In my opinion even Cirno is harder than Sans... And I think we can blame it to the fact that Undertale works even more in patterns than some Spell Cards do.
I find sans to be harder than most Stage 2 bosses. Stage 3 however? Nope. Undertale *is* an RPG first and foremost, and sans' fight focuses moreso on platforming rather than actual bullet hell.
@@Niiue I unironically hate Cirno a lot because of her first two openers, even though I already 1 CC EoSD, I will always bomb them, its so hard to capture her openings consistently
@@Niiue I find EoSD easier than PCB though, sure PCB has borders and less RNG their P.Sisters, Youmu and Yuyuko feels way harder than Patchouli and Remilia.
yup that's fair. item management is also something that exists too, since if you're inexperienced, sans can take loads of HP off of you. otherwise he's a breeze compared to stage 4 and above touhou bosses
Imagine actually saying that but in touhou battles you get Like three Lives I would just Imagine how funny it would be if he just wipes it all out with One bone XD
The only thing that would makes Sans fight only *slightly* harder than given credits for compared to a touhou boss fight is the soul mechanics and the blue bones. But it's quicky overshadowed by the fact that you have hp, healing items, and MUCH easier pattern to go through compared to touhou's
Agreed. The sans fight is still hard, but there's... harder. Though, towing the line between hard and fair is difficult, with some undertale fangames failing to do so. I'd say that touhou makes its difficulty fair while making it hard, so that's why I actually play it lol.
It's ironically easier than most Touhou Stage 3-4 bosses on Normal difficulty, on Lunatic even Stage 2 bosses are way harder than Sans. Even if we take the undertale fan games as an example of FDY with its Oversave tale (which for some reason is considered the apogee of complexity), then even there literally no boss can be compared with the tops in complexity in the Touhou, Hecatia, Rika and Sigma, I also remember Flandre from FDF as a trio, which was twice as difficult for me as all the bosses of Oversave tale combined, despite the fact that I played oversave tale on normal mode, and not on noob mod. And this despite the fact that among the most difficult representatives of danmaku shmups, the Touhou series of games is considered one of the simplest, for example, Bullet heaven 2 (did not play the first part) at the heavenly difficulty level, this game is approximately, and sometimes even more difficult than Touhou on a sleepwalker, the final boss Akron game are about the same in difficulty as the representatives of the trinity mentioned above, but already on heavenly + difficulty (heavenly + handicaps for speed), he alone will shame them (and this is not to mention that you can include all handicaps in general). Despite the fact that in Bullet heaven 2 there is a mouse control, which allows you to make much more flexible maneuvers than playing on the keyboard. And this one, not to mention the tops of danmaku shmups, even at the easiest difficulty level, is more difficult than Touhou games on a sleepwalker, for example, like games from the Cave campaign, the same dodonpachi dai-ou-jou the first 1CC on the death label (sort of like the maximum difficulty level) was set 7 years after the release of the game, although this game for many Cave fans is not even the most difficult passage on 1CC. Why am I messing around so much here? Yeah, I'm just unreasonably pissed off by comments from fans of undertale and fangames about the difficulty of their games.
*Touhou games on a sleepwalker Touhou games on a lunatic. I also note that I learned that Black label and Death label are not difficulty levels, but DLC.
This kind of comparison is very interesting to me because of the way it shows how relative difficulty can be. Touhou games and the genre they're apart of are focused very intensely on this difficulty. They are a challenge; a test of skill, and have been raising the bar to match their player base for decades. Undertale is not a game about difficult battles, and even though most fangames are, they are new, and exist in relation to the story more than the challenge. In a narrative heavy game about making friends and wandering through the underground, in a route where you are accustomed to wiping the floor with monsters through your stats to the point where dodging is basically optional, the sans fight is a *massive* difficulty spike which will stop most players in their tracks.
i managed to beat sans in sans simulator ( yes i healed a lot ) in like an hour, and i never played undertale or touhou so that means sans in a simulator is easy-
@@rumia_789 I'd personally recommend touhou 7 PCB as a starting point for touhou games but 6 or 8 should be fine too. However if someone wants to dive straight into hell (pun intended) then start with touhou 11 subterranean animism or god forbid legacy of lunatic kingdom.
@@Niiue 3 months late but it's alright you did a damn good job for a 1st try. Also you might not know but there is also a modded version of this fight which makes it harder if you are looking for a little challenge.
ah... a lot of people seem to misunderstand that this my first try at sans. it *was* my 3rd or so attempt in a few years though. personally, i'm fine with beating this sans. not too interested in mods and stuff, but i appreciate them nonetheless!
I beat EoSD's extra stage but couldn't beat sans, the reasons could be that undertale's hitbox is bigger than touhou's and undertale has other type of gameplay mechanics than just bullet hell , while touhou is literally just bullet hell and nothing else, don't even get me started on genocide undyne.
I'm honestly surprised there aren't more jokes about Geometry Dash players beating sans. That game is on near impossible levels of difficult sometimes. Even the easy levels will take most newcomers 20+ attempts, and I could beat Sans first try.
Wait, is it possible to continue after losing all your lives? I just started to introduce myself in the saga about 1 week ago and I started playing EoSD which is the most recommended by people
Sans is pretty easy once you find out his weakness. And that is 90% of his attacks being static. Sans needs routing like Touhou does on much later parts of the game, but his patterns are easier to get through and route however. Although he is on a game where you have a massive hitbox, a small box that limits your movement, slow player speed and hitboxes that are accurate to their sprite so no-hitting anything in this game is so bullshit to do and shouldn't even be attempted because of how poor this game handles hitbox and area of movement (Same goes for the next game Toby Fox made called Deltarune because it's just the same thing except there's a focus button.) Why do people think this guy is hard to beat?
My guess is that Sans is a bigger spike in difficulty than people expected, so they are caught off guard and panic instead of properly practicing for the first tries. Sans is hard to beat if you don't know what you're expecting. The thing is that nowadays, people *know* about sans and how hard he is, so they can brace themselves and properly practice, using other people's videos of him and their own experience. Of course, there's also factors like player skill, item management, etc. Some people can finish sans in a blind playthrough with no more than 10 tries, while others spend days attempting him.
Sans isnt too hard, I can do it with no items if I really tried, note that the simulator is easier than the fight in game, try playing sans last breath if you want more of a challenge btw
It was my 3rd or 4th try in years. I probably sunk like 15 or more attempts into it years prior as well. And uh yea, I've seen a lot of sans fights. You can't really stop it in all honesty.
Makes sense, EosD is a whole game while Sans is a shorter fight. Memorizing the patterns are a lot easier. Also, based Charlotte pfp if I'm not mistaken
@@iosis9324 that's the sad part idk how but even though i can first try sans this attack does more damage to me than like anything else he throws out (particularly the version with the larger blasters) 😭
I'd like for you to elaborate on what touhou logic exactly means. If you mean everything would be like Touhou, ie wider screen, faster character, smaller hitbox, as well as lives and bombs... hm. I'd say he'd be a challenge, but only in the sense that... he switches up the genre of game from curtain fire to platformer. If you mean just scaling this in proportion to a touhou boss, then he's not that bad. Bit of practice and he's done with, like a stage 3 or 4 boss in normal.
I think I get it... i was thinking if u only get hit once u die, it's hard to shoot him due to him moving u around, and possibly messing with ur HUD (if that's possible), karma (hard to implement, maybe you get hit, you have to do a mini game in the middle of battle to remove it before death... or just a debuff) it would be... annoying if not difficult. Tbh a mod would be cool... cringe, but cool. Try to just... put him on a touhou screen and figure it out. Always touhou in undertale, Never the other way around.
No no... you have it wrong. I mean newcomer as in, I was a newcomer to the Touhou Project games, rather than sans. Though this is roughly my 3rd try in that session, I had actually dumped in a few attempts in the past. Sorry to disappoint.
You couldn't have known how the gaster blasters work or the fact that you don't have to jump through the bones on the last platform pass at 1:45 if this was your first attempt You don't play like a player of any game that hasn't played this before and just fyi normal players of this game can practice the fight before they beat it too
@@aleph1192 yeah but the novelty goes away the more you practice and the title is misleading. I thought I was going to see a newcomer figure out sans and thrash him in record time but instead I just saw another sans fight from someone who'd been trying to beat him for over an hour before recording. This is a normal player fighting sans
@@bovineintervention6001 fun fact i beat sans after my 3rd try in this session, mostly just warmup since i didn't fight sans for a while. anyways, sorry for misleading. i meant to convey that i, a recent touhou player, tried to fight sans.
