If you look closely, you can slowly see Westballz transform into Joker after every wobble. The only reason he's not Joker by the end is because the very last stock was taken legitimately.
Everyone talking about the wobbling but that Luigi/Falco game at the start was absolutely disgusting. Looked like the least fun game as luigi in history
As a newer Luigi main I don’t really know how to deal with falco’s lasers well other than wavedashing on the top platforms. And I would have just unplugged my controller and forfeited as soon as the falco started camping
@@s0n4r56 it's easier on battlefield but poke stadium is hard, Abate vs StricNYN3 round 2 has a similar match up where NYN3 would spam lasers on poke stadium but Abate delt with the situation much better and won.
I just wanna say Weatballz vs Army is the reason why tournaments have wobbling banned so if you’re an IC main and joined a tournament where it was banned make sure you thank Army.
good...maybe Actual Skill should win tournaments...this "wobbling" (i dont even like the Name for it lol) is a baby-step away from Jab-Spamming in other fighting games like Tekken...how can you take yourself seriously when you corner-lock the other guy with weak-ass rabbit punches? tournaments are for Skill, not Cheese...
rtyuik7 if you die to jab spam you’re just bad at tekken. Jabs are high, you can duck them. Duck then punish. Also corner pressure is completely viable, if you are in the corner and you expect an opponent to not pressure you you’re not playing the game you’re hoping for a more neutral player.
@@onyxshade5381 i dont play Tekken, i just needed an example...either way, this Ice-Climber 'wobbling' bullshit makes the victim feel like a noob all the same...
If you look at the bottom of the comment section, you will see the people who were happy to see the endless wobbling. They are at the bottom for a reason.
@@Ashragi Yes. I would argue that breaking necks in football would make the players better. Being able to cripple opponents would certainly make the game more entertaining, and easier too. I see in no way how that would affect how the game is played.
Imagine practicing tech skill and getting godlike at a game, constantly pushing yourself further, and then getting killed because a guy knows how to play the rhythm minigame
I just really adore Plup's nod at Leffen's controller hurl. It's like, "yep, we've all been there. Saying anything would just make it worse." Plup for President.
The fact that Wobbling was legal for so many years is proof that competitive Melee is just a giant meme. That being said, I love this competitive scene.
If u know for honor its like when the peacekeeper can stab you infinitly with easy timing on a guardbreak you get guardbrokem u lose tje fight unless u play 2vs2 or 4vs4 where a teammate can save you
i remember when icies mains kept crying that they don't play icies just because of wobbling and wobbling wasn't even that good only to immediately drop icies when wobbling was banned
I saw one video about a tournament match which wobbling was banned. I forgot the players name but he was a IC main who did nothing but fled from the other player. The audience booed at him for his actions and he eventually had to leave the tournament disqualified. It was a sad display. I think what he tried to tell is that IC is nothing without wobbling, but I think he rather played himself for showing his lack of skill in Melee.
@@TheMCNinjas If you're talking about the video I'm thinking of, it was the puff player who was running away from the ICs, even though wobbling was illegal. It was on Dreamland and the puff took one stock then proceded to float around until the time ran out. I think he did this multiple games in a row. Both wobbling and timers shouldn't exist
Because people would rather live in unhealthy environments instead of admitting that Melee isn’t perfect. At high professional levels, no wobbling doesn’t matter much when the last great placing was from Wobbles himself at EVO. But touch-of-death combos with 3 buttons is the most unhealthy shit I’ve ever seen in a fighting game. And this is from a guy coming from UMVC3. And I honestly see Wobbling ban as a good thing - against the Puff matchup just pick up a secondary if you don’t want to get camped. Against the rest of the cast it lets you explore the character for options and skill limits. Grabs can still be touch-of-death for basically everyone even without wobbling, but at least it’s more interesting.
S H I N E Yes, but if they enter a big tournament, they know they have an extremely low chance of winning so they shouldn’t enter at all if they don’t do it for anything else
GamerGirlMikeWazowski so if someone isn't confident about winning they should not enter so you're saying no one should have entered tournaments when Armada and Hungrybox were the most dominant players to exist ok then
I'd have so much respect for ICs (desyncs are a pretty cool tech imo) but wobbling is just the destroyer of fun, entertainment, pacing, everything. Wobbling might be 'optimal' but honestly it's so fucking boring to play AND watch...
Daveed as a Chinese myself I have to say he does not look Asian, or at least natively. American- or European- born Asian maybe. There is just a subtle difference between native and none native Asians and even Asians from China, Korea and Japan that we Asians can tell but not explain, probably from seeing enough of our own countrymen to notice the difference. I digress
Aw man, who was this IC player that basically refused to wobble and had some of the SICKEST games you've ever seen in melee? He was freaking nuts and his playstyle was beautiful.
I want to know why tf chain grabbing and woobling were not banned the moment they were discovered, they ruin the "sport" part of smash and make matches look like paint drying documentaries.
Pls uninstall chain grabbing one can argue to be much less destructive since they require certain characters, percents, lack of platforms, reads or pivoting etc, and there are ways to get out of it (Marth chain grab on fox for example). Wobbling just requires both IC to be alive, and minimal tech skills
Barely anyone plays them in ultimate because they are one of the most mechanically intense chqracters in the game. Kind of ironic how they went from one of the easiest braindead options in melee to what they are now lol.
Ice Climbers are 8th on Armada's tierlist and 7th on the community tier list. Beating Spacies as Icies means you beat a top tier as a mid tier. Doing that in a tournament is a pretty cool accomplishment, I don't care how you pull it off.
@@awkwardcultism "Beating a higher tier is impressive" doesn't count if its done with a hugely unfair glitch. No one finds it fun or interesting to watch a dude do nothing but chain grab for 3 minutes while the opponent unplugs their controller and leaves because they can't even hope to win.
My only thought on the guys who rage quit his set during the middle of a match against puff was “maybe if you tried a move besides down smash you could punish him”
I think its because for a long time there wasnt really a globalized ruleset for Melee so the top ICs players of the time (Chudat Fly Amanita and Wobbles) had to adapt to wobbling being both banned and unbanned, then when melee got big after EVO 2013 people only saw these players who were good without wobbling and didnt realize how much degeneracy potential it had.
I can't believe that there's some people who unironically support wobbling or think it should be legal. Yeah okay lmfao. An infinite that you can't get out of unless the person doing the wobble has mercy should be legal? And don't give me that "weel wizout it dey be low teer", no character no matter how shit or how good they are shouldn't deserve an infinite that guarantees a stock.
@@neuro3697 "yeah I support an unfair 'move' that shouldn't be in the game to begin with that guarantees a stock because that's the only redeeming 'quality' of the character" -you I don't expect any intelligence from Smash players anyways.
@@Xandumas doesnt guarantee anything if you know basics of the game lmao. Theres a reason not a single IC's player has ever been #1. Anyone with half a brain isnt gonna get caught randomly. Thus wobbling requires SETUPS AND TECHNICAL SKILL??? WOW WHAT A CONCEPT. meanwhile hbox abuses puff and camps and ledgestalls every match. But yes, of course, wobbling should be banned LMAO Stay out my replies
If you are someone that defends the Ice Climbers wobbling then you have zero say on if Jigglypuff should be banned. Ice Climbers is as boring if not more boring than Jigglypuff by grabbing and timing the A button press. That's why the character dropped hard when wobbling was completely banned.
Honestly, I find it really childish when players get upset and don’t hold in their anger (or at least hold it until they’re not in public), but that guy who got wobbled 11 times, I’m super impressed he was able to hold it in. He probably would’ve won, because some of the stocks were close, but only lost to a stupid exploit Cheers to you man
I dont know how in the hell half of these guys shake hands with their competitor... it isnt fun, it isnt skill, it's a broken mechanic that has been banned...
It's pretty bad sportsmanship. Regardless of the torture they make you suffer for being annoying, obnoxious and making your life living hell just for wanting to play a game and have fun, you're a bigger man if you suck it up and shake their hand. That show's you win in the sense of honour and mental strength. Regardless, though, they all do deserve every shred of disrespect they get.
Melee is fast paced and crazy when both people playing agree to actually have fun. People who ruin the fun like wobblers and campers make the game boring and unsatisfying to play. Just imo
Wobbling doesn’t obey the advantage/powerspeed rule for fighting game moves. It’s too quick and easy to initiate for the amount of advantage it gives. It should be banned
You're ignoring range. It has one of the worst ranges of any move in the entire game. It also doesn't work if Nana is too far away or is dead. Finally, and most importantly, it's the only move in the character's moveset that's better than "okay". If we're banning moves for being too good and no other reason, the first thing we should take away is Fox's shine. That move is even faster, gives invincibility, reflects projectiles, and also situationally kills at any percent (the situation being the opponent being offstage).
@@awkwardcultism difference is. Shine is used for combos and takes skill to connect well into other moves. IC grab is just two buttons, it doesn't even look cool. Its just boring and its a instant stock.
@@awkwardcultism people want wobbling banned not because it's a good move, it's because once it strikes the opponent can do literally nothing about it and they have to watch their percentage slowly build up to kill percentage off of a throw. Shine is good but in no way busted. Plus, what the move actually does and the requirements to do the move are two seperate things.
the argument "just don't get grabbed" is such a stupid reasoning for not having wobbling be banned. Yeah, don't get grabbed and you won't be wobbled. sure. Getting grabbed is a mistake - if you make a mistake you SHOULD take damage for it, thats the ENTIRE POINT OF THE GAME. But that doesn't mean one mistake should = instant failure with no options for survival. That punish is far too strong! Getting 99% on a test shouldn't mean you fail the test! Characters like Jigglypuff have Rest as an almost-instant-kill, but at the cost of like 90% of their other moves being weak shite + needing to be INSIDE the other character to even perform it. Getting close to the opponent as a character thats so fragile and slow is a high risk move - thus the reward for successfully resting someone is also high. It's fair. Ice Climbers is an otherwise decent character with decent moves - and really interesting options like de-syncing - that also has an exploit that is as deadly as Rest, except all it requires is to successfully grab the opponent. It's an extremely low risk exploit that has a massively high reward payoff. It's unfair. I don't think fighting games always need to be super technical and complex. I don't think characters who are weaker shouldn't have some gimmicks that can put them on better footing against better opponents. I don't think exploits or bugs should always be banned from the game, no questions asked. But one of those questions is "is this actually fair? Is the payoff justified? Is the balance between risk and reward for both players balanced enough to keep?" and the answer to that for wobbling is a solid "no, its not." Also theres no point trying to compare exploits like wavedashing to wobbling. both are exploits, yes, but one has the result of "death for single minor fuck up" and the other has the result of "character go woosh a little".
Why does everyone hate the puff tactic? Its literally a form of gameplay, if you cant get past it you just probably suck at learning your spacing and patience to win
I like how people say to keep wobbling and when you get wobbled all of a sudden you change your mind and want it banned. In my opinion it should be banned since there is nothing the other player could do.
@@awkwardcultism but a lot of other fighting games have mechanics that let you ESCAPE combos. Sure in some other fighting games you can't do anything about a combo once you get in it, but the difference is that combos END. Wobbling is an infinite.
@@awkwardcultism lol, you know it's ok for different games to have different mechanics around combos right? Yes, they're different things between smash and other more traditional fighters, but that works to the benefit of both games. Don't gatekeep fighting games, nobody likes that
