Thanks again for the opportunity to come on the show lads. As I mentioned at the end, what you've created here with the Nero Show needs to be commended. While you don't get it right all the time - including having a dude on that's still riding 26mm tyres - you do get it right most of the time, and that is why your show is a success (even though some keyboard warriors won't like to read that). Keep it going and appreciate the work that went into this chat. See you in Noosa, Chris!
Go all in with the Zwift setup. Dedicated PC with ultra profile graphics (cheaper than you think), free sync monitor big but not too big (mounted eye level or down lower), two industrial fans, mini fridge, and water cooler close by. I do 6-8 hours per week easy. Group rides for endurances, races are fun, completing all the route badges got me into after having three kids.
I'd pay money ($10 patreon?) to see a Zwift race with you guys and some more cycling RU-vidrs (good content live streamed). Little Mayan Mash course let's go guys!!!
Hey Cam. Fellow SC local here...air-conditioner and fans for the indoor trainer keeps things civilized. Music for any workouts that have intensity and movies/tv shows for everything else. But, as Jesse mentioned, and knows, I'm one of those riders with the weird I can do ALL my riding indoors types (5 Hour Z2 is my longest indoors. Not that I am ever going to repeat that effort!).
You know what would be a good video? Give an experienced racer like Chris a bike fit with Neil. Really curious how much he'd need to change, I'd guess not a lot!
I agree with Jesse’s point, I always felt like I was missing out until I tried some of the high end stuff long term. Now I’m much more likely to go for a budget high performance build without feeling like I’m missing out… marketing kinda sucks, but it works really well
Absolutely fabulous show!! These shows with your special guests, especially the other cycling RU-vidrs are incredible, please, more of these (along with your regular weekly show!).
2:25 Mythbusters was asked what was their biggest 'Oh Wow!' moment was. They said a car they put in a wind tunnel, then covered it in clay, added the dimples and drag was reduced 14%. So I stick with the dimples.
Wow, You guys talked about so many great topics. Wheel and tire width are great for cyclists looking for marginal gains I believe after your fitness level is at a high level. Handlebar width is more of a preference based on your shoulder width, fitness level, flexibility and then aero performance. Western brand bike frames versus Chinese bike frames. My experience goes back over 25 years of racing for Cannondale (Saeco team bikes), Fuji Team and Specialized SL Gerolsteiner team bike's. After 10 years away from road cycling ( Traumatic brain injury related) I started watching all of your channels and then decided to start training once again, Indoor training for 12 months before deciding to build a Road bike. I actually chose a Chinese bike frame based on the Ridley Noah SL frame, I used a 2023 Sram Red group set and had a set of 45mm Carbon wheels with DT Swiss 240exp hubs and Sapim CX Ray spokes, These are identical as the DT Swiss all around race wheels. Thanks guys, You gave me the confidence to train and race UCI Gran Fondo races. Cheers
One thing that no one mentioned when discussing these ‘premium brands’ is the amount that they put back into cycling through sponsorships, charity and general support to grassroots cycling. Take Rapha and what they’ve done for African cycling for example. Some people want to support those causes through their purchases.
Tour Mag already tested aero penalty of tyres, going up from 28 to 30, 32, 34 only 1-2 watts aero penalty between sizes at 45 kph, which is marginal. Real world RR gains, better grip, and cornering speed by far outhweighs the small aero penalty.
@@pierrex3226 No, it's not a lot of watts, because these losses are at 45 kph, when u put out 400-450 watts to maintain 45 kph. So like 420 watts vs 422 or 424 watts, At 30 kph it's like 0.5 watts. ANd in real world, on rough terrain u gain back watts on RR with wider tires at lower pressue, which makes the 32 tyre faster vs the 28.
@@nerocoaching - Google "Flo cycling 105% rule" - should give you a starter for reading. I was going to post this exact comment that IRL the rolling resistance watts can often outweight the aero 105% rule depending on road surface quality. This is why i think we are seeing a trend towards wider external widths so people can run 28/30/32mm tyres and still reap the 105% benefits AND the rolling resistance benefits. Not that it actually matters to the average joe hobbyist cyclist in the slightest.
I bought a pair on Bontragers Aeolus 37V and 6 months later, I had a lag bolt go through the rim when I got push off the road by a truck, and 4 days later I had a brand new wheel. That is the second wheel they have replaced using the 2 yr no questions asked warranty in the last 7 yrs.
Thanks dudes! That was super informative and awesome! All my favourites from the RU-vid Sphere in one episode! Thanks for all the effort you all put in! Much appreciated!
Interesting convo regarding race attendance. I’m not sure if you were specifically talking about criterium races or road races or all races. Personally I would be (and have been) more into road races than crits because of crash risk. And there is no inherent beauty or poetry of riding around in an office parking lot. Road races are beautiful and whether it’s a loop or point to point the courses logically make sense. I think that’s probably one of the reasons for the popularity of gravel. Something to train for that is a beautiful experience as most people will not win and don’t care about winning
Ideal Zwift setup. Laptop directly in front of you, very easily reached. You'll need the perfect height table. MASSIVE TV behind it. Very efficient and with a simple three finger swipe you can toggle between media, youtube and Zwift. Simply run laptop screen partially closed with screen duplicated to the TV. Current Macbook Air's do all this easily. Minimum 3 powerful fans. Without those your basically wasting your time...
Just installed a 30mm gp5000 to the back wheel and been measuring how wide it stretches on a 21mm internal hoping it will end up close to 32mm. I thought I was being a bit weird but this episode made it feel a bit more normal.
@@burarum1 Takarenkaalla on eniten painoa joten suurin hyöty rullaukseen tulee siitä. Edessä 28mm rengas mitattuna 29-30mm, 28mm leveellä vanteella niin saa vähän aerohyötyjä.
Huge thanks to all four of you. If you need an extra validating data point, I've just pinned on a number for my first race, and wouldn't be out there without the content you create. Chapeau Chris and Jesse!
According to Cervelo back in 2015, an aero frame only composes 16% of the bike's drag, therefore around 3% overall, assuming an 80/20 split for rider/bike. • 30% - handlebar • 16% - front wheel • 16% - frame • 9% - fork • 9% - bottle • 9% - drivetrain • 5% - rear wheel • 3% - front brake • 2% - rear brake • 1% - seatpost Can discussions about 'which bike is best for what', also allow for upgrades across all these areas above, and not only wheelsets? The only 1% MG from the list above is the seatpost, & that's really only 0.2%, overall, a very marginal influence. Chinese Cervelo AB-04 aero bars, for example. They don't just fit a '15 S5! Decent volume UCI legal water bottles for a sometimes very hot ride would be nice, for comfort & performance support. Bottles, fork & drivetrain altogether almost equal a handlebar's drag. Indoors, you can do something else like watching movies to multitask; even music isn't safe via buds when mixing it with traffic. Our 1.0 & 1.5m passing rules are impressive here, thank you, Amy & the AGF, but still aren't enforced such that we can truly feel safe on our roads, even here in NW Tassie.
I feel that the training/race wheel thing is something that is more related to the days of Rim Brakes where the rim was the braking surface and would quickly get worn out from training rides, thus there was great incentive to keeping a separate high end, high cost wheelset for race day only and use a cheaper wheelset for training. With Disk Brakes, we no longer have to be concerned with quickly wearing out your race wheels and so this is becoming less of a thing, yes the wheels can also be damaged in a crash etc, but nobody goes out expecting to crash. The cost of tyres is nowhere as high in comparison to high-end wheelsets and so is less of a concern.
The first crit race I did, I crashed. It wasn't even my fault - I was near the back of a group of ~10 guys, and some dude shoulder checked another rider, he went down, took out like 3 other guys, and I was damn near in the middle of the fallen riders at 25mph and couldn't swerve or brake in time lol. Down I went. I still finished the race but it pissed me off pretty good.
Mirrors for the indoor trainer is a huge one. Really helps to self-correct strange movements and bad habits, when you go back outside you can feel what you are doing much better.
58:11 yes Chris, that’s exactly what my indoor setup is. Get one of those indoor cycling tables to put your iPad and water bottles on and then have the big TV with Netflix in the background. Makes a world of difference.
A banger of an episode fellas! I enjoyed every minute of it. 3 of my favorite cycling RU-vid content creators all in one place. 🔥. Edit: 4 content creators 😅
Swisside and Continental are probably leading the way with the marketing of a 'perfectly aero matched tire/wheel set up, with the aero 111 and hadron. Also apparently even testing new chilli compound for what is possibly going to be the next gen Continental tire - according to rolling resistance web site.
In terms of fall off in people for Club Racing - we definitely see it in Sydney Metro area. One influencer for reduced numbers is a cohort of riders who are competing on MyWhoosh for money. The prize money is available for A, B, C & D Grade. I was recently speaking to a well known rider (female) on the Sydney scene who came to watch a Sunday morning race at Sydney Motor Sport Park. I asked her why she was not racing on the day (with the Waratahs) and she told me that she was tapering for a MyWoosh race on Sunday night. She also mentioned that her prize money from MyWoosh is in the $000's
I took a shot and bought a set of Hyper Wheels about two years ago. They arrived in the NY area in 8 days, beautifully packaged. I have over 4500 miles on them, and they are flawless. Of course, putting these wheels on a Look 795 Huez would seem like a comedown, but it has turned out great. By the way, I'm a 90-kg rider.
I have a set of Hyper D33, hubs are great but over all the rims are heavy for what they are. They also won’t hold air. 4 hr ride they go from 52psi to 44psi. Have had 2 different set of tires on them, changed the valves and cores. Changed the rim tape. Have over inflated them and dunked in water to look for bubbles, no bubbles. I gave up.
You guys keep talking about not using multiple wheels because of the difficulty of swapping with disk rotors and the calipers. There are spacers that you can use to put all your rotors in the same space in relation to the caliper and swapping is a non issue. I have 3 sets of wheels that I swap, one training and two race wheel. How do you think pro teams do it? How do you think neutral support is able to give new wheels? It's not an issue.
cool session.....thanks all of you. would be good to know what other cycling space media/journalists/youtubers you respect or value....and by comparison the ones you don't.
I'd like to see you trying to test moderaly small tires with "to low of a pressure " backed up by a insert. To see if it makes sense and get similar results to a bigger tire.
Great episode. Perhaps the current price of an Australian race licence for masters is holding things back.. it's really gone up significantly over last few years
Awesome video and a lot of great information !!! I will watch your videos more often now. For a while I was confused that Edward Snowden is now giving away information about the bike industry, because that NorCal guy looks very similar to him. lol.
Numbers dwindle at Crits because the Aus Cycling License (insurance policy) is $350+ p.a before race fees. We all have ambulance and hospital cover don’t we?
Price is nearly $400 now. And it hurts more when you see AusCycling deprioritising road more and more. And I believe roadies make up most of their licence revenue…
Riding the S-Works SL8 as of now. When I was purchasing the frame, I made a conscious decision to go with my D50 (Drive) wheels, which I moved from my SystemSix. My plan was to move to some other wheels shortly after, but it has been 5 months now, and I'm not planning on doing anything until something bad happens with the wheels. As much as I can see the value in buying a top-end frame for stiffness and weight, this is not as applicable, frankly speaking, to wheels when these new CH products are as light, stiff, and apparently durable as our own EU/US brands. Got them check twice so far in LBS (Spec one) and even they were impressed with them... So this is how it goes.
@myxti3669 definitely lighter, you can definitely feel the difference on the hills. I would also say that it picks up speed better - but systemsix was definitely holding it better. When it comes to max speed, also in favor of systemsix I'm afraid. Comfort wise, SL8 wins big time ;). If not for more climbing that I'm into, I'd keep systemsix for next year or two.
It's so interesting JC hasn't give a shit on tire then now he quickly turns into tire nerd. I like it. I had similar experience once turn into disc brake bike I'm real tire nerd now.
Love these types of podcasts....Vegan, Nor Cal, Cam, etc. Excellent. Would be interesting to see the guests widen a bit, perhaps in age or experience? gg
Have a dedicated trainer bike of some sort. Zwift bike, Wahoo bike, a frame on a Kickr 24/7, something. Eliminate the first excuse; having to mount a bike on a trainer. The fringe benefit is that your road bike is never stranded on the trainer, creating an extra obstacle to riding outdoors. Lots of moving air. There's almost no such thing as too much. I have a ceiling fan on high, and two Vornados on high. I run Zwift on my laptop, Zwift companion on my phone, and sometimes Discord on my tablet for group rides. I have a flat screen in front of me. Watch whatever motivates you and/or helps you pass the time. Personally, I like to watch bike racing. Last winter I basically watched every cyclocross race that could be watched. That shit is entertaining! This morning I rode indoors and watched La Vuelta. Yesterday I watched Gravel Worlds from Lincoln Nebraska as seen here. stylesdeluxe.com/ss/2024-08-24%2009.10.46-1.jpg
Speaking of racing and how to get more people into it. As a person who got into cycling during the pandemic and in decent shape prior to that, I don't think the risk plays well with the reward. I think prior to indoor training if you wanted to get into bike racing you started at a low enough level of fitness that your ability to injure yourself was comparable to the level you were racing at. Starting out the fitness wouldn't allow you to ride at speeds over distance, now someone may show up to their first race with a Category A power level but with no bike handling ability and that can definitely increase the overall risk not just for that rider but for everyone involved. The solution would probably be road racing vice criterium racing where the distances traveled allow for better spacing and less focus on handling tighter corners, but road racing is prohibitively difficult to setup where a requirement to shut down road may be required. The solution just ends up being gravel, which is the only segment of bike racing at a high level that is actually growing, it has the advantages of road racing without shutting down traffic on roads, just use low traffic areas, while also being much more open to beginners that wouldn't even be willing to try a more traditional crit or road race. I know gravel gets a lot of hate especially from you guys but if you were to look at any race and ask who is racing for the first time you would be unlikely to find any at a more traditional bike race but find plenty at a gravel race.
I’ve been doin indoor since 3-4 years ago.the best training for indoors are zone 2, 30/30, and 4x4…I do my 90-120 minutes Zone 2 with NeroShow on my cell phone..i do my 4x4 with crazy music on the ears, but I HATE doing FTP interval indoor..I’ve used Zwift and TR bedore, but now days I left all that and use only my Garmin Edge 530 to control my Kickr Core and that’s it..
going narrow bars for sure makes it more difficult to get leverage on the hoods and drops. basically its less stable so youre forced to use more upper body strength and better technique, other wise the front end will get squirrly. another consideration is the stiffness increases alot, so when you pull theres not much give, sometimes when i sprint the front end will come off the ground each down stroke, but i'v learned to minimize that. bmx racers sometimes wheelie down the entire start ramp from the gate so it cant be that bad may just feel scary at 30-40mph. if youre a climber narrow hoods suck.
Might be interesting to see max power you can deliver across a wide range. I run really narrow bars on the track (about 28cm "hoods" / 32cm drops) and can get out at least 80% of my road max power (not fresh, so it's not apples to apples).
re the chat about indoor training, you guys are coming at it from somewhere with nice weather. Us in the UK do not have the same pleasant weather so don't have a choice.
Typical bike shop convo...getting derailed at every topic. We totally missed what Jeff's Dream Build Crit Bike was going to be! Follow-up video needed ASAP!!! Great show, guys!
Chris, if you get to know and deal with Michael from " Creative Cycles", your skepticism and reluctance in dealing with local distributors will be totally dispensed with. I unequivocally endorse his character, workmanship and quality of products! Cheers from Melbourne.
Threshold, z6. Erg mode on the trainer. Long z2... Outside. Long z2 sessions indoors are torture. But that's just me, with enough distractions/screens z2 can be done indoors but it takes mental strength
For Zwift setups I have it running on my gaming PC because I had one AdZ run crash on an old laptop at about 30 minutes in with not enough time left to start over before work which ended my whole session for the day. Just having capable hardware to run the game gives me peace of mind. I have 2 monitors and don't see a point in more for Zwift specifically, and I rotate which one Zwift is on depending on what I ride. They're both 28" 1440p but because of how my room is set up I can't see both well because I have my bike at an angle so if I'm strapping in for Zone 2 with a custom workout I have Zwift on the one I can't see well and something to watch on the one that's always in view and if I do threshhold free rides or racing and such I have Zwift on the one I have in view all the time.
Tire width aero is like 2w lossed per 5mm of width gained... It really depends on the rim width and depth though as Dylan found his 53mm wide tire was faster than a 50mm on a deep rim and the same as a 45mm
