That arcane circle very much feels like Archeage's magic circle but with a cast time in it instead of being instantly cast. Archeages magic circle is just a small like max of 2 player model's size circle on the floor that while standing in it you deal 15% increased magic dmg but lasts longer than 10 seconds. Player's generally don't stack in each others circles unless it's some easy pugable content and a mage doesn't have a point in it, this isn't the guild wars 2 aoe popcorn kinda buff that you thought it was (at 4th minute in video)
When I think of class specific utility spells I think of the earlier days in wow where mages could sell portal service and rogues could sell lock-picking service. That's emergent gameplay that really makes the world feel more alive. And in regards to like class specific buffs I also remember, before going into dungeons I would ask for buffs in Stormwind general chat and generally got people of all different classes providing buffs. That again makes it really feel like an mmo. I miss those sorts of interactions in modern day games, and they are often the ones I look back on and wish they were a thing again.
playing EQ again right now and what i am loving while lvling up is the unique utility and need for each class. There is danger even at lvl 30 leveling up, you NEED crowd control, you NEED to debuff mobs, you NEED certain classes and utilites to make camps and pulls manageable so tanks dont drop instantly and casters dont get run over and healers can keep up. Each role in a group has a utility and a purpose and if they dont do that people die, nothing is homogenous. You cannot just steamroll through content without putting thought into what your group is doing and who is contributing what specific buffs, CC, Debuffs, etc etc To be clear i dont want them to give us EQ, but i would like them to make each class feel unique and important for their own reasons.
@@CestPasFaux-kt9zq it’s not though, for one it’s massively expensive, it’s totally incomplete and probably won’t ever be complete. I am way More interested in the action style combat and open world pvp of ashes. I was a huge aechage player. What I enjoyed about eq was the depth of the character fantasy and the unique utility and function of each roll. Something that I hope they lean a little bit more into here versus the generalizations and almost wholesale feeling of some buffs and debuffs
@@hollinkarelja7564 for 50 box you play 1 week every 6 weeks. It worth it. I even updated to champion. This game is awesome and already a lot of content. Classes are uniques and has their roll.. exactly like Eq A real trinity, with deep gameplay 2 new classes in 2weeks : ranger and summoner for a total of 11 classes playable Look at AOC … 4 classes not even finished rofl Pantheon it is harder and more teamplay than any others MMorpg I played for the last 15 years Action games are bad.. spamming AOE spells with 0 brain , dodge fest.. and it is exactly what is AOC and archeage too. Playing for yourself with 0 sunergy Tell me where is the synergy inAOC gameplay ? Nowhere Zerg AOE spam fest spells and double tap dodge
Utility spells are for a slightly slower game type. You also need to have them be on a level where even though you know it is there to still require that ability. An example is a stuck door that you need a shield equipped and charge the door, a locked door that requires picking, an illusion wall that you need true sight to find the opening, a levitate spell to cross a chasm, a tamed pet to fetch an item out of a hole. Then down different paths you can have multiple branches depending upon group makeup
Not homogenizing buffs just for the sake of requiring more knowledge feels like an L take to me. If, in GW2, a warrior shout giving a damage buff and a guardian symbol giving a damage buff would have different UI, it would literally just increase cognitive load. They are often effectively the same. That's why both just grant the same buff, "Might". It allows you to focus on combat variables that actually matter. "Regen" only being one buffs also makes total sense to me. In WoW, druids had like 5 heal over time effects. But what was the point? Why not just condense that into one icon, where's the difference? Only weird thing to me is they have it stack duration, not intensity. So you can't really load up a meaty heal over time effect.
Yeah i was leveling my first character to max and then i learned about animation cancels and quit eso 😂 might be a skill issue but i feel like Animation cancel should not be in mmorpgs
If they literally copy/pasted Guild Wars 2 combat I wouldn't mind. My only issue with that game was lack of trinity system and catering to casual players.
It would even be better if they copy pasted lost ark combat except in 3rd person. That game bring thr way combat/combos and skill usage to the next level. It's the one thing that is right about the game in the heaping pile of shit p2w. The skills are so meaty and have a ton of interactions. Like some are charge based, some are instant, some are multi press where you have x seconds to use the skill 2 more times before the CD starts. Some you hold to charge, some you hold to charge and release within a window for bonus damage, some are regular casts, some are channel. There is such good variety in the way skills are used and can be combo style. I really think bringing the skills players use to the next level is what new mmos need. If they go the wow route like only instant cast/cast players will be disappointed with combat and that's one of the most important aspects.
Are you joking? Unique buffs are literally the most direct path you can take to a trinity. Standardised buffs is how you get a lack of class identity and clear responsibilities.
With the Arcane Circle I could see a support augment, say it's the Acolyte (mage/cleric) class, that allows anyone to gain the Arcane Might buff as a support skill or perhaps even different stuff such as mana regeneration. A more self-empowering augment might make the circle a buff that you don't need the circle for probably at the cost of being less powerful but you can be more mobile. Another one could be the circle is smaller but gives more power so more damage at the cost of less mobility. Or maybe an augment that makes it more of a permanent aura (since an aura is just an invisible sphere/circle) or that it's mobile and lasts longer so you can empower your allies. At least that's what I could imagine for a the Spellstone (mage/tank) class as a couple possibilities. I think choices like that would make the abilities feel meaningful.
Damage types and derivative spell effects can make for some really fun gameplay. Destiny 2 does this amazingly. Having a Solar Titan creates opportunity for other Warlock or Hunters to proc their Solar effects with either weapons, abilities etc. burning enemies ignite and then eventually immolate and then conflagurate or some bs. Ashes is supposed to have something like this for their CC system. I think it’s in there for damage types too.
maybe the damage could occur as soon as the button was pressed, with the attack animation acting as the 'cooldown' or reset before the next spell could cast, so it is a visual cue that serves a purpose.
Reminded me of the Breeze buff that Bards got in Everquest. They could make some coin from other players who wanted the buff in order to run faster for 15m I think it was. The necro's full invisibility spell was a blast as well, great memories of talking to new players and them having no idea what was going on. =D
About those gw2/eso stats. The gw2 ones is just there for visibility and accessability, like grouping all the regens in one single instance Eso on the other hand its about having unique buffs, you cant have two of the same buffs, contrary to eso
On your commentary on utility abilities/spells, I can see your point. In WoW lockpicking was a thing but then it just wasn't anymore after a while. However, I can see a couple of ways that utility stuff could become implemented in so that it could be good. One is that Scribing and Arcane Engineering could possibly be involved with creating limited use items, such as scrolls with Scribing, that are useful for things like dispelling an illusion or an arcane trap of some kind. That way you don't feel screwed if you don't have a mage but a mage had to be involved in creating the implements you need to use. With mobility stuff for Rogues that's trickier but like you said we haven't seen any kind of demonstration of utility spells so I can't really speculate much. Although, if such utility skills are more tied to factions such as some kind of Thief's Guild faction perhaps that could work instead. With people picking apart content there's only one thing that could work is to have some kind of way to randomize things on each server at the very least. That's not the same as randomly generated content but perhaps a place that was thought to need a mage instead needs a ranger instead or something. I'm just spitballing though. Then again, perhaps some limited randomly generated content would be good. I think something was said about some of the ocean content would have that on the level of randomly spawned treasure/loot and points of underwater interest and such. Now, something like that tower dungeon we've seen clips of gives me Torghast vibes so that could be some kind of shifting labyrinth which we might encounter similar things elsewhere but I'm sure AoC wouldn't make it @$$.
About buff and debuff part, I don't think the situation is that bad and I also think mix 2 type of buff and debuff still possible in my opinion. If you see those buff and debuff as basic buff and debuff then after leveling up it will change horizontally or vertically along the secondary archetype unlocked, for example rogue+rogue poison become deadly poison and rogue+fighter posion might also make enemy bleeds or extend bleed duration. Maybe unique buff and debuff such as the curse example mentioned in video that makes each archetype special are something needs player choose to dedicate invest skill points to its root in skill tree to unlock.
Maybe utility spells/dungeon mechanics should be randomized and varied in difficulty and rewards. Example: you’re running the tower a third time and notice a door that wasn’t there before. The rouge lock picks it, (assuming you have a rouge in your group) and there is a randomized boss battle. It’s a tough battle but if won, gives the group a buff that will help for the rest of the dungeon. Maybe a different time will be an item reward, or the locked door is a hidden magic door, and the boss battle is a platform challenge instead etc..
they need "keyword" buffs and debuffs in order to create synergies with different classes, if every single spell/buff/debuff is bespoke, then it takes away any of those interesting interactions they are going for. Meaning an ice wizard can synergize with an electrical ranger... or something like that....
Reality check: If you can't memorise the 9000 status effects, you can still play the game. You just won't be as good as someone who's memorised them. That's a level of frustration tolerance you're expected to bring to the table in order to play a game with a focus on risk vs reward. Conversely, if they make the game boring in the name of accessbility, players can't work on their self-acceptance and player skill in order to enjoy a boring game more. And you won't realistically need to remember more than like 3 buffs and 5 debuffs per class; likely fewer because of some of them being unpopular, low impact, or impossible for you to do anything about.
From what I am seeing, I personally think that in order the combat to feel more real (for melee class), you should be able to use your skills only when you are in range, not just swingig you shlong while runing. This make it clunky as fuk. Like you are blind man swinging his cane or something trying to find target
while i enjoyed GW2, i leveled to max and when i was max in combat i ended up with this whole list of active buffs and debuffs on my character and i had no idea what was actually going on or how to best create synergy with those buffs and my rotation. And i legit lvled from 1 to max on 2 characters and ended up just confused about what actually did what because there was so much overlap
The theories about the biomes are wild. If you're right about Intrepid hiding that much development to reveal at alpha 2, the hype for the game's progress would absolutely explode. I doubt it. I think developing the nodes just takes very, very long, because of all the seasonal changes and node growth stages, and it'll probably take additional years before it all comes together as fully presentable, playable, adjustable biomes. I don't think Intrepid is lying about making steady progress, just that the kickstarter backers are still in denial about just how much work the node/biome development is.
Guys I know you want it to be great, but its still only in very early stage... Even after the game is going to be fully polished and available, still million updates will happen... My point is that while you are waiting dont forget that Aion Classic is happening atm.. The servers are very populated and the game just feels so good.. PVP, PVE PVPVE everything.. The game is actually P2W which you may think is a no go. I Pay only for the monthly Siels Energy buff which you get for all of your characters which I would say Is a good thing to have, but it costs me 10E/m. Yesterday I reached lvl 55, which is the cap now in 25 days, playing 2-3 hours in average daily solo.. You can actually just speedrun the leveling with the main campain quests and reach cap no time.. if you have a party with at least one more player I think you can have it in a week.. So this game now focuses more on the endgame, where you have just too many activities to do... and I think Aion is one of the games, where the game just feels so good... Maybe it is just me because I play the assassin.. but the combat is very fun.. I can see the progression is not the fastest, but somehow I can enjoy even killing 20 same mobs... I think the combat is really great.. So it is not some advertising for the game, but I think now, while we wait, we have the chance to play on lower game patches, where the game still feels good. And would like to see more people. Which doesnt mean there are not enough right now. If you have some question, I play on EU Atreia server, maybe i can get you some answers. @Narc dont mind my reminder, would be great to see you there too, I think Aion has some really good solution for some of the issues Ashes are facing. Have a good one everybody.
as others might have already mentioned, i you have too many unique buffs then you will get really static raid groups where every party slot is determined by whether or not they have a specific buff or not. overlap will be minimized. also, aint no1 got time to memorize 100s of different buffs that can be changed every other patch. one more thing, personally, I prefer animation based skills duration and not global cooldown, just feels more natural, and having the ability to queue only the next skill + overwrite it if you click some other skill while the current one is still in progress, just like GW2 does
@narc I was just at their website looking at the shop, and you can't buy access to alpha 2 like you could a few months ago, will this be available again? i was planning on buying it closer to alpha 2 release..
No it won't be, sadly that was the cut off for Alpha 2. Your next entry point, will be open beta, probably in 6-12 months. Depending on the Alpha 2 tests, and feedback. Open beta will play on the same server as the alpha 2 with the server eventually becoming the PTS server when the game is launched.
@@brad6637 Are you saying beta 1 will be in 6-12 months? That is crazy. The duration of alpha 2 will probably be way longer than 12 months, since they will continusly release content over time. Expecting the beta within a year is just not a reasonable expectation. We really have nothing to go on to guess when beta 1 will arrive, but since they have like a few classes and more than half of the biomes missing from the launch of alpha 1, it might take 3+ years before beta 1. Just think about the time between alpha 1 and alpha 2, thats about 2 years, and I believe they have said that alpha 2 will be the longest development period of all the stages.
I just really hope the game has unique spells and tools that are unique for all archetypes. A few utility spells for that would be pretty cool as well. But most importantly, having unique stuff in your kit for combat. I really hate rpg games where all classes have the potential to do everything, it just ruins the fantasy
the combat inspired by archeage has me copeful. fireball ect get reduced cooldown after backflip animationfor example. I really dont mind animation canceling as long as its not for EVERY skill you are casting. if you can cancel the occasional thunderbolt in to snare I dont care. What WILL be cancer is if EVERYTHING is on global cooldown. that shit feels terrible
@narc hey narc loving the content for a game that doesn't exist. could I get your opinion on some of the spells and key presses and my idea for bringing it to the next level? Did you ever try lost ark? If not, I really have to say one thing that game does right on its heaping pile of p2w was the way keypresses and skills interact. They had unique key presses where you would hold the press and release it in a window for extra damage. Or just straight hold to charge, and the longer you hold, the more damage. They had non charge based multi press. When you hit the skill, you have like 6 seconds to use it 2 more times, then the CD starts. I wish this had been brouught up to the devs because right now it seems very basic as far as skills go. Like wow, for example, it's only instant cast/cast. And while this works, it's not very interactive for the players where lost ark its almost like you are playing a fighting game with combos you can pull off. If they went this route, they could even add it into the talents, so it's more optional for bonus damage if players want that or skip it to keep it more simple. I would love to hear your thoughts on this as no other mmo has fully taken advantage of dynamic skills like lost ark.
honestly the one thing i dislike about wow is the amount of add ons you need to play wow. if the devs banned the add ons and put them into the game like ff xiv; than it would be much better.
they will move A2 to december, u will see. And it will only be the Riverlands. They have 200 devs and the development speed is soo low. I only see dev speed of 5 people here.
I'm fine with animation cancelling actually, coming all the way from counter strike weapon swaps, to BDO stuff, it's quite fun to learn and get a hold of. While not necessary, it would reduce the skill ceiling of course and make combat less mechanical, but in the end it doesn't really matter.
I think some of these are unintended things that were embraced and not changed. I'm a counter strike player since 1.6. it also happeneds in alot of games like StarCraft muta micro (stacking the mutas), an unintentional quirk, the cool thing about that was there was a spell called irradiate that was meant for clumped units and it is a hard counter. So there is these little Meta things that happened around bugs. It all depends on the game engine. ESO might have a wider embrace if the combat wasn't dog shit. Guild wars 1 had armor swapping before you couldn't do that. And now it's just staff to shield swapping . Let alone GW2 nuance.
@@thebigbucktheory5488 I only played BDO which had cancelling (I mained shai, so the buff rotation is a very good example for this) And yes, muta stacking is a really cool "bug" :P Albeit, all air units stack into each other, mutas just happen to be small enough for it to really show an effect.
He's completely right about the standardized buffs/debuffs. It's bad in GW2 and it's gonna be bad in AoC too. "Oh, we don't have any sources of swiftness and too many sources of might" is such a dumbass problem to have created.
Agreed, it was awful in GW2. I'd rather see buffs that are exclusive to specific class types for ex. Armor debuff skills on Fighter/Rogue and chilled/burning for Mage. This also creates synergies between classes with the same damage types.
Even though I love a lot about GW2 I totally agree, the boon ball meta absolutely sucks in instanced content and WvW, the meta is to prov8de enough boons so that everyone can just stack and ignore most mechanics, sure it gets a little more complicated in end-game but if people could steamroll all content by boon stacking they absolutely would and that is Soooo BORING! If there were two things I hope Ashes doesn't take from GW2 it would be boon stacking and dailies, please for the love of god don't punish us with timegates if we can't log in for a day or two. When did MMOs become a second job instead of a hobby?
me personally, I really like half swing animation cancelling. I feel that it speeds up the pace of combat, which I like a lot. My favorite mmo is BnS, which has this system for some classes, not all, and it makes the combat feel more fluid. classes like earth destroyer or wind kung fu master utilize it well and makes it so the combat feel smooth for them. Some classes like storm astromancer (the main class i play) dont have the animation canceling as it goes through the animations quickly. I'm not a big fan of GCD combat as it feels like it really slows the combat down, making the combat feel more clunky for me personally.
lets pray we dont have the shitty buff system of gw2 where everyone has to stack up. especially for ranged classes this feels incredably clunky. much rather have your typical class buffs like wow does it plus some aditional party wide buffs from classes which you can stack like ff xiv does it. debuffs i think is a good thing when bleeding, burning or the like can come from different sources as long as it all stacks. especially when thinking about cleansing debuffs it wouldnt make much sense in big aoe battles when everyone has their own unique debuff and you have to clean all of them.
I love world of warcraft to death. I will play it until I or it dies , thats for sure. But one can only do so much in a week in wow before you hit a ceiling of content so...really REALLY hoping AoC can be that void filler and give me something to sink time into. Because CS2 is full of cheaters and basically unplayable (unless you play faceit / esea which is dogshite to do), and thats my only other main game.
ESO is my favorite MMO-Period. Does GW2 do underwater better, mapping better, and controls better(mouse/keyboard-definitely. However, I own both and play ESO far more often( i play pc with a controller mainly.
@@ElderSign32 it's not reasonable thing to ask cause it's alpha you go here to raport bugs and give feedback and not to play and enjoy it, it's not finished product Jesus you all addicted people are insane
bruh, some absolutely dogshit takes here on buffs and debuffs, only one source for 'burning'? guess we only get 1 fire spell in the whole game, no burning weapons, hell, better remove campfires and torches.
Some of your takes I disagree with this time chief. (this is a long post so it's under a "see more "tag) . . . . . . . . . . perhaps its because I love gw2 but it is what it is. Bias because fun but it definitely has issues lol. Firstly GW2 combat is the most fun in a PvX setting out there, tried lots of other shit and it loses to games like BDO in PvP and maybe WoW if you like GCD (I don't at all personally) for PvE but PvX, its right up there as a top 3, IN MY OPINION. As for it's buffing system, you're right in the homogenising state of GW2 but I'll also correct you on GW2 also - October 23, 2015 GW2 launched it's first Expansion, Heart of Thorns and within came it's first raid. On launch we had many more unique buffs among the classes compared to now and the result was the 10 man squads, 6 slots were filled by 3 specialisations (sub--classes for other games) - there was 0 flexibility from this for a LONG time. at the time there were 16 specialisations. The 'give unique buffs to classes' resulted in more than 75% of the playable classes, quite literally, NEVER being accepted into raid groups due to viability issues. that sucks even for the hardcore raiders. not being able to play other classes at all, feels like shit. now let's expand the context out of GW2's raids into GW2's player base - they're casuals and GW2 is a very casual game. The structure of buffing/class balance, as well as an array of other things I'm sure, left raids near untouched by a massive portion of the player base (data we had released from a 3rd party utility site that tracked how many players had at least 1 'kill proof' item for any raid boss) That's why GW2 has gone to the extremes of making EVERY buff generic - almost... kek -- next up, your issue of Gw2 not having supports is just wrong lol take the Regen buff for example, it takes priority from players with highest 'Healing Power' a stat that, who'd have guessed' increases healing output. GW2's supports are actually really damn fun but the nature of GW2's system can be quite spammy, as you're right in saying its about having all boon up for an entire encounter - personally I love Gw2's system but at the same time having reasons to take X over Y in certain encounters makes things more interesting I'd like to see they take GW2's system as a core, and expand on it to have a set list of buffs that are like 'baselines' and then classes bringing their own unique flavours ontop of those GW2 has minor examples of these like the Thief class' venom skills which empower allies attacks and are unique entirely to the thief and it's specialisations (again, subclasses) Let's contextualise that to Arcane Might, why would you want arcane might in a fight that favours melee, physical damage classes, instead you could take another class or another mage/X spec to get a different buff that empowers physical might, we'll call that skill 'All Natural Instagram Influencer' for fun. mix the two but create non-mandatory niches, thats the solution so is doing copious amounts of testosterone and posting selfies on Instagram.
Pretty much just plays like WoW at the moment. Not a good thing for a modern MMO. Definitely playable but the combat is not something that excites me about this game so far.
I'm confident they'll keep improving but it's improvements on a ancient combat style direction. I loved 2000s MMO's but I'd love to see something modern, something people under the age of 30 will enjoy.
@@blakedies I see your point 100% but I think a lot of mmos will keep using this kinda combat cos it works so I think if they can bring unique things to it and make it good and I agree make it more exciting which hopefully they will do before full release it should be good. They’re already doing a lot of new things with other aspects of the game and I suppose it’s hard to complete something completely new nowadays, like Narc said as long as it’s good and feel good and with their cool new systems they’ve designed I’ll be happy.
@@weirdoproductions6714 It feels like they're deciding to appeal to core audience from these older games rather than making something "next-gen" (I'm sure for example the Riot MMO will not be using this blueprint). Although I wish they went a bit of a more modern direction I do agree with you. I don't mind if the combat feels dated if I'm in the middle of a huge castle siege or world boss. These systems will make it meaningful regardless.
Animation canceling looks terrible and is a symptom of poor game design. Even ESO devs admitted it wasn't intended. They were just lazy (or stupid) to be able to fix it.
@@rext3404 weird. never knew animation canceling was a "symptom of poor game design" for all games. i just prefer skill. the more skillful a game is the more interesting i am. what an amazing game flaw
i dont understand this game uses the latest game engine and they have access to the latest gaming technology but why they character model character movement and skill animation is look ugly i dont understand i hope they improve it before the release
