I really enjoyed this conversation with Joscha. Here's the outline: 0:00 - Introduction 3:14 - Reverse engineering Joscha Bach 10:38 - Nature of truth 18:47 - Original thinking 23:14 - Sentience vs intelligence 31:45 - Mind vs Reality 46:51 - Hard problem of consciousness 51:09 - Connection between the mind and the universe 56:29 - What is consciousness 1:02:32 - Language and concepts 1:09:02 - Meta-learning 1:16:35 - Spirit 1:18:10 - Our civilization may not exist for long 1:37:48 - Twitter and social media 1:44:52 - What systems of government might work well? 1:47:12 - The way out of self-destruction with AI 1:55:18 - AI simulating humans to understand its own nature 2:04:32 - Reinforcement learning 2:09:12 - Commonsense reasoning 2:15:47 - Would AGI need to have a body? 2:22:34 - Neuralink 2:27:01 - Reasoning at the scale of neurons and societies 2:37:16 - Role of emotion 2:48:03 - Happiness is a cookie that your brain bakes for itself
Your work and discipline has really inspired many people across the globe ... Though I must add, that many youngsters, like myself love your way of expression & the extent you push yourself to deliver the unique #collabs & #interactions ... it's just Marvelous. Lots of love from India ❤️
Lex Fridman what if A.I will go down pathway of having to build a physical picture of the world and create mechanisms to interact with it? Will it have a body ?
Brendan Wright I really hope more people start making intelligent podcasts like this one. RU-vid is a playground for toddlers without good material like this.
Yeah. He speaks not too much faster than normal but his answers are dense af in terms of idea units per sentence. Lex could barely keep up in the first half hour.
All of us listeners are like pigeons, pecking on breadcrumbs from the insights this guy is casually tossing on the ground for us. Thank you Joscha! Please do more podcasts; your articulated ideas are like fresh baked cookies for our brains.
Hand on heart, I listened to the first hour LITERALLY 20 times, and still don't get all of what he said( of course I'm not native english speaker and have to translate a lot words, but still, it is crasy to get what he talks about). Now I am planning to download the subtitle and read!
Don't play this at 2x, content density is so high that a black hole might be formed right in front of your computer. I say this from experience. Commenting from another dimension.
His answers don’t freak me out as much as him not even taking a second to think about the questions Lex throws at him. He’s effectively reading his mind, pre-empting the questions, and answering them excellently. This is another level of intellect. Cannot wait for him to come on to the Portal.
@@naught_ I think Eric would have to learn a new level of humility, or if it is already within him then I will say that I have misdjudged him i would look forward to their conversation, however, because either way Eric would want to be able to talk to this guy
"A government, game theoretically, is an agent that imposes an offset on your payout metrics to make your knash equilibrium compatible with the common good"
Holy shit!!! That guy really is impossible! How can he manage those ideas at that speed, and then weave them in natural language!!! I'm glad that he seems to be a benevolent being. Can you imagine a guy like that with sociopathic or anarchistic views?
My name is also Troy, I also listen to podcasts for like 6 hours a day (I do deliveries), and this is also one of my favorites. Nice to meet you Max Troy, that must make me Lame Troy
sooo.. what part is actually profound? Its neat that they both have an ability - like a rapper being able to go with whatever and rhyme.. so they could probably go for who knows how long... but I'm interested in if they actually get to something new... i was impressed maybe 10 mins ago, I'm an hour in - and now im thinking he's stuck in the computer science mode. He's just going to keep explaining things in that language - its going to keep getting more complex until it breaks,. And he's hit that point - im thinking twice now..
@@michaeltrevino201 I had to look up "Pocket Protector " then I laughed when I saw what it is . OMG , my dad spent like $800 on a texas instruments calculator in the '70's and that is like $5000 today . I grew up with an analog wave oscillator in the basement . I can see it now in my minds eye , that bright green line waving over the emerald green field through the crosshairs
Normally Lex can give his guests a run for their money, regardless of their caliber, but with this guy his brain had to run on overclock for 3 hrs just to be able to ask an adequate question - loved it! :) Keep it up, Lex!
peep how hard fridman stay sweatin thru tha full duration of tha discussin lmao 🥵🥵🥵 bach n tha sheer staggering power of purebred unrestrained german autism got his ass on tha ropes from beginning 2 end 🤣🤣🤣
haha, I was just thinking to myself that I often listen to podcasts at 1.8x, but this one 1x. Joshua's CPU clock / speech cadence seem to be about 80% faster than the typical human.
@@dmitrysamoylenko6775 1.25?? Dang, I was struggling with 1x (usually I'm listening 1.5-1.75). I had to double check after a break when I heard Joshua talking so fast lol
I wonder if this is a result of the language structure of the German mind. How German language has a tendency to layer comprehension and meaning by gluing words together.
his talk at the last CCC was also a really tour de force for my synapses. A lot of pausing and rewinding and pausing and rewinding etc... ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-e3K5UxWRRuY.html
@@austinfromaustin320 that German language is a building block. More important is, to have small children "eating" through your local library /bibliothek. As there is nothing better to do when you grow up ....and sticking to it when growing up.
This one section was a gem that I will always remember: "Happiness is a cookie your brain bakes for itself. It's not made by the environment. The environment cannot make you happy. It's your appraisal of the environment that makes you happy. If you can change your appraisal of the environment, which you can learn to, you can create arbitrary moments of happiness."
@@bucketiii7581 This is only meant to be on a personal level (eg. through meditation), not through leaders in government forcing you into a way of life detrimental to your wellbeing or inducing you into committing genocidal acts.
Mature makes me happy… the Humuingbird who comes over by me, trees, bees, butterflies. My Puppies, growing my garden of Organic nongmo food.. The tropical Hawaiian islands…. A lot!!! 🌿🌞💫
That is depressing to hear in advance.. But he is wrong still not because its a defence we have within us to never let our guard down to be manipulated or controlled by natures gifts. its an instinct that is very sencetive and that can be eazily triggerd by the slightest unstability (caused by unfamiliarity) we feel within us. no one is perfectly balanced mentaly and our minds has no power to control our instinct try walking on sharp glas without feeling any pain or feeling for matter
@@Joshin_Jinn well... you, me, or Kaye may not be able to tame the instinct responses, but look at the case of protesting monks in Vietnam in 1963. The one from famous photo was not the only one.
nah, tha statement dat best summarizes tha convo is: "most people of tha west misunderstand tha nature of consciousness bc we been brainwashed by a crude middle eastern desert cult for 2000 years"
Several timestamps of particularly interesting ideas during the conversation. 4:01 Nerd is someone who submits ideas to peer review when communicating. In contrast to negotiating alignment as typical people do. 24:52 Intelligence is the ability to make models of patterns and see the structure of those patterns. Some models are general. 25:35 Some of the problems are so general that a system that makes models needs to understand what itself is, how it relates to the environment. The cognitive system (you) have to model its own characteristics (attributes? personality traits?). 27:39 Self-awareness and intelligence are not the same thing. Sentience / self awareness is an ability to make sense of the world and your place in it. In other words, it is possessing certain classes of models (models of yourself). Intelligence - ability to develop these models if you do not already have them. Conscious thought arises from a need to regulate surroundings that you are in. When I know something about myself is when I model it. Part of my brain models what the other part is doing. 43:04 Category theory in mathematics - describing a set of fractals. First principle thinking: automata, number theory, spaces. Watch: Steven Wolfram cellular automata. 44:52 We are side effects of the regulation needs of monkeys. Regulation concerns the relationship between an organism and its surroundings which often consists of other organisms. 45:40 “Consciousness emerges over dimensions of disagreements with the universe” - understand consciousness as the conscious thought (in contrast to the conscious experience)(Lieberman, 2022) 52:08 Dalajlama is governmental software running on a human being. What model do you identify yourself with? 55:55 ‘Consciousness gives it colour, flavour’ - This is the conscious experience (in contrast to the conscious thought) (Lieberman, 2022) 58:40 Attention to the attention itself. Again, such self-referential mechanisms that pay attention to the attention itself is conscious thought. The term consciousness is being used idiosyncratically, interchangeably as the conscious thought and the conscious experience. 1:01:42 Space of concepts - Gardenfors would be handy here. 1:03:00 Wittgenstein, Minsky, common-sense reasoning. However, no recognition of taxonomic (classes of objects) and thematic (mutual appearance of objects) semantics. 1:07:00 Boltzman machines for building models. Networks which train Boltzman machines in a way that the number of constraints is not trivial. Possibility (vs. probability) of certain scenarios modelled as an effect of interaction of intentional agents? 1:09:00 Meta learning. The 1st wave of AI was writing an algorithm which implements the solution for an identified problem (chess). The 2nd wave is writing an algorithm which writes algorithms which implements the solution for an identified problem (go). The 3rd wave will be meta-learning = find an algorithm that discovers a learning algorithm for a given domain. Referring to Lieberman again, is meta-learning the conscious thought influencing the conscious experience? In other words, can meta-learning be understood as an effect of interaction between the prefrontal structures (dlPFC, OFC, ACC) and the Gestalt Cortex? As a result, the conscious experience of a given situation is modulated (as in modulating attention around 2:03:00). 1:23:05 We are intelligent over our timescale. From a perspective of trees or long-living ecosystems, we could be tools for releasing deposits of co2 back into the atmosphere. 1:25:25 Lions building more complex models of their surroundings than antelopes do? In a sense that antelopes cannot go extinct if lions are about to survive. 1:30:00 Closed cooling chains 1:41:12 Communities not die, they evolve 1:45:54 Frictionless governments 1:51:43 As a civilization, we push random buttons without knowing what they connect to. 1:57:14 Most people do not care about understanding themselves because they are adjusted well enough. 2:00:56 You are a machine that thinks that's you. It begs the question what is ‘you’. Is ‘you’ the one thinking or the one experiencing? 2:03:21 Meditation is a bunch of techniques which allow you to control attention. You can change how your attention works (i.e. you can change your conscious experience). As a side note, experience (perception) is for action, possibilities of action (affordances) are being perceived. 2:06:50 Dreaming systems that model constraints. 2:38:21 You act on models of your needs, not on your needs.
Wow, you rock so hard! This is amazing. I realize it's selfish in nature so that you can get the info in your head and quickly reference it in future, but you choose to do it on a public platform and for that I thank you.
Never imagined that an artificial intelligence podcast would offer such incredible insights into general natural intelligence and the nature of reality. Joscha's poetic coherence and Lex's romanticism make this podcast seem like a simulation within a simulation.
yea.. and im wondering if they'll ever quit going into the same simulation. If they understand you can jump from simulation to simulation - jump into the real one and stop relying on the language of the ones you jumped from -- because theyre going in circles getting more and more complex - this is wrong, or dumb. They need to move towards simplicity. He should know this if he keeps talking about fractals.
@Mr. E Just a brainless post-modernist take on reality. "Nothing is real - it's all in your head". His entire psuedo-intellectual gobblygook is based on one fact - everything we experience comes through our brain. Duhhhh. He goes on to say nothing is real, you can never see truth, colours aren't real - what an idiot. Everything you see contains reality, and everything you experience contains truth. Practice critical thinking and that ratio of imagination to truth improves to favour truth. Consensus does a great job of checking your brain against other brains. Next! No more bullshit needs to be spun from the "we experience with our brains" fact.
Sometimes it takes an hour or so for someone to even mention AI :D. Not as much Artificial Intelligence Podcast as just Life and Philosophy Podcast hosted by a guy who happens to be very interested in AI :D.
I have listened to almost all the lex episodes. This the most insightful conversation on human nature Lex has ever had. I have watched it 3 times and will watch many more and learn new things everytime. Bach is just phenomenal. His sentences are very condensed and distilled. No wasted words, no pauses, efficient and well thought out and researched ideas. Incredible
Man respect to Lex for being able to carry on a conversation with this guy. I couldn’t keep up with hardly any of that let alone been able to formulate a response more intelligent than grunts and noises.
I'm an idiot who's barely employable, but I feel I understand clearly what he is saying, his thoughts don't make me feel confused, it makes me feel satisfied with his articulation and I'm sure I'll spend a week or more pondering this, but this situation makes me so confused about myself, I'm so bad at doing everything, but stuff like this seems crystal clear, I feel that it might have something to do with the fact that, as was suggested, my simulation is so poorly adapted for this environment that my brain is super tuned to finding out what this environment even is.
@@wilbertwallace6655 nah you just gotta fail more. Learn how to play Mary had a little lamb on three instruments. Than go play it for someone. See what happens.
One of the things I love about listening to Joscha is not just his accent, but the poetry and precision of his word choice and phrasing. It's beautiful, and meanwhile he is speaking deeply and profoundly, ranging across so many fields and intellectual tributaries... He offers the most intricate thinking and the most detailed, promising world view that I can nearly imagine grasping eventually.
Truly the best guest ever I’ve spent hours and hours listening to this one and rewinding it to listen again, this guy needs to come back and be a regular guest.
By far my favourite conversation with Lex. I keep coming back to it. Joshua Bach is another level smart. Just to point out, both of these guys are talking in their second languages.
We used Physics to deconstruct praying in religion which somewhat grants wishes by using the abilities of our frontal lob of our brains and hive mind to subconsciously influence others to achieve our wish. Now that you are outside the box and can see the box you can create new rules/ideas. 1. If the wish is not possible or you do not properly and effortlessly execute it then pray will probably not work for you 2. You can create methods like visualization of winning a race or getting a promotion and repeating the process will program your subconscious to make accurate decisions to achieve it while using hive mind, and the power of attraction to bring that possibility into reality. That is the importance of understanding the box, it allows you to sharpen your tools, verify they work, upgrade them, and use them efficiently.
This guy has finally given me a framework for life I can really buy into and understand, This was completely fascinating and i am extremely thankful. I love the origin story too, the most creative/interesting people usually always have weird backgrounds.
our way of expressing these concepts always attracts me, and nothing, but nothing compares with it-- the tone, the depth of spirituality, I can't put it into words. Your Manifesting Manual is something I can read over and over and soak up. ru-vid.comUgkxzpa8CIfZcihW4Z0F_ja0QF3W9KIatrsq I am in process of making the routine a solid part of my life, and it has made a difference! I LOVE your 12 meditations too! I know I am a different person after 9 months with Super Manifestor, and in process of continued positive change! You deserve accolades every day of the year! Keep on with everything, and as we say in Spanish, ANIMO! Lots of love and every blessing to you both.
I think this may be the 3rd or 4th video I've ever commented on... This is the best discussion I have ever heard in my life, that I can currently recall. Thanks for letting me hear this Lex
Listen to thousands of hours of intellectual conversations and I think this guy takes the cake. Most of what he's saying is not theory, provable within our own minds
This was my first time listening to this podcast and he answered the questions I’ve spent pondering for most of the past 6 decades on the meaning of life and if there is a god so beautifully and simply. I love the analogy about happiness being a cookie. He spoke to the issues I’ve had about the Genesis story and so much more in a straightforward simple manner without resorting to the standard line given by religious leaders that we must have “faith”. I do appreciate his honesty and knowledge and the simplicity of his answers and his understanding of different cultures and beliefs. I really appreciate Lex and his honesty and integrity and his pursuit of understanding of people and that he isn’t seeking to place a judgment on, good or bad, or cast blame on or promote or elevate people that he interviews but rather seeks to expose the truth, the reality and the humanity in each and every person. He leaves it to the viewers to form their own opinions, their own judgments, if one finds it necessary to judge others. He also explains his own thoughts and feelings and motivations and seeks to truly understand and empathize with each individual as a human being. None of us are perfect. Thankfully. We are each different and have had our own unique experiences, which we each absorb and respond to in our own ways. We should all be more open minded and seek to follow Lex’s example. Allow ourselves to be awed by each other, to find our own “cookies” of happiness without harming others, verbally, emotionally, mentally or physically.
Truly an epic Lex interview - the way Joscha relates his ideas is SOOOOOO dense, I have to rerun over and over to to grasp it, then to appreciate it, then to be captivated by the poetic beauty of it...amazing!
This is the kind of podcast you need a notepad and a pen to understand. The quality of conversation and ideas is enough for a premium lecture and i cant believe i can watch it, learn from it for free. Thank you Lex for creating the podcast and for inviting joscha bach to the podcast.
Best podcast ever. I was having a bad day and then what he said about being a nerd and relating to people really made so much sense and it made me feel better about things. And then the rest of it _completely_ blew my mind. I never donate to anything but I feel like since this is probably the best thing in my life its unethical to _not_ donate to the Patreon so I did.
hi , nerd here as well, in the spirit of gifting information i would like to suggest ru-vid.comvideos (cognitive science) ru-vid.com/show-UCyOZmV5gC74-1m3iQFUC6DQ (cogntive psychology) more reality altering stuff :P
@@Andy-pl7nk It helps if you are familiar with IT concepts. I work my whole life in IT, so I'm lucky in that sense to be able to follow him. Still I had to listen to this podcast multiple times over a couple of months to extract 75% out of it.
Maybe the best 3-hour podcast interview ever, one of a few worth viewing multiple times. Joscha is a beacon for outside observer nerds the world over. Lex as the interviewer is a delicious icing on the dense lemon pound cake of abstraction being served here. Have and will embed myself in this experience again. 5 stars.
And to imagine, their great grandparents probably fought and killed each other in ww2, and now we have such great minds meeting and discussing science , philosophy and solving great problems in our societies. Imagine how much faster the world would have developed had we spent money and time in building and progressing, instead of fighting wars.
If you listen to Joscha long enough you start thinking like him. He has a very pragmatic and analytical way of thinking, but he is cheerful and playful at the same time and I like it when he is talking about his kids and in the very end of the interview his interpretation of Genesis as a portrayal of childhood memories.
This gentleman might just be one of if not the smartest individuals I've ever heard speak in my life, this podcast is just wow I keep keeping back to it learning more each time and realizing how true the stuff he says is based on my experiences.
The definition of intelligence that "it is the device by which we model the world" has made so much sense to me that I don't think I will ever forget about it. It finally makes sense why humans are what they are and what sets them apart from other organisms.
Lex that was figuratively mind blowing! I mean - I had to actually pause a few times towards the end just to wrap my mind around the brilliant gems just gushing out of Joscha. OMG! Especially the last half hour! I have been struggling with these issues my entire life and went back to college to become a molecular biologist just to find the Cell is the answer as well. This brilliant human just validated everything I have been. slaving to uncover for 40 years - just exceptional Lex. Thank you so much. And if you ever start a hidden realm like John Galt - please, please come get me! I'm ready to go! Edit- I actually have watched this 2x now all the way through. Just ...I can't even...life affirming. I seriously agree 100% with Joscha...get it completely yet...blows my mind.
@@mobsnitchanonymous213 really? Someone who does not even adhere to the basic principles of his own method. Master your primary instrument, Mind, Consciousness. MASTER, not tell a story about it. 99.99% of so called acientists can not even stop their own thoughtflow for 30 seconds, eyes open, let alone for hours on end. Not a clue what consciousness is. You cant know what swimming is by looking at a picture of a swimming person. Read my post elsewhere to some links that clarify this. NO AI, not our tiny minds, are going to save us from extinction. Did the politics, the religion, the science, the philosophy or the technology of the lizard make it create wings? Yes, the answer is in the cells, and nature will take care of it, by forcing us with our backs against the wall, to evolve into Cosmic Consciousness. And that is only an intermediate step.
@@wilLOCK I just watched something that winds the torroidal aspect of space with light and the creation of matter that will reverberate with all who want to know the truth about the universe and how things really work. These are some of the sharpest tools in the shed, so prepare for an amazing treat! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-M_qEhKL5cyc.html (it will start at the torriodal part but back it up, the whole thing is great!) They go into quantum physics, electric nature of the sun, how planets are created and spit out, how matter created, etc. I'm so excited!!
8:46 Nietzsche, understanding the comedy of your situation, lack of self-awareness, taking yourself (too) seriously as a function of your own misunderstanding, etc.. This section hit me (and my inflated ego) deeply. I feel exposed. Thank you.
Lex, could you please ask every future guest how each of them approaches learning? I think it would benefit people a lot to gain an insight into the meta-learning skills that these brilliant minds use (though probably not always applicable to us mortals). Amazing session. Joscha is a beast!
My weekend data science project is to develop an algorithm, analyze this data you provide, and make a projection of the most likely thing that will be said about episode 102. And I'd better work fast, because Lex is cranking them out fast :)
Joscha is such an eloquent and brilliant speaker. His responses were so rapid and well thought out, it astounds me how he gained so much knowledge and has such a breadth of understanding of so many worldly issues. I don't agree every cell is a turing machine yet, but the analogy is incredible. All of these interviews Lex performs highlight my ignorance and laziness, but it still makes me happy to know there are those of you seizing every second of life.
@@andrewwright1922 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Is it possible to fall in L O V E with a mind ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Y E S . I t ' s very possible . ------
@@Robocop-qe7le how is cramming al this knowledge in a 3 hour podcast not communicating effectively? He got lots of complicated ideas across in record time imo.
Robocop2015 I think you need to rewatch. This was incredible to behold and ponder. He does not need to be correct, I found myself at odds with many things he said. Many of these quests do not [yet] have answers.
@@Robocop-qe7lejust like you, I used to believe that ppl who are extremely smart, talk fast, explain things way too complicated for "normal ppl" like me are just arrogant and want to be seen as intelligent. but i was wrong and just intimidated by their intelligence. they really just are like this and are cognitively superior. thats why their explanations seem trivial to them but complex to others
Truly transcendental experience. No single school, book, event or conversation can be as insightful and eye opening as these 3 hours. Opened me to so many new ideas, philosophies, ideologies and perspective. How can this guy be real and i have not heard of him? It was like a land mine exploding inside my mind every time Joscha was dropping ideas (or bombs). According to me, he is the result of many philosophers, computer scientists, physicists & mathemeticians in one. He should be the benchmark for human intelligence, period!
100%, honestly, I'm continually surprised that he doesn't have a higher profile than he does. I think he'll be recognized very soon in the broader public sphere of science as one of the all-time greats. He's still young too, by intellectual/great thinker standards.
question 🙋… a neurone is just particles passing through a membrane.. a computer 💻 and all it’s processing can be done with just valves buckets pipes and water. A touring machine is just punch tape and 🕳…. How can consciousness “emerge” from these things…? This guy is a joke in my opinion.
@@mrbwatson8081 I understand that you are incredulous, but if there is a computable explanation of consciousness, then that does mean that any Turing-complete system of sufficient size could be arranged in a way for it to create conscious experience, even your valves buckets pipes and water example. The system would have to be gigantic and the processing would be very slow, but we already know that in principle, such a system can learn to solve novel problems, since one can let an artificial intelligence run on such an arrangement - if you have some means of producing the "input" into that system. Whether we come to the conclusion that consciousness can be fully explained in terms of computation depends on whether there is any aspect of consciousness that appears unreproducable in a computational framework. The things that are (commonly) most arguable here are Qualia, and Dr. Bach argues that Qualia are likely produced by the brain as part of a simulation that serves to integrate both pre-processed sensory information and the associated meaning with the scenes, objects, sounds, people, etc that were detected during that processing. So the Qualia are then "loaded into" that simulation together with the objects and so on. We as conscious creatures identify with the symbols within that internal simulation, most(ly) with the representation of our own body within that simulated world.
@@nornront8749 so you seriously think valves pipes buckets and water can be put together in such a way that consciousness would emerge…? Who in their right mind could believe that…? Seriously 😐… why is it when it comes to consciousness people think it’s plausible to hypothesise such stupidity 🤪…! You think valves pipes buckets and water can be arranged in such a way that consciousness would emerge😂🤣 ….. 🪄 🎩 🐇 .. what makes you think that it’s even plausible…? “Depends on weather there is any aspect of consciousness that appears unreproducible in computational framework” 🤣😂🤣 you moron consciousness is experiential show me some computation that can experience itself…? 🤣 I think when you was a little boy,you spent a bit too much time alone with your computer. What gives you the notion that a computer can experience anything..? Does a calculator experience calculating when you press = ..? 🤣
This guest says more complex and deep abstract concepts so quickly and perfectly and never says um, uh, or anything to the point where I've rarely seen someone so amazing 👏🙀 Don't you love it when you hear about a new Author or an interesting field of study..well this Scientist amazes me. So thankful to you Lex for having him on.🙏
This podcast should be a six part mini series. It's just impossible to comprehend the shear amount of complex brilliance he has bestowed upon us. I am at awe completely mind blown, I have never in my 45 years on this Earth encountered somebody so intelligent and fascinating.
@@gabegabriel9288 Not at all, meditation doesn't teach you about cognitive science or artificial intelligence, they compliment each other greatly. A monk will understand the universe to a lesser degree than this man, even if he understands himself better.
@@pickledpope I must disagree with you here! Science deals with the "objective world", however all "objective" ideas exist within the subjective experience. Meditation is about examining the universe, not from the perspective of ideas, but realising than all intellectual thoughts and ideas are comprised of sensations. Enlightenment is about understanding this on an experiencial not intellectual level. The true building blocks of reality are sensations, not atoms or fundamental particles. As all these are concepts and ideas that are comprised of sensations within conciousness. To further illustrate my point, all scientific ideas exist within your own conciousness, how can you get to the bottom of reality by adding ideas on top of idea on top of ideas, when to get to the fundamental building blocks we need to deconstruct the only reality we have: the subjective experience into its constituent sensations.
@@pickledpope to clarify I'm not against scientific ideas at all or saying they aren't true, I'm just saying that they exist on a different higher level of abstraction than the experiencial truth that is revealed through meditation. These ideas are tremendously useful and should obviously be studies and advanced. But *fundamental* truth exists in the experience as it is, not as higher level abstractions.
I feel foolish to even comment on the content here. This is, without question, the most densely-packed thought-provoking three hours of information I have ever experienced. I may never unpack it all but it has me fighting so incredibly hard to force new neural pathways so to better understand anything, old or new, to the point I feel similar to the way I did when learning things as a teenager. This was a borderline childish experience for me. Experiencing Joscha for the first time will continue to be an immense joy.
48:01- Lex (with existential dread on his face): "But hold on a second! Do I exist?" This is gold. Edit: 1:27:19 - Lex (unironically): "But maybe the trees are the ones who made the phones." This just keeps on giving!
We are reintroducing carbon back into the carbon cycle, which can only be a good thing for life on the whole - terrible for us and species like us though
Wow, I am 30 minutes into this and have watched the 'happiness is the cookie your brain makes for itself' clip... and this might just be the best ever episode on this podcast! What a guy Joscha! Thanks Lex for this... only you can question and comprehend AI and philosophy so deeply while still making it accessible for everyone.
I appreciate the hell out of the fact that he doesn't use a lot of ads. Makes it easy to lay down and relax and listen without having to skip every 5 mins
love this podcast because this is the podcast where lex develops his intuition that consciousness is emergent 'a useful trick' of brain simulating what it would be like to be in the physical space for an evolutionary advantage. 48:10
Lex, you are the perfect interviewer for such an original thinker as Joscha Bach. You go deep and you don't let go until you wrestle the idea into the open. Just love listening to you process in real-time. This is by far the most interesting and I would say exhilarating session I have ever listened to - on any podcast. I am sure Joscha is going to make a significant impact on humanity. Thank you for all you do!
One of the things I love about listening to Joscha is not just his accent, but the poetry and precision of his word choice and phrasing. It's beautiful, and meanwhile he is speaking deeply and profoundly, ranging across so many fields and intellectual tributaries... He offers the most intricate thinking and the most detailed, promising world view that I can nearly imagine grasping eventually.
Watched twice and never lost my attention.. gained more on the second round, might go a third. This is brilliant Joscha and a great watch Lex keep up the great conversations of inspiration.
Most mind-blowing thoughts I've gained from here: - Idea of us being self-recovering memory of initial step to become fully self-aware - Genesis being childhood memory of uprising consciousness Thank you Lex, keep dreaming big and staying amazed/ing!
My god Lex, you have all of my dream guests in your podcast. Love you both! And this is the first podcast I need to listen 0.8 speed, Joscha's mind is rapid :)
This is quickly becoming one of my favorite podcasts to listen to. Regularly intriguing and insightful conversations and sometimes extremely difficult to follow.
Odds Trump is listening to this podcast: 1 in 1.300000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000...
This talk was amazing, I have watched it 3 times already just to give myself time to internalize everything. Also tried to discuss the topics with others to see if i can explain it to them, those failures brought me back to refresh my memory and understanding.
"I define a nerd as someone who thinks the purpose of communication is to submit your ideas to peer review. Normal people understand that the purpose of communication is to negotiate alignment and these purposes tend to conflict which means that nerds have to learn how to communicate with society at large." ok
The most interesting conversation I have ever listened to. Started listening to it while going for a walk and found that I needed to focus so much that I could not walk and listen at the same time. Every sentence that comes out of Joshua’s mouth is deeply interesting and deserves a good amount of thought to digest. What an incredible podcast!
2:29:17 "So the Catholic Church implemented game-theoretic principles" 2:34:45 "The society of the US is a society of cheaters. People do things that they know are wrong" ... "They suggest some non-sustainable business models and implement them". 2:37:20 "You also said that becoming adult means you take charge of your emotions. Maybe you never said that. Maybe I just made it up." So happy to be alive during this time.
Yeah - that whole "opening the eyes wide like a crazed shaman" whenever a mindbender rolls off your tongue - thing is clearly justified. What a mind this dude has on him.
I have watched nearly every Lex interview, and I want to hang out with Joscha more than anyone else so far. He makes great connections between normally disparate concepts. What a cool dude! For example, the idea that there could be greater intelligences on the earth, just at different timescales is pretty interesting.
@@I-0-0-I I was about to post almost the exact same sentence you did. Mine was that Joscha has the ability to collate data from disparate disciplines into answers to questions no one has asked yet. His pattern recognition is superior.
It's amazing to hear Joscha talking about these complicated subjects with such a humble confidence and using normal English words! If our consciousness is a "software" construct, does that mean that individuals with Dissociative Personality Disorder and Alien Hand Syndrome have a "multi tasking" brain that runs two implementations at the same time?
