said they do. Thank you and kudos for being THE one of a kind!
Thanks for putting this up. This is one of the best explainations of the two separate adjustments for the box that I've found on the web. And I agree that too many people go to the set screw and lock nut to try to take slop out of the box. Although that adjustment does limit the up and down movement of the pitman shaft and can take out some slop, it's actually for the "over center" adjustment, which adds resistance at the straight ahead position of the steering wheel. This resistance helps to maintain a straight ahead direction, when you take your hands off the wheel. However, the 6 to 10 inch pounds resistance that you mention is in addition to the measured resistance at either side of "on center". In other words, if the resistance of the rotation was charted as a line on a graph, it would peak at 6-10 inch pounds higher at the center of travel, and fall back to normal on either side.
This should be pinned. I adjusted mine so that it takes 14-15 inch lbs. of torque to start turning the shaft from center which drops off to around 9 the rest of the way till lock.
By trade I'm a manufacturing tech, have fixed my own vehicles since I was late teens. 1st time Ive even heard of this adjustment, and it's so clear now that it's almost shameful I didnt notice it on my own 🙃 : 1998 SCSB 2wd Chevy, with 334,000 and counting ✊ Thanks dude 🤙
What this video showed me was that several shops have told me to replace the box, it was shot. Soon as I get a reasonably dry day I'm going to make these adjustments. My truck at 240K miles just requires this. In my own experience in another industry, I'm used to dealing with part replacers, not true technicians. Thank you, thank you!
Did this (still mounted) in my ‘78 Elco and just wanted to say thanks so much for quality information. I will take it out soon and do it properly but this saved the sloop I was having. Liked and subscribed 👍 👍
This seems right on. I had to swap the input shaft on a similarly designed 1970's Toyota manual box once. His description of how to adjust is spot on. I figured it out on my own and did it by feel with no special tools. If you can't torque it the input spanner nut should be just tight enough to eliminated in and out play without making it harder to rotate. You can wrap the shaft in a rag and use vise grips to turn it. Do that with the top adjusting nut backed way out like he said and then adjust that one. Be warned. I'm watching this because I've been through two napa reman boxes. Both feel loose and tight at the same time. Having two adjustments is why. Considering the sorry quality of reman stuff I'm thinking it probably is best to work with what you've got rather than replace it.
This was the absolute most informative steering gear adjustment vid I've ever seen. Thank you! I have zero complaints, and im a critical sob some days lol
Thanks for laying down the facts on these boxes. I knew there was a right way, and wrong way… but been many a eon since I took the class at UTI on steering!
THIS IS GREAT! I have a new reman and I am still getting some slop. Like you said...my 1st run to was that screw but now this all makes sense. Can I just send you mine and you do the adjustments for whatever it costs LOL. Great video
New Subscriber..Thank You for the video. Going to do this on my 74 Nova & 71 K/5 Blazer..your tutorial made sense to ME. 💪🏁💪🏁🏄♀️🏄♀️🏄♀️⛱️⛱️⛱️⛱️⛱️⛱️ Yazmin Venice Beach CA
Do some of these boxes not have the adjustment on the input shaft like yours does? I'm working on a 2014 Express van, and it doesn't have those two spanner holes (or that massive locknut) at the top like the box in this video does. I adjusted that lower allen & locknut like you said not to do, and the steering play & vibration under braking went away like it should. 160k miles. EDIT: The owner didn't like the steering feel even though the play was gone. He asked me to adjust the box back to the way it was. The balljoints in both the pitman arm & idler arm are worn out. That's probably where the steering shimmy (back & forth vibration) is coming from.
Mann! This is great information! I have been wondering why my 84 Camaro still has so much play in the steering wheel, even after changing the entire front suspension! Thank you and kuddos for making a great video!
I have a 92 c1500 I replaced the steering box and all steering components my front passenger tire will not turn all the way right but will turn all the way left how do i fix it
Great vid, @@Joesmusclecargarage, thanks! Q: With the box on the ground, how do you determine if the box is centered? does the input shaft come up against a stop in both extreme directions? (never mind, answered below) Q: Could this be adjusted in-vehicle without draining the fluid? Why is it necessary to be empty of fluid? It seems the fluid wouldn't be thick enough to change the gear's meshing together … Thanks!
@@jbak6892 It’s not absolutely necessary for the box to be empty. I just like to have all of the fluid out of it. You obviously don’t want it full of fluid, but a little bit won’t hurt.
@@Joesmusclecargarage Thanks! If a person were contortionist enough, would it be possible to adjust the input shaft clearance while it's still installed? Doesn't sound like a lot of fun pulling the whole thing out for just that one adjustment… and would the 30# torque value be somewhat the same? Thanks again!
Wandering, excessive play in the steering. At rest, and not running, there should be a specific amount of play in the steering wheel. That amount is vehicle specific.
Outstanding just saw this video very informative I personally think you should be some sort of a shop teacher teaching young folks how to do all this stuff thank you for the information
Is this true for years 1995-2005? Is make, model and year of vehicle good enough to get a rebuild kit, or are there more than one style of box for a given make, model and year? Great video.
As far as kits go, do your own research. This video pertains to a GM/Saginaw style box. If you have a different style box, then I’m sure the procedure is different.
Just one question… are the bearings new or still the originals? As the preload changes a bit if they are new. As far as I know new bearings need a bit of preload vs already broken in bearings only need 0 backlash. This is a very good video thanks for doing it 👊
The bearings are the original bearings. It’s not a rebuild video. I understand bearings “wear in” and tolerances can increase .002-.003”. The bearings are not the cause of the excessive slop in a box. If the bearings are shot, the box needs to be gone through and adjusting it won’t fix it.
This was great but I'm not doing all that for a stock worn box. I will stick to the 1/8 turn method.. The new quick ratio high dollar box I'm going to buy on the other hand i will definitely use this method.
So I have a 2000 gmc top kick, my power steering pump is locking up with turning the wheel and also with brakes on. I replaced power steering & hydro boost. What should I go for next ? The gear box ?
I have an '05 TJ Rocky Mtn and the steering has been an issue for a while now. It has just a 2" lift, 32" KO2's with only 22lb alloy baja rims. Not even 70lbs total with the tire and rim. I have the Currectlync tie rod and drag link, Fox steering stabilizer and M.O.R.E steering box brace. I know these Mercedes gearboxes are not as good as the Saginaws, but would it fail with this modest set up? I had the gearbox tightened between an 1/8 - 1/2 turn about a year ago, but it was the half assed way, not how you illustrated. It helped for almost a year, however it's starting to get a bit sloppy and wonky again. It has never leaked any oil that I know of, I'm the second owner.
Agreed.... it was one of the hardest parts... Heat... get a plumbers torch and apply heat for 10 mins ish... put the pitman arm puller on and crank till firm/snug Tap with 5 pound hammer. Popp... off! Cheers
Hi. Thanks fo the info. Is it possible to make theese adjustments with box in vehicle after removing steering shaft, pitman, and pumping out the fluid?
Great video bud.....100% details! Just curious how a basic home mechanic might get that final adjustment done with basic shop tools? Maybe show how you would adjust for us
@@Joesmusclecargarage I did classic Ford restoration for 8 years right after highschool for a builder. It would be really cool showing how to do those adjustments he talked about. Visual help is always best help!
Where do you get seals at? I am doing a v8 swap on a 92 s10 and now that I have put power steering fluid in the pump I see I have an input shaft leak. I cant be leaking power steering fluid everywhere. Thanks. Great video.
Do you need an alignment after this? My truck now pulls to the right a lot more than it did. The adjustment did fix about 80% of the looseness in the steering wheel at center from left to right.
@chriss4365 I have no idea what you did. Removing slop from a box does not change the location of the pitman arm in relation to the drag link, tie rods, and spindles. Did you remove too much slop and the box is binding?
Joe, have you ever come across a box that leaks from the little pin sticking out of the input shaft? I thought my seals were bad until I saw fluid coming from the bushing area at that little 1/4" pin.
I've always wondered why the gears mesh differently throughout the box's travel. which I learned by taking all the slop out when the wheels were steered to the side, then of course the box bound up when returning to center. readjusted with the box centered and left it at that, but why are they made that way?
Hopefully this helps! I just got my old Saginaw box rebuilt in my bus… Powersteering works in both directions but… turning left, is too easy… and too quick.. like too boosted. Makes it a bit sketchy. Hoping it’s a valve adjustment issue
It sounds like an internal valving issue. You may have an internal pressure bleed. The Chrysler boxes of the 60s-70s had an external pressure relief valve that would cause the exact same symptoms if out of adjustment or sticking. They were so touchy if they were out of whack, the steering wheel would spin so fast to lock, it would break your arm if it was far enough out of adjustment.
I have an automatic, 2 speed power transmission, 350 rocket 68 olds cutlass holiday s convertible... can u plz make a type list of steps explaining the adjustment of the power steering box? We're in our 60s, and have owned the car for 26yrs... it's got some play in steering. Thank you, for your help! Topless in Tennessee
1. Remove from car. 2. Drain fluids 4. Tighten nose of steering box with 30 pppunds of measured force(as tight as yer 60 uear old hands can make it with a simple 8 to 10 inch pin spanner) 5. Retighten the nose locking cap. 6 check the tension on the inputshaft(6 inch pounds) ie:easy to turn. 6a. Tighten or loosen the pittman shaft adjuster. Lock in place. Yer done!
Thanks for the vid. Doing a front end rebuild on a 93 K1500. All front suspension is out and only thing left below steering box is the pitman arm. I wish I would have saw this before I put the new rag joint on.. But oh well. My wheel is pointed straight forward and the pitman arm is pointed straight back. When I put my hand on the arm there is some play (not much, but the arm wobbles) My goal with the rebuild is to get everything firmed up. Can I just try 1/8 turn adjustment on the pitman arm screw or am I going to have to pull all this stuff apart?
A little bit of play is normal/acceptable per the FSM. I wouldn’t go any more than 1/8 of a turn though. Any more than that, and I would recommend adjusting the box properly.
@AZHighlandHomestead I don’t have any. They would have been posted if I did. None of my cars have a box that needs to be resealed or rebuilt right now. Replacing the seals is easy.
I have a Saginaw 605 gear box and have trouble with the jamb nut - it looks different than the one in the video. My gear box has the ring retained cover on it. Any ideas?
FYI: You stated to adjust the pre-load worm gear shaft to tighten the cap to 30 ft. lbs., I believe if you double check the torque for the cap it is 20 ft. lbs.
You put a mark on "this" and then put another mark on "this" a 1/2 inch back and then tighten "this" so it lines up? Which "this" is "this" and which "this" is that? Thanks.
If you don’t understand and can’t figure it out, leave the box alone. This video was intended for those that have the ability to follow simple verbal instructions.
Yestarday i rebuilt my power steering box from my 2000 Jeep TJ and installed it, but I think i tight the worm gear nutt too much (maybe 1 more turn), because my steering wheel is too sloppy now (1 quarter). This inner nutt with flat flange lock nutt were stuck together, i tried to separate them but I couldnt, but they were aligned together so i left it as it was. Can i turn it counterclockwise (1 turn) while it is installed or its nessecary to uninstall the whole setup and try to separate them?
Thanks for the video..very useful..slightly daunting...only issue I have now is how to torque the cap down to 30ft/lbs without a proper torque wrench.. surely if you just doing it by feel then you are defeating the whole purpose since the tolerances are so sensitive..is there a torque wrench adaptor to do this with?
The adjustment procedure would be the same, however the adjustments themselves are more than likely different. Verify with an FSM that applies to your truck.
So is it only necessary to adjust the flange nut if the input shaft has in and out movement? Also, if the top set screw is only for the pitman preload, how does it affect the play in the input shaft?
My 84 El Camino has stiff spots when cold starting. As soon as I force it back and forth, it's fine until I shut the engine off for a while. I replaced the whining steering pump and did a thorough bleeding so there's no noise and it's still a problem. Ideas?
Joe, I bought a NAPA reman for my 97 Jeep TJ before replacing all the tie rod ends. After the alignment it drove like on rails. It is now is as sloppy as before any work was done on the steering. Would adjusting the pitman endplay a little be okay or should I just pull it off and do both input and pitman? Thanks, Dave
@@Joesmusclecargarage Thanks for the reply. I was somewhat hoping that the PS box was just loose on the frame (not the case). All the T-rod ends and B-joints were replaced
Well done Joe. I’ve messed around with GM gearboxes for years and never knew about that adjustment. I added PS to my 68 SS Camaro and used a reman IROC Camaro box since they have nice road feel. The car seems to wander a bit, now I suspect the reman guys don’t do this correctly. I’ll pull out the gbox and give it a try. Fortunately I have dial torque wrenches that will make it a snap. Thank you.
I clearly state in the video it’s out of an 83 Trans Am. I don’t believe in replacing factory parts when they can be repaired. Most of the reproduction parts are now made in the orient. Nothing is as good as factory OEM parts.
Hi...rather than a reman box would a brand new OEM Saginaw 68-82 Corvette Manual Box from Borgeson come with all the proper adjustment and be ready to drop in the car straightaway...I have a 1978 corvette...thanx
@@Joesmusclecargarage understand and thank you...but again if i were to go with the new aforementioned box from your experience do you sense it comes equipped with all adjustments pre-set and ready to drop into the car and simply tighten up all related fasteners
Hey im wondering if you has an opinion on a input shaft that has side to side movement? I have saginaw in a 92 dodge w250 it was rebuilt and the rebuilder put in a different torsion bar to firm up the steering feel. The steering is good, no slop, and firmness is good maybe a little to stiff for my liking but its cool. I noticed there is a small drip of fluid on the steering shaft universal joint thats on the input. i grabbed the steering shaft and noticed the side to side movement its not alot but im thinking thats whats causing the small leak. should there be any side to side movement, whats your thoughts?
@@Joesmusclecargarage that’s what figured. No in and out movement. Maybe it’s my rag joint with some play that’s making it seem like there is movement. I’ll pull the steering shaft and see if the input still has movement. Thanks for the reply.
I have a spanner wrench for the input shaft adjusting nut but how do you get a torque wrench on there to do the initial 30-ft-bls of torque on it? Seems like I would need a special tool for that like a huge socket like adapter with two pins that fits the spanner holes on the nut..
@@Joesmusclecargarage Yea, but don't think my little spanner or a pair of needle nose could even tolerate 30 ft-lbs. I may need a better tool to tighten it. Thanks.
Can you just adjust the pitman shaft without the other adjustment my pitman shaft has alot of slop don't think it's ever been adjusted as I can see the inner adjuster bolt is low almost in line with the lock nut on the outside oh yeah this is a 98 Tahoe 4 wheel drive if you need that information I plow with it
I’ve replaced every single front end item including the box and still have slop! Beyond frustrating! Every mechanic I’ve used all state that the steering will get no stiffer… I’ve never tried this method and I’m not sure what mechanics in my area would!
@@Joesmusclecargarage 1997 K1500... i can rock the wheel sitting or driving a good bit back and fourth and she doesnt even start to turn. ive taken it to many shops and even had a whole new front end put on and aligned and still slop
The one on my 99 Suburban is leaking a little and really sloppy. I'm tempted to buy a reman just for the sake of time (I'm not familiar with rebuilding them and this one has 250k miles). Are the reman units usually pretty reliable? Prices vary a lot on Rockauto.
Im Guilty of making the top nut adjustment without looking more into it... The question I have is did I ruin my box from over adjusting the top allen bolt? I cant get the steering back, it gets stuck whereever the wheel goes and cant find center ect. Is it fucked?
@@Joesmusclecargarage It was about a 1 ¹/⁴ turns then it go snug. then i backed it off about a 1/4 turn.... come to find out the slop i did have was in the rag joint so i adjusted a perfectly good box 🙄
@@timothykemp1772 Not usually. But adjusting only the overcenter adjustment on the top of the box will throw everything out of whack and it’s a guarantee the box will end up worse off than you started with. My advice is, do it correctly or don’t do it at all.
So I have a 01 Silverado. And I have to turn the wheel to far left or right for it to even turn the wheel Was pulling my trailer up camping and I thought I was going to wreck the whole way. I tried to adjust but I guess I did wrong or need a new box
98 chevy silverado - i replaced my input seal/o ring while the box was in the truck but i didn't mark the original positions of the housing, cartridge, lock nut. i tried the 1/2 inch back off per the manual but still have lots of play in steering wheel that wasn't there before. do you think i backed off too much?
I’m not sure I am understanding what you did. If you followed the procedure, there shouldn’t be any play. Did you properly torque your flange nut before backing it off 1/2”? Did you properly adjust your over-center preload? You did something incorrectly.
@@Joesmusclecargarage Ty for responding. I gave the video a like. Yes,, i probably did something incorrectly unfortunately. I had an input seal leak so while the box was still in the truck: 1. i removed the flange lock nut and the cartridge where the seal is. 2. i replaced the seal then reinstalled back on the box. 3. I tightened as much as possible and then put the lock nut back on. i didn't do any torqueing, i just tightened as far as it would go then backed off 1/2 inch and reinstalled the locking flange nut. i didn't do any adjusting to the OC preload as i was just replacing a leaky seal. There was no play in the box originally. I guess i am going to have to remove the box from the truck and recalibrate on a bench. I was thinking this could all be done while the box was still in the truck.
@@Joesmusclecargarage cool I've spent a good bite on all my front-end Parts and time and still had a little play in the steering I was looking at the shafts thinking it was in the u joints. To my surprise it was wobbling were the shaft goes on the box .I just assumed a loose bolt were it connected to my box.its tight tho then i thought the box was toast, maybe 15-30 degrees + or - of slack
@@Joesmusclecargarage a new box wasn't what I was looking to buy I just overhauled the rig changed a bent rod cracked piston change the injectors , injection pump, turbo rebuild front-end ,brakes ,tires .. expensive. Stuff
I just listened to the last 5 minutes and now I feel guilty for being a lazy ass and adjusting the wrong one. Stupid HOA. People already think I’m Fred Sanford with the amount of old cars I have.
Too stupid to understand simple verbal instructions huh? That’s ok. You’re better off keeping your little hands clean and leaving it to someone with a double digit IQ.
You've done this adjustment on the box out of the vehicle. How is it properly done with the steering box in the vehicle ? This is fine if you are replacing it but it doesn't address any adjustments if it is in the vehicle.
I don’t know what you’re asking. You can do it “properly” with the box in the car, IF you have enough room. If you’re going so far as to pull the pitman arm and disconnect the column, why not pull the box? It’s too easy to pull the box on money vehicles.
