As this is a complex subject, I would appreciate if you would watch the entire video before taking a stance because you might have missed something important I mentioned about this.
I purchased my first pair of Allen Edmunds this past week. I was a bit hesitant given some of the reviews I had seen but figured they had been around a long time and had a solid reputation so I took the plunge. When the shoes arrived they had mismatched shoe laces. Given all the things that can go wrong with production who would have thought something as simple as providing matching laces would be an issue. Maybe it was a "one off" but it surprised me nonetheless.
5:10 This reminds me of a NASA analogy from the Apollo Program: The Saturn V rocket has 5 million parts. A 1% failure rate means 50,000 things can go wrong.
Honestly, I haven't looked too closely at my AE shoes. There may be cosmetic things wrong with some but I simply don't have the eye to find these flaws. And from a distance (which is almost always the case) no one can find such flaws. I've even purchased a few second quality and I'm pleased with them. I suppose if someone payed full retail or a shell cordovan pair of shoes then any flaws would be offensive considering that they cost several times that of machine made shoes. Once I made the transition to a full grain leather shoe with a Goodyear welt, I could absolutely see the difference in longevity compared to lower quality shoes.
They’ve hired more American workers since 2016 and those workers have to adapt and train to the AE process. I’m not surprised if there’s more defects, it will fizzle out.
More American workers mean more profits paid out as real salaries. As the costs of materials goes up and good salaries are paid to workers, the profits will have to come from somewhere.
The leather quality is much lower now - it sucks, actually. I have many pairs from different time periods. Just buy a pair of Aldens...so much better it's not even comparable.
HeavyProfessor I disagree, I have multiple pairs from different periods and the leather is the same. The only thing that changed was more defect rate since 2015 because they hired hundreds of new workers. Aldens customer service is trash, great shoe but the Alden company is garbage.
The customer service is unparalleled by any company I have seen. I have a pair of 3 kings boots which developed a few loose eyelets after 3 or 4 months of wear. I took them back into the store and they were happy to send them back to the factory and have them fixed at no cost to me. I actually didn’t ask them to do this... they just immediately started filling out a service tag to get them fixed free of charge. As for the quality, I have found some defects that I am not happy with in their products. But this is also a customer service talking point... if you buy online you don’t have a choice of what shoes you get or if they have defects. I have found that in store I am able to inspect the shoes before buying and even ask the sales person what defects exist on a pair of factory seconds before I buy them. In my experience they have been honest because they don’t want people to return the shoes because of defects! If you can go into a shop and buy them in person I would highly recommend it. Their product is best stood behind when they are literally standing behind it...
The company customer service is great like you say, however the loose eyelets should not happen. You can say it is just one instance but it is not true, many customers are having the shoes starting to fall apart quickly. For the price, the shoes are not worth it. Allen Edmonds' perfect shoe is not as good as some manufacturers' factory seconds.
Unfortunately, they don't carry wider sizes in stock in the store, so all you can do is buy online. They do measure you in the store and will tell you which size you should get online which helps. I actually went down half a size from what I thought I should get.
Roger Huston that’s a good point. I’ve seen up to 3E in stores but they certainly don’t have them for every shoe. I don’t know if they’re supposed to do this or not... but I’ve had them order shoes into the store before (without me buying them first) so that I can see and try them on before buying. I’m wondering if your store could do that for you.
@@TheKret8 certainly not in every style, but they should keep at least a few in the popular lines. I'd like to verify fit, then order varient I want online. It's impossible to stock everything. Online it took me 4 tries to find what I wanted and that is only because I was able to visit a shop. I thought 12,but 11.5 was my actual size. That's almost $2k on a card as it takes time to return the 3 I didn't keep.
Maybe if they had a solid product to begin with they wouldnt need the gimmick of "great customer service". In fact most people would rather buy a product and never have to see or talk to anyone ever again. That is the true standard for "great service".
I was, literally, just mentioning this to my wife that I’ve come to believe that AE quality control standards have dropped and what would’ve been sold ten years ago as seconds are now sold for full price. I pick up my phone and there’s your video!
Yes unfortunately I agree. Some were so bad they shouldn't be sold as seconds as the shoes had defects where the shoes structure is compromised. Ie the tongue isn't properly stitched and missing stitches completely. Dry leather that doesn't match between shoes, colors don't match between shoes when multiple pairs purchased mainly the chilis. One shoe was physically smaller, not sure how that happened maybe someone misaligned the leather on the last. The good pairs I got were mainly in the older style boxes. Only had ridiculously bad QC around the time of a year before last buyout. Customer service has gone down too. Used to be a day or two to respond via email last time it was almost four days to respond. Refunds took several weeks after delivery noted by UPS.
As I already own ten pairs of AE shoes, I was most interested to listen to this video. I think you gave an excellent presentation, pointing out some of the pros and cons, while debunking some of the rumors, but doing so in a fair and even handed way. Well done!
I literally just purchased a brand new first quality pair of park avenues in the new burnished copper color. The burnishing on the shoe came all messed up and uneven; it looked like a child painted it on. There was no transition in the burnishing at all. I called Allen Edmonds, and after sending in pictures they told me that there is no way they would let a shoe that bad leave the factory as first quality; they said the shoe must have been altered outside of the factory and refused to do anything for me. They wouldn't exchange it, take it back, or offer to refinish it. I had 3 CS reps tell me the same thing. I am in such disbelief, and now need to dye a brand new $400 pair of shoes. I will probably never give them business again.
@@donalddesantoii8132 Ohh they do. But after sending photos of the shoes to AE customer service they denied responsibility, basically implying that I must have done something to screw them up.
@@HighGrade_FireBlade Take them into a physical location. It should be obvious to the store rep that there's nothing you could have done to cause this. Last resort, file a claim with the credit card company, make a complaint to the BBB and to AG's office. I've dealt with really bad companies and have always gotten a favorable outcome using this approach.
A post on Reddit titled "Allen Edmonds recrafting ruined my boots" shows how bad things at AE have gotten in terms of quality and customer service. The man had his boots destroyed by the AE recrafting team and they even put different soles than the original ones without telling him. They told him the same thing they told Matthew M., that there was no way the recrafting department did that and that they couldn't do anything about it. He had to post Instagram pictures of his boots and tag Allen Edmonds for them to notice and have the issue resolved. Unbelievable.
The American way...MBA grads move in buy a company or substantial position in the company and have accountants run the company in the ground. It’s a very American issue. You will not find it in Italy, Germany, and Japan. It’s cultural and the chase of the almighty dollar is at the root.
Zan G I’m an engineer and I see it all the time myself. First generation German American and I grew up differently....more need to take pride in what they do and keep a high level of quality in everything that we do. Best to you and your family.
If anything it's a foreign problem, not an American problem. Americans build the brands and companies from overseas buy them out and destroy them for profit. Look at Anheuser-Busch, Remington, Cole Haan, Johnston Murphy, Craftsman Tools, Black and Decker, etc. All of these companies were founded and built on quality, American craftsmanship. Once they were bought out, most by foreign companies in Europe, Canada, or Asia, production moves overseas and quality takes a back seat. The reason you don't see a lot of these issues in Italy, Germany, or Japan is because they are stubborn. Their business is their identity, and they don't trust anyone else to do it. They would rather go out of business doing it right than sell it to someone who might do it wrong. Look at Ford and Ferrari
I inherited some AE leather sneakers this year and also found a pair of black semi brogue oxfords (Lexington) at goodwill which are made in USA... I find them extremely stylish and also they are both in great condition after previous wear
If a person wants a shoe that is of a similar level of quality to a 1920s Allen Edmonds, such as that featured in a previous video, they are looking at paying at least a $1000.
I looked the EGs up. Certainly more or a UK/Euro aesthetic compared to the US Alden’s but I’m not sure I consider them finer. The Alden’s are a bit more blunt looking but my Cordovan Brogue and NST boots are perfection. Again, not as dressy but the craftsmanship and materials are superb. And compared to the AEs of today you can order them on line and know that you’re getting perfection. And my idea of $1000.00 is in Canadian so I may not be apples to apples with you!
This is a really good and objective take on the Allen Edmonds experience. I hope people that are moving from glued shoes to handmade shoes watch this video and take a moment to understand manufacturing tolerances.
I've been purchasing Allen Edmonds for over 20 years and I too love all of my Allen Edmonds shoes, and I own 65 pairs, most of which are AE dress shoes. Some are in calf and some in Cordovan. Whenever I've had to contact AE's Customer Service, they have always been very helpful and professional. Thank you and in fact, I firmly think the AE quality has even improved. They are simply beautiful and elegant shoes. I'm a member of the AE Enthusiasts membership. All the best to Allen Edmonds professionals and fans.
I think they are doing all right. Consumers these days wants to pay less money but want good quality. It’s a give and take. If everyone is spending $500 on a pair of shoes, which will create a market for high quality shoes. But if most people wants to spend less money, most company will try to lower their cost and put their factory in other countries hoping good management will keep the quality in high standard. AE tries hard to have the balance in quality, keeping the factory in US and the overall cost. I say They done a pretty good job.
Not to get long winded, but... It's a matter of quality control to volume. Fifteen years ago, before Mad Men and the whole retro-rat pack-GQ man craze, AE shoes were really unpopular. Basically, they were an old guy fuddy duddy brand. No offense to AE die hards. As the brand has become more relevant and the demand has gone up, the volume has to increase. So its just a statistical reality. The bigger the number, the bigger the margin of error. Let's not forget pricing. AE occupies a really specific place in market that it can't lose. So, it has to maintain its cost-per-shoe at a certain level to keep the price stable.
I love my Allen Edmonds. I have 3 pairs and I haven’t had any issues with any of them yet. You will always have some issues with any brand you buy. No manufacturer is perfect. Thanks Preston
Right now the best pair of dress shoe with competitive customer service is offered by Beckett Simonon. Their products are amazing quality. Unboxing shoes feels like opening up a new iPhone and customer service is amazing. I have gotten 4 pair of boots from them and since day one I have loved every minute with all 4 pairs. I discovered them after I purchased two pairs of shoes from Allen Edmonds website for over 600 bucks. I got the dalton boots and a pair of Chelsea boots. The Chelsea came apart after about a month of use. (not daily) and I got a refund after back and forth. The Dalton have blemishes that AE refused to take responsibility for. I bought them almost 8 months ago and have not worn them once. I was so excited to buy my first pair of AE but the experience was pretty bad. So far Beckett Simonon has filled that void and will keep buying from them.
I am not a shoe expert, however I have been buying business apparel since 1989. I have been wearing Allen Edmond shoes for business my whole career. In all of that time ( 32 years ) I have only two experiences where I needed to return a pair of shoes to them. Once for stitch that unraveled or maybe I snagged it on something and AE took the shoes back without question and sent me a brand new pair. The second time I had a pair of Strands that I sent to be re-crafted, complete sole and cork replacement and I got them back, wore them for 3 months and had tiny bit of delamination on the welt of the right shoe and AE re-crafted them again No Charge and gave me a voucher for a re-craft of any other AE shoe I owned. I have been a loyal customer ever since, I own 10 styles of AE Oxford and Derby shoes and could not be more happy with how AE has treated me as a customer. My favorite pair is a Black Waxed McTavish, look great for dress or casual and one of the most comfortable shoes I own, I'll be buried in them is my guess. I have looked at other brands even going into their stores and I just never got the same reception or feel as I have with AE. I want Value for my hard earned money and that does not mean cheap. I will pay for quality, durability and service, AE has given me that for many years now. Great video and love your channel.
Thanks for another great video Preston. You addressed perceived quality issues fairly. The differences (stitch density, and stitches following the welting grooves) doesn’t matter to me, and the price is so good, and made in the US, I just think they offer a great value for those that like the chunky Americana style. I just got a new pair of Hamiltons and I love them.
I purchased 3 pairs here in Sweden last 3 months (P.A., Strand, Mcallister). Strand: Pure love. Mcallister: Mis-aligned logo on sole, otherwise pure love. Park Avenue: Really butcher’s work...plenty of marks and mistakes on sole and uppers. Hence I think AE at the moment is both high and low in terms of quality.
I just purchased my first pair of Allen Edmonds shoes (Park Avenues), and immediately returned them for having a badly marred welt - it almost looked as though someone had dropped a soldering iron on it. These were on sale, but they were not factory seconds. The return was easy, but it was a disappointing first experience.
Regarding quality control, do you think it's possible that quality problems are not becoming more common, but rather more noticed? Thanks to renewed interest in classic quality menswear and shoes (in large parts thanks to people like you), a lot of people no longer beleive that some brands are quality just because for example their father has always trusted the brand or that it's more expensive than low-level makers, but rather are learning about quality and looking at craftsmanship more carefully to find real value for money. Also, thanks to the internet, word in the menswear community about any problems spreads much quicker thanks to RU-vid and forums like Reddit's malefashionadvice or Styleforum. It is of course just a thought, but what do others think of this?
Hey, Jaak. That’s definitely a possibility and has it’s real word counterpart in phenomena like Autism. Although it’s true autism is on the rise, it may be due to the fact that we are actually diagnosing children with it and recording individual cases more than we did in the past, giving the illusion of a rise in cases. A good extraneous variable I hadn’t considered.
I agree. It almost seems like some guys buy their shoes just to find faults with them and complain. Personally I don’t know enough about the finer details of shoe construction so when each of my two pairs of AE shoes arrived to my eye they were fine and more importantly they fit well. Just speaking for myself the quality has been good.
I think the issue that is overlooked my most ppl who complain is the fact that it’s a person who is making theses shoes. They are under a lot of pressure to turn out high quality shoes....by hand plus the people who are making these shoes aren’t paid a lot. They are probably over stressed as well. Until the manufacturing process completely removes the human element in the shoemaking process you will come across shoes that will fall short of your expectations. As consumers when we spend money on anything we expect and demand perfection and to a degree I get it however you have to re-evaluate this attitude/mental. A lot of the products we consume comes from overseas where the labor and environmental laws are lacking or nonexistent thus third world workers aren’t afforded the same legal protections. They work extremely long shifts for very little pay just so that they can make enough to scrap by or feed their family. A lot of them are migrant workers who are even more vulnerable than the poor works that work in the third country they reside because usually they are hundreds of miles away from their country of origin so they are treated much more harshly by the country they work in. When I was in the USN I was stationed overseas where I met a lot of migrant workers from different countries working in the ship dry docks. I even met maids and housekeepers from other countries. Are any of you aware of the factories that are located between the boarders of the US and Mexico wherein said factories aren’t under the jurisdiction of either countries? Again if you or I are spending are hard earn money on something that is of quality we should expect a certain level of quality. Just remember that when it comes to products that are made in bulk overall quality will go down. I work in manufacturing in the medical device industry and no matter how vigilant and attention to detail you are as you go about the process something will be missed or overlooked, that’s why you have a quality team to overlook the final product before it gets shipped out to the customer. Even then you still have the human factor where things will be missed or overlooked at the QC level. On top of that there is usually a small margin of error wherein things are allowed to be pushed forward usually it’s cosmetic related but never functional related.
I agree with you on all the points made and if I may add, the number of equity buyouts mean that the company has to make more money while reducing costs significantly. This would impact sourcing of raw materials and wages of labour. The value of the dollar has been dropping over time.
It's tough to go through three private equity buyouts/acquisitions. AE was once such a proud brand that made some of the best build U.S. shoes next to Alden. I have probably purchased 20 pair in the last 3 years and have noticed significant quality variation from pair to pair. It seems like the people working the bench in Wisconsin vary in experience and talent. I have sent multiple pair back for exchange due to quality reasons. It's almost as if AE adopted the "we're going to ship it and we'll take it back if the customer complains...knowing that many would not". I still like AE as a brand but I think their shoes are overpriced at full retail. I only buy during sales.
You can't go using statistics and figures that are contrary to bland intuition and what people 'feel'. People have their angers and they want to express them. Go away with your damn truth and reality. Great video.
I love Allen Edmunds. cost is great ,customer service is excellent and their recrafting is phenomenal. Also the one thing you said was the more they manufacture the higher the percentage. That is not true. The higher the production at any percentage means the higher the NUMBER of pairs that are defective. so 3%of 100 is 3. 3% of a thousand is 30. Higher number but not higher percentage. BTW love your videos
I have purchased many pairs of AE shoes and one thing that clearly stands out is that the shoes I bought used which were constructed in the 1990's are without question of superior quality. It is a night and day difference. The leather is much better, the sizing consistent, and the stitching finer and more carefully done. The shoes I have personally seen the most trouble with are Long Branches and Wilberts.
Like most things in life, it comes down to expectations and perception. Unfortunately, in the digital social media era, people's perceptions based on their expectations carry much weight and cause a huge impact. This is not always an accurate portrait of reality. I expect a great quality and strong construction but I do not expect perfection. And I chose not to cause undue harm to a brand because of my personal interactions with a brand. Opinions hold unnecessarily high wait today and I believe we consumers should be more careful, particularly if we care about a brand. Pardon the term paper, Preston. Lol
I think the very second he admitted that there is a basis for all three complaints, then AE are NOT worth the money. Doesnt mean they are a bad shoe. Though he makes a good point on customer service. There are some fantastic shoes and boots out there that have similar issues, but at half the cost. If Im going to invest $400-700 on shoes, they better display good QC and quality. Some wont agree, but Thursday Boot Co shoes and boots are one of the best buys out right now.
For the price point, it is what it is. If you want Italian, Japanese or even English quality that will last your lifetime and your sons lifetime, you pay much more. The satisfaction of owning truly premium , elegant and unique footwear belongs to very few. But so worth it!
I purchased a pair of $480.00 AE shoes in Fall 2018. These were not seconds. The quality control team must have taken the day off when my shoes were made. There were tongue gate issues on both shoes, loose stitches on one sole, crooked stitching on the other sole, carving marks on part of a sole, and crooked stitching on the eyelet area. Customer service was also unimpressive. I also ordered a pair of boots. A month later, I emailed customer service about my order. They informed me the order was cancelled due to not having my size on hand. I mentioned it would have been nice to receive a cancellation notice. There was no response. Yes, customer service is an important part of business. I am not impressed with quality or service. I'll pass on AE. shoes.
Great video Preston! Surgically done and very well presented. I’m impressed, and I agree with you. The parts that came from your visit were especially interesting.
I own 3 pairs of Allen Edmonds, cap toe oxford, randolph loafers, dress boot. All of them were "first" purchased at an Allen Edmonds store, all had defects and quality inspection related issues, all of them. They are comfortable and will take a beating but for the same price or less you can get anything on SALE out of Herring or Shoepassion better finished with no defects. Grantstone makes some nice oxfords too at a good price.
I have about 35 pairs of Allen-Edmonds and haven't noticed that much difference in their quality. I did have a pair of nuback Derby's that the two flaps where the tongue goes under were quite off but other than that I have had no problems with them. As I write, I am polishing my Edward Green Oxford Wing-Tip shoes which are by far the best shoes I have ever owned. Better then my John Lobb shoes even. They also cost, on sale, about a thousand dollars and worth every penny. Most people aren't going to pay that for shoes (unless they are stupid basketball star shoes which to me is stupid). In any case, I will keep buying AE's. I found a placed in Temecula that will Lobb bot tomize my shoe with JR soles and all kind of goodies-once that is done they will look very British without paying a thousand dollars for them!
Hello, I just started watching a few weeks ago. The videos are so relaxing :-) I am trying to get into the shoe polishing myself, but I cannot get mirror shine even with all the tutorials on here... But I have an issue, I tried mirror shine today and it failed and now the tip lost all shine and I cannot restore it even with cleaner and conditioner + cream afterwards. Do you have any idea what could help please? (Maybe there is a buildup of wax?)
I still think AE is an exceptional value and of good quality. True though, there are some deficiencies, but these are not things I was aware of but am now. It seems they are over-priced, but I still like them.
Been wearing since 1995 or so. They really need to bring back the old footbed and create it in such a way it won't get ugly and dirty. At this price point each buyer should be able to pick the sole of their choice.
Does anyone remember the (1970's) Zenith TV brand logo: "The quality goes in; before the name goes on." Today; the price goes up, and the quality goes down. Generally speaking.
Hi @TheElegantOxford I wonder if your opinion on if the Allen Edmonds of today has declined relative to 5 years ago, or 10 years ago, has changed. Essentially trying to see if you have any update to this content 3 years hence. Thank you!
You are spot on on many of the pros and cons. I would like to mention that AE is using a type of leather on some shoes called Techno Horse, but they might be phasing it out. It is full grain calf, but of indeterminate quality since they shellac it with an acrylic lacquer colored coating. It develops creases faster like bookbinder but the absolute worst thing is that NOTHING absorbs into the leather. So you can't condition it, cream polish it, or dye it for patina. Another big complaint I have about it is that AE does not make this known. On models that use the leather, like Greene St and Bond St, you have to look at the color code to make sure it says [color] calfskin or else you get the terrible coated leather with no warning. That said, I still love AE because they make good shoes in EEE and they have wonderful customer service. I've ordered from Carmina and had to jump through hoops for a week to return a pair of shoes that were EEE size and didn't even come close to fitting me. Same for Thursday Boots, they processed the return quickly but it took forever to get the refund. I've never had an issue with AE taking a complaint or giving a prompt return/refund.
Thank you. I guess there are some who will never accept the tiny flaws you mention. Doesn't AE offer 2nds? I wear Allen Edmonds and so does my protagonist in my hardboiled fiction detective murder mysteries. fred berri.
I am quite sure that high stitch density is not found on rubber soled shoes. I compared two pairs of Church’s Consul, one with leather and one with rubber. The leather sole had twice the stitch density as the rubber.
Not only the product but customer service. I was to be a dedicated AE customer until I place a pair sale boots in my basket on AE website. I did not purchase the boots that night because I was looking at sweaters. The next morning the boots in my basket were back to full price. Customer service said they can do nothing about it which I understand but AE will lose out on about 4 pairs of shoes at least which does not include a pair work boots and a pair of wingtip dress boots. I recently changed profession and loved to tell my clients my shoes were AE. I only had 2 of AE which will remain at 2.
I just purchased a pair of black Siena Zip-up Boots that are on sale and am looking forward to receiving and wearing them. I'll let you know how they are.
I did my own test. Buying full priced AEs vs when they have a "sale". Keep in mind this is NOT seconds but a sale like july 4th, fathers day, etc. EVERY sale pair had defects, as if it was a second. The full price were relatively fine. So they are passes seconds off as a "sale". Deceiving as hell and unforgivable. I have probably bought my last pair of AEs. Moving on to young brands like Parkhurst and Cobbler Union.
Honestly speaking, for the same MSRP, TLB Mallorca, J.Fitz, etc offer much better looking and similar/higher quality shoes. I have to say, AE is only worth it on sale.
A balanced, well-informed and thoughtful video. It's interesting for me as I'm based in the UK which means getting Allen Edmonds shoes is more challenging - mainly because of shipping costs. I probably would buy the brand otherwise. That said, there are a wealth of shoe makers in the UK that I could go to for similar quality to AE, namely Loake, Barker and Church's. I have recently bought 2 pairs of Meermin shoes off of Ebay and they are good, level entry Goodyear welted shoes - stiff competition for many established shoe makers.... Thanks Preston, Regards Tony
I have never bought such a quality constructed shoe.i wish they would make a quality $1200.00 shoe. Along with a $2,000.00 quality American shoes. I love American made "quality made shoes. The first time I bought I kept four pairs of shoes. Only because of the high quality in the lower end $400.00 range. I tried seconds, best was to buy all new only.due to the length of time of return on investment. The choice was obvious. Pleas keep the higher quality intact. It is worth paying more for the 10 year investment. If taken good care of before resoling. Them for another 8 years. Rekindling the American re evolution of manufacturing. Is once again to become vogue. Happy 2020 onword.
Allen Edmonds quality declined just as I bought my first pairs. The AE Park Avenue and Strands that I bought both buckled at the ankles. No, my feet are not flat. That’s a trained response from the AE sales team. My heel was also splitting. I returned them and will be moving on to something else. Bye AE!
Preston , I’ve actually watched this video three times and have found it to be very subjective . I am just coming up on one year of purchasing AE shoes and have amassed quite a collection . I have no basis to make an opinion about the subject however I am very very happy with what I’ve seen in the last year . With a larger foot my choices are few compared to many others . Me , I believe in the product and really think the styling is traditional and very up to date . Have I purchased shoes or boots that were not quite perfect , yes I have . Have I gone online and ranted about a perceived issue , NO , nor will I ! Moral of the story is that everyone is entitled to one’s own opinion and should be able to discuss openly . Keep up the outstanding work , I thoroughly enjoy all that you offer our community !
I have six pairs of EA, all purchased within the past three years. I have an oxford, derby toe, chukka boots, loafers, and deck shoes. Some were purchased in store, some on line. Some were seconds, some first quality. All have been good shoes. Also, I've never paid full price. They have sales frequently, so, unless you're in a big rush (which happens), you don't have to pay $400 a pair or more. I understand mistakes are going to be made. That will happen with any product. That said, clearly the vast majority of EA shoes are fine.
I don't have the sample size you do Elegant Oxford, but Allen Edmonds has been my go to shoe brand since around 2004, so around 17 years, and I have over 20 pairs now, maybe 25. Except for a few shoes I have given away or sold, they are all still in service. I have not noticed a huge difference in quality between the shoes I have bought the last couple of years and the shoes I bought 10 years ago. Soles have worn out and had to be replaced. But the leather itself has mostly been good, even on shoes bought in the last 2 years. It may be I am not as particular as some shoe mavens on this site or others, but I can say I see a huge difference still between AE leather uppers and cheaper brands such as Cole Haan, Florsheims, or Bostonians, the latter two brands formerly decent shoes but no longer. The virtue I see is that they make shoes in E through EEE widths which is important for me as I have a wide foot. A lot of brands are a no go for me as they are simply too narrow, or too long. It may be that there are brands like Alden that are better quality, but at what price? I can pick up AE on sale usually for around $200, sometimes under $150. When can you get Aldens for that price? Generally those go for $600 to $700, or more for shell cordovan, and they never go on sale. So, is Alden 3 times as good as Allen Edmonds? I don't know. If Allen Edmonds has a competitor, it is probably brands such as Thursday Boot.
I don’t quite understand the meaning of applying shoe polish at the fold points, because when walking, in these places it will simply crumble. Yes, it's beautiful, but not quite practical in life.
So people actually prefer the paler walnut, huh? Interesting. I'll concede that it's definitely a "truer" walnut color, but I prefer the richer, darker walnut color myself.
I ordered some Landons yesterday ad factory seconds and in carbon Grey as opposed to black, I work in retail menswear and will beat the crap out of these so minor cosmetics I'm not overly concerned with. Especially for 265 shipped to my door. As to the color, I know a RU-vidr who can offer some tips on making them blacker. 😉
Quality can be very expensive these days. Equity buyouts put more pressure on the company to source raw materials and labour from where it is cheapest in the world. They also have to sell more. The declining value of the dollar over time means that people are paying less for the same product. For example, $400 today may be about $200 in real value. The problem is that people expect the quality of the product to remain the same or get better. I have a number of AE products which given the care I give them will last a lifetime.
Bad materials should NEVER make it to the cutting room floor and either AE nor its fans (of which I was one) cannot hide behind that. Great shoes begin with great materials selected carefully and worked expertly. Unfortunately these private equity takeovers have damaged the brand enormously as ALL they are interested in is squeezing the company for profit so they can sell on and benefit. This is clearly the case with 3 buy outs in 15 years!!
AE is one of the FEW shoe companies I can even purchase from...not just dress, SHOES period. I laugh when companies say they make shoes in a variety of widths, Wide, wider and paddle foot...I am a true A/AA width and shoes of any type are hard to come by and usually the most boring model you've ever seen! I will buy AE no matter what, as they make some shoes that fit.
I think the overarching issue is the decline in the quality of US goods per se. Combine this poor quality with the America First rhetoric and you have the perfect storm of reducing quality and reducing markets. I no longer by American goods per se, you can thank Trump for that, and guess what there's a whole new world of quality goods out there.
Excellent review. Very thorough for sure. I have been wearing AE for over 30 years. I own 6 pairs of AE and am a size 13E, which is challenging to find, so feel fortunate I can get them from AE. I have some l some pairs well over 15 years and with good care, they will last another 15. I have noticed a decline in overall quality, particularly since the 1990's and early 2000's, but as you point out, it is in line with other manufacturers. The key here is how long you have been wearing the product. If a long time, you probably have noticed the decline. If wearing a relatively short time, you only know what you know, and perhaps have not seen the decline. I want to wish you and your family a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New year. Keep up the great videos!
hey preston! been following your channel for weeks now. have you ever mirror shine work boots like Red Wing for example? work boots typically has quite the matte finish. Is it even possible to mirror shine work boots?
I wonder if the 4% defect rate includes the shoes where the purchaser notices something wrong but sighs and accepts the defect, rather than contacting AE. If so, the real defect rate could be way higher (even double?). In separate news, I tried on a brand new pair of AEs at the AE store in a posh mall in Northern Virginia and the dainite sole was cut so badly one of the big lugs was half OUTSIDE the welt stitching on the underside.
Informative video delivered in a measured way, thanks Preston! I don't expect "perfection" on things like AEs because God willing, these shoes are effectively leather tools that are designed for durability and not as art projects. In many cases, these "misses" show the level of handcraft necessary in the build, and I like that. Naturally, am not speaking to unreasonable errors or sloppiness, of which there is very little from these makers.
Cowboy boots are another industry of footwear that I have noticed quality declining. Western style boots are 90% of footwear rotation because of ongoing foot pain. A high end pair of western boots are around or a little over the same price as AE. I've noticed bad stitching on the welts or toe design stitching lately. I wouldn't return a pair of Allen edmonds over very minor flaws but it is one of those things you notice when you're wearing them for the entire time you own them and even if people don't notice. Anything over $250 is an investment piece so it does suck when there are quality control issues.
You can slice it and dice it all you want. The bottom line is the quality fell and from when I bought my first pair over 20 years ago it fell dramatically. They are a good "beater" workhorse shoe for city blocks or something. They lost the right to be considered an elite brand with so many other better brands out there. There are so many start ups and even custom shoe companies that are now way better and about same cost. Shop before you buy any AE's. In the end, you won't buy them!
Just an update...got my replacement shoes and they're awesome! Ordered a pair in another color! Still waiting on the refund of the first pair, but love the shoes and AE!
You are correct about the soles. They went from Super prime to prime. The big question is why? If you are pro AE, you might believe that AE went to the prime sole for easier break in and comfort. If you are con AE, you will see it as a pure cost cutting measure. AE sells sneakers. Because it is a growing segment of the market that AE cannot afford to miss to stay viable or are they just trying to offshore all their products. More welt options have been introduced. Is it because AE is secretly converting all shoes to cemented junk or are they giving the customer choice? AE cannot win no matter what they do. Last question, can AE source the best calfskin leather at their scale? No they can't. But they really do a great job of getting workable calf that gives a shoe that presents well. These three arguments that you present, really depends on your perspective when arriving at any conclusion.
I have many (over 20) pairs of AE shoes and boots. I was a devoted fan and customer for many years. In the last two or three years, however, it appears to me that their devotion to quality and customer service has declined. Most recently for example, they reduced the quality of the material used in the shoe bags included with purchase, and provide only one bag instead of two per pair. They didn't even sell quality bags last time I looked. Also, the leather on some of my more recent pairs does not polish-up as well as on my older AEs. In years past, even minor issues were remedied readily by AE with no problem. More recently I have been presented with less understanding/agreeable representatives. I am not privy to AEs internal policies, but I have a theory as to why this may be occurring. In my early days as an AE customer I remember that they rarely had sales on first quality shoes. You could buy seconds at a discount but they had limited numbers and sizes available (of seconds). More recently, I have noticed that even their "first quality" shoes are discounted often, and the number of seconds is much greater. I fear that their devotion to BRANDING as a quality product has suffered due either to leadership, their perception of competition, or aging, or inability to keep, their best employees. A few years ago they raised the price of their first quality shoes for a short time but backed off that price point to return to their previous level. I don't know why but I think it was a mistake. I am of the opinion that once you start running frequent sales promotions and price reductions you reduce respect for your product and lose some of your more discerning customers. You also eliminate your ability to afford the same level of materials and workmanship. My best example of how not to do this is Rolex. Its very difficult to get a discount at your authorized Rolex dealer, and demand for their products is greater, or at least as strong, as for any other watch brand. Just my observations.
Yes, I dont know what they got rid of the red shoe socks (their proper name) for the ersatz white ones. I mean really how much money did they save by doing that?
Allen Edmonds has been going downhill ever since their sale. But they are nowhere near close to the American made classic they used to be. I have two pairs and both pairs had issues with the dye job, spots on the leather and issues with the welt.
I wonder how many "defective" shoes are because they were purchased online. When you go to a store, you can inspect the shoe before you buy it. When you purchase online, you are buying blind.
A leathersmith who works on saddles for me explained cattle are grown quicker today than in the past with steroids in order to get to the market quicker. As result, the leather is not as heavy duty. The cattle did not have time to have thicken its hide up and leather is not as good as in the past.
60-70% Quality, 40-30% Price: It seems, for many people, included, Quality and design go first, without losing that sweet price range spot. AE understands it well....Hopefully...
I love their shoes, but I just returned a pair where the shoe welt was ripped on the right shoe, right out side toward the toe. I would have kept them if it was on the inside, but my wife noticed it and you know how that is.
I love their story, history and designs, but when I buy their shoes online when they have a sale, I've found that what they ship out are almost always seconds or thirds. For this reason I've gotten away from the brand, but might consider looking at them down the road. I'm going to stick to their stores vs. mail order though so I can inspect the shoes before buying.
Freco1967 totally agreed. I was gifted a pair of McAllisters this past Christmas that of course were purchased through a holiday sale. Took me three pairs of returns at my local store before I was happy with the quality. One of them was downright a dud that should have been trashed.
I wouldn’t trust their online process as stories keep coming out that they send out second quality shoes. I would only buy in person during a sale after personal inspection.
Agreed! I am thinking of buying some Bontoni Derbies in Chocolate Black from Wilkes-Barr in SF when they reopen and stylish commented to me on- line that I should order them on- line.ARE YOU CRAZY I felt like telling her as they go for $1300 and for that price I want to spend an hour just touching and feeling it before I even try it on. Order it on-,line what a rock!
