@@j.d.4697 You do realize that most people who fly airliners in flight sim use reverse thrust on most landings? I know I do, and trust me, that bump wouldn't be on my list of complaints.
Thanks! I've been thinking about the T16000M for awhile and you just helped me make my decision. Very informative and great personal insight on the difference between the two !
I have had a HOTAS X for 4 years myself. Still works great. Although I am now upgrading because I want the better stick control of the T16000. And it has more buttons.
@@TgWaKu Hey you're still alive after a year, cool. I might just buy one as the price is so right, although you can get the Thrustmaster T.16000M with just the stick for the same price.
Thanks! I have been waiting for a video like this. I have played flight sims since I was a kid. I even made my own cockpit for Microsoft flight sim x back when it was new. Take care in this crisis. I hope you and all your family are safe.
I picked up the Hotas X from a Thrift Shop today, for $12. I was thinking about Flight Simulator 2020, but I'm even more stoked to play Squadrons with it.
@@overratedprogrammer been loving it so far the improved tracking of motion compare the Logitech extreme 3d pro is just indescribable. the joystick is just a breeze and joy to use.
I really hope you make it to atleast a million subs. Your content is quality. Just saw your video on water cooled air cooler. Talk about innovation and creativity. If you do (and I really hope so), I've been here since 31k subs.
As somebody with Virpil, VKB and MFG gear that's eyeing up a RealSimulator stick and base I got a good laugh out of the thumbnail for the video - but credit given where credit due, it got me to watch the video!
@@frostyvr9805 I had the hotas x fail on me quickly (sensors in the stick got seriously flakey). Not impressed with at least the entry level. My brother has the Warthog and loves it.. but until COVID subsides and allows the supply chain to fill, we're talking 800ish for one of those setups (sorry, no).
R King oh I’ve had my wheel for three years, my pedals for 2 and my stick for 1 and the only problem I’ve ever had was some dust messing with a sensor on my clutch pedals because the lubricant got old
@@frostyvr9805 Very good result for you.. I think the problems with the thrustmaster products aren't 'all joysticks produced', but rather a quality problem that only shows up in a percentage of shipped product. If you look at reviews of the products on amazon you'll see quite a few reports of bad product for both HOTAS setups reviewed here.. but that could be due to only a 1% failure rate, or a 50% failure rate (impossible to know the actual rate of issues among shipped joysticks). I certainly got caught by it.. but this doesn't mean the next one will be bad. Anyways.. happy joysticking!
I've been using a Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS since the early 2000s. Still works great, and I've used it within the last 24 hours to fly F-16s in both DCS and Falcon BMS 4.35.
I have the Hotas X and it's great for flying considering the cheap price. My combat flying in Arma III has really improved. Good luck shooting me out of the sky!
I have been doing Microsoft Flight Sim since 1997. Started on FS95 and on to FSX. I have the H.O.T.A.S X and still love it. I also have FS2020 on pre-order. I may have to upgrade to the one you prefer. Thanks for the information.
T flight 4 was my first hotas, then i moved on and tried some Saitek/Logitech sticks. Had both the X52 and X56. At the end of the day, i sold them both and got myself another TF hotas 4. Its not fancy, but the ergonomics and button placement are absolutely perfect for elite dangerous, and with a keyboard in between, theres nothing you cant do with it. Im in my 3rd one now. I view them as consumable hardware at this point. I can get about 4000 hours out of them before the drift becomes too much
If anyone is after a first class rudder pedal set and is willing to pay a bit more for quality, they should checkout MFG Crosswind. Nothing comes close and dealing with them is a pleasure. This is produced by a flight sim enthusiast who got sick of the plastic garbage on offer and decided to make his own at his small custom furniture workshop. The build quality is first class and the driver software WORKS, end of story, It WORKS. I have no affiliation with them, I'm just a very happy customer and will always sing my praises to promote it. This is the sort of company flight sim enthusiasts should support. We should support our own kind. Maybe we can convince him that he is wasted making furniture and he might design some other goodies for us. Well done MFG.
Great review. I have the T Flight Hotas but I find the precision a bit off putting at times. However, the way I have it set up is that I use the little axis behind the throttle for looking left and right and it works perfectly when I want to look left or right smoothly inside the cockpit. I wish that it existed on the new Airbus TCA officer pack.
The TFlight X is actually worse than the TFlights that they made for the consoles, that would be the TFlight One and the TFlight 4. The older X is actually harder to find, often more expensive than the newer console models. Definitely go with one of those over the X.
Awsome review! I might hafta just buy one n fire up a couple flying games I got on a game hdd...even try n get a new game or buy 1 just to even try it out ! Awsome man ..thanks!
I have owned both of these setups. The cheap one is amazing for 49 dollars US. It is also one of the only HOTAS setups that will work on an Xbox. It is a good unit and perfectly acceptable for the new flight simulation enthusiast. The T16K is a classic. My first one lasted over 5 years of daily use. Unfortunately the replacement unit lasted only about 30 days until the Yaw axis developed an intermittent massive error. Further research indicates this is a well known problem which TM has not addressed. Anyone who purchases this kit would do well to purchase an extended warranty. I personally loved the T16K for years but I would not recommend that anyone purchase one before Thrust Master addresses their quality control issues.
Unfortunately that's Thrustmaster for you. Goddamn Frenchie, some of their sim racing wheels have similar issues, a great shame as their products are often extremely good at their price point. Still I'd rather spend £100 and get a duffer than a couple of grand and still get a duffer from a competitor who then takes 3 months to send a replacement that doesn't even work out of the box.
You can bind a button to switch throttle to reverse thrust instead of needing a middle stop. I also remember finding a better throttle with more range and middle stop, don't remember brand and model.
It's a fantastic HOTAS, to be sure. The reason I went with the T.16000M FCS HOTAS after about 2 years with the HOTAS X was that it didn't have enough controls for my taste. The T.16000M FCS HOTAS has 9 programmable axes (I only use 8, mind, but it's enough) and 30 buttons (29 if you use one for a shift, giving you 58 buttons' worth of controls) as opposed to the 12 (22 with a shift) of the HOTAS X. And you can add the detent with magnets and epoxy if you so wish. In the end, you like what you like, but it's something to think about.
Thanks for the review! I play a lot of Elite Dangerous and the T Flight would be great for that game because of the 50% bump. With the T16000 I've seen Elite players upgrade it with an aftermarket magnet inside to stop it at the 50% since Elite players can use it as FWD thrust vs RVR thrust. Plus it's cheap! Ha!
Joshua Crowell you should have waited for the new generation of Xbox coming out with the release of mfs2020, I don’t think, you will have the best experience with the one s ...
Go with the dearer of the two. The Hotas X is great yes, until the stick drift issues start. All depends on the game/ simulation your playing some are more forgiving than others. But but the X and within a year you'll most likely be looking to upgrade. Microsoft 2020 however seems very forgiving on what controllers you use from gamepad upwards. Where as other flight sims certainly aren't.
Just a note: TWCS throttle is fairly close copy of the F/A-18 Hornet one including the button layout - the real one is of course dual as Hornet is twin-engine airplane
10 mins of video on whether I should buy the cheaper Thrustmaster setup - or the more expensive Thrustmaster setup. I daresay that this is content that, you know, Thrustmaster definitely likes. Ads are getting smarter... :) Informative video though, thanks!
First, thank you for your service! Second, Thanks for the DCS recommendation. Downloading now! Third, have you tried any of your flight sims with a 3 monitor setup? If so, thoughts?
Very interesting, at the height of the pandemic I was looking to get into flight sims but the T16000 with throttle was more expensive than the FCS is today if you could find one. Now into the 2nd ¼ of 2022 I see the price is more or less the same as this video.
I’ve got a HOTAS and use it on FSX and x-plane. I’m a casual sim-er, I’m planning to do more when new ms flight sim comes out. Had about 30hrs of flight training and have flown solo winch launch glider. I can fit a full size keyboard (Logitech g810) between the stick and throttle. Good piece of kit.
I own the Hotas X and been looking at getting a new flight stick for MFSim2020 so I like this video. However, I am curious how this would do with a space game where reverse thrust is used a lot. Like with the Hotas X i know i am in neutral when i hit that bump.
I have a TM Warthog and love it. I did have to replace the ring and do a bit of sanding to relieve the striction issue. Mine was never bad but figured while I was in there. It's butter smooth now.
Price vs quality I think the thrustmaster TM16000m & Hotas is a great buy. The only regret I have is not purchasing the foot peddles. Prices are way out of control right now. I paid less then a $100 USD for the hotas and yoke this time last year.
@@MajorHardware My T.Flight Hotas One which is almost the same as the T.Flight Hotas X you have if I'm not mistaken has developed a random jitter on the X-axis. I should have done my research properly and just gone with the T1600M with its hall effect sensors.
@@MajorHardware The trouble is that there's a problem inside the T16000 that causes Z-axis (a potentiometer) to show an uncommanded left yaw over time. If they fixed it, they'd have a superb joystic.
I actually had a T-Flight Stick X (the non HOTAS version) for years and I'm actually quite happy with it so I bought a TWCS Throttle in addition to that. Had to use silicone grease as well to make it less sticky but now I'm actually quite happy with this combination. And the stick just won't die - it didn't even lose center or went wobbly after years. It looks like cheap plastic crap but it performs far better than it has any right to.
While he's right about the throttle being a bit sticky, he's totally wrong about using lithium grease. Over time it will damage the plastic and eventually it will break. Use a silicone based grease that's safe for plastics. Do a RU-vid or Google search for this issue and there's a number of videos and threads on how to fix it.
@@MajorHardware it's not world ender. Just get silicon based grease and clean it up properly before applying the better one. Especially the throttle doesn't have much to break about it. Stick on the other hand...
For those curious the answer is neither. The T16000m is famous for breaking if you use and the T flight sucks. If you want to get quality get something from VKB. If you want decent and cheap get an X52. Downside to VKB quality is they are always out of stock and don't yet have a commerical version of the throttle.
Very nice :-). Just by name i know ThrustMaster it's supposed to be very good stuff... Now dual joystick like that would be perfect if there was a real machinery simulation like skid steer loaders and other machines and digging machines that have 2 joystick's (real machineries style)
I've had the 16000 for about 1 year. Love it. Only gripe is the sensor for the rocker on throttle has started going out. Gets jittery, so I don't use it anymore. Otherwise, good hotas.
I personaly liked the bump in the middle of the T.Flight Hotas X throttle because i used to play Mech sims like Mechwarrior with this stick. Basically: middle=Standing still, Push forward to move forward, push it backwards to go reverse with the mech.
thank you, Major Hardware, this was exactly the comparison that i was looking for! I will put in a word to get you promoted to LTC/LtCol/Lt. Col. soon.. just be sure you don't make it all the way to general, as "General Hardware" sounds like a big step downwards..
stopped by a shop and picked up the kit with the pedals a little while after writing my first comment.. then got home and had to mess around for at least an hour with the target software to figure out how to set everything up (and i'm in IT so i usually do have an advantage with technical things, but this was a small challenge).. I did manage to get it all set up though, and have then spent some time in FSX to get used to the change, but can already say it was a good decision to buy it!
Worth mentioning: The T.Flight Hotas X's joystick twist axis starts to drift towards the left after while. It's actually quite severe too. Even after using 3rd party software to make a deadzone its hard to control my yaw at times cause it's all over the place. This isn't an isolated incident either, I looked it up and it's a known issue with the model. The T.16000 is a much better choice.
Very thanks for the video, i made my decision to buy the T160000M because fore the price that is a little bit higher then the hotas x but,is worth it, for me that i like dcs and flight sim 2022 and i'm a beginner whit a little of experience whit drones and i really like flying especially whit fighter aircraft is good for me. Btw sry for the bad english but im italian :D
So I saw this video a few days ago and I gathered that for my budget I should probably go with the x because I wasn’t sure if I was going to enjoy it. Well I went on Amazon and ordered it for 59.99. To my surprise I did not receive the Hotas x, instead I received the t16000m😂. I am really enjoying and am seriously doubting if I would’ve with the x. Thanks for the video.
@@gasser5001 Your finances are obviously fine. Your attitude, however, needs work. Lots of work. I hope you're still young enough to be able to mature.
I used the PS4 version of the HOTAS X (HOTAS 4) with Elite Dangerous and I CANNOT play with a controller anymore. Recently started playing on PC and FUCK Keyboard & Mouse. I ordered the T16000M and it should be arriving on Thursday. I'm looking forward to getting back into Elite Dangerous once the T16000m comes in
In Elite, you should probably set your throttle to forward only and just use one of the buttons to switch to reverse mode. You pull the throttle all the way back and there's no guessing the exact position of zero. It' also gives you more control since the entire range of your throttle is only 1 direction.
I got the Hotas X a couple of years ago on sale for 20€, never used it though... With the MSFS20 fever going on I wanted to check out if it was any good and I have to say I'm not disappointed at all 😅
For everyone thinking about buying the T16000m FCS (the left one in the video). I use it for two and a half years now and i am impressed by its precision and amount of buttons of the throttle. In sensitive games like DCS it is often enough to barely move it (simply increasing the force on the stick) and the aircraft starts reacting. Unfortunately from factory the throttle comes a bit stiff, mine even squeeked a little as i moved it forward and backwards. But once you adjust the front and add some kind of silicon lubricant stuff, it works fine. Running it on Bearings would be more pleasant though. The first bug accured two weeks ago, so the joystick yaw axis was far off center and constantly held the rudder of the aircraft pointing right. A simple pull out, shut down-unplug-boot up-back in-calibration fixed it though :D I really like, that if the game supports it, you can map multiple layers of functions on every button on stick and throttle by assigning one button of choice as a modifier ( for example i mapped all buttons on my throttle with radar and weaponry in DCS, while i can use the exact same buttons for landing gear, flaps and other stuff as i hold the previously assigned modifier button. I heard there is even a thrustmaster software to double map buttons with keyboard commands (counting for every game you play). After all if anyone wants to buy it, i can recommend it.
I would also add that the T1600m FCS is a great stick and throttle setup that has lasted me for years. definitely worth it if you can afford it ($159.99 right now, ouch!). I stumbled onto a great product that's cheap for anyone who likes their throttle smooth with a little dampening. It's called Energy Suspension, Formula 5 Prelube. I had a small packet left over after a rebuild and didn't want to buy the expensive Nyogel 767a. I decided why not, its a silicone grease and it's easy to clean up. Well it works like a charm and that small packet lasts forever. Just want to share my find with the community so maybe it could help others.
I was thinking it was Chuck Yeagers Advanced Flight Trainer or air combat as it was pretty obscure en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Yeager%27s_Advanced_Flight_Trainer
That bump in the middle of the throttle is to differentiate between forward and reverse throttle. It really depends on what you are using it for, but it is a nice thing for some games. I love the throttle on the T.1600m, but for the price, I would take a Saitek x52 over it.
Haven't played a flight sim in ages. Way back I bought a HOTAS setup to use with MechWarrior 2, which turned out to be a less than optimal way to play that game. The HOTAS was programmable with memory for several configurations and buttons all over the place. I spent days tweaking the setup for MW2, including time spent editing the games configuration files as there wasn't any function for changing keybindings, so hacking the config files was the way you configured it. Now the game turned out to have so many controls that I ended up using three configuration banks in the HOTAS to get the most used keys mapped. In the end it turned out to be a nightmare to keep track of which functions was mapped to which profile. Besides in that game you steer the mech body and it's head independently so in the end it was much easier to run it using mouse and keyboard. After that I spent a lot of time configuring it for a StarWars game that I don't remember the name of. Most of the time you were flying the Millennium Falcon and again there was way more keys used than there were buttons on the HOTAS, but using several banks it was doable. The joystick and throttle worked much better here than in MW2. After that it wen't unused for a couple of years, and when I tried to get it working again I had forgotten everything about how the programming worked. However what was worse was that the joystick had developed a problem. It was a real old school analog joystick that used potentiometers and when it had been left unused these corroded so there was a small spot where there was no contact. As a result the joystick was basically unusable. This is one thing that won't happen to a joystick that uses hall effect sensors or optical sensors. Enough about that old hunk of junk. Now given my experiences I'd say you really want to look for something that uses either Hall effect sensors or optical sensors as potentiometers tend to age, and not in a graceful way. But before you run out and buy a HOTAS setup make sure you really want one and that whatever you are going to use it with supports it. Some flight simulators can be a bit picky about the controls. Also if you are all about simulation and know you won't be flying any fighters then you might be interested in looking at a flight yoke instead of a HOTAS with a joystick. It is more specialized but still might be what you really are looking for.
