I have the AIO and it’s a superb product. I control it locally with Home Assistant and really get the most out of it. Saved about 1/3 on my electricity over winter and have yet to benefit from the solar I had installed at the same time 😎
@@Lewis_Standing I already have an EV (and I have the Giv EVC awaiting install). I’m on Agile and averaging 10p/kWh through November and December. The ability to load shift and even better import cheap/free electricity and sell it back to Octopus for 15p 😜
@@jonathanthomson5000have you thought about how long your batteries will last charging them up and discharging them for 5 pence per KW. Will it pay as batteries will only last for so many cycles.
@@kevanswift7797 I have no reason to believe the batteries will not last for at least their warranty period when being cycled twice daily. I really don’t care much for any perception the batteries won’t last. I’ve invested and I’ll use the product to the maximum benefit of myself.
Very informative video, thanks! I'm thinking of having one of these installed and I'm just wondering if the external isolators are a requirement or just an added extra that you guys install. Can isolation not be achieved using the breakers that already exist within the Gateway? Complete layman here, by the way!
I would be recommending much larger batteries guys. I have 36kwh of battery storage and it’s just enough to run all day in a 3 bed bungalow with 2 people in all day. We fully charge overnight in winter at cheap rate and also have 36kw of PV solar so in the summer months we don’t fully charge at night. 12 wouldn’t last very long for most…. Nice install tho! 😉👊🏼
Guys, love the work, I’d really appreciate a comparison video of the various solar/battery combos. I’m after both very soon. There are so many out there and no single website seems to have a clear comparison of the various options. I also plan to get a hypervault charger for future EV needs.
I’ve heard that the give energy all-in-one needs to have maintenance inspections and testing carried out at quite short intervals in order for the warranty on the kit to be maintained…is this true? I’m told that the Tesla all-in-one with gateway does not require so much attention in this way… what are your thoughts, seeing as there is not a lot of cost difference between the two…and are you registered to enable people to get paid for feeding power back into the grid…??? Thank you…
I enjoy the videos coming out on Tuesdays. It's my day in the office so I get to watch them on my hour train ride home. I noticed something was missing from my life last week. 😂
I wish that more products like this would come to Italy. I love seeing all of these battery storage alternatives and I wonder why we have so few of them in Italy.
I'm pretty sure it's the chemistry that gives it a 100 SOD. Lithium iron phosphate (LFP) batteries like those in the Tesla Model Y (I have one) all have 100pc state of discharge. They also are better being fully charged unlike Lithium Ion which prefer the 20-80pc charging range.
reg's stop retrofitting existing systems in australia. but i added a used LG (not recall) batt and inverter - powered the fridge and freezer a few time since it's install - ryobi inverters are also used to keep the internet and things running
Once you have worked in an 800 rack data centre facility with 8mw of incoming mains, x4 2mw standby generators and a shed load of double online conversion UPS the idea of having a backup electricity supply at home becomes a bit passe 😂
I would challenge the TT Earthing arrangement installed here - to the point that it may be unsafe. When off-grid, fault current will not be trying to run to the TT Earth, it will want to return to the battery negative. TT Earthing is only applicable for current that originated from the Utility, and is seeking a path back to the same. In this scenario, the household Earthing arrangement should be bonded to the battery Negative, not the MET in the Gateway. Impedance to Earth (TT) will be infinite ohms in the way it is installed here. Of course once it's back on-grid, the household Earthing arrangement should reconnect to the MET, in favour of the PEN conductor - not sure if the Gateway can manage this switchover? If I'm wrong, I'd love to understand the reality!
The original standard colours were red, black and green and as we know, these cables can still be found in old properties. Then the colours were changed to brown, blue and green/yellow. There was a great deal of publicity and explanation to the public for this new standard of three core cable colours which everybody accepted. When brown, black and grey are the cable colours it is logical (particularly in the domestic environment) to refer back to the original standards and to use black as blue and grey as green. Simples!
Nah. Guidance says not to use the black as neutral. Its in the onsite guide. Whilst yes this is only guidance. Standard practice is now not to use the black as neutral.
I thought the Gateway needed 200mm clearance above and below , it looks like its up very close to that plastic roof, would that not risk overheating or void the warranty?
I'm assuming this is the AIO 6.0 not 3.6. What these videos don't cover is the DNO Certification (G98,G99,G100) . The AIO 6.0 can supply 6Kw where as the 3.6 is yes 3.6Kw and is G98 certified. Im guessing a G99/100 is needed for the 6.0. A friend has a Tesla Powerwall and a 5Kw inverter on a G98, something somewhere is limiting the feed in to the grid to 3.6 but who knows what, can someone explain? I would like the AIO 6 with a 3.68KW Inverter.
The units are CT Limited to 3.6kw output when on grid. This is not uncommon, lots of solar PV inverters will also do this. It gets around the DNO requirements.
How hot does that garage get in the summer and what temp can the battery operate at. I had a small section of that corrugated clear roofing on my shed the rest was opaque. It reached over 50 degrees Celsius (the thermometer wasn't marked above 50) near some metal shelves during a heatwave. I have since replaced the roofing with just opaque stuff. It still gets hot in there but no where near as high.
is there still a requirement for that generation meter you're fitting? Can you not use the serial number off of the gateway generation meter (GEM120) which is printed on the top of it? I know the MCS cert requires a serial number for a generation meter so why not use the GEM 120 instead? The house smart meter is for the SEG as I understand it anyways, so that generation meter is not really of any use. Not having a dig, just that a collegue told me MCS said the old gen meters are no longer needed. Cheers, great vid by the way.
I had an AIO fitted a couple of months ago and did exactly what you suggest. My FIT provider (eon) were completely happy with the model number and serial number of the generation meter already fitted to the gateway. The display does have fewer digits though, so I'll have to get my reading reset to zero more often.
Nice bit of kit, makes sense. Well done guys. How does this affect your generation meter? And how do you charge on off peak electricity during none sunny periods? Great stuff thanks
I'm in the military with 2 years left of service and want to become an electrician when I leave. Is there a route I can take to become qualified and also have the relevant experience required to join the industry on leaving?
Every approved installer I contacted says they won’t do Giv energy installs due to poor customer service - something to do with the change over from V1 to V2 batteries. Has the customer service improved ? I really wanted an all in one.
As an installer I would disagree with customer service being an issue, Never had a problem with speaking to tech support be that commissioning or later on with a obscure setting.
As a customer on the rare occasions I’ve had to contact Giv (for technical support) they’ve been fantastic and there’s a great community on Facebook which includes some of their staff so it’s often not even required to call them as the hive mind almost always knows the answer 😜
Is there no inverter on the market that doesn't require a switchover from grid to battery/solar?? I would've thought it would be possible for grid to feed inverter and solar to feed inverter at the same time, and the house wouldn't know where its getting its power from. If grid goes down, inverter can just cut the supply so it doesn't back feed the grid. Wouldn't that stop lights/electronics flickering or turning off etc when the power switches or goes down?
Is the app optional or required? And do you need to register for the app? In other words can you install and use the system locally without any internet/cloud?
I didn't hear anywhere how powerful the inverter was....If they try and use more than this value they will either be paying for mains electricity to make up the usage difference, or it trips out. I personally went for a Sunsynk 8KW system which is 8.8KW output so I could run a washing machine and tumble dryer at the same time. Just a pity the SunSynk servers are down so often makes seeing real-time generation data virtually impossible - rigging a webcam in front of the display is definitely going to happen...
Two things that concerns me about battery storage systems are longevity and replaceability. How long do these things last and how do you tell when they need replacement? And with electrical technology advancing so fast, will there be replacement batteries available in 10 years or whenever or will the whole system have to be replaced with something new?
A lot of batteries are rated for 6k cycles or more which, given that you don't fully cycle them every day means ~ 20 years. And yes, there will be replacement batteries, but perhaps (hopefully) not LiFePO4 - but who cares? it's an ac-coupled system.
@@simonrack4865 Right, so they need to be replaced after 20 years? That means that you need to budget for that or depreciate your new battery. Say the battery costs £4000: over 20 years that's £200 per year.
Lately the focus seems too narrow and what I would expect to be looking at is out of focus, please ensure the bit we are looking at is in focus rather than the shoulder of the person working
I can only afford to make the change to green energy gradually. I plan on starting with a battery and charging on cheap rate over night so that I can start installing infrared ceiling panel heating. Ultimately I want the whole GivEnergi AOI system with solar, so can I start with just the battery or does it need the gateway installed with it? I'm leaving solar until last because the panels seem to be developing rapidly and as our roof is east/west with some chimney shading I want them to be able to cope well with that. As you can tell by the question, potential customer not sparky! Tia chaps, great vid, I like the way you instal on fireproof backing, makes sense to even up the walls. 👍
Solar first gives you the best return by using your own generated power, rather than going down the arbitrage path. Battery technology is evolving more than solar panels, so deferring battery purchase also makes better sense.
@@terrydennis467oh, do you think so? I will keep an eye out on both then. I reckon it's going to depend on what time of year we start, in all honesty. Our finances should improve in the autumn so we'll be wanting to look at getting some infrared panels to start switching our heating away from gas. As they might add a bit to the heating bills (!) we'll want to supplement the cost which is why at that time of year it'll be battery first to alleviate their running costs. I'm just not sure how suitable our roof is for holding solar panels so I'd rather get into the nitty-gritty of that after I've got the heating sorted, if that makes sense. However if we don't get started on any of it until next spring/ summer I'll definitely consider panels first. it's a bit chicken and egg really isn't it?! Thanks for your advice, it's definitely given me food for thought. It may be that competition for this may arrive and drop the prices if nothing else. 👍 (I'm aware of the Tesla system but don't want to have anything to do with the Musk empire)
I think there is an argument that if you have an ev - a battery helps drop your overall energy price from 25-30/kwh to 10/kwh using ev tariffs. So the maybe the solar has to be considered against ‘when’ you use it and if you’re out during the day I imagine battery could be the best first step?
Spiking an earth. I would have thought it be separated low voltage and live to earth spike from the inverter/battery wouldn’t complete a circuit (bit like shaver point).
So it seems an external 3rd party solar inverter is still needed in this system (in this case, in the loft). Is there no way to feed DC straight from the solar panels straight into the AllinOne battery and avoid DC to AC then AC to DC conversions and losses. ? Anyway, great video, thanks.
No, this accepts AC only from the solar inverter. Good for folks who already have solar PV. If you are building from the scratch or want direct DC, then go Victron.
14:00 do i understand it right that in a normal house installation in the uk you rely on the erth that comes over the pen conductor? and don´t have a earth at the property which is tied into the pen on the entry of the service wires?
10:26 any normal person uses the cable with correct colors directly ... seems to be an UK thing sleevng other colors on cables .. regulations here in Belgium are the cable has to be same color on the whole run ... and when a neutral is present and a blue wire it has to be neutral / PE has to be yellow green. The rest of colors you can chose ( but green or yellow wires are not allowed ) usally L1 = brown L2= black L3 = grey ( but not obliged ) .
Heavier 3 core is used for 3 phase the vast majority of the time, so it’s produced in those colours. Difficult to find 3 core over 6mm in single phase colours.
It would be great if you could get the cable. Only way to get brown and blue is to buy 4 core which is more money and wasteful. Was never a problem in the old day with red yellow blue there was never any doubt. Since going to the stupid colours ( supposedly to harmonise with the rest of Europe) that’s when the problems set in
weird we have them in Belgum .. and even more weird .. uk houses have a single fase 80 or 100A fuse so verry common single fase in uk .. here we get 40A single fase standard ..you want more then 3fase@@Pugjamin
My wife arranged for solar panels to be fitted and wanting to be "independent" did not include me in the discussion. Originally she asked for the inverter and battery to be fitted outside but they phoned and talked her into getting them put in the roof. When I noticed, I asked the installer if he would be fitting a smoke alarm in the loft - he looked at me blankly. I told him the latest guidance was to not use external DC isolators if they are built in to the inverter, but he just shrugged and said he was a contractor. Obviously he did not attach any fireproof backing to the wall either. Should I speak to the company my wife bought the panels of or just leave it? I am going to fit a smoke alarm linked to the landing and fit an easy access ladder, and keep a fire extinguisher up there. What do you guys think?
Do GuvEnergy now do three phase batteries with whole home backup? Have you got any plans to install any three phase battery solutions? Rather than three single phase…
We are quoting for a new GivEnergy three phase hybrid system at the moment for one of our clients, but it doesn't do whole house backup yet, you can have backup circuits off the EPS terminal of the battery though.
You call a lot of Electricians out on social media then you install a system that doesn’t meet the Givenergy manual. If that system overheats you won’t have no warranty.
If adding an EV charger would you also use a Giveenergy one or combine it with say a Zappi? Can you add more battery capacity to it via a standalone battery?
Better off staying with the same environment, so I'd say a givenergy charger. You can then integrate the two systems together so that your EV doesn't drain the AIO battery when charging. Not sure if Givenergy have released the firmware to support it yet but the AIO was always planned to be paralleled with more AIO's. But when first released, you could only install one AIO.
The GivEnergy EV charger was not available at the time I had my GivEnergy Inverter and batteries installed. So I eventually caved in and had a (MyEnergi) Zappi installed, it works ok, but it’s not integrated… But neither is my ASHP. As far as the GivEnegy App is concerned the EV charger and ASHP look like a big kettle is being used! For me always aim for Integration. (A Zappi is more expensive too!)
@@John-FourteenSix It does seem that the givenergy EV charger doesn't integrate with octopus at the moment which does count it out for me unfortunately :(
Jordan another great video. Question I have if we havecac3 day outage would this banknof batterys fully support home with heat pump in this cold weather and ovens in the evening . So tell us please how long will this battery pack last in the event of a power cut in minus 3 conditions .
Can’t work out if you are serious or just taking the piss 🤷♂️ it’s 12kw hours at best plus whatever you get from the solar. Might keep a few lights and freezer on and hopefully keep your boiler running. No heat pumps or ovens
@johnwarwick4105 lol, that's my point. Why do people spend mega bucks to save money, which takes many years for a return on their initial investment. My guess is Jordans bill for this job must be close to £22k . People I livecrural I have 19kw solar system and batterys. 12 years later, I am nearly quid in. When your warranty starts coming to an end and you have to fork out again, you add years. Buy a small petrol or diesel generator. £1200 will get you an 8kw generator . Fit a transfer switch so you operate one switch to feed all of home and you will be able to run your home whilst your in a power cut for weeks if needed and have a shower and get your home with a heat pump. A smaller cheaper battery system can still work for you if you are thinking of green. In my case, living rural, we have been put for days. I invested £2500 on a 12 kW generator, so we could also charge our ev as well. Best investment we made. We still have a backup battery, but on poor light days, 4kw struggles to charge it. And by the way, on my 3rd battery, the next failure is not warranty. it's my pocket. So again, if I have to spend £2k on a replacement, then any solar profits would have to repay that first before I shout out about having free electricity.
@@gino2465 yes it's going to be an expensive job. I assume the solar was existing. Adding the gateway in my view is an expensive luxury but maybe they have supply issues ( though I doubt it's that bad) 13kw of batteries should enable them to be almost self sufficient in summer months . Weather it will ever pay back 🤷🏻♂️ electric prices in the uk have doubled in the last couple of years so who knows. More than 4kw of solar if you have the room
@johnwarwick4105 complete agree. But 13kw is not enough . I justvpriced a job. a customer with a huge hole in his pocket wants to run a system that will charge an ev off grid, i.e., grid outage mainly. 3x tesla batterys £28k alone. He would need a minimum of 12 kW solar , he does not have 3 phase which makes things difficult. Job is looking at £50k . I myself feel the way to go is using a vehicle battery example say Nissan leaf car with 62kw battery and using a vehicle to grid/ home charger . These chargers are available, and stand-alone units are popping up. You can still charge batterys using solar, which is what I do . But I have to remind people it depends on light in the sky. In summer I'm ev gives me 5000 miles travelling free last year. If you're lucky and you have lots of roof space, then fill it east south and west if you again have a huge hole in your pocket. If your system is off grid, then you're lucky. If not, you can get authorisation for more than 4kw from your dno. I know some have a 12kw system on a single phase, but you will have to pay for that pleasure. Forgot to mention tariffs not good yes octopus and some others give excellant ev tariffs but people need to install a economy 7 meter at a cost. They offer a free 4 hour period so you could charge your off grid batterys yes but they will not charge in that 4 hours . Reality really. Nothing is free . Summer and batterys and solar is free and small home loads work well on batterys for days in many cases but running showers heat pumps charging evs and in some cases 2 evs add to quickly depleting battery shorter time.
Is the TT earth bonded with the TNCS earth at any time? Or is the TT totally separate? And if separate, would some circuits (eg non battery backed up circuits) remain protected by tncs during a power outage? Thanks
@@artisanelectrics that's really interesting to know. Does permission from the DNO need to be obtained to do this? I've always wondered if half your house is non-grid tied "off grid", and the other half is normal grid, can you just go ahead and bond your 2 systems' earth without notifying DNO (in UK)? Thanks
GivEnergy state that the earthing terminal inside the gateway is to become the MET for the house. The DNOs method of earthing must be disconnected. When there’s a power outage and the domestic load is supplied from the battery, the neutral-earth bond is made, meaning all current which would have gone down the neutral conductor back to the transformer will then go down the local earthing electrode. If the DNOs means of earthing is still connected to the MET in any way, there’s a chance for that current to travel back down the DNO line and fry the poor engineer who’s been sent to repair the damaged cables. However, in BS7671 18th Edition, Amendment 2, the wording of regulation 411.4.2 has been changed to make the installation of an additional earthing electrode on every tnc-s system a “recommended” action. In this case, the DNO earthing and the additional local Earth electrode should not be kept separate. But the Earth in this case is being used in a very different way.
@@TomEggerton If disconnecting the DNO earth completely then you would effectively be converting a TNCS/TNS to a TT system. The Island mode earthing arrangements under the IET Code of Practice on Electrical Energy Storage Systems, doesn't show you as having to disconnect the DNO earth - when operating under island mode or not. What is essential, is as you point out if there is a PEN fault on the DNO earth, is there must be a consumer earth electrode fitted on any TNCS system when installing a system capable of Island mode. This effectively supplements the DNO earth under all conditions. The only additional necessary requirement is the earth-neutral bond relay to connect earth & neutral on the consumer load side when operating in Island mode, as with both line and neutral DNO conductors being isolated there is no longer an earth-neutral bond - and also the DNO earth neutral bond cannot be relied upon under a power loss condition.
@@blower1 for tns and tnc-s, the house’s earth is always connected to the neutral on the DNO’s side. When the neutral and Earth are connected by the relay inside the gateway, if that DNO Earth is connected to the MET inside the gateway, you will unavoidably energise the DNO neutral. Current will be sent to the MET, which can then travel back to the DNO neutral through the house’s existing Earth. This is why Giv and the DNOs that I’ve spoken to (admittedly only NG and SSE) have a big problem with a neutral-earth bond that incorporates the DNO’s means of earthing. They’re quite happy with it when it’s a local Earth on a maintained db, but when it’s a whole-house backup, which relies on the DNO Earth under normal operating conditions, they get understandably nervous. But finding any reference documentation on how to arrange this properly is pretty much impossible. They say they don’t want to you have any opportunity to send current back up DNO lines during a power outage, but don’t really tell you how to achieve this. The best I’ve got out of all of them is to turn every house into a TT.
Reading the comments I think you should clarify when doing these videos how little power 12 KW/h battery can supply. People are talking about 3day power cuts, heat pumps, showered and ovens etc. Just a note also for you young pups that never touched RYB, the decision to use grey as neutral and black as earth was as stupid as changing the colours in the first place, if you talk to any electrician in their 50’s and 60’s (normal people) let’s pick a colour that everybody associates with neutral ( black) and then sleeve it as earth 🤷♂️. Non of this will make any sense to our American friends as I believe black is their phase colour and white is neutral, will always remember that after getting a good shock in an American made control panel 😂
@@aryanelectrical at 38 it’s all you have know. Those that spent 20 years with proper colours where black was the neutral found it counter intuitive to use black as earth. In industry black was also a power colour for control panels. Ok it wasn’t as big a deal for the domestic guys, now how confusing would it get if domestic started using black as earth. If in five years another change was adopted for no good reason at all what would you think ? On the old RYB 3 core cable you never ever had and doubt whatsoever that red live blue neutral and yellow earth it all made sense as they were the closest to the standard colours, not even a diy would get it wrong and nobody bothered sleeving the neutral as blue and black were both standard neutral colours. Hope that explains why us old guys get grumpy 😂😂
Just curious, noted 32amp so assuming user has to be careful of load (for example showers) when running from backup? If so, any indicator for if running supply or battery without going out to the gateway/checking app? Looks like another great piece of work you’ve done!
Yep is limited to I think 5kw on back up so yes if your loads exceed this it will not back up the whole house. You'll need to shed loads for it to work, same with Tesla. We get it all the time it's not a whole house back up misleading. There are other products that will provide full house back up, you'll need a lot of batteries though if that's what you want.
@@b1stiecuffsah, now thats worth knowing. They never mention that to us lay-persons do they? Further investigation on all storage required. Actually been wondering if Ecoflow batteries would be another less expensive option for power cuts, can't remember what their max output is, somewhat less I expect but if the AIO doesnt really back up the whole house I'd rather spend my money on something simpler and cheaper for storage, dont know how much the AIO is but I expect its significantly more expensive than more ordinary storage, who's names escape me now...Pylontech, Foxx? Might have dreamt those, not sure. Might help spread the costs more anyway....🤔 Thanks, food for thought.👍
L and R are great helps if you understand Left and Right. But the dyslexic person needs help understanding Left and then what is not used must be Right (or is that correct?) No much a company tries to make things idiot proof, there will always be the one person who proves them wrong.
No harm to any7one but with that old school plastic roof I wouldn't be installing anything in there and the location really does look rotten and the wood needs replaced as does the roof.
I'm questioning who in their right mind would pay all that money for a beautiful job like that and then have it put in a single skin concrete garage that will be riddled with damp, under a single skin polycarb roof that looks like it is about to leak at any minute?
Great if you have piles of cash to spend, intend to live there for the next 20yrs to get pay back and are young enough to not die before you are not out of pocket. Oh and can afford to replace it all in a few years when it stops working. Nice niche to work in if enough people have enough cash to waste paying you to install on this untested stuff.
LifePo4 is pretty solid and likely to last 15-20 years when properly managed by a system like this. Only concern is outdoor installations such as these and the inability for LifePo4 to be charged below 0c - unless there is some form of preheating in the battery modules they may find no charging at all on very cold sub zero days/nights. Nights being when you want to use grid offset (cheap rate elec at night to charge battery)
@@blower1mine is outside, we’ve just had a period of cold weather where ambient temperatures dropped to minus figures, the battery temperature never dropped below 8 degrees and the inverter temperature below 20. Mine is pretty much always doing something (either charging or discharging) and hardly ever idles but perhaps a less utilised battery may be impacted by such temperatures.
Fly by night companies that won’t be around in a couple years, 12yr warranty is worthless. Technology will be obsolete long before that. You’d be better off burning fivers to stay warm.
