@@MaddyBird666 Around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world
I have never felt more mixed emotions than when I saw Discovery being raised to a 10 but then immediately being followed up by RAM being lowered to a 6.8
RAM is one of the best albums I have ever heard and felt an 8-10 is a reasonable score to give it. Who the hell thought a 6.8 was an adequate score for the influence and experience you get with that album.
@@aMonkeyInaManSuit Yeah, RAM is pretty much a flawless record. I wouldn't take pitchfork and their silly little ratings too serious. After all, it's just the opinion of a couple of people.
@@aMonkeyInaManSuit "RAM is one of the best albums I have ever heard" Did you just start listening to music last week? What kind of nonsense ass opinion is this?
@@Nerdz2 It’s like they did it out of spite. “Yeah ok, maybe we made a mistake with our first Discovery review…. but we wouldn’t want you Daft Punk fans to be too happy about it…” * bumps RAM’s score down even lower *
The TOTBL re-score is so weird, one because they had already re-scored it (it was still a 9.5), and also because this is a decade-defining album we're talking about. This was Pitchfork's Album of the Year for 2002, lest we forget.
Yeah random and unnecessary eh, like it was in their top 20 of the '00s many years after it came out so wasn't like a fleeting hype album. Still one of the best guitar records of this millennium, no need to disrespect it like that...
Their last complaint with Random Access Memories is that it gave way to Pharrell's Happy, a completely unrelated work, other than that he was on two tracks off this album. Yep, Pitchfork still up to their bullshit.
Take note, it wasn't the original author (the founder of pitchfork no less) of the 0.8 review doing that. That one is still accessible and still a mean spirited, fart sniffing tome of self loathing and projection.
@@dj_matanzaa Honestly, out of all their rescores that one is probably the least egregious to me. I wouldn't have lowered it to a 7.7 but I never would've given it the 9.2 it actually got either.
Pitchfork literally just gives out the score that is the most “trendy” for them to give an album that way they don’t get backlash for not liking a particular album
100%. grimes is in the news cycle for being cringe? yeaahhh you know what i think that album of hers from a while ago is gonna need a fat rescore all of a sudden
@@ozarkecologies lol what? It’s okay for your opinion to overlap with /mu/ or whoever else’s, that doesn’t mean you stole their taste that just means you both like a thing. I love TOTBL and I’ve never been on /mu/.
Say what you want about Demon Days (L to all of you contrarians ngl) but there's no way The Single Collections (which is just a compilation of singles and remixes) got a 7.9/10. Just so confusing
Even though it's a score increase, their reassessment of Vroom Vroom really annoys me bc it's SOOOOO stupendously backhanded. Pitchfork have this bizarre presumption that just because Charli, Sophie, and the PC Music camp were being quirky and experimental with their new hyperpop sound, they assumed it was actually some kind of trick and containing some kind of deep satirization of pop formulas that they got pissy at because they couldn't back up, and even with the update, they still frame it as the EP's fault that they overthought it so poorly. like jesus tapdancing christ, it's just pop music designed with the purpose of being FUN. Being fun doesn't need to have this crazy political post-avant-garde analysis to be valid, Pitchfork's adamant belief that everything must be and IS consciously didactic is so headass'd (that also includes their attitude on Daft Punk's RAM -- correct me if I'm misreading, but literally all their reasoning is "RAM didn't change the entire future of music, except in the things that did that we don't like no we're not gonna explain any further what that means") Pitchfork's entire methodology and approach to art is equivalent to asking a dude how he makes friends, and he responds with "well according to my calculations..."
@@MostafaElSakari ...no? Why? What for? I'm just making a point bc I really really love and respect Vroom Vroom and dislike critics who hold and impose nonsensical standards up to it lol
I actually think the BTD score change was warranted. One of its biggest critiques when it came out was that it didn’t have lasting power and would fade like every trend does. Yet it’s spent 400 weeks (as of now) on the billboard top 200. It’s not Lana’s best record, but it’s lasting power is undeniable.
@Immortal Science of Hauntology That's a criticism I understand. However, to me, telling Interpol to change up the aesthetic on TOTBL is like telling somon who keeps landing bullseye's that they need to mix it up and miss a few times. It's an album that has had a massive effect on me personally and no one else quite keeps that feeling going as consistently and long as Interpol does. Though I am always willing to listen to anything that can claim to.
Agreed. It honestly sounds better now than it did when it came out. Even in the midst of all the bland ripoffs that followed, it still sounds towers so much of the indie rock that came out that decade. Immortal album..
I highly disagree with Interpol getting a lower score. The drumming and basslines are extremely groovy, hypnotic, influential and classic the record just never gets old. The lyrics are great and still relevant to this day. The atmosphere they create is moody and sad but beautiful and bold without being too vague or too washed out. Sonically, I believe its in the top 10 best sounding post punk albums of all time no debate this was mixed and mastered to perfection. The songwriting isn't the most unique thing but that doesn't mean the songs aren't well written or performed well. Pretty much every song is memorable and catchy. Even if not that memorable... songs like "Untitled" and "Hands Away" are still at least intriguing or somewhat captivating. Maybe songs like "She Was Always Down" and "The New" are a bit too long but still phenomenal songwriting and singing on both songs. Also, the album has a great balance of tenders moments and aggressive moments. The outros they added to songs elevated the song and made for some rewarding detours or add different dynamics to the songs. Their debut is at least a 9 or a perfect 10. Once you play this album and get a custom to the album ...most likely you'll play it for the rest of your life. There's always songs on here you can revisit and enjoy.
This is why I like your reviews. You give your opinion, and your reasons for your opinions. If you change your score, it's because you changed your opinion. Pitchfork is magnifying their irrelevance as a critical outlet, they are openly acknowledging that they are changing scores based on reasons having nothing to do with the content of the albums. Hey folks, guess what? You don't have to do retractions like this if you do your original review based on the content of the album, instead of scoring according to the reaction that you want to provoke from your readers.
To be fair, it’s probably for that reason why they didn’t “canonize” these scores, because it’s unavoidable that public perception is probably a key factor in these changes. Basically, listening to Discovery back in 2000 is muuuch different than listening to Discovery in 2021. Though yeah they did RAM dirty. The fuck wow that?
Pitchfork's reviewing system is somewhat bizarre in that while the text is written by an individual, the score is an aggregate of scores given by the entire editorial staff. This has resulted in more than a few reviews where the text and the score are wildly mismatched. I'd say this article is at least partly a result of staff turnover.
@@jmckenzie962 yup They didn’t even throughly explain why it’s a 7.7 instead of a 9 or something like that. They just dismissed it as a transitional album of some sort smh
Not sure how they can still justify giving NIN - The Fragile and Tool - Lateralus 2/10 scores. Two of the most beloved and influential metal albums ever.
That random access memories rescore is a straight up insult. It was way more accessible than their other albums and way more successful, while still having some absolutely wicked grooves.
I think some of the re-reviews hit the nail on the head - Son of Chico Dusty, Vroom Vroom, and Discovery for example. However, downgrading RAM really surprised me. They dock it for not being as "pivotal" as Discovery, when I really don't think an homage album with "memories" in the title is aiming for being pivotal or inventive in any way. I re-listened to the album when Daft Punk broke up, and I think it really holds up - the production is flawless, the tracklist feels varied and yet coherent, and Touch and Giorgio by Moroder are some of my favorite tracks of the 10's.
@@Jf2jf2jf2 I really like the mix of the synths with the funky/groovy guitars in RAM. Personally I think it holds up pretty well with the rest of their discog.
My favorite Pitchfork Moment is reading that review trashing how pretentious Tool fans are (which they are, don't get me wrong), then jumping over to their Radiohead reviews written at the exact same time without any irony
@Quint0ni0 to be honest, I never liked how over-dramatic RAM sounds, songs like Giorgio by Moroder, Touch, Game of Love... I'm fine without ever listening to them again...
We'll never forgive them for giving Lateralus a 2 and Frances the Mute like a 4. They complained about how "stuck up" Frances was- I mean... I get what your saying- while also being incredibly stuck up. Wow. Imagine my shock.
My thing with these big review magazines is they'll always have this defect where, when they review a record poorly and get a lot of criticism for it, especially if that criticism lasts for years and the record becomes influential or popular to any significant extent, the magazine has no reason not to go back and "change" the review or the score or simply start putting it on best of lists and such. This is because, since they rely on the collective opinion of the writers and staff at the magazine, the one guy who didn't like it when it came out, wrote the review, and later left the magazine doesn't have any influence over what they think of the record years down the road. With a solo reviewer, the initial review is less likely to change and therefore has more lasting meaning. What I really want to know reading or watching a review is whether or not the reviewer likes it, not what the collective population thinks about it. That way I can get a feel for the reviewer's taste and understand what's likely to score well with them and what's likely to be criticized. Then when they score something well I'll already have an understanding of what makes a record good for them and, comparing against my own concept of what makes a record good, I'll have a good idea or whether or not I myself might like it. With a big magazine, where different writers have can wildly different opinions and tastes, it's much more difficult for me to know if I'll like something based on how they review it. Just my thought process on this.
This is a great point. I like Fantano, but I know there are certain areas and genres where we are just going to forever agree to disagree, and that's fine. But I have a general impression of what a good and bad score mean to Fantano. Can't say the same about Pitchfork, Rolling Stone, etc.
Just popping in to say you nailed it. Why I’m so glad we have RU-vid and other forms of social media now to be able to follow individuals whose tastes and perspectives may align close to our own or are at least, as much as a human mind can be, relatively consistent. I don’t agree with fantano on plenty of takes, but one thing that I can say is I’m always interested to hear his opinions because you actually have a concept of what makes him tick, unlike many faceless music journalists. No disrespect intended, but I like having that personal connection particularly when it comes to discussing music.
"Our review, which was written as a screenplay, focused more on the band's then-recent appearance on Dawson's Creek than the actual music." That's like what I'd write if I was parodying Pitchfork apologizing for their early era.
But he is. I’ll never forgive him for not agreeing with me. That is an unforgivable sin that can never be washed away. You either agree with me, or get fucked. I’m very mature.
"19 Album Scores We'd Change If We Could" What do you mean 'if you could'?! You're Pitchfork! You created the scores, so you can change them whenever you damn well please! You don't have treat this like it's an act of sacrilege. Sheesh.
The fact that they dropped TOTBL from a 9.5 to a 7 for having ‘bad’ lyrics and sounding like a bland ripoff is almost infuriating. It’s one of the best albums to come out of the whole early 2000s post punk and garage rock revival era.
@@pretendwilliams3525 That specific song feels to me like a kid reading out really awkward, bad middle school poetry in English class (both from the vocal delivery and the lyrics). I mean "she can read, she's bad" and "I wish I could eat the salt off of your faded lips" really don't do it for me. I like the hooks lyrics though they're alright
Meanwhile, Wikipedia will have to update all of these scores to respect the faceless dweebs at Pitchfork while refusing to respect Anthony as a legitimate reviewer
i can't believe Christgau's bullshit is recognized by Wikipedia but Fantano isn't. Christgau's reviews are fucking terrible and even though Fantano disappears up his ass sometimes, he usually backs it up, even if his reasons are shit. Christgau doesn't even do that, cause his writing is just shit
@@tite93 He doesn't have an editorial staff and self-publishes his reviews, meaning that he can technically say whatever he wants without fact-checking or quality control.
Born to Die is the 2nd longest charting female debut of all time! It's influence is still being felt today. It definitely deserved the up score. Her voice sounds amazing too! Pitchfork should also up score Blood Orange - Negro Swan and St. Vincent - Daddy's Home. Both underrated af.
Same. Unfortunately, they are massive contrarians, so they probably wont change their minds on their minds on their most hated reviews, just out of spite.
@@lepkember6913 i like how some people in the comments are like "i got no respect for pitchfork cuz they are just trendy fucks bowing down to the masses" and some people are like "i got no respect for pitchfork cuz they are spity contrarians going against common taste to spike attention"
Kinda sad to not get your reaction to the Wilco score change. Sky Blue Sky is a decent record but I was surprised they re-graded it that high, while they left their middling AGIB rating alone.
I have no idea about that......in overrall professional critics have barely idea , i mean, they dont have enough knowledge, enough open mind, never listen them. Pd. Lateralus is 5/5 stars......
What in the actual fuck?! I had to google that, who doesn't come out of that album having experienced how special it is? Lat is probably in my top 5 albums ever, that score is such bullshit lmfao.
" Every CD the critics give it a 3 then 3 years later they go back and re grade it and call the slim shady LP the greatest The marshall Mathers was a classic The Eminem show was fantastic But Encore just didn't have the calibre to match it " A hugely underrated Em song right there
@@teamkockroach4080 Nah I like Encore, it’s just eminem being a goofball but I’ll take that over his newer shit. As ridiculous as it is I think it’s a good album definitely underrated IMO
Finally someone said it. Disappointed Fantano didn’t talk about that one here given that he claims to be a big Prince fan. Both of those records deserve a critical reevaluation.
Moth by Chairlift is one of my absolute favourite albums of all time and I totally agree with the re- score. Firstly, they show such an intimate understanding of the verse- chorus- verse pop song format that they could completely mess around with the structure and subvert the form (e.g., they never repeat the verse on ‘Ch-ching’) without anyone noticing. Secondly, the sound palette is fucking gorgeous: Caroline Polachek’s delicate and yet operatic singing, with its so- called ‘natural auto tune’ is the most obvious example of this, but the vintage and yet simultaneously extremely modern sounding synths on tracks like ‘Crying in Public’ are unforgettable. Also, sometimes the production is genuinely risky, like the absurd guitar tone on the intro to ‘Romeo’ (which also has one of Caroline Polachek’s most distinctive vocal lines in the chorus’), or the sampled, filtered saxophone harmonies that show up all over the record, or the really abstract production on tracks like ‘Look Up’ and ‘Ottawa to Osaka’. I think Caroline Polachek summed up the album when she said that the pop song format should always be used as ‘a Trojan Horse’ for some new idea. Maybe the tracks sound bland to you, but maybe that’s just because the Trojan horse is so effective that you don’t notice how experimental it is underneath.
I think revising criticism for reasons outside the realm of just simply enjoying the music is so unbelievably pretentious. That's like reviewing the videogame Portal, and underrating it because you hate "the cake is a lie" memes. I think they're unintentionally reminding everyone of why they aren't a trustworthy outlet for honest opinions.
I'm like 90% sure they pre-write their reviews, sort of a shit on the artist and try to cancel them but then write like 2 paragraphs about the music itself.
Man I have really bad eyesight, I was like “damn they rescored Scott Walker’s Bish Bosch to a 10?” Then realized it was Discovery, which should be canon lol.
I'd have more respect for Pitchfork if their reviews weren't written like a college freshman's hot take corner. The scores are arbitrary to me. I could wildly disagree with them and still respect the outcome IF the writing backed it up. EDIT: OK, Rilo Kiley record did get me a bit. So uh...good work. Science Vs. Romance is amazing.
Seeing Discovery get the 10 it deserves followed by that disgusting RAM score drop was like finding $20 on the ground and then immediately dropping your wallet in the sewer 🤢
Don't forget Pitchfork originally gave Nine Inch Nails' The Fragile a 2.0, then gave the 2017 rerelease an 8.7, calling it Reznor's magnum opus and comparing it to Pink Floyd's The Wall 🙃
Interesting that you showed their changed opinion on STP's Tiny Music because that IS one of the most underrated rock albums (from a mainstream act) of the 90s
Turn on the bright lights is a 10/10 and the best album of its decade and pitchfork just lost my respect. Which is a huge blow to them because this is the first time I've been to their website
They are terrible, I’d take their opinion with a grain of salt because their “taste” is so fickle and scatterbrained. At least with Fantano, he’s very forthcoming about his bias and listening background. Pitchfork reviews are often chock-full of fluff and they make zero sense half the time.
@@Cheddar_Wizard Pitchfork doesn't have any consistency to their taste because their staff changes all the time. Longtimers like Schreiber, Cohen, even Zoladz or Fitzmaurice aren't there anymore, it's just a bunch of 28-year old nobodies who like whatever current fashion dictates. Fantano is a more respectable critic at this point, since at least he posts under his own name and that's it, not pretending to be some collective tastemaking institution.
I still feel the Interpol rescore was a little harsh. I personally think TOTBL is one of the best LPs to come out of the post-punk revivalist/NY rock era. I can understand the album showing it's age, but the 9.5 to a 7.0 was brutal. A low to mid-8 would've made more sense. They chose violence with that flat 7.0. Plus, that Random Access Memories rescore... oof.
Pretty sad you only reviewed one Keef project ever. Would have been cool to see in retrospect how you felt about him paving the way for the future without knowing it.
I honestly don’t have a problem with most pitchfork scores but them giving Björk’s Vespertine a 7.2 when it should have been a nine at least still haunts me
They did Interpol dirty. Turn On The Bright Lights is an incredible album from start to finish. Just pure moody, atmospheric guitar music. It's still their best album.
I kinda disagree he’s one guy so there’s less diversity of opinion however consuming a wide variety of music criticism is important so he’s just as valuable
Pitchfork has to be one of the most awful, nonsensical group of music critics I’ve ever come across. I’m constantly confused as to what rubric, or motivation is behind their scores. Some of their reviews are straight obnoxious.
