Mass Effect - Why You Should KILL the RACHNI QUEEN 

Dan's friend getting married : Dan to his friend : Why you should betray your wife....

The Queen does suggest there was an outside influence that forced the Racni into the war. She talks about a Song they follow, and that something caused the notes to Sour and affect them. So I let her live, because from what she says, something basically Mind controlled the race into the war. Basically confirmed in 3, but it's suggested by what she says in 1.

One thing I greatly respect about Commander Sheppard is if you choose to kill the queen He/She doesn't just press a button and walk way. Sheppard looks the queen dead in the eyes and watches her die. They know the consequences of their choice and they take that burden with them. It says a lot about Sheppard's character that they're willing to accept what they've done and live with it rather than just press a button, look away and pretend it didn't happen.

Only real issue with this mission line is that it shows that the development team wasn't given the time they needed for ME3 due to both Paragon and Renegade options lead to the same outcome with just some dialog tweaks, in interviews some of the team have stated they wanted a completely original mission for Renegade choices in ME1.

If Shepherd knows a war is coming with a super powerful species coming to destroy all advanced species, it would make sense to have an ally which is good at reproducing quickly and waging war. The same reason you may choose to provide Krogans a cure later, since there is more value to them as allies today than negative value as enemies tomorrow.

You are confirmed to have made the right choice to spare in ME2. A mind controlled Asari talks to you and she assures you she's taking care of the Asari and has kept her word to lay low. Maybe I'm crazy but I thought The Rachni Queen was one of the most genuinely honest characters you meet. There's also Eden Prime. They colonists mentioned that sound getting in their head. That was something that I remembered immediately with the mention of song

Well, if we really place ourselves into Shepard's shoes, the logical solution would be neither kill her nor let her go, but keep her there until Higher Ups decide what to do. But that's not an option.

I played the first game blind, or at least, free of rachni-related spoilers, so you can’t say the choice only makes sense knowing how things go in the later games; both the queen and that one scientist point out that not all is as it seems; some say “well of course she’d lie to keep herself alive!” Yeah well, carrying on about songs and sour yellow notes is a really weird lie to come up with, instead of promises of wealth, power, loyalty of a vassal capable of body-snatching your enemies, any lie to stay alive?? In addition, earlier in the same game, on Eden Prime, some of the colonists describe the noise of the *big bad scary ship* as being a sound that sounds/ feels like it’s in your mind, in your brain; hmm… we don’t (at that point in the adventure) know where the “sour yellow note” came from, but by this point in the story, we have two different accounts of strange, evil mind-noises; if she’s lying, her lie makes for a very weird coincidence, and my mind- and the mind of Marlowe Shepard- is more willing to accept that there’s something weird going on rather than there’s a weird coincidence of a colony hearing a brain-invading noise and the queen lying about a brain-invading noise

I always felt that the Rachni being saved twice by Shepard would be most likely to help when the Leviathans decide to make their move at dominance again!

I wish they would have added a third option. "Let her go only if she agrees to let you ride her like a war vehicle"

3:10 An add-on that BigDan didn't mention is that in ME3 Javik says the Protheans bred them to be more war-like.

No way would I kill the arachni queen, even after 10 playthroughs. Even Dr. Who let the Daleks live when we had the chance to wipe them out.

But Rachni queen is best Waifu!

The only reason I *dont* kill her in ME1 and save her again during ME3 is because I help Krogan. If, for any reason, Wrex goes mad or is dethroned and Krogan gets out of control, Rachni will be a good way to balance them out.

"why you should kill the rachni queen Me on a mass effect 3 7800+ war asset run: no, i don't think i will

Meeting the Rachni Queen 👑 is one of the most epic parts of the trilogy and I would not kill off the Rachni because they’re no worse than the crazy Krogan 😂

Actually, the whole game from 1 to 3 everyone criticizes you for saving the queen, so I think that this is one of the few decisions in the game that trully shows your character. That you won't be bothered by the critics and will keep doing what you think it's right. Other than that, even if you kill the queen this won't be the first time people say they are extinct and they are not.

The queen is already essentially a prisoner. Freeing her OR killing her is silly. She should be kept where she is and handed over to the council. A third option of retaining the queen should really have been available. It's one of the sillier non-dilemmas the first game forces on you.

Kill the Rachni Queen? Dan has been on his renegade lately, and I’m here for it. I noticed how Dan’s Cyberpunk videos were also renegade. Betray Meredith Let Takemura die Betray Claire Don’t save Brick Destroy Delamain Betray Judy (this is just criminal)

None of the reasons that led to the rachni war in the first place changed. They are the same threat they used to be. And frankly, same goes to the krogan. One leader, however wise and competent he is, cannot change the mentality of an entire species that was chosen to be soldiers due to their warlike nature. Even though I love Mordin, especially for his "had to be me, someone else might've gotten it wrong" attitude, responsibility at its best, his _conscious choice_ to become sentimental and "see the smaller picture" rather than stay pragmatic and ruthless keeps baffling me.

From what I understood from the codex entry about the rachni war was the the salarians stumbled into rachni habitat and got killed for their trouble. So the council in their infinite wisdom got the krogan to kill them off. It was the same as the first contact war with the turians and humans. Two races that don't understand each other ending in violence. You say there is a good reason that Shepard can't trust the rachni Queen at her word but you can't trust the councils version of history either. They have spun history to justify their decision no matter how flawed it is.

I will always let the Queen live. And damn, that Citadel music will always hit me hard, even when Udina is nattering over it.

4:45 Forget committing genocide, the real monster here is whoever put Wrex in Phoenix armor

I'll bet tough and moral decisions like this won't be anywhere in Mass Effect 4

In ME3 Shep makes a really good point: if she really is the *last* Rachni Queen, she can't afford anything but laying low. She might be able to create a few thousand soldiers in her lifetime but that's not a threat to galactic civilization. The real threat she might pose is centuries away, perhaps over a millennia. Granted, this means she could still pose a threat in the future. But. Like. Maybe opening an embassy or something is the solution here. How did the First Contact War end?

I always choose to spare The Queen just like I always choose to cure the Krogan. You need as many allies as possible to defeat the Reapers. Millions of Krogan and rachni would make excellent ground troops. I would also Imagine that The rachni working together could easily build defensive fortifications and could even accelerate the building of additional ships for the war effort. I do have a theory that had the Reapers try to launch their invasion during the rachni War for the Krogan rebellions, the Reapers could have been beaten without the need of The Crucible. If the Krogan ever tried to exact vengeance, the rachni would be valuable allies and vice versa.

It's the same with Rana Thanoptis, who seems to be friendly in ME1, but if you spare her will become an unstoppable threat to a lot of people. So you either have to murder a friendly NPC in 1 or suffer the consequences in ME3.

Lol Rex is dressed like Ashe

'I'm in the mood to play devil's advocate' *looks at post history* You don't say?

first time i played this game i did not known a thing about the rachni wars, but i know how dangerous they were. i read all the evidences and information about them and learned all i could dig in about the case. in the end, my very first time i played, i choose to release the queen. her words were sincere enough to me. and i didn't knew how this would come. when i played ME2 i was certain i did the right choise, so all is well when ends well!

Next video: Why You Should KILL Paarthurnax

This choice doesn’t matter they will come back regardless

To me the reason I let the Queen live is because of the Rachni shown to already have gotten out. If there is a chance the Queen can rain in any children already released will be best, if the Queen can't to stay undetected it would be in her best interest to deal with those rouge elements.

you could make this into a series of sorts. Looking at major decisions in Mass Effect and giving your opinion. Maybe that's already basically part of other videos, but I would enjoy those kind of videos

Man it's been a year and you grew so much I remember when you had 500 subs no joke your almost at 100k congratulations

It's refreshing to see more mass effect videos, as there aren't many topics left untouched in the trilogy.

2:21 dont worry embassador, something tells me you won't be around

One of my biggest disappointment of the game that if you don't kill the rachni queen, there will be modified rachni warriors on the side of the reapers in ME3, and if you kill the rachni queen there will be still modified rachni warriors on the side of the reapers... So nothing really changes. It could be a really strong thing if they write the game like if you save the queen it seems to be good, don't kill an entire race and so on, but in the ME3 the reapers indoctrinate them again and you have to fight them (maybe if the reapers fall they can be free). And if you kill the queen there won't be rachnis in the ME3 but you have to live knowing that you killed an entire intelligent race with their whole culture and everything (maybe find out that they were not evil at all just indoctrinated).

I liked the angle you went here. Not explaining that there’s a pleasurable beneficial reason for killing the Queen, but instead saying, if you were actually Shepard, that’s what you should do with the information at hand. Didn’t see that coming.

NGL on my first playthrough i wanted to save the queen cause it felt like she really wanted nothing to do with other species... then Wrex asked "Are you stupid?!" and i killed her :D

You remember the Protheans once tamed the Rachni for war and fighting, of which later on they become uncontrollably violent, forcing the Protheans to burn 200 of their worlds, yet they survived many years later. This kinds shows the Rachni's resilient.

3:12 "perhaps"? in me1 she said that her mother's voice was silenced by creatures that shepard is fighting against (maybe its only in LE idk)

I killed the queen way back when the original game was released just to see how the story differed. I haven't killed the queen since then, and I have replayed the ME trilogy dozens of times.

Wrex: “are you stupid?!” 😂😵

grateful video, i'm always curious about the other ways in this mission

Big Dan, this is an extraordinarily compelling analysis especially when we take ethics into consideration. I’ve been obsessed recently with the Dragon Age series especially since the newest game is closer and closer to coming out. Would you make a video whether it is more ethical to side with the Templars or Mages in corrupt Kirkwall?

I wonder if there are any interesting dialog changes depending on who you take and what thier paragon/renegade/racism level is, like at the end of the game you can have Wrex argue to save the council, wonder if its possible here...

Big Dan "Only good Bug, is a dead Bug ! "

Honestly killing the queen is the "smart" decision and allowing her to live only works out due to plot armor.

Even with what you say, the option available is genocide. You can make the same argument Wrex and Udina would, but if they weren't creepy crawlies, if they looked humanoid like everyone else on the Council but were still capable of war, could you honestly pull the trigger? If there's doubt, you should let the Rachni go. If War happens, the universe is a larger place than it was a thousand years ago. and their second chance would be done then.

It's funny how the Rachni Queen tries to call Shepard's bluff, and fails horribly.

I would say that in ropeplay terms it's the opposite if you want to be a boyscout/girlscout paragon type of hero to exterminate a species. It's actually way harder to trust the Rachni to be good on their word, so in the end when they finally become your allies it is a reward for a gamble (a very dangerous one) that was based on trust and the idea that you are not supposed to make species go extinct just because this or that, specially in the case of a species that certainly shows signs of intelligence, understands what is doing and is possibly capable of changing to live in cooperation instead of war. Same thing for the Krogan. You might end ME3 without knowing if the Krogan will wreak havoc after you make your endgame decision of curing the Genophage, some know that you need the female and wrex for a better result on that matter, but even when I didn't have ME1 import I still wanted to cure the Genophage, because it doesn't make sense for a paragon to trick an ally to help his cause. The opposite is valid in case of Renegade, Chaotic morality, but not for a respectable paragon.

3:09 - I thought it was pretty obvious with just the dialogue from ME1. Also, I don't know in which game (it could've been 3 but definitely not its DLC because I've never played it) but I thought it was confirmed that the whole reason that the Rachni War happened in the first place was that it was Sovereign's first attempt to overtake the galaxy without Reaper forces after the Keeper signal failed to trigger. That was also the reason why the Geth were employed, Sovereign had no resources of its own, so it used other races that it could manipulate to wage wars in its stead in an attempt to gain access to the Citadel. The only difference was that the Rachni weren't able to push the galaxy's forces far enough to reach the Citadel. So, realizing that a direct assault with what few Geth could be converted would also not work, it set out to find a way to circumvent the Citadel's defenses and take control before the galaxy could rally their forces.

Cant wait to see these types of videos for future bioware games

when this trilogy launched originally, I was playing WOW, so my first intoduction to this trilogy was the legendary edition on the ps5. I chose to kill the arachni queen. basically I went for rogue points whenever I dealt with the council or higher ups and hero points whenever I made decisions in the field. (mostly). this was my big deviation to that.

“To make the perfect choice with imperfect knowledge. That is what great men do.” Takamura 2077

I see Wrex and I hear Space John Goodman from the great lebowski 😁

With RPGs in general, not just with Mass Effect, I try to avoid killing main characters. I like the idea that they might show up again later with something interesting.

What if I don't want to witness the enormous cop out that is the Cerberus rachni in me3

My 1st playthrough was as paragon & genocide was too big of a stretch. On subsequent playthroughs as ruthless Renegade however, the queen gets the acid bath, as Shepard judges the rachni are too dangerous to unleash.

Big Pro: it makes Wrex happy. He's intelligent, 800 years wise, he's seen some shit so I value his input. If he says they are dangerous, then they are dangerous.

I always let the queen go. First playthrough my thought was "I believe you, but try anything and I'll reenact the Rachni Wars myself." I get a nice thank you and "we are staying out of trouble" message in ME2, and I bailed out the queen yet again to gain a valuable assets for the war effort in ME3, while keeping Grunt alive of course..

Could be a series here Big Dan! Why you should go Paragon or Renegade?

Bro… I start playing Cyberpunk, you make Cyberpunk videos. I finally get back into Mass Effect, and you release a Mass effect video🤯

It was tough, but I thought what the galaxy to the Kroken was too much

We still never found out what happened to the other creature that took control over people in mass effect two

Yay more mass effect from Big D

Yeah right commit genocide by ending the only friendly rachni queen and then lose on like 500 assets later. Great tactic.

Just got update in the news on Mass Effect one I kind of regret not killing it

I♥️you big dan♥️ MrHulthen is ma boy too! I'm a paragon type dude, and I'm more than happy to have X amount of hands/pins/claws to survive because of course I've seen Starship Troopers?! Insert various load ups of various macho infantry units ready to deploy against klendathu and their hordes! Big up the mobile infantry!

When I played ME 1 when it first came out, I chose to kill at first, but I think around my 2nd or 3rd playthrough, I realized that what the queen was saying, the "sour yellow note," was weirdly similar to what the colonists and matriarch Benezia were saying. Something went into their minds, and in Benezia's case, it literally controlled her, but for the colonists, it hurt them immensely until the ship left. So I chose to keep her alive after that since, to me, it at least proved that the rachni were all indoctrinated and this one queen was the species last chance. And in Mass Effect 2, we got to meet that asari captain who let us know that the rachni were peaceful now and only attacked pirates to save her life.

Personally I think the rachni queen is a reference to the Buggers in Ender's Game. The way I justify Shepard letting the queen go is that we don't know the entirety of what happened. The Queen's accounts raise red flags as to the nature of what was going on, so until more data is found, err on the side of caution. If the rachni become a threat again, Shepard will personally step on the front lines to aid in stopping them, even if it means her death. The galaxy has a lot more technological advancement since the Rachni wars and the council has the benefit of knowledge from all the Krogan and salarians that fought in that conflict. To quote a certain Sargent in Halo 2, "They tough, but they ain't invincible." There's also the possibility that the last rachni queen could eventually make open contact with the citadel council and move to have their civilization join the council races. Finally, there's the diversity that they add to council races as far as the variety of perspectives and experiences. While they may look wild, most of mass effect's aliens still follow the head, two arms, two legs body plan. The only ones that don't really follow this, besides the reapers who follow whatever body plan they feel like, are the elcor and the hanar. Both require very specific environments to live in long term. The Hanar even have to use special modules to aid in motion, or gravity would likely crush their insides. Diplomatically, a specialized non humanoid species is not unmanagable. In this case the specialization comes not from their environment, but from their communications, something the Rachni share with the Hanar. There's also no reason they have to colonize new planets to get what they need. They could build a dyson swarm/sphere the way the geth were doing in ME3 when the Quarians attacked. This would allow them to harvest electricity and use it to support more life. They could even potentially disassemble their planet for raw materials, though they may decide that's unwise after learning what happened to the Quarians. Still, where there's a will there's a way, and a dyson swarm is capable of holding trillions of rachni comfortably with room for 'guests' and captive or preserved wildlife. And because things don't typically happen in a vacume, there's no reason why the other races can't build their own dyson spheres/swarms to compete.

It's not just knowledge from me3 involving the Reapers and leviathins, but also Javik. He said that his people used them as biological weapons if I recall. That his people bred them for war. The issue with that, would be that the Protheans took the ones they saw as best for war. So the Rachni that were more war like may have been wiped out in that cycle.

Always a good day when Big Dan posts a video about ME.

Only my renegade does that, maybe next renegade will off the queen and save whatever that breeder is, heard Joker has funny dialogue on that I remember Mass Effect Recalibrated made all the creatures on Noveria Unknown until you are actually told about the Rachni. Dialogue suggests they didn't know what the creatures are despite it saying it right above their health bar. Mission Timings would delay the Cerberus base until you've encountered Thorian Creepers & the Rachni, so no chance of encountering them before Noveria I always bring Liara & Wrex on the mission. For Liara, it just seems personal. For Wrex, the dialogue is just funny "giant bugs are writing songs about you!" Too bad there wasn't just a leave them locked in the cage option

I'll still spare her. Besides, if it means the possibility of fighting with *OR* against them in the theoretical ME4 (assuming the game has the old save bonus for the original trilogy) after their being woefully underused in ME2 and especially ME3, well...

The way i see it the Reapers indoctrinated them So i save her even if my bestie Wrex disagrees But i see the point that Shepard doesn't know this in this situation so it's tough I played the series backwards unfortunately I discovered the ME universe through ME3 then i bought 2 and then i got 1 so when i played 1 i kinda already knew she could give me war assets so i saved her and it works out for me I'm curious to see if you know other ME secrets that i know ;) look forward to seeing more I'll check if there's more ME secrets videos

In the end it doesn't seem like it matters, a queen is present in ME3 regardless of what you choose

Dan: why should you betray this character that helps you at the end of the game just because I want you to play the game by killing everyone xD

If there's a Mass Effect show in the future, a revolutionary thing they should do could be to run polls before the show airs to then decide how the story will play out from these decisions. Imagine they make a poll where the viewers decide to kill the Rachni queen although we know keeping her alive is a better decision. It would be revolutionary

I remember in my first run I wanted an alien Queen with an ever growing army to owe me a big favour I could cash in to ambush the Reapers. In my head it was going to be amazing. Two games later I was majorly disappointed with how that turned out. Killed her the next run but that turned out to be pointless so went back to saving her since despite how anti climatic it is.

Even without knowing what would happen in ME2 & 3, I still took the chance and freed the queen. I feel like giving others a chance can lead to the best outcomes. Granted, that's not always true, but until I know it's not a good idea to end an entire race, I won't be the one to pull the trigger.

I flip back and forth, sometimes I kill them sometimes I let them live just depends how I'm feeling. At least either way you piss off the counsel, cause screw them.

When i 1st played mass effect (when 2 and 3 wasnt out yet) i got rid of the rachni because i wasnt sure if i could trust her not.

Known or not, a sentient being at your mercy should not be murdered just because their ancestors were your ancestors' enemies.

Some people make similar arguments about krogan or geth or even humans. Everything MIGHT become a problem in the future. Just because you had a traumatic experience, doesn't mean you should do genocide.

I see the dilemma, but I let the queen go because of two things - the colonists on Eden Prime, and Shiala. See, I played ME1 back when it was new, before we even knew how what we did in that game played out in 2 and, eventually, 3. But I remembered much of the oddities regarding everything we'd been learning about Saren and his ship up to this point (of course, I should point out that Noveria always came last for narrative reasons - Liara, then the Feros colony, and then the confrontation with Benezia). The colonists talk about a "god-awful noise" that seemed to reverbate from within you, and then you learn from Shiala how Benezia and the others were transformed in proximity to the ship itself. The connection is apparent if you follow the train of logic, and basically confirmed when you consider that songs and colors are how the rachni think and communicate, that they were indoctrinated by Sovereign all those years ago to begin a "purge" of sorts early on, likely to keep the asari and salarian species in check and prevent them from becoming a hassle by the time ME1 rolls around, and possibly to put even the turians and krogan high enough on the radar to make culling them worthwhile while also preventing them from becoming the dominant species in the next cycle, as both are far more militant than the asari and salarian. So, despite the fact that it pisses Wrex off, I can't in good conscience kill this rachni queen.

Yah, that's the thing that sucks about these kind of games, you're best experiance will always be your first time, if you succeed. You have the benefit of going in blind and makign your choices more natural. Upon replay you already know how it will likely go, or at least how some choice will turn out, thus you can avoid mistakes next tiem or use the benefit of hindsight.

Yeah, she talked about her ancestors being swayed by a "sour song". I figured it was the Reapers or some other outside force. I only ever killed her in pure renegade playthroughs.

If you keep her alive she remembers you in ME3 and joins your cause against reapers

To quote Kira Nerys... "Nothing justifies genocide."

To me, the fact that rachni end up helping scientists building the weapon against the reapers (while everybody in the station witness a WTF situation everytime they see them) justifies not killing the keen. It is just a few points more in the help meter in ME3 but the alternative is GENOCIDE.

If you kill the Rachni then you should pursuit for the upgraded genophage because this Shepard will act based on the odds.

I remember my first playthrough my logic was... if I bring the Rachnni back the Salarians got no choice but to bring the Krogan back for my boy Wrex. In hindsight young me did not fully understand what galactic warfare meant

The only time I killed the Rachni Queen was when I first played ME2 on PS3 when EA was forbidden from putting ME1 on PS3 and had to do the interactive comic to take you through major ME1 decisions. I chose to kill Wrex on Virmire and kill the Queen. Partly because I was still almost completely unspoiled, but also partly because I felt like if you actually play ME1 for most of us your emotional connection with Wrex makes it really hard to kill him and your moral compass about genocide makes it really hard to kill the Rachni Queen when you actually play through that conversation. I also think that in the context of what humans know saving the Rachni should be the renegade choice. Renegades aren't evil, they are non-conformists, the conformist thing to do is kill the queen, the non-conformist thing to do is give the species another chance. I like how Shepard demanding that the Rachni "stay dead this time" comes back to bite them on the butt in ME3. Ha ha, shows how smart you are dumb humans.

By my opinion it doesn't matter when the reapers make a klone if you kill her that eventually betray you if you free him in ME3. But if you free her than you have an ally.

Naw i hate bugs. Dale Gribble my way thru all them bastards.

In my mostly Paragon run, I let her go. My Shepard, having done the massacre at Torfan, decided "never again" and he could not bring himself to commit genocide. My recent Renegade Shep on the other hand, went "We are staring down a Reaper invasion and the Rachni were known to attack without even an attempt at diplomacy last time. That is a risk we just cannot afford right now!". And after all the side quests showing how dangerous and swarm-y the Rachni were, she started feeling VERY secure in her decision. XD

6:57 this is why I always tell Javik to view the shard. If I had a way to view memories of friends/loved ones I'd want it. Yes it's sad that he decides to no longer live in our galaxy, but that's his decision. Without the knowledge of the outcome you have to look at the here and now. This is how I also decide to destroy the reaper hybrid (as Cerberus would abuse it, I'd gladly save it for the Alliance) and to destroy Keiji's Greybox (to honor his final wish and he purposely linked his memories to the information for a reason).

I kept her alive in my first playthrough but killed her in the second. My perspective is that I'd never want a species that could mind control other beings to be left to their own devices. At this point in the game all the previous instances of beings that could mind control other life-forms were the thorian and the reapers, both of which were bad. At least that is my two cents.