Sorry for the difficulty some of you guys are having in understanding me. My lungs are kinda messed up so I have to talk quickly to complete sentences. For some of the more technical aspects you may have missed: Fire rate for the gun was .8 seconds per round, rounded up to 1s for unclassified publications. Carousel was continuously replenished, but if you did fire all six rounds, it could be replenished in around 5 seconds (In the time you replenish one round in WT you could replenish 16 IRL) Offroad speed was about 80kmh in desert (modeled) and 56km/h in woodland (tested and modeled). Since I'm getting a lot of comments about some things, here. *"How did you verify this was someone who actually worked on the program?"* He gave me personal details about his employment; what contractor he worked for, what his job was, who he worked under, that I was able to verify through primary documentation. Furthermore, I was able to verify nearly everything he said, from the reload rate down to the test instrumentation being the most unreliable part of the program. *"You're just making this up so you can make the HSTV-L overpowered."* For one thing, I'm not using this man's testimony for bug reports. I already have bug reports for the major issues the HSTV-L has in War Thunder, with each having upwards of four sources. Second, I've stated time and time again that if the HSTV-L WAS fixed, I would want it to go to 10.3 or 10.7. Three, I don't want overpowered vehicles in War Thunder, I want ACCURATE vehicles in War Thunder. I don't know about you guys, but I learned that cheating in games isn't very fun when I was around eight. It's a lot more fun to actually have a challenge. Fourth, even if I did want the HSTV-L to be overpowered and Gaijin implemented my bug reports while keeping it 9.7, its win rates would skyrocket and it would be moved to a higher BR anyway. I made this video purely to record this man's testimony for history's sake. *"You're just trying to hype up your favorite vehicle / You're a nationalist."* Crazy thought, but I don't actually care what you guys think about the HSTV-L. If you think the Leopard 2 is the best tank in the world, cool. If you think the T-90 is the best tank in the world, that's cool too. As I've said before, I don't think you can say any tank is the best in the world since each country designs their tanks around their own specific doctrine, but it's your opinion and you're entitled to it. What would I gain by "hyping up" the HSTV-L anyway? And if you were one of my close friends, you'd find the idea of me being a nationalist to be laughable. I think American tanks are the most interesting, but I'm far from a nationalist. *"If it was so great, why didn't they adopt it?"* As explained in the video, the M1's continued development was favored, so the program's funding was diverted to that. Development of the HSTV-L's gun had already put a pretty large dent in the budget, the full scale development of a production HSTV-L type vehicle would have made it even bigger. *"There's no way it was as good as it was described, the US Army would never let such a potent tank go to waste."* If you believe that, you are obviously not very familiar with US Army procurement.
theyll do like what they did to the Type 90 MBT armor test results that showed it was much stronger to kinetic projectiles (they had a Type 90 and shot it with JM33 from the 120mm main cannon of another Type 90 to get these results), and say Gaijin: "oh no theyre wrong theyre lying its all biased."
spookston needs to interview me. abrams has 1 second reload, 100000mm of kinetic armour everywhere from the front, and silver bullet has 100000mm of pen at 2km at 60 degrees. source:wookiepedia
@@m1a1abrams3 don't forget 50 cals with 400mm of pen at 500m, meaning you can kill some mbt frontally with just the machine gun. Sometimes they don't even need the main gun.
@@General_Dave_1 Not even a couple billion of dollars. You can get a functional BMP-2 for around $300k and shipped worldwide for another $150k + another $75-$100k for the government approval. Now rusted left over stuff like the HSTV-L? The US govt would willingly to part with it and write it off as free money for them.
I love the fact that places like RU-vid let us hear from people like this. Huge props to this engineer for sharing his experience and thanks Spookston for putting it out here for us.
It's actually cooler how they did it with T-90... before it was created. It's mentioned at 2:08. I feel like I've just listened to used car advertisement:D
And I bet gaijin will still not change anything about the HSTV-L because they are too bussy figuring out how to implement top BR premium tanks which are still one rank below top tier (just like in naval)
@@Real_Claudy_Focan That's how I also felt about the video. I do however need to say that this does sound like what a real person would say. I hope that Spookston has done some checking himself on the person.
You know, A long time ago I wanted to make a comment saying "Why don't you(Spookston) ask an engineer from the HSTV Program" But I thought it sounded too insulting and kind of unrealistic. Darn, GG.
Have you considered providing a google drive or direct links to some of the sources you use? I've been waiting for months for the Army to respond to my FOIA request on the HSTV-L
Just so you guys know how hard it is to get a FOIA request, I was in a Stryker rollover and messed up my neck. The VA needed more than just sworn statements so I had to request the official records from my own accident. I’m still waiting after a whole year.
Would be nice to have some text as well to read what the engineer said during the video, you unfortunately talk sometimes a little fast, causing me to have to rewind the part. ^^;
Keep it mind it's a single biased source, so I wouldn't take this as gospel. Listening to this guy, the HSTV-L was fast, reliable, deadly, survivable, comfortable, compact, etc. Basically the best thing since sliced bread. I somewhat doubt the veracity of some of this, personally, knowing armored vehicles in general, especially considering this vehicle was never adopted in the end.
Stop breaking peoples dreams ! In reality it would probably be extremely expensive and maintenance intensive. Ad it would perform well for the first 6 months after being produced. Survivability is highly doubtable as it is tightly packed. 75mm piercing T-80 front is doubtable of barrel life is 6 rounds of APFSDS
Since they don't have an actual tank to test out and rely on spy plane and other mean to simulate the tank armor so the deadly part is a bit questionable without actual combat testing and survivability is well provided by the mean of "don't get hit" so that part also a bit meh? Although the fast, reliable, deadly, survivable, comfortable, compact traits do fit a WW2 tank though, it the Sherman. Fast enough, very reliable, deadly enough with 75 and 76mm, crew survivability is high and armor is decently good, comfortable and well kinda minus the compact since the Sherman is quite tall Given they can do something like that in WW2 I think they can be done, well minus here and there feature like armor protection since it a light armored vehicle
Since that time one commenter said how spooks always starts talking after getting the kill, it became something to look for. nice kill spooks and is that generals music i hear in the background in the first seconds edit, it is! knew it. "Songs used (in order from first to last): Command and Conquer: Generals - Fight for Peace "
I love the info. Though as someone with just a but of skepticism, I do feel the need the ask where the credibility of the source is. Don't take this as an attack or offense. I do not mean for it. And I understand the desire for the engineer to keep his privacy.
This is honestly my absolute favorite kind of content. Preserving history, saving stories of those who worked on projects. Please never pass up an opportunity to talk to people like this.
@@Glebasik148 Caliber doesn't matter much in the modern era, velocity matters more. By reducing the calibre while still holding the same velocity, you can get a round with better penetration but bad post-penetration damage due to the impact area being less and therefore creating less spall/sherapnel. This is the whole idea behind APFSDS (Armor Piercing Discarding-Sabot Fin Stabalized) rounds, as the actual projectile is way smaller in caliber than the cannon's caliber, hence why they are called "sub-caliber rounds". Its achieved by having a "sabot" around the shell while its in the cannon barrel that discards after its fired mid-air. It achieves more penetration by reducing the contact area while retaining or even increasing the force put on the armor (because it is more aerodynamic).
140mm can pen up to 1m of steel armour 75mm can`t even penetrate a 500mm of steel hstvl had 280mm of pen if you talking about railguns then yes but you need to have really long shells to compensate for loss of mass
@@Glebasik148 What you are saying is correct, but unless you are in an bunker busting role 500mm and 1000mm is the same considering the maximum (effective) thickness of tank armour is going to be 300mm. And considering that it has much greater firerate, both has its ups and downs. However, any cannon above 125mm of caliber is really just impractical and wouldnt make significant difference while adding logistical and reliability problems.
Not really, people do deserve to question the validity of the source and criticise it's reliability..... I hope this is not a personal attack on his well being or the engineers who worked on the project. But according to the information given, is too good to be true..... Which I find it strange, that's all.
Not really, I mean Gaijin just use whatever data available online and make the vehicle worth getting for users. It is currently the best tank in the game bar none.
Can you make more of this interviews with the different vehicles in war thunder or even the ones that can be implemented in the game. Is very interesting and amazing at the same time. Keep it up. Thanks💪🏼💪🏼
What are the practical applications of formulating force multipliers of military assets? Is it used to compare enemy and allied vehicle strengths in order to decide upon a ratio for allied tank divisions/battalions?
Are there more detail about the gun performance and the estimation for armor? Why was RHAe used? Since this is the 80s, did further testing being conducted on era such as kontakt 5, or the program was cancelled before US intelligence recognize the existence this type of era? A 75/90 can get throught any t72/t80/t90 from the front makes ruskie engineers looks like a bunch of idiots, and chances are they ain't. (Assuming armored portion and point blank range)
cool but it was probably for the best that they ended up with the xm1. imagine the upgrade process for the m1 applied to this, 400 hp just wouldn't cut it. or maybe they would have developed a heavier tank at which point we're back to the m1.
I find it really cool that once this program was cancelled the Canadians started to work on it more under a secret label as a new transport vehicle for JTF2 up until they were shut down by the Canadian government at the request of the Americans...so kinda like the Avro Arrow. Data files on it were purged and the prototype was dismantled. The only reason I know about this is because my dad and uncle were both military engineers put in the project to do the mechanical work on it. (I'm sorry I don't have any files on it as I mentioned they were purged and my dad being a mechanic didn't have access to sneak some out)
I personally think is a bit too exaggerated, to be fair the engineer would say how good the vehicle was when interviewed, as would any other engineers would. But the ARES system wasn't even used on the LAV..... I would take a massive grain of salt, but is good nonetheless. But I would not dare to say any of this is fact. The fact that most of the people who worked on the project were long pass while the people who worked on the T-72, T-80 are still working on the Armata project and actually appeared on RT documentary to tell their experiences working on the old Soviet tanks....... They greatly emphasis on the flaws of their old design, what required changes to improve on their newer tank project......Even if they are bias in favor of Russian tanks, but they are still living breathing and talking engineers. Compared that to this..... without a definitive proof of documents, is simply no way I can think this source is any more reliable than hearsay.
@@JohnDoe-yc6ox right i'm just trying to figure out what kind of insane dark magic math they're doing to get a vehicles weight just by watching it drive around
@@garrett707 ye ikr its crazy what they can get out of an image..... i mean still crazy though, I thought you needed like at least 105mm + to penetrate the t80u’s frontal armor. I guess not? Since they claim 90mm is good enough?
@@JohnDoe-yc6ox They may have also have insider intel in the engines used and so were after looking at the speed of the tank and comparing it to the horsepower of the engine, they were able to get the weight of the tank. We know that weight is unevenly divided between frontal armour and side armour( assuming its frontal armour is the about the same percentage of its weight as the previous model tank) so factoring in that and you can get a close estimate of the frontal armour.
I love that you love the HSTV-L as much as or probably more than us. Also please tell your friend to write a book on it. Its criminal there aren't any.
Is it just me or i kinda have a weird feeling about the interview.. I mean im not trying to say this is fake or something it just kinda feels weird since we are just going off of what spookston says and texts, instead of it being screenshots of the engineers answers on mail. With the engineers name blurred or something, again not trying to say this is fake or something and if you didnt get my point it feels sketchy because spookston doesnt really show the mail itself or anyother way to proof that its actually a real engineer.
Hmmm i would like to belive you, but considering HSTVL was built in 1979 talking about XM885 penetrating "soviet T-90" is funny to say the least. Also not giving any credentials aside "citing" a supposed "engineer" that was part of the project is on the level of peoples claiming to be tank commanders just to enforce their opinion about the tank on others.
He didn't say that though. He said the 90mm would have. 1. The 90mm was built later into the program. 2. The T-90 was conceptualized during the early to mid 80s, around the time that the ARES guns were still being tested. 3. In primary source documents they often reference a "future armor threat." It is entirely possible that they set requirements to that future threat when building the 90mm, and that the T-90 either met or was below those expectations when it became more well known. If I have a handgun that can punch through a kevlar vest that isn't made yet, but after it comes out I say that it can, that doesn't invalidate the claim.
@@Spookston It doesn't invalidate the claim, but everyone can quote an annonymous person providing no real background info and say this is a go to best info out there and that it proves an X point.
@@Volke_ Ok, but I'm not trying to prove a point here. I literally just said "I talked to a guy on the program, here's what he said." He provided personal details about his employment to me that I was able to verify through official documentation.
@@Spookston Well making a video about talking with engineer about HSTV-L and bringing up points about reload rates, penetration etc. Seems to be rather specific and made to prove a certain point of view. Ofc don't get me wrong, im not accusing you of lying, but sadly the amount of fabricated technical info in the internet made by fanboys of certain vehicles, is way too big to just take a WT community contributor words as they are when he provides no real backing to his claims from an interview with a mystery engineer. If this all is really true then great source you got there, but with no proof backing your claims to it being legit, aside quite cliche "dude trust me i background checked him" it's hard to belive all of what you said in the vid as truth.
none of the youtubers covering the HSTV-L have made the connection to the Mauler MBT, arguably the COOLEST tank to be used by the G.I. Joe forces against Cobra. the Mauler is basically an HSTV-L but it shoots lasers. that's the only difference.
6:31 Were those estimates accurate to the actual effectiveness of the armor? I would think that such an estimation could be wildly different than reality. However, I'm sure the engineer was just giving a quick summary rather than going into further detail. But surely an MBT designed to resist the main guns of other MBTs would be able to defeat a smaller round frontally? Why would the HSTV-L's gun have so much more penetration than that of a traditional MBT main guns? (105mm).
Was the HSTV-L the basis for the tank designs in the Aliens Colonial Marines Technical Manual? The way the turret looks, especially, looks really similar.
Honestly, it sounds just too good to be true. Prototype tanks usually have issues, they are missing features. Often initial production series still have those problems until they are rectified later (if at all). What's more, production versions can be worse, because some cuts had to be done, meaning you get simpler targeting systems than on prototype, the engine might be weaker and an older model, etc. This sounds a bit like IS-7, a super tank, but not put into production.
Hey Spookston can you do a video about the American M1 TTB (tank test bed). I only heard that there are only two version of this machine. One with a 120mm cannon and one with camera
I'm kinda skeptical about a few parts. I certainly don't think they are lying, It's not possible to know everything about a project this size. Fantastic that this person got in touch with you and great questions. The BELIEF that ceramic engines would be perfected certainly existed at that time. Problem is, a few decades on, we know that the tech is nowhere close to being ready for mass production. The overall reliability being good at the prototype stage? Having been involved with developing new technology, not military or weapons, there's always SOMETHING that's held together with duct tape and string so you can get to testing the major bits. (Because why bother fixing the little things if the big thing doesn't work?) Likely just didn't know all the little details. Fantastic conversation you had. Reminds me of one of the local gunshows I got to talk to a guy who worked on an autoloading 8" gun for the navy that fired fixed ammunition. The case he had was something like 4-5' long. Other questions that cross my mind to ask them. How was maintenance on the gun vs other systems? Time or difficulty? How often did jams or malfunctions occur and what sort of degraded mode operation was possible?
wow, this was very informative spooks. its cool hearing about the tank from someone who was involved in its development. thanks for going through all the effort to bring this too us.
Gaijin: Okay major updatae. The crewmembers now actually die and their families are gonna protest in your hangar. You have to kill them too too start another game.
Spooktston please defeat T-90 where, that designer has never had access to t-90 armor, side shots yes but not frontal Kontakt 5 shots. In fact the hstvl from the side does indeed pen T-90 in war thunder so I dont understand why is this an issue for you. Some of the shots and kills that you got in the game are completely unrealistic, shooting a tank that does not carry heat rounds wont lead to automatic explosions. Plus Sabot rounds from 75mm guns do not lead to automatic explosions. An hstvl will not withstand a 3bm42 round hit that is a fact. The extra armor that it has in real life wont guarantee it survival in battle against sabot rounds, against 30mm rounds it will, but the so called 30mm pens that the game does we all know are not that realistic. We all know that most tanks have weak side armor that is a fact and it is reflected in the game. There German Army as well as the Us army conducted tests on Kontakt5 armor and weren't able to pen it with 1980s and early 1990s rounds such as the DM33 that is why we have the A3 sabot round versions and the newer A4 round. In the game war thudner I have hit hstvl with a DM53 round in the turret and twice below the turret each time the tank magically survives so the rng factor calculated in the algorithms of the game is designed in such a way that we all have to go through a major grind, which of course is what we all hate.
Side note don't leave the country you are living in and I don't think you are a nationalist, war thunder is a game designed to make money so don't expect to find fairness in video games. They have nerfd and redone almost every vehicle, only some mechanics are realistic in this game, like a sabot round hitting the side armor and incapacitating crew members, penetrating the lower plate below the frontal plate of a tank and below the gun those are real mechanics that do occur and plenty of tests do confirm that. Of course the fact that you do get in contact with individuals that have worked and designed a tank is fantastic and hopefully those elements get integrated in war thunder but we all know that it is a game.
I have a question tho not particularly specific to the HSTV-L How accurate were the armor evaluations done by the CIA on the soviet tanks to their actual thickness?
US Army veteran here: I can expand, a little, upon what he was talking about with the 3 round bursts. Some of it is related to the nature of armored warfare and doctrine. Something worth pointing out when it comes to combat effectiveness, especially with regards to degrading armored and mechanized elements, is that when a vehicle is hit, it often is continued to be fired at even if it's clearly no longer engaging or moving. This was more true in past generations than it is today, but the idea is that even if a vehicle is hit, and some element of it is damaged, the crew killed, or even if the engine catches fire, it can still be recovered post-engagement and taken to be repaired, refitted, and recrewed. This isn't really modelled in War Thunder, but then again neither are the other components of a ground combat force. So it's a bit difficult to see how certain vehicles would fit into the battlespace.
Also, to add, the vehicle was part of a doctrinal shift in the DoD. At the time the US military was shifting to high maneuver style warfare wherein smaller most self-sustaining elements were able to engage and/or tie down enemy elements far larger in size and scope (in terms of battlespace occupied). The best example of this being the Iraq invasion of 2003 and the force restructuring of elements like, for example, the field artillery into their own, self-sustained, combat units with indigenous infantry, armor, cav scouts, and support / logistical elements. This is still being pushed today and if, for instance, you take a look at Defense News or the Military Times you will see other such projects coming into the fore as newer platforms are being developed to replace the more aged ones, or ones that aren't the best fit for their role (e.g. the Bradley).
I live near APG so I think it’s really neat to hear about this stuff. Also there is actually an HSTV-L left. There is a picture of it in Anniston Army Depot
I found that picture this was the only one built that I know of. It dont look nothing like what I remember . I need to post some pictures when we test it at Aberdeen and Ft Knox early 80,s
Spookston you should do one of these on one of the most misunderstood modern tanks in the world,the Merkava. It would be awesome if you could interview a merkava mk4 or mk3 crewman,favourably a gunner or TC and ask meaningful questions about all the misconceptions about the tank. Great vid!
They dicked a lot of programs, because the military ordinance department be fumbly and corrupt as fugg. Light tanks that were way more serviceable in the field got cut to blow more on money sink ventures. The Abroomz had the bigger double gulp turbine that would make more profits, similar to fatter pimple mobiles replacing easier field maintenance high mobility trucks because lol unlimited tax revenue for their friends in the business. The FAL debacle is a notorious one that set the gold standard for their bullshit.
