Nio ES8 1000 km challenge with battery swap 

NINE NINE NINEE NNNINNNEEE!! *Shit profusely*

The car automatically positioned it’s self for the swap so why couldn’t it leave the swap zone automatically?

you realize that the car automatically leaves the swapping station though right?

@@BizzMRK I didn’t know that.

I totally agree with this. Even if it automatically leaves the station, where will it park? It will definitely take up a spot that someone else needs. Waiting for 6 minutes, or possibly less in the future, is definitely doable by anyone. Just pee before you swap 🤣

This is not correct

Why not to let the car do it for you, it can automatically do the swap and then move to a bay next the the swap station and wait for you

It should ba able to autopark outside when swap is finished

It needs to self-park afterwards.

@@kdihalas because cars are not allowed to drive themselves. You, as the driver, have to be present. Not run off while the car is attempting to park itself. Until we have a full self driving car and we have legally figured out who is responsible, then it would become an option.

Self parking sounds good but if its busy where does the car go, I don’t think manufacturers want to hire out more real estate either for temporary parking spaces. Much better to get the driver to sort themselves out.

the current setup allows nio to build the power swap station across only 3-parking space. if they do the drive-thru design it would take up more space

I've been saying this since like forever. Geely does this and it takes much faster than NIO 2.0 power swap station. Geely battery swap station in action: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Y5-_tVnWpZg.html

@@krs400122 Fair enough. How about a turntable inside the swap station? You drive in with your front and get turned during the swap to drive out with your front as well.

@@Janaale That’s pretty impressive if they can do it in just one minute…

When will you get to try a Lucid?

It's great but practical use seems bit low. You need to build and maintain a huge battery swap station + you need spare batteries that can't be used in cars. There is no way possibly you can really have a dense net of them, can be a cool gimmick if it's on your road for long trips at popular places, but I feel like with cars approaching 500km+ of real world autobahn range this is just overkill to save yourself maybe like 4-5 minutes? Given the fact you have to stay in the car while it swaps the battery currently you will then need to take your pee break afterwards, maybe you grab something to drink and a small bite to eat and your stop is going to be like 10-15 minutes anyway, which means you don't really save that much compared to using a supercharger, especially with the charging technology getting better and better, whereas if you can possibly have your car do the battery swap by e.g. just parking it somewhere and then it drives in, swaps and parks again outside by itself. The 2nd problem is that you can't really scale this shit. Whenever there is more traffic, you could possibly have 2-3 cars ahead. With superchargers you can have 8-16 stalls at a time, they can easily be added to any parking spot and given the low price for adding additional chargers once the key infrastructure has been done it's rather cheap, but you certainly can't go ahead and build 4 instead of 1 swap station. Let's assume only 4 cars ahead, even if each one only takes 3 minutes for the swap your own swap will take you 15 minutes, while with the current technology you would probably have to wait in the car for the whole time.

Works great on road trips! Over 1000 swap stations in China and tons along the main highways

In reality the situation in Italy is getting better at a fast rate: Tesla opens new location with regularity, plus the new year probably the superchargers will be open to other brands also in Italy. Also highway companies like Autostrade per l'Italia, who with FreetoX and other energy provider, have all plane to triple the ultra fast charging station by the end of 2023

@@Eric_Garrison you probably missed the bit where I referred to Southern Europe. Or central, basically anywhere but Scandinavia

@@LunnarisLP exactly. It’s a gimmick and is not scalable. Not in Europe, at least.

The idea behind home charging, is that you never (99% of the time) have to go to the station, even if it's only for 5 minutes. You should definitely try charging @home, it's a nice feature, not a chore.

Yeah, but I have to pay for charging at home … I dont pay when I swap since 6 swaps are included when leasing the battery

@@bjaco9530 Ohhh, I see. I understand. I forgot that you had to lease the battery. I, personnaly, already really didn't like the system, this doesn't help. You are not paying extra for your charger at home? You are just talking about the electricity cost? IMO, this model encourage bad habbits, for so few benefice (long haul trips, which are, generaly, pretty rare),

6 free swaps a month means almost no one pays for swaps right? Do you lease the battery?

Correct. Note, 6 swaps only applied for those that ordered the car before 1 March 2022. We are entitled to 6 free swaps as long as we have the car.

CATL is already entering the market. You just need to standardize on the same level as charge ports. And it's not supposed to replace charging, it's an alternative. Great solution where charging infrastructure isn't as easy or available to build out, or where personal parking spaces with charging options are also unavailable, like in larger cities. Look to China and see how widely this is already in use.

Some chinese manufacturers ahave already formed an alliance and established a common standard for theyr swaptechnology. To assume it wont play a role for the autoindustry is kinda ignoring that fact. It may not play a role for you, but for many others. I gues in countrys whre high chargingspeeds are not possible becouse of the grid, swaps will be the way to go. Less peakpower to charge the battery and possiblity to help out the grid when needed as a backuppowerplant.

@@Bud_Terence you would peak up at charging the battery to serve more customers

Speedfreaks will love this. Hammer at >200km/h on Autobahn and just swap for a fresh battery in

@@robertsarkezi2080 "slowly charged". Business will detest to that

The point is every manufacturer would have to place such a swaping station, if the concept would spread. That's not really realistic. If Nio stays solo for that tech it might have its advantage but the better the batteries will become, the closer it's getting to the performance and probably overtaking it eventually (111km/h swaping vs. 108km/h charging).

@@eruma Don't forget the other big advantage of Nio's battery swap is when battery technology changes owners can pay to upgrade their battery to the newer technology without having to buy a whole new car. No other manufacturer is offering that right now.

@@eruma Why not realistic? NIO already has over 1000 Swap Stations. Most of them come with chargers. Gen 2 can in theory do 300 swaps a day. New Gen3 will take only 3 minutes to swap. They will also hold more batteries and be able to do more swaps per day. Users say there is only a line during rush hour which is fine as there are also chargers. NIO has done limited testing of discharge to grid and will roll out en mass with Gen3 swap stations. This will make more and more sense to you the more you learn about it.

@@silys5253 A single manufacturer can do that, it's fine. But it won't come for the majority of car industry. Every car company would have to build such infrastructure, that would lead to a mess. And as we saw, the average speed isn't that much higher. With better cell tech, you might draw or even outperform the swap-system.

@@eruma Eventually NIO drivers will be able to swap their 150 kWh big pack batteries, which will still take only 3 minutes on their gen 3 swap stations that will be coming online in the next year or two. I seriously doubt there is any DCFC tech that will be able to add 130 kWh to a battery inside of 3 minutes, or even 5 or 10 minutes. Currently something like an Ioniq 5 can add about 50-55 kWh in about 18 minutes, and that only takes the battery to 80%. If you want to take it to 90% like a NIO battery that comes out of the swap station, it would take even longer because charge speed goes down at higher SOC levels. And the Ioniq 5 is about as fast at charging as you can get these days.

It is actually quite inexpensive to provide large numbers of low amperage outlets to apartment garages and parking areas, to allow for overnight charging, to meet daily needs. It just takes some organization to get it done. Also large apartment complexes could provide several 25kw to 50kw DCFCs so that EV owners could fully charge on an ~approximately weekly basis.

@@dmunro9076 yes it's not impossible, but I just wanted to say this technology is useful and can help to the transition, both systems can coexist at the same time

@@javiervazquez7141 How much does it cost to install a battery swap station with the required staff and extra battery packs, along with the needed charging infrastructure for the swapped out packs? It seems to me that the same investment in additional DCFC chargers would provide a much better return on the money spent. The Nio battery swap system is part of the problem, if it means less investment in charging infrastructure.

Bigger capacity is very necessary for road tripping... I use(d) 100kwh pack and drove all over China. Would have sucked with the 75kwh packs.

@@Eric_Garrison I can see that in the less swap station populated area. Here in the Yangtse River delta, 75kWh works fine. The road trips you did, which I loved to watch, 100kWh is for sure recommended. As a daily driver with the occasional road trip in the area the 75kWh is sufficient.

@@mgshg1627 Def for city driving 75 plus swapping is plenty. Thanks for watching the videos ...and hope you are loving the ET7. Can't wait to get one in USA.

It has already been done: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-THSsspz_6ts.html The time was 11:25, i.e. 2 hours and 25 minutes longer than with the battery swap.

Type 3 Discharge 🤣

No idea why people seem to have an impression that NIO cars don’t have the option to charge.

@@theolich4384 Dont get me wrong. the car is great. swap station needs some serious speedups tho.

OnlyFans 🤣

@@bjornnyland a quick one in the loo 👍

Yeah the idea is that you have the option to go the swap route or the charging route with this car. The ice car still gives you the most freedom because you can stop as frequently as you want but you're not forced to.

They have done this millions of times (11 million swaps with 250k+ cars) so the safety and reliability is answered.. Many people claim they have gone to toilet while it was swapping,.. Not to mention, you dont have to always pee while swapping, factoring in 7 mins pee time for every swap is stupid... It takes as much or even lesser space than a carwash... Batteries are being reused and recycled so pollution bit is answered And finally, you dont own the battery, the price of the car doesnt include the cost of battery, hence is cheaper...if they remove a battery from your car, it gets automatically checked for damage/ issues.. If damages are detected, they remove that battery from circulation and repair it.. So no matter what, you get a good battery with company claimed range

There will be 3-4 minites with no air condition. Acceptable even in very hot days.

11+ million swaps with 250k cars says yep

They have done this millions of times... If it catches on, manufacturers can move to their own stations

These work exactly like laser cutter automated storages have been designed for over 10 years. They run for 24h a day for many years no problem. What is complicated is to change a battery that is broken inside a car that is not designed for battery swap. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-lzKO0pie-4s.html

Westeners are soo easily decieved in the lust for consumtion and cheap thrills. Chinese industry spionage in EU and the US and the fact that China is a dictature that wouldn´t mind if Russia invaded Europe is forgotten.

Probably space restrictions at the locations. It looks like it is intended for drive-through but they didn't have the room to orientate the stall properly. It should also be mentioned that this is the only swapping stations in all of europe right now, so it is more of a demo station.

Probably due to space limitations in China

@@BizzMRK Well, you can see space both in front and behind the station, so not sure space restrictions are such a constraint at least in this case.

Winter -10 Pulling a 2000kg trailer. Try to do this with fast charging, Nio is in a league of its own.

@@Lucas-wp2ph I doubt you can get in there with your trailer but perhaps with an updated drive-through design. Again, he spends probably some time waiting, then 8min in the thing, then potentially additional time to visit the toilet, clean windshield or grab food. With the other, you plug in and do what you need in parallel.

@@Samsson83 Fast charging in Winter is many times very slow and the bigger the consumtion the bigger advantage battery swap has over fast charging. And also these battery stations are needed anyway for grid balancing.

@@Lucas-wp2ph With battery preconditioning and especially with heavy loads/long distance this becomes less of an issue as you generate heat. Agree that there might be a space for them in some form but it’s not compelling like shown in this video. The balancing could be a thing but requires a lot of intelligent management. I guess you‘d want the battery „magazine“ below as small as possible so you’d have only as many in there to have a reliable output of one 90% battery every 10min. So this system needs to load 2-3 batteries simultaneously in order to be faster than normal charging. The more batteries you charge at the same time, the more complex the machine gets. Don’t think there is a lot of margin for discharges to balance the grid during peak times. But maybe they could be helpful in some instances and with intelligent coupling.

@@Lucas-wp2ph unless we are talking canada where winters get extremely cold (well below -20°C in some regions) this is not an issue. Heatpumps which have long become standard in EVs and battery preconditioning ensures very good charging rates at most climates. I can charge the car in winter below 0°C at max speed without any problem.

It might be based on land use. I would imagine there is a drive thru variant, which would be more efficient.

2 kr/kWh and 100 kr/swap. On average 3 kr/kWh. HPC in Norway costs up to 7.5 kr/kWh.

@@bjornnyland wow that sounds like an extremely good deal!

You only pay for the energy you "charge up". If your battery has 40% when you arrive, and you leave with 90%, you pay for whatever that 50% equals in kWh.

@@KPFaaland ah makes sense

But you actually pay for kWh before charging losses.

But that 10 to 80% is best case. Which is not a real world case. If you watch Bjorn's EV6 video you will see the problem. Swap is always going to be faster.

@@johniooi3954 It is a real world case and there are lots of YT videos available to prove it. However, it is true that the EV-6/Ionic-5 need firmware and/or hardware mods to ensure that the optimal 10-80% charge curve is available over a wider range of ambient temperatures; this seems to be an easy problem to solve. Providing battery swap stations and the extra battery packs needed to do that, seems a somewhat more difficult and costlier approach to the problem.

Well, consider the que and if the swapping station is not in your way. It will never be more swap stations than superchargers. Not to memtion if charging speed will be much better. Not impressed.

4% more batteries needed.

Or music, let alone Netflix. I’m not impressed.

He mentioned 100 NOK/Swap + the received kwh's (forgot how much the kwh costs). Pretty cheap for now. Probably subsidized by Nio i guess.

It simply has to cost more ? The battery still needs to be changed , plus labour at the swap station ? Also if you swap with 20% charge still on the battery, is your 20% swap is that taken into account , not likely ? So likely cost extra as time costs money and this saves time ? But will this catch on ? I can absolutely see this working for commercial purposes large trucks and delivery vehicles, where a lot of time is spent charging large batteries?

Nio charges a subscription for it, the base subscription includes 2 full battery swaps per month. The subscription fee ranges between 146€ and 209€ per month. They charge 0.20€/kWh plus a 10€ swap fee outside the subscription. This is only available if you lease the battery rather than buying it, which is roughly 9000€ cheaper but the subscription is more expensive after only 4 years of using it without using any extra swaps outside the subscription. It should also be noted that this swapping station in Norway is the only one in existence in europe right now. With the swap taking around 5 to 10 minutes I really see no benefit in it to be honest. It takes just marginably more to use a HPC, which is significantly cheaper and you can walk away from the car.

These swap stations must be way more expensive to build and operate compared to fast charging stations...who is paying for that? With the arrival of solid state graphene batteries swapping may become obsolete in the future??

When you swap out your depleted battery, they charge it again and put it on some other vehicle... So there will be free batteries... If there isnt any battery available at the station you are planning to swap, they can let you know beforehand and you can divert to any other station... Also about the company thing... Tesla is doing the same thing with its supercharger network too

@@frodobaggins2852 I agree with you but there will need to be quite an overhead of spare batteries being charged. I still think battery charging speeds will negate the need for it. But, it is all interesting and it gives people options and isn’t that the wonderful thing about how EVs are developing?

@@8637paul well i dont think battery charging speeds will come close to swapping speeds unless there is a revolution in the battery itself... Which again NIO is bringing through solid state batteries so its not far away.. Also, with swapping, you dont have to worry about paying for battery damage after your warranty ends(which is very expensive), and you dont have to worry about battery degradation either Yes.. EVs are innovating and evolving much faster than ICEs did..

@@frodobaggins2852 I think battery charging speeds will keep improving but probably not as fast as swapping. That being said, in most future science forums, the energy of the future is hydrogen and hydrogen fuel cells only take 5 minutes to fuel up so the future does look bright. I think the swapping stations are a nice option to the fast chargers but obviously not a replacement.

@@Outsider.Reviews the generation of hydrogen is a problem we havent cracked yet.. Its still highly costly, and inneficient... But im still hopeful

you mean like the 150k solid state battery comening in 2 months and the 400 people development center for battery research and the hungary factory for chargers and swap station and the unmanned 800V swap station gen3 coming next year?

The station is designed to drive through, just it will take a lot space in order to install the station this way , not economic .

@@LL-bn1xn You mean like a drive through Mc Donald's?

You have a 30-40 min delay if charging stations are full.. 15 min sounds good compared to that

That's a good point. I guess we'll have to wait and see. I hope we get a video on it for winter swaps

several video about this from China... works just fine in sub zero. (they are not stupid.....)

also... 11 Million swaps. not a novelty at all

No problem so far. We have used the swap station since January (=snow, ice and salted roads)

😂 Comparing a Tesla to a Nio is funny,

yeah a non starter with 10+ million swaps and 1070 stations

@@Lucas-wp2ph yeah these guy have no idea.

From your comment I can only assume you do not understad a thing about how any of this works🙂

@@Lucas-wp2ph Any battery swapping is dumb.

@@kirbykrause7866 Paying over 20000€ for a battery change is the real stupid.ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-DG9Izqp6WWU.html

even if you hammer it, you won’t shed an hour. The normal traffic will prevent any advantage of driving fast for few meters.

@@davids.6671 No haha there at all. Depends when you drive. Mostly i start at night when i go to vacation(150- 160 wherever possible), so i get at least 120-130 average speed. ;)

I'm pretty sure the swap stations have charging stalls on the outside as well so you have the option to charge or swap. Also, from what I understand the swap station can also give power back to the grid during power outages or peak hours etc..

It's possible to have all batteries in the station charged to 80%, one at 85% and one (ready to be swapped at any moment) to 90%. Once the swap process of the charged one starts, the next two in queue get charged by additional 5%, each one at the charging speed of 45 kW, which is perfectly fine at that SOC. By doing this, little harm is done.

2 kr/kWh and 100 kr/swap

@@bjornnyland Thanks i'll convert it

I was like is that a Burger King 😅