I got sent this Lima Crab by Frank as a donation to see if i could get it back together and running. Thanks to Frank and also to Stuart from St Mary Church Model Railway Support - ko-fi.com/00bi... FAQ - ko-fi.com/post...
Thanks for the tips. I have just acquired an abused non running Lima 205125 MWG (Black British Railways livery '42700'), seemingly the same loco as in your video. It suffered swollen weights in the tender and loco chassis, these had distorted the tender shell and loco chassis. Once I filed the weights back to size, everything works. It just doesn't like 1st radius Hornby curves and the uncovered loco wheels refuse to rotate on them, but fine everywhere else. I found you can remove the loco / chassis weight without removing any of the wheel connecting rods by lifting the axles out complete. Ideal for those of us likely to lose the tiny nuts.
I'm with you there Bill , fixing tractors and sweepers , no worries , one of those little pins in a watch strap and it's vibrating like a drunk before opening time . Sympathise as you're obviously describing a well loved hobby .
Dear Bill, 1/good video 2/Richard Gardiner, a contributor to now defunct Airfix Model Trains ( edited by Chris Ellis, of the defunct Airfix Magazine, with those amazing Airfix City of Truro conversions) did an excellent article on upgrading the Lima Crab ( Hughes cl 5 2-6-0 ).3/ As Aussie Pom below says, the tender is all wrong, however,Richard Gardner modified the tender body to the correct width and length, and by retaining the Lima tender chassis, you end up with a Deeley tender chassis with a new Fowler tender body version, a modification which the LMS did in the late 1930s.Hence a rare tender variant. 4/The prototype Crabs were intended to get a new L&Y style tender to match the Crab's wide cab.but this was not to be, instead the narrow Fowler tender sufficed.5/regards from Australia.
I have had one of these from new in 1985 or thereabouts. It ran well on DC for a year and then was put away for 25 years, since which time on both DC and DCC it has not performed well. I have had endless trouble, so much so that a kind person from RM Web sent me a replacement tender. This worked quite well but the loco would not go at slow speeds and stalled over some of my many dead frog points, because, I think, of the 2 wheel pickup and short wheel base of the tender. It also slowed when going round 2nd and 3rd radius curves. This is despite the removal of the centre tender wheels. There is no apparent Mazak rot and the driving wheels turn freely by hand. There is also a spring on the screw connecting tender to engine without which it will not work. I think it is time to revisit the tender motor, given your advice in the video. The motor itself appears not to be running freely at lower speeds under load when on the track. Thank you for this video. Great help.
One tip I was given for shaky hands is immediately before performing the required action clap your hands together hard. This can ‘confuse your system’ long enough to perform the action. Doesn’t always work but might be worth a try.
Very nice job of restoring such a poorly designed loco and tender. It is an attractive livery and worth saving. I suppose people mean well, but commenting on your shaking hands seems rude to me. My father had Parkinson's and it was a terrible thing. Glad your tremor is just a minor annoyance. Thanks for all you do.
Ime the same Bill, when I try and do something tiny, I feel fine, then pick up a paint brush or tool and I shake like the dickens , very frustrating. Great job I thought that engine was a lost cause
Nicely done Bill. FYI, those two stalky things on the tender rear are ventilators, to allow air out as water fills the tender tank. Or as water gets used up, in reverse......
I've done battle with one of these in the past. I agree with all your points and the comments, but it was on par with many of its age I guess. A couple of points. The connection between cab and tender is awful. It relies on the long screw shoulder connecting with the washer/ tab on the engine, and then the drawbar making contact with the screw and tender connection. This works OK-ish when new but wear makes it all slop and fail. I ran a thin wire soldered directly between the engine pickup and motor. It's much less erratic afterwards. Also, you can dampen down the motor noise on this and airfix tender drives by sticking foam backed tape to the insides.
You did an excellent job. I've had a loco drive Lima 2-8-2 DB BR39 since I was 5. It picks up half from the loco and half from the tender. The loco front axle transmits current to the motor by running on a mazak block that weighs down on the base plate axle contacts. The entire metal base plate is live, and the front truck also picks up. The base bock has a slight mazak rot bubble in one point, but not in a position that can hinder the pickup or drive. I use technically petroleum jelly on on axles and pick-ups, it lubricates and also conducts electricity while not damaging plastic. I also apply it to the motor gears.
Another excellent fix video, the livery does look good and you've got it running really well. I had two of these as non runners that I manged to put together to have a running model. However it was such a kerfuffle that once completed I never wanted to run it again !
Yay the good old manky brush . Nice looking loco . Some quite fine lining on the tender which left Hornby behind back in 1978 when this loco was announced . The tender I think is the wrong width . The real things had quite noticeably narrower tenders in comparison to the cab . In that respect the model actually looks better than the real thing ! Good to see another oldie restored . People get quite sniffy about Lima models but she looks good to me . Not bad for a Nuts loco !
I bought on of these Crabs back in the 80s when they first came out. However, at the time I didn't have a proper layout so it had little use. It was maybe 25 years later when I finally got round to build a permanent layout. When I came to Run the Crab, the loco driving wheels became rather stiff. I took it apart and the dicast weight appeared to have become swollen and was causing the frames to distort and rub on the wheels, similar to the one on your loco. Why it was like this I don't know as it wasn't when new. Rather strange! I filed it flat and put it all back together and it ran perfectly. Yes, those centre wheels on the tender were a little crude. An interesting video, I wonder how many other Crabs had this problem? However, all this is now in the past as I now only model in 16mm scale!
It's a corrosion process known as "zinc pest" or mazak/zamak rot. The zinc-based alloy needs to be made with very pure zinc -- the slightest contamination with lead leads to a form of corrosion that makes the metal swell up.
I've resurrected a couple of the Lima Crabs and 3 Lima Kings, all with distorted chassis due to mazag rot to a greater or lesser degree. The mazag can be filled to remove bulges etc and if the chassis has distorted too much - quite common - it can be returned to it's original shape by heating with a hair dryer - the plastic has a 'memory' and will be returned to its proper shape when as it cools. I wish I could remember where I learnt this so I could credit whoever it was!!
Brave man! Those Lima Crabs are awful. They can look quite nice, but you're very lucky if they run well, and servicing them is pretty much a nightmare. The Lima 4F's are a bit simpler, but also not easy to get running at all well. You did an excellent job on this one. You even got it running quite smoothly and quietly, and they can often be found sounding like coffee grinders.
Hi Bill, excellent video as usual. I notice at 20:20 the left hand drop link to union link is bent 45 degrees from vertical. If this re-aligned it might help smooth running. All the Best
Mazac rot is a common problem on these models, I managed to file mine flat without any issues. I fitted a CD motor and pick ups to the other side of the loco and hard wired both sides back to the tender so as not to rely on that spring wire. she now runs super smooth and faultless. As for the steps on the front bogie, I always thought that was a brilliant idea.
That spring with which I have had trouble, might be the answer I am looking for. Th loco runs freely but is also stalling frequently. I might try the hard wiring etc you suggest.
One thought on mazak rot. Once you have filed the swollen block, paint it over completely with black gloss enamel paint so that it is sealed from the atmosphere. As you know, the rot is a reaction, and if you can remove the oxygen supply.......
Hi Bill, your comment about your shaking hands that they get worse the fiddly the job. Mine do this too, I've had it for decades. I was diagnosed with Essential Tremor. The doctor gave me some medication, which helps a lot. It might be worth checking it out.
I have one in black the issue with mine is that the front driving wheels dont run freely i yhink might need lubrication also the middle wheel on the front part of the engine tends to bounce up and down a bit
I had a similar kind of problem with my Lima GWR 4500 class loco. It had apparently never seen any length of track, but was a non runner because the die cast weights were bulging. Removing them without breaking the loco chassis was a pain. I ended up scrapping the weights and manufacturing new ones from steel. Was it worth the effort? No. Was it fun? Yes!
Good evening Bill and people of RU-vid I myself have one of these Lima Crabs, and thanks to this video in particular I have the thing running smoothly, even at lowish speeds (though it can struggle a bit over the numerous points in my TMD). However, it does suffer a little problem with wheel lockup. I have no idea why this happens though I suspect it has something to do with the rods underneath the cylinders, rather than the driving rods or the valve gear. I cannot get into the body, I've turned the blasted screw for about half an hour and it didn't budge. Does anyone have any ideas how to investigate and fix the problem preferably without putting myself through the pain of unscrewing the body? I have read a solution on RM Web where you disassemble the rod assembly and solder the things but this is a bit beyond my capabilites. As such I'm stuck. Any ideas? **EDIT** - i have no idea what i did but the rods dont lock up anymore. Runs nicely now!
Hi Bill, do you have a pair of tender weights for a Lima Crab that you would sell to me? I have an ebay non runner which is now OK but the weights were missing.
I've had 2 Lima N gauge models. They use a smaller version of that ringfield motor. Except it's too large for the gauge and you end up with a model that is too big. It was also awful to work on. Imagine a thumb nail size ringfield motor. It has put me off the mark for life.
I agree - it's a handsome model in that livery. And as for shaky hands - Insignificant set beside your uncanny ability to disassemble ageing plastic "clip togethers" without breaking the clips off... Great to see the new lay out starting to take shape. Think you ought to feature in the new landscape - ru-vid.comX71q3t_YgVk 😀
