I realized fashion for women is a scam when I wear the same damn ting 3 times out of the week and get the responses as my gyal who wears a different outfit almost every other day
@@val_valentine003 Yeah, I don't get it either. What do you even do? wear the outfit once and never wear it.... Again? People actually think that wearing a piece of clothing more than once is... dirty or something?
i feel like men are called fashionable when they just wear all baggy things and look young and relaxed this way bc the more "classic and basic" look for men is rather tight fitting shirts and almost tight pants, like very straight and simple silhouette so the bagginess is fresh. but it's probably also about how they carry themselves
the classic and basic look is baggy/relaxed lmao. skinny clothes aren’t considered classic, just look at james dean and marlon brando back in the day buddy
I think a good example would be the “who wore it better? “ headline. Women can wear the same dresses years apart, have completely different body types and have never met, yet they’ll still be compared. Then men all wear the same copy past suit to the same event and yet no one says a thing
ugh i hate the “who wore it better” like just let these women be lmao they don’t need the constant comparison to other women just because they have spotlight
I've worn the same 2 jeans and 2 of my favorite sweaters and one dress for months and no one cared and I still got 3 confessions during 3 months. Normal people don't actually care unless you're some extremely popular celebrity or something. And the people that do care are usually other girls.
@@plzleavemealone9660 this is what I’m saying. I wear the same shit everyday and nobody cares. I’ve worn the same dress to three different occasions, and have gotten many compliments on the dress. Normal people just do not care and if they do they are mostly women saying something.
A man can’t care about this stuff without being labeled “gay” and that sucks. I’m a straight dude and I hate how boring men’s fashion is. But as soon as I start thinking outside the box when it comes to underwear, clothes and formalwear, suddenly my sexual orientation is in question? That’s bullshit.
Honestly I don't care anymore, If I'm gay, I'm gay ig, I don't have a problem with that. I like to say if you have a problem with the way I want to dress then you're not the kind of person I want to be around, that's what makes me happy, so F it, y'know
except you CAN care. challenge the norms. men’s fashion is boring but when men express themselves through fashion more, it will change. challenge toxic masculinity.
You know it's crazy, as a guy, I've actually had the same thought, but from the opposite perspective. I'd think to myself "women have so many options and ways to express themselves with fashion. If I was going to a formal event, my options are pretty much just a suit and tie." But I never realized that from women's perspective, that would be a bad thing. And now that you point it out, I do realize that I would probably be overwhelmed having to live up to such high fashion standards too.
It's loose loose, men have less socially acceptable options and can't fully express themselves. Women have too much socially acceptable options where the standards are too high. Goddammit it, wish we could just all share.
this is why i wore a suit to my recital lol i wanted to cross dress but i didn’t have a mens cut suit 🥲 and thank you so much for understanding, it truly helps us a lot
yes absolutely yes, I hate that men formal attire is so limited. I'm not sure what I would want it to be because I don't also want to be wearing a dress but it's so boring!
It can be both! Sometimes I revel in the amount of choices I have to express myself, and feel bad when I look in the men’s shoe section and find the same slacks repeated over in over again in different shades of brown. But when I just want to live my life and not care about what I’m wearing (especially during formal or semi-formal events) it’s quite stressful. It’s a double edged sword so to speak.
Something I've thought about recently is that male fashion standards may be so low partially because there aren't as many options in male fashion. If you go into an H&M for example, only about a quarter of the store is male clothes. This could also be related to how often men shop compared to women, but then this becomes a chicken-and-the-egg thing. Do men shop less because of less options, or are there less options cause men shop less? Same goes for fashion standards as well. Do men shop less because of lower standards, or have lower standards because they shop less? And so on. The other thing I find pretty interesting is the correlation between masculine female clothing in relation to feminism. I wonder if the increase in feminine male clothing is related to how men are starting to divert from toxic masculine standards. Anyway, just found that interesting. Great video!
I don’t think that there are less options for men to shop. There are just waaay more options for women bc women fashion became a huge industry thus leading us to buy more and more often. I don’t think there was always such a huge difference in shopping options for men and women. It just changed for women and has not yet changed for men.
@@Mondscheinelfe is not that it changed for woman, the modern fashion industry was created around woman as their target demographic. So it makes a lot of sense that the womens fashion evolved overtime a lot faster than mens fashion is evolving. All the point of shopping malls, high street stores, department stores, etc. was to induce woman to consume, because at the time the people who had the available income and time to spend it was middle class housewifes, so the market developed all those things to them. At the end of the day its all patriarchy.
Men's clothes are better quality than women's quality, that's reflected on the tag. But there's almost no diversity in cuts, fits, lengths, colors and textures
@@lastmanstanding7155 Yeah, I don't get what they are trying say. For me as long as the clothes aren't visually dirty looking (like all muddy), I don't give a fuck what people say.
@@user-fo9lw3pq8l thats not the goal tho. if he feels comfy and feels good looking, it works. his goal isn't to become the next up and running model. Plus not all of us are loaded in money
In all seriousness I think that 99% of general fashion is just how attractive you are and how well your clothes fit. I’ve seen extremely pretty girls pull off literally anything; they can shave their hair and wear a seemingly random set of clothes and still look fantastic. I think when you see these ‘amazing fits’ for men, you’ve just seen above average attractive men wearing these outfits, and what you’ve really been ‘blown away’ by was just the fact that they’re attractive. The fits are pretty objectively basic as fuck; I don’t know a single man who doesn’t wear clothes like those you mentioned.
This is what most people overlook! it’s always the most attractive boys that go viral and then girls think any guy can just wear a t shirt and jeans and be a fashion icon. That’s not how it works.
fr its not "easy for a man to be attractive" because what makes men is attractive is genetic. Height, bone structure, facial aesthetics. No one is dating the 5'6 guy cuz he wears a nice polo shirt and knows colour theory in fashion.
@@leftenantthunder Wow, I’m so thankful people see this the same way I do. I find this fashion debate so funny. Have you ever heard someone say “you would look good wearing anything, even a trash bag”. Well that statement holds true, attractive people in trash bags are still more appealing than ugly people in “fashionable” clothes.
@@boass the buzzcut is a great example of this. Its a hairstyle heralded as timeless and suitable for anyone but have you ever seen a guy whos not sterotypically masculine rock one? They look like a heroine addict 😂😂
To give you reference to how rigid male fashion is, I was given the "damn you're dressing kind of gay" look by relatives for *tucking a shirt in*. Masculinity is VERY rigid
@@tadeo517 My friend said chuffed pants looks "gay" the other day and theres me stood next to him with chuffed pants XD looks like im gay hahah. NGL though growing up in rural areas sucks a fat one. everyone looks the same and if you try something different you get ripped a new one for it
in my opinion, body types really do play a big part to make an outfit look good, so an outfit may look good on women but may not look on men and vice versa
Yes! I wish it wasn't this way but the because the silhouette is an important aspect of the outfit/aesthetic, it doesn't always translate across different body types. Which definitely alters how we perceive the outfit on a person.
Men's clothes are designed to highlight our masculine biology. While women's clothes are designed to highlight their feminine biology. That's why a man, no matter how pretty and skinny he is, will always look ridiculous on a dress, a skirt, or a tight t-shirt, even baggy clothes look ridiculous on us, guys. However, when it comes to baggy clothes, the average girl can pull it out, and still look cute. "Cute" is not a thing when it comes to men, at least not the same way as with women
@@scarletdragon1019i actually think men wearing dresses looks "stupid" to most people because of prejudices. most people aren't used to seeing males dressing that kind of clothing in their everyday life and/or have that masculinity complex. im pretty sure if all men started going out in dresses it would become just as normal as a girl wearing a skirt. people used to get weirded out by women wearing pants too so
For men, I've seen that it's seen as bad to try experiment, like people will call dudes wearing nail polish gay. Or if a man wears something that's too "out there" then it's seen as bad. Homogeneity is something that males are almost forced into. If you wear something different you get clowned on. Even something that isn't significantly bold, like boot cut jeans. Men will get flamed for it. It's quite interesting to see how it's the complete opposite for women (where it's frowned upon to be the same, yet for men it's frowned upon to be different).
@Allan Grundy ii it's just nail polish, you wouldn't say that to a woman because it's seen as something feminine. They just want to look nice like every other person
@@googlekopfkind there's 2 possibilities in this. You're either incredibly masculine and your masculine traits "cancel out" the femininity of your choices. Or your lucky and friends and society just like you a lot.
As a guy who likes to go with more of a workwear/skate, or a mix of that with athleisure, type of aesthetic, I legit love when I see a woman wearing the same time of thing. Also, all of those outfits look great on you, especially the first one with those jeans
Yeah idk what she's on about, women wear this all the time. Its called Grunge fashion and its super popular with skater girls, metal heads, tomboys etc.
I’d argue that maybe some of these men are just confident. Maybe it’s not even the outfits that they are wearing that we like, maybe it’s just that they seems to be really comfortable in their own skin. Obviously some of the fashions boys are killing it i.e wisdom and Tyler the creator but others are just confident conventionally attractive men.
Most often, especially on a picture, people don’t really mean confidence when they say that someone looks confident. They often just associate certain masculine facial features with confidence and thus call it that. So I guess what I’m trying to say is, that the confidence you talk about is in its essence just the conventional attractiveness you talk about.
It's the body's frame. Certain cuts/ styles of clothing just look better on certain body frames. I used to wonder about this a lot as a teen and get frustrated when clothes I've seen on other people don't look that great on me. Grew up a tomboy (kinda still am) and I liked a lot of baggy tops and pants BUT, I am chesty. (My lower body though looks more athletic/ boyish) )So when I wore baggy clothes they just didn't look as great on me as they did on my siblings that had much smaller boobs. Instead, my mom (who is in fashion retail) suggested I only do baggy pants and fitted tops and my outfits started looking a whole lot better. There are tops that look amazing on me and basic on my siblings and vice versa. That's what's going on here. Also, the men she showed have similar bodies. I bet some other men wouldn't look as good in those same outfits.
This is exactly what I was thinking. I don’t think it has much to do with gender as it does the body frame and how attractive the person is to the viewer. You said it better tho :)
I had the same experience trying to find what works for me, I love baggy comfy clothes but I was cursed with boobs that make me hate the way I look in pretty much any top that doesn't hug my figure.
i love baggy clothes but i struggle with my lower half. im grateful that i have smaller boobs (but even then i bind because i'm enby and get dysphoria still) but i dislike how feminine my hips are, would much rather want an athletic build on the bottom like boys in these pics have 😖
the idea that an outfit is good only if it suits everybody is a weak point to make. The body who wears it is crucial to the perception that we have, i understand that it's unfair, but that is kinda how it works. the size of the body, the personality, even facial features play a roll in this, take for example Saint Laurent's male models all of them have androgynous features (skinny legs, a mix of masculine and femine facial features) because it complements the style that adresses feminity on a man's body, if a hyper masculine man like Henry Cavill wore an SLP outfit it would look very off, while timothee Chalamet would look amazing. it doesn't mean that SLP is bad fashion is just mean that the wearer's body is very important for the look
I think the problem comes in when we put one type above another. I'm big on body types and finding out when best enhances people's natural beauty, which is different for everyone, but I understand why some people want to reject that approach because media pushes the hourglass body type to the forefront and pretends it's the "correct" shape for a woman to be. I love very baggy androgynous looks on other people (usually tall, slender, with a straight frame) but as as a short curvy girl I absolutely hate the way that style actually looks on me, because it doesn't suit my natural body type. I definitely don't think these kinds of videos would be as prominent if there was more equal representation in the fashion industry.
this is why i think the topic of "is it an outfit or they are just..." gets really stupid most of the time. Some clothes don't fit me as well as a curvy women, the same with them, some clothes don't fit them as well as it fits to someone without curves. If i chose an outfit it's not only because other people use it it's because i like it and i know it fits me, or i simply make them fit me changing things
I would also say an element of "is it a fit or is HE just skinny" plays into this, oversized looks look the best hanging off of a smaller (though still tall) frame, whereas for bigger builds, muscled builds or even just average/dad bod builds, it can be very tempting to fall into dressing super rigid and boring bc that's the shit that fits well, whereas anything that's more interesting tends to require that smaller frame to pull it off well. The silhouette of a fashionable man on social tends to rely on him being skinny/fit without a lot of bulk from fat or muscle. Personally this is why myself and a lot of other men gravitate towards workwear and skate/punk types of fashion, carhartt jackets look great on bigger guys, straight cut jeans as opposed to super baggy, slightly oversized or just normally fitting shirts, stuff that actually plays into and accentuates the fact you're a guy with a bigger body. I know I struggled for a long time around 16-22, growing out of my skinny teenager body into a bigger more muscled frame, because I just felt like the fattest piece of shit for no longer being able to pull off the skinny oversized look, and I feel a lot of guys have the same reaction. Just my two cents on this, though I completely agree with all the other points you make, mens fashion definitely suffers from a lack of expectation + rigid masculinity and doesn't have nearly the same pressure as women's fashion
Obviously fashion is subjective but ive never vibed with the oversized look. The whole point of clothing is to enhance visually and or be functional. Baggy iversized seems counter intuitive for both.
i think part of the reason stuff like carhartt looks better on larger guys is because of the social element where our brains know this is work wear and them being a bigger guy gives you the impression that even if they are a bit pudgy they've probably got muscle under it from working some kind of manual labour. all but one of the actually strong people i knew growing up were not slimmer gym type guys but what is now called dad bod so i think that combines with my existing conceptions about people who wear carhartts. i was never trying to go for oversized but i know what you mean because i started as a 110lb twig and passively gained about half that as i grew out of my teenage years.
@@EPWillard Yeah definitely! There's a level of confidence when you're a bigger guy wearing work wear because it DOES feel like it was made to fit you because it actually WAS. Designs like the Detroit Jacket were made in an era when the fashionable look for a man was tall and buff, not skinny and lean, so it really does compliment that larger frame and the confidence boost is massive from that alone. Also I completely agree about the muscle-manual labour point, the fact it's WORK wear adds to the overall look and confidence for the person wearing it, because it's ideally meant to be on a bigger body in the first place, and it shape and design lets everybody know about it. As much as people shit on work wear becoming too trendy, it's one of the few styles still being produced in this era that still have that old, much larger silohuette, so of course it was an instant hit among bigger guys struggling to squeeze in to a tiny shirt-baggy jeans combo.
Here is an off the cuff, stream of consciousness thought. I think that part of the effect of men being fashion king status is more body language than anything else. You could definitely pull off some of the looks you wore. The problem is right out of the gate, you had doubt about what you were wearing and your body language was very different. A lot of guys are super relaxed or assume powerful or confident body language no matter what they are wearing. The same can be said of fashion models striking a pose when being photographed. I have seen plenty of bold fashion choices amongst my wide array of friends. The ones that stand out are always the people that look like they are confident or relaxed within the clothes they wear not because of the clothes. Also as a man who is more ornamental in his fashion, I get a lot of compliments on the way I look or am dressed even when I think I am being "casual." Sometimes this comes from people I would scale way higher on both fashion and physical attractiveness. I know that to be because I am so over confident in myself and how I present myself. All this being said, I think a lot of it is just as you said, more about the perception of how a man is expected to present himself versus the expectations of what we reserve for women. Side bar, I love androgynous looks on everyone! Sorry for the mini ramble. Great video as usual.
confidence and attitude definitely affect how we perceive a person, but i wonder if that has more to do with how attractive we view a person to be rather than how fashionable they are. attractiveness and having a sense of fashion can definitely be hard to separate from one another, and i'm sure being fashionable influences your level of perceived attractiveness, but should attractiveness legitimately factor into how fashionable someone is?
@@ashenlion805 Yeah for real, a ugly man who wears the same clothes as the examples wouldnt be considered fashionable either. Plus as a guy I found the girl in the "rigidness of masculinity" section actually more fashionable but maybe that's purely cause i found her more attractive. Also the outfits that oliSUNvia wore were very fashionable for the casual setting especially if she wore the with confidence, However I dont see a guy (or girl) wearing that stuff in a award ceremony or gala
@@anubis8791 it’s not just about the occasion, I never seen any guy use the same about of styling with the help of jewellery or layering as I have seen in women.
Yes I agree but i believe that actually is the opposite and more prominent problem compared to what the video discusses. The video tries to say that women can't wear masculine or simplistic fashion and be seen as fashionable. However, there are many suits made for women that ae worn by fashionably business women. There are no dresses made for men and they are never considered fashionable wearing them (other then Tom Holland performing Umbrella). In the same vein men are considered unfashionable with a lot of jewelry and makeup (to a lesser extent.) Women can wear both feminine and masculine clothing, many do, and be considered fashionable (for example Zendaya in her suits/casual clothing) but men really don't have both options.
I think the better question is "is it an outfit or is he just tall?" We have all pinned an image of a skinny girl wearing jeans and a white t-shirt. I don't see how it's different. I don't disagree with the premise that women need to try harder to achieve the bare minimum, but it's only easy to be fashionable if you're a ((tall, skinny)) dude.
@Judging Budgie I’m a relatively short girl (5’3”-4”) and I love dressing like a lot of the guys in this video haha. My staple is an oversized tshirts and straight cut wide pants and sneakers. Maybe it’s just my style but I was watering at the mouth for every outfit she wore in this video haha. If you’re looking for advice, I would say try and find shirts that are just long enough that your silhouette is 50% shirt on top and 50% pants on the bottom. Or if you like tucking things in, 1/3 is shirt on top and 2/3 is pants on the bottom, Also, I’ve found that wider cut pants work better but that’s just my taste. Platform sneakers are super cool and can add an extra inch. Try and match colors well, and while it sucks to hear, a big part of making these outfits work is confidence. Stand tall, shoulders back, hands in pockets, basically fake it til you make it. Try not to care too much about what others think, I promise you look dope!
@@handitover. also a very short person here (155cm, I think that's around 5"?), thanks a lot for the tips!! if you have any more I'd totally love to read more haha
Woman don't actually have to. Most people (besides maybe some other girls) don't care. Unless you're a celebrity that made herself known as someone ''fashionable'' literary no one cares. I went through school for 3 months in the winter wearing two pairs of jeans, a dress and 4 big a-s confy sweaters repeatedly (my favorite sweater twice a week or sometimes three times even). I was only wearing a bit of foundation nothing else. My hair just washed, that's it. 3 guys that I talked to a few times confessed their feelings to me during that time and no one ever even seemed to notice or care what I was wearing. Because guess what? No one cares. The only time a guy pointed it out was when I found a cute hair tye in my room and decided to wear it and he said, well, that's cute. I think a lot of people don't realize that most people don't care that much. A study showed that most people look at themselves in zoom calls for example. No one looks at things in detail as much as you believe.
@@plzleavemealone9660 I think that's a good point. When I was in school, the realization that nobody cared about how I looked was freeing. BUT, school doesn't represent the whole world. In a professional setting if I forget eyeliner there's a good chance my coworkers will comment. I was thinking about this when I said women are often expected to put more effort into their appearance.
@@spigney4623 But would you have gotten that comment if you never wore eyeliner before. If someone suddenly decided to get coffee instead of warm milk with honey, people would comment as well. And while I do think people shouldn't have to wear a uniform to work when they are just gonna sit on their seat for 8 hours anyways. However if a men came into work without his tie tied properly or his hair done he might even lose his job just like woman.
As a straight man, i realized how rigid mens fashion really was when I went to a concert with a fishnet shirt topped with a button up shirt (unbuttoned to show the shirt). To me, I was trying something new that I don’t really see with other guys. I had a gay friend with me at the time who was a fashion major and he said it looked great on me. My other friend who was straight started thinking i was gay. I do believe fashion trends will change the norms in the future and I am simply just waiting for that hoping that men’s fashion can improve. I would also like to say something that I have heard from a friend that men look better when they layer their clothes and women look better when they show more skin.
I've started layering my clothing a lot more recently and I definitely agree that it looks infinitely better, but it's gonna suck when it gets hot out, lol.
As a man who’s into fashion, I’ve always seen it as the complete opposite. A situation of men having less variety of clothing options/styles while women seem to have all the freedom to dress however while having so many options of changing things up. I’ve even spoken to friends on this and yeah, other men who want to try new fits feel stuck due to the low amount of options in menswear. Ig this video was eye opening mostly due to seeing the other side of the argument. Though I do disagree, I feel like women can usually wear any outfit and still look desirable, while men have to go away from norms to seem even slightly good looking. Even in the examples u gave in this vid, trying on the outfits men wear yourself, I feel like that still looked fashionable. But idk
I think that these strict gender roles and ideas make it worse for everyone. Men have less things they can “acceptably” wear but they are considered fashionable for a large number of those things. Women can acceptably wear a wider range of clothes but a lower percentage of those clothes are considered fashionable. It’s a loose-loose situation.
Completely agree with you, had to stop the vid and look in comments to see if it was shared opinion ^^ Should be interesting to see, in term of prices even, how expensive are men clothing to get a bit away of the norm. As someone that likes to style a bit differently (not hypebeast stuff), I still do have had to spend 150-200 bucks for the "out of norm" clothes that I have. Everything else will be "an alternative to a classic" and often the tweak would be either made of lack of taste either not special enough. And imo, these basic outfits on a girl, look cute and fashionable, while on men it's seen and reseen, seems like the names says, pretty basic
This entire debate also started with the rise of kpop where the male kpop idols actually have good fashion sense but many are "basic" too yet the kpop fans will praise that outfit no matter what its more about the person I feel than the actual outfit
@@Taylorc0de Fashion is subjective. If u like someone's style u have that right. Perhaps, J-hope's style tho nice on him isn't everyone's style preference. But... there r still lots of ppl who like his looks too. V has a bigger fan base thus, u will see more compliments of his style. I saw a fashion student react to their outfits and whilst she thought J-hope may be the most technically fashionable, she resonated better w/ the style of Tae as it's acc closer to her style. Also, being extra/experimental isn't the only thing allowed to be fashionable, simplicity + "basic" looks r the foundation of fashion. The main point of fashion is wearing clothes that suit the individual + fit their proportions. Ppl r allowed to have simple styles or not, one isn't acc better than the other. V is definitely an attractive guy (so yeah ppl will think he looks gd in a lot of things) however, he still dresses in a way that works for HIM. Dressing like J-hope wouldn't work... cause he isn't J-hope. So, if ppl think V or JK look fashionable, y not? The clothes suit their style and proportions and they wear them confidently. ( Im not biased towards V or JK btw.)
Who are u to say men don’t dress ‘fashionably’ because of ‘fragile masculinity’? Ima reveal somethin crazy to u, 80+% of men literally don’t care about fashion like women do (duh) and that’s why we don’t dress crazy. We have no reason, but most of all no desire, to do so. Y’all set ur own standards for how men should dress and then complain when they do/don’t dress that way (like tf)
and btw literally nothing wrong with norms of clothing tied to gender. What is odd will continue to be odd no matter how progressive u want to think lol.
This was such a great video! I don’t feel aesthetic attraction to men, but I still found myself viewing the men’s outfits ‘better’ than women wearing the exact same outfit? Idk, I thought it was odd because I still view the women as prettier. Maybe I’ve just become accustomed to women being ‘dressed up’ and it still being perceived as casual.
Yup a man and a women could literally wear the same outfit for example: jeans and a plain white T-shirt. But people would find the man to be fashionable but the woman to be basic.
This is somewhat interesting to me as an aroace. While I do experience aesthetic attraction, i almost never find men attractive and I do think it's mostly due to the low standards of men's fashion. I also seem to be one of the only people in this comment section who wasn't all that blown away by the outfits she was recreating it the first place. I do think we tend to give men the pass regardless what they wear and disproportionately celebrate them when they brake the routine even a little bit. I just wish women weren't held to such a ridiculously higher standard.
"I feel like I look dumb" Those are the exact words that run through my head anytime I have to put on something considered "fashionable" as a dude. All I really want to wear is comfortable pants/shorts (depending on the weather) and a t-shirt with one of my favorite bands on it. Anything else makes me feel silly and inauthentic. I dunno how it is for other guys, maybe they feel more free when they put on "fashionable" clothes. I feel like I'm in a costume, expected to parrot some lines I didn't memorize because I never signed up to be in this play.
I definitely agree with you, I felt the exact opposite than her, all the outfits looked great on her and all the examples of the guys in them make me gag I hate guys fashion they all look dumb please just wear casual clothing and pull your pants up your ass. It’s a strange effect that guys fashion looks casual on women, and annoying on actual guys.
I experience a pretty similar thing from the other side of the spectrum. I'm biologically female, but like to dress masculine sometimes, and often feel like I'm trying to portray something that I'm not, even if I feel more uncomfortable with feminine clothing that day.
Eventually you just begin to ignore it. I'll say that my two cents on this take is that it MAY be the lightning and angles you are observing of yourself. Some outfits I have look better with a certain profile, haircut or angle of the light I'm using.
i think people have different preferences..idk exactly what is the difference between fashion and style but i think they are a form of art which means it is a way of communication, a form of self expression so so do you for you
It’s like I disagree and agree at the same time. I don’t think that guys are not expected to be “fashionable”. I’ve seen guys be mocked for not wearing the latest pair of shoes or clothing items that being very expensive. This have been a thing for not just females, but also males. Also having a brother who begged for newer clothes because the kids at school would roast or make fun of him. I’ve even heard women sometimes not like when a male doesn’t have expensive taste. Clothing in general can be a sign of high status depending on lots of factors. Not everyone thinks the same. Some clothing just doesn’t look good on a female not because of her being female, but it doesn’t complement her body as it would a male would or male like body meaning in terms of how much yin and Yang you have.
I agreed really strongly with what she said about men’s fashion not breaking any gender roles, which leads it to be extremely simple by comparison. Majority of men’s fashion is just pants and a tee, sweatshirt, hoodie, etc. Just varying in color. Women’s fashion experiments in silhouettes and textures and fabrics. So men’s fashion is extremely simple by comparison.
@@karaleigh_eva honestly it depends on who we’re talking about. Clothing for men is more complex than what we make it to be. Me being black I’ve seen just as much creativity and artistic clothing from both male and female in the black community. That’s only because there’s a stigma that black people have to always look the best. In fact clothing for men in general has been at its highest peak of creative designs than ever before, probably not as much as women but it’s changing. I do believe some men just dress basic one because, most likely don’t care, two they don’t know how to dress and never had to care about it. Women on the other hand power is seen in her beautiful while men needed money to feel powerful. So it makes sense why they don’t dress up they never needed to.
@@velvetday3874 yes all because you have expensive clothes doesn’t mean you’re fashionable. Being fashionable in the black community is important. Sorry I didn’t explain enough. Growing up I’ve seen my own people talk down on someone because of what they’re wearing and if it didn’t look good. That’s why I said is depends who.
@@LethalLemonLime it does if her point was men have more freedom to dress and still be seen as attractive. That’s not necessarily true, because men still have to put in effort and women can wear the same shit as us and look good. Women try harder than men to look better than there peers, and that’s what she’s seeing rather than her nearly opposite point. It’s not like girls are just automatically seen as ugly because they throw on some jeans and tennis shoes rather than a skirt and heelz.
as a guy i've struggled with presenting myself through fashion because of bullying for being "too different", "too feminine", "gay", and "a girl"- i still think if it was better if i just wore hoodies and sweatpants, but i don't want to. i've gotten more confident with it and i'm proud of myself for dressing how i want. i still get weird stares when i use the boys bathroom and go to boys p.e, but i don't care. better that than dressing how i don't want to dress. to demonstrate: i often use clothing from the "women's aisle", dresses, skirts, and other feminine stuff.
Im a bi guy and girls with these looks are just so much more appealing to me, but the video really made me reconsider my own style and encouraged me to make bolder fashion choices
I would prefer a woman with the "just came out of bed, and put on the comfiest clothing I could find" look rather than "I've spent 2 hours getting dressed this morning" woman
Yes to your statement about how men dressing feminine is more revolutionary than women dressing masculine! That’s what I’ve been saying!! Women wear pants and even suits, and it’s nothing special; but if a man wears a skirt or dress or even just makeup, it’s so controversial! I think it’s cool, but I know a lot of people who think men dressing “girly” is weird. And I feel like it’s both misogynistic and misandristic.
@@BigblackDavis i like dressing feminine because I am feminine. That's all Yes maybe some people do it for attention, but there's no attention to be given if people aren't shocked in the first place lol... I don't get what is so revolutionnary about a man wearing a dress, it's a piece of cloth. Some men in the east culturally wear dresses and that's just how it is At the end of the day everything comes down to society.
@@BigblackDavis "Difficult personality" With the say you said it, sounds like you'd love everyone to bend our backbones for society's indecisiveness. I think that a lot of "masculine" clothing is not "manly" but just comfortable, which is something that was historically taken away from women for men's eyes (figuratively). Also, "feminine" clothing was weirdly kept away from men and was the source of speculation for men's sexuality. So I say, society is the weird one, not us thinking and deciding for ourselves.
@@BigblackDavis btw the spandex booty shorts are perfect for girls doing a more high intensity workout or just a lot of running bc it keeps you cool and doesn’t do the swishy. all of the girls on my cross country team wore them w sports bras even tho it was just us and we had no one to impress. I know that’s not the main point of your comment, but I see guys w this misconception all the time-generally it’s just easier to move about in less clothing which is why I’d personally prefer an all-female gym to not deal with any drama with it.
A lot more men care more about functionality over aesthetic. Why do you think men's jeans comes with big pockets, whiles women's jeans comes with little to no pockets. Pockets make the jeans look uglier, but they are more functional. The majority of men prefer the functionality over the aesthetics. That is why it is just as hard to find men's jeans with fake pockets over women's jeans with real pockets. I hate this notion that both genders are the same and we gravitate towards the same things, and the only reason why people prefer certain things is because of "social norms."
@@RiseUpToYourAbility I believe that the “smaller pockets” on women’s clothing came from a marketing ploy to encourage women to buy bags/products that can hold their items. Lots of women absolutely love pockets and get super excited when brands can market correctly. Plus, big pockets aren’t ugly, I think that cargo pants and baggy jeans are one of the biggest trends right now for women
@@beatriceines3456 All I know is that market doesn't lie. There is no great conspiracy. It's like women complain about how women's shampoo and body soap cost more than men's. Well that is because men are willing to use Irish spring soap and 5 in 1 (Body wash, shampoo, conditioners, shaving cream, ETC) Men care about functionality that is why we are ok with Irish spring over some fancy smelling soap from bath and beyond. That is why men's grooming products don't cost a lot because men aren't willing to pay more.
@@icymeow3417 It also makes sense that a man’s outfit (however good or bad it is in its own right) looks entirely different on a slender woman. A square jaw, defined muscles, and wide shoulders make low effort casual fits look better, but what those men could look like is leagues ahead of average men in the same clothes.
As a boy who loves fashion , you’re right it is indeed easyer for men to dress “good” but a huge part of that has to do with the fact that not manny guys like fashion and they just wear THE RANDOMIST SHIT. So then when a guy dresses “midd” the fitt is considerd good,amazing,fashionable. There’s just so much more compitetion between girls then there is between boys in fashion , but on the other side if u dress good as a boy/man you get so much shit over u just bcs u dress good and stand out from other boys/man.
I also loved these outfits, and to be honest one of the upsides of losing weight and getting into weightlifting for me was the ability to wear these kinds of loose silouettes. But I'm lesbian, so dunno. Maybe pants on women do be gay idunno! lmaoi
I do agree that lots of men get the title of "fashionable" when they are really doing the bare minimum, but I do have to say that I think these recent topics like "is it an outfit or is she just skinny" misses a huge part of fashion. Something that a lot of people forget is that a huge factor for wether or not an outfit looks good is what your body type is. For example, shorter people tend to look better in high waisted looser pants because they enhance their legs, and give them an illusion of being taller. So just because something looks good on one body type and not others doesn't mean it's not fashionable. Fashion isn't one size fits all. That's part of the skill of being fashionable. You can't just copy and paste something from the internet and expect it to look good, you have to come up with your own unique style that compliments your body and personality.
totally agree I take a lot of inspiration from anybody but if I ever try and recreate a fit I usually only recreate fits with my height and similar build in the picture
anything is fashionable so even if your wearing a minimal outfit, and it's "bare minimum" if someone thinks its fashionable than its fashionable to them bare minimum ≠ bad
In my experience, men's fashion is made for respect more than attention. A well-made, long-lasting suit shows that a guy recognizes quality. Also, the fashion with men's traditional formal clothing exists as a blank canvas to make every choice pop. Patterned shirt? Pocket square? Eye-catching bowtie? People notice. And, of course, wearing the same kind of outfit can create a sense of camaraderie.
i think a significant part of it is also that clothing tends to follow trends from above and because of things like the french revolution where they would identify people and execute/imprison/street-murder them based on clothing men's fashion has been very quiet for the last two centuries and change. if you look to the previous time period men were constantly dressing up as much as possible, making diverse choices in fabric and colours, and similarly to women changing outfits based on the event or time of day etc. the extent to which a powerful man could finance his wife's outfits could be a culturally accepted way that he signals his wealth and taste without making himself as much of a target because he can blame it on the woman's tendency for spending money if push comes to shove. of course this is more historically minded and alot has changed in the last 130 years or so, but i think it's worth considering since current cultural ideas usually contain significant DNA from previous ones.
It's not the outfit, it's the man that's under the outfit that will always determine whether we like something or not. It's the same for women (or at least should be). You wear the outfit, don't let the outfit wear you. Style and confidence will always stand out more than any fashion trend.
I agree with this. If you are happy with your outfit then you will be more confident and people will notice you for that. If you have a nice accessory that stands out, they can compliment you on it to break the ice. the outfit itself is self-expression.
I personally know nothing about fashion, but a good outfit in my eyes means clothes that highlight feminine features in women and masculine features in men. For me attractivity is comprised of two key points: face and body shape. I am honestly unable to compare two outfits on two different people. I can only say that outfit one makes you more attractive than outfit two. It's all just pieces of fabric to me.
totally agree I didn't buy new clothes when I became more fashionable at least imo I just learned proportions colors values and texture and instantly got more fashionable regardless of my closet
Gender norms aside, the reason you don’t feel cute on the same outfits might also have to do with dressing your silhouette. Some pieces complement body shape better than others and that’s just it
I may get roasted for this but it seems like women are judging other women and bringing men into this when we never really wanted anything to do with it in the first place.
For basic fashion, It really is the person underneath that makes the outfit. I'm a straight guy and I disliked how those fits look on guys while I liked it how it looked on OliSUNvia. It seems to me that it's more about how the person looks in the outfit rather than the other way around.
The rigidness of masculinity is a good point. I am a straight male, but for my fashion choices I get called gay or bi or trans even sometimes. This does not bother me, but it bothers me when I tell them I am straight and they say that I absolutely can not be because of my clothing. This could also be amplified because I live in the south where the fashion is boots, jeans, and a t-shirt. However on the flip side because I wear more interesting clothing, I seem to get more compliments on my clothes than my friends do and more attention from women in certain situations.
Imo having the confidence to wear what you want makes you more of 'a man'. I'm pretty much in the same situation except with reversed genders, of course it's easier for us girls to wear 'masculine' fashion as that's seen as more powerful and femininity in men tends to get ridiculed, which is kinda dumb cause we all got masculine and feminine traits (whatever the hell that even means). Not to mention one's clothing doesn't even tell anything about one's preference in love, just their interest in fashion and looking the best they can while still feeling comfortable with themselves.
@@ashwinabrahamjacob525 Maybe a skirt lol. If he has painted nails, or a bit of makeup or feminine build then I might assume that there is a chance he might be gay or maybe just an emo or any weird fashion shit that exists but still a chance to be straight. But if I see a crop top, dress, or anything like that then no shit men will assume you're gay lmao
As a guy I think part of the reason we build ourselves up in "mid" clothes is bc we don't receive that a lot from others, so when I see my friends looking even remotely presentable, I like to give them compliments
No it's literally just because men's fashion is pretty simple there aren't really that many options. Women's clothing relies on showing off their body so there are more options they can use to have more skin showing in different areas and different holes cut in the fabric to show skin in different spots and other stuff like that.
To your point at 6:31, an interesting question to ask is who is enforcing this? Who is the authority that is judging and saying women "have to" have multiple dresses. I dont think guys care at all, in fact the only ones that seem to be enforcing this rule on women, are other women. I have never heard a guy say "oh but she wore that last time...she only has 1 dress...she is dressed like that other girl". This is ironically part of the reason guys don't have to worry, because guys don't judge each other like that. Just my thoughts
Damn being a guy sounds great, for girls they would mostly just glare at each other the rest of the night (at least in highschool or sth, I guess it gets better in college)
saw a girl wearing oversized tee, baggy pants and sneakers last evening and oh boy, she looked so good in it. maybe it differs person to person, whether they consider it basic or fashionable.
The thing about this is, if you have an attractive face/are or atleast act confident, you instantly look better for the people around u. If she looked tired or depressed, doesnt really care about her posture, for many this wouldnt look as attractive. Confidence does alot really! 🖤
@@brvhtxxbxk Honestly for me, a girl who looks like she just rolled out of bed is appealing. The more tired-looking the better lmao. i guess i’m attracted to the honesty of it, and i’d want the girl i’m with to be comfortable to dress casually around me.
@@CALKULTIK the roll out of bed look has been popular for a long time too and it still looks good on women. Oversized hoodie with jeans/leggings hasn't gone anywhere for years. if women want to dress simple they still can so dont totally agree w/ parts of the vid.
Personally as a man i’ve always been jealous of the variety that women outfits can offer to the point where i projected what i would have liked to wear if i was a women into my girlfriend even tho she dress completely different from what i’d wear myself if i was a woman.
i thought mens standards for fashion were lower because of the infinitely smaller selection of clothes we have to wear without looking "feminine or gay" lol. even the graphic tees at F21 are better in the women's section. i just started shopping in the women's section in stores honestly no point even checking the men's section💀
We have solid diversity in cuts. We really just dont have dresses/ skirts, hyper tight bottoms, and lack cuts for our top that are less flattering for a dudes build. I do wish we had more patterns/color
The discourse on this subject seems quite deep, but here is my take: If attractive, then fashionable. Else, not fashionable. You can boost this with clothes as necessary. However, if the baseline does not match society’s guidelines, then the boost is like multiplying zero by some arbitrary constant. Anyways you looked hot af in those clothes lmao.
I've seen people I find sexually attractive wearing things I don't find fashionable. In this case, I'm still sexually attracted to them, but I don't see that specific look as being fashionable. A lot of sexy twitch streamers (imo) are examples of this.
I'd just like to mention something I think you glossed over a bit: men and women are... different? I totally agree that women are more put upon by society to have variety, but it's also true that good outfits on women are outfits that highlight their femininity in some way, or highlights stuff that men don't have, like curves. The outfits look better on the guys because it highlights their masculinity, their straight up and down rectangular profile. The masculine outfits on you mask your feminine features, while they highlight the male features. Idk, it's just my take on things. Love your videos!
I agree with you there. The fits she tried would look good on a tall, rectangular woman (like most runway models). Its not about gender so much as height and how angular your figure is.
yeah, i was thinking about this when i mentioned at the very end that fashion sometimes serves different purposes for men and women! so then it makes me start to wonder about how gendered fashion is, and why fashion is geared toward that direction. it starts the question of whether fashion should be separated from the body or whether the body and fashion are linked e.g., are low rise jeans fashionable if they require a certain body type to look good?
okay but as a girl i love it when men express their personality through their fashion. to all the boys and men out there, please don't think that you cant dress a certain way because "its not masuline enough" or because of stupid stereotypes of society. i have a few close male friends who have the most gorgeous sense of fashion, one of them has a softish,cutesy, femine type of style, baggy jeans, similar to kpop idols, and I love him for that. but like seriously though, there are so many types of boys. the bruh boys who throw on whatever they can find, the ethereally elegant boys who dress with class and colours, the mystical secretive boys who chose to highlight their beauty through rich deep colours and the sunshine rainbows boys who live life through pastel colours. boys, fuck society interpretations of masculinity, yall are too perfect to exist.
It's also easier said than done. I am a man that's into fashion and it's hard to express yourself without being called gay or made fun of in some other way. It's not as easy as "just don't listen" or ignore it, it's probably easier for you as a woman to dress however you like because it is socially acceptable for women to wear almost anything and still be considered fashionable and desirable but it just isn't as easy as it sounds. You can just listen to what gay men have said about how theh felt being discriminated and that's how most of us feel. Stares when you go outside, the whispers, the rumors etc. We don't only have to fight against society and the societal norms but also in our own gender where people make fun of and treat other men differently for wearing things that aren't socially acceptable. Most men don't have the privilege of being in a forward and accepting environment for them to dress up like that.
@@twit9129 its horrible to hear the way you're treated, I deffo don't think people can just ignore it , I cannot belive society wont let men express themselves. I guess its nice when you have people who support your decisions.
Thank you! But I think another large issue is that there isn’t an affordable variety of mens clothing, all the stores have the same stuff just in different brands, colors, and sizes 😭💔
There is no great conspiracy. Men for the most part just simply don't care about fashion. Women will judge each other on their hair, makeup, outfit, ETC. Men just each other on their competency. We simply have different criteria.
i would like to argue that it is not just men in general. it can be combined with the skinny argument. as a plus sized teenager, i have gone through EXTREME body dysmorphia because no matter how much time i put into an outfit, it isn’t for me. it’s for the skinny men. i feel like we should combine both the “just a skinny woman” and “just a man” argument into “just a skinny person”
very messy thoughts about this: a lot of my friends consider me fashionable even though, imo, my outfits are pretty basic - I just switch it up a lot and wear nice colours and accessories. most guys just put in so much less effort into dressing themselves because they don't have to/there's a stigma for men to dress well, like you mentioned in the video. as soon as you switch up the sillhouette or wear some more out-there colours/designs (like...not black, blue, brown, grey lol), it really stands out. I watch fashion youtubers sometimes, ones who focus on women's fashion, and ones who focus on men's and it's like kinda funny seeing how basic the men's stuff is. it's like they'll talk about the different cuts of pants but it hardly even varies, or oversized shirts
as a dude that likes exploring bolder more artistic clothing it's SO difficult finding affordable mens clothes that aren't just plain shirt, plain shirt + graphic, plaid/striped shirt. lately I been buying clothes from women's department and hand-tailoring them to fit my frame :')
idk if it's just me being a lesbian but when you put on the "fashion man" outfits i thought it looked AMAZING and so much better than it did on the men!! it's just got this casual vibe that looks really good
Oh my goodness, I cant explain how much I can relate to you. It looked so fashionable but she kept saying it's not. I thought maybe it's because we have different fashion sense but I genuinely find the women who wear such fashion way more fashionable and attractive than the men wearing it.
I disagree with the idea that men's fashion has lower standards because there is a broader range in what in considered fashionable / acceptable. It's the opposite, there's a smaller range - women can wear more or less any outfit a man could and still appear "normal", whereas a man wearing traditionally feminine clothing is still widely seen as unacceptable, let alone fashionable. I think it's seen less fashionable for women to wear "basic" clothing BECAUSE there are more options available, so it seems like they should go for a more elaborate / feminine option just because they can. The same can be said for why men can all wear the same suit at an event but women have to all have a unique dress.
yeah I mean my boyfriend wants to dress better but he genuinely doesn't know how because every time we go out to look for clothes its just either basic one color t shirts and basic pants/shorts, or like some lame graphic t shirt...and yes of course there are some sweaters and sweatshirts and stuff, but within any one kind of "style" men's clothing options are extremely limited and boring. It's giving a lot of credit to say that there are even enough options available (buying new, used has a few more) for guys to have a distinct style even. It was shocking to me how few options are available for guys when i went shopping with him for the first time...guys have to get real creative and/or push major boundaries to dress outside of basic I think.
As a trans women who lives in Brazil I'm almost always in boy mode what I've noticed is that "being fashionable" is being always a one up from the norm, two steps in trying and anything more than that you're gay and trying too hard. Tldr: The minimum standard for men is lower, but so is the ceilling.
Pois é, quando eu voltar pro Brasil eu vou lançar uma saia e camisa larga com uns Jordans e quero que se foda, vou ouvir muita merda, mas fazer o quê? Ainda mais sendo hétero. Vou usar eyeliner também.
Pois é, eu sou brasileiro também, e eu penso muito sobre todos os olhares e preconceitos que as pessoas vão ter sobre mim se eu vestir o que eu realmente quero (esmalte preto, um choker, jeans tipo skinny...). Eu tenho muito medo de passar a "linha" do que é aceitável e conhecidos ou até amigos terem dúvidas sobre a minha sexualidade, e que eles se afastem de mim por isso.
It’s worth noting that a vast majority of the female fashion standards are perpetuated by women, not men. Most men couldn’t care less if you wear the same dress several times. That being said, it doesn’t change the fact that the standard is there, I just think it’s important to see why it’s there, because if we don’t, we can’t work on changing it.
that blue hoodie fit looked amazing. I get the point you're articulating in this video, but I feel like it depends on the build and confidence of the person, regardless of gender. I hella vibe with baggy fits on women. they're definitely not less fashionable by definition
I agree, I feel like she missed her own point a little bit because every outfit looked nice. I think it’s just not her style and that’s why she doesn’t like it.
I just dont get this vid because I think she is underestimating the amount of girls who just wear a hoodie and jeans/leggings nowadays? There are a lot of ppl wearing very simple fits now.
This has been a really interesting video for me. I live in a small city where people look at me weird when I tuck my t-shirt in my pants or when I wear anything that's not black or grey. In my town the standards for fashion are so much lower than the fits you put on, that I think these outfits you showed were really crazy and I never see girls dressed like this in real life. As a dude I think the standards for men in fashion are definetly lower, however I never noticed this discrepency of how men and women can wear the same fit and the dude is treated as a fashion icon and the girl as just casual. Then again I live in Germany and we're not known for being fashionable.
I was like "why is this so similar to my experience?" until I read that you are from Germany as well haha it's definitely different in bigger cities though. people are wayyy more fashionable there than in a smaller town. the female fits she showed though, you wouldn't see that on a normal daily basis in Germany. the supposedly male outfits shown are more of what people regardless of gender wear in bigger cities
@@greenleaf4570 Yeah I know. I mean I get my style inspiration from people on social media, who tend to live in bigger cities and whenever I'm in Hamburg or especially Berlin I'm like 'damn people actually wear these fits on a daily basis', while people look at me weird for wearing something slightly different... Thank God I'm moving to a bigger city soon tho
I think there's a huge difference between the fashion you see on Pinterest or in magazines and irl. The fashion seen in photos (of really good looking guys and girls) is literally made for photos and hard to recreate and look good irl (like you struggled with tying that sweater "properly")
I'm gonna be totally honest, a lot of these fashion problems are mainly perpetuated by the women themselves in my experience. Here's an example. Throughout my senior year of high school, our picture day had to be rescheduled twice. The first time, everybody wore whatever they intended to wear, then we were told early in the morning about the reschedule. Nobody was too bothered initially, just a tad disappointed. After a few minutes, cue the girls lamenting about how they don't have any other dresses and how they have to go out and buy another one before the next picture day. The guys, me included, were all repeatedly asking what was so wrong about just wearing the same thing for the reschedule when we heard these complaints. There was no response with reasoning above the level of "you just don't." Next picture day rolls around, every guy shows up in the same outfit we had initially, and the large majority of girls were wearing something new. Same song and dance when it got rescheduled. Final day, when we actually got things taken, girls were in new outfits again. And the worst had come to pass. Two of the girls had *matching dresses*. They were ashamed and spent all day worrying about how "awkward" that was. In contrast, the guys were pretty much all wearing standard suits, mostly blue with one red suit and one or two black suits. On top of that, all the suits were the same suits we had bought for a formal last year. We all jokingly/genuinely complimented each other each time. I don't think I have ever seen men complain about women re-wearing stuff. If something looks good, why not wear it again? Why waste money? It simply doesn't make sense. Women, on the other hand, keep the stigma going and perpetuate the idea within themselves. Sure there are outliers, as there are in any statistic, but I'm talking about large majorities.
I’m a woman and I agree. It’s a herd mentality. If you dare wear the same thing for those reschedules, the other girls will point it out and either directly ask “didnt have money to buy a new dress?” Or be passive aggressive like “I get you I mean its a shame to buy extra outfits youd only wear once”
@@TadanoCandy yeah in school I found girls very mean and extremely judgemental so I simply didn't spend time with them. I'm in my 30s now and still don't give a shit about fashion.
I agree but your point about 'men don't care if women wear the same thing' is a bit misleading because women don't dress up for men. Makeup and fashion is a way of expressing individuality since women friend group tend to be more tight and emotionally involved. There's a whole documentary on womens prison cosmetology. Desire to be pretty and different doesn't start and end with men.
I think in the end, the biggest factor that determines whether we think an outfit is great or not is whether the person wearing it is conventionally attractive or not (both face and body)
the statement "I feel like i just got out of bed and just put on the most comfortable clothes i could find" is extremely accurate for how 99% of the other men i know dress it's literary just putting on whatever and then having a quick check in the mirror to make sure you don't look like complete garbage
As a man who likes fashion and design I think that most of men don't pay attention to how they are dressed but also in men's fashion there is not variety of clothes. For example I like wide pants and when skinny pants were in fashion (I don't how to say it I am not English ) I had to were skinny jeans because there weren't wide ones in shops, you know.
@@santimer1067 Fro me I couldn't care less of how fashionable I look. If I look like a mess then so be it. Fashion has never been important to me, but to each their own for those who care about their fashion
As a fashion-oriented guy, it's really hard to find cool clothes that don't fit a standard male style. And women get all these cute boutiques littering the streets, it makes me envious lol
@@TitaniumTronic I would more often if they had something that looked good on me! They catch my eye when the clothes themselves are elegant, beautiful, cute, or badass, but I don't see myself in them. Sometimes stuff looks good, just not on you, and that's okay.
@@diogeneslantern18 I'm not averse to using feminine clothes if they look good on my body. I choose clothes that make me feel like me, and that tends to happen with male-coded clothes. A good chunk of my wardrobe is women's clothes, but that always comes as a surprise to people. In the end male clothes are what a person that looks male wears. I'm aware there's a whole range of male styles, what I'm saying is there's at least a magnitude fewer specialty stores for men than for women. I understand that it's a result of a much smaller demand, likely due to the value society places on female beauty. It still makes me feel pleasantly envious, but if it ever bothers me enough, I know I can always learn to tailor.
As a trans guy I reckon a lot of what's considered 'fashionable' is based on just dressing for a cis male body, or the ideal for that - essentially, I'd say it's the same argument of 'is it a fit or are they just skinny'. I could wear the exact same thing as my brother, and it'd be considered a fit on him because he's cis and just look odd on me because something is 'off'. That being said, if I wore something more 'feminine' by modern standards, like a '70s style outfit, it's considered a fit, and I get more compliments as a man because people gloss over the more feminine features I have - it's as if they expect them to be there if I' m wearing something 'feminine' so they can ignore them and focus more on the fact that I present as a man. I don't know if that made any sense in the context of this video, but I think it's a matter of what features people 'expect' to see based on fashion standards and then seeing it as a fit because they expect it to be a fit based on who's wearing it.
Makes sense honestly. I’m AFAB and nonbinary but prefer to present ‘masculine’ (I feel like it kinda cancels out my ‘feminine’ features). I have pretty much always dressed the same as my brother, in graphic tees and jeans, but as someone who looks ‘feminine’ otherwise, people tend to think that I don’t care enough, as a girl, about fashion and how I present myself - thus contributing to assumptions and judgements on my worth. It’s as if there’s this standard that people expect girls to uphold, while guys can do the bare minimum and put no effort in, and since so many people perceive gender as a binary and assume because I’m AFAB and have distinctly ‘feminine’ features that I’m a girl, the immediate conclusion is that I’m not doing enough to meet the expectations.
As trans guy i kind of agree with you, you were right, but i think sexually is actually also a factor in the "it's that a fit thing". Before I completely passed 24/7, i used to wear more stereotype manly man stuff, an nobody batted an eye to it. Now i dress how I feel like it, in more gender non conforming way, and most people know I'm bisexual, those plain outfits that i used to wear, aren't seen as me looking good anymore, if i go out with just jeans and a white shirt, I'm seen as basic, i feel like better fits are expected of me
I think you did an amazing job on this video! As a man who just recently got into fashion in the last couple years, I have noticed that despite often wearing looks that I considered way more boring then my female friends, I was still the one getting praised and people were very suprised by the idea that I could be into fashion, like I'm pretty sure my grandparents think I'm a drag queen, cause they keep sending me fake nails 😭
Reminds me of when Yohji Yamamoto occasionally lamented having to design clothing for men because he was basically always limited to a shirt, pants, and maybe a jacket, to the point he started designing them backwards just to try and have fun with it lol
I noticed you didn't provide any examples of "unfashionable" men. Similarly to women's fashion, a good looking guy can pull almost anything off and confidence goes a long way.
Ok. I like this video, but it seems like you kinda glossed over the fact that if they're not stereotypically attractive, fashion minded men are bullied, shamed, ostracized, sexually harassed, and in many cases assaulted for being "girly". Even if they are wearing men's clothes.
That also happens to attractive men. Maybe not as much as before but pretty boy has been thrown around as a slur quite often. I am seen as an attractive guy and get a lot of shit for trying out new things.
I think that typically happens in rural America because here everyone knows each other you’ll get your spine ripped out from your asshole straight out your mouth for doing something as stupid as assaulting someone for being girly
@@brown9671 true, although both are used in a derogatory way. If you care about your looks to the point you do the bare minimum it's seen as emasculating whether you're good looking or not.
Meh. It’s more about what YOU make it. If you ask me, fashion might be the most wasteful and pointless thing to invest in, because of labour, high prices, kids feeling insecure and less, and the whole 9 yards.
@@Dhdhdyqha I highly disagree. Dressing the way you want to is peoples first impression of you. If you want people to think certain thing about you, dress that way. If you want people to think you’re chill, dress chill. If you want people to think you’re smart, dress smart. Dressing in a way you want to be perceived gives you confidence and often it makes people respect you more. Fashion has been around ever since clothes have, and that’s for a reason.
As a straight man, the day someone made fun of me for wearing something borderline “gay”, was the day I realized how silly it is to be worried about how you’re perceived. Since that day my style has completely shifted into the “gae” And nobody tells me shit
this reminds me of this guy in my class in middle school. he painted his nails black the whole school year. at the end of the year, we were given different award (ex; “most artistic” “most likely to be president” etc.). he won “best nails.” they are plain black nails? and there was this girl who always had super cool nails, and we all expected her to win, but no.. the guy with the most basic nails won💀
Because we (society) don’t expect a man to paint his nails. Like we don’t expect a woman to perform as good a man in PE class, so for the same performance women would have a higher grade.
I see tons of girls getting more appreciation for shit guys do all the time, whether its sports or getting hired for the most basic job. Yeah his nails are basic but considering how hard it is for a man to self express himself in a feminine way, him painting nails means more than the average girl who can do without the mental burden. The same applies for the examples I gave before about girls doing guy things because of the society expectations. There's more to it than "HURR DURR ITS SO BASIC THO"
Reminds me of something I've realised recently: for women, "self-expression" means constructing a persona complete with a fashion style, hobbies, social media etc. that reflects who you are inside the best. For men, it's simply just... existing as yourself. (Oversimplification of course, but this is the trend I've noticed.)
@@johnmiller4895 i think most people would call you sexist for not realizing there's a difference based on what society expects from men and women. I mean the point is that for women's "self-expression" to be realized they have to have a personal fashion style, certain hobbies, a style of social media presence, etc. Meanwhile for a man's "self expresión" he just has to... exist as himself. I don't think it's necessarily true, maybe for some men who strongly adhere to the general standards of their culture's homogeneizating class ir whatever the fuck narrative that holds power. Otherwise, we wouldn't see all the memes for the different types of "Subculture Bro" (star wars bro or movie and tv bro, sports bro [golf bro bball bro rugby bro football bro], money bro [like finance or crypto bro], gym or more esoteric fitness Bro, political bro, fucking language bro, computer bro, etc). Though maybe those men who do have a personality only do it for fun, just like maybe the girls who got their social media and stlye on point only do it for fun
Yeah I’ve noticed women tend to have more curated instas and even the photo dumps are curated to give a specific aesthetic whereas for some men their posts aren’t as curated (from my perspective) and they can just post whatever. There’s so much pressure to have a specific self-expression for women ;-;
@@johnmiller4895 Feminism is literally all about acknowledging the differences (between the way men and women are treated) and fighting to change it. Essentially, feminists want to create equality through equity. It is supposed to help everyone, men included.
When you presented the GAP outfits saying the man was an 8/10 and the woman was a 6.7, I was very surprised. I honestly think men don't put as much thought into what women wear as women do. I immediately thought of that woman as being a 9/10, and the man a 5/10. Matter of perspective to some degree, sure. At the same time, I feel like its best not to overthink it, especially if ones goal with their outfit is to attract a man.
Yeah bruh fashion is turning into how many looks I can get out of this. I really don’t think a man really cares what a girl wears I mean unless he’s the controlling type either way we should all be our own person and there’s many men out there doing simple fashion shit and still look good . It’s funny how most of those photos shown were caucasian men. Which is another female gaze in itself in my humble opinion
To me, the woman outfit seemed like it was thought out, honestly 10/10 as a casual comfy outfit. The man, meh. It just looked like he put on the trousers and the hoodie he had available. It’s just clothes, not an outfit.
Oof, where do i begin. Women have more options for clothes, so ofcourse the bar is set higher. Adding to that, women also have the option to wear mens clothing while still looking very presentable, stylish, and still somehow conserves the feminine-silhouette and energy, while the same can't be said if a man wore womens clothing. This is simply because womens clothing are made only for women, while mens clothing are made generally for both sexes. You mentioned formal wear in the video, it's basically the same thing, women wear dresses, men wear different coloured suits. Dresses and suits, plus women could wear suits too. Literally, with the options we men have, the only other way we can express ourselves is through the use of colours. Moreover, an outfit is considered aesthetic based on how "easy" is it for our brains to process the outfit, so even if a woman wore something super bizarre with too much going on, it would still be a sucky outfit, why? because it's not aesthetically pleasing. You'd think this is logical, but after watching this video, apparently everything has to be about the battle of the sexes. TLDR: Yes ofcourse men have it easier to be fashionable, we have less options. EDIT: Yeah makes alot more sense why this video was posted after looking browsing through the channel
9:04 Idk how other people feel, but in my opinion, I would've flipped the scores. It looks kind of awkward on the dude but super good on the girl. The fit of the clothes on her, the shoes, and purse she chose for it look really good.
They're both basic boring outfits but the guys is definitely better because it actually fits him. Girl is wearing clothes 2 sizes too big for her. Though it just goes to show that it's all subjective, what I think is best is what some people think is worst. That's why this whole argument is dumb.
Yeah but would you call her a fashion icon for just wearing that …personally I wouldn’t but I for sure do know a lot of people would call a man a fashion icon for wearing something so basic
Oh sry I reread your comment and understood that what I you wrote is totally different from what my answer would fit too ugh English is not my first language so idk how to translate to you my thoughts correctly ((( And I sadly can’t delete my other comment because I can’t see it for some reason
i think it's because as a young girl, i was praised for having a sense of style, when i only color coordinated my outfits and just cared about how i looked. meanwhile, the boys around me wore basketball shorts and random tees their whole life, so when they grow up and suddenly start wearing jeans, or actually coordinating their outfits, it's revolutionary.
i think it's also interesting to consider that the range of men's clothing is so small, making it easier to step outside of the norm and look "fashionable". but at the same time the lack of range is restraining for men
I got called slurs for trying outfits that were different than just putting on baggy tee and jeans for looking too feminine in my country. There were times where I envied that a woman could put on "masculine" clothes and still get a pass while men wearing feminine clothes immediately get the gay label regardless of their actual preferences. But I never thought about the other side in this situation, it sounds horrible to feel pressured to always compete with such high fashion standards.
It’s funny because I’m bi and I have the same type in women and in men, so when it comes to checking out people, I hold the same sort of standards to men and women, so I’m kinda immune to this bias. I found some of the fits to look pretty nice on you, if you were going for a more tomboy look, you know, I’d wear it.
Your videos are a God sent for a 27 year old trying very hard to break out of awful social norms and problematic thought processes. Thank you for your fantastic content!
I mainly thrift my stuff and I am really into fashion, Highschoolers are brutal and always say I’m “dressed like a girl” even though I just look better than them lol, I never understood why guys wearing more colorful things or crop tops or lots of jewelry was considered something only a girl would wear because I never saw fabric as something gendered.
I definitely agree with your points in the video, but as a man I really wish I had more acceptable fashion options. And while as you say a man might look more “fashionable” in basic clothes than a woman. Men don’t have try as hard to get a “fashionable” look, but men are also kinda stuck only wearing “basic” clothes. Have you ever shopped in the men’s section? We have no options. Jeans and T-shirt’s and hoodies are all we’re allowed to wear. If I could go in the women’s section, find clothes that fit me and not be criticized for wearing them, any “basic” fit would be out the window for me. Basic clothes aren’t what I want to wear but it’s what society and the clothing store tells me I can wear. I want to be decorative and feminine but I’m not allowed based on my clothing choices in stores so I do my best with boring basic clothes. I would love to see less gender separation in fashion in the future. I also think it should be more acceptable for women to wear “basic” clothes because you look good in them even it’s not the “norm” you should be able to go out confidently in something that’s more comfortable than fashionable if you want and not be looked down upon for that. Gendered fashion standards are ridiculous but things are moving in a more positive direction it seems.
Freshman year of high school, I was at a fundraiser and a parent chaperone came up to me saying "Nice shoes". I looked down at his and saw we were wearing the same shoes and we laughed about it. I think if everyone had this reaction the world would be a better place
Personally I think there's a difference between looking good and being fashionable. The fits you tried on look good on you, it's not necessarily fashionable but it definitely looks good and I think it's a preference thing. But this was the most interesting video I've watched this whole week on RU-vid. The pacing and delivery in this video got me paying so much attention. Love it!
Im a man and my style is very versatile throughout the days. One day I'll feel like dressing better, and other days I'll feel like dressing as casual as possible (like the examples you showed in this video). My problem is that every time I dress casually and somebody says that my outfit is so cool and fashionable I tell them that it's not, and they're outraged by that
Yess exactly, adult women dress almost simple as man. Pants and shirt, skirt and shirt etc. The examples she show as female clothing actually just a teens dream of what she will wear at a party.
In my experience, I've noticed that fashion really isn't a thing due to how subjective it is and how often it changes depending on decade, season, time of day, place you'll be in, who you'll be with,etc. So what I'll usually do is wear whatever is most comfortable and suits the occasion without caring if it's fashionable or not. This is something i've talked to my GF about and she seems so confused everytime we go out saying things like "why can you dress so comfortable everywhere we go, and i can't?" I always tell her the same thing: "nobody cares how you look except you, so dress however you want. if you want to be comfortable, dress that way". I also agree with you in the sense that girls are trying too hard to impress, and I think they should stop, it's so unnecessary. I also think that most of the clothes you tried on look really good on you, maybe the pants are a little too baggy,but who cares. The outfits didn't look amazing on the men either, they were just hot af. Those outfits of men you showed in the pictures just look average, nothing special at all. tl;dr wear whatever you want, fashion is stupid. fuck bitches, get money :)
I personally love adding some “feminine” traits and silhouettes to my outfits. But I still think men are kinda limited in what they can wear. Maybe people here in Italy are still somewhat close-minded for what concerns male fashion, but the range of clothes a woman can wear is far wider than that of a man, cmon! Also, I think the outfits you showed, although minimal, looked kinda nice and cozy. Maybe you’d be more eye-catching with something different, but it’s still not a bad fit. Meanwhile, a guy wearing high heel sandals and a tight dress would look much more out of place. Depending on your physique it could look very awkward. So yeah, everyone has different shapes and colors that work with their body, but to summarize, I still think women can be much more flexible. I hope we’ll reach the same level of freedom as well!
@@kyutiekyujin564 Hey I’d just say go for it! As you said, the more you wear what you actually want, the more confident you get. Takes a while to really get out of the shell but you can do it a step at a time. You’ll also find your style changing and evolving as you go through this so it’s kinda nice :)
