Overclocking the 4090 should be illegal! 

I know Jay didn't say it but EVGA is so lucky it got out, if the FE is better than a Strix, Nvidia is royally Fing the board partners.

It was so cool plugging my computer into the GPU.

Jay - The error correcting on GDDR6 will happen before you start seeing artifacts. You can't just boost until you see artifacts, you have to run a benchmark after each frequency bump and see when the scores start going down. The errors will affect your scores before you see the artifacts.

If anything AIB should see this as Nvidia is working toward phasing them out

u have to imagine evga has a 4090 we will never get to see just collecting dust in a warehouse or lab somewhere

The comparison to cars on the dyno made SOOOOOOO much sense! I appreciate that..... Keep up the good work!

I always go with GPU tweak with my ASUS cards. I feel like it makes more sense. I understand MSI Afterburner is still very much what people prefer but GPU Tweak 3 is not bad at all and it always feels more right to use the software the manufacture of the card provided.

the best part about your car analogy is that if my fuel system in my car fails short ( and it is the weak link) my car changes the ignition based off a multiplier, starting at 1.00 and goes down... my car underclocks its self.

I always love these overclocking videos, please keep doing them! These are some of my favorite videos from your channel. Thanks for covering the 40 series, I can’t wait to see how far you can get!

I have been a car guy for years and this year stepped into building PC's. Your car reference was perfect and I wish more people could do those types of references for me!

Thank you for the content! Personally I've found overclocking is like stretching. You can work your way up higher stable, But when I turned on my computer the next day it won't boot. I'm guessing that's what you saw with the initial AC run.

Jay's personality has this effect of making relatively boring things like watching other people wait for benchmark results fun indeed. That's a remarkable gift imho.

No wonder the board partners are pissed if the fe card performs so well what value add do they have

Derbauerr already power modded a 4090 with an Elmore Labs voltage controller, and very quickly hit a power limit, it was only very slightly voltage limited, and volt modding did not really get him a lot of extra headroom. Maybe with colder temperatures you could run more voltage, and he probably will, but it seems that Nvidia is running these right on the very ragged edge of what they're capable of. Or what they've bios limited them to.

Through my own testing, I found the lower temp problem Jay had is related to the GDDR6X. I was experiencing random black screens on cold system starts, even though my card passed stress tests and benches at +1500 memory offset when it warmed up a little. So with blasting the fans I found once the GDDR6X memory temps fell below 35C, memory starts throwing errors at speeds above 1450mhz, this is consistently reproduceable. It is weird because generally silicon performs better the colder it is, at 24Gbps these memory modules behave weird and need a sweet spot temp to run well, I've found that's around 60c. I run the ram daily now at +1400 offset and it's been solid(23.8Gbps). The FE cards don't cool the memory as well as AIB cards, so that would explain why it did better on memory, it's keeping the ram in that sweet spot range better and avoiding this cold bug problem.

I love the blanket method. It's a whole new world for tech this round.

I had an old GTX card, don't remember exactly but may have been back in the 500 och 700 series, that was only stable at maximum overclock when the card was hot. Tuning it while hot would get me to a stable place but if I let it cool down I started getting artifacting when the temperature dropped below like 75 degrees. Run the benchmark for a while and as the temperature went up the artifacts dissappeared. Made it really annoying to find a truly stable overclock for the card

4090 has a digital voltage control so you need elmor's evc to use the i2c. I think LN2 will be necessary for higher frequencies tho :)

I was able to get the VRAM on an EVGA 3080 to +2000 and be stable, a Gigabyte to +1500, an ASUS to +1500, a different EVGA to +1200, an Aorus to +1100, an HP to +900, an MSI to +900, and a Dell to +800. I was amazed at how high you could overclock the memory on those 3080's and the HUGE range of values that different brands of cards would crash at. EVGA was always king at making these video cards as stable as possible. I am going to miss them. Every single one of those cards didn't have heat-pads behind the VRAM going to the metal backplate EXCEPT the EVGA cards. And because of that EVER SINGLE CARD except the EVGA ones would throttle unless they had heat-pads going from the VRAM to the fucking backplate... God damn, I spent a lot of money on fucking heat-pads. I really am going to miss EVGA.

I think its faster with lower clock speed and lower temp because in the 40 series there is bunch of hidden clock speeds too. And I think they might be boosting higher due to the lower temp.

It looks like it's that time of year already! Can't wait to see some LN2 on the 4090!!

Just had to pause the video in appreciation of that moment at 4:55, I want more tech channels to explain things in terms of what happens when you're on the dyno ;D

Wow that is trippy. Can't wait to see the others come up with videos explaining why this is so different.

I haven't been this geeked out since I got the 2080Ti, sort of lost interest in the last couple of years. But watching this brings back so many memories

Jay, it could be possible that the memory performing better is making it so the gpu is doing less work. Meaning that the memory or at a minimum the GPUs ability to utilize the memory is the bottleneck.

Can't wait for the 4090 Tie to start tripping breakers.

Hey Jay, stupid question (probably) but I wonder, did you check the behavior of video- and effective clock speeds in HWM when OC? Apparently these seem to be somewhat tied to core voltage. Which seems to have a huge impact on performance when undervolting, even tough core clocks are the same... (unlike 30 Series) I wouldn't be surprised if those react to higher voltage as well... Just an idea though... 🤔

Watching these videos is the closest I will ever come to a real gaming PC.. These are just insane! I am still on my rig from 2009 haha

I love when jay compares computer and cars

Always nice to see your process

unrelated but I've recently noticed that I watch every video this man posts and shows up on my feed, but I never actually listen to what he says or watch the video. I just put his videos on and walk around the house doing stuff, using the video as background noise lmao

What I want to see (don't think anyone has covered it yet) is noise and thermal comparisons between the FE and the Strix. I couldn't care less if the FE gets a higher score, I typically buy Strix cards because they run much cooler and quieter than the FE.

what a terrific video, well done. Keep it up

I ended up with Core clock at 125hz, and 2,000 Memory clock. Pretty satisfied considering it's just air cooled in my PC, and I've never had a card get anywhere near 2,000hz on mem. Great video!

I miss the days when this channel was smaller than Barnacules and video titles were clear.

I wanna hook this up to a waterblock and put the radiator outdoors during a nice Swedish winter. Yummy

Also I like how you use car analogies to help explain

What you were saying about lower temperatures allowing more performance from a given clock speed is actually true and an accepted scientific fact, fundamental in the field of electromagnetism. Lowering the temp of a conducting material reduces its electrical resistance, e.g. the super conductor train in Japan uses wires and coils which have been cooled to extremely low temps. Very astute!

What cant it run straight out the box? These things are beastly and I hope AMD stays with them with the 7000 series

i watched steve's teardown of the FE and it looks like its top notch build quality. thermal pads and TIM are all like perfectly applied. no glue and actual metal frame. i was always anti-FE, until the 40s finally upped their game

I love watching you do this it's so great

Modern Physics has that, the very hi voltage and frequencies opening and or expanding. love how you made that transition.

That card is comically huge.

A graphics card being that big should be illegal.

Maybe the overclocking mechanism has som sort of stabilization mechanism. What I mean is that if it has to skip a cycle, in order to compensate for errors, it simply runs slower, since skipping a cycle lowers the processing speed. It's like the diff between 6 or 7 clockcycles per instruction on the CPU. If the answer isn't done by 6, it skips to 7. Then if the temp drops, it tries for the 6 again, which then is a boost on top of the overclocking settings. (like 16% or such.), and then ofc it crashes since now it tries to run that much faster, instead of skipping to the next cycle, which then in turn allows the rest to be done correctly as well. You can check for it by comparison in framrates at less or non overclocked speeds, and then calculate what the outcome should be at overclocked rates. If the numbers come up lower for testing, it starts skipping more. Also the most latency between any processing and memory is reading the memory. But most of that is difference between clockcycles. If the memory is at clockcyle like 3000.4 and the processor is at 4000 exactly, the computation can't start until reaching 3001 for the memory, after which the processing unit will have to wait till 4001 or even 4002 as well. Memory can only be read if the bus is already showing the correct result.

@5:09 my man just compared constant voltage on a GPU to a return style fuel system on a car lolll I love this channel.

Would love to see Kingpin on the board with his one off EVGA 4090.

I remember I originally subbed to this channel because Jay was a car guy and a PC guy, by the way I liked your analogy. I wonder if most car guys are PC gamers and just don't know it yet.

I said it b4. the voltage slider does do stuff. but only if the voltage/freq curve has been setup in msi afterburner. I can show you what I mean if you wish to get in a chat with me. but it DOES do something. you can also lock freq rather than have it jumping around. there is also a feature to clock based on temp.

Thanks for the car analogies

I honestly wonder if you were to underclock the core and then possibly clock the memory higher, would it lead to a higher score?

Debau8r was able to unlock the voltage and the card immediately became power limited

i liked your dyno analogy! i get it, but non car people might not. fuel is power, more fuel you can burn the more power you can make, voltage=power. love it jay

I love watching Jay and co it’s like hanging out with the boys

Hey guys great video as per usual. Optimum tech did a good video on undervolting and found video hz speed dropped but the core clock said it was the same. He was using hw monitor and 3 different core clocks to look at. Could pushing the ram or the core be causing the voltage to drop to low in one or the other? Does that make sense?

nice to seee you having fun doing what you like for a change

Is the strix using large thermal pads like the tuff is? Do you track the ram to see if it’s thermal throttling?

Funny that you also have cold instability, i have an issue with my 7950X being unstable with -20 curve optimizer on a fresh cold boot, but being stable in warmed up stress tests. I have given up for now but i hope it will resolve with new bios.

I liked the ending

Imagine the score if Jay had managed that cable mess on the desk 🙃

My dad builds servers and once told me that your biggest enemy is time for data to move like length of cables etc. seems negligible but it can add up. I wonder if the low temp is contracting the board decreasing distance data travels.

FE sounds like a plan, great video.

Yes sir Jay I like your car references and I hope ppl actually understand what you are talking about. Luckily most of newer ecus these days will pull timing and cut power on a fuel pressure loss or sudden spike.

Could it be the shrink effect from low temps with 5nm node?

I took a lot of time and care putting it together and it runs really well

afaik the 16Gb Micron Memory Chips on the 4090 and 3090Ti have negative cold scaling. at some point you will have to place a memory heater on the card or try to increase the memory voltage to heat them up more (they might also scale with voltage and run a bit faster) i'm also wondering if the FE is using higher spec memory modules than the AIB cards like that one 6900XT did where it had something like 17Gb/s modules while the other cards had 15Gb/s.

I always enjoy watching Jay overclock. He's what convinced me to get 3D Mark and have fun with it. I want to buy your stuff, but I need tshirt colors other than black. I'll buy two deskmaks if you make them for left handed mice. Until then, keep up those incredible ifixit ads.

Imagine being able to actually buy a 4090 not from scalpers. Especially an FE.

Thank you for what you do, Jay. Did you use gpu tweak 3 with the FE card or is it only for Asus cards?

I wonder if it makes a big difference in games these overclocking numbers, if it does I might try overclocking mine, right now I'm just using the silent bios and chilling at low temps with plenty of fps to spare. I actually undervolted and got the same performance at 300-320W, I'm very happy.

i feel like the strix was designed to run horizontally (with the Mobo vertical as it would be in the case) something as silly as it's orientation could be the key factor in it's cooling capabilities (as it's vapor chamber)

Haven't built a new gaming rig since 2013! Still running an OC 2600K / AMD R9 Fury / Sabertooth 77 board. ( Replaced dual 7970's for the R9 in 2016 ) I see some nice stuff finally dropping in price , where I might finally build a new rig later winter time. Going all AMD though I believe.

The red and blue honestly looks amazing

It’s to bad the FE cards are impossible to get, pretty much only through Best Buy here which had 0 in stock day one

I absolutely love Jay's overclocking videos. I wish he kept overclocking after his 3090 kingpin card died from being lapped

Jay you da man! 💯💪🏽

From my experience, temperatures may affect how voltage regulator actually behaves (on both CPU and GPU) which may cause crashing with lower temps. I had this happened a few times. Hot silicon, rock solid. Cool it down a lot, crashes all the time. If you are able to heat it up without crashing, rock solid again but as soon as it goes to idle and cools down, it may crash again. For sure VID or just ASUS voltage regulators take the temps into account and the voltage you see might not be exactly what you have on the core. By the way, I have no clue if that works, but wouldn't Ctrl+Shift+Win+B (GPU restart) be enough to flush corrupted memory?

Jay you keep saying these cards are voltage limited and they are not. Watch Der8auer's video. If you raise the voltage even 50mV above what the software lets you do you run face first into the power limit. He is currently working on a Power Mod for his card so that he can push it beyond the 600W max power.

That fuel pump - turbo pressure to voltage - clock speed metaphor is really cool to me

The really bad thing is water cooled card with preinstalled blocks are still more expensive even they dont have expensive vapor chambers and th air cooled cards picked up with material they use for the giant air cooler.

Waiting on my 4090 went with the liquid cooled MSI

5:15 i never knew he was knowledgeable on cars like that

Air gun and shop air noticed got extremely cold on my fingers. Loud but I wonder how cool you can get an air radiator with shop air carefully placed

I had an issue with lower temps on a RX590, think it was down to holding a higher state for longer, it could hold it for short bursts but not a constant

The GPU Tweak is gonna be acting differently in comparison with Afterburner, also the GPU Tweak has different voltage profiles maybe giving a try to that might have change the results. The 0.050mV on the Performance mode might increase something between 30-60mhz to the clock, that’s interesting considering that the FE is somehow at the same level I believe than it is safe to assume the Rog Strix P-Mode isn’t a really P-Mode it seems a kind of “placebo”. Also, the voltage fluctuations not always make things crash it will be for sure depending on how voltage is regulated on the PCB. Anyway…

gpu tweak is actually damm good now.

Science time with Jay had me in tears

I saw this exact same behavior on my 6900 XT. Ended up setting a 2525 Max Clock with a 1135 voltage 2150 ram speed and maxed the power slider also slightly increased the fan curve. In Timespy the clock sits right around 2460 the ram at 2138 pulling around 1080-1100Mv and gives me a GPU score of 21800 +/- 50, temps were round 62-65 GPU and 86-89 hotspot. Upping the clock speed or voltage anymore than this spiked the temps and my score ended up dropping 600-800 points. As Jay said something else on the card is benefiting from the lower temps and that is giving better performance boost than core clock.

I tried overclocking and getting at best top 10. I did for the 2070 super for awhile but for my 3080ti I got a bad card. I can't even break 13000. These 4090 cards hitting 28000 to 30000 is crazy.

Now I know why EVGA left that makes way more sense than anything.

What might be an issue on a 4090 that causes 3DMark to freeze the whole computer at the end of a benchmark? I've had it go through the entire benchmark process and force me to hard restart my PC at the point when 3DMark should be showing the scores.

Jay knows car stuff man hes the goat!

DerBauer's review showed the 4090 being far over its optimal point on the power curve so I'm surprised at how much headroom is still left to overclock. It was surprising how well it ran at 60-70% power limit, which was 100W less power and could make using one in a SFF system somewhat manageable.

Get that chip to 92c to 93c it starts to show weirdness , then cool it so block the fans and force a overheat then let it cool itself slowly as a while

looking good jay!

How much is it affecting your EDC. I'm wondering how it's going to push your CPU

Can't wait to see Newegg bundles that contain a 13900K or 7950X, a 4090 and a window unit air conditioner. Meanwhile in Canada people will be selling their space heater to buy a 4090.

Those prices should be illegal...

Jay is the man cause he compares everything to cars. A good car analogy can go miles (pun intended) when explaining computers to the layman.

o yea. jay throwing out those running too lean car comparisons.. love it