LS - Problems with Bel'Veth? 

When she was teased (or rather leaked) we got this idea of aa void swarm kind of champion (having lots of minions, etc). When your cinematic was released we got the impression of her infecting the environment or others to create a swarm that would overwhelm any force. When we got the champion kit reveal we got a on-hit champion with scaling attack speed from farming jungle, damage reduction ability, and some arbitrary movement ability. Where was her swarm-like theme? Slapped onto her ultimate- completely disjointed from the rest of her kit. Man, Riot really dropped the ball on this champion.

Easy fix, make her monster voidlings follow her and you can stack them through the clear, they default to lanes if you get too close to the minions, that way she can keep her theme, have extra power in duels at river fights, not feel useless in clears compared to the meta junglers, and have a clear role in competitive matches being actually playable, just need to tweak the ratios ofc

I've played like a dozen games with her now. she either stomps incredibly hard or gets stomped incredibly hard. I've tried a few different strats and a full clear into scuttle or 5 camp clear into scuttle, if they don't invade you early and you get that scuttle, youre off to a good start. if you get herald or drag before 10 min you run away with the game. If they invade you early you're just irrelevant all game.

But how will this effect my silver games?

Maybe her passive need jhin/yas treatment meaning when she builds atk speed some will go to AD, and building atk speed gives AD

Watching LS play belveth on stream hurt me inside. I think it's safe to say we should take this opinion with a grain of salt

her swarm abilities need to be put on one of her basic abilities because it being put on her r with the condition of you needing to kill baron or herald feels very bad and when she was teased she was teased as a swarm like champion

riot should stop forcing roles with mechanics. just make her numbers good in jungle, not kindred mini game that makes you useless until 15 minutes

The biggest problem is she is actually balanced in bronze and iron with horrifyingly low winrate anywhere else, even silver. If they balance her for anyone else, she will ruin ranked players experiences in bronze.

6:43 GOD I miss the old Mordekaiser, I still can't come to terms with this, he was just so ridiculously fun to play in so many ways. Riot used to say they'll never delete champions, and yet here we are, together with Aatrox mains, Sion mains, Galio mains etc.

You brought up a lot of good points. In my ONE actual game and many practices in the PBE, she also feels like a worse Master Yi. They both relay heavily on attack speed and are weak early game. While Bel technically doesn't need AS items, early on she is so god damn slow and does less damage early that many will be rushing Kraken Slayer and Rage Blade to get that boost. But here is why I am making the YI comparison. Because while she does seem to have lots of sustain, she is entirely vulnerable, even with her E. The reason why Yi is so annoying, is because a fed/late game Yi will spend more time off screen than in, because of his Q. That ability makes him un targetable and with AS items and Takedowns Yi players will spam that like no tomorrow. High elo players will know better how to deal with one and also end a game sooner than the lower elo ones. On average at least. Bel'Veth NEEDS to stay in until the late game and seems to be entirely dependent on her team. Which in Solo Q, a good team is never a guarantee, more like a lucky break. And if you are up against a semi-competent enemy team, just hope that your laners are doing better than you. While I am VERY excited for her release, I will not lie, any and all Bel'Veth players will have a TOUGH time.

imo she just needs to be able to pop her ulti by default. It's feels super awful to get collapsed on once in a game, have your entire jungle taken, and be unable to be useful thanks to her extremely weak base form. The only way to come back is a lucky assist or sneaky dragon/rift, which both are incredibly unlikely to happen once the enemy team has the advantage. Basically, in her current state she is far too feast or famine and has 0 consistency. Maybe give her another transform condition where after 6 camps it spawns a piece of coral? Idk something needs to be done to address her only on kill ulti

As much as I like Bel Veth's design it seems weird to force her into one of the slowest scaling roles in the game lmao

I love her as a concept, a single dueling 1v1 atk speed champion (I used to play old sion like this), they just need to pick up her clear.

Did she have modiffyers on non attack items, let’s say she builds bamis cinder, being a recipe item that helps her with that first spike, and then building into either frost for slow to stick or sunfire for the Onhit on it.

I think its way to early, lets see what happens when she is in actual games. People said, even challenger players, that Zeri sucked when she was released and well, we all know how that went.

Another banger from Ls himself

When you mentioned the ping at like 5 minutes in I feel that's a lot bigger part of your results than you make it out to be. Zed would also seem like hot dogshit on 200 ping.

One thing ive been experimenting with is an E and W max tank jg. Titanic -> Sunfire but it has typical early game woes but the tiamat does increase clear times a bit and makes it easier

They could make it so that her E has a passive, that grants her like bonus Life Steal. Or her Q grants her bonus AD based on Attack Speed or something.

Is this not anecdotal? Belveth is hard, and so will likely have a low winrate. But videos exist (like phylaris') of her clearing fine. Why would a champion with difficult clear and general play patterns only be good in low elo? I also just don't see the justification for some points about how she doesn't take full advantage of recipe items.

Welp that aged like milk ....again edit: mb looked at wr for all elos

now they will buff her to the moon and she will be insanely overpowered and we will realize her actual state is the balanced one, but we didnt know how to play/build her

This just shows how even amazing coaches cannot predict how players will use new champions, he says she's shit, and theres me with 82% winrate in 30 games in high gold and plat elo. This champ is busted

LS AKA Lavender Sea

Do you think she will be the next funnel champ with sometime like lulu mid to help her keep up

I think this is another viego for you. Belveth turns into a new champion with vamp scepter. She also has good dueling potential early. I also think she will eventually also be played top.

She has to be, even in soloq, picked after the enemy jg, imagine if the enemy pick karthus and full clear the jg at 3:05 and have 30s tempo advantage by the 3 clear

he sounds and looks like he's gonna cry... i feel your pain...

If I am honest I don't really think she's is strong until she gets to use her ulty because that's when her "real form" comes forward, she does more dmg she is faster. It's like that's the real champion instead of the one you see before her transformation. And as you said, if you stop her from getting the objectives and if she fails to gank she will be useless unless her team is just better.

after few games on live server, i thinks she is not that op. Even if she ahead, u can actually kite her out, and if she fall behind, its kinda hard to come back since she need void coral from obj to transform

while ive heard these complaints about bel, after playing about 50 games with her on pbe and a few on live I have to disagree. I've had a very high winrate with her. Her clear is actually really fast. start with raptors-red-wolves-blue or gromp then the other. you finish clear in time to hit skuttle just as it spawns. alternatively you can skip wolves and just do blue and gromp, get skuttle and then rotate back to wolves then raptors again and then krugs. this is a really solid start. her dueling potential is quite high even at low levels dispite what ive heard. her scaling is insane and by the end of a 30 min game youll have 7 attack speed, will delete squishies, and completely outclass most bruisers and tanks, even rammus. I think the issue is how people are playing her, unless the issues dont arise until very high elo im not sure. CC can fuck her and getting counter jungle sucks but she can recover from that surprisingly easily. You REALLY only need her q to clear jungle especially after early game. After a certain point she snowballs out of control. Once people figure out how to play her properly im sure she'll find her place, she really isn't bad.

her gameplay is off, attack speed seems weird for a manta ray champion, I expected her to be a ap, something like summoning fishes to help her clean or something like that, the animations are odd and not pulished, also she just keep getting things tweaked constantly like animations, textures, and now they are completely changing her face on pbe. To me it seems like bel'veth was rushed to make the players happy, since we dind't have a champ new champ since renata in february.

So her only good base return item will be recursive bow thanks to aa modifier

just played 4 games could not agree more

In my opinion, its her jungle clearing ability that needs to be improved, and only that

I know it's early but this champion's design looks so boring. Unfortunate cause the recent champion design were so fun.

I played her 20 games in plat and she feels really good

She can't even oneshot the smallest golems, that's just sad how low aa dmg she has. Feels like her early game needs a buff, because lategame she's fine. Also you should be able to get her impowered ultimate without having to kill baron / herald.

The main problem with this champ it seems like is going to be that she cant be buffed since because of her infinite dashes she will just be unstopabble when buffed

Man didn’t expect her fucking E to be so broken

Maybe your viewer base is just outclasing you in the game and thats why you have so low winrate.

Average content creator before release: BROKEN CHAMP !!!!! RIOT WTF 100 KILL GAME (1 SHOOTING BARON)

i think belveth needs adjusting. nerf the swarm and buff her basic spells like her e

So 3:06-3:15 full clear not good enough? Huh kinda doubt on that. Agree on the rest.

They said the same thing about veigo now look at him

I like the idea of Bel Veth, and despite how you feel I LOVE that she is meant only for jungle! (I'm tired of laners getting all the cool champs and then stealing junglers too haha). As a jungler it's nice to get attention other than reports lmao. Hopefully they can find a reasonable way to make her more playable though.....and also buff Kindred!

A champion with a lower winrate than Ryze? WHAT? Sounds like a hotfix buff to meqeqeq

Ah so Riot finally released a champion that reminds people what SCALING is actually SUPPPOSED to feel like. Not... Yasuo/Yone/Yi gets half an item so now they can get a penta no problem.

her passive should work on cannon minions

I bought bel veth, played one game, decided im never gonna play that ever again until she's been buffed

0:53 Ivern?

Its actually crazy how off base LS is in this video. 2 weeks after release people will be begging for a nerf

Thank you riot games for spoon-feeding another champ to low-elo plebs like us. I'm gonna do the funny and spam bel'veth top.

Bad design from concept not viable unless stats are insane they should rework her into a mage instead of being a blood razer squishy.

She starts off very weak and gets really scary if she pops off. Definitely feels like a low elo master yi kind of champion

u need 1st herald or you are useless all game, its a high elo strategy champ but sucks on master+(no cc no mobility no tank, nothing) this will be a dead champ no matter what

the problem with belvath is why play her when yi exist, yi is stronger early and late game im more scared of yi than belveth, she need to do bonus damage to monsters

Doesn't Riot have Master+ players to playtest these monstrosities ? All of the problems listed in just the first minute can be easily surface in alpha with competent players

cant wait for LS to be wrong and this becomes another viego-esk situation :)

I outfarm every single jungler for the most part of my games.

idk about this.. sure she is weak early but she can 1v1 almost any champ in the game and her scaling mid to late game to me, is probably the strongest in the entire game. The most disgusting thing about her is her samira ult.... it seems absolutely broken especially in team fights / skirmishes

stop building her ad then my dude, she's much better as an ap champ

It might be a bad idea but I think that her early game would be so much better if her scaling wasn't weirdly locked behind her level, each stack at level 1 gives her 0.60as and it's like.. why not just give her 1% off of the bat and not make her have to level to make use of her passive effectively

Her problem is her passive honestly. It litterly forces the champion into 1 roll. Which honestly is exstreamly unfun. If you were to change the stacking system to be similar to thresh or senna the issue could be solved on that front. I dont think her jungle is an issue due to how hard she scales. Honestly I expect her to dominate games where her team is ahead in low ello, but suffer in pro play as Her lack of power can be abused in high ello and pro play early game.

Pooor poor pooi4 man's shyvana

Her R feels like absolute shit. Stand still for 1.5 seconds while everyone can still auto you.

Her q is so bad while u have dashes but just in specific direction making u die trying to run away from enemy and her ult mid fight rooting herself to get the coral is so stupid

Belveth is so slow champion both her clear and movement speed. I like conception, but she needs huge buffs or adjustments to be reliable. She is really weird champion she has great early and theoritically great late, but atrocious midgame, which makes you often useless late

Try full crit belveth with navori

I played her in my first game and got an S+, I had 260 cs, I was duod with the support who was playing janna, and I won most of my duals, she is very weak in team fight as she gets focused a lot, I got both heralds, 1 baron, and I think 3 drags, I went 18/6/3… I had so much fun with her and I will continue to play her

I really don't know why a champion with this design got the kit of an autoattacking slapping champion, it really feels out of place, even worse than Aurelion way back when.

For a scaling champion that has weak wave and jungle clear that sounds really bad

They gave garens ult 100% ap scaling and its aoe

"Here is a bunch of my thoughts on the champ, oh but I played on 200 ping and can't reliably do the most basic ani-cancel required." Yeah ok, whatever. Post this video when you can actually play the champ without a ping gap.

They should have just reworked Master Yi instead of making Bel´Veth

She a Tiamat user??

bel'veth can 1v1 with the enemy jg if they're even.

Give Riot Nuggets again to buff her

Her clear is actually not bad phylaris has a great video on it

Huge miss. Champ is turbo OP

This video me. Haahhaahahah 😂 who could imagine the reality

Thank you for ruining my hype waiting since a decade for a decent scaling jungler who can maybe face top and mid's scalers :D

i dont think bel veth is hard in my opinion she could be easily a 1 diffculty champ but the problem is that she is EXTREMELY weak and she have countless counters so she's a non reliable champ

I think the void spawns need to be nerfed

Low WR = really bad early game

i dont think shes bad 1 v 1..

doubt she'll have a low wr in live

Looking like another taliyah launch :/

what a bunch of bs. "her recipe items dont feel good"??? wtf does that even mean?

Ls also said yone would be bad upon release

I believe you're completely wrong about belveth. I've played her extremely well at top. She can't fight 1v1 till she gets enough atk speed, but taking krugs, and raptors is extremely good for her. Play her as if she's a cheese Yi + Yuumi mid combo. She goes top, and constantly invades with smite + Teleport. Take the jungle item. Treat smite as a ignite. Contest with the jungle objectives. You are going to get flamed, but she does this way to good.

She is too squishy, too weak in early game.

ive never used a worst champ than this holy shit it literally does 0 ( zero ) dmg

i find her ok , her clear is very good , her dueling is very good , i dont agree with this other than the part about the ult , ult is just terrible , it is too conditional , i like the concept but if u cant get that ult she is just weaker a lot and the ult feels so out of place , maybe if her abilities wre enhaced during ult it could be ok , . but i played her and she wins duels and ganks really hard , because of her e ,

This is the worst review ever tbh

shits broken af. like every new champ, and they only get fixed once abused in lcs

Nah first 3 of my games with her were wins with S rank so..... I disagree

This feels like a really problematic and overloaded kit. I think they really overthought this one.

Bel’Veth is broken, honestly no idea what LS is on about. Let’s see how well this video ages lol